Manchester United Banter Archive January 07 2015

 

Use our rumours form to send us manchester united transfer rumours.


07 Jan 2015 22:58:52
Just been reading on Sly Spurts transfer centre that we may be in for Tim Krul (Newcastle) if RM follow up on reported interest in DeGea.
Please no, big Dave is the only reason we sit in 3rd place at the moment, IMO it would pretty much end our season if he went.

Believable3 Unbelievable1

I think if DDG does go, we'll be after Lloris.

Agree4 Disagree0

The 1st sentence I wrote was probably made up from a "tonto el culo" but the 2nd is very serious :-)

Agree0 Disagree0

I agree with Babolroto, If we are to lose DDG and i sincerely hope we don't then the only real option for me is Hugo Lloris. I don't think we can afford to bring in someone else from outside england and for them to have have to acclimatise to the premier league.

Agree3 Disagree0

I think DDG will sign a new contract. If not i hope we skin RM for 60 mill minimum and give them some of their own medicine.

Agree0 Disagree0

07 Jan 2015 22:52:58
Im surprised we have let kean sign for burnley, i think he's a better bet than Mcnair and blackett

Believable2 Unbelievable6

He looks a decent player but imo would only ever be a squad player with us. He isn't any better than the likes of O'Shea, Brown, Shawcross or Evans.

Personally i see us signing at least two CB in the next couple of windows so that would have meant that he was behind the new two players plus Evans, Smalling, Jones, Rojo and Blind.

Not a lot of point keeping an 8th choice CB, and that's not even including Blackett and McNair who LvG clearly rates as well. Obviously some of those mentioned will leave but still. We need to clear the deck for the new signings and any money we can bring in will help.

Agree1 Disagree0

07 Jan 2015 21:39:47
Would definitely take Godin and/or the young Jimenez both look solid tonight. Seen more of Godin but Jimenez does look like he's going to be quality. Doubt either would cost an arm and a leg either!

Believable1 Unbelievable0

08 Jan 2015 06:15:15
I am not sure you would get either for much less than £25-30m.

Totally agree that either would be a great addition to our defence.

Agree1 Disagree0

07 Jan 2015 19:05:31
Victor Valdes rejected being No.1 at Liverpool to be No.2 at Utd.

Already a Man Utd legend!

Believable25 Unbelievable0

07 Jan 2015 17:52:43
The LVG debate is getting tiresome, we are only halfway through his 1st season. Let's go back a year when Martinez was a revelation at Everton and Rodgers was doing really well at Liverpool. Go on the Scousers' sites now and they are openly calling for a change of Manager. I know everyone wants instant success but it was never going to happen. Yes some of them layers could be playing better, yes LVg has made a few odd decisions, and yes 3 at the back needs to be binned. But we are 3rd, unbeaten in 11 and have huge injuries. The club feels different and we have a Manager big enough for the job. Debating if he is the right man or not so early when we are in this position is pointless.

Believable13 Unbelievable0

Ajh
So what your saying is in 12 month its going to be even worse ?

Like it or not debates like this keep the site ticking over in quite times

Agree1 Disagree8

07 Jan 2015 19:37:45
I agree Tony, I'm all for people having an opinion and sharing it regardless of what that is, but I do feel there are a few (no one in particular) that simply post for a reaction.

I don't understand how people think we should be flying either, yes we spent big but we had to, lvg is trying to rebuild a confidence shot team and because we ain't winning 5-0 every game the claim is he is failing. Even thou we are winning games more regularly. What are people expecting over night success?

Agree9 Disagree1

07 Jan 2015 20:20:31
The LvG debate is this years Rooney debate!

Agree3 Disagree0

Gav - So do you think Rooney is world class or sunday league level? :P

Deeps.

Agree0 Disagree0

07 Jan 2015 22:34:03
Definitely Sunday league :)

Agree0 Disagree0

Jred

I could have used Allardyce as another opposite example, my point is that 5 months is not along time in football. I'm not yet convinced by LVG and I don't think he's the Messiah that some do, but it's too soon to start talking of replacing him. Despite his continual formation changes and odd substitutions we need to see a settled team that can start to gel.

Agree1 Disagree0

Just had a look back at recent posts and it seems most of us have a similar opinion but express it with either a glass half full or half empty approach.

We all feel generally more positive but are not yet convinced by what we have seen. LVG has a strong c.v., is a big character and has changed the mood of the club. However, the football, has not been great, tactics have on occasions been odd, and a number of players need to pull their finger out.

Agree2 Disagree0

07 Jan 2015 23:23:42
Good post Tony, The younger fans from many clubs are fixated by instant success and the notions of signing players that they know little or nothing about in terms of their character professionalism or ability to relocate and remain happy and grounded.
LVG has done a good job so far IMO, as a club we were in a very precarious position and he has begun to right so much of what was going wrong
Sure he makes some odd decisions but Sir Alex has made many of those . Jose once made 3 substitutions after 20 mins wenger makes plenty of mad choices.
LVG does court controversy and attention a bit like Jose some of the odd stuff comes off and some doesn't guys like these will always brush aside the bad choices they make and move forward.

Agree2 Disagree1

Ajh
I think there is only beast who wants to sack him .
for me there is a middle ground, he has done ok but things take time .
its great we are 3rd for example but then again arsenal and co have been pretty poor and we have more or less the same points as last year.
There is a feel good factor around the place and excitement again, is that lvg or the biggest spend in world football and looking forward to watching players like falcao and di maria.

You can't blame lvg for every mistake but it would be wrong to credit him with every plus point imo.
At the moment i think its ok so far not a disaster but not to great either.
i would actually be more confidant if we had less points but where playing better

Agree1 Disagree0

07 Jan 2015 16:10:04
Does anyone find our supposed signing of Valdes strange? I am sure he will not be cheap.

He is a good shot stopper and was always good coming off his line but also suffers on high balls played into the box from set pieces and corner and generally stays on his line.

I am not sure what the signing achieves since we have lingard as a back up and he is okay unless he wants to leave and fed up with sitting on the bench.

