Manchester United Banter Archive January 14 2013

 

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14 Jan 2013 23:07:32
Could all these de gea rumours be fergie using the media to unsettle casillas?

Believable1 Unbelievable9

No, SAF has not really spoken about DDG and has played him on a regular basis.

Fresh!

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Surely it's more likely to unsettle de gea, can't make his confidence any better! It's just paper talk anyways, a slow window always gets filled with these stories

Snakey

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Nonsense. Based on his form this last year, Casillas is hardly going to get any worse.

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14 Jan 2013 22:58:35
Welbeck proved yesterday he has the potential to be a great player, he is already a decent striker and just needs to get some confidence and start finishing better. He was very unlucky not to score yesterday as well.

With a lot of talks about Lewandowski and I myself believe he will join united in the summer, which means one striker will leave.

Now we have a few options here..

-Sell Welbeck or Hernandez although they are magnificent players and are have around the same ability as Lewandowski.

-Sell Rooney, or put Rooney in midfield. The last month has proven we don't need Rooney to do well as RVP can easily win us games too, I don't want him sold but I feel that way with a lot of our players.

-The most unlikely would be to replace RVP after he leaves, so maybe we would have the 5 strikers with maybe one going on loan such as Welbeck to a mid table side. Lewandowski would slowly take RVP's spot in the team in a few years.

Whats everyone's views on this? I don't want any strikers leaving but I would love Lewandowski to join.

-JakeW

Believable1 Unbelievable10

Its tuff mate, I feel wellbeck or chico will have to leave my choice would be danny, they both deserve first team football and if it were not for our amazing front line would get it, the problem is though chico would fetch the most cash... Some tough decisions to make if we do sign lewi!
Chris the REDman {Ed004's Note - I think lewandowski offers more than Welbeck unfortunately and is a similar player, However, I'm not sure he has a very high work rate like Welbeck}

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I do not think Welbeck will ever be good enough to lead our line.... So why not sell him and bring in Lewandowski or keep hi for another year or so and then sell him with Henriquez coming through.

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JakeW - I find it hard to believe that anyone who has watched both Lewandowski and Welbeck regularly can say they are of similar ability. Danny always gives a 100% and certainly a lack of game time has affected his progression, but one thing that doesn't change is his finishing, he needs 3 or 4 chances to score. Look at Sunday, he had at least 2 very presentable chances and his first touch let him down and the chance was gone.
Yes he never stopped running, hassling the Liverpool players but we need more than that from a striker and sadly I don't think Danny will ever be a first choice striker and if he has a career at Utd it will be as a back up striker.
Lewandowski seems to score goals for fun and yes his work rate might not be as good as Danny's but his ball control is better and more importantly he scores goals and that is what we want strikers to do.
Given a choice, sorry but only winner for me and it isn't Danny.

Keanooh

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Keanooh they are both tall strong strikers, Lewandowski is more technically better and is much more clinical in the box. Where as Welbeck can do all of the hard work but isn't as clinical in the box. I was Borrusia Dortmund a lot so I do see a lot of Lewandowski.

They are also both around the same age and both have the potential to be as good as eachother.

-JakeW

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Will people stop saying "sell welbeck". I'm a huge man utd fan just like you all are. Was at the game on sunday and out of everyone on the field he knew what us fans think about utd vs pool and how massive it is to us. You can't teach what a local boy has, so as long as he is happy being the 3rd/4th striker we should all be happy to keep. We should be wanting our own to do well not get rid of them at every chance we have! Come on stand by our youth!

Adam Dean

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You have to remember that welbeck is only 21/22 whereas lewy is 24/25

These 2-3 years of added experience at a club where he's playing every week makes a huge difference to a players contributions and confidence on the pitch. I think welbeck should be loaned to a premiership club were he will play every week e.g. Newcastle. Then his confidence will grow and he will start to score more goals

Philiphs93

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As i have said a few times welbeck doesnt have the quality to play for united unfortunately. He is a good runner but his play in the final third is very poor and i can't see him improving sufficiently that he will get to the quality we need. If he was 17/18 i'd say he might have a slight chance but at 22 i just can't see it. I like the guy and he is a local lad but with the quality now in the league and europe we need much better. Welbeck should go and Hernandez should stay as he makes a huge impact from the bench unlike welbeck.

Brendan

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Good point Adam D, I think Welbeck's best qualities are he's young, homegrown and willing to sit on the bench. Lewandowski is clearly a step up in class but could imbalance the squad IMO as he'd be expecting to start games. The most balanced starting 11 would have EITHER Lewandowski or RVP in it, not both, as they have a similar skillset. So I find our link to beg Lew a bit strange.

Gav

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14 Jan 2013 22:48:58
well played on sunday, you deserved to win.
now on to important matters, all these players will be gone in the summer and heres why-
1/ de gea, he's a tube, or a flop, hence his nickname flappy.
2/rooney, 1 good game in 5, its not enough for saf, off to spain i think.
3/ anderson, after a 6 year wait for him to come good, its sad to say its over for him, the staff at the local kfc will be in tears.
4/rio, past it, will sign for steve bruce sometime when he gets a new managers job.
5/ scoles and giggs, into the retirment home, before age concern gets involed.
6/ danny wellback, he will be going into acting in the usa, with a remake of the fresh prince of bel air, well he looks the part.
ps, you might laugh, but this could come true lol................lfc

-----------------------------------
Well This just sums up you lot to a tee lfc, to in denial about your own teams rapid DECLINE (and that is wot it is), you can call it ''transition'' and all that other junk you keep getting fed by your club but in order for that you need to be moving forward and lets be honest for a second mate, you aint exactly doing that under paul jewell are u? so by all means come on here slag our table topping team off as much as you like, we feel sorry for u, i used to think ya banter was witty and gd but now you have just shown ya self to be just another liverpool fan! full of bull!!
Chris the REDman

Believable9 Unbelievable1

14 Jan 2013 23:31:46
i think chris, its the david de gea bit, that has upset you mate, iam sorry.
ps, i think one day he will make a fine keeper maybe in spains 2nd or 3rd division lol.............lfc

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Funny guy lfc, he's funny. Even though De Gea is the successer of Casillas, and already higher than their beloved donkey Reina, he still finds a way to make fun of him.

Now what, you re gonna tell us how Alen is the welsh wizard and he's much better than Carrick, or that Jonjo Voldy shelvey is the new Gerrard, or how Lucas is the best defensive midfielder in the premiership?

Funny guy lfc

Mick

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Liverpool fans say that we are in decline. But we have a young squad that's only going to get better. Most of the next generation are in place. With every game we pull a few points further ahead of Liverpool. Whose the team going backwards? I'll give you a clue, its not us.

Fresh!

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Liverpool have been in transition for over twenty years, the thing that they haven't realised yet is that the transition has taken them from the dominant force in english football to midtable also rans. One day they'll wake up and say "what has happened to my club".

Shappy

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Liverpool have been in transition for the last few seasons, but most Liverpool fans fail to realise that transition is not necessarily a positive thing. Liverpool are now firmly a mid-table team who are a long way off competing for the top four let alone the league.

Euro league football isn't going to attract the world's best, or keep players like Suarez in the long term, and they don't have the financial clout to buy success. Any sensible Liverpool fan knows that fourth place would be a reasonable goal within the next 3-5 years. But even that will be a long struggle, especially in a climate where a significant proportion of their supporters believes that the club has a divine right to challenge for titles. In the meantime "fans" like lfc will try to live vicariously from the failure of others because they deep down they know success is beyond the capabilities of the club for the foreseeable future.

Danny Pughnited

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Another amazing come back lfc
Chris the REDman

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Oh how you mickeys make me laugh
Reina...surely he is called flappy a terrible season & in severe decline
Wisdom...Is that Norman, another young lad who looks well outof his depth
Agger....Or is that de niro from taxi driver, looks like a headless chicken
Allen...the welsh iniesta ha ha
Borini....who yes you might ask, niot even championship fodder..Stick to yourown joke side lfc
Blackpool Red

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Allen = the Welsh Leon Britton.

Sydney!

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14 Jan 2013 22:22:47
got this from the liverpool page

"The team line ups suggested that our team was like for like compared to united on paper, but in reality we had more gifted players than them on the pitch. Apart from RVP and Suarez there was no real head to head. Gerrard is much more technical than Carrick and as for the defence Skrtel-Agger pairing is as good if not better than Vidic-Ferdinand. The fullbacks in Johnson-Wisdom might be a tad lesser than Rafael-Evra. Reina again is much more qualified than De Gea. Lucas is much more experienced than Cleverly also Allen is more rated than Kagawa."


LOL

DesiRed.

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Sounds like a Jamie Redknapp post ;)

Gav

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So Kagawa, who is one of the most promising talents in the world, is less talented than " welsh Xavi " :O .

It amazes me how he missed the fact that jonjo is much better technically than Rooney.

Mick

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Allen more highly rated than Kagawa?! Kagawa was shortlisted for the 1orld Player of the Year last year whilst Allen had a decent season at Swansea. They really are funny.

Fresh!

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I did point out the ridiculousness of the Kagawa comparison to them.

AJH

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If this was the case how come the liverpool LOST again. i think in all fairness though liverpool are nearly at the end of their transition. Once they have dropped a few more places i think we will be looking at the finished article

dave

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14 Jan 2013 22:17:00
Sometimes i wonder, out of our current crop of wingers who i like most,
Nani, Young, Valencia, Giggs, Even Welbeck to an extent!
My choice would be Nani. Yes i know he is not consistent at all but he tries to get past players and always tries to make things happen, Is that not the aim of a winger?
Recently i have been very disappointed with Valencia, His game has changed somewhat. He no longer flies past opposing defenders but slows down play and just passes it backwards, even when he does have the chance to deliver a good ball he fails. Young is similar to Nani except less effective in my opinion. he cuts in and rarely has a decent end product. Nani can go inside or outside an opposing defender and keeps them guessing which also allows our wingbacks to overlap and add a different dimension to our attack.
I for one have miss him, Yes he is frustrating at times but he is also sublime other times, He is a match winner and can create things like a spark, or one chance which could turn a game, I would prefer this any day to Either Young or Valencia, Dont really have much to say about Welbeck other than he runs around alot and can't seem to grasp chances when they fall his way. Giggs doesnt have the legs for the wide position anymore and i don't think anyone would disagree with me on that one.
So who would your Winger be?
Mine would be Nani
James

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I struggle to pick one TBH. Valencia looked class last season, gutted he's not the same player this season. Young is a useful squad player IMO but I think we require someone with a bit more about them to compete in the CL.

With regards Nani, we all know he's class on his day. I've begrudged his inconsistency as much as the next man. But as things stand, we may need him to perform from now til summer to achieve our goals. I for one will give him a clean slate for now, given our wing issues we need to get behind him and hope he steps up to the plate. It will be his last chance I would have thought.

Gav

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14 Jan 2013 16:47:30
Not United related and I should probably ask this question on the Chelsea site but I'm a United fan so I hope you don't mind me asking. Have you ever seen a player go out on loan like Lukaku and appear to have contempt for his original club? He looks like a great prospect why do Chelsea not want him? He says he wants to stay at WB for another 2 years, Chelski spent alot of money on the lad, they look like fools. {Ed002's Note - Chelsea let him out on lon because he is nothing more than unfinished raw talent that needs some finishing.}

Believable0 Unbelievable0

You don't think he could help them? This would be a 4 year loan deal

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I would have thought he'd make a good 3rd choice striker for Chelsea (next season), especially given they've been short of cover up front. He looks dangerous but raw, would have thought 1 full season at WBA would give him a good grounding though. If Torres was to leave Chelsea then Falcao, Ba, Lukaku would make for a brilliant squad of strikers IMO (covering just one position). Let's hope they don't end up in that position though!

