Manchester United Banter Archive July 09 2012

09 Jul 2012 21:49:30
All the fellani haters on here amaze me top top player we could not handle him lay year when playing off jevlavic an that's were the beauty playing off the front is just something else he can do because I assure you he much better in front of the back four and I think for 20 million given his age and the potential the lad has to get better in a better team I would be delighted if we got him, many many of my friends are season ticket holders at everton and they have raving about him for a couple of years now so I took the time to watch him and they are right he is really top class I know it's just speculation at the min but I hope it's comes to be true and some of you will then see what a top top player this lad is and will soon be even

Fellaini was played as a second striker against us, do we buy him and play him as a second striker? Since when have we become a Stoke or an Everton to want to play anti-football?

Sydney!

Ive got to admit i like Felliani aswell hes the bully type centre mid we need to be honest if we couldnt get an M'villa or Strootman id love Alexandre Song or Marouane Felliani as there both really under rated imo

Syd

No on is say Play him as the second striker but he can play there as an option B. I was merely making the point we struggled with him when playing out of position and that he would be a great option to play in front of our back four he is strong can tackle is really good on the ball everything someone should be sitting in front of our back four, people will be surprised when this lad gets a move how good he really is.

Darren the red

Fellaini and Song would be harder to get than M'Vila and Strootman.

Sydney!

Sydney!

No he wasnt, he was dm (winning everything in the air) until the later stages when he was deployed as acm or as you state a second striker, with devastating effect, not one of our mid fielders could get the ball of him, also isnt that what city do with yaya when they need a goal?

Cban

Cban, Fellaini started the match just behind Jelavic hence the reason he gave Evans and Carrick a torrid time, not our strikers.

Sydney!

09 Jul 2012 21:08:50
Hi there, not posted before. Just wanted general views really. I feel the Baines deal will happen and although he will be slightly over priced due to being English he is a pretty solid left back and we could do worse as we aren't looking long term due to Fabio.
I feel if we could wrap up Moutinho, then him along with Carrick, Cleverly, Kagawa, And I would give Anderson one last chance as he does have the potential as we all know and those four players are a great selection. Then draft in some youth players such as petrucci and cole.
Not sure if Debele is the answer if fletcher doesn't return however but looks like a decent squad player?
What do you guys think?
Being realistic those potential 3 players could cost £50 million?
Nik

I think 3 players and £50m sounds about right.
Not convinced we're bidding for Moutinho, but some people say they have info that we are. Baines would be a good signing but overpriced, of course.
Shame about Fletcher if it's true he won't make it back.

M.D.

09 Jul 2012 20:38:09
Gonna put it out there chaps, it's a long shot but how about Moutinho, £25 Million & Witsel, £10 Million plus Anderson?!

Not saying that's gonna happen fellas but just a thought. Only say this as, RUMOURS are Benfica are looking at Anderson and SAF has monitored Witsel for a little while so possible deal to be struck?

Ports

Pinto a portugese correspondent for CNN said that Witsel is in Utd sights for £8 million plus Anderson and Moutinho will end up at Spurs or Utd

fearny

Buddy any deal that involves Ando out and Witsel in gets a green light from me.

He is an all round more solid player than Ando and would suit the Prem down to the ground IMO.

Jono

Id much rather have Javi Garcia if we are going to have anyone from Benfica hes 3 times the player

I am a Javi Garcia fan too. He can also fill in at CB in emergency.

Sydney!

09 Jul 2012 19:22:11
On the RVP argument...

He's got four years at best at the top of his game IMO, and two of those he'll probably be injured.

IF we could get him for £15m...
AND
IF his wages were £150k/week, £7.8m/year...
AND
We gave him a 5 year deal...
AND
If we wanted to move him on 4 years from now...

We'd spend £46.2m on this guy over a 4 year period, and he'd have very little sell on value, £10m at most. And these are conservative estimates, the fee itself could be £10m more etc.

Also as discussed at length, he doesn't fit in with the way we all feel we're heading towards playing.

AND he's either leaving Arsenal for lack of money or ambition, depending on how much of a cynic you are.

Can we REALLY say our owners are ones for paying huge wages, or investing huge sums of money on our squad?

I think he's a great player, when fit, but just can't see any desperate need for him.

