Manchester United Banter Archive March 20 2018

 

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20 Mar 2018 20:57:41
Danny Lancs asks lower down about SAF early days.

A different perspective, there was a drinking culture in the club. People don't realise how bad it was. One Thursday night not long after SAF joined I was in a pub in Sale when two senior first team players arrived. There was a game at the weekend but they were hammered and got more hammered. I watched as one was collapsed across the end of the bar and eventually had to be carried out by the bouncer. My friends and I were going to the game at the weekend and just shook our heads in shame. There were no cameras, no mobile phones to record it on. My late brother was in the same pub for lunch and regaled to me how one key first team player sank 7 pints of lager over lunchtime with a game several days away.

You have to understand perspective, when SAF arrived we had endured circa 15 years of utter Liverpool dominance and a press that eulogised them, everything was nice stories about the boot room. We desperately longed for success, the joke about our end of season party being in February when the Scousers went too far ahead to catch them grated beyond belief. It is why winning is what matters, the Scousers ground out wins, collected trophies.

SAF arrived and he had won so much with Aberdeen, I watched some of them on tv. We had new hope, yet we hardly saw an improvement, the football was awful, it really was and didn't the Scousers love it. There was no social media but radio shows had people on doubting SAF. The only time my belief wavered was the 5.1 defeat at City in 89. it was hard to take because our dreams were being ripped apart again. Someone told me though that SAF was making changes to the club and stick with it. I was someone who stood on the Stretford End shouting Sexton out so it was hard not to protest, yet I had seen some of the issues and to be honest the choice was throw it all out start again with another manager or stick with SAF, I chose SAF. We were promised so much with Big Ron. I went to away games because we thought we could win the league, only to be shattered by a bunch of prima donnas and that was awful in the end, nice football but nothing to show for it, so we just had to wait, give SAF the chance. SAF then made a tough decision over Leighton, destroyed his career really, but it was the right one. It was probably a turning point for the club. We won the cup but the manager showed he could make tough decisions and that is what Jose is doing. There are more modern problems at the club, now players can't be criticised as it might hurt their feelings. I played football in SAF early days and it was physical, not like now, you had to deal with criticism and not get upset about it. Different problems now but still things that need tough decisions, do we want a manager to make them or someone who cosies up to them for 18 months until the players don't like what they hear again. You decide.

Believable13 Unbelievable2

20 Mar 2018 21:18:22
Cracking post red man thanks for sharing and giving an insight into those early days.

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20 Mar 2018 21:38:51
Thanks for sharing Red Man.

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20 Mar 2018 22:24:14
Loved reading that red man, good post.

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20 Mar 2018 22:42:49
Top top top post Redman these players should be men and not act like girls and take everything to heart.

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20 Mar 2018 22:43:15
Brilliant read Red-Man.

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21 Mar 2018 00:01:17
Redman, you're referring to Norman Whiteside and Paul McGrath. We used to see them a lot around Manchester in bars when they should be in bed. Different times but they were great times.
Also Bryan Robson could drink with the best of them but somehow managed to keep his career going.
Players of today are a different breed and the managers have their hands full. To be honest, it's a difficult job and one I hate to do nowadays.
I was at Stret End from 1970 till 1990 before I moved in order to take my son to the matches. Then we moved back to Stret End and now singing stand and we would like to go back to Stret End. Life moves a full cycle. There's never a dull moment at our club.
My best memory was when we got beat at home by the brilliant WBA side containing the late Cyril Regis. The crowd applauded the teams off the field. Brilliant match despite us Losing. Sorry to bore posters with silly memories.

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21 Mar 2018 00:21:51
Best post I’ve read in a long time RM. 👏👏
Good supporting post AAA. 👍.

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21 Mar 2018 02:35:52
Red Man good post. Evoked a couple of memories. Ta. 👏.

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21 Mar 2018 03:04:43
Great post redman and AAA, but I have to ask how fecking old are you people? 😉.

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21 Mar 2018 00:56:36
Does that mean AAA's post was a top top post? 😂

I think there is a move by the press to hang Jose and stick the knife into utd. They have been waiting to watch it all blow up. I for one am going to support the manager and trust that if these players aren't right then he will move them on and bring in the right players.

Can anyone really say that Alderwereld/ umtiti, Kroos, Bale, martin/ max/ rose with 8 making way Doesn't sound exciting? This squad needs a revamp, we have a few very good pieces at a good age. I think this summer will see our first team get significantly stronger.

If a few don't make it and don't feel they got a fair chance then they need to be honest with themselves. Easy to blame other people when the truth hurts.

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21 Mar 2018 05:37:34
AAA, seems we trod similar paths.

CSM, in August I will have been supporting the club for 50 years.

I started going to games in the South stand seats about 1971 with my late brother, I then went in the Stretford End Paddock around 1976 before going in the Stretford End not long after.

Tough but great at the games, we got behind the team far more, mainly because we were underdogs to the Scousers. Still we queued to get in en masse and screamed our heads off, were the extra man. I remember the 5-3 game with WBA, wonderful players Regis and Cunningham, would have graced today’s game. I have experienced the lowest, I was sat in K stand in 74 when Law back heeled in for City, people don’t realise the humiliation, now it is made out to be humiliation when we lose to a lesser opponent, 74 puts everything in perspective. However, there was 84 and Barca, what a night.

The mid eighties Everton came along and did what we couldn’t, beat the Scouse from top spot. I was at the 85 cup final, it’s never brought up now, but we sang Everton, Everton out of respect, they did a lap of honour in front of us and we cheered them, easier because we won, but they had put the Scouse in their place even for a couple of years. Hence my soft spot for Everton.

Nostalgia huh, one of my memories was in the 80’s, meeting and spending an afternoon drinking with Wilf McGuiness, lovely man but couldn’t imagine him being strong enough to lead.

Nostalgia, apologies, but my dad took me down Chester road, past Old Trafford in the late sixties, totally different place to what it is now, then it was a gritty northern town for tough footballers like Bill Foulkes, not the shiny modern one it is now where sensitivities are part of the psyche. Standing on the terraces gave a different, more grounded view of the game than sat in the rarified seats. Standing cost about 30 pence I think which you could save up from most of your pocket money to pay, it was raw and you went to support your team, now they go to watch, to be entertained, it’s different, it’s the corporate animal, sad because most of you won’t have experienced that raw feeling of a goal and thousands rushing forward in a crush all together while screaming, then trying to get back to where you stood and find your mates. Wrists were broken on the barriers in the crush, but oh what fun.

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21 Mar 2018 05:53:48
Red Man thanks for giving some perspective and good memories. I think the younger generation has now add a different meaning to supporting 🤣🤣🤣 and I guess they want instant results just like instant coffee or tea.
Love to be able to have a nice afternoon tea with you and AAA when I have the chance to visit UK. It’ll be a rewarding trip 😉.

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21 Mar 2018 09:24:10
You're right RedMan. We must have been present at all the old matches. 666 and dodgy and all other posters who commented, make no mistake, our club is the best in the world. There mught be clubs like City or Chelsea with the new money, but our club has history and tradition that they can't buy. That's why as much as I dislike the red Scousers, I also have respect for their achievements. As they are also a traditional club with great history.
RedMan, that WBA game was just something else. Sadly, both Cunningham and Regis are no longer with us.
But one thing that RedMan absolutely nailed is the atmosphere at the ground. I have also experienced the surge in the stands on countless times when we used to stand and though it was frightening at the time, it was exhilarating. The stadium used to shake with the noise. 2468 the reds are great by Bachman Turner overdrive used to start the show and the crowd were up and running from the kick off. Now we have this stupid presenter who kills the atmosphere before games and when he stops yelling on his microphone, the crowd are so quiet. As RedMan rightly says, we used to go to support while now, people go to be entertained a bit like an American football game. I do wish the club will sort this out by liaising with the fans. I sit there so many times and the away supporters if lesser teams are the only ones heard. This is not the case at our away matches, where our support is the best in the land by a mile.
And a last memory, I've been to Anfield four times and seen United win on every occasion. Two of those, my brother and I were sold tickets by touts to the away stand but in our haste to get into the match at the last seconds before the start, only to find that we're in the Kop. Have you tried watching your team score goals when you can't celebrate?