Gav

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14 Jan 2013 21:09:42
@ Jono

I support your view of the De Gea situation. To add to the debate here are some of the things i think.

1. If exactly those things would have been done by Lindegaard he would have got absolutely slaughtered on here for it.

2. De Gea relies a heavily on his natural reflexes rather than textbook technique. Its clear to see in a lot of the saves he makes which are very unorthodox in nature.

This means that it will be very difficult for the United staff to bulk him up because he will almost surely lose some of his reflexes after doing so and he is so heavily reliant on them. I think i read an interview from SAF where he mentioned something similar.

3. The problem for the saves which he put right into the danger area was actually that he got there a split second too early which gives an effect of the ball hitting his hand and rebounding back rather than the force of his dive forcing the ball away from the danger area. Its a problem with technique imo and this may be way too technical and critical but i think this can be coached into him and may be ironed out.

4. He isn't the tallest guy either, so it makes it that much more difficult for him to collect crosses, and command the box during corners.

5. We bought him based on pure potential, which seems to be our trend of buying these days. I think SAF has made a mistake here.

6. A lot of the people on here who are coming out in support of De gea are the ones who were championing for him to be brought in. A fancy Spanish name with a fat price tag and difficult deal to do seems to be the taste of some on here. Saying he is young and WILL become world class is more excuses and than a voice of reason.

I support De Gea. He was my third choice after Neur and Adler, but i must admit from what i see right now he isn't what we need. I would much rather prefer Begovic. Does everything right and is ready for the now.

De Gea MAY give us 10 years and become world class, but we can't be sure, the signs really don't seem encouraging to me, not for become a premier league great anyway. Somebody like a Begovic WILL give us 4-5 years of experienced confident goalkeeping, and i would personally prefer that, especially a change of the guard in the defense just round the corner.

I hope De Gea makes it, i really do.

REDFAITH

Believable6 Unbelievable12

Finally I'm not alone haha.

Outwith his technique ( I have mentioned punching and using legs before) what do you think of his mental abilities?

Did you see him retreat into the goal instead of coming out and blaming the defense? I find that very unsettling and adds to my belief that his frame of mind and mentality is not what it needs to be for this league.

Do you think from the rumours of us scouting Begovic, Mignolet and others? For DDG or Linders in your opinion.

Prepare to be roundly disagreed with haha.

Jono

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So your a coach now REDFAITH?
Dnt start with all that people are only protecting him because of price tag and nationality! The save on sunday was a very gd REACTION save, but you need that little bit of luck in games after making a GD reaction save! for example De gea is unsighted by Rio gets down and saves the ball, unluckily for him Rafa was unaware of sturridge's run into the box.
Now look at the arsenal game after ours, Shez makes a gd save from the first shot for the second goal, but funny enough, if he had pushed it in front of him Dzeko doesn't get a tap in goal, its all swings and round abouts mate, keepers are there to save shots and defenders are there to defend our goal from shots, so who was in the wrong?? Because De gea saved the shot but i suppose if he had been 'technically' gd he should of saved the shot, spotted rafa had switched off, got up quickly, closed the space down on sturridge and saved the follow up shot, pushing it out for a throw in, because we can't risk a corner against him.
but back to the real world for a second, you say we can't bulk him up so he can't be commanding because he needs his to be that slim to make his un-technical saves? because cech, VDS, Buffon and Caslilas are built like brick S**T houses aint they? You dnt need to be massive to be commanding! Expirence will bring that, but by your thinking we should just cut our loses go and buy STOKES goalkeeper and let him develope into a worldclass keeper elsewhere! I take into account that right now he aint perfect but he is 22! in a new league at the biggest club in the world, trying to fill one of the best goalkeepers the prem has seen boots! I will stand by my comments if he sell him or keep him, he WILL turn into a worldclass keeper soon and i hope we are there to benefit from it! The united way is to buy young and produce them into worldclass players NOT ditch them after 18 months on the back of the media and and upset ex scouse players on sky's witch hunt!
Tell me wot you think when you see hart? cech and begovic mignolet etc?
i'll tell you wot i see, i see very gd keepers playing at there full potential, and when i look at de gea i see a younger keeper not that much behind them keepers mentioned but with still bags of potential.
nuer, Hart, adler, begovic ain't nowhere a 'in there prime' Casillias, buffon, VDS or Schmeical.
Plz take no nastiness in my post, had a few beers :)
Chris the REDman

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14 Jan 2013 20:40:25
well played on sunday, you deserved to win.
now on to important matters, all these players will be gone in the summer and heres why-
1/ de gea, he's a tube, or a flop, hence his nickname flappy.
2/rooney, 1 good game in 5, its not enough for saf, off to spain i think.
3/ anderson, after a 6 year wait for him to come good, its sad to say its over for him, the staff at the local kfc will be in tears.
4/rio, past it, will sign for steve bruce sometime when he gets a new managers job.
5/ scoles and giggs, into the retirment home, before age concern gets involed.
6/ danny wellback, he will be going into acting in the usa, with a remake of the fresh prince of bel air, well he looks the part.
ps, you might laugh, but this could come true lol................lfc

Believable4 Unbelievable10

And you'll be losing Reina, Agger, Skrtl & Suarez, whereas we all want Scholes and Giggs to retire, wel all know Rio won't be far behind and some of us want to sell Rooney.

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We will still win and be near the top and you will still be miles behind us. Take a look at your own squad, Allen was a terrible buy at that crazy price. Gerrard is old and your best player will go to a place where he can win. Reinal is past it and you have a clown for a manager.

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If we wre to sell all those we'd be swimming in cash! Hardly a major worry.

Am I to read between the lines that 'United are in decline and next season will be ours' ? Lol

Gav

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Nice to see a pool fan admit we deserved the 3pts.
I see you use my ploy, like when i end a sarcastic text to someone, end it with lol and they can't be annoyed.
1, Pepe Reina back to Spain, he couldn't stop a pig in a passage.
2, Skrtel will move to Hollywood, playing Skeletor in the new live action blockbuster.
3, Gerrard will at last take everyone's advice outside of mersyside and move to Spain or Italy for one last title bid.
4, Suarez will also move to Hollywood after being hounded out of Britain at every football ground in the country to play Splinter in the new teen age mutant hero turtles movie.
5, Brendan Rogers will get the sack from Liverpool for not qualifying for Europe and crawl back to Swansea only to be shown the door and end up in the championship managing a delegation threatened team that he was perfect for all along........... you may laugh but this really could happen lol.
Flyhalfmitch

p.s.thanks for the 6 pts this season.....cheers easy!!

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He wasn't so flappy against you was he, saying that he didn't have much to do. One save in the whole game.

Rooney didn't even play, imagine if he did.

Sydney!

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Balls coming on this site, and criticising our players, when every single player you mentioned in the post, would playing every single match for yer Looserpool.

ZigZag

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Now this is the story all about how
Their lives got twisted upside down
And I'd like to take a moment just sitting right there
How Liverpool ended all the way down there

(Fresh Prince of Bel Air tune ft. Danny Welbeck)

AvidDevil

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So the man of the match was useless, de gea is a flop far better than Reina and lastly rio is past it? Remind me what did Suarez do on Sunday?

Caolán.

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So lfc Liverpool still struggle to beat a Utd team that's been hampered by injuries and has kept on its golden oldies. Mock us all you want but how many points are you behind us. So concentrate on your own team is they' ll need all the support they can.

Mad Hatter

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Not sure what your point is. We know Giggs and Scholes will retire, that's why we bought Powell and will clearly buy again. Rio is also getting older, which is why we have Smalling and Jones in the wings. Anderson has been injured so much he has hardly played, you may hate Rooney but he still delivers when he's asked to. Welbeck may or may not make it, if not then we will replace him possibly with Henriquez. As for De Gea, Spain's next number 1.

I love the fact that after 23 years you think trying to annoy us is good sport. I don't even get annoyed any more, I just find you very very sad.

AJH

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Cute, trying to use comedic relief to cover up how awful your club is. 24 points behind us is the real funny rubbish right there.

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Rub it in mate


united 1999

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15 Jan 2013 00:49:34
AVIDDEVIL, ..........bravo...............lfc

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14 Jan 2013 20:20:19
SAF has started allocating the resources for next season with Wilfred Zaha and Luka Modric high on the list. United will also look for a powerful midfielder along with at least 1 new centre back. Hummels is a long term target but the 2 Greek centre backs (Sokratis Papastathopoulos and Kyriakos Papadopoulos) are both being watched.

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Hummels please I couldn't afford to buy the letters for my shirt with the other two lol
ARB

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14 Jan 2013 20:10:33
Wish Fergie would just come out and just say if any of these rumours about De Gea leaving are true like: " He is one of the best young keepers around and will be with us for many years to come". Get annoyed at reading so many articles about De Gea being linked with a move back to Spain

James

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14 Jan 2013 20:09:38
Ok, getting a bit worried about StevieK. It's a bit crappy over there and whilst he was getting the day off, let's hope nothing bad happened to him on Saturday. Don't take the p1ss out of me, it's not a good situation over there, people are getting hurt. He hasn't posted which is unusual. Of course, he could just have got very drunk...

AJH

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Hopefully just a mega hangover after beating the scousers.

DodgyBanter

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StevieK is a belfast lad right?

I live over in Belfast now and to be fair mate where i live i have barely even seen a protestor. It is only a few places where things have gotten out of hand. The peeps burning buses etc the other night are right people and don't even know what they are even trying to accomplish.

Anyways don't wanna get all political on here so will leave it there but ya man StevieK is most likely, as Dodgy put it, nursing a killer hangover.

Paso

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Despite the shocking, drunken revelation that you were married, I knew you still cared AJH! :)

I did get to see the game, and was planning a serious session after, but got a call just prior saying I was starting back at 5, because of the trouble, so that was knocked on the head.

I've been on since then until just now, bar a three hour kip at my bosses house. Bit bruised and battered, stiff and sore, and extremely weary, but still smiling after the result.

Appreciate the concern mate, genuinely.

StevieK

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And Paso is right. Don't even think of not visiting here!

There have been protests the length and breadth of the country that have all passed off peacefully. It's just a few hardline pockets round some estates in the Belfast suburbs.

You can still come and wine and dine, go to the theatre, see our beautiful scenery, and you wouldn't even stumble upon a protestor, never mind a riot.

You'd still be safer in Belfast city centre, than any big city on the mainland.

StevieK

ps I moonlight for the Northern Irish Tourist board :)

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14 Jan 2013 18:34:16
Everyone is talking about Zaha but I honestly think Isco has to be our priority in terms of winger. Far better than Zaha in everything. He can play left wing, right wing(crosses ball better than our wingers atm) and attacking midfielder. At that age, we could get him around £18m( Real Madrid bid €16m was turned down). If or when Rooney leaves, Kagawa can play in mid and Isco from left wing dropping causing all sorts of Nightmares.

Chelsea has been investing heavily in young players. And I can guarantee that if he does go to any big team. He will be in first team(with a year or 2, he caused real madrid lots of trouble when they played).

