11 Nov 2017 09:38:50
Utd are currently 2nd in the league, yet as fans we aren't entirely happy.
Mourinho's over the top defensive approach to the Liverpool game saw him come under criticism.
The Huddersfield game, perhaps a knock affect of a the previous two games, or just that Huddersfield played their hearts out. Chelsea showed us that with Jones and Smalling in a back three aren't good enough.
Here lies the problem. Jose bought Lindelof who is struggling. Smalling and Jones have been hit and miss. Even Southgate dropped Smalling because he wasn't a ball playing defence that he wanted.
Pogba has been a big miss, there's no doubting that. To lose him when you the rest of the team at your disposal and reshuffle the formation shows that Mourinho lacks confidence in this teams abilities.
Valencia and Young aren't defenders. There converts, somehow Valencia has lost his ability to cross.
As we approach Jose's fourth transfer window, the defence is far from complete. Shaw looks likely to be sold, Darmian, Blind have been ok at LB. Tuanzebe should be given more game time to form a partnership with Bailly. He's composed, great technically and good on the ball. Mitchell played well last season against Palace. I would have thought in the EFL he would have been given a chance. Perhaps the last game in the CL would be a good time to blood some youngsters including him.
We have some very talented youngsters available. The passion, enthusiasm and determination they played with against Palace reminded me of United of old. Entertain and succeed.
The question is- can Mourinho entertain and succeed?
Or will he throw the toys out of the Oran and leave before his 3 years are up?
11 Nov 2017 10:34:34
I think Jones played really well this year.
11 Nov 2017 11:18:43
I can't remember Jones not playing well to be honest for a very long time. Same as always with injuries, but when fit he has been very good, both on the ball and defensively.
On the flip side Darmian and Blind I can't remember having good games, just like Rojo as a LB they are all hindrances. Offer nothing going forward and go to sleep or are clumsy as hell in equal measure. Blind can't run either, despite being better than the others on the ball.
Somebody needs to be taken to task about the Lindelof deal, we pulled out in January or we didn't do enough to get the deal done - now he makes Prunier look like an astute signing.
It's not good enough to say he isn't ready when he takes a wage, cost millions and was extensively scouted apparently. Very odd, apparently Miki was similar last season, he has hardly pulled up trees either a year later.
11 Nov 2017 11:36:50
Rojo is better as the left side of a back three, he is not a great left back.
How did Lindelof play for Sweden last night? I see Italy didn’t score.
Players take time to adapt, Vidic, for example, and Beast were you similarly calling for someone to be taken to task at the time of the Veron deal? Or is it just because this is a Jose purchase? I would like to know whether a Lindelof was a number 1,2 or 3 in the pecking order of central defender purchases, but the lad needs time before we judge him.
Miki looks like he can’t get the pace and power of the game in his second season. Still to be seen if he picks it up.
11 Nov 2017 12:04:42
Yes I agree Rojo is a decent CB, awful LB.
Didn't watch Lindelof last night, weak point Red Man - straw clutching just to argue.
Yes some players need time to adapt, if he needed time why isn't he on loan, why did we pay big money for him after scouting him for ages? You have to go back to Veron to make another weak point.
Vidic and Evra turned out to be two of the best players we have signed, I'll take 1/ 100 odds that Lindelof won't be. I love how people jump to extreme examples to try and make an argument, how about listing the 20 odd players signed in recent years that have not delivered, Schmidfield, Depay, ADM, Falcao for example. I'd wager Lindelof fits more into that category than the extremes of Bebe or Vidic.
Yes it's still to be seen if these players like Miki can lift it, but it's been 15 months now. The world keeps moving, they keep earning and we keep waiting for them to "get it". At the end of the day all the players get our full support when on the pitch, but off it we need to call a spade a spade. Would you be happy with the Lindelof purchase so far Red Man? Rather than what could happen, let's look at what actually has happened please, because that is all we can know for sure.
11 Nov 2017 13:07:26
I still think lindelof will come good. I've no concrete evidence of that of coyrse but he was scouted over 18 months and was well regarded by many and I've seen him play very well for sweden so let's hope its more a case of vidic than prunier.
For me there are at least half a dozen players in our squad that are miles short of united standard and will never be good enough to help us win the league and the problem is we have needed them to start 20 plus games a season and if we continue to rely on these guys for that amount of games we will not win the league because they will continue to let us down and play at their level which is average.
Our squad is very weak in certain areas its been that way for 4 years under 3 managers. with crap league placing because they are not good enough to start 20 plus games and win enough of them.
11 Nov 2017 13:17:45
Totally agree Ken - it would be foolish to write off Lindelof so soon, but it has been a truly woeful start to his career with us and I am bewildered by the whole situation.
Averageness permeates through the squad, not sure what's worse the fact that we have a lot of 7/ 10's playing week in week out, or the fact that so many of our fans seem content with this situation.
"Working Progress" keeps being spouted, well it isn't working too well for me and progress is subjective, League Cup and Europa League may be trophies but they were basically ignored 5 years ago when it came to season reviews etc.
11 Nov 2017 14:05:46
We have made some very poor purchases in recent seasons that looked good at the time but haven't worked out. Depay was dreadful as was ADM, Schweinsteiger and Schneiderlin delivered nothing, Falcao was a risk that didn't work out, and it looks like Shaw will be on his way. I know acidic took a little time to settle in but he never looked as dodgy as Lindelof currently Dora's. God od knows the scouting but that's a lot of money wasted in recent years.
Now let's look at who has moved in recent years (I realise they may not have wanted to come to us) . KDB, Mane, Stones, 3 players who would get straight into our side. So would Walker right now. We have a lot of money but m not sure we have been spending it wisely.
