Manchester United Banter Archive May 13 2015

13 May 2015 22:09:11
Watching the highlights from the U21 game last night and I have to say Januzaj looked head and shoulders above everyone else on the pitch for this age group. His passing was accurate, he distributed well, took risks and glided past the opposition effortlessly at times.

He linked up fantastically well with Wilson in particular which bodes well for the future of the first team. I can't help but still think that loaning Januzaj out may not be as beneficial as some may think. I want him to stay and build on that understanding with Wilson (if he gets a chance), Herrera, Mata, Di Maria, Rooney and now Depay etc. The class of 92' would never have been as good as they were had they not had the chance to play together from a very young age.

I can see why folk would want to loan out Januzaj, Wilson and co and yes the experience could be a great thing for them but how many times have young players who are considered potential first team players been loaned out and it has either came to nothing or stalled their career? Chelsea and Arsenal have had a heap of kids loaned out for years now and nothing has come of them. Liverpool have stuck by Sterling and incorporated him into their first team system and he is now considered a fine footballer.

It's a difficult decision but I'd rather the creme of the youth set up stay put and get exposed to playing for the biggest club in the country while being managed effectively. We have got some good kids at the moment.

13 May 2015 23:18:16
To get a fair sense of the futures for Januzaj and Wilson, I would like to see LVG settle on a position for Rooney, Di Maria, and Mata. For example, if we strengthen at CM, then Rooney can remain at CF, then can James Wilson be #2 there? If so, that would suggest moving RVP and Falcao on. For Januzaj to get decent minutes next year, he would at least have to be among the top 4 wingers. We have a lot of talent right now, but overloaded in some positions, and light in others.

14 May 2015 00:38:35
Can someone tell me what position did januzaj play against manchester city U-21? Winger or attacking mid?
I agree with jmb. While a loan might be beneficial in some ways, I would like to see wilson januzaj and pereira work together and be in the first team squad and slowly be integrated into the team. The three of them should get more game time next season and possible starts in the league and fa cups.

14 May 2015 06:39:34
We need to play Januzaj and Wilson. It didn't help getting knocked out of the League Cup so early and as 4th looked dodgy for a while, LVG has taken no risks. I think both are hugely talented and need game time; both could have great careers with us. My worry is that if we sign a few more players, LVG will tinker even more and try different formations. Hopefully we can sign players early land he can do that pre-season. As for ADM, I think we need to move him on if at all possible. Happy to eat my hat if he is a revelation next year but I simply don't see it happening.

14 May 2015 08:03:47
Drd,

He played on the left mate.

13 May 2015 22:06:15
On past and possible future United (irrespective of likelihood):

Chicharito: Looked lively, created chances. Much better than he did in his last couple of seasons at United.

Tevez: Toiled well to little effect.

Ronaldo: Unable to make the difference

Evra: Great performance! Typical of his best times at United. Were his weaknesses in part due to the failures appearing in front of him?

Pogba: A little languid at times but did extremely well to create the chance for the goal, but missed one he should have scored.

Vidal: Really impressed with his work rate. He was the dynamo that kept it all together allowing Marchisio and Pirlo to be as effective as they were, because, there were times when Juventus were second to every ball. Can we sign him, PLEASE?

Bale: Other than the chances he missed I thought he looked really good. Again I would be tremendously excited if he came to United.

If we could sign these two, Clyne, Benteke and a quality centre half, bring back Chicharito, and let go Rooney, RVP and Falcao go, along with Nani, Rafael, Evans, I believe our team would be much more balanced, energetic, speedy and creative, and with a broad enough spectrum to compete well both domestically and in Europe.

13 May 2015 22:47:41
The Bale at Spurs is the one we need not the current Madrid one he didn't do enough he is not happy you can see it in his body language

14 May 2015 01:33:06
So sell our best player and replace him with benteke? And keep Hernandez? What have you been smoking lol.

Hernandez was poor tonight he did nothing I don't know what game you watched but there were no chances made by him, they should have left him on the bench

And other than the assist pogba was average,

And bale made evra look amazing not once did he try and take evra on or use his pace to exploit evra, bale of last season would have ran at evra at. Every opportunity, all he kept doing was cutting in or taking long shots.

Other than your Vidal analysis I couldn't disagree more mate.

