Manchester United Banter Archive March 25 2014

25 Mar 2014 23:01:37
Hi first post, been a fan for over thirty five years. Really worried what gutless performance, no pace, basic skills none existent, really hurt that city just strolled it, hart didn't even get a sweat up just a bit of catching practice, can anyone see whAt Moyes sees in training just so out of his depth, this is going to take years to get the heart back, is was that which set us apart . Gutted!!

Totally clueless, no idea what system to play against most sides.Camera panned on Moyes late into the game and he's just sitting there like a half dead pigeon.Why the hell is he not jumping up and down on the touch line trying to gee up his team?
He sticks Clevery into a midfield in a game of this importance, Fellani has turned out to be a waste of skin, and DM tells us that he has plans and ideas for the future, well here is a plan David take yourself and your brilliant back room staff for a good walk and don't come back before you finish destroying this magnificent club.
The thought of him getting 100 mil to spend in the summer scares the hell out of me, god only knows what he will buy, and even if he did manage to secure a few decent footballers he will f*** them up too.
One final rant, his post match comments we never turned up or we just didn't play, christ you would swear he was managing a schoolboy team not Manchester United!

Couldn't agree more. DM is totally out of his depth. At one moment the cameras actually showed Moyes consulting with Chris Woods - a Goalkeeper coach no less - the man is cluess. And to play Cleverly was just laughable. If Cleverly is the best we can offer in a Derby against the league favourites than god help us. Citys' midfield must have been bricking it when they saw his name on the team sheet!

25 Mar 2014 22:18:42
Gaz Nev said it right. utd have to have a re-think about the direction there going. there's an identity crisis.
I could take the crap results and not challenging for things this season so long as we could see that the players were getting to grips with a new direction formation, tactics, playing style etc. But I haven't got a clue about any of those things from one game to the next. Can somebody please enligjten me? What formation does he want us to play, what style of play is he going for? because I sure as hell can't tell.

25 Mar 2014 23:08:50
Ive been saying the same thing for months.
You can recognise all Jose M teams by their style of play.
All wenger teams, all pep teams, all rodgers teams, even Martinez (same style as wigan allbeit with better players), all cruyff teams, all trapatoni teams all jack charlton teams. Whether you like the style or not. It is obvious that those coaches are able to stamp their style of play onto their teams. its clear for the players they know their positions their jobs and they carry them out or they are kicked out.
But 9 months in we don't know moyes style, preferred formation, ethos, or plan and for me that is the most damning fact of his tenure. we have more questions than answers every week. Its not too early to see it. even with the wrong players top coaches can influence the style of play and it should be clear what that style is.
But I like you and like millions of others we can't see it. It should be obvious by now. The only thing that is obvious is that the players don't understand the instruction or don't believe in it. so is that the players fault or the coach;s? For me the answer to that question is that its the coach's fault.

25 Mar 2014 21:59:23
So many poor performances tonight. The Sumer must surely see the end of rio evra cleverly and possibly Rafael along with giggs and vidic.

We were truly awful. Headless chickens. No one seemed to know what their position was. The game just passed fellaini by. He is so slow and has no hunger to track players.

But the biggest thing of all was moyes expression. He looked like he knew he didn't have long left. I for one would not be surprised if he was let go tomorrow.

Why include Giggs? There are plenty that if would ship out ahead of a 40 year old Giggs.

And good riddance to him, another record broken, started with the wrong team, mata on the wing again!
We do not match up to the top teams a little bit like Everton used to.

25 Mar 2014 21:40:03
Another game against a big team and, yet again, we are simply brushed aside.

The key difference between the two sides is that City play as a unit: they know each other's game, their teammates' movement, positioning and strengths. They know all this because they are playing in a stable system with the same players week after week. There is some level of squad rotation of course, and some variations of formation and strategy, but overall there is a core way that City play in the vast majority of games.

In contrast the United team is rarely the same two games in a row. Not just in personnel but in formation, tactics and strategy too. Last weekend we saw some signs that Rooney, Mata and Kagawa were developing some awareness of each others' game. So what does Moyes do? He decides to drop Kagawa, and push Mata to the right wing to accommodate a three man midfield that has never played a single game together. And, naturally, this three man midfield looked confused and incoherent, and we were on the back foot from the get go. Even after City scored, they were still dictating the game.

