Manchester United Banter Archive July 13 2014

13 Jul 2014 21:59:51
Ed, do you think it's fair to say our three primary targets are probably Reus, Hummels & Vidal?

With Carvalho & Vermaelen as secondary targets? Just your opinion of course, but is that a fair assumption?

{Ed002's Note - I am not going to try and predict that Syd. }

13 Jul 2014 19:17:31
Hi guys.
I really don't understand some media headlines.
If barca enter for our target our chances become slim. if PSG eye our target we stand no where. If real Madrid Bayern or city show interest in out target we are looking for another options?
Why?
Why the hell united is so down graded by them? OK it has happened most times in last 5 windows that we didn't compete but common man. Reading this type of head lines getting on my nerves.
What the hell is a problem in our negotiation department. Why other clubs enters and wrap the player in 48 hours? And we scouting and making agent inquiries. for months.
Sometimes it all looks so silly

{Ed002's Note - Players often have a choice. If you have a problem with the media just ignore it.}

13 Jul 2014 20:21:31
I am not sure why this issue is with the Media. Fact is We don't offer the same money as the other teams. Worst still is the fact we don't have CL football now. Yes we are Man Utd, However Money talks.

Its either 1 of 2 things imo. 1) We were never really in for the players. Or 2) The other clubs pay way more money in fees and wages. I know I sound like an arrogant red here but why would any player turn us down to go to city? or Chelsea? (ok maybe the pull of living in London?). Imho the only clubs that have the pulling power to snatch our targets are Real or Barca and maybe Bayern at the min, anywhere else is a step down. So it must be penny pinching that prevents us from getting certain players. Hopefully the club has realised this and is now prepared to pay what it takes.

RD

It is hard to know the truth on any signing. even in the same papers or Web pages you will see us as favourites for a player and then beaten by a team.in CL.
I think we need to just stay calm. negotiations team are doing there job and we will win some player races and lose some.
Unfortunately we are fighting the loss of Climate this year. to some that will matter.

There are 4 main reasons:
1) a natural tendency for the Latin players to want to play with the top Latin teams,
2) London is a bigger draw than Manchester, and right now so are Madrid, Barcelona, Paris, and Munich
3) Ever since the Glazers burdened us with so much debt, United has not shown or been able to show the financial commitment required to bring top players to the club, and
4) Ferguson left an aging team, and gave us a mid-range manager to negotiate the immediate years after his retirement, leading to upheaval, uncertainty and no ECL football.

Still can't understand why people chose London above manchester as Ian Brown said all that's missing is a beach!

14 Jul 2014 08:29:43
It doesn't make any sense to me why our fans seem to think as soon as we put an offer to a player they should take it regardless of who else is trying to get the player just because we are Man Utd. Not evey player wants to play for United. At this moment if a world class player has the choice between us and teams like Barca, Real, Bayern etc we're very likely to be disappointed. We have an aging squad in transition and finished 7th last year and have no CL where as these other clubs can offer the same if not more money than us, CL football and almost a guarantee of challenging for major trophies immediately. People seem to think if a player has rejected us once we should never go for them again as they have disrespected us which I also think is daft.

The problem is Rjmanutd this was happening when we were top of the tree, coming 7th has just made it harder, but it should entice players to help lift us back to where we belong because it will happen eventually.

Kind of like Rangers players knowing that it's a matter of time before they are competing with Celtic again.

14 Jul 2014 13:34:56
It's clear that previously we were not offering the same sort of money as other teams who are as big as our club. So players like Nasri, Silva, Hazard etc were linked with us but took the pay instead. We can't simply sell a club on its heritage to a player who has no affiliation or feeling for our club.

I agree Beast that some players will be enticed to try and bring a big club back to the top but the majority who have an offer from another big club at the moment will not be joining us. Look at Di Maria, he apparently has offers from us and PSG. I feel we are a bigger club with a more successful history who play in a better league. Di Maria will more than likely go where the money is and where the immediate chance to play in the CL is available. I personally don't see anything wrong with that should he do it but others see this as a slap in the face.