What do you guys think?

Red Samurai

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Why not sell Nani and someone else either Young or Valencia and buy both Isco and Zaha?

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Because Nani, Young and Valencia are all better than Zaha and proven they can play at the top level. No argumenst from me on Buying ISCO or Muniain.

Shahram

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Has to be isco he looks class

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Valencia is no better than my milkman. Wake up and smell the coffee.

Aesop

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14 Jan 2013 18:23:16
Excuse me and where was the brand in the 2nd half, oh yeah he gave the ball away which allowed the scousers to score.
Carrick was yet again the best midfielder on the pitch.
Still can't believe they paid £15M for Allen, he is truly shocking.
"The Welsh Xavi" that is so so funny.

Red Daz
----------------
The Brand? You have your tongue well and truly up his a55.

G.A.G.U.S

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Oh dear, there's always one G.A.G.U.S isn't there.

TK-Red

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Shocking TK, shocking.

G.A.G.U.S

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Funnily enough it was carricks bad pass which led to clevs losing it...

JK92

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Prat!!

Marky Mark

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Why all the hate toward Clev? I don't get it, good player, I've never heard anybody say he was great. I just don't understand United fans hating on a player for no apparent reason.

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14 Jan 2013 20:45:41
Carrick was awful 2nd half. Most of his passes were misplaced or fired into players chests from a few yards

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Carrick's allowed an off day, he has been immense this season.

Sydney!

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Game of two halves for Carrick, I think.

First half was as good a performance as I've seen from him - absolutely controlled the midfield and his passing was accurate and incisive.

Second half, he was pants.

StevieK

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Sure the no-names comment about Carrick's second half performance was Jamie Redknapp's or Hansen's word-for-word? Correct me if I'm wrong

ALDUtd

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I think it still proves the point that our current CM can't handle the pressure game. We need 2 CMs that are perfectly happy in possession when pressed and capable of keeping the pressing up the field game going for 90mins.

Jono

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15 Jan 2013 10:18:40
Dont worry syd i wasnt slating yr fave player, carrick has had a great season, his form just lately has been excellent. he was very good 1st half but 2nd half he was shocking, the game needs to be commented on how we see it, not always with bias tiwards and against certain players.
Annoys me how carrick can do no wrong
and cleverly can't do anything right
on here anyway

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There is a strange dislike of Cleverley on here from one or two. Very odd that they want a youth product to fail, especially when he has had a good start at United. He needs to be a little more adventurous and that will come with game time, but other than that he has been efficient and has grew into the midfield.

I would say Smalling, Jones, RvP & Hernandez are my favourite players. the first three for their talent and Hernandez for his personality. I just think Clevs deserves a fair crack of the whip before he is hounded out of the club like Gibson was.

Sydney!

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Clevz is pure class. Well done Tom, I think you're having an excellent season and have a great chance (together with Rafa) of winning the Young Player of the Year Award.
PerthDave

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14 Jan 2013 18:21:01
Jono

Would you be able to speak fluent Spanish in interviews after 18 months if you joined Real Madrid? Don't think so. You don't train with De Gea every day, you don't speak with him every day, so how do you know how fluent he is in English, one of the most difficult languages in the world to learn? Valencia can't speak English after 6 years in England? Tevez can't speak English after 6 years in England? But God forbid, David de Gea can't speak English fluently after 18 months in England.

Frankly Jono, if Neuer saves that shot yesterday, not a word is said. That's a fact. De Gea is a scapegoat with people it seems. I was more annoyed with Rafael(who had a great game) for not covering Sturridge(by the way, Rafa didn't have his back to goal when the shot was taken). Didn't the exact same thing happen last season in the Europa League, when De Gea made a save, and Rafael was asleep allowing Muniain to score? No doubt, you probably blamed De Gea then too. So the defence should take responsibility, or at least partial responsibility if the ball falls to an attacker. I'll give you the Newcastle mistake, and maybe the Swansea one too. But yesterday was not a mistake. He was unsighted by Rio, the shot came in low and hard. Watch again, and you can see how fast he had to get down. Makes the save, is up quickly again, only for Rafael to be asleep.

Mignolet better than De Gea? Szczesny better than De Gea? Jono, you couldn't make this up. Did you see City's second goal yesterday? Mr. 'Better than De Gea' palmed a shot straight to Dzeko for him to score. I suppose there's an excuse for that is there? Mignolet is a decent shot stopper, and that's it. Cech and Hart are rather obvious Jono, but I can guarantee you thought Joe Hart's City career was over when he went on loan to Birmingham didn't you? Hart showed no world class promise in his early days at City, hence the signing of Shay Given to replace him. Did you think he was going to be world class then?

It's amazing that people have no patience in this world anymore. We signed a promising young goalkeeper, knowing he wasn't going to set the world alight at first, yet people are still pissed off straight away when he makes the odd mistake at such a young age. Jono, what is this fumble we see every week? I didn't see him fumble anything yesterday? Or against West Ham? Or against West Brom? So why make stuff up? You kept saying he made a mistake against City, yet it was a world class double save.

I think you need to show just a little bit of support Jono. Just imagine he is wearing an Adler mask.

G.A.G.U.S

Believable17 Unbelievable1

Agree with EVERYTHING you said, now it's starting to become pathetic blaming De Gea for every goal.
Change the record and get behind our players.

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I think in Jono's case he has made his mind up and nothing Big Save Dave can do will change his mind, he won't be happy until he has been driven back to Spain.

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Agree with G.A.G.U.S 100%, great post. I read someone on here yesterday say english was an easy language to learn, what a load of rubbish, it is one of if not THE hardest. Come on most english people can't speak/write it so what chance has De Gea after 18 months?? He has fantastic raw talent and with a few more years of experience he will be immense. I just hope he is still at our fantastic club.

He was not at fault yesterday what so ever and anyone that thinks he was is either an person who listens to other persons too much or just had no idea about goalkeeping. It was a very quick reaction save and he did amazingly to get a hand on it. In these cases the ball can go anywhere and Raphael was caught daydreaming as has happened before. He could easily have beaten Sturridge to it and done his defensive job if he hadnt totally switched off.

I don't see a goalkeeper in the league who has got more promise than De Gea. He won't actually hit his peak until his 30's either so i don't see everyones problem other than the fact that they don't get goalkeeping. Everyone raves about Hart but he is no better on crosses than De Gea is now and he has more experience. If he was english everyone would be raving about him but because he cost £18 million and is a foreign keeper everyone is on his back. In a few years all the people wanting rid will be on here spouting crap like 'I always knew he'd come good' and 'what a great keeper' you wait and see.

Brendan

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I agree we should give DDG time and be patient. The summer would be a good time to re-evaluate, so let's see how he gets on til then. He has clearly improved with us IMO but still has room for improvement.

I particularly agree with your point that although his weak palm out against Newcastle (for instance) was a mistake, yesterday's effort was just a good save. Looking at it in real time, and taking account of the angle and power of the shot it would have taken immense technical ability and luck to push that wide.

Gav

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Lets be honest.
English is surely one of the easier languages in the world, certainly the easiest in Europe.
Grammar is way, way, way easier then any other European language.
Mastering any language is challenging though!

So I don't blame him not taking interviews in English, just look at how Ronaldo speaks English, quite embarrassing for someone who moved to England at the tender age of 17!

Jonny8

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Jonny8, to use a good old English word...poppycock! There are differing views on how easy / difficult English is. Whilst we don't have genders our spelling and grammar is somewhat bizarre. It can also depend on the native language of the person attempting to speak it. As you say though, no language is easy and I think we should leave the kid alone.

AJH

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Courtois is a much better keeper then DDG and so is Begovic.

FRED THE RED

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G.A.G.U.S

It doesn't need to be fluent mate but as a keeper who has to communicate, organise, command and use his voice to stamp authority he must be able to grasp the basic football lingo. Maybe he can but if he can he isn't doing it.

I didn't mean weekly fumbles I meant weekly there is a talking point about something that can be linked to the GK. against West Ham he didn't put a foot wrong but there is something in it if you can only highlight half the games over the last month where he hasn't done anything wrong.

If you now say you give me the Newcastle and Swansea ones are you not a little concerned that its happened agin? Even taking the blame game out of it the fact we have conceded 3 now in the same way must be a point of interest. I think the manager will tell the defense to keep on their toes but put more emphasis on the keeper doing better.

In the light of signing him I was always against it, I always preferred others but just as he may have been others first choice doesnt mean he is right. If the stories are true that we get rid in the summer what then? Will you stick by your judgement or think SAF knows best still? It could put allot of DDG's fans in an awkward spot.

I firmly believe mignolet and Szczesny are better all rounders than DDG. DDG is ahead on shot stopping but there is multiple other areas where he lacks. You can't compare two players mate like for instance Hart had played for Shrewsbury, city off to Birmingham and back to city by 22 where as DDG has played in Athletico then with us by the same age so he should be better as he has played more top flight games. Who would I rather, Hart after the Birmingham loan or DDG now? Hart all day! Its just my opinion.

I would change that opinion if he was doing all the things I want in a keeper regularly. Unfortunately those areas seem to be up there in his weaker areas. I don't want punches I want catches. I don't want palm outs I want holds or tips. I don't want keepers that sink into their nets I want a keeper that if he thought it was Rafas fault getting in his face screaming at him to pull his finger out. I can't see how a keeper can be a success without those. All the greats do/did it.

I know allot think we just need to give him time and point to players doing it to their 40s like VDS but that's like saying the same will happen with all keepers which is not the case.

Guess time will tell at the end of the season with what SAF does. It's my opinion that he has till the end of the year to sharpen up or he could be for the chop.

Jono

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You know, I always see this 'De Gea bashing' but just didn't think I needed to respond. I honestly feel as tho some of us think we are player fifa/footbal manager. Maybe we are playing robots (as opposed to humans) that are not expected to be tired, off form, or have any short comings as long as they have their batteries charged (even so, my gadgets seem to misbehave quite regularly). I guess that's why some of us would never have a career in management. We seem to know which players will never be great, who we should sell and who to buy. If it were up to most of you, our club would die. (End of rant).

De Gea is a good player with loads of potential. Is he polished at this stage? No. Neither was Ronaldo, who was frustrating and raw, but became an awesome player. Most goalkeepers don't even start showing great class that early, and De Gea single handedly saved us on many occasions. I believe the lad will be good, and I would hate to see him sold, only for him to blossom at some other team. Give the lad a break, bunch ah know it alls.
P.S. If I wasn't born in an english speaking country, I don't know how I'd do with the classes.

Bernidre

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14 Jan 2013 18:14:28
I don't no why but I can't wait for nani to fit again I gave a good feeling that he will be back st jus best again.
What do y'all fink?

Spoogz

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Funny how some of us can't wait for to be sold!
RedSince68

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I really hope so, we need him on top form desperately. I'm sure he will be given plenty of opportunities given our current wing situation - so it's down to Nani now to prove he can consistently perform. We all know he has the ability, on his day.

Gav

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Think you are wishful thinking8
Chris the REDman

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14 Jan 2013 17:59:07
"David will be slightly disappointed, " admitted Steele, when reviewing the keeper's first year. "We probably got what we expected. There was no way we expected him to come in and play as he had been playing.

"It was a totally different change for him in many, many ways. Hence the reason why we said before that, to replace Edwin, we needed two and that was the main reason why Anders Lindegaard was on board. So when we did feel he needed to come out, as you know, the games were shared with Ben Amos and Anders.