So why did Moyes pick a team that have never played together in such an important game? To counter City's strengths, of course.

It's the same story in every big game because Moyes is allowing the opposition to dictate our tactics. He's not picking the best players, or allowing the players to develop a better understanding of each others' game because he is too concerned with our opponents' players. Most importantly, I fail to see any core way of playing in this United team: there is no consistency, coherency or overarching strategy.

People rightly said that Moyes deserved some credit for his selections in the last few games. But the man also needs to be taken to task for his gross ineptitude against any decent side. 3 - 0 defeats against our two biggest rivals in the space of 10 days simply is not acceptable. As far as I am concerned Moyes could spend £200m during the summer and he still won't be able to challenge for title. He doesn't have the bottle or the confidence to focus on winning matches rather than simply trying not to lose them.

Does any United fan genuinely believe that he is good enough to win leagues and champions leagues? I know that a number of you think he deserves time, but do you honestly have faith in his ability or is it just hope?

LOL @ Moyes winning Champions Leagues and Premier Leagues.

If i'm honest. just hope!

Danny, as you know I was one of the "give him time" brigade. I was fully behind hm for several months, so can't really be accused of knee jerk reaction etc, but Moyes has had more than enough time now to show some improvement. But, bar a couple of half decent performances, nothing has changed. If anything, we look further away from the top teams than we did before Xmas.
I genuinely feel for Moyes. He is a decent and honest bloke, and a good manager. Unfortunately it is now quite clear that the United job is too big for him. He looks absolutely lots.
There is not much to be gained by getting rid of him now, but I do think we must part company with him in the summer. We need to stop the rot, or we could find ourselves in serious trouble. This has only been one very bad season, but we now look way behind the top teams. I am not panicking quite yet, but I am getting seriously concerned about where United are going. Just spending a load of money doesn't guarantee anything. Mata and Fellaini has already cost us £64m, and haven't had a huge impact so far. Another £150m could easily be spent, but there is no certainty that any new players will be success.
These are tough times for Manchester United.

As you know, I didn't need to be converted, I was against his appointment from day one.
A dour man, brought dour management with him, playing dour football like he did at Everton, all coaching staff were defensive players (I'm excluding Giggs who is in disagreement with Moyes most of the time).
Tactically, the team has gone backwards. Confidence wise, the team look unrecognisable from the one that won the league. Style wise, no one on here can come and tell us what style we're trying to achieve, because no one knows.
When most teams are playing high tempo, we go out and spend £27.5m on fellaini. What was that all about?
The only thing I disagree with Betty on, is why keep him till the summer then sack him? Why not part company now and let a caretaker manager take over for the rest of season, while we go out and get ourselves someone who knows what he's doing.

Nomidfeld

Been saying this since the uninspiring man got the job. No way of playing and no clear vision and constantly serving up crap boring slow football, like he's still at Everton. There's no sign of change because that's all he knows. We have taken a chance on him because he'll toe the party line and say the right things Fergie and the Glaziers want him to say but the fact remains he's won nothing and looks a million miles from changing that. We've have had no investment from the Glaziers for years (rvp apart) and without a top class manager or investment we will continue to see the same rubbish week after week. I notice Paul Scholes was man enough to say what he felt tonight and tell us (what we all know) he's backing Chelsea because of the special one. Maybe he needs to speak to Fergie and Bobby Charlton.

Nomid, yeah I take your point about getting rid now but I don't really think we would gain anything from it. If we sack DM now, an interim or caretaker manager will only have 8 league games, and it means the players having to adapt to a new manager now and then again in a few weeks. They have already shown that this squad struggles with change after playing under SAF for so long. And another point is, who could we get in for less than 2 months?
Aside from those 8 PL games there is of course the QF against Bayern. Realistically, I don't give us much hope but I don't see the benefit of sacking the manager the week before a ECL QF tie.
Just my opinion though, but one thng is now quite obvious. David Moyes is not the man to manage United if we want to continue winning trophies.