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21 Mar 2018 10:21:02
AAA you got me really laughing with the tout ticket incident. Yeah probably just smiled when we scored whilst at the Kop end 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
I really agree with what you said about going to support rather than to be entertained. But then I can also understand about other who feels they paid for the ticket and expects to be entertained. It’s tough to be a supporter 😉🤣.

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21 Mar 2018 15:36:09
666, luckily my elder brother was there to control me when we scored. It involved looking at one another with sad faces while deep inside, we were laughing our head off. 😂.

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21 Mar 2018 18:14:19
Big Norm. Another great, but flawed player from my own shores. I'm noticing a pattern, here.

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21 Mar 2018 19:56:47
Brilliant lads thoroughly enjoyed that whole thread.

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20 Mar 2018 20:03:03
Lots of questions about how SAF got on when he first joined so I had a quick look back at his signings to see how many were great and how many were less than great. It’s interesting reading for anyone not old enough to have been there.

Goalies were a thorn in his side. Jim Leighton came in and was initially solid before losing his confidence, not helped by being dropped for the FA Cup replay of 1990. Les Sealey came in and did a job, he was a character but was never in the top echelon. Then came Big Pete, a giant amongst keepers and still the best I have ever seen. His departure was like when SAF retired, he was a nightmare to replace and there was a comedy of errors before we sorted it out. Van der Gouw was a solid number 2 but we also had Taibi, and Barthez and Bosnich, and Carroll, and Howard, some were ok, Taibi was pants but none of them inspired confidence. VDS arrived and steadied the ship but he was our 6th keeper post Schmeichel before we got a top class stopper.

I’m not going to go in the same detail for other positions but it is worth pulling some out. In terms of ones that didn’t work out, flops if you like, well the list is pretty long. Take your pick from Djemba Djemba (so bad they named him twice), Kleberson (a World Cup winner), Bellion, Blanc (signed 10 years
too late), Poborsky (because he chipped Schmeichel in a tournament), and of course, the incredible Bebe, which to this day remains a very expensive mystery. There are many more that were seen briefly before disappearing.

However, the flops are outweighed by the astute and clever signings. His second signing was Brian McClair, a top man and a great servant, followed by Steve Bruce, the best player never to be capped by England. His fifth signing was Lee Sharpe, a 17 year old from Torquay who was incredible for us, quickly followed by Mark Hughes. Interestingly, the four of them were signed early in his reign and were integral to the future success.

Then it was about finding the others who could complete the team. In ‘89 Pallister and Ince were signed followed by Irwin in ‘90 and the team was starting to take shape.

The major signing for me was Schmeichs in ‘91. I remember standing in the Stretford End watching him warm up. He was enormous and dominating and he scared the crap out of me. However, whilst the team was doing ok and winning cups the League remained elusive. We lost the League to Leeds in ‘92 playing away to Liverpool - I was at Anfield that day and it was horrible. The following season saw a stuttering start until November when we signed Eric Cantona. He turned up his collar, stuck out his chest and said “I have found my home”. He was the oil that made the engine run smoothly: he came, he saw, he conquered.

After that, we continued to see both good and bad signings. Players like Yorke, Vidic, Ferdinand, and Evra proved inspired but there were as many flops who didn’t work out signed during that time.

What does that tell us? It suggests that signing payers can be something of a lottery. Veron was signed from Italy and despite being an incredible player didn’t really work out. Yorke was signed from Villa and whilst most of us thought he was ok he was incredible for us for a couple of seasons.

A final word to a player who has become a legend. He didn’t always play, he never complained, he could always be relied on to score. I remember him coming on a sub when we were leading 4-1 away to Forest and scoring 4 goals in about 20 minutes. Ladies and gentlemen, I give you Ole Gunnar Solskjaer.

Believable16 Unbelievable0

20 Mar 2018 20:36:08
I remember meeting Schmeichel in a news agents in Poynton. I swear he was twice my size and I'm 6 foot. His hands were like digger buckets but the amusing thing was his wife was tiny.

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20 Mar 2018 20:38:55
Great post AJH thank you as I am one of the younger posters who was not around in the early 90s or pre Fergie era. My earliest memory is the 99 treble year at the age of 5 years old and my favourite player for a long time was Ruud in the early 2000s. The player two players I wish I got to see live were Cantona and Bryan Robson. My old man idolises Robbo and says he is exactly what we are missing today. I think on the whole sir alex’s Signings were astute as you say and something that stands out to me is that they were not household world class names when they joined us. But they grew into amazing players. One of my favourite signings in the last 10 or so years was henrikh Larson. What a player and he came up with some important goals.

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20 Mar 2018 20:46:12
Good post pal.

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20 Mar 2018 20:55:28
Bryan Robson, what a player. He was incredible and it’s such a shame he played in an era when we were not great. He was the archetypal Captain Fantastic, he broke his leg 3 times (before he joined us) and dislocated his shoulder at least twice whilst he was with us. He could rough it with the best, but he was also class.

SAF kept him despite his drinking as he trained like an animal and it never affected his performances. He was still there in ‘93 albeit not as a first choice and he raised the Premiership trophy with Brucie when we finally won it. Robson is a United legend in the truest meaning of the word. I rate him higher than Keane, it was a privilege to see him in the flesh. Google FA Cup semi final vs Arsenal in ‘83, he and Whiteside scored screamers to see Arsenal off 2-1.

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20 Mar 2018 21:06:05
The baby faced assassin! could always rely on him to get you a goal.
Great memories
Good post mate!

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20 Mar 2018 21:24:26
When SAF first became manager the league was comprised predominately of British talent, with a few northern Europeans thrown in. The mangers and owners were also British. Match day revenue was the main source of income. As a result English football was completely different in every way to the way it is today. With a few exceptions, like Ronaldo and Van Nistelrooy, once the market for talent became global, it seems to me that SAF's recruitments started to wane . He will obviously go down as possibly the best manager ever for his accomplishments at Aberdeen and then United, but perhaps he was of his time. I wonder whether he would have achieved as much in today's environment.

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20 Mar 2018 21:51:47
I think that’s a tad harsh Shawthing, signing overseas players already playing in England is one thing, signing overseas players from overseas clubs in a another thing completely. SAF signed a few duffers from overseas but he also signed some super players. Vidic, Evra, Solskjaer, Johnsen, Stam, Fortune, Silvestre, Ji-Sung Park, were all signed from overseas. I think it is always a risk, it was then and it is now. All in all SAF did ok.

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20 Mar 2018 22:43:45
Solsjear was amazing. I wish the players show as much passion as him.

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21 Mar 2018 02:43:30
Ajh I've played with Robson 3 times in united legends matches here in ireland. My fav united player of all time. My lad has his boots he gave us after one of the games.
A gent and full of stories.
On the 1st occasion i was warming up and was beside Ray wilkins. I asked Him who was captain for the day as wilkins also captained united and England. He turned and looked at me as if i had 3 heads and said. 'There is only one skipper here mate the skipper is the skipper of course '😆.

