Manchester United Banter Archive May 30 2015

 

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30 May 2015 23:35:00
There has been a fair amount of discussion on Benzema here over the last week or so.

To those that may not get chance to watch him very often: don't Judge him on his performances with France. There is a love-hate relationship there and he has never looked near his best.

When he was at Lyon we were very close to signing him. I believe Sir Alex had tabs on him from a very young age.

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30 May 2015 21:23:01
Regarding Ferdinand. I just came across a comment saying that "the rolls Royce is now in the garage", that's about right.

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30 May 2015 20:47:21
Thanks to that performance Benteke's off my list now. Was of the opinion of giving him a chance, taking my words back and dumping them into the liverpool!

Comes down to Berahino, Clyne, Schneiderlin, Otamendi and Gundogan. Gundogan wasn't too good today but he has the qualities. Hummels I really am not sure. He may not suit the EPL.

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31 May 2015 00:59:00
Benteke was on your list and now off after 1 game?? Decent striker but not what United need in my opinion.

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31 May 2015 01:31:05
32m clause for someone putting this level of a performance in a final just ticked him off my list. Rather wouldn't mind giving Wilson time to settle in while we search for a RVN.

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31 May 2015 02:45:30
RVN would be lucky to net five goals a year in our current set up.

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31 May 2015 04:37:50
You may be right JMB. It also points to the fact Falcao didn't fail all on his own. He made great movements, intelligent runs, but either got bullied off the ball or didn't receive any pass at all. We really need a star player so that teams just focus on him and make room for others. Need a dictator in the midfield too. How I wish our problems are solved for good this summer!

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31 May 2015 07:26:47
Problem is Redsoul Falcao was asked to play with his back to goal which is not his game. If we are going to play that way someone like Benteke wouldn't be a bad option.

I would prefer two troublesome wingers with a striker who can drift wide and ghost into postions when defenders are drawn wide by the wingers such as Muller type player.

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31 May 2015 09:08:32
Haha this sums a lot of people up, benteke played yesterday how he has played most of the season but the game was on terrestrial tv so he's now off the list. People watch match of the day and think a player is fanrastic but don't realise they are just the highlights.

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30 May 2015 20:16:47
I'd like to echo those sentiments about Rio. He's gone quietly and announced it FA Cup day and probably not many people will notice. Someone below is correct, he is a legend along with Stam. For a few years he was thee best cb in the world. Quick, composed, great on the ball and reassuringly manchester united through and through. For me he is up there with Baresi, Maldini, Thuram, Blanc and Stam as one of the best I've seen in my lifetime.

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30 May 2015 20:04:47
Anyone watching the German cup final? Not been impressed with gundogan so far. The game is flying by him.
Hummels has looked ok.

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30 May 2015 20:29:05
Hummels has been really poor in the second half. Losing the ball and not even retreating fast. This type of play will be severely punished in England. I would take otamendi over hummels any day. He's a bull. A proper defender.

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30 May 2015 20:37:53
His distribution has been very good. What a game though!

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{Ed004's Note - His distribution has been class. However, he has looked poor at the back though I'm not sure if that's because the defence has had no protection at all from the outfield players. He hasn't been at fault for any of the goals though}

30 May 2015 21:01:11
Defensively I'd say he's been average but I'd have him in our line up ahead of of jones smalling etc any day.
What a player de brunye looks though. Chelsea will be kicking themselves over him soon if they aren't already.
Really really disappointed with gundogan.

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30 May 2015 22:39:08
He's a great distributor of the ball, very composed and a class act. He's slow as a tug boat and not that great at tackling/blocking/intercepting though, maybe not the saviour he's been portrayed.

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31 May 2015 00:40:21
I have been saying that gundogan and hummels are not good enough. I'll be really disappointed if we buy either of them.

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31 May 2015 06:07:09
Well i have said that i am not sure on either either and by the sounds of it tat has been confirmed.

I think Verrati is absolute class and watched him in their cup final and for being 22 he has some footballing brain on him to go with his ability. Absolute star in the making if not already.

I guess there will be more of us in the ottamendi camp, he is not as good a passer as Hummels but a defensively a beast and the type of guy you want siting instructions at the back 4(in spanish lol).

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31 May 2015 21:02:37
Disappointed with Gundogan, Hummels and Laporte( all alleged Utd targets) Hummels will get roasted in the prem with his lack of pace. On the other hand, despite his age, Dani Alvez would be a great signing, although I cannot see Barcelona letting him leave.