14 May 2015 06:41:21
Rumour has it Nani might be coming back. if we are going to give McNair, Wilson, Januzaj, Blackett and a vogue of others chances, then there is some major pruning needed in the summer

13 May 2015 21:50:58
Congratulations to our very own evra for making it to champions league final. Chellini and evra vs suarez will be fun to watch

13 May 2015 17:30:20
Hey ED, I asked a question about James Wilson's contract situation. That hasn't been uploaded.

Was there a problem with that post?

{Ed007's Note - I've no idea mate and there's nothing showing at our end, have you checked under your bed? We used to lose a lot of posts until one day Ed002 found them all down the Blue Sofa.}

13 May 2015 21:18:57
Mumbai boy, it's on the rumours page.

13 May 2015 21:48:22
It's a bit of a iffy comment if you ask me. Not saying he knows its done but get the impression he thinks it may happen. So do I but it not mean it will happen. He got some stick again tonight but other days some of the shots would have gone in. Think its a bit unfair the way he has been treated considering his stats are on par with Hazard.

13 May 2015 21:49:09
Sorry replied to wrong post. Was meant to go under the Bale MUTV one .Sorry

13 May 2015 20:55:35
watching Pogba and looks like 17 million pound player rather than the 70 million pounds. :)

13 May 2015 21:51:35
I do agree a bit, but still the midfield 3 have played well tonight. I'd love Vidal out of the 3 though.

13 May 2015 21:58:53
just come back from 2 month injury hasn't he? Regardless, he's not worth £70m.

13 May 2015 23:08:09
Most of the game, Pogba looks like a very good player, nothing more, certainly not worth the huge numbers we are hearing. But then he is capable of the big moment, because he is so talented. But he doesn't look like a player that can take over a game. He is not an unstoppable goal scorer, nor a center mid who can control the game like a Pirlo, Scholes, or Xavi. Still a fantastic talent though.

14 May 2015 05:10:52
Zin

I agree talented but not a dominant player who influences the game. Vidal is much more influential and i can see why they are hawking him around to get silly money and build from the proceeds. For me does not get involved enough and was quite loose with some of his passing.

13 May 2015 20:22:56
Bale seems to be contributing more to his hair band than the actual game!

Doesn't seem right or happy, hope we get him. Also its now £31m for Depay when you include add-ons apparently.

Alan Smith is useless, Buffon makes a standard save and its "great experience".

I fancy Juve to get back into this.,

{Ed004's Note - If that figures from the BBC apparently it's wrong. It's around 30 million euros}

13 May 2015 20:29:01
Yeah it was BBC, they seemed pretty specific so thought it must be accurate coming from them - cheers Ed.

{Ed004's Note - By the sounds of it the deal is worth 27 million euros up front with 4 million in possible ads ons and they get a percentage (rumoured 10%) of any future fee. Great deal that IMO. Just Bale to get next...}

13 May 2015 20:47:28
Great deal for whom Ed?

{Ed004's Note - Manutd. Works out at under 20 million pounds for someone who has 21 goals in 28 games and who has been developing rapidly over the past few years.}

13 May 2015 18:30:12
Regardless of whether we have an interest in him or not what would be people's opinions of getting Schweinsteiger in the summer. Would probably be a cheaper option than others looked at for that role.

{Ed004's Note - Depending on price he could be the perfect short term Carrick replacement. Would prefer Javi Martinez in defensive midfielder though}

13 May 2015 18:36:30
Would love to see him here even if it is for 2 to 3 years, one of my favourite players.

13 May 2015 18:39:16
It's a yes from me. Mentioned him as others have over the last few years and I still think he's good for a few years yet. His brother wants the move too as he supports us apparently.

13 May 2015 18:48:14
A huuuuuuge yes from me, great player! I love bacon too.

13 May 2015 18:50:34
Did somebody say Bacon?

13 May 2015 18:58:20
It's a yes from me too for schweinstiger, or even Martinez both fully capable? And here's hoping a swap for Di Maria and Goetze will surffice too!

13 May 2015 19:04:05
Hummels, Bale and Clyne ( Vidic, Giggs and Neville.) We have the rest.
Patrick

13 May 2015 21:45:47
Nathaniel, you've got 4 yes's.

13 May 2015 10:35:04
Will MU be looking to offload Jonny Evans? Been a liability all season and our best form started when he got his 6 game ban. I genuinely belive we can't challenge for the title with him as a regular first team player.

13 May 2015 17:10:05
Yeah I can't see him staying, LVG likes his ball playing cb's and the ball looks like a hot potato when it is at his feet. never rated him.