Obviously we are a bigger club than PSG and I agree with your points apart from part of the last sentence.

When the going gets tough the type of players you need are ones that will put the team before themselves. If a players is declining the opportunity to play for Man Utd because we are not in the CL for one year, then they are short term thinkers who will run like rats from a sinking ship the second things get difficult. In a competitive league like the PL you need players that are committed to the team and making a major decision on where you play based on one pathetic problem like lack of CL for one season is the type of clown we could do without.

Lack of CL being the only reason we are getting turned down is farcical.

13 Jul 2014 18:17:29
will there be any signings unvailed at the same time as van gal on Wednesday? Here's hoping for at least 1 or 2 more significant signings before season kicks off

Might see Herrera and Shaw sit alongside him i'd guess. Doubt we'd have any other signings wrapped by then. Is the iron tulip definitely being unveiled on weds?

13 Jul 2014 16:34:32
At the moment we are all concentrating on the coming season and the likely buys LvG may make. It is interesting and exciting but LvG will also put in the structure for the future as he has elsewhere. He will likely set out a strategy from the youth to the first team and a structure which may bear fruit in 5 to 10 years, long after he has gone. He will set a vision for how to achieve what the club want, whilst looking at how the youth are developed.
I can't wait for the day LvG walks out of the tunnel against Swansea, it is a new era in more ways than people are looking at.

It is exciting to think how he will organise the academy and how that will bare fruit in the future.

And in the short term its exciting to see how he develops the likes of januzaj, powell, wilson, pearson, rothwell, and janko etc.

Yes it is an exciting new era and hopefully, a successful one too, but let's not forget, LvG was also sacked a number of times too. He isn't he Messiah, he has no magic wand, but he does the players to play their part. As we saw in the WC, he took a bunch of mainly average players and turned them into a very good team, mainly due to the team/work ethic he put in place. Maybe some of the players we can't wait to get rid of will find themselves now! Interesting times ahead!

It is what he does with the youth set up which I'm most excited about.

Totally agree with that midfield general, I think at least 2 will be integrated into the squad this year.

I agree red man . Also like the picture of big Duncan. Nice one!

Cheers Pancho, imagine you will have a certain English centre forward from the seventies?

I look forward to what LvG does in the background. I expect he will look at our whole strategy, particularly youth development but also define our style. Many talk about Manchester Uniteds style, but what exactly is it? At Barca they had the same situation and LvG actually wrote it down to define it. LvG is more than a manager, he is a strategist.

13 Jul 2014 14:06:28
Balague has just retweeted, di maria chooses PSG.Man united lose out on another elite player "

Good - I don't think it would have been money well spent.

Hopefully that means PSG sell Veratti to Juve and we can get Vidal.

Thank god for that! There are five or six wide players I'd rather we went for who would cost considerably less and are a lot more consistent. Di Maria is about the same level as Nani - his good games just come around a lot more frequently!

13 Jul 2014 14:46:08
Look at big al coming on here trying to wind us up about players who pretty much nobody on here wanted us to sign anyway.

Getting a bit embarrassing now al, haven't you put a war chest to go and spend on Southampton and Swansea players?

On other news, Rickie Lambert says, he want's to follow in the foot steps of Andy Carroll.

Deeps.

Haha they bite back

F*** him, if he dosent wanna play for us then I don't want him either. we want men in playing for the shirt and the fans not just personal glory and pound notes.

Seems Big Al is whistling in the dark!

Who's Al?

Didn't Castles Tweet that?

Di Maria is after huge wages, so PSG are always going to be favourites there. That does leave Konoplyanka without a club though. Liverpool signed Lallana, PSG will get Di Maria, Arsenal have got Sanchez & Oezil. Poch will want to use Lamela & they have Chadli too. I know Leverkusen are interested, but I think we could get Konoplyanka if we really want him.

I would rather spend a mere £12m on Konoplyanka and bring in the likes of Vidal and Hummels.