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{Ed004's Note - I would be over the moon if any of those first 3 are signed}

30 May 2015 19:53:50
So with the talk below of Sanchez and Ramsey being good at United, I was thinking of the players from Chelsea, Arsenal and City who I believe would genuinely make a huge difference in our team next season and that I would take ahead of other players across Europe. Here's my thoughts:
Arsenal - Sanchez & Ramsey
Chelsea - Matic & Hazard
City - Aguero & Zabeletta
I honestly cannot think of any others that I would take. No GK's. Not Cahill, Mertesaker, Kosicielny, Mangala. Not Kompany as I think perhaps he may of peaked. I know we need CB's but I think the one's we have been linked with are better then those named. Silva is good but I'm happy with Mata, not fussed on Costa. No LB's. What are everyones thoughts?

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30 May 2015 20:03:53
I would honestly say that from arsenal I would have Sanchez, Walcott, Ramsey and cazorla. Chelsea I would have matic, hazard, terry and azpiliqueta. City I would have aguero and toure

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{Ed025's Note - how about cahill or koscielny brad?

30 May 2015 21:18:05
Sorry I thought I'd put koscielny down, he's a really good defender and would be an improvement on what we have! Not sure about Cahill though, I'm not really a fan

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{Ed025's Note - its all about opinions in the end brad mate...well toss john stones in there instead mate.. :)

30 May 2015 21:29:21
How nobody has mentioned David Silva amazes me.

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{Ed025's Note - another great player MPez..

30 May 2015 21:36:21
You'd be mental not to take Azpi if you could IMO :-P

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31 May 2015 01:02:52
Azpilicueta, Ivanovic, Koscielny, Sanchez, Hazard, Costa, Aguero, Silva, Zouma, Matic, Fabregas, could all walk into our team at the moment.

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31 May 2015 01:43:04
Ramsey would walk into our team. Shame we missed out on him turning into a real class act.

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31 May 2015 06:10:49
Silva is class. Azpilicueta goes unnoticed by most but a brilliant all round player. Sanchez, ramsey, Aguero(best striker in the league and possibly world football with the exception of Mr. Messi and hazard are no brainers.

We missed the boat on Matic as he is brilliant at what he does. Mentioned last year we should bid for Walcot but not many agreed. Very good player and scares the hell out of most defenders.

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30 May 2015 19:18:33
Jon moss the ref looks older than me and can't keep up with play. Is this really the best we can do for FA cup final ref?

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31 May 2015 06:11:36
Was going to say something along those lines, how on earth does the FA pick him to referee a Wembley cup final is beyond me.

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30 May 2015 19:10:56
Just in case anyone thought Benteke will make a good addition, the last 90 mins has shown how crap he is. Hopefully going to Liverpool.

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30 May 2015 19:22:03
Next Andy Carroll.

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30 May 2015 19:33:30
I disagree, benteke, vlaar and Delph would make us real champions league contenders!

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30 May 2015 20:09:34
I was thinking the same regarding Benteke. I know it's one game but he turns like the Ark Royal.

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31 May 2015 00:50:37
An over rated player,another emile Heskey

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30 May 2015 18:06:27
Of all the strikers being named these days, what do you guys think about Mitrovic? I haven't seen him play so don't know much about him. Would like your opinions about him.

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30 May 2015 19:12:42
Never seen him play either tbh but apparently United have recent interest in him.

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30 May 2015 22:43:30
If the Rooney interview that LVG asked him to go looking for the ball less are true and he wants a forward to play the way his striker did at Bayern this guy is perfect. He has an air of Shearer about him. He can score from nothing, is quality in the air, and bullies defenders. He also has a grat first touch and has pretty good dribbling, although he uses movement and strength more.

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30 May 2015 18:00:28
watching cleverly in Fa cup final and he is truly pants and goes out of his way to make himself unavailable for a pass lol

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30 May 2015 18:08:41
"Goes out of his way to make himself unavailable" that is the best description of cleverly.

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30 May 2015 18:10:04
How good is Ramsey though, I would love us to buy him?

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30 May 2015 18:20:39
Ramsey would be some addition ok

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30 May 2015 18:48:04
I feel worse about signing Di Maria whenever I see Sanchez playing.

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{Ed025's Note - hes quality sailor..

30 May 2015 19:04:14
TC23 demanding the ball, only to play a pointless wall pass of 2 yards! He does it all the time, I'd actually rather have a wall in midfield.

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{Ed025's Note - worst player in premier league history..

30 May 2015 19:30:05
Sanchez is built for this league and at half the price of ADM is a quality bit of work by the gunners.