"Anders had the injury just after Christmas and then, as fate has it, David gets back in when you least expect it and just went on and it was important he finished strongly. That's the big plus factor for us. He has adapted partly. The first season is always the most difficult. He has been through lots of firsts and we know he'll be better prepared in terms of the second time."
To add to the convo before

Believable3 Unbelievable0

14 Jan 2013 17:30:42
De Gea won't be leaving. He's our number 1, hence him starting the majority of games. If we are looking at new keepers, my bet is that it's to replace Lindegaard.

Percy

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14 Jan 2013 18:32:17
My theory on Wesley, based on nothing but a hunch. His age, skills, wage demands and position while not exact are not too dissimilar to lampard. Now if you think that frank offers more to team morale ie it won't upset rvp, and he will come for free and he will be happier rotating. Plus it means saf can use every spare penny getting cr.

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14 Jan 2013 17:06:13
Question for ed, sid, i am kloot

How will man utd be this year financially,
I mean the debt, what will net debt be
Sponsors, will they have a big impact and are we due to re negotiate any
Performances in league and champs league, will they help dramatically

Please give me a detailed awnser!


Big v {Ed007's Note - Over to you Syd, and use some lubricant, you don't want any nasty friction burns down there.}

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You just opened the gates to hell. I can see a Sydney kloot standoff

Mick

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Lol, Mick. He's causing trouble ain't he? :)

I would be interested to hear Syd's views though as he's good with the figures. Do you know the details of our re-negotiated sponshorship deals, Syd?

From a less knowledgable point of view, I'm not worried about our finances TBH. We've spent healthily in the last 2 summer windows and the gap between loan repayments and revenue seems to be increasing gradually. So long as we have the funds to improve the squad and/or facilities when required then the rest of the finances are of less concern to me as a football fan.

Gav

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Gav, don't do it, you have your whole life ahead of you...

AJH

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We are looking at turning over a record £360m+ this year. I imagine debt will drop to around £320m gross. We have already made £15m-£20m more this season in the UCL compared to last season. Then there's the £11m Chevy cash plus £5m-£10m more in little sponsorships and telecommunication deals. Player sales will make the finances look very healthy, with Nani going plus others the profits in sales will be significantly more than last year.

The season after the debt will fall below £300m providing we get past the UCL group stages. TV money is rising £34m, the Nike deal will be £20m more than it currently is so the turnover will be into the £400m's.

I am sooooo hot right now ;)

Sydney!

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Oh and with the debt decreasing, the interest is falling. In 2010 we were paying £68.8m in interest every year. During a massive recession didn't help matters. Now the interest has fell to £31m after the £63m was removed from the gross debt in the summer. We are in a very comfortable position financially, "BUT" lets not forget we should never have been put in this position in the first place.

Sydney!

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AJH, I'm living on the edge and it feels good, lol

Gav

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Cheers Syd, always there with the figures!

Hope to see a good level of investment again this summer, given we still have gaps to plug (CM, winger, possibly LB/CB) and there should in theory be money there to fund such deals. One more strong summer and I feel we should have a top mix of youth/experience/quality in the squad. We'd be in a good position to just 'tweak' then for a couple of years, which would be a luxury.

Gav

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Gav, tweaking is a luxury and it's a luxury Chelsea have had in the past when Drogba and Lampard were in their primes and a luxury City have got now. It would be great for us to complete our transition so that we can spend £25m+ on a special player every season.

Sydney!

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Exactly Syd, like Barca have been for the last 4/5 years too. The best part about being in that position is the consistency of performance you get from having a similar squad from one season to the next.

Gav

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14 Jan 2013 17:04:06
tkred just to go to a point further below, if barca were to make an offer for de gea of cash plus player, which player would you expect them to offer or who would ask for? For me sanchez or cesc.

Believable1 Unbelievable0

If Barca or Real came calling for him I would either ask for....

1) £30 million.
2) Alex Song and £15 million
3) Sami Khedira and £12 million
4) Fabio Coentrao and £15 million
5) Alexis Sanchez and £8 million

I think all of them would improve our team and leave a good amount to spend on the replacement (Begovic, Ter Stegen etc)

Let me just be clear though I do not think he will leave for another 2 years or more

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Messi or ronaldo

Ross

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Its a good question. Perhaps they would try and offer someone who isn't part of the first 11? Maybe Thiago or Jonathan Dos Santos? I would like to see someone like Sanchez or Fabregas but I don't see them being offered.

TK-Red

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14 Jan 2013 16:55:34
bond i see your favourite hazel irvine is looking fine on the snooker. {Ed007's Note - Two of my most hated things together then :-)

Believable2 Unbelievable0

14 Jan 2013 18:04:11
best not send the photo in of her in a celtic top then. {Ed007's Note - She's far too ugly to be a Celtic supporter.}

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Bond did you see Jackie Bird on the Hogmanay show?

Jesus Christ! If ball sacks could have an elbow!

Jono {Ed007's Note - She has been seriously not well Jono and needed a couple of emergency ops. That was her first public appearance in a few months, she actually grew up 5 mins from where I stay.}

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Bond

I never knew that mate she did very well getting herself ready for the show then.

Did you hear about the Gartcosh player that died this weekend? My workmate was watching the game and told us about it today?

RIP Mr Bain

Jono {Ed007's Note - I checked there Jono, it was a twisted bowel she had and it was very serious, her family were told to say their goodbyes. I heard about the Gartcosh player, tragic isn't even a strong enough word for that kind of thing.}

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Is Jackie Bird still reading the news over there! What age is she now?

She was reading the news when I was at Uni over in Aberdeen back in the late 80s/early 90s.

Hope she's ok.

StevieK {Ed007's Note - She is 50, God I feel old!!}

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14 Jan 2013 23:56:53
i think she's cute. Hazel irvine i mean. I've bagged off with worse, some horrid cases of the ten-to-two's in the past. The ol cider visors do go on the blink. {Ed007's Note - Hazel Irvine...cute!!! You are one sick puppy, no wonder you didn't leave a name.}

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I'll be honest, I fancied Hazel rotten all those years ago :)

StevieK

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14 Jan 2013 15:05:52
Here's an interesting topic for discussion;

Robin Van Persie vs Dimitar Berbatov

When you look at both players and their attributes, they are actually quite similar;

Technically superb
Intelligent football brain
Excellent link-up play
Neither particularly blessed with rapid pace
Superb movement & spacial awareness
Natural finishers
Charismatic/flair type players

Now, I'm not saying that Dimitar's time at Old Trafford wasn't a success - in fact far from it, I doe one highly rated Berbatov, and really enjoyed watching him play (particular highlight being his hat-trick against Liverpool!). Looking back however, when SAF bought Berbatov I think SAF expected Berbatov to make the kind of impact that RVP is having at the moment. Unfortunately I don't think that ever happened in truth.

The question is why? Looking at berbatov as a player and as a character, he should have had that impact in hindsight. Is 'work ethic' the real difference between these two players? Would it be harsh to say that perhaps Berbatov wasn't as 'liked' by the other players compared to RVP. RVP does have this untouchable/invincible 'aura' around him ala Eric Cantona, which Berbatov never really had, so is this the difference between the two players?

Interested in everyone's thoughts on this.


WF Red Devil

Believable4 Unbelievable1

14 Jan 2013 15:37:49
a sound theory. Van persie plays with a smile on his face. The berb played with a frown. I think its a combination of personality and work rate.

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Rvp has better movement a more intelligent football brain and a far superior temperament not to mention he's probs better at everything else aswell but he's really humble and great team player i remeber a post mach interview he did where the interviewer was praising his exceptional start at old trafford to which he replied he wasnt satisfied with his his assist tally
and wanted to improve that which shows you his mentality.

marlow

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RVP works harder than Berbatov. It's that simple. People used to say of Berba "He isn't lazy, just has a languid style" but RVP covers much more ground than Berbatov and doesn't insist on taking so much time on the ball. RVP's main concern is being effective as opposed to being stylish. It just so happens he manages both where as Berbatov always wanted to play in a harlem globetrotters kind of way. That's my take anyway.

TK-Red

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RvP's movement stretches defences all over the place, creating space for the other players to run into.

I like Berbatov and how he plays but it isn't the United way. His through balls are exceptional.

They are both clinical finishers, the key difference is however. RvP is a team-player and does alot of work off the ball, where as Berbatov commands the ball at his feet, and plays the game at his own pace

ALDUtd

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14 Jan 2013 16:26:13
"RVP's main concern is being effective as opposed to being stylish. It just so happens he manages both"

That's a great point to be fair.

WF Red Devil

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14 Jan 2013 16:55:39
To be fair, they're all sound and reasonable responses and I agree with all the points made.

The census seems to be that whilst Berbatov was without very technically gifted, the difference seems to simply be a 'team ethic' mentality. Whether that be creating space for others, physically working harder for the team, etc.

Would anyone disagree that perhaps the move to Old Trafford might have be perhaps a little 'too big' for him (as in Berbatov)? Some players thrive and improve under pressure, whilst some crumble, and of course some do not change their performance levels at all. Clearly RVP is thriving on the pressure of having to perform week in and out, and it's bringing out the best in him.

I see similaralities between Berbatov and Nani in that respect. No doubting Nani's ability, but is Old Trafford perhaps a little too big for him also?

Appreciate the comments guys, and Ed's keep up the superb work!

WF Red Devil

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Sound post and I agree that rvp and berba were both bought for an instant impact. I think if I'm completely honest people would have much rather we had signed tevez, who much like rvp was a crowd favourite. Tevez was more popular than berba because of his bulldog and incomparable work rate where he would chase the ball all day. Now I was a massive fan of berba and tevez despite him being an absolute person and traitor. But they were the complete different end of the spectrum when it comes to the style of forward play. But I believe that rvp incorporates both these two players skills with berba-esque control and skill with tevez's work rate and robustness. And as a result he has the aura which is revered by the fans, management and fellow players a la cantona. We are incredibly fortunate to have him and he is a pleasure to watch.

Park 3 lung

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14 Jan 2013 18:13:56
yes i agree it was too big a move. The price tag didn't help him. We overpaid pure and simple. Not his fault but it created a pressure on him. Also it didn't help with people saying he was the new eric. He simply couldn't cope with the expectation. I also think its too big for nani as well, the pressure of the ronaldo comparisons.

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Or to put it simply, Berbs was lazy and missed so many chances. RVP is a born winner, he has fire in his belly and is world class.

Boyley

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14 Jan 2013 13:23:01
To add to this whole Wesley Sneijder 'is he isn't he' debate, lets use a bit of logic.......

1. He plays in a position where we've recently recruited a young emerging talent (Shinji Kagawa).

2. It's a position where Rooney is slowly being integrated into, and we're likely to use him more in that role as time go on.

3. Wages (no need to say any more)

4. It's rare that SAF goes in for players twice - especially he the 1st time the player in question was being too greedy, and clearly was incentivised by money rather than career success.

5. He's 28 - which once again goes against our age biased recruitment policy. Yes, we had the Berbatov example, and more recently the RVP purchase, however these were 'special cases', and a big factor that made them 'special cases' were because both were proven in the Premier League.

6. I think Sneijder is over the hill slightly, and I believe his 'better days' are behind him. Players develop and reach there respective prime at different ages. Owen peaked very early in his career, as did Rooney. RVP on the other hand matured like a fine wine and is currentyly enjoying his peak (and long my that continue!). SAF is superb at judging players, and releasing them when their on the decline.

