Manchester United Banter Archive November 20 2011

 

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20 Nov 2011 23:14:17
I cannot understand all of this moaning.. we're doing well. We might be 5 points behind City but if we keep winning and keeping clean sheets those points can be made up after Christmas. This is like 4 clean sheets in a row now.. exactly what we needed after the City game. We have big injury woes and we're still bagging 3 points in nearly every game - what's there to moan about!

Everyone just keeps complaining that this team isn't good enough.. Just keep watching them prove you wrong..

Joe

Believable3 Unbelievable3

20 Nov 2011 23:10:27
Joe

I believe your point about Ronaldo is not a good one. Ronaldo was World player of the year for a reason. Nani and Ronaldo bare no comparison at all.

Nani is not our best player, when he plays well he is good but Rooney is the only world level player we have. The problem is as I and one or two others have said, Nani is inconsistent.

Red Man

_________________________________

I would agree with you Red Man that Nani is inconsistent, however when he's good he's amazing - this is the reason you lot get so wound up about him. You see his stunner for Portugal, you see him knock in a few from 30 yards and you get annoyed because he doesn't play like that every game. I agree, it is annoying. The fact that he doesn't play to that standard every game.

My comparison between Nani and Ronaldo is simply based on their inconsistencies. I would agree with you that for a while there Ronaldo was great nearly every game, but there were parts of his United career (particularly early on) where he was every bit as inconsistent as Nani. It used to drive me insane when he didn't show up for a game, and it was the bigger teams for a while as well - he just blended into the background when the team wasn't performing.

They both have the capability to change games on there own, and they both have failed on numerous occasions.

The difference between them was that when Ronaldo was at his best he was the best in the world.

I would argue also that when Nani is at his best he is just as good as Rooney. He is just there less often..

Joe

Believable4 Unbelievable1

20 Nov 2011 22:46:02
Now normally i'm a big fan of Nani but recently it seems like he thinks he's made it and isn't putting the effort in like he has over the last 18 months. He is a world class player on his day but they seem to be fewer and farer between this season. If an offer of 30m+ came in for him in the summer i'd sell him. Getting rid of a great player is always a tough decision but if it means we can bring in a few good players and improve the overall team then great.

If we sold Nani, Berbatov, Park, Evra, Carrick or Fletcher, Kusczcak, Gibson, Macheda and Diouf that would bring in around 80-90m plus the normal 20m the Glaziers promised we'd have every year that'd give us 100-110m to spend theoretically. I'd love to see signed with that money:

Alba or Izaguirre if Alba wants to go to Barca.

Jack Rodwell, great young player who is adaptable.

Marco Reus, a great prospect who has a touch of unpredictibilty about him.

Marko Marin, a great player going forward either centrally or wide left.

Wilfried Zaha, a great young player who is as good at laying on chances as he is at putting them away.

The two german lads for me are the best players in the bundesliga not currently playing for Dortmund or Bayern Munich both of which can be hard to negoitate with. They really are great players who could be picked up for abit less than other similar players because they don't get as much media attention. Rodwell has shown this season that it isn't lack of quality but lack of being managed properly. with these top quality young players along with what we have then we'll have a fantastic group of young exciting players.

Let me know what you think.

Shappy {Ed004's Note - With that money I would want Bale, Martinez and Gotze.}

Believable10 Unbelievable4

20 Nov 2011 22:20:09
With regards to the Luis Suarez and Patrice Evra racism case, many people are claiming this 'Negrito' word to be what Suarez used. Suarez claims that Evra is called this by his United team mates too, but they used it in a different context. Suarez made direct reference to Evra's skin colour! Why would Suarez say that to Evra? Why did he not admit to saying that word originally? Why did it take 4 weeks for him to admit to this? Is it any surprise the FA charged him just days after this?

G.A.G.U.S

Believable6 Unbelievable2

20 Nov 2011 22:15:48
"I will tell you what they didn't do "Rain fish I always Moan" - they didn't sell Carrington when they had the chance and they didn't re-name OT when they had the chance. Over looking millions there in both cases so jog-on, years served at Ot doesn't give you the right to look down your bias nose at others. Its coz we are united on the pitch and off that we are the Greatest so dont forget that!"
----------------------------------------------------
You make a couple of very good points, but just because the Glazers never sold naming rights to OT or sold Carrington we can not say that is a good thing that they done for us. They have no f**king right to do those things to our club.

