16 Apr 2024 07:41:33
Tumbleweed! has written an article entitled, Player Assessment At Manchester United
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Manchester United Banter
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16 Apr 2024 08:20:01
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16 Apr 2024 07:39:08
{Ed's Note - Ed001 has posted a new article entitled, Liverpool v Crystal Palace - A Quick Liverpool Perspective
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16 Apr 2024 03:15:08
Interesting to see Liverpool fans starting to turn on Klopp after just a handful of bad performances. We've been terrible since last January, yet there are still people on here who'd rather blame everything but Ten Haag for our abysmal performances.
I'm not saying that the way that our club has been run since David Gill left hasn't been shambolic, but pretty much all of the issues that Ten Haag has had to deal with are ones that his predecessors also faced. If anything, I'd say he's been backed much better than any of our post-SAF managers when it comes to transfers. They were still able to implement their own styles of play, even if not all of those styles were effective or entertaining to watch.
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16 Apr 2024 05:25:27
redseven
What clag you're chatting.
Ronaldo?
Sancho?
Greenwood?
Sale/ investment?
Not one of his predecessors has dealt with the current pressures relevant to any of that, not one.
While I have resigned myself to the reality that he won't be here next season, he has had a very rough ride.
There are some on here who blame the players and the coaching staff for how abysmal this season has become.
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16 Apr 2024 06:42:24
Ork
Ten Hag has caused some of his own problems with his inflexibility, lack of leadership skills, poor ingame management, tactics and what he says.
If he got his tactics right and we could see a pattern emerging he would have had an easy ride. He pushed for players he knew Antony, Malacia, Amarabat, players that made no sense Mount, he was given money and in Antony’s case too much. I no longer have any sympathy for him and after throwing ac19 year old under the bus he should have been fired yesterday.
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16 Apr 2024 08:00:18
He, like most of us, is paid to do a job. He isn’t.
He tried and I wanted him to succeed but he is lacking in flexibility, severely lacking tactically, delusional in his comments and has started chucking young kids under the bus.
Sorry but I am firmly in the OUT camp.
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16 Apr 2024 08:13:28
Redman
I'm not defending any of that, I'm just answering the BS claim that ten Hag has faced issues that were mostly encountered by his predecessors.
The 4 situations I mentioned and all of their respective complexities have been faced by not one of his predecessors - not one.
He has made some mistakes and deserves the criticism for them, but let's not all talk clag.
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15 Apr 2024 12:53:35
I don't think the garnacho situation liking posts criticising eth is comparable to the sancho debacle.
I am not sure if he removed his 'likes' or left them up and we also don't know if he apologised to his manager for doing so or indeed if his manager asked him to.
I hope this is kept under control and not let escalate like the sancho episode.
We have a cup semi final at the weekend and that surely is the only thing that matters at the moment so I'm sure it won't derail preparations for that.
Looking forward to the Coventry game I'm sure we will see a positive reaction from at least some of the players.
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15 Apr 2024 13:58:49
Regardless of the similarities I can't see for the life of me why players get involved on social media in this way. More often than not it's going to end in drama. In an unlikely alternative world where I'm an elite professional footballer, there are no newspapers or social media accounts anywhere near me. I guess it's down to the strength of the individual but I can't help but feel the mental state of half the population would be healthier without social accounts.
Looking forward to the semi final too. Some of my favourite memories of watching Utd in my youth were of Mark Robbins' breakthrough season, in particular an FA Cup semi-final I believe (inc replay) against Oldham on their infamous plastic pitch on which they were imperious. Classic times.
We're still heavy favourites but it's definitely a banana-skin and we're an accident waiting to happen.
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15 Apr 2024 14:15:26
It seems like a non-story to me. A 19 year old lad has probably in the heat of the moment let his frustration get the better of him, and committed the grievous crime of "liking" a tweet or two that criticised the manager he was frustrated with.
He's then calmed down, probably had someone have a word with him and removed the likes.