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31 May 2015 06:13:32
Sanchez has been brilliant and his work rate is fabulous. We definitely bought the wrong guy.

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30 May 2015 16:42:22
Haven't posted in a while but have to pay tribute to a wonderful player who was a truly great servant for our club!!

All the best in retirement Rio & thanks for the memories

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30 May 2015 16:34:35
I hope Falcao doesn't secure a move to the premier league, I wanted so badly for him to succeed and completely understand why the club didn't take the option on him however I'd hate for us to regret that.

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30 May 2015 14:13:33
Good luck in your retirement Rio. You were a great servant during a golden era for the club.
£30m back.in 2002.just think how much we would have to pay now for him!

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30 May 2015 14:12:08
Anyone wondering about players/managers in general the European pages has a good bit of info, not necaserrily United but intersting write up about Klopp and if I've read it right looks like gundagon could be headed for Bayern.

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30 May 2015 15:19:20
As much as I want gundogan if it means him going to bayern and schweinsteiger coming to us I'll be very happy.

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30 May 2015 16:00:10
I don't agree discountdave. schweinsteiger is 30 and gundogan is 24. schweinsteiger we will have to be looking to replace him after 18months.

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30 May 2015 17:26:52
I do want gundogan but I feel the role schweinsteiger plays is much more needed than the role gundogan plays.

Ideally I would want both

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30 May 2015 18:12:26
Scweinsteiger for the holding role vidal as box to box. We can dream.

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{Ed004's Note - Schweinsteiger for the holding role and Gundogan for the box to box role.}

30 May 2015 18:34:50
004 I'd love that but if we could only have the one it would have to be schweinsteiger offers defensive support which we've needed for a long time

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30 May 2015 13:26:11
Hi Guys

I'd like to pay tribute to Rio Ferdinand who has announced his retirement.
What a class player and a class person.I hope he enjoys his retirement after what has been a terrible time for him recently.
All the very best to a top man.

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30 May 2015 13:43:44
I echo that Bazza. Always gave his all. I think he could make a decent pundit someday.

Good luck luck to him.

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30 May 2015 14:30:44
I would class him as a Utd legend best defender along with Stam we have had imo. He had a real calming influence on the team and is EXACTLY the type of defender we could have done with right now. He wasnt perfect but his pace and positioning always got him out of trouble he happily left Leeds to come to us captained the side to the 08 and has to go down as a Utd great.

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30 May 2015 16:07:28
I love Rio, every other supporter seemed not to like him because he was utd through and through, class player class bloke, good luck to him.

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30 May 2015 11:30:23
I am currently watching the Spurs v Sydney FC game and I still cannot believe Spurs have flown out here to tour less than one week after finishing up in the PL. They are playing a full strength squad as well including Harry Kane and co who have an U21 championship coming up which I find strange.

But the main reason for my post is that the host in the studio has said the club has sold over 70,000 of their new shirts at pop up merchandising stalls outside the ground. Now I have never really been one to buy into 'this player and that player will pay for themselves through shirt sales etc', but if 70,000 shirts were sold at £45 each that would equate to just over £3.1million from ONE GAME. This doesn't even take into account the cash received for their share of ticket sales etc.

Now no disrespect to Spurs but we, Manchester United, have a much more broad global appeal than them and I am absolutely flabbergasted at the figures of funds generated from these off season world tours. I wonder how much revenue United would generate from these excursions overseas. It is unbelievable how much cash is in our game at the moment.

Ps. Christian Eriksen is sublime.

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{Ed001's Note - they would not have received anything like that amount from the shirt sales. Spurs itself might not have even received a single penny for it.}

30 May 2015 11:42:16
Ed001 in what way do major clubs earn from these worldwide tours then if not through merchandise? I am assuming they are paid for their participation?

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{Ed001's Note - yes, they get paid to go out there.}

30 May 2015 12:24:52
Also Ed are they obligated to play full strength squads?

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30 May 2015 12:24:52
Also Ed are they obligated to play full strength squads?

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{Ed001's Note - depends on the agreement, usually they are under an obligation to field X amount of first team players for usually 45 minutes. Sometimes it can be a limited number, sometimes it will be a contract to play a full strength side.}

30 May 2015 13:00:02
Thanks mate. Appreciated.

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30 May 2015 08:26:01
There are a host of names being suggested to fix the midfield issue with many going to cost us a hefty fee. I think people are missing the answer that is staring us in the face. We need a box to box midfielder who can score a few goals, someone with energy and passion. We already have that, but we have loaned him to Villa and told him he won't be getting a new contract. Tom Cleverly is the man, ridiculed at United, he lost all form and confidence. Look at him now, he's just what we need.