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{Ed0333's Note - Great post Ken. I love these type of anecdotes. If you’ll permit me to waste some of your time with one of mine. Me and my mate were in Dubai at the time when Houllier and Thommo we’re managing Liverpool. We’re on a desert safari belly dancing by a log fire and all I see In the dark is some guy belly dancing whose attached to biggest nose I’ve ever seen in my life. My mate whose a west ham fan says that’s Phil Thompson and I’m like no way he’s at home trying to figure out a way to win us the Premiership (actually thinking about it, it may have been the summer of 2002 because I watched the World Cup final in Dubai) Low and behold on closer inspection it’s Thommo with his family on holiday. So I’m trying to act all cool like but dying to speak to him. I’m edging closer and closer like and I get close enough to pounce. Banged his ears for 10 minutes because I didn’t want to go full on stalk. Suffice to say he was a lovely guy, took pics with us, introduced us to his family. My mate was made up because he met someone who actually had a bigger nose than him. Oh yeh I forgot to mention at the time there was intense INTERNET speculation we were signing Zidane and I asked Thommo if it was true which was highly embarrassing for me should I say. Anyway thanks for your time and I’ll leave you lot alone now.

21 Mar 2018 05:48:38
Ed0333

I can give you a similar story. In 1990 I stayed at a very nice hotel in Rhodes, Olympic Palace I think, one of the guests I met was La Toya Jackson with two enormous bodyguards. However, the hotel had a football game in its games area, my sort of thing back then and I beat a couple of challengers. Then along comes Ronnie Whelan of Liverpool, who wanted to play, we played and chatted, really nice friendly guy. Played him several times after that, can’t remember who won.

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{Ed0333's Note - Your story beats mine Red Man. You had Latoya Jackson and Ronnie Whelan in the same story. Did Ronnie tell you tales of the great Manc Norman Whiteside? Who incidentally was on the same chiropady course as my mate in Southampton University apparently the fella could drink lol.

21 Mar 2018 05:57:41
Ken 👍👍👍.

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21 Mar 2018 06:36:17
Ken

What a wonderful experience to actually play with those legends, something to remember for ever.

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21 Mar 2018 10:42:07
Great stories guys, mine is a bit more recent though, Michael Essien and I attended the same College (St. Augustine's College) He has always been a jovial lad but a beast on the field when playing for the school team. Always took it easy with us during internal fun games though, and when a mate runs past him with a ball he had a smile on his face as if to say 'you know I let you go"

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mbd              

21 Mar 2018 10:54:42
Done it a gew times redman also got to play with zidane and beckham scholes paul waksh sharpe and many others in the 02 in london. At a charity event beckham was running.
I got booked in the semi final of that tournament for fighting with ray parlour. It was just after his very public divorce where his wife got a ground breaking settlement of a huge percentage of all his future earnings. Paul durkin was the ref. he fouled me and was getting booked. I said to durkin . ah don't book him he is only angry because his wife has all his money. he went mental😆😆😆 he creamed me in the next tackle fairly it has to be said. I tried not to show the pain at the time but f me i felt it for days. After they won the match on pens he made a bee line for me i thought he was going to flatten me. But he stuck out his hand and said ' hard luck irish fella. what's said on pitch stays on the pitch'
Great day that was. It was on sky too. Tim lovejoy was there doing interviews etc for soccer am.
Ed0333 its nice to hear a story like that. Most of the old school guys are really nice when you play or meet them. Not like many of today's generation i wouldn't bother trying to talk to them.

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21 Mar 2018 12:57:16
I remember, must have been 88, so I would have been 6. I would often go to games with my dad via the Portland Hotel, who offered VIP packages to some of their residents. We were in a lounge with cakes and champagne waiting for Fergie to come give a post-match speech. I told my dad I was going to the toilet and seeing as I was there for a while, he got worried, and walked in to find me sat on the bog with Gordon Strachan and Martin Edwards crouched in front of me. All I remember is them asking me who my favourite player was and me replying Strachan not having recognised the player I was talking too, probably because I'd only ever seen them kitted, not suited, up.

My dad has some good stories of the time, drinking and clubbing with some of the players. He also speaks a lot of the drink culture and how Fergie put a stop to it.

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21 Mar 2018 13:23:52
what a great thread guys. This is why i love this site.

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21 Mar 2018 16:36:40
Wow amazing stories guys. Some of you have been very lucky to meet those stars. 👌👌👌.

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20 Mar 2018 19:04:32
Just a different perspective on the luke shaw debate. These are quotes from his former coach and mentor at southamton madr today.

He does make you pull your hair out at times. You have to try different things to get the best out of him, ’ Dodd told BBC Sport. I
think they have tried everything and they have not got through to him to get him out on the pitch and perform.

‘Luke is one of those players where you have to keep on, you have to keep pushing him and he needs to be challenged.

‘He is a fantastic player, but if you have to question some of it – his drive, training everyday, and giving absolutely everything.

‘You are at Manchester United. Mourinho expects you to put it in every session and that is an area where Luke will struggle. ’

I would suggest that this guy nows him better than anybody.

It does put a diffetent perspective on it. Nobody here knows him but this guy does know him probably better than anybody.

Believable5 Unbelievable16

20 Mar 2018 19:27:09
Doesn’t put a different perspective on it for me, people who constantly moaned about Rooney being overweight after the summer are defending a player who can’t even stay fit during the season with training every day and more than likely a dietician. Mourinho is the 3rd manager to question him, there is only one person to blame here.

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20 Mar 2018 19:30:40
I don’t disagree ken, the challenge is whether anyone is prepared to invest the time needed. Young has come out today and said he could be the best left back in the world but whether he is looking to defend him or motivate him I don’t know. The kid is talented but he appears to have an application issue. Maybe he’s a bit thick because of you have that talent why would you waste it (Morrison springs to mind) . For me, if the talent is there, it is up to a club (hopefully ours) to get it out of him.

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20 Mar 2018 19:36:32
It's quite well known that Shaw can be a poor trainer, and how much Mourinho puts into training.

However, Mourinho has on four or five occasions tried this public humiliation of Shaw to try and get a reaction. If it didn't work first time then why keep doing it?

Mourinho also has a habit of ostracising one player he feels is surplus to requirements in attempt to keep others in line and scare players into not challenging him or his methods.

In any other walk of life if a person in a position of power repeatedly kept ostracising a person for whom they are responsible for in front of co-workers or in front of the worlds media it would be considered bullying.

He is attempting to emotionally blackmail a co-worker into doing something his way.

I don't buy your line about Mourinho has no choice as he is contractually obliged to answer questions. He has autonomy to answer those questions as he sees fit, rather than downbeat one player he could choose to elevate another. He could say Young's form is such that he doesn't deserve to be dropped. He could point out the things Young is doing well and why he is selecting him ahead of others. Or just simply say it was a tactical decision.

We know Shaw has struggled with training, many people have pointed this out, just because he struggles with motivation or understanding of his situation that doesn't mean he deserves to be hung out to dry over and over and over again. Mourinho could keep it in house. If Shaw isn't the right kind of player for him then thank him for his efforts and let him move on in the summer.

I'm not surprised about the timing of this whole Shaw situation, the press and worlds media start to question Mourinho and his ability. I wouldn't be surprised if one or two of the squad started to question it also, especially when you consider Pogba's recent treatment, he is a very popular and influential player in the dressing room.
Mourinho's modus operandi to deal with whispers that the players might be question him is to scare them into not challenging him by showing those players what happens if you cross him.

Shaw is his scapegoat this time.

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20 Mar 2018 20:12:33
I disagree shappy I think you are making way more of it than it actually is. At times perhaps Jose has been tougher on shaw but that’s because the lad has immense talent but can’t even stay fit during a season. We do not know what goes on behind the scenes and but I would be pretty confident that Jose has tried everything from putting an arm around him to giving him a kick up the arse. When does enough become enough? This smacks to me as frustration and a final roll of the dice for Jose on trying to provoke a reaction from shaw. And if shaw doesn’t like it then it’s bye bye for me because I’m sick of talking about potential and chances with him. He had a terrible injury but other plays such as Coleman has managed to come back so clearly he does not have the mental strength or drive to make it here.