13 May 2015 17:12:31
I'm sure he will be gone this summer, we need to make room for a new CB.

13 May 2015 15:05:47
Me again!!

I do like all the debates on here and here's another one for you.

Lets say we keep LvG & De Gea, get Bale and Hummels. NO CENTER MID.

Do you expect us to win the league?

To be honest, i expect us to be title challenging next year anyway. Regardless of transfers. The squad should have gelled by now so i fully expect a title charge.

Some of my mates insist that we need a CM and without one we will miss out on top 4.

Lemme know what you think.

13 May 2015 15:28:01
We wouldn't miss out on top 4, but with other teams strengthening, we wouldn't win the league, in my eyes.

13 May 2015 15:31:11
Unless we bring someone in capable of replacing Carrick, we will get nowhere near the title. Matic was Chelsea's most important player this year because he gave stability in front of the defence, and linked the attacking play. We were at our best this season when Carrick filled the same role. However, we cannot rely on someone who will be 34 in a few months. Blind just isn't good enough, and we have nobody else in the squad who can play that role.

In truth we probably need another cm player too, to add depth. But we should be able to cope with Fellaini, Herrera, Mata, Rooney and Di Maria all capable of doing a job there. But a cdm is an absolute must if want to have any chance of competing with Chelsea. Just one look at the difference in our stats with Carrick and out of the starting line up should tell us that filling this position will be key for next year.

13 May 2015 19:06:50
LVG has already said he's going to buy a centre mid.

13 May 2015 07:44:51
The following is a direct quote from Gianluigi Buffon :

"I have been in football many years but the decision of Sir Alex Ferguson and Manchester United to not play Pogba and let him leave is one of the strangest I have ever seen.

"After just a few training sessions we saw how good he was. it cannot have been the same player they saw in Manchester - we thought they maybe needed glasses.
"I have never seen a player who is so good at his age, he is so strong, so technically gifted, has exceptional all-round play.

"Pogba can do things only Pogba can, similar to Messi and Ronaldo. United let one of the top players in the world leave but that has been only good news for us"

It does make you wonder what actually happened with Pogba at United. We went through all that trouble with Le Harve to get him in the first place and for what? Pogba didn't become a world beater overnight when he joined Juventus, so for Buffon to say he was top quality in his first few training sessions then he was obviously a fine player at United. What a loss.

13 May 2015 08:43:46
Hi fellow reds!
First time poster, been reading for a good while, brilliant site well done eds and regulars

Jmb, Imo fergies biggest mistake as our manager, but who am I to know better than fergie, something most of been wrong with the lad if fergie reckoned the da silva twins could put in a better shift than him in the middle

13 May 2015 08:44:50
Pretty sure ed002 has said a few times that he wanted to go and it wasnt SAF's fault. Maybe he had an agent whispering in his ear about vast sums of money.

13 May 2015 09:01:52
The editor has mentioned repeatedly that Pogba was always going to leave. It had nothing to do with Sir Alex not playing him that season.

Pogba was being hawked around Europe by his agent from the summer and it was clear before the game against Blackburn (which he keeps talking about over and over) that he would be leaving to Juventus. The club and manager did everything to keep him.

You only need to look at what his agent has done with Ibrahimovic and Balotelli to know that Pogba will move from club to club every 3 years and be a cash cow for his agent. Also look at what his agent has said about messi and what he would have done had he been Messi's agent. After that, draw your own conclusions.

Personally, I don't at all want Pogba at United. He consistently dragged ours and Sir Alex's reputation through the mud and has shown no respect for the club. He is overpriced as well. I'd rather sign Nainggolan and Vidal/Gundogan for that sum.

{Ed001's Note - that is true, but he could have chosen a different agent, which Ferguson used to force young players to do. Once he chose not to go with a Fergie approved agent, he was never going to get a chance at United.}

13 May 2015 09:08:22
Munster D - welcome mate, looking forward to seeing some posts from a new face. I think we all agree that Pogba may have been Fergies biggest mistake.

Brendan - that's all well and good mate but it does make you wonder why he wasn't given a chance if he was as highly rated as he seems to be. Maybe there was an underlying behavioural issue or something like that but what a good player he has become.

13 May 2015 09:19:10
@Ed001

I don't know about not choosing a fergie chosen agent, but what I can definitely say is once he chose Mino Raiola, he was always going to leave. If not then, then in a couple of years he would have.

We don't need this circus at all at United. Good riddance if you ask me. There are plenty of midfielders around the world whom we could buy.