That's my view on it, thinking from a logically perspective. Sneijder was a great player in his prime, but unfortunately I knot convinced he's the same player.

Thoughts and comments always welcome.


WF Red Devil

Believable4 Unbelievable3

WF

I think he was targetted to play CM next to Carrick mate not CAM so that would nullify a couple of your points. We currently have 2 CMers at 3 and 38 so a player ten years younger would be a massive asset plus if he were to play deeper his passing would be utilized more than his running which Scholes has shown in his career can be very effective.

The wages thing seems to be a block but that could be over come with some negotiation.

Blanc was approached more than once as was Maldini, Thuram, VDS aswell so there has been a couple previously even if they still didn't come.

Jono

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Just cause you think you make sense mate dose not make it logic...... Maybe he hasn't peeked yet maybe he is wanted for a different roll an maybe his wage won't be an issue in future

CAIN

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Think its fairly obvious he peaked 2-3 years ago.

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Can everybody stop with the Wesley Sneijder will he won't he comments.don't want him don't need him past his best move on and forget him, its getting tedious.

nelly

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14 Jan 2013 13:19:23
Guys I haven't really watched either of Zaha or Strootman play regularly but from the videos and games I have seen I have the following conclusions about the two.

Strootman : Most of the videos I saw of him were of him scoring goals or putting in decent balls from midfield. Couldnt find any videos of him tackling or harrassing players and stealing the ball off them. Surely that is a trait that we are looking for in a midfielder, arent we ?


Zaha : To me he looked like a poor mans Nani. He is quick, tricky player but his crossing didn't look that good to me. But age is on his side, can he turn into a player good enough to play for us ?


MUMBAI_BOY

Believable7 Unbelievable0

I don't rate strootman highly, mvila and sissoko are voth ahead of him and both available.
That said its not always the individusl ability that determines compatibility for the team. Maybe there are some specific tactical reasons we seem to want strootman over the two i mentioned
Bren,

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14 Jan 2013 14:48:26
in fairness to strootman your not really going to find many videos on youtube that are collections of great tackles whereas you will easily get goals. Zaha is like nani was at that age and can be worked. Nani failed but zaha might succeed as we won't have the early issues we had with nani of having to settle him into a new country. Also zaha won't be crippled with the new ronaldo tag like nani was. If nani does leave i would still want a replacement for him as well as zaha.

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14 Jan 2013 15:11:30
bren mvila has serious attitude problems meaning no one will touch him with a barge pole and fergie is too old for that much hassle. Sissoko is regarded as having gone backwards over the last eighteen months.

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I read recently that Rene Muelensteen said that Strootman is not a player that has been mentioned inside old trafford, which was quite odd given all the press reports.

I am starting to think none of teh players mentioned including lew are going to end up with us.

Shahram

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You will not see Strootman making crunshing tackles. Its not his style. He is more like Toure in that respect, simply overpowering opposition players off the ball.

In the europa league he averaged 8 tackles per game. Carrick averages 2, 5. Just some stats for you

Mick

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14 Jan 2013 12:03:26
So to west ham and i think rooney anderson and nani are going to come in with something to prove!

belive syd when he says rooney wasnt injured, looks real slim !

nani for me was given a break to sort his head out aswell as being imjured and i beleive hell come back fireing

Anderson bin back in training a while now so can see him returning to the form he was getting too just before he got injured!

You know 99 the treble year i was on school trip in belgium and i decided to go karting instead of watching final thinking man you had it in the bag! we got back early from the trip about the 85th minute and the rest was hisotry, woke the hole hotel up though !

big v

Believable2 Unbelievable3

Big V, I believe Nani was injured, but not as badly as the manager made out. My thoughts on Rooney are just my opinion, but I do think he was told to get into shape. I think we will see a slimmer and more sharp Rooney against WHU or Spurs. I think his compassionate leave made his comeback a little delayed. He has been training for a few days so surprised he wasn't on the bench.

Sydney!

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Man you??

GDS

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Not sure about that if he wasn't injured I think he would if been in the squad against Liverpool hope to see him against west ham

Agree2 Disagree0

What?! We had a chance to win our first European Cup since 68 and you decided to go karting as we "had it in the bag". Surely I can't be the only one who is astounded by this?

TK-Red

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I would say that we will line up like this:

_________Lindegaard
Jones__Smalling__Evans__Buttner
Nani___Carrick__Anderson__Giggs
______Rooney__Chicharito

Nani, Anderson and Rooney in particular need games. Giggs is a sensible choice to give our other two wingers a break, Jones to come in for Rafael and a keeper rotation. We may see Evra at left back, but I think Buttner will get a game. As for the bench, well I think one or two young faces will make it, probably Tunnicliffe and Vermijl.

Fresh!

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14 Jan 2013 13:18:30
lol man you i ment to man utd,

Syd do you think nani will be wanting to prove a point as fergie gave him vote of confidence a while back saying we need a nani and is incredible talented

Big V

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Lol hey i was young and my dream was to be a f1 driver back then !

still my memory of that day puts a smile on my face everytime i talk about it !

tk red i think moments like that keep you a fanf or life through the rough and smooth off the club!

Big V

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You're not wrong there Big V.....but just imagine if you had missed it? The idea of missing that occasion makes me shudder.

TK-Red

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Must of been fate. surely as my grandad is a man city fan he would of loved me to miss that moment lol.

Big V

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14 Jan 2013 15:33:35
i watched it sat in my replica shirt, o the shame eh kloot. Looking like it was finishing one nil in the 85th i took my shirt off. Can't claim credit but was buzzing at college the next day.

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14 Jan 2013 21:09:23
Rooney only started training Friday be lucky to make the bench at WH

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14 Jan 2013 11:50:55
Lads in work this morning recon we are in contact wit WS about a move after being talked up by RVP to senior staff......heard he voted for RVP at ballon dor so can't imagine they really hate one another ...... This is a rumour no more no less so please keep the childish comment to a minimum .......... I hope it's true the guy is fantastic but I love the guy so am completely bias but all the talk about Liverpool in contact could be bull according to Wat one of the eds have being saying .......... So eds syd GDS anyone heard anything ........ Also I'm pretty sure at this stage Zaha is nailed on ........

CAIN

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Apparently United are interested if the price is right. Sadly Sneijder is showing no signs of lowering his demands. Do not think it will happen mate sorry.

Sydney!

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If you believe the papers WS doesn't want to go to Gala, if he did i think he'd be away by now unless he is bidding his time to see if we or any other EPL team come in.

If he wants to stay at the top level he will have to reconsider the wages he's looking for, the fee is no problem for most teams but if he drops his wages i think we'll be interested.
Voting for RVP could have been a signal that he wants to play beside him, i have always said i would love him in a united shirt, i would play him in a deeper role as scholes have done in his latter years partnering cleverley - him and carrick could interchange.

I underrstand the wages and age are the main things but RVP is the same age and look at his impact, could RVP become SAF greatest ever signing?

I'm not sure if any of this will come off, i for one hope it does, i would be gutted if he moved too another EPL team such as those dippers.

Giants14

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Is it true i hope soo, if we get him and cr7 comes back 2 us we will be feared by every top team on this planet it will be awesome finger crossed;)zee

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Have to agree with syd and the club on this one. If the price is right then he would be one hell of a signing, he seems like he just wants the cash though and we have amazing team spirit that we wouldn't want to threaten.

GDS

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It says a lot for Sneijder that even in such a desperate situation, he refuses to budge on his demands.

Surely, if only an average Turkish club are interested, its time to rethink your valuation of yourself. But Sneijder, even when he's not playing at all and has no other obvious options, refuses to budge on his own valuation of his worth.

Not the kind of player I want at OT, to be honest. If it were me, I'd be slashing my wage demands like a man possessed - what's the other option?! Never play football? Drop the wage demands safe in the knowledge if you perform, they'll soon get back to normal.

RED_SKY

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Or don't drop the wage demand an signal your intent to negotiate ....... Which I think he could be doin

CAIN

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14 Jan 2013 11:36:21
hi guys its zee from norway here again, just wanted too say stop talking rubbish about ddg he is young ang he is still learning and he is still better then alot of young keepers who is playing 4 top clubs i think he is better then cassilas(sorry spelling) he makes alot of blunders four real madrid and we got enough people who hates our team so i think its sad when united fans talks rubbish about their own club i know we need one player like cap keane and don't woory guys we will make it and we will have a player like keane in the middle of the park;)united united

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14 Jan 2013 11:35:20
Heard Vidic might be injured again. Any updates?

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I think he is ok he was on the picth four 10min i think and he looked ok to me after that tackle, i think maybe he got a minor injury so he will play againt west ham im looking toward that game zee;)

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I don't think he will play as it seems like based on his doctors he will play one game a week max until such time the knee is proven to be completely healed.

Shahram

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14 Jan 2013 11:18:09
hi guys, it has gone long time since i posted on this site.love this site, keep up the good work eds(sorry spelling)it was awesome yesterday we beat liverpool and we have 18 wins in the league looks like saf`s getting there with his possisen style(sorry 4 spelling wrong) we are the best team in the whole world and we have most fans so i don't understand why people say that liverpool and barca are the biggest team when we have like 200 million fans more then the second team under us when it comes 2 fans so 2 all you other fans not manchester united fans;) we are a global club not you and your boring teams and even barca sucks well 2 all you "fans" who think their club is the biggest club...up....yours:)sorry 4 long post but i hate when people try 2 annoying me with that manchester united is not a global team well check out who got most fans on this planet and on another planets its us the biggest team in the whole univers, glory glory glory united united peace zee from norway:)ed007 we are the team who has most fans right hope im not wrong thanks:)its cold in norway minus 17 or something cheers guys we will win back the league and champions league too and the fa cup it will be bonus 2 win it:)4 manchester united guys and 2 some united fans please i know we need a mf player saf will buy on or couple of another players so please stop talking rubbish about our team and get behind the team we have alot of others who hates us and talk rubbish about our team so all of us united fans we need 2 back up our team, i miss cr7 keane and van der sar but look how are team is still doing a good job on the top of the league and after the real madrid matches we will be on our way too the final in the champions league, i don't know about you guys but i looking forward too knock barcelona out in the semi finals our in the final the score will be manchester united vs barcelona 4-2 in the final;)but if we meet them in the semifinales in barca i think we will play 1-1 our 2-2 and on oldtrafford 3-1 or 2-0 will we beat them united 4 life:)sorry 4 long post.

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14 Jan 2013 10:15:37
You may have noticed that Rio Ferdinand was partially blocking the view of the goalkeeper when Gerrard struck the ball. It also went through his legs I believe? The ball was also hit low and hard along the ground, De Gea was moving to his left and suddenly had to dive quickly to his right to make the save. It was a great save. If Rafael had been alert, and cleared it, we wouldn't be having this discussion Jono.

Now I don't know why you keep bringing Lindegaard up. He has nothing to do with this. In fact, if Lindegaard had done what De Gea did today, you would probably be saying it's a great save.

G.A.G.U.S

I keep bringing Linders into it as he is the other option we have and after 1 mistake similar to the three DDG has done was roundly critisized. I wouldn't be saying it was a great save unless it was Adler ;-).

But in all honesty when Linders was in all we heard on here was DDG would save that or DDG would have done better etc so why can't it be the other way?