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30 May 2015 08:55:19
Spot on AJH, lvg has no idea what he is doing letting him go, if he's allowed to flourish he could be the next zidane.

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30 May 2015 09:48:02
Looks as though it's a nice day for fishing AJH. However I think getting Cleverley back would mean they might as well give us next season's Premier League now.

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30 May 2015 10:17:19
Chesney Sneijder and him could form a proper understanding. As fresh would say, they'd be our Xavi and Iniesta.

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30 May 2015 10:28:46
Still disappointed the TC23 brand didn't make it global.

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30 May 2015 10:29:23
Sheesh, I must try harder

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30 May 2015 10:54:57
The real shame was that all we needed to do was rotate him 90 degrees and at least 50% of his passes would have been forward.

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30 May 2015 12:38:50
Lolll Danny u made me chuckle!

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30 May 2015 17:34:36
LOL Danny, I almost pee'd in my TC23 boxers!

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30 May 2015 17:47:23
Ajh. If you are watching the fa cup final, that's exactly why we are selling the Brand. He's just picked up a booking for the thickest most idiotic trip, no brains at all.

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31 May 2015 02:36:02
Sorry, but 70000 shirts sales would mean just about every one there last night bought a shirt, there were 6 of us that went and none of us bought one and i so a lot of old spuds tops.

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30 May 2015 08:13:16
I wonder whether Dimaria is really that much good player as we all think.In Madrid players like Ronaldo, Bale, Kroos etc attract defenders making life comfortable for Dimaria, allowing him to do what he do best and also in Spain he may have got free kicks in most situations where he lost the ball and go down easily in PL. Plus in laliga generally defensive side of football is not as good as their attack.

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30 May 2015 10:56:23
When did he play with Kroos?

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30 May 2015 11:55:22
Sorry, My mistake. I thought Bale and Kroos joined Real in the same season.Real had enough players to take pressure off dimaria even before Kroos joined them.

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30 May 2015 07:38:44
Can I ask everyone who they would prefer,
Nainggolan or Gundogan personally I'd prefer Nainggolan, he's box to box, scores a few and I think he has the highest tackle win rate in Serie A, he's very like Vidal. Gundogan Is great but was a part of a team that really struggled this year, and I'd worry he'd be another Kagawa.
Opinions please

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30 May 2015 09:03:14
Kagawa was a kagawa because he was played out of position most of the time and just couldn't really hack the physicality of the league. Gundogan is a completely different player and I think he would thrive in the prem if he stays fit

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30 May 2015 14:10:16
Gundogan is a fantastic passer. I think we would create quite a few more chances with him in the side. Often this year many of you have rightly complained that our midfield failed to spot the runs of strikers or wingers in behind the defense. Gundogan is the type of player who sees those runs early before the defense regains its shape. He has vision, a quick mind, and is two footed in his passing range.

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30 May 2015 16:54:17
Naingolan any day. We need some presence in the team and he will give us that.
Gundogan is overrated and will flop.

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{Ed004's Note - Will be interesting to see how Gundogan gets on tonight in the cup final. Will be keeping a keen eye on him and hummels then later on Alves and Laporte. Good day for football fans}

30 May 2015 21:05:00
Unfortunately most of his through balls will need to be backwards as Wayne tries to huff and puff his way forward from collecting his bearings from deep.

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30 May 2015 06:21:59
I read in a previous post that by signing Otamendi, Gaitan etc Dimaria may feel at home, we can see him back to his best. Currently Rojo is there, Spanish speakers like Mata, Degea, Herrera, Valencia are around. Although Zabaleta, Aguero play for City they are in and around Manchester. How much more does he wants?.I don't think Dimaria actually wanted to join United. In Dimaria's case I think Woodward took a decision similar to Real Madrid's President by signing a player even if the Manager actually don't need that player, just to show United's financial might.

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{Ed025's Note - thats a very expensive way to show financial clout MM, for me he thought the likes of bayern, barca, psg, chelsea or city would all be fighting for him, but none of them did, a luxury player like him will find it very hard to shine in a team that have struggled of late like united. i think it was a panic buy and to be honest his body language tells me that hes not happy about being at united. my advoice would be to sell him even at a loss..

30 May 2015 01:09:13
Wow it completely sickens me to see Blatter with his big thumbs up celebrations on yet another turn as head of the top table. I have honestly never seen a guy as corrupt as this clown. He is eating our game from the inside out . He reminds me of "diamond" Joe quimby from the Simpson's a sound of a briefcase opening would see him toasting with a martini made from orphan tears to wash down his unicorn aperitif.bastard.