{Ed001's Note - I agree, but the question should be asked why he chose him, rather than going with Fergie's chosen.}

13 May 2015 09:24:52
Ed001 - it sounds like you have just hit the nail on the head there mate. Once he went against Fergie's wishes with the agent his time was up regardless of his ability. That's the type of guy Fergie was (his way or no way) and its part of the reason he was very successful.

13 May 2015 09:35:20
No doubt JMB, it's a huge shame he isn't here, with that type of player in the side this season, we'd have been a hell of a lot closer to Chelsea.

13 May 2015 09:36:18
JMB,

We don't all agree that Pogba was Fergie's biggest mistake at all, it's been made clear that Pogba's agent was trying to move him on and get a good deal for himself, Fergie didn't want a player holding the club to ransom like he was trying to do, and as REDFAITH says, just look who his agent is and that says it all.

In terms of biggest mistake, I would say letting Jaap Stam leave when he did was a much bigger one, as Fergie has even admitted himself, as well as the signings of Veron, Djemba Djemba, David Bellion etc.

13 May 2015 09:41:31
His career will follow a similar path to that of Zlatan, he will constantly move clubs every 2/3 years forever in search of the next big payday .
We need someone who will grow with the club and give us stability in seasons to come.
right age,right talent,wrong attitude.

13 May 2015 09:47:10
I don't know about that GDS. If you seen Veron in his element at Lazio it would have been hard to see that he would have flopped as big as he did at OT. The others I agree and you could add countless others such as Kleberson, Anderson etc.

What I am trying to say about Pogba is if he was that good when he first joined Juve then he must have been that good at United. What I don't understand is why he wasn't given a run in the first team if he had the ability.

Yes maybe his agent was a pain in the neck but if he had the natural ability back then why not give him a chance to prove he deserved a bumper new deal? The money he was on initially at Juve wasn't anything spectalcular in this day and age so there was obviously football reasons behind his move.

13 May 2015 10:00:34
GDS2, enjoy your posts

I don't think signing players like bellion, djemba jive bar and kleberson were a bigger mistake then letting players leave like pogba and Stam as you've said, he took a gamble on those young players didn't pay off, but it was well known pogba was going to be a real talent, imo his stubbornness and ego got in the way

13 May 2015 10:30:18
The reason he didn't play Pogba regardless of his obvious talent is he didn't want to help his agent by putting him the shop window.

Pogba was never going to sign a contract extension unless we paid Raiola 4/5m signing fee(which he got for getting him to sign with Juve). We can't regardless of talent be held to ransom to pay for youth players who have came through our OWN youth system to sign professional terms. Imagine if we had to pay similar amounts of money to get Evans, Eagles, Richardson and Cleverley to sign professional terms. Everyone would be going mad, once you go down that route you are stuck with it.

Regardless of how good a player Pogba becomes, Sir Alex made the right choice in letting him go. It might be hard for some people to grasp but there was Manchester United long before there was Paul Pogba, and there will still be Manchester United long after Paul Pogba has retired.

{Ed001's Note - that is not true Shappy, he was frozen out because he wasn't signing for Fergie's chosen to get him a nice payment. If Rainfish (or whatever name he was using last) was here, he would be here telling you how Fergie operated in this regard. Young players were not given a chance the moment they chose not to sign for his choice of agent, no matter how good they were and it was nothing to do with helping an agent. It should have been about doing what was right for the club, which was playing the better player to get better results.}

13 May 2015 10:46:17
Where did you get the £4-5million agent figure from Shappy?

{Ed002's Note - The advice that led Paul Pogba to leave was not just from Mino. Manchester United had an offer made for the player in January by which time they already knew he would be leaving in the summer. The decided that they did not wish to sell even though it would have been acceptable to the player and his advisors. It was all dealt with at the time on these pages.}

13 May 2015 11:01:01
Redfaith , you say above that Pogba dragged the clubs reputation through the mud .
Did Fergie not do the same with the whole Rock Of Gibraltar episode ?

13 May 2015 11:01:44
Hey my good mate Ed002 is back (I knew deep down we were still friends!)

So is that figure of £4/5million to the agent correct?

{Ed002's Note - I am not providing any transfer information but simply want to stop any misinformation being shared regarding Pogba.}

13 May 2015 11:19:34
Ed002 you make me sad.

13 May 2015 11:31:36
Seems like I have a stalker. *Disagree*.

Whoever it is, fair play, but you have way too much time on your hands.