Im not denying that DDG has more potential than Linders does but in terms of what's right for us now I can't help but think there is a need for a far better out and out No1 with Linders (if he is happy) to be No2.

Begovic, Mignolet, Hart, Szczesny, Cech, Chortios(sp?), are all keepers owned by clubs in our league and all are better IMO. Its now no secret we are looking at keepers and IMO its only for DDG.

So begs the question then, are we looking to get rid or does he want out? Either way its looking increasingly likely through rumour and mumblings that a move may well be on the cards, which to be honest I would be ok with.

Potential is all well and good but take Forlan for a prime example. Came here with a big tag for top, top player yet never really worked for him. He moved on and became a cracking player as the style and culture of the Spain way suited him to the ground. IMO DDG is the exact same.

18months he has been here yet he still can't speak English properly, still doesnt command his area, still doesnt open his mouth, still is as weak as ever never mind this constant palming out of shots all these are down to his wanting to succeed and develop himself yet we are seeing no improvement.

If we were hearing stories of him doing extra in the gym or working more on the down sides to his game I would feel more confident in his wanting to be here and wanting to stay but his ability now is enough to be a success in Spain and for that reason I see a player who has an eye already going home and so sees no need in developing the side needed to play over here. I mean why learn English if your just going back to spain right?

On yesterday the shot was 2-3 yards outside the box so around 20 yards. DDG was on his 6 yard box so that's around 13 yards away taking 1 away for distance between Rio. So a shot stopper as good as he is should be holding those shots all day. He reacted in eough time to save it without having to stretch very far. He was flat footed not moving to his left I have no idea where you are getting that from. IMO it was a normal save that he wrongly palmed back into the box. so its his mistake. Whether or not Rafa could/should have got there he wouldn't have been needed if DDG had done his job corrrectly.

We both have our own opinions on this and I may well be in the minority but I think we should have a far better keeper regardless of how great DDG COULD be.

I think many should realise that potential is not alway met regardless of how much people want it to.

Jono

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The guy is in his SECOND season as 22 year old. Bit early to talk about potential not being met. As soon as we sort our defence out i.e. replace Rio and Evra then De Gea will have more protection and look a much better keeper. Even the worlds best need a top defence in front of them. Sadly I'm not sure he will be given that chance come the summer.

TK-Red

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TK, I am 100% in agreement with you, I want us to keep the faith with him, but I think the manager has seen enough. I think Begovic in the summer is a real possibility. The penny has dropped with him and this summer is the time to sign him, IF we are planning to that is.

Sydney!

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14 Jan 2013 13:01:58
but who is he going to move to? Barca aren't in the market for a keeper. Madrid aren't either, they have casillas. Yes i know he's feel out with mourinho but i'd wager that mourinho leaves before casillas does. Also de gea is ex atletico so would he play for real? I'm sure he's said in the past he wouldn't. So that just leaves atletico themselves. Well i'm sure we'd want at least what we paid for him back and i can't see atletico paying it even with the money from selling falcao. So i don't see where he'd go. I think its more likely we're looking at number two's.

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Jono,

1. We all say Lindegaard wouldn't save that because that's fact. DDG has the best reflexes of any keeper on the planet today. If you take a look at highlights of DDG's saves from last season and pick out the best ones (Mata's free kick and the volley at Stoke), Linders wouldn't get anywhere near the ball to keep it out. Neither would Cech, Courtois, Szczesny and Mignolet. Hart maybe.

2. Making a nonsensical statement like those keepers are better and having 'IMO' at the end doesn't make it respectable or credible.

3. Forlan never did have a big tag, nor was he a "top, top player". The only hype around him was because we paid a lot of money for a relative unknown from South America.

4. Valencia and Anderson have been with us 4 years. They still don't speak proper English. Feel like dumping them too?

5. Big fancy analysis of distance from goal and how far he was from the line. Means absolutely nothing when the ball is placed far to your right. The only real mistake he made was at Newcastle. The rest were very good saves. And yes, Gary Neville's opinion on saves is as worthless as yours when up against Schmeichel's.

6. With your hate for DDG, you are and always will be in a minority of 1.

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I agree Syd! I just can't see De Gea being here long term as SAF seems so indecisive when it comes to the GK position. Its shows a lack of faith. What I don't understand is that we discussed De Gea at length on this site before he signed and we all knew that he was a long term option and that he was never going to come in and be the best keeper in the world within the first 2-3 years which makes me question why SAF has been caught off guard. If I were him I would be asking Eric Steele some serious questions.

TK-Red

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No name, you don't think barca wouldnt want to replace valdes with de gea?

phil

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You say Barca aren't after a keeper, no name, but Valdes is nowhere near indispensable. Both Barca and Madrid would love to have De Gea as he is the future and both Casillas and Valdes are beginning to stagnate.

TK-Red

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TK, I said this the other day. I think they knew they wouldn't be getting the finished article, but I think they never anticipated he would be so poor at commanding his box. I think Steele has made a slight blunder here, I think he didn't consider the difference in styles of play between the EPL and La Liga. Sometimes that's a problem when you use ex-players to scout. I would like us to stick with DDG, but feel his time is coming to an end unless he improves A LOT between now and May.

Sydney!

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TK

I agree that a player in his second season should be given time but after 18 months I would have expected a bigger increase in his ability overall. Its no good being a good shot stopper if your overall game is suspect.

Look at his whole game mate. Like I listed above the weakness areas are not improving to the level we want are they? Within 18 months Ronny had been coached to stop the step overs and concentrate on the end product but we are still seeing almost weekly fumbles, failed punches, no command, no speaking, no authority that's far to many weaknesses IMO compared to what other keepers could bring.

I said with regards to his potential that IMO he won't reach the level many on here seem to believe he will reach and not only believe that, they seem to think that's its basically agiven that he WILL become this super keeper that we will be talking about for many years. Now everyone has their opinions but where is there proof that this will be the case?

There is none!

That seems to be the arguement when defending him 'He will be world class!' Is that what you think SAF will be saying to him in the dressing room? Dont worry about it lad you'll be world class or will he be showing him that these mistakes are costing us and in the up and coming knock out games could cost us big if he doesn't work harder on it. I know where my money is on. Look at Rafa who has matured considerably after his rash challenge got him sent off v Bayern. He still goes in a bit to early IMO but has learned to stay up far longer but do you think SAF had a go at him for doing it and told him to work on it or said its ok your young?

I still can't see any pictures of SAF after we conceded but it will be an interesting view I think.

I ask, how many more goals like this do we need to concede before we start pointing out that the keeper is at fault?

Did you notice him retreating into the net after conceding? That to me was a tell tale sign. That is someone not entirely comfortable within himself. Watch it again and look for it mate. He looks like a boy in a mans job. If everyone thinks he has the right mentality look at it and watch as he stands in his net for a couple of seconds before walking out again. That is enough to convince me he has a million miles of work to do mentally to have any chance of mixing it with the best.

I still can't believe some one thought he was certain to be better than Big Pete haha jesus.

Jono

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14 Jan 2013 15:04:15
phil and tk yes de gea is a better keeper than valdes hands down. But i don't see them spending twenty million on a keeper. Its not sexy. Add in they have bigger issues at right back and centre back and the fact they have bigger debt than us and i can't see them spending big money on a keeper this summer. Eventually maybe but that's a couple of seasons away and everyone was talking this summer. As for madrid as i said i'll wager that mourinho leaves before casillas does. I think that perez buys too much into the casillas hype, like fifa do. And that the next manager won't want to rock the boat by picking a fight with casillas. Again its not sexy to spend twenty million on a keeper and i can't see perez allowing such expenditure on a keeper when they have casillas and are chasing players like bale. I don't see either of the spanish big two going for a keeper this summer or next. And i don't see atletico paying what we'd want.

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I know what you're saying Jono but he is 22. It is only natural that he doesn't feel confident enough to shout at his defence. That lack of confidence will only be increased when being rotated with Lindegaard IMO. You mention SAF and ask whether he would say "you'll be world class" and I think that's what he should be doing. He did it with Ronaldo. From day 1 he was saying "this boy will be the best player in the world". At some point DDG will mature enough to be able to tell the difference between him being at fault and his defence being at fault. That will come with time but until then he is likely to be slightly more shy. That will also change as he becomes more fluent in English I think. As for Schmeichel, he wasn't exactly a world beater at 22. Comparing ANY keeper to him is never going to end well but De Gea certainly has the potential to be as good as Van Der Sar.

TK-Red

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I'm not convinced Barca's priority will be RB. He may not have been on top form this season but they still have Dani Alves at the club. I would agree they need to sort out their CB pairing though. Puyol won't play forever and Mascherano isn't a natural CB so they need someone to partner Pique. Beyond that, however, I think a GK will be fairly high on their list. I would agree that they wouldn't want to spend £20million though. I think RM would but Barca are far more likely to try and offer cash plus a player.

TK-Red

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TK

I think a massive attribute you need as a keeper is self confidence. I think that's one of the most important traits as it can effect decision making in all of a GK areas.

A GK that is shy or uncomfortable quite frankly is a liability waiting to happen as any mistake will make his progress recind into a negative. We have seen an uncomfortable player in Obertan and he didn't have the right mentality to succeed with the perssure of playing for Utd. The keeper position brings with it an added pressure anyway and getting compared with VDS or Big Pete will add more. Plus everyone expecting him to be world class aswell will heap it on him. It takes a certain type of person to be a successful GK and I can't see it in him.

I hope I am wrong mate and he becomes a success but I think we will have a struggle to keep him and an even bigger struggle to get him to the top.

1 thing to remember is we have never produced a world class keeper. Every keeper we have had in SAF reign has been older when purchased.

Jono

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2nd No Name aka DDG

1. It is not a fact that Linders would not have saved that shot yesterday, that is your opinion. It wasn't a reflex save so no idea why you are bringing relexes into it. You are aware that its only your opinion that those keepers wouldn't have saved those shots. Its not a guarantee just because you say so that its definitely the case.

2. Saying the likes of Cech, Mignolet etc wouldn't get anywhere near a couple of saves DDG has done is in itself a nonsensical statement. The reason I put IMO at the end it reinforce the fact that the point is 'in my opinion'. You do know that is what that means yes?

3. Forlan came with a big hype from S America and a quality scoring record. So yes big things were expected. My point about him stands though does it not?

4. Anderson speaks english ok and Toni has at least grasped the needed language to do his job properly. A GK on the other hand NEEDs it to organise, command, distribute and lead. All of which DDG is not good at.

5. The ball was not far to his right as it was about a yard inside the post. A shot stopper of the magnitude you hold him in should have been able to cartwheel over the ball and pick it up midway. Also I might add against Big Petes opinion yours is just as worthless then!

6. I have said before i don't hate DDG I just don't believe that he will reach the level we need for him. You obviously think he will.

If SAF gets rid in the summer and we get another No1 what will you say then? SAF must be bonkers yeah?

Jono

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14 Jan 2013 09:51:30
Morning Gents,

Great result yesterday and for 60 mins I thought we were outstanding with the exception of putting the ball in the back of the net.

Danny Welbeck fully deserved MOM, he is such an awkward player to play against and his work rate and runs created chances for himself and others, I also thought his movement was excellent yesterday, once especially when he got in behind Skrtel and was fouled. Only thing the lad is lacking is finishing. People mentioned if he played for a lower club would we be looking at him, but for me if he had goals to the rest of his game then definatley we'd look at him but goals will come for him if he carries on working hard, goal scorers get better as they mature and he is still young but training day in day out with argubly the best finisher in the league if not Europe will help the kid.