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{Ed007's Note - What's Blatter done to harm Man Utd? AF done more damage to Utd with his racehorse carry on than Blatter could ever do, it's not as if FIFA being corrupt is anything new so why the outrage now?
If you think the FA and PL aren't just as corrupt as FIFA and UEFA you're kidding yourself on, it's just the corruption in the EPL favours the big clubs including UTD you refuse to see it.
How many players have Utd tapped up over the years?}

30 May 2015 02:57:42
I have to disagree Bond. Have the FA's and PL's dodgy practices lead to the deaths of an estimated 1200 migrant workers? If the decision to give the World Cup to a country like Qatar, whose population is 80% migrant workers, with such extreme temperatures and a possibly huge disruption to the domestic calendar, never has and never shall make an atom of sense. Are these migrant workers going to benefit from the World Cup? Yeah, only in the paltry sums of money they shall make, should they not perish before the first whistle is blown.

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{Ed007's Note - Aren't the numbers being bandied about are actually deaths in ALL construction works going on in Qatar since they were awarded the WC? An example is that over 200 migrant Indian workers died in Qatar in 2010 - before the World Cup announcement. If so it paints a very different picture and either way surely that's down to Qatar and not FIFA? In the United States in 2012, 4,383 workers died through accidents at work and according to data from the National Institute for Occupational Safety and Health and Bureau of Labor Statistics, an average of 15 workers die from traumatic injuries each day in the USA with an additional 200 workers are hospitalised.
If England were awarded the WC would there be an outrage over the British Establishments ongoing paedophile cover-up, people working for zero hour contracts, people dying over benefit sanctions etc, would all those things become FIFA's problems as well, or would they all be FIFA's fault?}

30 May 2015 03:28:22
But the USA has a population of 320 million contrasted to Qatar's 2 million. I'd bet that the wife of an employee crushed under a forklift at Home Depot is compensated in a way that a widow in Kathmandu could only dream of. And if these industrial accidents are the fault of the Qatari's, then why was such a country given the World Cup? Because Fifa are at best incompetent, at worst criminally corrupt.
As for the Paedophile cover-up, zero hour contracts. isn't that clutching at straws? There isn't a county on earth without it's problems. But these additional deaths in Qatar are the result of the wrong country getting the tournament. Look at how many deaths occurred in the run up to the London Olympics in comparison.

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{Ed007's Note - Gibberish.}

30 May 2015 07:33:25
Totally agree Roman. Whether it is 1 or 1200 does not make a difference. One death is one too many. Abdominal for anyone to belittle that is crass.
Qatar is corrupt as is fifa and it is about time things are brought out in the open and people are brought to account. Just braise they've got away with it for years it doesn't ake it right!

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30 May 2015 05:10:44
Hot topic, but got to say Ed, the awarding of this tournament to Qatar makes no sense whatsoever. It's like awarding the winter Olympics to Ruanda.

Drawing an analogy between industrial deaths in a private economy made up of domestic workers, and foreign migrant workers lured by the oil wealth of some abusive despotic oligarch, even taking into account the statistical inaccuracy, is preposterous.

We all know what it's about. Money. And on the corruption note, what relevance is it that the FA or the PL is corrupt? Do 2 wrongs make a right?

Anyway I'd be prepared to bet that sooner or later the unrest sweeping the region will swallow them up too, and, whether or not FIFA reverse their decision, the tournament will in fact never take place.

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{Ed001's Note - Ed007 has no idea of the flagrant human rights abuses going on, with the backing of the law there, that is the big difference between Qatar and the others he was trying to compare it with. Yes the USA and UK have major problems, but that is people acting outside the law, whereas the issues in Qatar are within the law.}

30 May 2015 10:22:31
Just my two-penneth on this.

The migrant workers are choosing to work in Qatar, as far as I know nobody is putting a gun to their heads forcing them to move over there? Take a quick look at pay per capita in Qatar ($100,000 USD - more than twice the UK ), I wonder why so many migrants are moving there to do manual labour? We have Eastern Europeans doing a lot of our menial work now, why would Qatari's be any different - winkle pickers anyone?!

If they are telling their bosses they are skilled when they really aren't to get a good wage then that is their own fault. Sure the laws need tightening regarding health & safety, but what exactly do you think these guys would be doing in their home countries and what are the human rights like? How many Europeans have died over there working, hardly any because there is no need to flee your home country typically.