Believable1 Unbelievable0

{Ed002's Note - Lindegaard and Amos have been told they are not wanted and to have their representatives find a new club.}

07 Jan 2015 16:58:27
Think Lingard might be a bit small to be playing in net mate.

Agree3 Disagree1

Why should it be strange?

If you see Lindegaard live he isn't good enough as a number two at our level. The move for Valdes makes total sense as long as it doesn't mean the loss of DeGea.

Agree4 Disagree0

Not strange but would not be happy DDG left in the near future

Agree2 Disagree0

I couldn't agree more that it's strange I can't imagine he'll be on a small wage and will he be happy being a no2. DDG should be playing every game he can while he's in the form he is. I might be in the minority but I always thought he was over rated.

Agree2 Disagree0

Redman

They will pound him with crosses into the box and he is not the type that is good at coming and collecting or punching crosses. Lindegaard might not be great but the Valdes signing is neither here or there when you loo t his age.

He is similar to deg when he first came, not great at dealing with crosses but a good shot stopper.

Agree0 Disagree0

United signed a longer term prospect in May called Vanja Milinkovic, a 6'8" Serbian in May, so my guess is that Valdez is a stop gap back up until the young 17 year old comes of age. It all makes perfect sense whether de Gea stays or leaves. Amos and Lindegard have clearly been assessed as being not good enough for us, and they need to leave so they can play regularly somewhere else. Meanwhile we get a better array of experience and prospects.

I don't believe it's to put pressure on DDG who is clearly going to be our #1 - assuming he stays. If Milinkovic fulfills his potential then United would have the option of making a boat load of money by cashing on de Gea.

Agree3 Disagree0

I think it could just be to gain fitness and move on at the end of the season he won't be happy been number 2 and won't ever push out de gea

Agree0 Disagree0

Next season when I hope we have Champions League football and DDG signs back on we would have two quality keepers for the extra games. LvG could trust his number two as a League, European and World champion.

The point for me would be if DDG, who I don't think has missed a game this season unlike most of the rest of the team, had a injury and was missing this Sunday who would you want in goal? Lindegaard is a step down, a big one but the experience and quality of Valdes would be positive. His distribution, like DDG is good, he will need time to settle but next season, like many big clubs we will need two in every position. Valdes is a good move for me and something I felt needed addressing.

Agree1 Disagree0

07 Jan 2015 15:06:08
Hi Guys

It would appear that Victor Valdes is on his way to The Reds I sincerely hope its as Number 2 to De Gea and not to replace him.I really rate De Gea and in time he could be the best keeper we have ever had.I always thought Peter Schmeical would be our best ever now I think David has a real chance to be better than The Great Dane.

Believable3 Unbelievable0

We have a ridiculous amount of players with contracts running out in Summer 2016. Obviously DDG is one of those, but a lot of fringe players also including our underperforming CB's, so I imagine the 2015 window will be the busiest incoming and outgoing we have seen. I think Valdes will be understudy to DDG, but I am worried how close it is contract wise as well.

Agree1 Disagree2

I think De Gea will sign on, a lot of money will be thrown at him. Valdes will be firmly number 2. It's for the good of Lindegaard and Amos that they both move on.

Agree1 Disagree0

07 Jan 2015 14:31:04
Deeps - "Anyone who thinks LVG must be sacked is a troll", well I am not a troll. I think he should be sacked as he has not lived up to anything he has said so far. The league table flatters us and it looks like we have had zero investment performance wise. Granted there will be reasons for all of it, but there are reasons behind why Moyes got the sack and every other manager gets the bullett. Due to Moyes we are giving this guy far more wiggle room which is softening peoples perspective in my view.

Ultimately I am not happy with him or his methods, therefore I would prefer it if he is moved on. However I totally understand why most people think otherwise, I wouldn't be arrogant enough to call them trolls for having a different opinion to myself. Mine may be extreme, but it doesn't mean I am not right with my view.

I suppose I just take a firmer more decisive line, most people have a lot wider grey area than me and are prepared to allow the rope to lengthen.

A ruthless supporter of the team, certainly not a troll Deeps!

---------------------------------------------------

I apologize for the remark Beast mate, I wasn't talking about you in particular. In fact your posts are atleast reasoned and even if I do not agree with most of it, I will never call you a troll.

Just wished you would see some light, I personally can't be miserable watching "my" club play. Yes, there are issues, but above them there is United.

Deeps.

Believable3 Unbelievable1

07 Jan 2015 15:03:24
Be careful what you wish for! - there are not a lot of available top class managers out there. If we got rid of Van Gaal we could be stuck struggling to find one. Ed002 has said a few times that the rebuilding process will last at least another 1-2 transfer windows. I am sure you can give him that long.

Agree3 Disagree0

Cheers Deeps.

I always want us to do well, its just unfortunate I don't have the faith others do in the current manager. I am open to being and indeed want to be converted, but I haven't seen enough evidence yet that he is the best person to do it.

Above all else comes the club and I hope the performances in the future enable me to be more positive in general and specifically about the manager.

I do like the fact he has acknowledged the performances haven't been good enough so he will hopefully change things as a result.

Lets hope it starts this weekend.

Agree1 Disagree5

TOT66 - It is possible to make two bad appointments in a row it happens a lot, but I do agree there isn't a great amount of options out there. The major problem for me is what we are building towards, I don't see what that is yet, we lack any identity and by the time it comes to fruition (if it does) he will be retiring apparently. Or even potentially leaving this summer if one of the Ed's (I think 002) has been advised correctly.

Even if you think he isn't doing too bad, there is only one LVG, how can anybody (especially Giggs) continue his master plan, surely it is foolish to invest so much in a finite resource?

Agree0 Disagree5

07 Jan 2015 15:30:29
I get that but even if he is replaced or retires I am confident that he will leave a better squad than he originally inherited. I have not heard anything to suggest that he will not see out the duration of his contract but am intrigued to find out if there is truth behind that - if true that could suggest that a replacement may already be lined up. Just hope it isn't Giggs becoming manager can only damage his reputation as a club legend.