Has he apologised? I dunno, I expect he probably has. But frankly that's between him and the manager.
It's typical media making a mountain out of a mole hill. Unfortunately I expect we'll have to endure plenty of these kinds of reports over the next month or two. The media smell blood in the water and know any stories about United are a sure fire hit. Making them their money, regardless of whether the story has any truth in it at all.
The Sancho situation was completely different. Sancho publicly criticised the manager and called him a lair, refused to remove the posted message, and refused to apologise.
Not only was Sancho's initially digression far worse as it was a public statement made with intent and in his own words, as opposed to simply liking something someone else posted. It was his subsequent actions that made the situation untenable. While Sancho was also a 24 year old man with far more life experience and should be far more grown up than the 19 year old Garnacho.
Expect these rumours to be a near daily thing, certainly after every game we fail to win, between now and when the decision to remove EtH is made official.
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15 Apr 2024 14:25:14
Yeah spenno my 1st every live match was the 77 final.
Spenno a lot of the high profile players make more money off their social media accounts than they do playing football. It's the world we live in. It's how a lot of that generation communicate. Bizarre to you and me
Old dogs and new tricks springs to mind.
If you only knew how much some of them make for a few posts it would make your hair curl.
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15 Apr 2024 15:41:16
Love the rumour mill, not difficult to keep us in the news at all.
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15 Apr 2024 15:59:11
Don't get me wrong Tumble, I'm not quite in the senile bracket (yet! ) and have my own social accounts, but the thought of players playing a big game or finishing a long training session then immediately whipping out their phones to see where they've been mentioned baffles me.
By all accounts the latest suggestion is that it wasn't even the player himself but one of his 'team' who manages it. Dunno if any of that is true but I'd like to think if I was in a position of authority at a top club I'd be making sure all players and their entourages were a little more savvy on what to be doing under the club's name.
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15 Apr 2024 16:36:37
Wondering if Sancho comes back once ETH moves on?
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15 Apr 2024 17:33:39
I doubt it Eric that's from a footballing point of view only.
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15 Apr 2024 19:37:56
You may be right Ken. That being said, all depends on the new style of football the DoF and coach want to follow. He may suit it…as might some of the other outcasts.
I have absolutely zero doubts in my mind anymore that ten Hag will be moved on in the summer.
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15 Apr 2024 21:27:33
I don't see a way back for eth Eric. No doubting he has not had it easy but its never easy at United. I am totally putting my eggs in the sjr basket along with the new management team. It's all we can do in my opinion.
I won't like or agree with some of what they decide but that's OK imo.
That includes if they want to keep eth, sancho, Greenwood, rashford whomever.
The coach next year will have a very difficult job.
I've no idea what can and can't be done in terms of selling and buying players whilst taking SPR regulations into account. Costs have spiralled out of control and the need to reign them in is paramount.
Alonso took leverkusen from bottom of the league when he took over to champions in 2 years overtaking bayern and red bull spending less than 50% of what they did. More than 60% of his squad were bottom 2 years ago now they are invincibles.
The right coach can inspire and improve what we have until he can build his ideal squad in conjunction with the dof over 4 or 5 windows like klopp and arteta did.
I hear the argument that eth has not had the opportunity to work with them. 12 months earlier and he would have been in a better spot buy imo he has very badly fluffed his audition and seems to be making it worse at every opportunity.
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15 Apr 2024 22:30:27
Tumbleweed, there’s too much to do in terms of player sales for us to turnaround that quickly. That dressing room has seen off multiple managers, it needs tearing up and rebuilding.
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16 Apr 2024 00:09:27
Rewz I'm not suggesting we will become champions in 2 years if you think it will take more than 4 or 5 windows to clear out I'd be surprised. There is no doubt that between the next 3 windows 15 or 18 of the current squad will be gone with maybe 12 coming in.