It amazes me that because the world cup is on it is the reason for these 1200 deaths, ludicrous. If they were building skyscrapers it would be the same or any other major industrial project. I'd love to know the numbers in China of deaths building their useless structures or India, it's all covered up - I spent a lot of time round SE Asia and you see the most dodgy Health & Safety around almost every corner.

It's just in vogue to blame FIFA for everything. Qatar has issues no doubt. But to say FIFA is to blame for these deaths it just fantasy in my eyes, you may as well blame their parents for giving birth to them - they were going to be doing something dangerous anyway.

I hate FIFA, but the world has 10 times more serious issues than a bunch of fat old men doing dirty back handers - why do you think African & Asian members voted for Blatter again, reality check most of the world is corrupt and would get away with what Qatar does if they could, we even do in our own little way - just order something from a fast food place in London!

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{Ed001's Note - sorry Beast but you haven't a clue. These people come from absolute poverty and are just desperate for any job. The wages you are talking about does not include those of the slave labour majority that are putting the stadiums together. This is just idiotic nonsense from someone who is ignorant of the reality out here in the Middle East. You may think you know about it, but clearly you have no idea of the conditions of the workers at the bottom end of things. For instance, even here in Dubai, which treats workers much better than Qatar, my gf, who is Filipina, has a workplace that does not provide them with drinking water, they have to bring that in. Their contracts are completely ignored, leading to most of their wages being deducted, so that they are left with virtually nothing to live on, even though they are supposedly paid very well. Then there is the refusal to allow her to take her holidays, because they are afraid she will use her time off to find another job out here. Added to that she usually works over 14 hours a day 6 days a week and then you tell me that there is no issue with human rights? You are so deluded it disgusts me.}

30 May 2015 11:06:18
Well said ed001, people need to realise that the migrants being exploited in Qatar are being actively recruited because of their poverty and then subjected to appalling conditions under the full protection of the law. There is a massive problem with employment laws in the rich Gulf states, and the people who are affected by these laws are generally those with limited options and no power to challenge them. The costs of these laws are being laid bare in Qatar's mounting death toll, and anyone who doesn't think FIFA was unaware of this pior to accepting the bid is seriously naive. The truth is that FIFA couldn't care less about it once they got their big brown envelopes.

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30 May 2015 11:22:09
Ed - You are taking what I have said out of context. I may not be as informed about the Middle East as you are but I am pretty confident that I can speak with some authority about poverty around Asia as a collective! I am certainly not deluded and have more than a clue.

I appreciate these workers are not paid well at all and empathise with your girlfriends and other migrants situations, but they are moving to Qatar because they are better paid than what they are at home (or think they will be) - they are taking a chance which is nowhere near as worth what they think it will be. You don't see them moving to Somalia or Bangladesh though which is my point about wealth in Qatar.

I appreciate this is more personal to you than it is to me, so it isn't easy putting a counter point in writing and I am trying to tread carefully.

I haven't said that Qatar doesn't have major issues, but look at the Philippines as an example. I spent a long time in downtown Manilla (not the modern city part which was just like any European city), it was one of the worst cities I have seen in terms of poverty and H&S issues. Live electric wires hanging next to pools of disgusting water in the middle of residential areas with wild dogs roaming riddled with disease, hookers of all ages doing God knows what metres away from police (of a sort), old people with children sitting in pools of water under rusted dangerous makeshift shelter with cars driving inches past them - all next to a Starbucks or similar.

Of course I know that these workers are not treated well, the death rate wouldn't be high if they were, (these deaths are the tip of the iceberg which I appreciate). But the thing is they are not treated well at home either in most cases. The world is a dark place in 95% of it, I just find it amazing that there is this sudden uproar when these abuses go on all over the place. Go around Burma or Cambodia and you see 8 year olds working 12+ hours days 7 days a week, in absolute squalor. Do you think they even know what a holiday is? I don't want to start getting personal and comparing war stories as there are people 10 times more experienced than me and this obviously isn't the best place for us to do this.

I empathise with the poverty and the disgusting environment all of these people are subjected to, however blaming FIFA for Qatar Human Rights abuse is like blaming the Earthquakes on why Nepal is in a mess! Governments all over the place are corrupt, famine, poverty and disease is everywhere, the people leaving to work in Qatar are doing precisely what the people in North Africa are doing, how many of those do you think will be looked after once all the media attention dies down - coming to a busking/begging site near all of us as soon as they have hitched themselves under a lorry and risked death for what?