Chorltonred. You're right. Scholes told it as it is because he's an honest no bullsh.t bloke.
Problem is that the top people seem to have their heads firmly in the proverbial sand and are blindly backing moyes to succeed.
Moyes has never succeeded in the past so why will he suddenly turn into a winner with all that extra pressure that comes with the United job.
He was wrong choice and will always be the wrong choice.
It hurts me to read people saying that we will be happy with a good performance but that is how far our ambitions have sunk. We don't expect anything good anymore and when we keep being battered by our competitors, we seem to take it in our stride. Failure breeds failure.
Every day that he's allowed to manage is a leading the club backwards. If saf and Charlton and glazers can't see that, then we're in serious trouble.

25 Mar 2014 21:22:20
Based on tonight I am really worried about the bayern games. It could be really embarrassing. Ferdinand should have become a coach 2 seasons ago. I really don't need to comment re cleverly. So so so limited its unreal. Phil jones, no composure.

I hate losing to City and what makes it worse is I do not see things changing anytime soon.

25 Mar 2014 21:03:17
Time is most certainly up for Ferdinand. We badly need to get some CB's fit.

Time should be up for a lot of players.
Half of the team can't play a pass unless it's to a City player.

Seems to be up for Cleverley as well!

25 Mar 2014 20:38:13
If Fellaini is worth £27m someone is having a laugh. How much would Yaya Toure be worth if that valuation was correct?

Fellaini is not worth the cost of his replica afro! don't know how he got away with that Elbow.

25 Mar 2014 19:47:36
Hmmm could be a long night haha

25 Mar 2014 19:11:57
Out of context, but perhaps worth consideration and hopefully on the banter page even though it has only an oblique reference to today's match with older money going against newer.

Since the premier league started 5 teams have won it. In the previous 21 years there were 7 different champions, and in the 21 years prior to that, 11. Football is mirroring the world in general with the wealth being centered in fewer and fewer hands.

Reports would have it that United are prepared to spend up to 200m this summer, and in so doing try to ensure they remain with the European elite, where the correlation between money and success is more evident that ever.

25 Mar 2014 21:48:28
its alright saying utd could spend all that money
you have not got the right manager to spend it he needs the sack

And that's the worry. He spent £64m and they've been a waste of money. Give him another £200m? Are you having a laugh?

I think Mata will turn out a good buy, with a change of manager.

25 Mar 2014 18:35:43
I'm really looking forward to the match tonight, its funny considering that after the Liverpool I was dreading the derby. But that is the great thing about football, a good performance and suddenly the hope starts to return.

And that's the key thing with football, hope. Without it and the dark clouds decend and suddenly all is not right with the world.

All we need is hope, hope that the club is moving in the right direction. And that can come with a goid result or a good performance.

If we play to our strengths and we push City close tonight I will be happy with that. But if we panic and go defensive and lose badly then it will show that Moyes isn't learning and my hope for next season will take another knock.

As for the Champions league I personally think we have got the best draw possible. There were no easy teams left to play, but by playing the best team left in the competition we are in a no lose situation. With no one seriously expecting us to win then there is no pressure, plus if we win then the confidence gained could carry us on into next season.

Lets hope these sprouts of improvement continue tonight.

Lol Shappy, sprouts of improvement? The mind boggles

25 Mar 2014 17:26:43
so whos goal do u think was better rooney or beckham?

Rooney's IMO, albeit closer than Beckham's, his was a volley and didn't have as much time on the ball.

Beckham.

Rooneys was probably more difficult because it was on the volley. But Beckhams was further out and such perfect technique and placement. Because he was the first to do it, it has become such an iconic goals. Ever since that goal, players at all levels love to try to "do a Beckham". So, for those reasons my vote goes to Golden Balls.

Rooney all the way. Simply because of less time to react and difficult to execute.

Beckham, he was in his own half and it went in perfectly without bouncing

25 Mar 2014 17:08:47
The only player that I am scared off in the city side is Yaya Toure. If we will control him results will be good. I am very bad with predictions this season so I am not going to say anything about scoreline. Just want us to put up a good show and win it.

Aguero IMO is the best striker in the world. I am glad he's injured tonight.