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16 Apr 2024 06:46:09
Rewz
The new DOF etc should deal with players deciding who should be playing for the club, the manager is a transitory employee, who has had ultimate power for too long. The club failed to change or realise when SAF retired, just thought it would continue and the manager would have power like SAF. Time for a head coach who will be judged on performance and not the mythical five years time when magically it all comes right.
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14 Apr 2024 22:58:56
It's been said before but unai emery really is a fantastic coach. There's no chance we could get him but he should be on any list we have. Everywhere he goes he has success (other than an unlucky stint at Arsenal), and his teams have a clear style and substance to them. I'm sure he's having a very good ebening tonight 😂.
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15 Apr 2024 07:09:32
But according to many on here, only months ago we have already got a fantastic coach, yes appears now many have changed there minds! Over a year ago I named the players who were not good enough that included AWB McT McG etc etc, I was given pelters again many have changed there mind. nice you finally woken up and smelled the coffee that ETH is out of his depth.
I was also given stick for questioning ETH demeanour also ability to fall out with everyone, you all said he was a disciplinarian and doing great at it. How’s that looking now?
These players are not as bad as you all say, they are just being told to play with a terrible game plan and tactics and awful coaching. A decent manager would get a lot more from them.
Bruno and Rashford are probably our best two players but you all fallen under this spell that they are rubbish, they are not rubbish it’s what they're being ask to do, same with Casermiro, he is hardly rubbish. but of course the lambs follow.
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15 Apr 2024 07:38:45
I'll take Ross county's manager at this point.
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15 Apr 2024 08:45:48
Romanian what nonsense about Rashford
He ain’t rubbish he’s absolutely useless and lazy and spineless
Yes ETH isn’t blameless.
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15 Apr 2024 12:43:32
Brilliant post Romanian Maverick. On behalf of all of the posters on this forum, thank you for sharing your valuable insights with us, oh wise one.
It’s good to know that none of this is the players fault. I will take back anything I’ve said about Rashford’s work ethic and Martial’s laziness. Rangnick, Ole, Jose and LVG are all to blame. Damn those managers, it’s a miracle that they’ve managed to win league titles and champions leagues before they came to United.
Also thanks for the heads up on “McG”. I haven’t heard of him before, but will surely check him out.
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15 Apr 2024 13:03:46
Wazza I think we got a couple of those managers a little past their sell by date in Jose and lvg.
None of our managers let go since fergie have won anything of note since they left and been fired from their subsequent jobs too. Of course only some of them even got another job.
I think it was right they were fired.
Jose did an OK job apart from that eth had a good 1st season.
Lots of our players that were deemed useless and toxic and sold have gone on to win titles and plenty of them.
I'd say the coaches were a bigger problem than the players. Their winning pedigree since their various departures would uphold that view somewhat imo.
I'm not suggesting that all the players are right for united but neither is the manager we have imo.
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15 Apr 2024 17:40:42
Its a shame that sarcasm doesn't come through in a different colour font Ken.
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15 Apr 2024 17:57:18
If you seriously think that ETH is this such a strong character and full of discipline, don’t you think for one minute he would drop Rashford if he was not doing exactly as ETH is telling him to do… maybe use some more brain power on thinking why he is picked for every game, I’m told he is the best trainer at the club, so hardly lazy!
BTW I said Sancho was an awful waste of money because his attitude…got that right too, even though one big poster on here told me time and time again I did not know what I was talking about he he is great and you even backed him up…. How that turn out!
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15 Apr 2024 23:26:42
Wazza, sarcasm is in black text on this site.