However I must go back a few years when RFT's crew (MUST) would say that the Glazers WILL sell Carrington, that they WILL sell the naming rights to OT or even worse that they WILL sell OT. Well these things never happened did they? People said that they WILL sell our best players and they WILL lower our wage bill. People said they WILL take dividends, in-fact £125m in one season, but they never did those things either did they? I am not defending the Glazers in any way because they shouldn't do these things, but I just want to show how wrong RFT and MUST have been when predicting the future. MUST said we WILL be paying off the PIKs, well we aren't. We mustn't forget that the Glazers are Vulchers and they see our club as a big fat golden goose that sh1ts out cash, but we also mustn't forget that MUST were very wrong with their predictions.

Sydney!

Believable4 Unbelievable4

20 Nov 2011 21:01:08
if we sell berbatov in january does anyone thing we should put a cheeky 25-30m bid in for torres?
i know he has flopped at chelsea but we all know how good he is and a player of his class doesn't just turn bad, in my opinion if he was at united with rooney behind him he would start to be that great player again, plus his price wouldn't be that high as he hasn't played well for the past year, so if we could get him for 25-30m what do people think? buy him or not?

Believable2 Unbelievable5

20 Nov 2011 20:47:21
Guys, just a quick one on full backs. Who do you think in your opinion are the best full backs in PL now?

My choice would be Walker Rb and Enrique LB

RedJam

Believable1 Unbelievable4

20 Nov 2011 20:42:23
Reflecting back on yesterday

I am becoming concerned that as a team we are playing and are just doing enough but there is a deeper more ingrained issue. We now lack brilliant individuals that have taken us up a level in the past. Without SAF pulling it together consider how many of the individuals in the team would get into any of the other top teams. Three years ago we had Rooney, Ronaldo and Tevez who, at the time, would have got into most teams in the world. Now we have Rooney who is starting to show signs of frustration with the paucity of the others around him.

We are supposedly waiting for Pogba but the longer he doesnt get a chance the more you start to think there is an issue.

Yes we won yesterday, but SAF seems to be sending the team out to not concede and go from there. I believe this is now down to lacking that extra level of player and that is a real concern especially as we are unlikely to spend what is needed.

Red Man

Believable10 Unbelievable4

20 Nov 2011 19:40:45
RAINFISH wont like it( who cares) but why is he so arrogant ?
I think he might have been the class bully. And also that all his classmates, neighbors etc. are United haters, Not that they dont like United but for the simple fact that RAINFISH supports the club.
And anyways who is this RAINFISH? (last time someone asked Who is Sydney? there was a series of answers by Bond and others. Expecting the same :) )

Mr Noname

Believable3 Unbelievable1

20 Nov 2011 18:59:38
I'm actually happy that liverpool won today, hopefully they will go in against city on a high and take a few points off them!

Believable8 Unbelievable1

20 Nov 2011 18:09:56
how long will rooney continue in midfield

Believable0 Unbelievable3

20 Nov 2011 18:00:20
Sydney it looks like you and the Glazers have got another little fan in Devil Dust. I take it as a compliment that you say i am 100% against anything that is connected to the Glazers. If anyone can tell me one good thing they have done for the club i am happy to listen. They have just taken taken and then taken more for the club. As for Fergie well if he doesn't want to answer the 75 questions that the Irish gave him when he kicked up about the Rock, then he just does as he is told and like Judas Gill he toes the party line. So I plead guilty to the crime of hating the Glazers and wanting them out of my club. Be careful Dust for if Sydney thinks he has another Glazer sympathiser he will use you to push the party line. I know your game Sydney but enjoy the banter. RAINFISHTROMBONE

Believable0 Unbelievable3

20 Nov 2011 17:19:37
What normally happens is that the TEAM adjusts according to the needs of their best player so that they can maximize the output of that player(messi,barca,RVP,etc).......but in our case the BEST PLAYER is adjusting for the entire team and thus we are losing out on Rooney's brilliance as a striker........

For the past few games it has been difficult to watch the entire 90 mins, I hope Rooney goes back to playing as a striker even if it means playing Anderson alongside Carrick or Fletcher.

MUMBAI_BOY

--------------------------------------------------

Very interesting point you made there mate. Now by seeing last nights performance from United you can see that they are also doing the same. They slowed the pace of the game to such an extent that they made Carrick look good. But I dont think this strategy will work against a team which attacks the ball when not in possession.

Mr Noname

Believable0 Unbelievable0

20 Nov 2011 17:04:28
nani when on top form is great player but yet again yesterday we didnt see it 1 good game 2/3 bad ones if a good offer comes in ie 25/30m then there players of his level if not better u could acquire who are more consistent gaitan hazard for example cjwales82

Believable3 Unbelievable3

20 Nov 2011 16:44:01
The John Terry/David Liability high line is brilliant to watch. They've got absolutely no idea what they're doing! Tottenham will finish above them if they keep this up.