I’m not supporting or condoning when Jose publicly criticises players because I feel it should usually be dealt with in house. But I am sick of the majority of these players and their attitude. We are on our third manager in 5 years and the common denominator in the failings have been the players. Yes the appointments have been poor and I’m not totally convinced by Jose, but there is a lack of professionalism and winning mentality in this squad. Whether you like Jose or not, or agree with his methods, he is a winner. He has high standards and shaw and other players are not matching those. If that is the case then get rid because we need that ruthlessness back. Sir alex had total respect and fear and maybe it’s going to take for Jose to ruffle a few of these pre madonna’s Feathers to get us challenging again.

Finally, people bring up Rooney being over weight or unfit. I find it ludicrous to compare him with shaw. One player was one of the passionate and hard working players we have had in a while and the other is not. Rooney for all his faults always worked hard, played with passion and wanted to win. Although shaw has played well when he has been given an opportunity, he doesn’t even show an ounce of commitment that Rooney did for us. 3 managers have said these comments about shaw and I think it is time to accept that it is best he moves in for both parties. Yes we may regret it if he turns it on for spurs or whoever. But there is no way in hell he's going to make it here and I am quite frankly sick and tired of discussing his potential when he doesn’t have the professionalism to even keep fit.

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20 Mar 2018 20:34:07
Sorry Park just read your post completely agree pal.

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20 Mar 2018 20:32:18
Good post GDS2.

I'm sorry to have to break this to you all but Luke Shaw has been rubbish for Utd.

A complete waste of money.

Poorly scouted and thrust into the lime light at one of the biggest Clubs in the world after only playing 12 months of professional football.

He's must be taking home over £100k a week I don't feel sorry for him one bit.

This bullying rubbish is nonsense and before you all jump all over me it does make a massive difference how much he earns. The blokes made for life, he's being paid millions by the club and when he gets a chance he can't even be bothered to run up and down the line and close people down. He's mugging us all off.

What has Jose done that's so terrible? Took him off at HT for a lack lustre performance when he should be busting a gut to get his place back? Come out after the game and told some home truths? Not picked him because others have been performing better? You've all gone soft.

Go and watch Shaw play, the bloke hides, he doesn't want the ball, he stands in position's where he's marked.

Seen as though he's got the whole world feeling sorry for him he should go and play for a Club where there is no expectation, where he can eat, drink and train how he likes. A Club where he can drive his Bentley into training and no one questions his commitment, desire or professionalism, a Club where he can enjoy all the trappings of being a professional footballer but without ever needing to be professional or accountable for his own performance.

This is Man Utd we're taking about for gods sake.

Luke Shaw make a decision about if you want to be an elite sportsman and stop wasting everyone's time. Do you think Ronaldo and Messi got to where they are today without putting the hard work in on the training ground, without making sacrifices, without having strength of personality. Man up!

Sorry for the rant Shappy I always enjoy reading your posts but I just can't agree on this one.

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20 Mar 2018 20:43:00
Park, I agree that Shaw is running very low on chances if he hasn't run out already.
I don't think he will make it to be honest, he does seem to lack that mental toughness you need to turn phenomenal talent into a phenomenal career.
In many ways that clear lack of mental toughness just makes it worse in publicly humiliating him. It's clear if a player lacks that strength of character then any act to bring him under close public scrutiny is only going to exasperate the problems.
He hasn't got the mental fortitude to make it, fine, let him move on and so be it. Constant humiliation isn't in anyone's interest. It's harmful to his well-being, it's shameful for the club, it will lower any potential transfer fee we would receive and I suspect it'll make players think twice about joining the club.
The only person is benefits is Jose as we are no longer questioning the poor performance he presided over in our elimination from the UCL. I also suspect the players will think twice about disagreeing with Jose for a while to.

I know Jose has a winners mentality, and he demands it from his players, and clearly our players need to regain that state of mind. But my moral compass is unhappy with the way Jose is running our club. Should we sell our soul for a nice silver trophy? For me winning is hollow unless we do it our way. I'm not sure this is it.

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20 Mar 2018 20:55:28
Five managers have all said the same about Shaw . This is nothing new it is a damn shame the guy was doing everything right even linking well with Depay and then he breaks his leg . It's a case of what could of been -SORRY 😆😆.

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20 Mar 2018 20:55:39
That's fine Danny, you don't have to agree, in fact I would find it unnerving if everyone agreed with me all the time.

You proscribe to the Tory view that how you should be treated depends on how much money you have.

I don't, I think people should be treated the same regardless of how much money they earn. People are quick enough to jump on a celebrities back for getting special treatment and feel they should be treated the same as the rest of us, then feel that they should be held up to a higher level of scrutiny because they earn more money. Therefore, not treating them the same as the rest of us.

I don't think we can have it both ways.

Clearly Shaw has commitment issues, clearly he doesn't train hard enough. That's fine, it's his life and he can choose to make the most of his talent or throw it away.

The club doesn't have to employ him and if they feel they aren't getting value for money then sell the lad and cut your losses.

Don't publicly shame him, don't try to emotionally blackmail a performance out of him and don't bully him. While we are here debating the technicality of what constitutes "bullying" and whether it's acceptable the name of our club is being dragged through the gutter in the world's press. But that's okay because Shaw earns a lot of money.

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20 Mar 2018 21:04:47
Good post Danny agree with that and good point on shaw getting too much too early. We were fools to pay a teenager £100,000 a week to a kid whose was 18 years old. It’s time for him to grow up quite frankly.

That is a good point actually shappy in terms of shaw clearly not having the mental strength to deal with criticism. I agree some people cannot take criticism as well as others so I appreciate that we do not know how shaw is taking it. I think the club should have cut their losses last summer instead of keeping him when it was clear Jose didn’t want him. It smacks of the board wanting to keep him and hoping he turned good whilst Jose clearly not wanting him.

I’m with you shappy about being unhappy morally at how Jose is there running our club. It is not pretty and I do feel we have sold our soul a little. However, having had time to think and assess the options out there and where we are currently in our rebuilding, it would be naive to sack Jose without giving him the summer and another year to try and get it right. At least when or if he goes in the summer the squad will be more balanced with hopefully some full backs and more of the deadwood stripped from the squad. It’s not pretty but if Jose can get these players to put in some hard graft and man up I will be happier. I agree jose’s Tactics are crap at times but it’s down to the players when it comes to application, hard work and passion on the pitch. Too many players for me are hiding and frankly don’t give a rats arse. These players are being found out and it’s time for Jose to identify and move them on. They are far too comfortable on their lucrative contracts and it’s biting us in the arse with how we have mishandled giving such big contracts out.

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20 Mar 2018 21:08:35
If I was selling my car this summer I wouldn't be making a point to any buyers how much I just don't want to keep it. Why not just say nothing and sell Shaw for best possible price if he duznt want him . How on earth does people thinking the manager bullies a young player and possible buyers thinking he has no future at utd help the price.

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20 Mar 2018 21:23:14
I get that Park, we can't keep chopping and changing the manager. However, that shouldn't come into the equation when deciding whether to continue with Mourinho or not. you can't keep the wrong man in the job just because you've changed managers a few times recently.

I would also question whether it's a good idea to let Mourinho spend another fortune unless you planned to keep him at least in the medium term. The owners were apparently reluctant to let Sir Alex spend big in his final few seasons as they knew he would be leaving soon and any players he bought might not fit in with the new regime.

Isn't that half the problem with Shaw? He was bought for a large fee by a manager who is no longer at the club and the new manager doesn't rate him.

Also have all of Mourinho's signings been that good?

Mkhitaryan is no longer at the club. Lindelof has been hit and miss. Zlatan was decent for a season but hardly set the world alight while also restricting young players at the club. Sanchez is yet to have a good game for the club. Pogba splits opinion whether he has performed well or not. That leaves Bailly, Matic and Lukaku who could be considered successes. 3 out of 8 is not a great batting rate. If your generous and say Pogba has been good then its a 50% success rate.

