07 May 2013 11:07:24
Vidic has come and said we should be looking to Bayern and Dortmund as the future in how we play. He made a special mention to the way they close the opponents high up the field.
We have been saying this for a year now, so do we think saf will change the style of play? Or do we think he will continue the two wingers tactic which leaves us wide open to counterattacks?
Of course, if we go the Bayern/Dortmund route, we better start buying some high energy/creative midfielders to doing the job.
Interesting to hear everyone's views as up till now, no united player has spoken publically about our tactics,
Nomidfield {Ed004's Note - Personally I agree with Vidic though if we want to play further up the pitch I think we need atleast one fast centre back to cover for Vidic's lack of pace. I reckon Smalling is quick enough to cover for Vidic and Rafael doesn't lack pace but it may leave Evra exposed and I can't see it suiting Baines as he isn't the quickest either. Up top I reckon RVP is a better striker than Lewandowski atm and Kagawa is brilliant playing in a high tempo game but we need two better wingers and a more combatative midfielder beside Carrick. So I reckon we could easily implement the system if we signed a left back, Strootman, Rodriguez/Lamela and Gotze(No Chance)/Sanchez/Reus and then played Kagawa centrally. You still have Valencia, Zaha and Welbeck as wingers who offer width and I'd sell Nani and Young}

1.) 07 May 2013
Vidic is bang on but the problem is that he is part of the reason we defend so deep. Him and Rio lack the pace they once had and none of our midfield are good enough defensively to compensate (I'm not counting Jones as a midfielder). Once we strengthen the midfield and are able to keep possession more effectively in the final 2 thirds, we will be less susceptible to counter attacks and, as Ed004 says a pacey CB would do us the world of good.

TK-Red {Ed004's Note - Could that be why Ferguson has been looking at Garay and Ogbonna I know the latter is quick not sure about Garay.}

2.) 07 May 2013
I think strootman lacks pace which is why I'm not so sure about a strootman Carrick partnership
Jred {Ed004's Note - I was thinking that as well Jred but look at Schweinsteiger and Martinez both are very slow players but currently they are the best midfield partnership in the world imo. I reckon Strootman and Carrick wouldn't be as good as them but they would be better than the other midfields in Europe bar possibly Dortmunds and City's depending on if they sign someone to partner Yaya. Also Barcelona's as well}

3.) 07 May 2013
Neither Subotic or Hummels are fast, not too sure about Garay, don't think he is from what I've seen, could be wrong. {Ed004's Note - However, both are quicker than Vidic and Rio, also both full backs are very quick and Santana is very quick.}

4.) 07 May 2013
I never thought as Schmelzer as fast, just a good defender. Smalling, Jones and Evans are all more than fast enough to play that system with Vidic though, we just need a pacey full back who can defend and attack, there isn't too many out there, suggestions? {Ed004's Note - Is Baines quick enough? I know Schmelzer isn't the quickest but Hummels is quicker than Vidic and Vidic plays Left centre back usually. Unless you swap him and play him right centre back with Smalling playing on the left but that could get confusing}

5.) 07 May 2013
I wouldn't say Baines is any slower than Evra difference is Baines actually defends, but I see what you're getting at with Vidic playing left he would need more cover. I honestly can't think of anyone who we could sign for left back, the only players I can think of aren't obtainable like Lahm. Do you know the availability of Coentrao? {Ed004's Note - I don't unfortunately. Alex Sandro from Porto not seen much of him, seems very good going forward but just like Evra defensively though he is younger and quicker}

6.) 07 May 2013
I think sergio Ramos is good option he faster than what we have {Ed004's Note - Wouldn't want him here. The man is a liability and would cost a fortune. Not sure he would suit the physicality of the premiership as I could see him losing the head a lot easier over here}

7.) 07 May 2013
I've heard good things about Alex Sandro, with him being young we can make him a better defender and he will pick it up naturally anyway if he is a gifted player, ah well only time will tell. And to the guy who just posted about Sergio Ramos, hell no, he is quite possibly one of the most overrated centre backs of the decade, at right back he got away with it as he was dealing with less ariel threats and less challenges, put him in the middle and all his weaknesses get exposed. Just imagine him playing against clubs in the premier league like Stoke who will get under his skin and force him into getting sent off, he allows himself to get played far too easy and gets drawn into all the drama far too easy. Had more red cards than any other Madrid player ever and he's only 26 isn't he?