Agree1 Disagree0

Beast you must not be watching the same united if we lack identity, every post you make is anti LVG,

yet the majority of us have took our red tinted glasses off an actually see our team for what it is,

a team that last year lacked investment(we only bought fellani), confidence, ambition, positivity and if anything we lacked IDENTITY last year.

now LVG has come in and changed the way we look the way we act and perform on the pitch, how u can constantly say that lvg should be sacked is a joke and quite frank plain stupid.

would you have been happy with moyes still in charge? a manager who has 0 stature in europe no experience managing a team at the top, i guarantee the likes of falcao and di maria would not have signed for moyes, we would not be 3rd in the table and everyone would be on here slating the owners and ed woodward yet again.

and it is clear for everyone to see what type of football were are trying to play.

you need to understand we are not good enough to be challenging for the title our squad is not as good as chelseas and citys, but give lvg credit he has transformed our team compared to last year.

we are in transistion, and its going to take more than 150 million to make us title winners again.

so stop the slating and constant moaning i think lvg has more sense than you on how to run a football team, 3rd in the league apparently playing bad and not once has a full fit squad he can't be doing that bad of a job if we have the 4th best defence in the league with apparently a poor defence.

Agree3 Disagree1

07 Jan 2015 16:27:59
Beast you may be slightly missing the point with LvG. He is a proven top class manager, who works on building a possession based attack geared team that allows young players to get a chance to succeed.

In essence everything we want our club to be, but he has proven that his methods take time to sink in. I always throughout it would take longer for him to succeed at our club with implementing his methods due to the style of play and the level of technical ability that our fringe players have.

His style is much more suited to the european style rather than the rough and ready nature of the Premier league. But you can see signs of him adapting and appreciating the difference. The most obvious one being him bringing Fellaini back into the side to bring more physicality to the team. That is certainly a new facet to LvG's game plans.

But the main point with LvG is not just his tame at a club but the state he leaves it in afterwards. He placed a lot of the foundations that have allowed Barca and Bayern to dominate football for the last 10 years. Unlike Mourinho who tends to leave a club in disarray when he leaves or more often than not is removed.

A lot of people wanted Pep when Sir Alex stepped aside but imo he would have struggled more than LvG has. That is due to the heavy reliance his style has on technical ability and footballing acumen. Our players would have been a million miles away from what Pep would have needed. He needs intelligent technical players to make his tactics work.

Now Pep would imo be the perfect person to take over after LvG, he is a manager in the same mould and would have been at Bayern for four years by the time LvG's contract is up and would likely be keen on a new challenge. He has also shown that he works well at building on foundations set down by LvG.

The knowledge and ability LvG is installing in our squad and at youth level will benefit us for the next 10 years if managed correctly. That is why i am prepared to allow LvG the time needed to implement his ideas, as i am looking at the bigger picture. Like a great chess player you always need to be two moves ahead.

Agree7 Disagree2

Mufc
I would have to disagree about di maria and falcao .
Im sure money had a lot to do with why they are both at the club.

But let me get this right you are having a go at beast for having a go at lvg while having a go at moyes yourself ?

Agree2 Disagree0

Shappy
What was your opinion when we signed moyes ?

Agree0 Disagree0

The team has a lot of identity now and are all playing for the manager which is more than I can say for Moyes. Last year, we had zero identity, zero chance, zero commitment, zero tactics, zero spirit. If you can't see that, then god help us!
Re the investment, I'm sure you know that all of falcao, di maria, Shaw, rojo, blind and hererra have all been injured for long periods of this season. In addition, our whole back line has been injured for long periods. And to compound it all, carrick was missing for the first 8 weeks. Surely, even you can see that all these injuries will take their toll on ANY team??!!
Or are we just expecting lvg to create miracles and get us to top spot after 4 months and 46 injuries!! You have to have some perspective on this and actually realise that we have had a shocking injury problem. This happens sometimes, and to be 3rd with a new manager and coaching staff, 6 new players in the team, lots of youngsters being introduced, and all the injuries, is an excellent achievement.

Agree3 Disagree2

07 Jan 2015 16:41:03
Do we have to have the same discussion over and over again each day beast mate, we get it buddy.

Everyone is entitled to an opinion but it seems everyday u are finding ways to start this topic over and over again! It kinda makes me miss the Rooney posts now.

Agree3 Disagree0

Shappy - Good points and I do understand the objective is there for possession, but where is the attack? My problem is that most people talk about progress, but we are not going to play 3-5-2, a 4-3-3 is completely different. Players will need to learn different roles, so how can we be progressing if we haven't played the formation he wants to play?

People are also saying the team spirit is better, which outfield players are doing better this season? Rooney was quality first half of last season, Young & Fellaini didn't play. The rest have gone backwards.

I may be overly critical in many peoples eyes, but I just don't see any progress as yet. All I have seen is an inspired DDG and boring, slow and uncreative football. It stands to reason that when he eventually switches to his preferred formation with preferred players that the canvass will be fresh again surely?

Yes we keep the ball, but so do Swansea. We have been relying on individual brilliance to win us games, that is something any manager could do.

I will save my praise for when I actually do see a plan taking place because at the minute it is firefighting. He has done well to have us in 3rd, but when you look deeper, no Europe, massive investment, players playing for contracts, weaker opposition it isn't a success so far.

I would also argue that Bayern and Barcelona would have risen to the top without LVG. Are Man City good now because of what Mancini left, or Chelsea because of what their numerous managers left? Every manager has their own ideas, as we saw with the Moyes period, the AVB period at Chelsea etc.

Agree1 Disagree2

Chris
To be fair deeps is the op.
Beast has just replied to other peoples post that where aimed at him

Agree1 Disagree0

Jred. i doubt we would have, the window showed that, all the players we had talks with and tried to sign and we failed. look at the fabregas scenrio, we tried to sign him had 3 bids rejected, they say the club didn't want to sell but ultimately fabregas said no,

but having a go at a manager who is making us better and its clear to see the direction he wants to go in compared to a manager who didn't make us anything other than an embarrassment, there was no sense of direction under moyes.

but moyes is history the argument is LVG. who else would be manager in you eyes that would be better than LVG?