For me we need to flood midfield, don't give Yaya room and use what pace we have. My bet would be Welbeck running in from our left because they push their fullbacks up, if he can get to the centre backs even Kompany is not blessed with high pace. Midfield centrally is the vital area. Funny but I fancy Rooney to score as he often goes on scoring bursts.

Sabre Tooth Suarez is a better striker than Aguero in my opinion, though there is not much in it. They are both top top players.

Aguero is one of the best player, but I was referring the team that is playing this evening

Sorry, that was a little off topic from the OP. Didn't mean to hijack the thread.

Well looks like we are going with a midfield three. Interesting to see how Ferdinand and jones do.

I thought Vidic was available and only banned for one game but maybe I am wrong.

Red Man .'often'??

Puzzled

Often enough to be one of our all time top scorers. He tends to score in batches and you must be hoping I am right.

25 Mar 2014 14:19:32
Has anyone else noticed De Gea's accuracy from his long passes down the pitch?

In the past two games it was massively apparent and allowed us to break with speed and relieve pressure.

Hopefully tonight it helps ease pressure on our defence as City will be looking to attack.

De Gea has always been accurate in his distribution, maybe his long passing prowess is down to him being Spanish. With quicker, better wingers our counter attacking would be a hell lot better

Mate, I was down in the corner with my wee lad for the Villa home game last season, and got a close up view of his kicking accuracy.

Not once did the coach have to move to collect a kick out. Everyone was hit with pinpoint accuracy. Brilliant to watch.

He may have the best kicking accuracy I've ever seen from a goalkeeper. He isn't meant to be too shabby playing outfield as well. He beat Anderson in that corner challenge haha!

25 Mar 2014 10:37:47
Guardian reporting that united have two deals already set for the summer. One of these tentative agreements seems to be for carvalho. But who could the other one be? Players like Kroos, gundogan and cavani seem likely to wait til the summer to decide. I'm still not convinced in our interest in llalana sp. I think it could be shaw. As much as he may want a Chelsea deal, I think Jose will stick with azpilequeta and city are set at lb. Just my guess. Eds and others, any guesses or ideas?

I'd say that one is Carvalho and perhaps Garay as the other. I don't think that we will get Shaw which is a shame so I think Coentrao will come in, Kroos won't decide yet. We may go for Gundogan. I can't see us getting Cavani.

Moyes sounded pretty confident about recruitment at the press conference yesterday too. Interesting.

Carvalho and Mangala perhaps?

RF, those two would add much needed sturdiness and power to the midfield. Undoubtedly Mangala will push up into midfield like Rio used to do.

@Sydney!

From what I have watched Carvalho is not someone who can play in a two man midfield. He has to be the deepest of a 3 man midfield.

Perhaps Moyes will sign someone like Kroos too and a midfield three of Carvalho Kroos and Mata could play?

Add a front three of RVP, Griezman/Reus/Di Maria, Rooney and that is a top side.

The full backs to provide width like they always have in Moyes' sides. I think that would be a very solid and dominant lineup.

Redfaith

I think that's Moyes plan.
A world class 3 man midfield and Rooney and Mata behind RVP.

I would say shaw is one of them if true.

With all the rave about Mangala, we've forgotten all about Kurt Zouma. Equally as gifted imo, and could command a lower price than Mangala.

{Ed004's Note - already agreed a move to Chelsea}

25 Mar 2014 03:04:43
Moyes: "Hopefully we will be coming out of our bad period quickly. Plans are afoot to try and make a real good go of it next season."

Sounds like a manager who has got a couple of signings in the bag already?

What else is he supposed to say, "we've been useless this year and we'll carry on being useless"!
He has written the season off and is trying to keep interest by saying next year we will compete.
Only time will tell.

Nomidfield

Agree, jam tomorrow

Buying players is only part of the answer, they need to be organised using the best tactics for appropriate games, motivated and believe in what they are doing. Time indeed will tell

25 Mar 2014 03:04:43
Moyes: "Hopefully we will be coming out of our bad period quickly. Plans are afoot to try and make a real good go of it next season."

Sounds like a manager who has got a couple of signings in the bag already?