Do you still want to trust the man who might not see out next season with 100m+.

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20 Mar 2018 21:41:36
That is a good point Shaps. I’m fully behind the idea of getting a jardim or Tuchel in as I do not think Jose will get us to winning the title or playing attacking football. But the way I look at it is that Jose is not getting the most out of our attacking players, as opposed to the signings being poor or he squad not being good enough. I think Jose has not resolved the pogba and Sanchez conundrum of how to fit them in the team. I like lindelof he is very cultured and able on the ball and needs a run of games. Like you said matic bailly and Lukaku have been a success.

All those players you have mentioned are players who I would consider key first team players. I cannot see any of them getting moved on or not playing an important part under a new manager. What I am getting at is that I think Jose has bought well and much better than his predecessors, but is not getting anywhere near enough creativity and quality out of them. So if Jose was to be given money to spend this summer I would trust him to bring in full backs that were good enough and the midfielders we need. Ok maybe we still won’t play decent football but if he were to leave at the end of next season then the next manager has a much stronger platform and squad to work off. Rather than to come now where we are in a much more shaky position and changing manager would be a disruption.

It’s a very chicken and egg scenario and I know it sounds odd but perhaps it is better to give Jose the money as I think he has bought well and let him finish his rebuild. His issue has not been quality of signings for me it’s been that he has not been able to integrate them successfully into a cohesive team. Whoever takes over will have a very good team imo and it will be his job to get this players playing the style of football we demand. I’m not advocating we keep Jose for years but just allow him to see out his 3 year deal.

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20 Mar 2018 21:48:28
We'll have to call this one a day Shappy.

I just fail to see how Jose has humiliated or publicly shamed him or brought the Club into disrepute as your suggesting?

Maybe I'm missing something but were his words so bad? So cruel? Can a manger not now criticise a players performance, commitment or professionalism?

What I will concede is that if Shaw is mentally fragile than Jose words will do little to enhance his performance or confidence.

Your normally bang on the money so maybe I should give it more thought and check my moral compass.

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20 Mar 2018 22:02:38
If he's planning on selling Shaw in the summer, he's got a funny way of going about getting best price. I'd be bigging the lad up, playing him as much as possible, to hopefully get a fair market price for him. Slagging him off in public like this, is going to put off would-be suitors, or only attract low prices because it's clear José doesn't want him.

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20 Mar 2018 22:17:18
Can't get my head round that either nou, why would u talk down the price of yr own asset, jm duznt have to rate him if he duznt sell him but surely talk him up not down, we could end up with a reduced price and a manager perceived as a bully of young players it even causes debate on the man utd page . Absolute no win he has to go and any buyers pretty know it.

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21 Mar 2018 01:47:05
Lots of interesting debate on the Luke Shaw comments. Tony V didn't get away free from criticism in the very same interview yet that hardly got a mention in the media let alone the big fuss the LS comments have attracted, and Tony is our team captain!

I thought LS looked like he had taken previous criticism on board and was starting to mature a bit when he had a run of games a couple of months ago, but seems he has regressed again. Who knows what goes on behind closed doors but perhaps Jose is trying the same tactics again (he has form for using the same tactics! ), perhaps he's sending a message to the rest of the squad, or perhaps he's simply run out of patience with the lad.

My personal view is that the public nature of the criticism is a little odd, but the comments have been magnified by the media more than necessary.

The bullying debate is interesting and I see both sides. It can't be nice for the Shaw family to read and I feel for them mostly, but it comes with the territory and criticism can comes from current/ former/ rival managers/ players, pundits, fans, etc. I'd happily take a few public bashings from Jose for ~£100k a week without having to put in too much effort to earn it. In fact, I'd even write the scripts for the bashings myself!

Lastly, I don't get the thought process of some that says give LS game time to hike his sale price. We are Manchester United, if he's not good enough or committed enough to be at the club then he shouldn't be wearing the shirt ahead of someone who is; appearing for United is a privilege that should not be devalued. I'm not the biggest fan of Ashley Young at left-back, but he's been better than LS this season, and it would be criminal for him to be denied the chance to cement a place in the England World Cup squad to put LS in the shop-window.

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{Ed0333's Note - that made good reading

21 Mar 2018 01:56:42
Its not the managers job to maximise price stevie nothing to do with him as per ed002.

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21 Mar 2018 07:15:24
The truth is what we as fans think probably means very little, it seems to split opinion tho .
It's not a one if incident, I Still think Jose comments a few months ago about him having to be Shaw brain and make all his decision were worse .
The lad had just played well but Jose seemed to want to make a point it was all down to him . I'm still not sure what he was trying to achieve there .
I find his treatment of Shaw a bit odd to be honest.
The main question is does it or has it upset the dressing room or even the board and there has been a lot of reports it has .

Someone I think it was anglered posted the other day that j ducker was worth following, and he has wrote an article suggesting that senior players etc find the treatment of Shaw vindictive.
At the least it what everyone is talking about and paints nobody in a good light imo which raises the question would it not of been better to keep things a bit more in house .

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{Ed001's Note - it's mixed, Ducker is generalising about individuals and so is not giving a full picture. Some, such as Matic, worship Mourinho and will not listen to any suggestion he has got anything wrong. Others hate him and so hate everything he does. The vast majority are spread between the two to varying degrees.}

21 Mar 2018 08:30:36
Ed
Sounds like Jose splits opinion, obviously these things are not just down to the manager other people will be involved and have a view .
Is Jose been fully backed by the club in regards the treatment of Shaw.

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{Ed001's Note - everyone splits opinion, you can please some of the people all of the time etc. The problem Jose has is that a large proportion of people at United never wanted him and he is now turning some others against him with his treatment of Shaw, especially those at the business end of the club who see his value in the market dropping significantly. His backing is decreasing outside of Woodward, who hangs on his every word, according to what one member of staff told me.}

21 Mar 2018 09:59:25
Ken, it's not. But as per Ed001, I don't think the money men will be too happy.

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{Ed001's Note - it is not his job to maximise value, but it is also not his job to completely devalue assets and then complain when he is not being given hugely expensive players to replace the ones he himself has devalued.}

21 Mar 2018 11:02:54
It happend i don't see an issue with any of it. i'm 100% certain if shaw was my son i'd be telling him to shut his trap consider himself lucky and to listen to a manager that knows more than him. i'd advise him to make a public statement that he takes on board the managers comments and that he will try to improve and regain the managers trust. Then there is no story and people won't be talking about him.

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21 Mar 2018 12:24:06
Problem is Ken, nowadays its not the players father that has the say like it used to be, its agents thinking more about there pockets than what is in reality best for the player.

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21 Mar 2018 13:19:33
True fzz sadly.

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20 Mar 2018 15:09:22
Beginning of the season I thought we had a real good shot at the league with the football we was playing, numerous 4-0 wins and great fast counter attacks. What's happened? What's changed? Same squad minus mkhi and plus sanchez.

Lack of effort?
Manager criticism getting to the players?
Manager losing the dressing room?

Can't put my finger on it tbh, we all knew the style Mourinho is famous for, but I saw different to that at the beginning. Now he seems to be going more cautious. Not to my liking.

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20 Mar 2018 16:48:31
Name me one player who looks to be enjoying themselves?

Then start naming the City or Liverpool or Spurs players who seem happy in their work environment.

Chelsea players were pretty happy last season and they won the title, this season they look miserable and will struggle to finish in the top four.

That's not to say that happiness is the only thing that makes a difference. But our players look like they have the weight of the world on their shoulders at the moment. Our dressing room doesn't sound like a happy place atm.