Agree3 Disagree2

07 Jan 2015 17:15:09
Has LvG had more 'wiggle room' than Moyes as you put it?

Its a results business before anything else. Moyes was moved on because he couldn't achieve the results and left us 7th in the league, that's football. LvG to date has us 3rd in the league, with better results. What 'wiggle room' precisely does he need when our target is top 4?

I thought it was well known that LvG tends to get results but usually after a slow start?

Which makes me wonder why some people aren't willing to give him time to improve us further. Perhaps we should get someone else in then sack them after another 6 months if they haven't fully transformed us?

Beast keeps saying he would sack him - but you can't sack a manager without having a better replacement to take over. So who is that man, Beast? Who is better and available to come in and take over? Otherwise calling for his head is wreckless, in my view.

I admire the views of posters like Deeps and jred because, although they have a lower opinion of LvG than myself, they are still capable of giving balanced arguments and they realise that managers need time, especially when the transition is so great.

I can see both sides of the argument but seeing the 'sack him' comments, I'm sorry but I find it hard to take those seriously. I can see some negatives in LvG (even saf had those) I just see zero sense in talking about sacking, which then distracts from some of the valid points being made Imo.

Agree4 Disagree0

Mufc
There is a number of managers i would of went for before lvg but that's irrelevant, i think herrera is a top player but there are other players i would of bought first. That doesn't make him a bad player

So we failed to sign players last summer because of moyes ?
Again i disagree and i think this is another example of everything is moyes fault .

I didn't think moyes was the right man for the job and i'm not sure lvg is . For reasons i have covered before.

Imo moyes never done a great job at united and so far neither has lvg .

There are numerous reasons why both have struggled but to be honest i don't think the performance under either has been great.
Lvg has got us to 3rd on 37 points after 20 games played.
last year we had 37 points after 21 games. couldn't find how many after 20 but this shows that result wise there isn't much difference than year.
Also most would agree our performances haven't been great but lvg gets results but the above stat raises questions about that.

Since this time last year we have signed blind rojo mata etc etc and rvp has stayed fit .
Are we that much better of after 200 +mill spend.
this isn't a go at lvg or moyes

Ps
If i had to pick i would go for simone

Agree3 Disagree1

My opinion of Moyes when he signed was he wash't the right man but let's give him a shot. But through out the season it became very very clear that the job was way beyond his ability and he had created discord in the dressing room with his inability to manage the players. The players have to carry some of the blame, but we can't remove 30 players from the club. So it became a Moyes or the Players choice for the board and they made the only choice they could. I feel Sorry for Moyes and wish him the best of luck in his future career. But now we need to move on and stop bringing his time at the club up as it is now irrelevant.

Beast the skills and the ideas the players are learning will enable them to play in many different styles. That is the point of what LvG teaches. He wants players to be adaptable and thus his training and coaching of player is focused on that. He has switch the way he sets up because of the players and the ability of the players he has available to him.
352 was never his plan for the dutch national team and became a way of solving the problem of overcoming key injuries and a lack of ability in other areas and enable him to get results.
For the Dutch team at a world cup it is all about results, no one cares that their country got knocked out playing good football. And like wise this season for us is all about results. I think LvG has come to our club and seen a similar problem as to what he has just experienced as the Dutch manager and is doing what he knows works to get him through it. His aim this year was 3rd place, and we are in 3rd atm. He is being proven right. But trust me if he was still the dutch manager he wouldn't be playing 352 now. So we may have to suck it up this season while he trains and improves our players so they have more ability and a better understanding of football and wait until he can bring the players he wants in and the injuries clear up before we can start to see what LvG's long term plan is.

For atm he is just doing what is needed to get the results he needs to be able to continue to build.

As for who is playing better this season, well DDG, Rafael, Smalling, Young, Valencia, Carrick, Rooney, RvP, Mata and Fellaini are all playing better than they did last season.

Agree7 Disagree0

07 Jan 2015 17:30:55
I understand that jred bud, just getting very tedious now, was there a need to start a new thread and rehash the same views over and over?

Agree5 Disagree0

Shappy
The thing is when people questioned moyes you gave a similar passionate defence you know, everton play like dourtmund crack and look how that turned out.

to be honest there is a lot of hype around lvg that i don't really agree with he promotes himself very well.

Agree1 Disagree3

07 Jan 2015 18:19:28
Jred, I defended Moyes during his early days at the club and up until around Christmas as that was too early to tell for sure if he would fail or succeed. But from January onwards it became clearer and clearer that he had lost the dressing room, and from then on it was a case of when he would be fired not if.
We should back the manager until it becomes clear that he will never succeed at the club.
Thats not to say we can't question him but to call for his head when he hasn't done a bad job and in fact when you consider all the factors you could say he has done a decent job maybe even a good one is foolish to the extreme imo.

Agree5 Disagree2

I think sacking him is a bit harsh i think its a big job and it will take time .
I thought the same about moyes tho so what do i know .
Next month we might be top or we could be flying a plane over OT.

Agree0 Disagree0

Jred. You keep mentioning people hyping lvg up. Who is hyping him up? Who called him the Messiah?
We're all saying to give him time as he's only had 4 months of Pl football. Its a steep learning curve even for one as experienced as lvg.
But messiah he's not and a miracle man he's not. It will take time.

Agree0 Disagree0

08 Jan 2015 08:12:50
Nomid,

I have noticed a few people saying that 'I don't think he's the messiah like others are saying' but like you say I don't think I've seen one post calling him the messiah, and if I have they are less than the posts calling for him to be sacked. In general 90% of us have the same opinion but just go about explaining it in a different way.

Agree0 Disagree1

Nomid
Where have i called him the messiah ?
Have a look at some post from early in the season tho .

I think and i could be wrong you mean my " lot of hype statement "
But i think that's true, have a shappys post above which he must of got from the lvg handbook.