He will want a substantial signing on fee, he will also was wages close to £200k a week. He would cost closer to £60m and like you said he is highly likely to miss several games a season, last season was a strange season for him. No one will offer him a five year deal either. 3-4 years is more likely.

Sydney!

What is it with people and sell on price. We do not buy players to sell on at a profit we buy players to bring success onto the pitch and that is how they are paid for. Success on the pitch means more money which therefore means more money available on wages and transfers. If SAF feels a player will bring something to the team that could be the difference to us winning the league or losing it then he will buy them regardless the age.

Neil

Syd

Is it not that he was asked by Arsenal what would it take to stay and he asked for around 200k knowing full well it didn't matter what they said?

For the reasons of money He could soak it up at Arsenal staying as Queen bee in that squad. If he genuinely wants trophies then I don't think he would be all that bothered with not much more than he is on.

Obviously his agents will have other ideas but wherever he goes I don't think anything over 140k will be his wage. So with us, City or Juve he is far more likely to be trophy chasing with a wage rise.

Jono

Neil, you say good players repay the cost by playing well on the field, which leads to more money through competitions. That maybe true for non-CL teams getting into the CL, but we are not one of those teams. Unless RVP can guarantee Getting to the CL final every year, which is about 10-15m difference on average, to going out at the QF's, then he's not worth it.

Jono, according to the Arsenal editor RVP has demanded close to £200k a week plus other luxuries. I imagine better bonuses and a cut of his image rights. The demands put forward by his agent were not that of a man who just wants to win trophies. I can only see him playing for City.

Sydney!

09 Jul 2012 18:43:59
Seems to me there is a deal be done for Persie boy. If he really does want to come and Arsenal were smart they would do a swop and a bit of cash from us to them taking Berbatov in part exchange. He would be perfect for them, less risk and loss on both sides and both teams could improve as a result of that deal.

Add that to another quality midfielder such as Modric or Moutinho and we have a team.

Kagawa will be player of the year in the premiership this year...

I stated the same thing when RVP announced he was leaving, Berbatov is leaving why not try to incude him in a deal for RVP - the wages would go into RVP contract..ok plus some extra.

Would Berbatov be happy to move to Arsenal being an ex Spurs man? i think berbatov would be better suited to their style of play - slow, measured passing.

Just a thought but would be a decent deal.

Giants14

09 Jul 2012 18:25:42
Im an Everton fan and I am just posting what I have heard apparently rumour is that you lot will sign Baines and offer Evra in part exchange! I think theres a good chance that you'll get Baines but I cant see Evra coming to us. If you sign Baines one of them will be sat on the bench.
Cheers lads,Joe EFC

I cant see Evra going to you the wages are a stumbling bock plus hel want to return to france i think so maybe PSG will come in for him

Worst post I have ever seen

fearny

09 Jul 2012 16:57:33
The only reason United fans even mention Ashley Cole as the best left back in the world is because he is the only one who has ever kept Ronaldo quiet more times than being beaten by him. He is a good player tho but if you would seriously have him at the club now then you are living proof you all prefer players from other clubs.

He has had dips in form just like Evra and is the same age....

1redarmy

And he's been better than Evra has over the past 2 years so i don't really see your point. Evra's form has collapsed catastrophically since the Munich games, now over 2 years ago. he;s got worse and worse. Last season City, Everton & Bilbao to name just 3 teams targeted Evra and took advantage of the fact he couldn't be arsed to track back.

Now i don't like Cole, i think he's a muppet as he's proved on several occasions, but I wouldn't mind our left back putting in performances like he has the last season.

Do not compare Ashley Cole to Evra. For the last 6 seasons i've watched him and i can't remember a significant dip in form once. Even on an off day (and i honestly can not remember one), he is the best left back in the world. In a league of his own. Shame about his off field antics, otherwise he would be considered a true England great.

OsgoodIsKing

Wow. The only reason?! Nothing to do with the fact that he is probably the best?

M.D.

He's got to be up there with Lahm (better) and Contreau, can't think of many others...but no, I wouldn't want him at United because 1) age 2) wages, and 3) he is Ashley Cole, lol

Gav

He played well against ronaldo once in euro 2004 ronaldo was 18, today roanldo would smash all over the park.

Haha Ashley Cole.