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20 Mar 2018 16:58:53
In all honesty I think we need to cut our losses. Rid of Mourinho and possibly Pogba too. Send em both to PSG, get Allegri or Jardim in and some midfielders who go about their play properly and don't pose around like an overpaid child changing their hair colour everyday and updating there Instagram by the hour.

Else I feel we'll fall behind.

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20 Mar 2018 17:09:34
I think it’s an indication of players being afraid to take risks. As the season has progressed, players are less likely to do something that deviates from Jose’s instructions because that’s what gets you dropped. This has helped defenders somewhat by ensuring they have extra protection, but stifled attacking creativity. If you’re game plan is being directly dictated by the manager, this leaves little room for any improvisation.

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20 Mar 2018 17:55:50
I think a lot of players are struggling with weight of expectation that comes with being a united player. Maybe they've realised they aren't good enough. Maybe they look themselves up on twitter or come on here. Not to defect anything away from Jose. I'm sure that's not helping matters with some of them.

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{Ed025's Note - shaw is certainly struggling with the weight mort, but i dont know about the expectation bit mate.. :)

20 Mar 2018 20:44:54
Just want to point out that we have a squad full of internationals and there's a world cup coming up. Maybe that's why a few players are taking their foot off the gas a little. Plus we've not got a lot to play for anymore.

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20 Mar 2018 21:57:43
I’m with Mort. Too many can’t handle playing for us and have stage fright.

Shaw being a prime culprit, added to the fact he can’t be bothered. Look at Young's comments today. If Shaw got his head down and worked he’d be one of the best in the world. Quite a dammning quote from a team mate.

Maybe even put Pogba in this bracket. He came here to be the main man but he clearly isn’t right now. I’m not advocating selling him, but great players have come here and crumbled over the years.

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20 Mar 2018
New image uploaded to the
Manchester United Player Sightings page entitled, Same scenario

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20 Mar 2018 13:47:15
Great one 👍👍👍 🤣🤣🤣.

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20 Mar 2018 13:58:52
I have a question for all those who point to Ferguson getting time get it right as a reason for us to persist with mourinho today, was SAF's teams performances boring or poor before he won the titles?

And before I get accused of having an agenda or something, this is a genuine question. I was born after Ferguson win his first title so don't know much about how we actually played under him early on?

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20 Mar 2018 14:16:32
Club was in a mess when fergy took over in the bottom 3 I think .
Scouting, youth set up was a long way off what it should of been .
He stabilised the team and got about sorting out off field stuff out .
End of the 80s was tough going loads of injuries and bit inconsistent the work he was doing on the off field issue probably saved his job .
90s kicked of and it an upwards spiral different feel about club .

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20 Mar 2018 14:19:28
Ask Red Man he's always a great source of information regarding the pre Fergi era I always like reading his posts and he'll give you an honest account I'm sure.

I'm nearly 40 and only really started following Utd seriously around 1989. I've had my season ticket since 1993. I vividly remember the 5-1 defeat to City and things being throughly depressing around that time but I must confess I can't really comment on the quality of the football. My dad and uncles are all big Utd fans and they all said it was sh** and a lot supporters were calling for him to be sacked.

Probably doesn't answer your question very well sorry.

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20 Mar 2018 14:52:01
Csm there are a lot of parallels.
New signings doing badly very expensive ones too at the time.
2nd in his first full season then about 6th the following 2 seasons. The football was just as bad as now.
But the club of course is different now. We were 20 years without a title then we are only 5 without one now.
Then we were the biggest spenders we are not now.
Terrible culture in the dressing room its probably not as bad now but maybe not too far off. Lvg stated yest he found many of the players to be unprofesdional. Its quite obvious some of them are.
Gresvsie makes the same point in his article there that i'm making today. Good manager poor players letting the club down.
We were a sleeping giant then now wr are only a giant taking a nap😆
Thats only my opinion of course some see the same parrells some dont.
But for the 2nd and 3rd year of fergies reign while he sorted out the wheat from the chaff the football was terrible and the results were too.
He was backed because he had a proven winning record and the rest is history.
Its not the exact same as its 30 years ago but there are a lot of similarities. Fans calling for his head. Fergie unceremoniously dumped many fan favourites he ruled with an iron fist. Players had to get their hair cut. Harrasing the trainees by showing up at house parties. He had every doorman in manchester in his pocket. He made tough decisions and didn't suffer fools gladly.
He didn't treat all players the same. Moran whiteside magrath were thrown out due to their drink culture but robson wasnt. he was fergies island.
Not the same but pretty close.

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20 Mar 2018 15:08:24
Thank you Danny Ken and jred, so there seems to be a consensus that we played poorly as we are doing now. Always thought the football wouldn't be as good but mostly in the same vein just needing better players to get results.

Would really love to get redman and ajh's thoughts too on this.

Might just make me give grumpy atleast a season more before calling for his head.

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20 Mar 2018 15:10:12
I remember the same analogies when Moyes and van Gaal were in charge. The truth is that Fergie took over a completely different club than we have in present day. He built solid foundations that are stil in place now, even if they do need some revamping.

Jose has been handed a huge amount of money to bring in top quality players, and still complains that he needs more money to compete in the league and in Europe. Obviously we should be looking to improve the squad, but the underlying problem is that Jose can’t get the best out of players he already has at his disposal, even some of those he brought in.

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20 Mar 2018 15:16:01
English football in general was in a low way back end of the 80s United where a bit of the top in England miles behind the best in Europe.
The European ban had hurt English clubs, no where near as much money in the English team .

Fergy took over a team that had won 3 fa cups and a league 2 title in 20 year . We were 2nd from bottom of the league and had been in the second division 10 year prior .
The turn around of the club both on and off pitch for me was staggering .
Never ever dreamed we would be winning more titles than the scouse.

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20 Mar 2018 16:14:13
There was such a drinking culture in the game back then as well, and Utd was no different. Fergie had some job on his hands knocking that on the head.

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20 Mar 2018 16:27:44
That was a great read ken.

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20 Mar 2018 16:38:20
As has been said, his first 2 full seasons were a tough watch, a few couldn’t see it getting better. It was probably worse than it is now, fans were very disillusioned in the early years. The FA Cup win in ‘90 masked another average season but after that it took off. Players gelled, we started playing with 2 wingers and ultimately Eric was the final piece of the jigsaw before we won the title. He had to ship players out and his initial signings didn’t make it to the Championship team either.

Ralph Milne springs to mind, we used to whistle the theme tune to One Man and his Dog to him as he loitered on the wing vainly waiting for someone to pass to him. And there were others. But there was also Schmeichel for £600K which was incredible, and Brian McClair, an unsung hero who in his first season didn’t go more ham 3 games without scorinG.

SAF ram everything. He turned up at a Torquay game to sign Lee Sharpe personally, imagine that today.

Google Arsenal 2 - 6 Man United League Cup, that’s when we were starting to get it together. Lee Sharpe hat trick, this was before Giggs got a look in.

Martin Edwards stood by him but remember we had been average for many years so it was easier to do so then. There wasn’t the money in the game either and only the top team qualified for the European Cup as it was then so financially the club wasn’t under any pressure.

After all the cups, a title, and then a double, we didn’t win anything in ‘95 and unbelievably the Evening News ran a poll on whether he should be sacked. He sold big players and promoted the youth leading to the infamous “you can’t win anything with kids” quite from Hansen. The rest is history.

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20 Mar 2018 17:07:37
Great post ajh very informative for someone like me.

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20 Mar 2018 18:00:12
Good posts AJH an Jred. Back then i'd have been happy with the one title and getting the monkey off our backs.

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20 Mar 2018 18:19:17
Good thread, but one key point I want to make that is overlooked often when comparing the best possible outcome to the current situation. By the way it happens with players as well all the time (still waiting for Depay to be the next Ronaldo) .