The whole it takes 3 month to adapt to his tactics .
It takes any squad time to adapt to a new manager but this is a good statement by an experienced manager to keep the pressure of while he settles in.
People would have you think his ideas are so different that as it is put above he needs to teach them to play.
Come on carrick rooney falcao and the rest are pros they have played under numerous managers, is lvg style of possesion football that radical.
The whole he leaves a club in great shape is debatable .
He was only at munich 2 year once he was sacked a new manager came in played a different style and they have been amazing .
And barcelona where doing all the right things before he got there .
Lvg was part of that but so was cruffy and many others.
Lvg got the sack when they where 3 points of relegation they have been amazing ever since .
So 2 clubs that done ok under lvg but went on to be amazing under different managers yet he gets the credit . that's good PR.
I think a mystic has grown up around lvg to be honest.

Truth is i think he is a decent manager who is doing a decent job but some of the BS and excuses get on my t1ts . But everyone to there own its a banter site about different views

Agree2 Disagree2

07 Jan 2015 12:29:42
Why is strootman a 30 mil player?
He moved to roma for 15 mil, played 25 games had 12 month out with a serious knee injury .

jred
-----------------------
Because United want him. I don't know much about him, but he's been linked so much that people are now convinced he's world class.

Believable2 Unbelievable0

He is player who I feel is starting to become 'forced' on the fans by the media. He said he thought Van Gaal was a great manager in an interview and now it's been reported everyday that he is our primary target at an inflated price. The media is power.

Agree2 Disagree1

{Ed002's Note - The media aren't forcing him on the fans. That is ridiculous.}

Ed what I am saying is with the media constantly linking him to the club our fans (some of which have never seen him play) all of a sudden believe we should bid X amount to buy him. If we don't buy him and say he wasn't even a prime target to begin with and we lose points due to poor midfield displays fans will be on the clubs back claiming we should have signed Strootman because the media has put it in their head that he is pretty much a United player.

Football is a fickle sport.

Agree1 Disagree1

{Ed002's Note - That is the modern day fans for you. Nothing to do with the media.}

07 Jan 2015 12:49:12
Why is anyone valued at what they are?

Why was Mata a 37m player? Why was Ronaldo a 80m player? Why was Bale a 86m player? Why was Fellaini a 27m player?

Because that is what a club is willing to pay for him. Why are houses in London more expensive than a similar house in Newcastle? Because that's the market. Football is no different than any other market place, supply and demand. If you have it and someone else wants it then you dictate the cost, if they want it enough they will pay what you ask.

Why is Strootman potentially a 30m player? Because someone is potentially prepared to pay 30m for him. Beyond that everything is speculation and opinion.

Agree5 Disagree0

I have said it time and time again Real Madrid in particular have killed our game with their 'buy players at whatever price' attitude. I for one would like to see salary caps, financial transfer restrictions etc forced upon every club under FIFA. FFP is not enough for me but we all have different opinions I suppose.

Agree0 Disagree0

If Barcelona or Bayern wanted him they would pay £20m to our £30m. It isn't just supply and demand, its about who the demander is more often than not and how poor their business acumen is.

If Bony was being signed by Liverpool he would be asking for £150k max, not £200k a week like he is for City.

We have made a rod for our own backs by paying way over the odds
, banging on about how much we have to spend and how much we need certain players. STUPID business acumen is at fault and more money than sense, Real, Chelsea, PSG and City paved the way and we are in hot pursuit, without a sugar daddy or sugar government/state.

Agree0 Disagree0

Strootmans a bit like tom huddlestone, lvg should maybe give hull a call

Agree2 Disagree3

07 Jan 2015 16:35:05
Strootman's a bit like Huddlestone in the same way as my car is a bit like Lewis Hamilton's F1 winning car.

Jred you have you opinion of Strootman and so does everyone else. It just so happens that a lot of people who understand the game and are involved in its day to day running think much more highly of Strootman than you do. that's not to say that your opinion of him is wrong, just that it is an opinion. Much like me and my opinion of Hummels.

Until the player signs and proves us either right or wrong then its all just speculation and opinions.

Agree4 Disagree0

Strontman is like tom huddlestone! I've heard it all now!!

Agree1 Disagree2

Shappy
You must have a nice car.
There was a real transfer fight over strootman when he left psv all the top teams wanted him.

Watch huddlestone at spurs and i'm telling you even with my limited understanding of tbe game they are very alike .

By the way huddlestone was highly rated .
Maybe even by some people who understand the game

Agree0 Disagree3

Shaps
Also did you not write a big long post the other day as to why we should sign strootman ?

Agree0 Disagree0

07 Jan 2015 17:31:54
I do have a nice car but my C class mercedes is still no match for Lewis Hamiltons F1 car. lol.

Huddlestone was highly rated by certain aspects of the media but then again so is every english player who is give a chance at a young age.

And yes Huddlestone and Strootman play similar roles for their clubs and play in the same position but there is a gulf in ability.

And no i didn't write a post the other day saying we should sign Strootman, i wrote one saying he and Hummels WOULDN'T be the players i would target. I think both are very good players but imo both have faults in their games which i feel could hinder them in their ability to play in England.

The difference is that LvG knows Strootman personally so i feel that if LvG wants him it is less of a risk. As he knows what he is getting and obvious has a plan for it. Where as he will know a lot less about Hummels and therefore its a bigger risk, and one i don't think is needed or worth taking.

Agree2 Disagree0

What we think isn't important in the whole grand scheme of things. If the club think he's good enough, then they will move for him. Fitness and cost will play a part of course, but he would join and personal terms wouldn't be an issue. He was of interest before LvG and still is now LvG is the manager so you cannot rule him out.

Personally I think there's better out there, but the club are a better judge than myself or anyone on here. They would have had their best people scouting him for years extensively, not just at matches, but in training too. They would have done many personal checks and taken a few manager's opinions on him. It wouldn't be a knee-jerk signing for sure.