Matthew...

Believable7 Unbelievable1

20 Nov 2011 16:38:53
Can anyone think of a fixture that has produced more great games over the past 5 years or so than Chelsea-Liverpool?

Probably my favourite non-United game.

Believable3 Unbelievable2

20 Nov 2011 16:10:17
Went into subway today and asked for their biggest, greasiest, most expensive sub.

They gave me an 'Andy Carroll'.

UNITED_LEGENDS

Believable9 Unbelievable0

20 Nov 2011 16:06:25
guys i dont know how many of you has ever thought that we would be better playing a 4-3-3 formation. it would ablle to solve our midfield problems and take the maximum out of some players like carrick ando and rooney... personally, my fav formation would be:

De gea

Rafael Vida Rio Fabio

Carrick
clevers
Ando

-------
Nani Wazza Young
I think it depends on nani and young's adaptability to become more like forwards ( like cristiano and rossi) instead of wingers.
instead of carrick we can play jones or any dm if 1 is to be bought
cleverley would be dictating the tempo of the game , much like xavi or modric, and Ando would be utilised at his best position : attacking midfielder.
chicha/welbeck could start ahead of nani/ Young and rooney will be enjoying his prefered position as a free agent spraying passes all around the edge of the opposition area. I know it looks too much barca like but if it suits us better than why not?|
in the future we will see smalling and jones as our main cds and we could see pogba playing ahead of carrick or even clevers and ravel ultimatly replacing ando or even utilised as a free agent if rooney is to be rested.
A similar united formation was tested by ferguson ( the 4-5-1) but the attacking flair was lacking considering rooney had to drop deep to collect the ball, but in this case, nani and young beeing utilised as forwards and for games that need better protection of the back 4, fletcher would be ahead of clevers or ando and valencia would replace nani . Any thoughts?
Mick

Believable2 Unbelievable1

20 Nov 2011 15:45:46
Im relatively new to this site and i really enjoy it and the Eds do a great job, But can i just ask RAINFISHTROMBONE a question please? Do you love or hate United ? Genuine question...mufc

Believable4 Unbelievable0

20 Nov 2011 14:25:42
Guys just read Bayern Munich's CEO comments that they were and are still interested in Nani what you guys think if we could use him as a makeshift bid for Bastian Schwienstieger. Eds any thoughts?

Mancunian Red {Ed004's Note - We need someone like Schweinsteiger in midfield but who would you sign to replace Nani, the only winger I can think of went to Barcelona this year, maybe if Di maria was up for sale but he is not as good as Nani imo}

Believable0 Unbelievable0

20 Nov 2011 14:39:41
I thought I saw Evra limping during the Swansea game,
now I realize what is was - he's gone and shot himself
in the foot!

www.youtube.com/watch?v=l4_fQXwIV4E&t=35m30s

Believable0 Unbelievable4

20 Nov 2011 13:49:23
RFT I agree in some point to what you are saying however as far as I am aware we tried desperately to sign Sneijder in the summer maybe the Ed can confirm this.
Also I think even if the glazers were not the owners we would surely struggle to compete with cities billions so Im not sure apart from being debt free of course just how better off we would be on the field.
We need to sign quality soon we are all saying that for 2 years now and if we do then IM sure we will be able to stand up to any team out there.

Devil Dust.........................Oh my god Dust where have you been for the last couple of years. These leeches have taken more out of our club to pay their debt than city have spent on players. it is people like you who blindly follow and don't ask questions that put us in the position we are in. Devil Dust i trust that you are very young and so i forgive your youthful naivety if not then your ignorance is laughable but unforgivable. Sydney will defend the Glazers but with a reasonable argument you are just a fool. RAINFISHTROMBONE

Believable3 Unbelievable6

20 Nov 2011 12:58:33
i must say you are doing well , scraping these 1-o s , but you have turned into a bit of a boring side to watch , i suppose you will say its the points that count , but you must yourselfs find watching utd is hard work these days............lfc

Believable3 Unbelievable0

20 Nov 2011 12:37:46
Im an Arsenal fan and just wanted United fans opinions on their CM situation. I personally believe that your best formation is 442 with Rooney and Hernadez. I see fans on here are saying about signing Erikson, M'Vila and I know that u's have been Linked with Sniejder. But I think United should go in for Modric as he can play in a 442 and is good going in both directions. Plus thats means you will take Spurs' best player. Whats all United fans opinions on the situation?

Believable5 Unbelievable0

20 Nov 2011 11:57:05
I have my feelings why rafael hasnt been playing and its nothing to do with being injured!
Hes been pumping iron and turned up in the jungle under the disguise of " fatima " :)

CRAIGY!