{Ed004's Note - Griezmann?? Real Sociedad are struggling financially. I reckon if there isn't much competition we could push for a fee of around 20 mill. I reckon the fact we have bid for Sanchez and Di Maria. Along with robbens quotes today highlight we want a winger}

Will we be selling the entire first team squad so Stretfordender? Because every single top player is doing it for money and personal glory, regardless of what bull they say in the media. Some more so than others, but there's a reason that the richest and most successful teams tend to always have the best players, and it has nothing to do with playing for the 'shirt' (the same shirt on which the club crest is about one fifth the size of the sponsor's logo).

Castles.originally tweeted that yes and went on a rant.reguarding united and their struggles. But that's your business ;)

Not really dannypugh, obviously players want to be paid well and I have no objection with that, my point is I want people here who want to play for manchester united because of what we represent as a club, our tradition and history, kinda like when robin van persie only had eyes for us even the man city wanted him and could pay him more money, luke shaw more latterly with chelsea keen on him and could pay him more money.

RVP wanted to play under Fergie because he felt he'd win trophies. Shaw would have signed for Chelsea (he supports them) if they agreed to Southampton's asking price. Whatever the club, or football clubs in general, once represented is not how modern players players see it (with a few notable exceptions).

Owners see their clubs as businesses designed to make maximum profits. Our history and tradition are now just things that the owners use as a marketing device (see the advert for the last shirt launch and try not to vomit). Players understand this and attempt to make as much money as possible too (and who could blame them). Anyone who thinks that players chose United because what we represent are just being had by the Glazers and their ilk. Players chose the club that can provide the highest wages or the best possibility of success: they're thinking about what is best for their own career and it has very little to do with any nostalgic feelings toward a club's past. Even RVP acknowledged that Fergie told him that if he joined he'd have a championship medal.

Al, that's the problem when you are trying to sign "top end" calibre players. Luckily for you Liverpool don't have that problem.

13 Jul 2014 13:54:10
So the biggest sporting spectacle. Who do you guys think would shine? Going for Messi and Mascherano. The best player in the world and the best player in this WC imo.

Deeps.

Garay & Mascherano - Messi has been average for a long time now. I think he is on the decline, his key was pace and he has lost that yard which set him apart - obviously he gets a lot of the ball so he will do some good things, but like Wazzer his best days are behind him imo.

Obviously just comparing how pace was crucial in both Messi & Rooney's games, when it goes it takes a lot away from what separated them from the very very elite.

I would agree with the best player in the world and wc part.
But I think messi might be carrying an injury

I predicted Messi to top-score and Argentina to win before the tournament kicked off. I think Messi will bang in 2 in an Argentina win but Muller will get 1 and pinch it on assists like he did last time.

Agreed Jred, even though I think it's fatigue, he has been performing at God like levels for years and years now. I hope he is able to pick himself up one last time and do it for his country.

Redseven - I had a similar prediction, Argentina to win and Messi to get the Golden boot/ball.

Beast - Lol, you are more obsessed with Wazza than I am ;-), Messi may not be at his best, but he is FAR from average. He has literally carried his team through out of the group, infact it was his solo run and assist for Di Maria that saw them get past the Swiss. He still is IMO consistently the best player in this world. I would agree he is not what he was a couple of years ago though, I think the body can only take as much.

Deeps.

The problem for messi is the rest of the argie attack haven't played great.
So teams have been able to go out with one tactic stop messi.
Put 1 some times 2 players on him pack the area of the pitch he plays and try and foul him every time he gets the ball.

13 Jul 2014 14:47:51
I have James Rodriguez to score first at 150/1 but have it well covered now to take the pressure off. Just looking forward to a great game.

13 Jul 2014 14:48:33
R7,

Did you back top goalscorer or golden boot mate? They are 2 different bets.

Yeah I think so Pink, haha - I'm hoping what I have seen of LVG we might see a better Rooney next season then we can be on the same page. Although when the Utd shirt comes on he will get my total support irrespective.