He's nowhere near as bad as Jred is making out, but he is also nowhere near as good as some others are making out. He does lack pace, but he does have great positional sense much like Carrick. Also to be fair to Shappy, he has been flying the Strootman flag since he was at PSV. Well before he was even linked to MU. We will see what happens I guess.

Agree0 Disagree0

Shaps
My mistake that should of been wouldn't.

Shaps/syd
Huddlestone was a good player good range of passing got stuck in clever football brain but lacked paced.
And that's my assesment not what i read in the paper .
But injuries started to take there toll and he stalled.
so i'm I underating stroots or you tom ?

That said neither would be or would of been high on my wish list decent players but better out there.

Agree0 Disagree0

07 Jan 2015 18:25:52
Jred like i said i wouldn't sign him as i'm not sure he is everything we need right now. I have rated him for a long time like Syd has said and a couple of years ago i would have snapped him up. But his recent injury along with the large price tag would put me off atm, even though i still rate him.

But like Syd said whether i would or wouldn't sign him is irrelevant as it isn't down to me.

Agree3 Disagree0

07 Jan 2015 11:22:50
Question for Ed002, can you see bale moving in January, or is summer the only time?

Believable1 Unbelievable0

{Ed002's Note - No.}

Eds do you think he will be in the summer

Agree0 Disagree0

{Ed002's Note - Nothing has changed - Real Madrid will sell him if they can - the money they want remains the issue.}

07 Jan 2015 11:22:35
Greetings to you all!

New poster here but I am a long time reader of this site and what an interesting little site it is! Now onto the famous men in red tops and black socks.

Well everyone seems divided on LVG (probably more 70/30 at this point) and rightly so. We, the fans, paying fans, deserve the utmost best from a club of our stature at all times be that results, performances, transfers and merchandise prices so I'm glad to see such variety in opinions from my fellow comrades.

Personally my view is that Van Gaal has done 'ok' so far, nothing extraordinary, nothing excoriatingly bad. Would I have liked Moyes to have had more time? Certainly. But I am never one to advocate the sacking of a manager (especially after less than one year in the job) and as much as Van Gaal would never have been my first choice (Pep is the only SAF replacement for me) I will support him fully until he leaves the theatre. The one thing I will say though is I would have liked to have seen Moyes with the backing LVG has had as following on from the best coach in history on the back of a EPL title winning season is a much harder job than what LVG has taken on. Again this is all my own personal views.

Onto our season so far. I hate our system, hate it. I cannot in reality ever seeing a team who plays 3 defenders (average defenders at that) ever winning the EPL. I have seen us depend on David de Gea more than we have ever depended on anyone in the last 4 months or so and hat off to the lad he has been massive for us. It simply doesn't work in EPL, teams will pick us off in the next part of the season unless we revert to 4 at the back. We got some lucky results with it so far so now let's scrap it and get back to basics.

In terms of incoming players I honestly would rather do without than sign average players for a January premium. Look at City possibly about to splash out 30+million on bony if reports are to believed. Good player? Yes. Worth that much? No (I hate what Chelsea, City, Madrid etc have done to our game financially). We need to wait on the right players becoming available at the right price and not spash out on names that won't fit our team at the moment. Interestingly I seen Ed002 posted saying 'don't be surprised if LVG is not at United next year' a while back if that's a possible scenario he shouldn't be given a dime this month.

Anyway I believe we have a squad to keep a place in the top 4 this year. Van Gaal who's performances may have been uninspiring has got some good results this season and hopefully we shore up at the back and kick on for the remainder of the season.

Keep up the good work guys.

Believable9 Unbelievable2

Welcome to the site and great first post

Agree1 Disagree3

Welcome on board.

I agree on so many of your points mate. We should not be buying average players for the sake of buying in Jan and also agree on the fact LVG should be given more time and your assessment of him so far is spot on.

I am 100% with you that 352 is not right for the PL.

Agree0 Disagree0

I don't think we will see three at the back for much longer. The manager must know that it isn't working. That said, he really hasn't had much of a choice considering we had no fullbacks fit for a while.

If we start with three at the back against Southampton on Sunday, they will beat us IMO. We have to go four with a diamond midfield, and preferably Rooney and Falcao up top.

Agree1 Disagree0

07 Jan 2015 13:04:18
It all depends on who is fit. We know Young, Blind, and Rafael are out. Shaw and Rojo are likely to be but could be fit enough to play a part.

If we say they are all out then his options are play Valencia and Januzaj as wing backs or play Blackett and either McNair or Jones as full backs.

Personally knowing Southampton will play a pressing game having three at the back will play into their hands as it invites pressure on. Considering the quality of our CB's that doesn't seem like the best idea.

The better option imo is to play with a back four of CB's, they can tuck in and allow Southampton's wide players to go wide and try and whip a cross into the box that has at least 3 CB's in there. They won't get much joy.

But it allows us to play our best players further forward and force there defence deeper thus making it harder for them to press due to the gap between their defence and midfield would be huge leaving loads of space for players such as Rooney, Mata, Herrera and Di Maria to hit them.

For me Di Maria will be the difference maker as it will be his pace that will push them back and create the space for everyone else.


The tricky question is do we start with two up top with Falcao and RvP or do we drop one of them for Mata.

Agree2 Disagree0

07 Jan 2015 13:47:14
Shappy,

Rafael is back I believe, going to wear a protective mask.

Juanmatasbeard,

Brilliant first post, as you say you have been a reader for a long time so you have had a long time to think about what your first post will be and you can tell, well thought out and clearly enjoying all the discussions about LVG at the moment.

I would agree with your assessment to be honest, done 'ok' nothing better, nothing worse, probably above average, certainly hitting target position wise but probably under achieving on performance level at the moment. I don't think we can underestimate the issue we have had with injuries, but there have also been some strange decisions, taking our 2 best players in the game off against Stoke for example, and playing 5 at the back on Sunday even though we had Rafael and Shaw playing were a little baffling, but he obviously sees the players day in day out and knows what they are capable of, much more than we see judging them in 90 minutes each week.