Special mention for Rafael, thought he was excellent and yesterday showed how he has matured. In the past I was concerned he was to rash and dived in to much to tackles but he stayed on his feet and won countless tackles, thought he was great, hopefully Ronaldo will have his work cut out against the boy when we play them. But i'd imagine with Mourinho being there he'll instruct Ronaldo to go up against Evra after Rafael's performance :)

What I liked yesterday was we pressed high for 60 minutes and the first goal, Kagawa, Evra, Kagawa, Carrick, Kagawa, Evra, Kagawa, Cleverley, Welbeck, Carrick, Kagawa, Welbeck, Cleverley, Evra, RVP, GOAL! Beautiful.

One concern for me though was Valencia, really don't know what has happened to Toni, looks the shadow of himself when he came on. He's an honest professional who seems like a genuinely nice guy and I would love for him to get back to what he was but yesterday for the first time I thought about maybe SAF selling him in the summer.

Anyway, love doing the double over the Scousers, think yesterday should put to bed the RVP/Suarez debate, if of course there ever was one :)

Ports

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I'd agree with most of that, Ports. Good assessment.

Gav

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14 Jan 2013 09:51:23
Welbeck got MOM yesterday so he can't have been as bad as some are saying can he.
He was brilliant 1st half, was involved in most of the good things we did including the goal. I admit he didn't have a great 2nd half, i wanted hernandez last 20 mins but nobody played that well 2nd half? I thought overall 1 of our defenders probably deserved MOM, Rafael was brilliant apart from sleeping for the goal which this time can't be blamed on DDG.
Welbeck needs a goal to boost his confidence in front of goal that is clear, but that will come and then so will more goals.
Even when not scoring though be lookd class on the ball and works his socks off so when the goals start coming we have got one hell of a player.
Get off his back, support our good young player who could become great and never moans about been 4th choice.

Will Red

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I'm not one to slag united players off and when they are on the pitch they get my 100% support but if they arent up to it then i think as fans we should discuss it.
I personally do not think welbeck is good enough for manchester united. He runs his socks off and i cannot knock his effort but quality wise he just isnt where we need our players to be in the first team squad. He rarely sets up any chances and even rarer converts chances. In the final third which is his area as an attacker he gives the ball away far too much and shoots from ridiculous positions where he has no chance of scoring. He is as frustrating as Nani but the difference is that Nani has real quality when he decides to use it. He is a mid table quality player and that is where he should go and we can replace him with a player with real quality.
He isnt the only player at united not good enough don't get me wrong but if we want to move on to the next level of winning the champions league again then welbeck doesnt have enough quality needed so he shouldn't be here past the summer in my eyes.

Brendan

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It needs remembering he is only 21 and still developing. he has shown glimpes of real quality in the last couple of years. he scored goals last year and also at sunderland. he has shown how good he can be in an england shirt. he is 21 and will only get better.
IMO he will prove you wrong.
I can't think of any team with a better 4th choice
Will Red

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14 Jan 2013 09:45:37
My throat is still killing me, always does after the Liverpool games, chant of the day "Luis Suarex your teeth were offside".

Not happy with Webbs performance over the advantage rule. When Reina was down the scousers carried on attacking despite one of their players calling for his team mates to put the ball out, soon as we started countering Webb blows the whistle!! If they couldnt be bothred to put the ball out why should we?

Sturridge coming on didn't do that much to change the game it was Carrick and Cleverley going missing after bossing the game for an hour.

Bazza

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MOTD picked up on Carrick's slack 2nd half performance. It's important that when only two is in midfield that they are both playing well.

Sydney!

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Excuse me and where was the brand in the 2nd half, oh yeah he gave the ball away which allowed the scousers to score.
Carrick was yet again the best midfielder on the pitch.
Still can't believe they paid £15M for Allen, he is truly shocking.
"The Welsh Xavi" that is so so funny.

Red Daz

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A poor choice of pass by Cleverley and poor control by Carrick. Cleverley had a good game yesterday.

Cleverley = Free
Allen = £17m
Carrick = £18.6m

Like I said both midfielders need to be switched on when you only have a two-man midfield. They were both faultless in the 1st half, 2nd half they were not.

Sydney!

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Carrick covered 6.5 mile more than any other player

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14 Jan 2013 09:11:23
Liverpool supporter here. First of all well done for yesterday. took us far, far too long to get our act together though I am more or less pleased with the last 20 minutes. You deserved to win. Anyway as you can imagine we´ve been talking about strengths and weaknesses after yesterday´s game and I´d actually like your thoughts on our squad / the changes made to the team. I suppose I´d like to have input from a totally different perspective than that of a Lpool supporter and who better to ask than you guys, ey? It´d be nice to get some genuine, objective input! Cheers, Germanred

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I still think you are 3-4 top players away from a top four position. You can raise your game to play one of the big clubs, but teams like Stoke, WBA, Swansea etc have no problem turning you over. Personally I think the money you have spent over the past two season has been spent very poorly. You have spent more than United since the Premier League began and look how far behind you are. It's a bit of a catch 22 situation. You need top players to get into the top four, but you need to be a top four club to attract top players. Sahin is proof that top players are not interested in signing foe Liverpool. I do not think it will be long until the novelty wares off for Sturridge too. For the next month or two he will look good, but he will soon start to fade. I think it's important you keep hold of Suarez, but how long will he stay playing Europa when he could play in the UCL? Keeping Suarez and adding quality players to him is the way up, but even then you will need Spurs to sell Bale and Arsenal to keep their spending low. Spurs will always reinvest the Bale money and they will keep improving. I think you are a few years off a top four position yet. People keep praising BR, I am not entirely sure why as he is in a worst position than Kenny was in and Hodgson for that matter.

Sydney! {Ed001's Note - why is Sahin proof? He left because he got injured and then couldn't get back in the team. Silly point Syd, there was never any deal other than a season long loan for him and he chose to take Liverpool over Arsenal, which suggests top players are interested.}

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Hi mate i thought liverpool showed excellent character in the second half when it looked like they would simply be brushed aside, i thought the lad wisdom looks like a beast of a player sterling an suarez were incredibly quiet and stewart downing shouldn't get into the barnsley team never mind lfc sturridge looks to be a decent signing tho

dean

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Get rid of joe allen drop gerrard futher back as holding midfield with lucas suarez as the attacking midfielder with sterling and borini with sturridge up front:-
reina
enriquez agger skrtel johnson
gerrard lucas
borini suarez sterling
sturridge

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In my opinion, you need to play Sturridge and Suarez up top together to support each other, you also need to sort out your midfield, Sahin could have been good for you if Rodgers had played him where he wanted to play... Field Suarez as left wing, Sturridge through the middle, or Sturridge right wing and Suarez striker, you need a better left/right wing than Downing or Sterling, with the style of play Rodgers is implementing you need Allen to step up his game or buy a couple of midfielders, Sneijer and Gerrard partnership could have been very good for you with a defensive/holding midfielder in there to protect the back four, someone like Alonso... With that you are still keeping the triangle in midfield which is perfect for your passing style. So I would think you need a creative, consistent winger, and a couple of experienced, quality midfielders.

Kez.

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14 Jan 2013 10:10:33
buy a proper left back and get johnson back to right back. You need a dynamic midfielder. Lucas is competent. Allen does ok but when gerrard goes you'll struggle. Decide if your playing wingers or not. If you are go buy a couple as you can't keep putting all the pressure on sterling. Buy a poacher type striker as the rest are all too similar. The starting eleven is taking shape but the back up is either raw kids or players not good enough. Strength in depth is weak. Also some realism couldn't go amiss. Yes you were a great club and you have ambition to be one again but accept at the moment that its a way away from happening so cut all the public chat about how great you are and concentrate on proving it. At times your pr just makes you silly. Stop using the manager as a mouth piece for the owners and let him manage. But get some scouts in as you still make bad buys. I.e. borini. Hope that was objective enough for you.

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Not convinced Rodgers is up to the job - fired by Reading and took over a strong team already moulded by Martinez at Swansea. I think Liverpool have only had 3 worse Prem starts than this year. Sturidge should be a good signing for the money and should get you goals. Not sure you will be able to hold onto Suarez if one of the big foreign clubs come calling.

IrishRed

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You want genuine objective input about Liverpool so you have come to a united site, good luck with this...

GDS

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Prepare for the championship, if I were you.

Aesop

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When sturridge came on and borini things changed for lfc if rodgers were to go with sturridge and saurez and works a team that can support them he would get a better overall performance stevie G has to be in the team as he is an inspiration to your team. At times the ref made some dodgy decisions yesterday but overall had a decent game. I am a die hard red devil and have always disliked LFC but at times they show some of the class they used to have all those years ago but now they are to inconsistant. 20 yrs ago anfield was a fortress and no team liked going there now even the bottom teams don't mind going there and taking points off you. LFC need to start being more consistant throughout the season and beating mid and low table teams.
Cheats2005

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Ed001, we both know that he wanted the Arsenal move until Liverpool offered him over £4m to join on loan.

In the end even the money wasn't a big enough motivation for him.

Sydney! {Ed001's Note - offered him? You know nothing Syd, the 4.4m was payment to Real Madrid for the loan, not Sahin. You are talking nonsense.}

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I'm not convinced Sahin is a top player anyway Syd! Good player, yes, but not a top one. In terms of the starting 11 I'd say Liverpool are a top LB, CM and winger away from challenging for the top 4. Maybe even a truely world class CB to dominate the defence as I'm not sure either Skrtel or Agger are real leaders.

TK-Red

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GDS - It would appear that that is exactly what I got! Cheers guys

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TK, Sahin is a top player when happy. He needs to be played in the correct position too. Injuries have undoubtedly slowed his progress at RM and I just do not think he wanted the Liverpool move in the first place. Due to the evidence of the past 18 months I wouldn't pay the £16m RM want for him, but he would be a steal at £8m and that is why RM bought him. I think Dortmund will buy him back in the summer for a under £10m.

Sydney! {E
d007's Note - Your posts for Ed001 are sitting waiting on him Syd, he is busy elsewhere just now.}

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Sahin gets a cut of that cash Ed, he also gets a healthy weekly amount on top of his RM wage. There was a lot of pressure from RM for him to accept the Liverpool offer as the Liverpool offer was unusually large, he wanted the Arsenal move.

Sydney! {Ed002's Note - The additional relocation package paid to Sahin was beyond the payment to Real Madrid for the loan Syd.}

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It does doesn't it, I did make a point yesterday that Liverpool fans who come on here for a bit of banter and discussion seem to get a fairly good reaction.

It's the usual suspects that always let you down.

Ed001 is a Liverpool fan I believe, always seems to be arguments when you are around ed.

GDS {Ed002's Note - You are right about the arguments. It keeps us sane and provides a nice diversion to the otherwise mundane lives we lead.}

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Ed007, it doesn't really matter mate, it's not urgent.

Sydney! {Ed002's Note - I'll send Ed007 out to find him right away Syd.}

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Ed007, it doesn't really matter mate, it's not urgent.

Sydney!

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I suppose it depends on your definition of a top player Syd! That's not in any way a dig. I just mean that, for example, one person may have seen Nicky Butt as a top player as he was quality where as others might see him as someone that is a good player, fills a hole and does a job without making it his own. I would see Sahin as one of the latter.