11 Nov 2017 14:41:37
Lindelof was going to be a great player our new cb all the experts on the site said so .
Seriously who watches Portuguese football or makes a point of watching Sweden .
I asked the same question in the summer as I had only seen him play a couple of times but he looked a bit lightweight and a bit slow .
People question the strength of our squad, well on most match days this lad can't get a place on the bench .
How many players look world beaters playing for other clubs until we buy them?
11 Nov 2017 14:58:04
I'm not sure we do due diligence. Surely we should have known about Shaw's fitness issues before we signed him? Ed said Depay wasn't ready, and he was spot on. ADM was always a Woodward signing and whilst he is talented it was clear he didn't want to be here. Schweinsteiger was crocked, Schneiderlin has been slid for Southampton so his poor form was a surprise but we have made a lot of mistakes.
Pogba looks like a great signing, Ibra has added something, Bailly hadgreat first year (think he looks slightly dodgy this year) . Miki doesn't look up to the EPL and I'm still not fully convinced by Lukaku.
A few poor purchases and progress slows, a few canny ones and we can fly. Fine lines.
11 Nov 2017 15:08:31
So if a player doesn't walk straight in the team an produce 10/ 10 performances they should be sold? Thought united fans backed players.
11 Nov 2017 15:30:10
Fair assessment AJH our recruitment has been questionable recently, having said that I think the majority of Jose's signing's have been very good. I really like Pogba, Matic and Bailly and no doubt Ibra made a big impact last season. I think the jury's is still out on Miki and Lindelof is well down the pecking order at the moment.
11 Nov 2017 15:50:59
You don't need 11 world Class players to have a world Class team .
People say we need a top right sided player, is Miki not one? 23 goals in his last season for Dortmund playing on the Right .
Talented lad this boy creative player only been at the club one season .
We payed 90 mil for a striker 100 mill for pogba add matic in there Herrera who people where raving about last season .
Bailly Jones probably the best GK in the world Ddg .
Are rash and martial not top young talents, is sterling really a step up from these 2 .
Was Mata not Chelsea player of the league winning CL?
Lindelof was a great signing stones an awful player just a couple of month ago .
Fellaini is a great example how many people wanted him dropped sold, not good enough . Did Jose rate him tho .
Talent is there we are 2nd in the league and not playing well?
11 Nov 2017 15:54:49
Danny
The ed said bailly was very much a club signing Jose didn't have a big say in it.
Jose was a big fan of pogba but I'm sure the club and the money men where just as keen .
Our signings, good and bad are very much a joint effort down to more than just one person .
11 Nov 2017 18:33:48
Agree with that jred BUT whos resposible for missed signings. It was pretty clear jose wanted peresic but someone put a stop to it. There we comments made that he's not marketable enough for us. If that's true then someone is to blame for it amf its not jose.
11 Nov 2017 19:18:38
Ridiculous to be giving up on Lindelof already. He came in and looked a bit too keen and anxious in preseason (silly foul for penalty) and Jose held him back and let him settle. Good decision if you ask me.
He then worked his way into the match squad and was brought on unexpectedly as a sub for a Jones injury and again made a silly mistake 2 mins into the game that cost us dear.
Again Jose has held him back from the spot light and has him working his way back.
The lad is talented and I think he will be a very good player for us. He does need to settle and grow into a club the size of Man Utd.
Declaring him a disaster is hardly what the lad needs so early into his utd career. Give him at least 12 months to settle before you decide he is useless and an embarrassing signing that the scouts should be ashamed of.
12 Nov 2017 01:53:06
Nobody is giving up on Lindelof, we are just saying it's not exactly been an astute signing so far - has it been?
Like the Zaha signing, that I tend to forget about.
Depay I could tell from the World Cup he was out of his depth. 99% of fans on here wouldn't hear it though.
There is loyalty, then there is blind loyalty.
12 Nov 2017 09:13:57
Some Players work out straight away, some need time. I recall Rio, the worlds best defender at the time, needed a little time to adjust to how we played, how SAF wanted him to play and he had been playing in the league. Lindelof played in Portugal, not as strong or quick a league, however is a Swedish international who plays regularly. i for one will not prematurely judge him. In fact, how on earth can Lindelof be judged as “not exactly an astute signing”. The prices being banded about in summer made Lindelof relatively reasonably priced and time will tell if he is astute.
I was one who warned that Depay would take time to settle and shouldn’t expect as much as some people on here were, seems to be doing well now and I seem to recall we added a buy back clause.
This is another Beast set of undermining effort set of posts, the manager got it wrong again about Lindelof. Well having read what Woodward allegedly told Klopp about Utd being like Disney I suspect the corporate hand is in most things including transfers. I suspect there is a drive to find players who may increase in value as part of the recruitment to please the owners, after all the Ronaldo sale likely made the Accountants very excited, so I won't just be about the manager and there is a belief the club didn’t bring in the player wanted, that is what we should be questioning.
12 Nov 2017 11:35:00
Far too early to judge Lindelof, although admittedly he hasn't gotten off to a great start. The thing is with Lindelof is he cannot do any worse than he has done so far, so we will inevitably see a vast improvement even if he isn't up to our standard. Jose did say he expects a long Bailly and Lindelof partnership so he must see something in him. He is very much a signing for next season like Jose also said. I think he needs games though and we should be using him when we can, however if you were Blind, Smalling whoever and Lindelof was playing ahead of you, you'd be pretty p! ssed off.
{Ed002's Note - I would not worry about that happening.}