He would never leave to another Prem team, not out of 'cough' loyalty but the fact no other manager/team would put up with his sh**e off field (well maybe City).

No doubt on the park he is a very good LB and half of what he gets noticed for is last ditch tackles and blocks but if he was the best he wouldn't be needing the last ditch stuff as he would mark his man better.

He gets caught out at the back post allot and balls over the top of him which highlights a weakness in starting position but no doubt is good at making up the ground going forward.

IMO give it 2 years and we will be seeing Chelsea's version of Evra's decline maybe they will sort it out quicker than we did.

Jono

Oh and I really do not rate Contrao either. Has had an indifferent campaign with Real but finished strongly with Marcelo out. He carried that on into the Euro's where he played with a bit of confidence but IMO he is a liability and consistant fouler with very rash challenges.

Lahm, Alba, Chellini, Marcelo are better than him and IMO Alaba will be as well.

Jono

Lahm IMO is the best LB in the world. As good at defending as Cole, better attacking than Cole and far more versatile than Cole. Lahm is an amazing player. Evra, Alba, Marcelo & Coentrao are all better than Cole attacking-wise, none are better defensively. Lahm is the best in the world for me.

Sydney!

09 Jul 2012 16:03:31
Park's officially gone. Dunno about anyone else but I'm personally gonna miss the lad, 2011-2012 may not have been his best season but he always give us 110%.

He will get a great reception at old Trafford that's for sure. Legend.

GDS

He did always give 110% and was United through and through whilst he was here. I must say I also admire the fact he's gone to QPR quietly to prolong his PL career. He's made no fuss over wanting to stay or moving to Europe or whatever. Always seems to put the club first, a model professional

Good luck Ji Sung!

Gav

09 Jul 2012 15:43:50
I think we should really go out and sign moutinho I've been a great admirer since he left sporting Lisbon a few years ago not only can he dictate the tempo of a fans he also gets stuck in and helps do the dirty work.
ShaunMUFC

09 Jul 2012 15:13:04
Thanks Ji Sung. Good luck

09 Jul 2012 15:08:46
Sheff Utd fan here heard we are signing John Cofie from youu on season loan. Anyone know if he's decent?

09 Jul 2012 14:33:01
hey guyz! hows this?

De Gea


Rafael Ferdinand Vidic Baines


Modric
Kagawa
Valencia Nani

Rooney
Van Persie

subs- lindegaard,evans,jones,smalling,giggs,cleverly,carrick,scholes,young,welbeck,hernandez.. (too much players though)

this can b a strong line up...
once fergie told that he wuld definitely like to sign RVP. so u never know..
I wud b really happy if our starting eleven were to be this though it is largely not possible to happen..
I know many of u wud argue about RVP cuming to united wud end welbeck hernandez progression and blah blah.. but cmon guyz.. we play so many games that fergie can definitely make them all play enough games.. and about kagawa.. though he plays in hole but he is still very good in AMF position..
Though the possibility is less but it can happen..
just my opinion

Aakroz

You have to realise in football you have to defend aswell as attack.Modric and Kagawa in the middle... bit lightweight

fearny

Modric and kagawa would get bullied off the ball...

1redarmy

To light in the middle any strong midfield would ease part that take out young kagawa can play left and add carrick along side modric that would look good


Dwright

Hell no, with that midfield we'd be wide open in the middle. Rooney Valencia RVP and Nani will never get the chance to do anything as we'd never win the ball back in midfield.

Shappy

Sorry but any posts including Modric in the side are just deluded. I thinks its been a good 3 or 4 weeks now since he's made his mind up where he wants to go and it aint to us!

If Modric were sold he would go to, in order: Real, Chelsea, PSG, Us

Halesini

09 Jul 2012 13:34:00
Congratulations to Patrice Evra for managing to piss SAF off so much by your performance in the Manchester derby that he spends £ 14m on Leighton Baines!

Will Evra be sold, be back up or used in a more forward position?

Pedro

Possibly, probably, not at all.

Sydney!

I actually agree with you, Evra was destroyed in the last Manchester derby, all their attacks were down our left side as they knew he was the weakest link. Fabio obviously isnt good enough to provide any competition so we need to bring in an experienced player who doesnt need to settle into the league and can start straight away which is the reason we're signing Baines. Regardless of the price, hes' still better than Evra has been for 2 years.