TK-Red

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Ed002, Wow, so RM got the £4.4m and Liverpool paid more on top to Sahin? No wonder he went from wanting the Arsenal move to changing his mind last minute. Although he would have been pressurised into a Liverpool move by RM too for that amount. RM received or would have received nearly half of what they paid for him in the first place.

Sydney! {Ed002's Note - The £4.4M was a loan fee. After that a club pays wages, or in his case a % of the wages, and typically a relocation package (rail ticket, room at the Travel Inn etc.). Keep in mind the value RM placed on selling the player was much higher - "unrealistic" as AC Milan noted of what Pardeza was asking.}

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Ed002, didn't Sahin receive a signing on fee? Or is that what the relocation fee really is? So to speak.

Didn't RM get all of the £4.4m or half?

Sydney! {Ed002's Note - The loan fee went to Real Madrid - he was being loaned by them as he was under contract to them. On top of that there was an amount paid to the player for relocating to Liverpool and a percentage of his wages paid by each club.}

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14 Jan 2013 08:57:14
I may be putting 2 and 2 together and getting 6 but I saw nani in the tescos in handforth dean and he was doing quite a large food shop! I don't think anyone who was on there way to a different country in the next week or so would be buying that much food so it looks like he's here for the rest of the season at least

Trickee

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Or it could be because they don't have good supermarkets there and he is getting a better deal at Tesco lol

Shahram

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100k a week ..... I'm sure he would leave the cornflakes behind if he was flogged mate.....

CAIN

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Or he likes the english food to take away with him ;)

Giants14

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Must have been a huge trolley to get enough food into it to last til the end of the season.

IrishRed

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This is one of the best rumours I have ever heard. Brilliant.

GDS

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I generally don't like having a go at others peoples posts but come on, please tell me you have posted this just for a laugh?

Can you imagine the thought process, oh I better not waste my money on a Friday big shop just in case I get whisked away on a plane mid week never to return.
I better go to the lateshop instead and just get the essentials!

and that isn't even considering the thought that would he actually go and do a shop!!

karllap

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Perhaps he's hosting a dinner party later, with Anderson invited?

Gav

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14 Jan 2013 01:01:23
Just seen the interview with fergie where he said vidic became our 18th league goalscorer today.

One man team?

GDS

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I have just read the Graham Poll (seriously anti-United) article in the Mail Online. It shows a picture saying 'proof' Vidic was offside. Well it clearly shows they were level.

I love listening to Graham Poll giving his expert opinion, then watching Dermot Gallagher correct nearly every wrong opinion of his. How Poll became a referee at all still amazes me.

Sydney!

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To be fair Syd, he also said he didn't notice the connection watching the game, and certainly wouldn't have expected the linesman to see it.

StevieK

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14 Jan 2013 00:53:29
Just like the rubbish you believed that Fergie told you for 6 years starting in 1986?

Plymouth Red

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A scouser talking about the past, I can't believe it, they are usually so forward thinking as well.

GDS

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14 Jan 2013 00:48:56
Oh and just because Big Pete says the save was good means nothing unless your willing to take Neville's criticism of DDG efforts against both Newcastle and Swansea where he said both were poor and not good enough.

Jono

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Hate to pick holes in your argument jono as I value your opinion on here but how can you say if we listen to the greatest goalkeeper united ever had about goalkeepers we should also listen to a right back about goalkeepers as if that's exactly the same. Surely you must have meant something else as there is actually no logic to this is there?

Is like saying schmeichels opinion on right backs is as important as Neville's, it's madness.

GDS

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I admit i have a habit of defending DDG to the death however i thought the goal against newcastle was his fault, he should of caught that or pushed it round the post as it had little pace but he can't be blamed for the swansea goal and the liverpool goal yesterday, the swansea goal came from a shot at point blank range and gerrards shot had that much pace on it he did well to just keep it out, i do however agree with syd when he says hed love him to stay but the staff at utd might be thinking differently and not have the patience for his improvement as the goalkeeping position is imo the most important on the pitch as a sound keeper breeds confidence in the rest of the team and at utd i think the manager wants that confidence straight away so i wouldnt be suprised if he's sold in the summer, however jono ive seen you mention adler, id rather have ben amos in goal than adler, he's no better than lindegaard, my choice would be between begovic, forster and krul, i think its important if DDG is sold we get a keeper who knows the language, has had experience of the british game and has more authority in the penalty box, i think these 3 keepers cover those aspects.

phil

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Know a goalkeeping coach who has recently worked at league clubs. He told me that keepers are coached to parry out / away the modern day balls like DDG did because they are so unpredictable in their flight. I think again in his short career the blame is on our RB who again failed to predict / respond to a rebound and a mark / tackle the CF following up.

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GDS

There is logic mate as the defense is the target for the blame and in particular Rafa (our current RB) for yesterday. So as a defender who was used to having a top keeper in big Pete behind him Nev's view on what is good or poor from a keeper is valid.

The fact is had DDG NOT palmed it back into the middle of the box we wouldn't have conceded. Rafa was only picking up blame as he didn't guess DDG was palming it out again.

I genuinely can't understand how so many are so quick to blame probably our best performer yesterday for not guessing our keeper was going to palm it back into the middle again instead of admitting DDG was at fault.

I ask if when evra played that hospital ball across the defense when the striker got it if he had scored would you be blaming Evra for putting the ball there or the CB for not guessing the mistake and getting in front of the striker?

We were in possession of the ball and lost it about 5 seconds before Gerrard shot so the defense just got back in line (as they should) as The shot got taken and Sturridge started moving whereas all our defenders turned. So we have a guy starting to move compared to a defense on their heels so of course he won't get there first. It wasn't like Everton where he failed to track runs while the ball was being played around us it was a snap shot that was taken just after we lost possession in front of the defense so they had to stay still to defend the shot and lost out to an already moving striker.

Jono

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Phil

Have you seen much of Adler mate?

I watch the german league regularly and out with Meuer he was the top GK in the league the year we bought DDG. That year he has a terrrible time with injury and declared his intention to leave for a new challenge. Since his move he has thr 4th best record in the league even though Hamburg are no great team. He speaks English and is a Utd fan which would suggest he knows allot about the club abd its history. He is a good age with far more exp than DDG and would have been a snippet of the price. IMO he would have been a far better option. I said it at the time and in the 18 months since I have not seen enough from DDG to suggest I change my opinion.

Jono

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Jono, to be fair Neville has always been critical about goalkeepers in general.

He made an error against Newcastle, but yesterday was forgivable.

The difference is Lindegaard wouldn't have even got a hand to it.

It was unfortunate that it went where it did, but Rafael was ball watching.

Sydney!

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Problem is lads, Schmeichel is part of the Goalkeepers Union so will not criticise the GK, and Gary Neville is in the Right Back's union so will not criticise the Right Back.

No name mentioned that GK's are taught to parry out/away the modern balls which is fair but this must be related to the defence in training so they should be aware of this.

For me, Gerrard's hit a good shot low and hard towards the corner, it also I believe went through Rio's legs or he was close to it anyway so DDG first thought is to save the ball, he reacted well and made a good save, getting down quickly and getting a strong hand behind the ball, as Gerrard is shaping to shoot, Rafael should of been preparing for any rebounds like the striker was. It's not the first time Rafael has been flat footed in this position. Can I add as well, I thought Rafael was excellent yesterday so this was just one mistake which he'll get out of the habit of doing as he gets to understand the game more with every game he plays.

Ports

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Also Jono, actually look at when Gerrard nicks it off of Carrick, Rafael is 2 yards from the edge of the box, Sturridge is 10 yards out from Rafael, Rafael had time to react, no doubt about it, Sturridge runs behind him, Rafael is actually in a good position when we lose possession he just has not reacted, this isn't a case of being caught on his heels, just has not reacted, maybe through tiredness or just switched off, but he'll improve on this.

Ports

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Jono,

Cheers for the reply. I am not blaming rafael at all, in fact if anyone it was cleverley and carrick trying to be too clever in the middle that lost possession, but we played some good passing in that part of the pitch and you could understand where the over confidence crept in as we had just gone 2-0 up.

Every goal we concede does not have to be blamed on one of our players though, sometimes the opposition just do well. De gea made a good save, he did what he could but Sturridge was ready for it as good strikers often are and even if rafa had reacted he wouldn't have got there.

I think de gea is improving all the time and could be one of the best goalkeepers in the world in a few years time, and if he is still with us then, will have grown into a man at the club and could become a great leader.

GDS

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No Name

That is absolute horse she*p.

Keepers are never told to parry unless the shot is deemed too hot to handle. the ball is not going to move when it is on the groung like yesterday is it? The shots in the air are the only ones where the catching can be questionable. Keepers are always told to use your hands and always told to get a hold of the ball as anything other than that leads to unpredicatbility with regards to where the ball will end up going.

Had Gerrards shot been a rocket and DDG just managed to get a touch on it he would have only managed to tip it wide but he got down easily and got a full hand on it palming it in that direction NOT away from the goal. His mistake!

Jono

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GDS

I agree he could well become a great and stay with us for 10 year but I just cannot see it. IMO casillas will go down as a great keeper yet I don't rate him highly either. Its all about opinions in the end.

But what I can see as a growing trend on here is the red tinted specs. DDG IMO is less talented all round than say Begovic. So if the debate is brought up its consistantly pointed out that DDG WILL be world class without a doubt. Why? There are no guarantees in football and on top of that after 18 months his weak areas have not improved greatly. We can buy him time by pointing out his age or not been in the league that long etc but that's called making excuses. There is no guarantee that this potential he has will be reached.

IMO his weaknesses will constantly be put to the test just because of the types of teams we face over here compared to Spain. I was hoping for a marked imrovement in the second year but all we have is more inconsistancy and continued errors in almost every game. Even if they don't lead to goals mistakes breeds confidence in the opposition and drains it in ours.

I would take a reliable 'older' keeper in Begovic who is excelling in our league at an average team over a highly priced younger keeper who MAY or may not become a world class keeper. I think the idea of what DDG could bring was too appealing to SAF and maybe he is slowly realising the possible mistake.

We can afford to give outfield players time to develop into world beaters but IMO keeper shouldn't be messed with and we should have bought a more experienced keeper who could replace VDS in terms of quality now.

DDG is here for the time being so I will support him while wearing the shirt but I will still point out errors I believe he should be doing better with.

What was you answer on the Evra horror pass mate?

Jono

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De Gea was NOT at fault yesterday, yes he has made mistakes but yesterdays was a quick reaction save and the ball can go anywhere in this situation. It is up to the defence to stay alert and mop up any loose ball. Raphael was at fault and was caught daydreaming as has been the case before. If Sturridge could get to it then so could Raphael the only difference was tgat Sturridge was more aware and wanted it more. De Gea is and will be an incredible keeper. He is young and has areas to improve and that will come as he has the raw talent needed.

Brendan

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Just one point Jono, if Rafael should not have anticipated the parry how come Sturridge was so quick to do so? Rafael had a storming game but he switched off completely there.

Cleverly cost us the goal by losing possession, Rafeal should have been more aware but DDG did well to stop the shot in the 1st place IMO.

Gav

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14 Jan 2013 00:31:11
"Your teeth are offside, Your teeth are offside, Luis Suarez, Your teeth are offside!!....... haha absolute quality banter :)

Rouge Diablo :)

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