Agree0 Disagree2

Bang on about moyes as well imo

Agree1 Disagree1

07 Jan 2015 17:37:08
Welcome and excellent first post!

Agree0 Disagree0

07 Jan 2015 11:07:59
Three players I feel Manchester United should sign this winter.

1)Winston Reid - He would be a bargain buy and would another body to our defense. He is better than or equal to what we have at the moment, and I'd have him than Vlaar, who is injured a lot. If he fails, he turns out to be a 4-5m flop, we signed a stupid Buttner for the same amount and let him stay for 2 years. If it turns out to be a transfer mistake, it's the best mistake we would make. He could be a squad when we let Evans, Michael Keane and probably another CB to leave us in the summer.

2)Nigel de Jong - Forget about Strootman for this window, get De Jong. Why? Because he's been Milan's best player of this season and he is a monster in midfield, dishing out tackles and recycling and winning back the ball. If he plays in the middle along with Carrick, United would certainly won't have to worry about playing 5 at the back. His experience in PL would be a benefit as well.

3)Xherdan Shaqiri - He may short in size like Silva, but he is a very physical player, and everytime I hear his name, I recall the game vs Basel when he the MOTM, and was unstoppable, putting in crosses, running past people, and his dribbling wasn't shabby either.
Bayern Munich are a quality side and have let brilliant players like Mandzukic, Luiz Gustavo leave for Value for money deals in the past, and I believe Shaqiri is a player United should sign, injecting pace in to the squad.

I know we should be signing world class players but then again how many world class players are there? Who'd really come?
Shaqiri, De Jong and Reid would be decent business and ensure we get into the top 4.
I'd rather have De Jong shielding our back than see Evans in a back 3.

Believable5 Unbelievable6

Make no doubt about it on their day De Jong and Shaquiri have proven themselves to be as good as anyone in their roles.

Agree5 Disagree0

If be pretty gutted if we went from signing players like Mata, Di Maria and Falcao to them three! Not the right direction IMO!

Agree2 Disagree1

07 Jan 2015 10:32:45
Hi all, thanks Eds as always.
Reading a bit about Strootman this morning and wanted to offer my opinion.
Firstly there are similarities with Carrick. When West Ham suffered their mass exodus years ago he was the one player they were desperate to hold onto. Liken it to the Southampton-Scheiderlin situation over the summer. He brings about composure in midfield and assurance, but passes positively and well, probably some of the attributes that if Cleverley had utilised then we would not have a problem now. Strootman shares a lot with Carrick in this sense.
Secondly, however, Carrick has never been a world class tackler or interceptor, and this is what Strootman can offer a bit more of. Plus he scores a few more goals. He is more aggressive but perhaps not as calming. The sort of player that would have looked fantastic in the Dortmund CL final side.
Carrick IMO is a better player, but with the addition of Strootman we will have real quality in CM. LVG knows Strootman better than most and is best placed to help mould him into the world class talent he is.
A £30 million player in my opinion, not more, but I can see us paying over the odds for him should he prove his fitness.

Happy new year all.

Believable1 Unbelievable2

I personally think for the money quoted for Strootman there is better options. It irks me seeing us linked with players like Stootman or Pogba etc for big money when we were linked to them years ago for a fraction of the price or in Pogba's situation we had him in our ranks. But if Van Gaal thinks he will be the driving force in our team then who am I to disagree.

Agree7 Disagree0

Carrick this season has been fantastic for us, and Blind is an able backup.
Strootman, we should wait for him in the summer, given that we won't be against top class midfielders till end of season(Chelsea, City and maybe Southampton aside), we could manage without him. let him prove his fitness first, nobody wants a new Hargreaves and it was probably the reason we did not sign Vidal, I'm happy we didn't. And more happy we didn't get Vermaelen.

Agree1 Disagree1

07 Jan 2015 11:20:03
I would say Carrick is a world class interceptor. His reading of the game imo is what makes him so good. He is in the right place at the right time and he sees the right pass before everyone else. What let's him down is his pace and power or rather the lack of it.
Because of that he plays the game in a more "european" manner and as such maybe doesn't get the credit he deserves in England, where we consider someone who charges around and throws themselves about to be playing with passion and heart rather than them just being a step behind the opposition.

As for Strootman there are some similarities with Carrick, he is a good reader of the game and likes to sit a little deeper so as he can get as wide a view of the pitch as possible. But Strootman having been an attacking midfielder in his youth tries to play the ball forward more and quicker, this leads to him having a slightly lower pass completion rate as he makes more high risk passes per game. It is also this more progressive nature that means he is less of a calming influence than Carrick who is better at slowing the game down and keeping possession. Neither have pace but imo Carrick is slightly more mobile but Strootman has more power due to his broader shoulders and impressive upper body strength.

Both are very good players and are similar in their abilities and talents. But imo both fall a little short of the world class bracket. But then again there are very few who make it into that category atm.
LvG wants Strootman and he knows him better than any of us, as a result Strootman is likely to be a keg cog in LvG's plans and would therefore be a very good signing.

Agree5 Disagree0

Why is strootman a 30 mil player?
He moved to roma for 15 mil, played 25 games had 12 month out with a serious knee injury .

Agree0 Disagree1

07 Jan 2015 11:32:34
Id of loved Vidal him and herrera with strootman this window would be ace falco Rooney di Maria as s front three I could only dream off

Agree2 Disagree1

Shappy
In the same way lvg wants hummels

Agree0 Disagree1

07 Jan 2015 12:13:04
People always liken Strootman to Carrick, but if we bought him I wouldn't see him as a replacement for Carrick. He would replace Fellaini in my eyes. Strootman would bring that physical tough tackler that Fellaini was supposed to bring, whilst coupling that with a high quality passing range.

Agree0 Disagree0

Can't ever see us buying him at a fraction of what is being quoted. such an average player who still seems to have not recovered from his knee injury.

I think just lazy journalism.