Qatar unfortunately isn't the exception here, that is my point - Imagine being a construction worker in Syria right now! People are choosing to go there and they are clearly not that informed when they go, but nevertheless it is their choice - they may have limited options but I'm confident they haven't left paradise for hell!

Anyway I think I'll stick to talking about Utd as it's less controversial (just about) - I hope I haven't caused too much offense as that isn't my intention at all.

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{Ed001's Note - you are still missing the point, FIFA could easily pick and choose who is eligible to hold the World Cup and the conditions that workers labour under is easily within their power to include in the bidding process. So they are to blame for the deaths of labourers working on those stadiums, as they knew full well what would happen but only cared about the brown envelopes they would receive.

As for your point about them being better paid, most of the time they are promised better pay, but as I was pointing out, it is generally taken off them in deductions for things that are supposed to be free in their contract. For instance, my gf has to share an apartment with a few other workers, they are supposed to get air con, water, gas and leccy paid for by the company, it is in their contract. Instead the company deducts money from their contract for water, gas and electricity but refuses to pay for the air con so they have to pay for it. Then there is the flights promised in their contracts, which are meant to be paid for at the company's expense, but instead every worker is deducted a sum each month towards the price of air fares. So you say they are choosing to get better pay, and I would agree if they were actually getting what they were promised. My gf has qualifications coming out of her ears, there is no way she can just go to the UK or any EU country because she could never get a visa. So her choice is to stay in the Philippines, or to stay here. I am sure if she had known that contracts were just ignored out here that she would probably have never come out here, as she was in a decent job before leaving.

If people do what you suggest, and just carry on turning a blind eye and not accepting the blame, then the human rights abuses will just carry on. Yes there are human rights abuses in every country, but, as I keep saying, the difference is that in most countries they are not enshrined within law and protected in most of them. Bringing a World Cup to Qatar is tantamount to backing the regime and the laws it exists under. FIFA should be better than that.}

30 May 2015 11:46:54
Wow I never realised Qatar was like that at all, my friend works as a quantity surveyor over there and he loves it, but I suppose he's working at near on the top of the ladder. Had my eyes opened big time after reading this

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30 May 2015 11:52:51
Ed 001 - I am not defending FIFA at all we are on the same page. It is obvious they would hold the World Cup in Hell if the Devil gave the biggest backhander.

The situation your girlfriend is in is similar to a lot of people leaving home for greener pastures (when coming from a poor country to a backward one). The brothels of the world are full mostly of women who thought they were leaving home to be a maid or similar. It is disgusting that there is no justice and peoples lives are wasted or abused in this way. It was the same with the Chinese & Irish in the US with railways, this type of abuse has gone on for hundreds of years - the tactics evolve but the problems remain it always will whilst money and power remain linked.

I hope that the people who have mislead your GF get their comeuppance - people toying with lives to make money is abhorrent.

I am pleased that the farce of FIFA is being shown for what it is, but it is just the tip of things and FIFA is just one of thousands of facilitators.

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{Ed001's Note - I agree they are, but letting them off because they are one of many is something that should never be done. FIFA is not meant to be about profit, it is meant to run the sport for the good of the game, so it is worse, if anything, when they stoop to these levels because of greed.}

30 May 2015 12:03:52
They should all be punished. But when you have people like Blair as former peace envoys to the Middle East, it's like expecting the prisoners to lock themselves up at night. Who can we trust at the top really to sort this out?

The US are only involved now because they lost the bids and want revenge in my view.

I just hope we start improving the origin countries of the migrants so richer countries/regimes find it harder to attract and abuse people, then they will have no choice but to amend their methods. Long road ahead mate.

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{Ed001's Note - hopefully it will happen though.}

30 May 2015 07:16:20
feisty today, Bond.

It almost seems like your trying to defend one of the most corrupt organisations in the world. Surely not?

Jam missing from one's doughnut? :)

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{Ed007's Note - Not at all, there's no question that FIFA are corrupted and I can't help but wonder if there would be this furore if England were hosting an upcoming WC. What I'm asking is why FIFA are being blamed for pre-existing problems in Qatar? I'm sure that the fact Qatar is a Muslim country is nothing to do with it.
The figures being thrown about as 'fact' are a total number of deaths in the ENTIRE construction field since Qatar were awarded the WC. So there there were 150 work related deaths in the UK in 2012, the year of the Olympics, so why weren't the Olympics blamed for them? I can go back and look up how many died per year since London was awarded the Olympics if you want.
But taking the 150 deaths in 2012 as an average, London were awarded the Olympics in 2005, so that's 7 x 150 gives us 1050 deaths caused by the Olympics, going with how they have worked out the Qatar figures that are being used.
Until someone can come up with precise figures of deaths at actual WC venue constructions then there's no real argument apart from a general human rights one, and again, that's nothing to do with FIFA.
Have a read at this.