8.) 07 May 2013
Garay is not the quickest but his positioning is great. He is a bit like a younger, less good Rio Ferdinand. He lacks Rio's sheer pace and strength, but he is great on the ball. Personally I wouldn't want him here.

I also think Vidic is not the most suited to play high up the pitch. Not just because his lack of pace but also because he is not the best on the ball. But he is still our best defender, possibly one of the best in the world when fit. Unfortunatly, I don't see the combination of Rio and Vidic as one that would work, especially with Evra. We'd have 3 slow defenders and we would have to maintain a deep defense line.

But Evans, Smalling and Jones are more than capable of partnering, or even replacing Vidic and Ferdinand in the next year or so. The only problem is Evra, as he has evolved from the best fullback in the world to a defensive liability. Buttner looks like a great crosser and dribbler, he also has bags of pace. Defensivly he is not the most confortable but that can improve with time and experience. That is the reason he has not played much this season imo. Whenever he played he was good and could have played more, but I suspect he has been doing a lot of work with the coaches behind the scenes to improve his defensive abilities. Fergy might really be seeing him as a succesor to Evra.
If thinhs don't work out for Buttner there's always Alex Sandro we can go for, and Fabio could be used in a player+ cash exchange.

Mick {Ed004's Note - I'd like to see Buttner play the rest of the league games this year and it is a shame that it was Rafael sent off and not Evra tbh haha. However, I'm not sure Buttner would be ready for next season and I agree with you about Garay but I disagreed to an extent about Vidic. I agree he is no Hummels, Pique etc who can run and pass the ball out our of defence but he isn't the worst on the ball he is calm and composed and I rarely see him lose possession. I think Vidic has to start as his leadership and aerial dominance is badly missed when he doesn't}

9.) 07 May 2013
ED004, I'm guessing Buttner has been signed primarily as cover and unless something happens he won't be a 1st team player?

What about Fabio? How is he progressing at QPR? I had always heard that when we signed the twins, Fabio was the better and only injury held him back. Any chance of him coming back?

RedDub {Ed004's Note - I reckon Fabio will come back but I don't think we should or anyone should expect him to come back and solve our defensive problems on the left hand side as if he isn't starting frequently for QPR then I don't think he will start on a regular basis here. You are correct in that Fabio was always the higher rated of the two brothers however, he has been hit with a lot more injuries and while Rafael was trying to break through he was up against a declining Neville, Fabio was up against one of the best full backs in the game at the time. Now personally, I'd take Fabio back and use him as cover for Rafael at right back. A bit of brotherly competition and a few years back Fabio played right back vs Barcelona in the champions league and if my memory serves me right he played very well there that day. Now I would sell Evra this summer and sign an experienced left back in Baines and then he will help with the development of not just Buttner but Blacketts and hopefully the twins as well}

10.) 07 May 2013
My views is that we must try to see what Bayern and Dortmund are doing and try to copy and improve on them.
For that we need at least two young, athletic, fast midfielders who can pass and break up play when not in possession. If you watch the German teams and barca, they don't go in for big tackles, they just crowd the man in possession. But you have to be fit and young to do that (is not Anderson)!
Re the defensive areas, I think the biggest problem will be evra, as he is always caught out of position and generally does not tend to track back quickly enough. So two midfielders, a left back, and a winger will be great.
Fergie, over to you!
Nomidfield

11.) 07 May 2013
I'd like to see a back 4 of Rafael, Evans, Vidic, Baines next season, with Evra being sold.

I think that would be a solid back 4 but with enough pace to play higher up the pitch. I'd have Jones as cover for Vidic and Smalling/Rio as cover for Evans - Jones will get a few games in midfield too. Fabio to cover Rafael and Buttner to cover Baines.

Unfortunately I doubt we will sign Baines which makes my plan a bit pointless, lol, but that's what I'd like to see and it wouldn't cost much (sell Evra, buy Baines).

12.) 07 May 2013
Hopefully so Ed004, as I feel we need to start playing much further up the pitch. Strootman's lack of pace isn't as much of an issue as he can dominate the midfield physically. A lack of pace at the back only bites us on the arse when we continue to be bullied out of possession, something that Strootman would go someway to solving. I'm not entirely sure about the Strootman/Carrick combination either Jred. Perhaps the presence of Strootman will allow Cleverley to get forward and play his natural game? Or perhaps Strootman and Carrick will provide a platform for Kagawa to perform?

TK-Red