Just because it may have been this bad once and a great manager corrected things and built a legacy, what about the 1000+ managers that haven't done that - it's taking two bad situations and cherry picking the ultimate outcome from millions of variables that are far more likely to occur?!

Odds on Jose doing a SAF are slim to zero, just because some people see parallels (I don't), far more likely to do an LVG than a SAF.

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20 Mar 2018 19:29:54
Beast,

This was a question for people to put a different spin on it not just spout the same answer again that you always give. Very informative post for us a bit younger, there does seem to be some similarities, we certainly have a manager who has proved himself at the top level so might be worth not sacking him just yet.

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20 Mar 2018 12:17:11
Rather hypocritical of Deschamps to complain about Pogba’s lack of playing time, given his own selection strategy of him for the France national team.

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20 Mar 2018 13:18:57
Spot on Wallace. So many out there helping to add salt to wound 🤣🤣.

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20 Mar 2018 13:32:03
what ever happened to he was dropped because he wasn't performing.

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20 Mar 2018 14:00:49
Deschamps is an idiot he is French fa's attempt at levelling the playing field given the advantage they have in the number of talented world class players in their team.

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20 Mar 2018 10:42:32
Media field day and buffet with poison for ManUtd supporters and stirring the emotions. There is so much spices from the media into the unflavored red soup. I laugh at all the reactions i have read on this site in the days following the CL exit.
What a joke calling for the head of the manager now. It just shows the unity of the supporters of the biggest club in the world. More like unsupportors? Imagine all the anti ManUtd people laughing and loving every minute of this. I am embarrassed.

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20 Mar 2018 12:43:09
Yeah, I mean imagine all those paying customers wanting a decent product for the money and time they invest. Disgusting!

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20 Mar 2018 12:49:42
Come on 666 everybody's entitled to their opinion pal it wouldn't be a banter site otherwise and a very boring place if we all thought the same.

There is nothing wrong with voicing your opinion if you don't think the Club is going in the right direction.

I very much remain pro Jose for a number of reasons which I've highlighted on numerous occasions but even I must admit that those that want rid also make compelling arguments.

I don't think there is anything embarrassing about that and if they didn't support or care about the Club they wouldn't be talking the time to read or post on this site.

Nobody is flying planes over Old Trafford or taking Jose Out banners into the stadium we're just discussing if he's the right man to take us forward.

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20 Mar 2018 12:55:25
Modern fans have no patience its all about the now. We've slowly been turning into something I've always despised. Real Madrid. Spoilt fans turning on managers after a bad game. Calling for more an more expensive signings only to turn on them first sign of trouble. Is Jose right? I think he needs next season. If its not working then think about a change.

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20 Mar 2018 13:09:43
Im not embarrassed by anyone else's opinion. People have a right to express themselves.

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20 Mar 2018 13:15:23
Yes I am very agreeable everyone has their own opinion and definitely fine with the banters. To borrow the word from Mancman just disgusting to see the media poison.
I am very happy to read the banters trust me. Only thing is feeling sad that the media nonsense is helping to worsen the situation.
I am not a Jose super supporter but I am also not happy with how we have been playing. But let the man do his job and support him and chop him only after the season (be it this or next) . Just feel it is very disruptive. All I feel is that we should just support the manager and make decision after the last PL game.
Personally I think he has done an okay job till now. Perhaps we have too much expectation from the glory years and need to understand that we have been spoilt? With the last 2 managers helping our descent to before Jose took over, perhaps we need to be a little more patient?

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20 Mar 2018 13:16:26
Yes Mort I am all for the same as evident in my above response.

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20 Mar 2018 13:17:54
Partly agree Danny.

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20 Mar 2018 13:26:50
The question Is, is Jose the right man for United. If we look around old Trafford apart from the fans who is United through and through.
I see Charlton. Now I bet he is looking at Jose in the hot seat saying how did you get in there.
It's common knowledge that he doesn't like Jose. Before Jose got the job and it came out Charlton didn't want him, I was like give him a chance he will change do things the United way. Has he, No he hasn't he has just proved it's a Jose show.
And if I'm honest when I look at him now I see a Chelsea badge, a blue tinge. isn't that what a few people at the top of United see.
I know managers come from different clubs but there's something about Jose for me that doesn't sit right.
Now that's my last post about Jose.
If he says he stays I support Manchester United not Jose.
I will always watch and support United.

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20 Mar 2018 13:33:54
so would everyone be happy playing fantastic football and winning nothing for the next 5 season. only finishing in the top 4.

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20 Mar 2018 13:43:52
Ah, the old, 'either or' argument. As if the two have to be mutually exclusive. Funny how other top teams manage to do both.

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20 Mar 2018 13:44:59
Leahy I hear you and I also feel some of that as well and believe you me I do feel a mix of what all are saying. At time I feel he is too blue for my liking picking fights with Conte as if he has something to prove being a better Chelsea manager. But I’d like to believe he is professional and he knows that he is now a ManUtd manager.
Best thing for me I feel now is just support my club and see what happens next season re the title challenge and silverware.

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20 Mar 2018 13:48:17
What about playing dull football and winning nothing do you want that bolger? What about option 3 playing entertaining football and winning a quintuple of trebles can we pick that option? Or are we only allowed one or the other? Guessing as city are playing games great it must mean they are now going to Implode as they can't play good football and win stuffs not allowed right?

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20 Mar 2018 14:22:07
Jesus Bolger. I thought we done that argument about entertainment and winning or losing. What have Barca, city, psg, Bayern and Celtic all got in common? They all play entertaining football and they're all winning their leagues by a mile.

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{Ed007's Note - I fixed that for you :-D

20 Mar 2018 15:40:02
theres also teams that are playing entertaining football and winning nothing.

its a topic that's best left alone because its going round in circles.

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20 Mar 2018 16:15:10
You brought it up! 😁.

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20 Mar 2018 09:20:51
Just off topic slightly but who do you guys believe is our player of the season so far this term, if I had to pick I would say Lukaku, has scored plenty of goals which players often find hard when coming to united, has improved his hold up play immensely, not perfect and took a lot of flak but I believe he deserves a lot of credit for his debut season.

Believable3 Unbelievable3

20 Mar 2018 09:51:37
A toss up between Zlatan and Daley Blind. Both been excellent and definitely worth new improved contracts.

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20 Mar 2018 11:18:29
lukaku seen as though we just park the bus he's scored a fair amount of goals.

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20 Mar 2018 11:57:00
Matic lukaku ddg are the 3 standouts for me so far this season.

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20 Mar 2018 10:09:35
Good shout that WRD. Lukaku has been much better than I expected. I think he could do even better if we played to his strengths but because he has had to adapt it has improved his all round game.

I thought he would be a poor signing so it goes to show I have no idea what I'm talking about.

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20 Mar 2018 12:01:37
Probably DDG again. Lukaku and Matic next. Although I think Lukaku's got better as the season's gone on, while Nemanja 'the island' Matic, has maybe looked a little jaded of late.

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20 Mar 2018 16:41:02
Would love to hear a chant containing "the island" maybe that can be the singing sections homework or summer break project.

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20 Mar 2018 18:29:29
Kenny and dolly.
Island in team
that is what you are
You are jose's dream
You can take us far
Play with energy
Its a diferrent world
Please rely on each rely on each other
ah hah

Il get my coat.

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20 Mar 2018 08:59:27
How much further ahead would we be with Pep?

Believable3 Unbelievable4

20 Mar 2018 09:04:48
Points wise it's very difficult to ascertain, we could be 5-8 points better off or be 5-8 points worse off. But our football would be much better to watch and we would still be in CL.

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20 Mar 2018 08:41:09
Well it’s been a bit feisty on here hasn’t it? I love the debate and discussion but not everything has to be black and white. Just because you want Jose to stay doesn’t mean you agree with how he has treated Shaw. Just because you want Jose sacked doesn’t mean he hasn’t made a lot of progress. This constant black and white “which camp are you in” is getting boring.