Agree0 Disagree2

{Ed002's Note - Manchester United have serious interest in the player - I have told you this for months.}

07 Jan 2015 12:43:46
Not quite Jred.

LvG has coached and spoken to Strootman on many occasions and there for knows him a whole lot better than we do. He is fully aware of what he is capable of and what roles he can play in the side.

LvG hasn't had those same opportunities with Hummels so will have to make a calculated risk in signing him. LvG may think that it is a risk worth taking. I personally do not.

Having watched Hummels on a weekly basis for several years I can tell you he is a very talented player, but one who picks up injuries often and has a couple of small issues with his game which imo would be more of an issue in the Premier league than it does in the Bundesliga. As such signing him for such a large fee imo doesn't make sense.

Personally if it was me i would sign Varane, but if he isn't available or wants to move elsewhere then i would look at Otamendi, Garay and Schar as other options.

As for Strootman personally I would choose Schneiderlin ahead of him and would also consider Luis Gustavo as an outside option. But LvG has seen and knows Strootman so he is better placed to judge him than i am.

As for Hummels until he moves to the premier league and proves one of us wrong then i think we will have to agree to disagree on that one.

Agree3 Disagree0

Shappy I agree what you say about Hummels. I posted further down about his pros and cons and at the price that is being talked about their are too many cons for me. Fantastic player but very, very risky.

Agree1 Disagree1

Shappy
So lvg wants strootman "therefore he would be a very good signing ".
did you not post last week that strootman wouldn't be good signing . ( i might be wrong )


But that doesn't apply when lvg wants hummels.
The only difference i can see is that you have a big deal about not signing hummels.

Agree0 Disagree0

Strootman may be a risk but sometimes you have to take that risk. If the manager thinks he will improve us, I say take it! I'd sooner take a risk on Strootman, than save money and buy De Jong or likewise! What was you saying about signing Ruud Van Nistlerooy?

Agree1 Disagree0

I was all for signing RVN he was a top player .
I don't think strootman is that special and if it wasnt for us being linked to him in the paper i don't think many would be shouting buy strootman

Agree0 Disagree0

07 Jan 2015 16:50:03
Jred, your only taking part of my post and either not reading the rest or(maybe more likely) choosing to ignore it.

I have stated because LvG knows Strootman and his capabilities then maybe he is better placed to judge him. Also we don't know LvG's long term plans so again it would be hard to see how any specific player would fit in.

For the record i personally would prefer Schneiderlin As he knows the league and is proven, is injury free and imo slightly more talented.

But i don't know what LvG has planned or how he intends to use the players he is targeting.

That for me is the main difference between the potential signing of Strootman and Hummels.

My issue with Hummels is different altogether, and i have stated my issues more than enough times so won't go over those again.

So i would rather we didn't sign either Strootman or Hummels but could understand the potential Strootman signing and feel it is less of a risk as LvG knows him and his abilities.

Imo you are basing your opinions on them on two different things, your opinion of Hummels seems to come from his reputation rather than you actually watching him, and yet Strootman also has a good reputation yet you don't like him because you've seen him a few times and have been unimpressed. Are you trying to have your cake and eat it?

Agree3 Disagree0

Need. Everyone knew rvn was an excellent player before we signed him, so that was no surprise.
Strongman and Hummels are risks. Personally, I would prefer pogba and Ramos over the other two.

Agree1 Disagree0

{Ed004's Note - Couldn't see Pogba or Varane as been possible alternatives. I would be delighted with Hummels and Strootman. In fact over the moon as all we would need would be a rb (Coleman) and a winger (Reus) to have a top team. However, would be just as happy with Godin, Laporte or maybe Inigo Martinez? Haven't seen much of him but was excellent vs Barcelona. Would be happy with Schneiderlin instead of Strootman as well. Reckon we might be better off with 2 midfield signings tho as feel LvG will want two box to box midfielders (Strootman holding with Herrera + one other) as I'm not sure that role suits Rooney.}

Shaps
I have a different opinion of you over hummels and strootman the same way i did over rooney .

Actually our opinion of strootman are similar I've said the same .
The difference is i don't buy the whole lvg risk knows strootman etc.
Any signing will be down to more than lvg the club scouts ets all have a shout .
Also i think the club and lvg would be fully aware what hummels or any high profile player is capable of .
To think other wise is a bit naive imo.

Also i can assure you i base my opinion of a player on what i have seem and not reputations .
Or is that shocking that i and even some people who " understand " the game could rate him .
And also feel he would work well in a lvg team

Agree0 Disagree0

07 Jan 2015 17:33:12
Totally agree with Jred on this. I have watched him loads and can honestly say he is nowhere near good enough.

I know Ed002 says our interest in serious but i find it so strange that we are even looking at this guy. Then again I find LVG's love of RVP at the moment strange too and some of the other things he is doing.

I don't really care what LVG sees in him as he will not be the first or last manager to get it completely wrong on a player.

For those of you who keep harping his name, don't you think it is strange clubs like, city, arsenal, spurs, chelsea, madrid, barceona, bayern, dortmund and i can go on have never been mentioned in the same sentence with this guy and no one has any interest?

Most top players have a number of the big clubs interested in them. We are one of the largest clubs in the world and most successful club in Britain so adding a B grade midfielder will not solve anything.

If this is LVG solution to our midfield I do not see him being here very long.

Agree0 Disagree0

But what are the chances of us getting pogba? Anyone with half a brain would prefer pogba, but it's not going to happen. It's like saying i'd prefer ronaldo over bale so we shouldn't sign bale. Strootman looks like the best available option for the position we need at the minute, and i think he's an upgrade on our current midfield!

Agree0 Disagree0

Anotherwiganred

Why is strootman available.
He has only played 25 games for roma and the club have said he is not for sale unless an offer of 100 mil comes in

Agree0 Disagree0

08 Jan 2015 05:34:53
I Don't know if he is available, but Ed002 has said on numerous occasions that we have a serious interest in him, have you heard that about pogba and Ramos? I'm merely saying he's better than what we have at moment so i wouldn't care if the club paid 30 mill for him.

Agree0 Disagree0