Believable4 Unbelievable1

20 Nov 2011 11:31:19
Guys I just have to say dat carrick played really well yesterday.
We were very controlled and kept a lot of posession. Eds I posted about why we need carrick about 3 weeks ago.

Him and ando may start next week v Newcastle.

Believable2 Unbelievable4

20 Nov 2011 11:14:43
everyone here knew one way or other , that it will be another 1 0, so it was hardly a surprise. Good thing is poor defensive form of start of season is sorted thanks mainly to vidic. But great attacking form of start of season is gone. Everyone seems to be out of form especially the ingers, even park.
Otherwise lack of creativity from middle would have been less of a issue to some extent if wingers , nani, young were playing superbly. And rooney should start scoring goals again or he would keep on shooting from long range . i still thing second half of season would be as good as the start of season.
U.P.

Believable2 Unbelievable0

20 Nov 2011 10:59:38
Anyone else notice rio played left sided centre back yesterday. Usually Vidic plays next to evra but I thought it worked well yesterday. {Ed004's Note - Post further down the field discussing it}

Believable3 Unbelievable0

20 Nov 2011 10:17:35
Hey syd was nani world class or what yesterday? Again poor frustrating , it just ain't good enuf

Believable3 Unbelievable2

20 Nov 2011 10:13:01
Hi guys just read an article abouts uniteds 17 year old rob ie brady.it basically says that he is a really taented player and has performed really well this season in championship.

It also says that fergie said he has big hopes for him and wAnts to loan him out to premier league team for the rest of the season

Believable2 Unbelievable0

20 Nov 2011 09:54:56
Given the next couple of games that we have the first real opportunity to see Pogba and Morrison will be the Palace game in the LC.

We then have villa away and then basle away in the CL. If we beat Benfica and Basle do not win their game then we have won the group so this would be another game that these 2 would have to play in. We then have Wolves at home.

I would expect to see these 2 in at least 3 of these 4 games, but we will see. I know syd thinks saf is stalling on playing pogba until the contract is signed but someone has to give and i would prefer if it was saf this time and just played the boy.. this is all he wants... once he is getting games he will put pen to paper... otherwise he will be gone, and we think we missed a trick with rossi, and pique.... this would be a lot worse....especially if he goes across the city to the dark side.....

oxred..

Believable2 Unbelievable0

20 Nov 2011 09:32:37
I have been taking stick recently from no marks like United 92 who have just appeared on this site but I would like to ask one question what did i say that hasn't turned out to be true? I said we wouldn't buy a world class play maker in the summer as the Glazers have other uses for our money and I also said it was the standard of the other teams that was keeping us up there. Of course we will be linked with every player under the sun come each transfer window but the same old excuses of no value in the market will come out whilst we have still no spent all of the Ronaldo money. Ferguson has built a fabulous legacy at the club but because of the debt situation, the squad he eventually hands over will not be strong enough. There is no point me naming the players who are simply not good enough i see their names on this site every day but there is no one putting pressure on them. Before you mention Pogba and Ravel who me and Sydney have been championing for the last 2 years ask yourself why does the Boss not think they are ready to step up. Rooney said we didn't have the players to compete until they gave him a wage rise and then everything was rosy in the garden. Every single one of you knows our squad is simply not good enough and we are where we are inspite of not because of the Glazers and purely on the man management skills of Sir Alex. Let me take you back to the Derby when city had DeJong and Nasri sat on their bench, imagine our midfield with those two in it. Please please non of you lecture me about teams buying the league, Real Madrid have been doing it for the last 60 years and no one says anything about them. There is only one reason that we can't compete with City for the best players and that is some fat inbred Americans who have no interest in us apart from us being a franchise that they can make a lot of money out of whilst we pay off their debt. And people come on this site and have a go at me a the people from IMUSA because we actually care about this club. RAINFISHTROMBONE

Believable6 Unbelievable2

20 Nov 2011 08:01:35
What normally happens is that the TEAM adjusts according to the needs of their best player so that they can maximize the output of that player(messi,barca,RVP,etc).......but in our case the BEST PLAYER is adjusting for the entire team and thus we are losing out on Rooney's brilliance as a striker........

For the past few games it has been difficult to watch the entire 90 mins, I hope Rooney goes back to playing as a striker even if it means playing Anderson alongside Carrick or Fletcher.