Flimbo

Evra wont be sold. He will have little value anyway in fairness but will be valuable as competition for the new incumbent to the Left Back spot Leighton Baines.

Halesini

Wasn't just the derby either, Bilbao did the same.

There is every chance Evra will be sold. The club will want him off the wage bill and it's pointless having Baines and Evra in the same squad. A lot will depend on the incomings. We will know more in a month or two.

Sydney!

And Everton, Tony Hibbert of all players destroyed Evra.

Tony Hibbert :(

Sydney!

09 Jul 2012 11:02:58
I'm just trying to think of what the implications would be if we were to sign van Persie which according to rumours is quite possible! This can only mean one thing..we are playing Kagawa as a central midfielder with van Persie and Rooney up top.. Whilst I agree that there is always room for world class players, van Persie seems a little unnecesary and would lessen the impact of Kagawa who could become another Park if he is consistantly played out of position. Overall I would much prefer not signing van Persie who would be a waste of money and would mean that we would stick to the same old 442 system which is swiftly becoming obsolete.

RedDevil19

Totally agree RedDevil19...

for the money it would take for the whole package.... we could use that towards a DM/CM.......

Oxred

If RVP is a serious target, and I'm not convinced he is at all, I think we could line up with a "fluid front 4".

So you have LW, RW, ST, CF.

Rooney, Welbeck, RVP, Nani, Young, Kagawa, Powell are all comfortable in at least 3/4 of these positions each. Add Hernandez and Valencia who are more one dimensional and I think we'd look good going forward. However I think we'd need a real DM for this, which is something Fergie doesn't really like.

Agree totally, would hamper the progress of Hernandez and Wellbeck need to strengthen the midfield (priority)

PSY

442 only works against weaker opposition.

If you look at the Bilbao game where we were torn to shred in the midfield its because we didnt have the numbers or personnel (or both) that could cope with their high-pressing game. Its not the only example where we have come unstuck.

If we got RVP in. and I think its a very big if, I'd be tempted to run 2 different teams, i.e. 4-2-3-1 for the big guns and champs leage with Rooney as the lone striker and 4-4-2 for easier prem and cup games where you could adopt RVP and Welbeck as the automatic pairing.

Scores of reasons why it wont work before everyone jumps on me but just saying that, as a principle, there is no harm in having players who can play in different role and give different tactical options.

RVP and Rooney could be many people's ideal strike-partnership but in a 4-2-3-1 we are rumoured to adopt in future that would see Rooney replacing Kagawa and I cant see Kagawa being bought as anything less than 1st choice.


Halesini

For an injury prone 28 year old its not worth the money. But for me that isn't the worst bit about the deal. Purely the fact that we will be sticking with a 442 and not getting the best out of our new world class playmaker Kagawa is really worrying - for that reason I hope it doesn't go ahead.

RedDevil19

As you said, there is always room for world class players. How about;

Kagawa Rooney
RVP

up top.

Plus Rooney often goes off form throughout the season so RVP could be played on those all-to-often occasions.

I don't think we will sign RVP though, but I hope we do.

FredtheRed

RedDevil19

Im not looking to pick a fight but how can you say Van Persie would be a waste of money? He is as good if not better than Rooney, who is our best player and yet you say we dont need him? Cmon now, would you actually prefer chicharito and welbeck to robin van persie? If so then I think you need your head checked!

Your dearest friend :-)

Flimbo

Flimbo, how much use will RVP be when he gets his next muscle injury and is out for three months?

Top player when fit and on form, but he has had just ONE injury-free season since he joined Arsenal. At 29 he is too much of a risk for the cash that he wants.

Sydney!

Hmmmm...... Uncle Halesini has had a partial re-think:

4-3-1-2
a la

Valencia Carrick MOUTINHO or GAITAN
Kagawa (in the hole)
RVP Rooney

Thoughts welcome my children .....


Halesini

Or...worst case scenario...we don't get RVP AND we stay playing 442!

Personally I would imagine if SAF has put so much thought into buying Kagawa then he will already know where he wants him to play. I may be wrong but I can't see him just moving him around based on who we buy next

I'm really hoping we get to see Kagawa in 'the hole' and we switch to 4231, as you would prefer RD19

Gav

Flimbo, Welbeck and Chicharito are not my concern, I'd take van Persie every day. My concern is that if we sign van pere will still be playing 442 which is outdated and also we have signed a brilliant attacking midfielder in Kagawa. Rooney will play a lot, Hernandez and Welbeck will rotate, so there is no need for RVP.