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14 Apr 2024 17:10:18
Let's go through our team, Onana, has settled after a shake start, keep. Dalot, great attitude but not good enough at RB keep for now. Maguire sell, Lindelof sell, Varane sell, Kambala one for the future keep. Martinez keep. Shaw good when fit and can ply CB too as cover, keep. Malacia, looks promising keep. AWB, great tackle but poor positioning, squad player keep for now. Casemero and Ericsen past it, sell. Bruno great worker but needs to more disciplined, keep. Mount needs some game time, keep, Mainoo so much potential, keep. Garnacho, keep, Hojlund, potential keep. Antony good worker, keep for now. Then Rashford, just don't know, maybe another manager can get him back to his best, keep for now. McTominay a squad player, keep for now. ETH not up to it, sack. Along with the players out or loan injured (Sancho, DVB, Martial) we have about 8 -10 players to get rid of, hard to do in the summer but we need to get them out before we can rebuild with young hungry players. Big summer coming, hopefully.
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14 Apr 2024 18:42:43
In all my four decades of following Manchester United, I've never seen a clear-out on the scale being spoken about by the majority of fans.
It always used to be a predictable couple in, couple out, maybe 3-4 each way lol.
But I agree. Lots to move on for various reasons, some more likely than others due to contract situations and salary demands.
The squad needs to be trimmed for sure. As for signings, we need at least 4-5 players able to start and play in whatever the style is.
The trouble is it's not clear who's going to be in charge, and therefore what that style or his requirements are.
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14 Apr 2024 18:49:49
With international tournament and the changes above ten hag I just don't see there being that much change to the first team. So many fringe players to deal with that I can see a lot of these players back next season.
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14 Apr 2024 18:53:46
I've seen Bournemouth Brentford and Brighton go though our team recon enough is enough.
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14 Apr 2024 19:56:56
We need a massive reset and if that means a season of mediocrity but the big earners and wastrels have left it is a step in the right direction
We been absolute pony for 10 years so another season of mediocrity won’t make much difference
The first name who has to go is Rashford
If we got rid of Rashford Casemiro and Varane that’s a million pounds a week saved on wages plus Martial and Eriksen that’s another 400,000 a week saved
Sick to death of these players.
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14 Apr 2024 21:11:29
Dalot - get rid. An absolute liability. Can't defend. No awareness of danger.
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14 Apr 2024 21:18:54
Don't think there will be any takers Blackpool.
Perhaps Chelsea or arsenal but highly doubtful.
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14 Apr 2024 22:14:34
Jodler I sometimes think the same then on other periods of form I also see some good attributes.
Tactically he is beings asked to fill in to cm when we attack so he is then not where he needs to be when play breaks down which it inevitably does due to everything being off the cuff so it leaves him badly exposed.
Garnacho took the wrap for it yesterday which may be the case in eths plan but the plan is not sustainable obviously. Its his style. It's his vision. It's the same sort of madcap defending that allowed spurs win a cl semi v his ajax team.
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14 Apr 2024 22:18:52
Dalot out and anthony. and that keeper I don't care how much he improved he isn't good enough going forward. And the talk about Southgate surely Jim Bob has more sense I'd rather keep eth.
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14 Apr 2024 22:37:23
Tumbleweed, Dalot does make some important positive contributions. He is a Premiership player after all so he must have some things going for him. But we have to remember that he is a right back. Full backs are required to be competent in many areas but their priority is to be able to defend. He just simply does not have a defender’s instincts.
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15 Apr 2024 11:20:02
Funny how we all disagree on certain players. For now I'd keep the following. The rest can all do one as far as I'm concerned:
Onana
Bayindir
Dalot
Kambwala (send on loan)
Martinez
Mount
Mainoo
Garnacho
Hoijland.
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15 Apr 2024 11:23:11
Dalot is a keep for me. He shows passion for the badge, puts effort in and is diverse enough to cover RB and LB if needed. Its unrealistic to expect an improvement in every position over the next few windows, so I would rather keep a player that wants to play and ship off the ones that don't.
In a more stable, consistent side I think he would be a lot better.
4
15 Apr 2024 12:01:06
I forgot to include Shaw although his injuries are becoming concerning.
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15 Apr 2024 13:40:23
Jodler I agree on the instincts it's not natural for him. That's down to coaching I think.