Messi has been their best attacking player, but Argentina have been pretty toothless, and we can't hide from the fact every ball is played to him. He has been average compared to what we have been used to seeing from him and he does look on the decline, but saying that most teams just double up on him so that loss of a yard is more stark, plus he seems to be carrying.

13 Jul 2014 10:16:54
Id love peoples opinion on this, ed004 if you have time i'd like your thoughts as well.

All the reports on us pulling off the Vidal transfer sound promising. But the prices quoted just don't seem anywhere near realistic for the worlds best midfielder £30m to £35m plus Evra who we value at around £2m.

It just doesn't seem possible at them prices.

If they were saying £40m to £45m plus Nani and Evra I could believe it.

Thoughts :)

{Ed004's Note - I don't care how much he costs I just want him signed tbh}

13 Jul 2014 13:12:18
How are u feeling about this transfer now ed04? I no u thought it wouldn't happen a few months back, have your opions changed?

{Ed004's Note - Yes I'm very optimistic now tbh. He would be a top signing}

Tbh it was one that we all wanted but I think we all sort of resigned ourselves to adding it to the "wishful dreaming list" but it does seem that we are not that far from pulling off what I think would be the most significant signing in our recent history that is how big an impact I think this guy would make with a manager who knows how to use players to the best of their ability along with completed signings(Shaw&Herrera) add a CB and we we will be more than formidable next season and in my opinion a winger/left forward away from winning the lot next season.

Just MY opinion.

When you consider some of the ridiculous transfer fees in recent times (Carrol £35m, Torres £50m, Fellaini £28m, Cavani £55m, Falcao £52m, Bale £86m, Hulk £38m, Illarramendi £34m, Pastore £34m, Witsel £34m, Fernandinho £34m, Marquinhos £32m, etc) Vidal should be costing around £50m. I'd be impressed if we somehow got him for £35m and not at all bothered if we ended up paying up to £60m.

13 Jul 2014 14:41:50
I think it is to do with his age domi, there is no sell on value so any premium for that is knocked off.

My thoughts exactly redseven.

That makes sense gds2, I still can't help but think that anything under the £40m mark is a bargain for this guy. Especially when you look at some of the other transfer costs.

13 Jul 2014 11:23:50
A lot of reports going about that Vidal has said he would love to "play for one of the biggest club's in the world."

I'm starting to believe this might happen! Also Hummels and Reus on the radar, Di Maria to PSG. Got to love the sily season!

Believe I know where your coming from but he hasn't said utd. It could be any of the big clubs.

I know mate, didn't say he had. He was directly asked about rumours linking him to United though and that was his answer.

13 Jul 2014 14:50:18
Bookedred,

He was answering questions about interest from united. Why would his response be something to do with a different team? Makes no sense

Agreed GDS, it's all about context!

13 Jul 2014 10:30:59
Di Maria seems to have split opinions, some think he is coming here, others say he will turn us down for PSG. We have a lot in our favour though. Considering they have paid £50 million for David Luiz (Euros) they have to be a bit of careful with FFP. Di Maria is a United fan and the English League is far stronger. let's hope.

But if it was a case of getting Reus if Di Maria fails then I hope it goes tits up.

13 Jul 2014 09:32:45
I'm not a Di Maria hater, I think he is a top class footballer, but he can, and does, go missing in big games when things are not going to plan. I just think there are better options cheaper. You all know I rate Griezmann my only concern is he may be a little light weight aka Eric Lamella, who did not suddenly become a bad player when he joined Spurs. Reus or James Rodriguez would be ideal but are both fantasy land imo. What we need is someone robust with pace not necessarily an out and out winger but he just joined Arsenal :) and good luck to them. If DI Maria he does join PSG it could be a blessing.

Vidal is now actually looking feasible for the first time a summer of Shaw Herrera and Vidal while not covering all our needs would be our best transfer window for a long if not all time. I know a lot on here ( me included ) think we need a CB but the extra cover Vidal and Herrera will bring should not be under rated both Jones and Smalling are good and I believe Jones ( injury free ) can be world class. Evans is a very good squad player and reports of young Keane are encouraging. To be honest a midfield of Herrera Vidal and Mata behind Janu, RVP and Rooney is a big step up from last year.