Ken, I’ve decided not to comment on your posts any more, the jred / ken show has been getting tiresome; I see a comment from jred and I know there will be a reply from you and it feels like there is an AJH / ken show developing which I want no part of, it really can’t be much fun for everyone else.

Continually stating your opinion over and over again doesn’t change that it is just your opinion, and judging from the likes / dislikes there are enough people to disagree with you without me having to join in.

Ed, can we put this discussion to bed for a while with a poll? Do you want Jose as United Manager next season. Yes or No.

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{Ed033's Note -


Jose Manager Poll

20 Mar 2018 09:13:51
That poll is as evenly split at my time of voting as the fans are around the country.

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20 Mar 2018 09:22:03
AJH - agree with everything you say about the postings.
The only thing I would change is the poll question, or add an additional question:
Do you think José is getting the best out of the players we have?
Bloody hell, José is a controversial subject, we can't even agree on a poll question lol.

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20 Mar 2018 09:22:25
Tony,

That is why I have taken a step back a bit, I know if I post that the same people reply with the same point they already made 10 times, with buzzwords like 'red tinted glasses' being used over and over.

I don't really get why there are different camps, we are all supposed to support the same team and want the same thing at the end of the day. I know people are upset we got knocked out of the CL the way we did and that is fuelling a lot of the posts but I don't know anybody who thought we were going to win it anyway, we are 4 or 5 players away from being anywhere close.

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20 Mar 2018 09:23:11
Ajh
It a good shout that and a fair point.

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20 Mar 2018 09:36:36
You guys also have to factor in the occasional Liverpool fan voting for José to stay ;-)

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20 Mar 2018 11:10:04
couldnt agree more GDS2.

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20 Mar 2018 11:15:14
I can't vote, its a difficult question.

Im 100% not happy with the style of play. (manager)

Im 100% not happy with the effort of the overpaid players.

So ideally a load of deadwood would leave and the team will start playing better next season. Who the manager would be is any ones guess and a call I can't make.

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20 Mar 2018 11:16:05
Fair point ajh it should be noted its not all one way traffic. I think that's fair to say.

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20 Mar 2018 11:51:12
The only reason i'd vote for mou to stay is because of lack of a better suitor. Keyword for me here is better, not potential.

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mbd              

20 Mar 2018 10:05:55
I don’t think José should be sacked at this point, but he does need to at least recognise the failings in his approach and try to adapt. At the moment he looks like he’s hell bent on alienating himself from everyone rather than just accepting that he’s fallible.

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20 Mar 2018 10:12:57
Tony, I wrote a similar post the other day which was turned into an article. I find I'm on the fence about Jose, although tilting toward feeling he might have to leave sooner rather than later.

I think a better poll would be are you happy with how Jose has the team playing? I expect we would see a far more United front in that poll.

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20 Mar 2018 07:28:43
"Paul Pogba may be struggling to get game time at Manchester United, but the flashy Frenchman has unveiled a new ‘Super Saiyan Blue’ hairdo, which takes inspiration from popular anime DragonBall Z, on Instagram to celebrate the international break".
Its good to see that Pogba is concentrating on the football and turning his dismal form around.
I think some if these players are living in a totally different world.

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20 Mar 2018 07:59:20
Don't you worry there Attack Attack Attack, his agent says 'he'll be a club legend in the near future'!, and with someone like that as your agent, its not hard to see why he's another player with a sense of entitlement, living in his own walt disney world of fantasy, apparently deschamps is going to help council him on the living nightmare of having to sit on the bench for 2 games while trousering 290 grand a week, i feel his pain, i really do!

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20 Mar 2018 08:10:27
I'm not supporting his choice of haircut, but I do find it strange how people consider getting your haircut as a sign that a player isn't concentrating on their football.

Having spent 14 years in the Barbering industry and having cut many professional sportsmen's hair, I can confirm everyone needs a haircut. Does getting your haircut stop you from doing your job?

Beckham and Ronaldo are considered club legends and I can't remember them ever having a hair out of place. Somehow they managed to fit in regular trips to the barbershop around their 6 hour working day.

For me if your a young millionaire and getting your haircut every other week is the only excess you have fallen pray to then your doing pretty well. Alcohol, drugs, gambling and women are far bigger distractions from football than getting a trim.

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20 Mar 2018 08:17:27
Most people in top flight football are totally deluded. They believe they are gods. Most are decidedly average. The modern day footballer at the top end makes me sick. My uncle has his own travel agency business and deals with a lot of Premier league footballers and some of the stories are unbelievable. They don’t live in the real world.

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20 Mar 2018 08:19:34
Absolutely spot on Shappy!

Can you fit me in for a short back and sides please? Maybe some blond highlights?

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20 Mar 2018 08:39:23
Shaps I'll have some of that too. Do we get the banter discount? 😂.

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20 Mar 2018 08:42:44
In other news, Shaw was caught brushing his teeth and applying deodorant, this must be the cause of Mourinho's criticisms.

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20 Mar 2018 08:50:39
Man has haircut exclusive. Compelling stuff.

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20 Mar 2018 08:55:07
Angel - Maybe you could go for a flat top mate? With my blonde highlights I reckon we'd break some hearts!

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20 Mar 2018 09:01:18
Nothing wrong with changing hairdos AAA just need our Goku to start performing and taking responsibility like his anime counter part.

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20 Mar 2018 09:08:39
Ronaldo and Beckham regularly put a shift in and nobody questioned any extra curricular activity they may have had because of that, Pogba is all show and no substance.

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20 Mar 2018 09:24:37
It is entirely impopssibly for somebody to concentrate on football and also get their hair cut. He should have long flowing locks until he has scored 30 goals in my opinion or he needs to leave.

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20 Mar 2018 11:18:02
A saw a great picture of him getting his barnet done with the caption
'Salon Dor winner 2018'

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20 Mar 2018 10:05:37
Shappy, I wish I had enough hair to have different styles!

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20 Mar 2018 10:17:25
GDS2 so you see Pogba more like Eriq La Salle circa 1988 than Michael Jackson circa 1977?

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20 Mar 2018 10:28:52
Players with non-black boots shouldn’t be allowed on the Old Trafford turf. And standard crew cuts for all. Bebe knew. .

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20 Mar 2018 10:55:59
I think it's tactical. Distract the opposition and then score.
Whilst posting, I think that Pogba will be a club legend. I not so sure that the club will be the one we all support.

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20 Mar 2018 14:27:07
Interesting views boys but at least we stopped talking about mourinho for 5 mins. Haha.

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20 Mar 2018 14:30:22
Personally, I think his head is in the shed and he's stealing money from United. He needs to knuckle down and show the club and fans what he's made of. But he won't as his image and off field activities seem to matter more than his job as a footballer. And that's the point in case. He does not come across as a committed footballer and let's face it, no one in this site can argue that Pogba has been a success.

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20 Mar 2018 15:52:29
yul brenner did not need a hair cut.

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Review Of The Day 20th March 2018

20 Mar 2018 04:43:11
{Ed's Note - Ed001 has posted a new article entitled, Review Of The Day 20th March 2018

Believable0 Unbelievable0

20 Mar 2018 06:07:57
Interesting review. Good stuff Ed.
Thanks.

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{Ed001's Note - cheers 666.}

20 Mar 2018 09:04:42
Great read Ed - nice to see Rojo retains a bit of 'old fashion' defending in his game. The first training session would have been interesting lol.
Whilst the debate on here centres around José and how good the players are, reading about Ravel is a stark reminder of wasted talent.

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{Ed001's Note - cheers mate, very United-heavy today for some reason. Odd how that happened that all these stories come out just now isn't it? Almost like the club were trying to get attention away from something... ;-)