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15 Apr 2024 14:05:17
Shaws checked out again after being asked to lay off the maccy D’s.
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15 Apr 2024 14:30:28
Mainoo, Garnacho and Højlund are the only one's I'd say definitely have a long term future at our club.
You then have players like Onana, Dalot, Martinez and Mount who I think probably have a long term future at the club, but due to varying issues from poor form, injury and question marks on where or how they fit in the team, means that they aren't dead certainties for me. Although all should be kept for the next couple of seasons or so.
You then have Rashford, Bruno and Shaw. Players who can be key players, but have either struggled for form or injury. These three should be kept for now, but very much next season should see them playing for their futures. Bruno turns 30 at the start of next season, so isn't a long term option. While Shaw turns 29 this summer and is likely to soon start to decline due to his game relying on his physical traits, they are also likely to decline earlier due to his injuries. So he isn't a long term option. Rashford could be here longer, but that might be because we can't find someone to take on his wages more than due to his performances and impact on the team. Although if he can get his head straight and back to his best form he can be one of the best forwards in the league.
That's 10 players who should be here next season, with 3 of them probably playing for their futures.
The rest need to be shipped out over the next couple of summers. Players like AWB, Maguire, McTominay and Antony will probably get a stay of execution as we can't shift everyone and while none of them are good enough, they can at least contribute to the side as squad options. Players like Amad and Malacia also probably stay yo see if they can get fit and prove themselves to be useful either at first choice or squad options.
That's another 6 taking it to 16 who should form part of the squad next season.
Everyone else should be moved on if a club can be found for them. Not all will, but we need to move as many of them as possible.
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15 Apr 2024 16:27:57
MancMan,
Shaw has always been injury prone. Last season was his most consistent season as he managed to stay fit.
If the club got a good offer for him in the summer, I'd sell him.
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15 Apr 2024 17:15:47
I’m not even convinced by Rasmus, maybe as number 2 striker but he got a hell of a lot to learn, running all over showing willing is no more than Weghorst done, he is nowhere near the required level to lead the line at a club who supposed to be top 4…. Yes he gets little service, but don’t look great at what he does do, I would like to see if he develops under a proper coach but to me he not progressed this season at all.
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15 Apr 2024 21:25:02
Don't we all demand a complete clear out of players when they fail to perform, think we did this last a few years ago with Ole, and then Jose and LVG.
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14 Apr 2024 16:42:09
Absolutely fantastic, the women have beaten Chelsea for the first time ever to reach the F. A. Cup final.
Terrific defensive performance in second half, Spurs in the final.
Come on you girl's!
10
14 Apr 2024 17:27:36
Brilliant 👏👏👏.
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14 Apr 2024 17:46:37
Great news. Let's hope the men can do the same next week. I'm very hopeful.
Great result for the ladies today.
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14 Apr 2024 19:17:33
Great performance and revenge for last year…well done ladies! 👏👏👏.
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14 Apr 2024 11:48:27
We are now at the end point of the Glazer/ Woodward disastrous management regime. The season is essentially over, bar a possible cup final against a team that will be highly fancied to beat us, assuming we can get by Coventry, who will firmly believe in their chances. After last season's improvement, this has been an awful campaign dogged by injuries to key players and appalling form by the remaining senior players. The only bright spots have been the emergence of some youngsters. although we are now at the point of risking them becoming totally demoralized. and in the latter part of the season, the goalkeeper.
The manager has been unable to change the dynamic. He's stuck with tactics that have seen us conceding an unconscionable number of shots. Of course, had he decided to play more cautiously, packing the midfield, and committing fewer players to attack, then the complainers would no doubt be accusing him of being a reincarnation of LVG. Perhaps he's simply too one dimensional and unadaptive in his thinking, or perhaps he just doesn't have the quality of players needed, so it's damned if you do and damned if you don't.