RedDevil19

RD19 & Syd

I was just suggesting that Van Persie would only improve the squad when compared to what we have now, Rooney included, in fact reckon Rooney himself would love to play alongside him, and that I cant see how that could be money wasted!

Syd - Fair enough he has only had 1 injury free season but doesn't the fact he is still worth £20M even with his injury record and with just 12 months on his contract go to show just how good he is?

Flimbo

09 Jul 2012 09:39:24
Had a chat with me mate on sat at the weeding who works for SEG who manage van pirse. The contract on offer from juventus is alot higher than what on offer from united and city but there are a number of complications. Robin wants the move to united ge does not really want the move to Italy and thinks everything he wants to move for he will get at old Trafford but there is a big stumbling block to this man utd and juventus are only willing to go to £15 million for him quite a bit less than what arsenal want which is £20 million and united have said this will be there highest offer for the player. Juventus are willing to come up a bit but not much as there wage offer is so high, and city are willing to pay the £20 million but the player is very unsure that city would be a good move for him for many reasons. Pressing him on were he thought was likely at the min he said 40% juventus and city and united 30% a each. He said if its down the advice of agents the juventus move will happen as they gain the most form this signing on fees and wages currently on offer, but he does stress the player is holding out for united to broker a deal and that he would not expect it to be sorted anytime soon and much like nasri last year he could easily see van pierse strarting the season with arsenal and the making a move in late august. Let's hope we can broker a deal he would be a great bit of business.

Darren the red

£15m is a fair price.

Sydney!

I would love RVP in a United Shirt, him along with a DM and i believe will be a great force in both EPL and CL

Giants14

I agree £15M is a fair price but should we not stretch to £20M if it means we will definitely get him and then try sell Berbatov for £5M to make up the balance? I understand its still costing £20M in effect but we would be upgrading our attacking options on a par with City in my opinion, then with Baines coming in and 1 more midfielder I think we would be very well equipped to go for trophies

Flimbo

£20m fee and potentially £40m in wages. Too big of a risk if you ask me.

Sydney!

Flimbo makes a superb observation re Berbatov who surely SHOULD be leaving this season just from his own 'I want to play' perspective.

Now, being the wily old fox that I am I rather think Wenger is one of the few managers who would see the benefits of a Berba + £15m cash deal for RVP.

What say thee pilgrims ?

Dear Mr Arsene ....


Halesini

Agreed flimbo.

Would we say 15m tops and run the risk of losing him to City where he would not only boost their strikers but maybe help in getting Nasri back to top form further to our detriment.

Or say fine we meet at a compromised £20m (I would pay no more) and hope as a previous poster had pointed out he gets what he wants in Arsenal getting the cash and his move to Utd. City could of course up their offer again and they are capable of doing so easily but then it's on Arsenals head to show some compassion to a players wishes and accept what they wanted originally.

I think with his age he would halo more than hinder our young strikers and he can also drop a little deeper and play behind or left of a top three.

So more tactical options for the formation we are moving to and a top class player for say £20m (or 15 and Berba gone) is a defo yes in my eyes.

But ONLY if there are monies still available for a minimum 1 hopefully 2 CM's.

If not? Then f**k Van Persie haha.

Jono

Haha Jono, agreed :-)

Flimbo

09 Jul 2012 08:20:05
For a bit of fun and something different (if the Eds will allow), let's make a starting XI, Team Name and Stadium name related to Fish. For example Shoal-a Ameobi and Sole Campbell. Go!! {Ed002's Note - Sure, have a blast.}

How about:

-------------------------David Seamen
Jose 'Bass-ingwa'-Neil 'Haddock'-James 'Perch'-'Fillet' Lahm-
-----David 'Seafood Platt-er'-Paul 'Schools'-
'Salmon' Kalou--------------Joe 'Sole'-----------Andreas 'Limpet'-
----------------------Faus-'Tuna' Asprilla-


Team Name: Fergies Fishlings

Stadium: The Rose-'Bowl'

Rubbish I know haha.