30 May 2015 14:32:19
The poverty in many parts of the world is awful, and the manifestations of it difficult to witness, but surely it is less sordid than the outright exploitation and quasi enslavement of the poor by a wealthy elite, whose own -often idle -population is basically bribed off with massive social services.

The Qataris are desperate to put on a good face, building museums and lauding their culture, like for example pearl diving, which was based on, guess what, slavery.

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30 May 2015 14:50:15
Just read this for China - "The National Bureau of Statistics reported in February that there were a total 68,061 deaths due to work accidents in 2014 or 5,671 deaths on average each month."

The same China that had the Olympics in 2008 and is about to host the World Athletic Championships this year.

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30 May 2015 16:08:54
Its terrible what's going on in Qatar.

But ask yourselves why is a corrupt organisation like fifa allowed to thrive in the first place? Its because we live in a corrupt world which breeds such organisations for the benefit of the fat cats.

If people want to get passionate about corruption then they should look at the power structures that control us all e.g. Our corrupt political system, the central banking system, how mass media operates etc.

Its fashionable right now to slag off fifa but Imo they are just a symptom of the corrupt capitalist world we all live in. I'm all up for sorting fifa out and the issues in Qatar bit there is also a far bigger picture which needs to be sorted.

I hope people don't take too much offence to ed007 and beasts posts here as I think they are trying to highlight this bigger picture which many people seem happy to ignore so long as they can have a rant at the likes of fifa, once in a while.

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{Ed007's Note - I don't see what anyone could possibly take any offence at HB, and if they did then it's them that has the problem. People are far too precious these days and being offended seems to be the new black.}

30 May 2015 00:28:44
Reading comments down about our down in form from last season and i beg to comment thus: fergie is to blame for it all. 5 seasons or so to his retirement was when our form begin to deteriorate. We needed fresh but key players in our team and he did nothing and we couldn't make an impact in Europe. While other teams were busy making changes in their team spending to get real players we relied on players like Babe, Anderson, Cleverly, Oshea, Brown, Evans and the likes who could not be constant even in mid table teams. He couldn't plan for the future of the team. As if that was not enough, he brought in a manager that no real players will be attracted to be under him bcos he was a mediocre. Now we are a bit of a doubt to world class stars not bcos we cannot pay their wages but bcos they are not sure we are a force anymore. players now prefer to go to Chelsea, man. city, PSG, Beryan and now Arsenal (Ozil) rather than come to us. Not to talk of Real and Barca who have established themselves as d best teams in d world. We keep deceiving ourselves about being a great club, yes we 'were' but will soon be in d history books if nothing is done seriously.Now we know that our history is not just enof to attract what we need but we need to splash the cash also to get them here so we can remind d world how great we were. It hurts me to see teams like Chelsea, Barca, Bayern getting their players on d cheap while we waste money yet getting what they are not interested. What so we think?

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30 May 2015 00:56:44
I think you're possibly the most negative person on the page

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30 May 2015 08:59:38
I think we are d biggest club in d country, if you think we aren't because we haven't won the league for 2 years then you are incorrect.

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29 May 2015 23:22:47
Ed004 I have seen you post that Smalling could be a potential candidate for skipper in the next season or so. Do you really think he has what it takes?

No offence to the lad but if I go through a list of our captains from Robbo to Rooney I can't help but think he doesn't merit the role at all.

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{Ed004's Note - I'm not sure he is captain material personally but pretty sure I saw comments from LvG saying he has really stood up recently. He seems to like his captains being the same nationality as the team (Rooney, Carrick, smalling all had arm band at some stage). I don't think there is any other better cb at the club either so he should be one of our main players.}

30 May 2015 01:01:14
I think we have to start making the younger players we have start to believe in the ethos of our club so Smalling for the captaincy is a good call for me, it's all very good spending trillions on new players but I still believe our most potent era came from young British players who bought into the belief structure that our club has always strived on . It's incredibly important to have the "spine" that everyone talks about and I look at smalling ,Shaw, Wilson and maybe Pearson as our spine for years to come and feel a little more positive than I would if we consistently spent £100+mil per year on fancy names.

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30 May 2015 10:31:45
Fair play ED. I do agree Smalling has come on well this year but he is still for me an average squad player at the moment and captaincy is bit premature.

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