13 Jul 2014 09:45:30
Grund,

I agree with pretty much everything you said here mate, the last 2 lines get me very excited about the new season, and that would be with just one more signing. Roll on Swansea at Old Trafford!

13 Jul 2014 10:04:57
Grund ,

You say Di Maria goes missing in big games and yet in the Champions league Final , when Rea were 1 - 0 down he was the only one to show up for a large part of the match while Ronaldo was anonymous

Maybe the Ox could be viable, he would add pace, dynamism is English and may not play every week for Arsenal with their recent signing of Sanchez and Walcott coming back. £20mil he would be ideal.

13 Jul 2014 10:13:52
I agree with you there Bilko. Di Maria put in a shift in that game and I had to keep checking to see if Ronaldo was still on the pitch.

Ignoring the price I would be extatic for is to get any of Di Marea, Reus, Rodriguez and if not realistic then Griezman.
First 3 have that strength and mean streak the same as Sanchez who would have been ideal
Just think we need a bit of a beast who puts fear into defenders. then utilise Januzai and Nani better.

Nani? you can't be serious :)

13 Jul 2014 13:47:28
John to be fair ge would make a cracking water boy

13 Jul 2014 00:29:29
So now that the Dutch players are on there way home, which ones are we likely to see following LVG to Manchester?

My money is on Blind as cover for Shaw and midfield, maybe Classie as understudy to Carrick for this season and long term replacement?

Any thoughts guys? Eds?

{Ed004's Note - only two I would consider would be de Virgl and blind. Obviously robben isn't an option. Possibly Strootman in January}

13 Jul 2014 02:25:34
Would love to see Robben here but its not going to happen

13 Jul 2014 05:55:40
Yeah. Vrjil also for me

13 Jul 2014 08:12:38
If we are going to be linked with de Vrij can we at least make sure we start to spell his name. I think the two on this post are the 15th and 16th different spellings of the name so far!

I've been really impressed with De Vrij, very solid at the back. To be fair, so have Vlaar and Martins Indi, although Indi looks like he has a mistake in him - still a little raw. Less impressed with Blind.

Wijnaldum also looked strong as an action packed box to box, good ball retention, excellent defensive cover but also prepared to drive forward and run past the strikers if necessary.

To be honest, just hope he brings back the real RVP, rather than the imposter who turned up for Davey Moyes last season.

Virgie, blind, indi jamat for me.

For me blind, depay, and then maybe strootman in jan.

I was impressed with de vrij however I would rather us go all out for an established more experienced cb such as hummels, and get jones back on track. I kno a lot of people said he went backwards last year but I think we'd struggle to name a player that didn't last year

I'd rather we leave Indi alone for the time being I personally feel Vlaar and De Vrij were much better.

LvG got a lot more out of that squad than most could have done but as with MOTD or You Tube fever there is often World Cup fever. Players look decent for a few games and some think they are then good enough. We don't need good squad players, we have plenty of those, we need top quality in my opinion in three positions with also an eye on a cover for left back. Out of the Dutch squad, who considerably over achieved, perhaps Robben but his age is against him, not sure about any others.

De Vrij for me would be great, looked very composed and years ahead of his age and would be set for years.
Martins indi is done to Porto I understand and will be announced this week.
I would take jaanmat to push Rafael and Blind as cover for Shaw or holding midfield.
I don't see a mass influx immediately but Maybe some surprises with youngsters with the under 21 manager coming in too.

I would like to see one of blind or indi. Blind because he can offer cover for the left back spot which we will need due to the impending loss of Evra and he is definitely better in midfield than either clevs or fellaini. Or indi because he can play cb and then the left back spot if shaw gets injured

Very impressed with de vriij over the whole tournament quietely got on with his job, had another solid game last night.