Jono {Ed007's Note - You guys have far too much time on your hands!}

My 5 a side Team
GK The Cat-fish
DF Mark Fish
DF Sol(e) Campbell
MD Coral Poborski
MD Sushi Kagawa
CF Makrel-Smith

James perch, paddy roach,john ruddy,connor salmon
johndenton

Edwin Van Der Starfish
Nicky HaliButt

Lee Scampy (Camp)

James Perch
Sole Campbell
Joe Haddock (instead of Mattock)
Ashley Code

Dirk Trout
Victor Fischer(man)

These have to be a few of my favourites, especially Dirk Trout.

RedDevil19

I like it Jono, good effort!

StingRay Parlour

StingRay Parlour!

Haha that is top drawer.. I totally missed him.

Also my owner would be 'Shark' Mansoor.

Quite fitting really ha.

Jono

GK: Scott LOACH (Loach)

DF: Jordi ALBACORE (Alba)
DF: Ashely COLEY (Cole)
DF: Gary MONKFISH (Monk)
DF: Steven CARP (Carr)

MF: Matty Tailor (Taylor)
MF: Johnathan GREENLING (Greening)
MF: Marko MARLIN (Marin)

ST: CISKO (Xisco)
ST: Lucas MORA (Moura)
ST: Billy SHARK (Sharp)

MANTAchester United

GOLDFISH Trafford

09 Jul 2012 08:32:28
So.....Rooney announces his best friend in footy is Ashley Cole !.....he spent most his time in the US with him..
Fergie looking for a left-back......2+2 = 5

No no no! Wouldn' want Cole anywhere near Old Trafford.

Rjmanutd

Why not the best left back in the world

ross

No he isn't!! Will people give over! Ashley Cole is a very solid left back!
Lahm for one is better.

Whistler.

Lahm is better.

Sydney!

09 Jul 2012 02:25:34
Right I've seen so many names mentioned but does anyone actually know who our transfer targets are and why does everyone seen to think Baines is a done deal.? If he was would he not hae signed by now?

09 Jul 2012 00:13:44
So It seems if the bird is the word. (rumours are true)
We'll have had the best window in years.
Baines, Moutinho, Powell, Kagawa, Henriquez all coming in
DEMBELE MIGHT BE BOUGHT IN JAN (Fletcher won't regain fitness but he'll be given time)

LOANS:
Amos & Tunnicliffe - Hull
M.Keane - Blackburn
Thorpe & King - Wolves
Brady - Everton or Wigan
Fabio - QPR
Macheda - Besiktas or Boro
Bebe - Forest

08 Jul 2012 22:58:44
I have it from very good source that Darren fletcher will not return. He will take up a position on the coaching staff. Best of luck Darren. My source also tells me van Persie is a real target and united is his preferred choice. A big story going around is that fergie is looking to off load Rooney and was hoping real Madrid would be interested but they have no money so now it's down to city and Chelsea. I'm told there is more skeletons to come out of the Rooney camp and fergie has had enough.

Load of rubbish. Everything you said, made up and pointless !

GDS

Complete and utter BS, Rooney is now a reformed character (not reformed but you know what I mean). United wouldn't sell unless they were offered in excess of £60 million and not even City would offer that. Also we won't get RVP I can promise anyone that, he's Juventus bound if not then City. United interested but not for £25 million for a 29 year old who's had one good injury free season.

United Till I Die 1987

Juventus only offered arsenal £8million for rvp last week

08 Jul 2012 22:35:09
luka moric and his agents have given Real upto 7 july to seal his move to madrid or else he is ready to opt out of the deal and consider other options......oh GOD this will make SAF have some hope and wait on the player without looking at other prospects...........,but i believe we are still bringing in 4 players possibly baines,fellaine/dembele,striker,moutinho/modric

08 Jul 2012 21:52:11
supposedly we haven't actually bid for dembele. bit confused as to whats going on

08 Jul 2012 21:26:37
Just looking at transfers a different way...what if we are looking for the unheard ofs who would be of interest in the positions we are looking to fill with the main one being central midfield. The main one that springs to mind is Acquah, I wonder if we have interest in him as a small signing because he is the definition of box2box like Essien, just an interesting thought...

RedDevil19

08 Jul 2012 20:51:02
Hmm! Lets agree there is diff between speculation and rumour then all here on this site are all specs.