The close season will be interesting. We are not going to be an attractive destination for any top players. The transfer season will be affected by the Euros too. There's so much change required in every aspect of the club perhaps a year out of Europe will be a good thing. The new team, with or without ETH, will be slightly less pressured by an intense schedule to try and acquire a squad capable of successfully negotiating 60+ games in a season.
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14 Apr 2024 15:26:03
Manchester united will always be a top attractive destination. End of story.
We need to go after the people we actually need, and who actually want to play for Manchester United. Those are the 2 criteria for all transfers.
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14 Apr 2024 15:59:14
jimbobred
I think if you think that's the end of the story you need a dose of reality. Were not a attractive club to come to unless its with wages on offer. Weve been poor for a decade and most players that have joined have found there career and reputation decline with us.
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14 Apr 2024 20:33:47
Agreed W16 we are attractive for a financial point of view, and that is the main reason so many big names have joined us over the past decade.
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14 Apr 2024 22:56:43
True in a lot of cases wazza. The glazers gave the keys of the sage to the wrong men.
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14 Apr 2024 23:15:28
Again, there is a process in place, the big earners will be on borrowed time, and the fundamentals of being Manchester United will shine through.
Manchester United is still a top attraction, for players and supporters the world over. End of story.
If you think otherwise, go and support Villa once they secure top 4.
Plastics.
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14 Apr 2024 11:37:11
While we all hope that this summer will be a big one in terms of rebuilding the squad, we have to be realistic! How many of our players are we going to be able to sell especially for the fee and wages asked?! Let's face it they aren't exactly painting a positive image, the performances and effort of most have been way below standard so why would anyone else want them? Temper your expectations for most likely a large number of them will still be here come August.
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14 Apr 2024 17:00:26
Well Martial will be off so that's a great start, Casemiro and Varane need to go but unless Saudi clubs come in then wages are going to be a problem, I think AWB needs to go he is a great tackler but that's about it.
Then there is the if you get the right offer for them let them go, that would be Maguire, Rashford, McTom, Pellestri and Anthony.
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14 Apr 2024 11:33:39
6 points from the last 21.
On the brink of 8th place if West Ham win today.
Question - would be genuinely be better to remove the manager now and put an interim in charge for the remainder of the season? If have no idea who it would be, but could the tactics or desire be any worse than they are right now?
You often see a bounce when such appointments are made. Maybe enough to at least keep in the fight for sixth.
Genuine question.
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14 Apr 2024 12:00:12
I see your reasoning, but for financial reasons it won’t happen! If it were me I would let him go now rather than let this fester for another 2 months.
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14 Apr 2024 12:07:51
Would you rather spend £15m today on Dan Ashworth or removing ten Hag?
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14 Apr 2024 12:35:55
I'd absolutely pay the £15m for Ashworth now.
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14 Apr 2024 14:51:34
Sack him now and if it’s to be Potter he can get started now.
1
14 Apr 2024 15:12:13
Id do both…😂.
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14 Apr 2024 16:19:10
An interim new manager bounce isn’t guaranteed. Need only look at what happened to Chelsea after Potter was sacked. They got even worse under Lampard.
0
14 Apr 2024 16:39:04
We need to adhere to the rules.
0
14 Apr 2024 17:04:19
I would say if we lose our next game to Coventry and go out of the Cup then he must go then but the fact that our new CEO, DOF and technical director are not at the club yet will probably mean he is here till the summer.
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14 Apr 2024 19:19:22
What rules are those Ken?
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14 Apr 2024 20:45:21
I'm not an expert Tim.
But you are only allowed to lose a certain amount of money over a 3 year period concurrent (I think)
We have been sailing very close to a points deduction or at best falling foul of those rules.
An exit spend of eth's and staff payout will run to millions. Ideally on next years book. Next funancial year starts July 1st.
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15 Apr 2024 09:48:27
It really is a bizarre system. Wish I could count on a £15m payout if I was crap at my job and facing the sack, I might try a little harder to fall out with people.
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