MUMBAI_BOY

Believable1 Unbelievable0

20 Nov 2011 07:15:41
fed up of hearing pogba rumours any chance of getting this sorted in the next five weeks?

Believable0 Unbelievable0

20 Nov 2011 04:12:58
So its another clean sheet then and another 1-0 victory. No wonder we will have people coming on here crying about the midfield, but this they did a fine job imo. My analysis of certain players :-

1. Defense - With Vidic there, and Jones marauding down the right its looking really good.

2. Midfield - We do need a good midfielder, but from yesterday's game, it wasn't the midfield that was at fault. Carrick protected the defense really well and also distributed the ball to the strikers and wingers comfortably. The haters will still blame him for no reason whatsoever, although it wasn't really him that was the problem, rather Giggs who was non existent and should not be played anywhere near the center now.

3. Wingers - Nani, oh nani, what was he doing? The worst performance by a united winger for a long long time! He did absolutely nothing right. He needs a rest for a week if you ask me. On another note, its good to see Valencia, when he will get some match fitness with a few games under his belt, we should be much more consistent from the right hand side, with Jones overlapping.

4. Strikers - Hernandez is improving on his build up play, but still he needs to work on his first touch and using his left foot more often. Rooney created some really good chances, we just couldn't finish them off on the counter attack.

But a win is a win, another few 1-0 during christmas, i wouldn't care how they came, if we go into January with the same situation as it is or better, then i believe we can kick it up a gear. We haven't had our midfield, defense, and attack playing well at the same time, when that happens we will look much better.

A midfielder has to be bought in January though, no question about it. I have heard about certain noises coming from La Liga about United interest in a couple of players while Berba and Gibbo being shown the door would partially finance any deal nicely, keeping the greedy americans smiling over in Delaware.

REDFAITH

P.S. Good to see some people actually watching the match and seeing the work done by carrick and real problem being the wingers losing the ball.

Believable4 Unbelievable1

20 Nov 2011 02:41:36
This has been mentioned on other pages already but I feel it deserves a mention here aswell. Condolences go to Brad Jones and his family after the loss of Luca his little boy to leukaemia. Im sure all our thoughts are with him.

TK-Red

Believable7 Unbelievable0

20 Nov 2011 02:38:21
Oh well same old story after one of our games midfield talking point.

I (although not his biggest fan) thought Carrick played well. Did his defensive job well including a couple of lunging blocks and a couple of interceptions. The only problem again is that when under any sort of pressure his forward game goes to sh*t. A fair few times he had a player on him and he tried to pop a pass off forward without looking up and it went straight to the opposition.

Now that can be seen as a failing from the other CM but if he is to be as good as we need him he really needs to look up and decide his pass from that, not play a pass into where he thinks someone should be.

As an almost 30 year old he should know this by now.

Any way on to the game.

We played as Syd said in first gear. We defended well enough to allow us to do so but as another poster said we shouldn't be resting on the fact we have a 1-0 lead especially against Swansea. We should have played them off the park and used that early adantage to pin them back.

We got the points, fair enough but the performance again possed a few questions. Nani? was he playing? I only noted his 2 shocking corners at the end. Giggsy, how did he get MOM? Park, is no more than a busy body when playing CM. Effective for a covering wide man but thats it. De Gea played really well for what he had to do. His decisions on crosses was spot on. And best of all! Fergie decides to pull Evra, and he wasn't even playing as bad as he has been recently haha.

Onward and upward from here till Jan then get at least 1 CM in to help us.

And Mick, Ando has proved countless times he is average at best. His attacking game should be on a par with Rivaldo, Ronaldinho and what have we got? A fat version of the predator. Not good enough.

Jono

Believable2 Unbelievable0

20 Nov 2011 00:11:48
Ok, I know people have talked about this before but who would ye rather get?

1-Eden Hazard
2-Christian Eriksen
3-Shinji Kagawa
4-Yann M'Vila
5-Javi Martinez
6-Ganso

And this is if we can only get one. Who would ye prefer and who would ye think would make a bigger impact? What do you think Ed?

Believable0 Unbelievable2

20 Nov 2011 00:22:16
I think there might be a slight over reaction here tonight.

After 2 weeks off we and internationals we have travelled to a difficult away game against an unknown opposition and come away with the points.

Yes we can play better but our success is built on wining when we play poor.

We can all see the team is in balanced st the moment and we need to improve the left and add maybe two centre mids but you can't sign someone in Nov and we are winning with what we have.

Personally I think if Pogba and Morrison were ready (physically & mentally) they would be in the squad but they are not.

I'd like to see Rodwell and modric come in but lets see who's in come Feb and maybe we will all be happy?

Also I think Britton looked good today and impressed by Brendon Rodgers, talented manager.

Ajp

Believable3 Unbelievable1