13 May 2015 11:34:52
Ed001 is bang on here. Pogba may have left anyway, but Fergie's stature at the club should not gloss over his dodgy dealings. Even if Pogba was destined to leave, he was clear a better player than the majority of players who played cm for us that year. Even Scholes admits that he was surprised when Fergie asked him to come back when we had a player of Pogba's standard who couldn't get a sniff.

13 May 2015 11:53:56
So to summize. It was a Fergie mistake then.

13 May 2015 12:18:15
I agree with redfaith over priced and will be a problem player where ever he ends up as he will get shopped around every 2 or 3 years and brings about a lot of uncertainty and instability. His agent is one interesting character.

13 May 2015 12:46:24
No player is bigger than the club, we were here before Pogba and we will be here after. SAF knew he was a mercenary, we offered a record amount for an academy player and he turned it down, from that point he was never going to play. Let it go.

13 May 2015 13:38:22
We are not far away from being able to compete with the elite clubs of Europe and a few strategic additions will make this squad a very very good team.

Even with our horrendous year last year we were competitive against the likes of Bayern who are loaded by all accounts.

Look at Juve's team and they have not gone out and blown their brains out on any single player but bought smart. If they can pull off Pogba to PSG and verrati and Cavani going their way, They are brilliant.

Let Madrid buy an entire team of high priced guys from all over the world and its always a circus there as too many egos to manage.

We are in a good place financially and hope we do not have a repeat of Dimaria this summer as for me that has to be our worst ever deal given what we have paid and what we got in return. Sanchez at half the cost is double the player.

My biggest concern is that we do not genuinely have a world class striker anymore, which we have been used to having for so many years and need to get a genuine 20 goal a season scorer who is a Centre forward and not a false 9. Benzema would be my first choice.

13 May 2015 14:09:17
Did Pogba chase the money or did he chase the play time?
Yes his agent is an a.hole but which agent isn't? In my opinion Pogba made the best move for him and it turned out the right move for him and his career, afterall isn't he now classed as one of the best in the world.
Fergie mistake in my eyes.

13 May 2015 16:41:04
Thanks for the info Ed001.

Personally I couldn't care less about Pogba right now. He will cost ridiculous money not just in terms of transfer fee but wages too. Even if he did sign he will be on his bike in a couple of years.

Vidal, Gundogan, Nainggolan are some very good options who could be just as good as him, if not better. There is no need to bring the pogba circus to town. What we need is sensible and smart buying which will be sustainable. Starting with letting go of Falcao and Rvp, perhaps even Mata.

13 May 2015 17:08:03
Easy to blame Fergie when we don't know what went on. I think he has always chased money and fair enough as people have different drivers and everyone likes wealth but maybe in equal proportions to other things in life.

In his case and his agent they definitely are always chasing the buck.

13 May 2015 17:09:45
BTW in our case and what is most needed if you gave me choice of Verrati or Pogba, I would take Verrati. Praying PSG buys him as that might be window for us to get Verrati. Having said that i think Verrati wants to go to Juve.

13 May 2015 17:21:57
I would take Pogba over Verrati any day of the week but saying that, I wouldn't say no to Verrati.

13 May 2015 17:24:27
This pogba thing has been done to death ed002 has told us many times what was happening.
If he signed for city / viera it will be no surprise either, viera was chirping in his ear at the time advising him to leave utd and go to juve. Pogba and his agent are trouble. This fergie dis respected me is crap reminds me of ya ya and his lack of respect because he didn't get a birthday cake!

13 May 2015 19:58:10
No doubt Pogba and his agent were chasing the money, but Fergie was doing it too. I'd wager that Fergie made a pretty penny 'advising' young players on the right choice of agent over the years.

13 May 2015 20:21:52
Yes done to death. We offered him a good contract and he declined, he was clearly leaving, so why would you play a player who is determined to leave when you don't even stand to make a transfer fee for him?

Obviously he was good enough to play, we knew that, Saf knew that, everyone knew that. But the issue was he was always moving so I think we were right not to play him.

If you know who is agent is then none of thus is surprising.

{Ed002's Note - You are not reading my note - there was critical input from someone else - it doesn't matter who, but it was decisive.}

13 May 2015 17:12:30
Ed001

Fergie forcing agents on to young players is more conspiracy theory stuff mate. You don't actually believe that do you?

Its like the Barca Doping story and specialist doctors all bs in my opinion.

{Ed001's Note - I know he did it mate, it is not a conspiracy it is fact.}