Manchester United banter 10


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14 Mar 2018 09:24:17
I posted last night before I had chance to watch the game ( I was watching my local non league team play a top of the table clash and very entertaining it was) I have now watched the game and in the cold light of day can honestly say that the scoreline flattered us. Utd last night played the kind of cowardly, pedestrian and downright insipid football that is fast becoming our stock in trade. Jose alluded to coming to Old Trafford with other teams ( Porto and Real Madrid) and had positive results and knocking Utd out of the competition so it was nothing new, wrong Jose! on those nights we were the better team and went out in very contentious and unfortunate circumstances. Here we are again and this loss is being fortunately swept under the carpet under the guise of having a very important match at the weekend and the usual platitudes are being offered by the players and staff after this defeat but do you know something? I'm sick and tired of these excuses, I'm sick and tired of the flat, boring insipid displays, I'm sick and tired of show pony players more interested in their hairstyles than putting in a shift, I'm sick and tired of the gutless displays, I'm sick and tired of the stop start season that we are currently experiencing, I'm sick and tired of this season, I'm sick and tired of Jose. I hope that someone can direct me to this post next season as we are on our way to our 21st league title but I won't hold my breath.

Agree6 Disagree0

14 Mar 2018 08:26:34
Another false dawn it seems. Every time we think Mourinho might have cracked it he reverts to type and we lose with a whimper.

He has been a fantastic manager, one of the best in fact.
However, the key part of that last sentence was "has been".

His tactics can still be effective, but not as often as they used to. He has not changed his approach of philosophy in nearly 20 years. The landscape in football has changed dramatically in that time.

Jose still thinks the best way to defend is to have bigger stronger faster players. Yet Mac City don't have any defenders of defensive midfielders who fit that description, and yet they have conceded less goals than us.
Control of the game through use of space has out performed physical strength.

Last night we had a starting midfield of two players over 6'4 in height, the two midfielders we had on the bench we're both over 6'3.

Yet how mobile are they?
How good at controlling the game are they?
What technical skills do they have?

In a time where teams have looked to possession football for nearly 10 years, and high presses for 3-5 years we are choosing to hand possession over to these teams just so our big strong players can win it back. What is the point?

I'm starting to feel Mourinho might have taken us as far as he can, and I wonder if it is a good idea to allow him the time to pull down the platform he has built.

We need a couple of midfielders and a couple of defenders in the summer, the question is do we allow Mourinho to bring in those players in his mould knowing full well that these players will very likely out stay him at the club?

Do we need more Mourinho players? Or do we need players who can play the United way?

Agree6 Disagree0

14 Mar 2018 08:25:44
After that absolutely diabolic performance is don't see de gea being in a rush to sign a new Contract or even staying beyond the summer.

Agree3 Disagree0

14 Mar 2018 08:25:29
Well, well, well.

I've not been happy with most of the performances all season but was pragmatic that we were at least better than we have been and moving slowly in the right direction. That performance last night has almost destroyed any benefit of the doubt I was willing to give. Is Jose trying to get fired? Are the players trying to get him fired?

I've been saying all season that I would give Jose time to get this right and I stand by that as I can't stand being a team that sacks managers after only one/ two seasons. But he is making it almost impossible to support him at the moment. I can forgive almost anything but a lack of desire and that was truly shocking last night. Almost like the players were saying to him, 'you want us to play like this? well this is what you get then. '

I am only praying that this was the night that the penny dropped with him and he will start to use them differently. Pressure from the players, the board, the fans. He is not an idiot - he MUST know that that wasn't good enough and that the fans will not stand for that.

Very interested to see the reaction in the next few games. An insanely optimistic response to last night might be to think that this is the game that finally sees a change in attitude. I just can't quite see it.

Agree3 Disagree1

14 Mar 2018 08:07:17
It's very rare nowadays that I get genuinely angry about a game football. However, last night was one of those rare occasions.

On Saturday with a few of my mates, I criticised Jurgen Klopp for never having a plan B. This is a criticism that can be generally be levelled at Come and Wenger as well. Rarely in his managerial career can that be levelled at Mourinho. Last night though, it can. If plan A was to be direct, quite deliberate in our passing and play up to Lukaku and Fellaini then fine. It's not the most enthralling but it is how Mourinho wants to set up and how he feels we can get success. When this doesn't work because Sevilla have smarter midfielders and defenders who can cope with a long ball unlike Liverpool, there has to be some other way of playing? The players looked lost last night and as much as Mourinho's tactics were poor, the players should also shoulder part of the blame. I get that Mourinho has his way of playing but when you as a £300k p/ w player can see it isn't working surely you can try something different? Surely, you aren't so terrified of a manager that you refuse to do anything other than what he says when what he has told you is extremely ineffective? Play quicker, maybe try to beat a man? Take some responsibility? Those moments need someone to realise the game isn't going the it should be and they go and make a difference. Think Keane vs Juve or Beckham vs Greece. Was it tactical genius that led to Keane grabbing a game by the balls and hauling United through? No. Was it tactical genius that led to Beckham haring all over the pitch doing the work of 3 men in the 3nd half then scoring a last minute free kick? No. It's big players making a difference.

I fully believe that United playing at 70% could have beaten Sevilla. They are an average side and everyone in the last 8 will be desperate to draw them. If we had gone out to Real Madrid or Barcelona playing this way, I would still be angry but I would understand the caution and the reasons for it. You want to ensure the likes of Messi, Suarez, Ronaldo and Bale are kept quiet. You don't think that about Luis Muriel, Joaquin Correa or Franco Vasquez.

Agree2 Disagree0

14 Mar 2018 08:06:44
I think everyone is in agreement that last night was a disaster and people are rightly blaming fellaini starting and poor tactics and attitude which I completely agree with but no one has mentioned de gea I thought he was at fault for the second goal which really put the fixture out of our reach.

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14 Mar 2018 09:36:05
I think de gea has a bank of credit with us so large that he can score own goals at will and still come out standing tall.

14 Mar 2018 09:47:40
Yeah De Gea is rubbish, hopefully we will sell him to Madrid for a nice sum in the summer and sign Butland, should really push us forward to winning the league and Champions League.

14 Mar 2018 07:26:58
And people where given poch and spurs a hard time last week?

180 minutes of football 4 shots on target .
Attacking intent 0
Any kind of fluidity 0
Need to look at the manager here. Can't keep shouting spend spend spend.

2 biggest let downs yesterday our 2 best players . Sanchez and pogba these are the players that when everyone described as world class.
Never mind martial isn't good enough etc Sanchez shouldn't be making the first 11 .

As for pogba on this form he is lucky we have injuries or he wouldn't be on the bench .

Make no mistake these 2 are top quality players but like a lot of our players and team they are no where near there potential.

That was an awful team performance last night against a team that are 27 points of the top of la liga .

Just look at the 2 games . 4 shots on target in 180 of football .
Never mind winning the champions league how much money does Jose need to beat Seville. Are they a great team? Full of star names etc .
Can't say we haven't got better players
Can't say we haven't spent more
Can't say we don't play more

To get beat over 2 legs in the way we did against not Munich or Barcelona but a pretty average team like Seville, the buck stops with the manager.

Agree7 Disagree3

14 Mar 2018 07:38:59
Cant disagree with much of that Jred- that was a cowardly, inept, embarrassing display last night after the first 15minutes. We could have conceded 5 last night and that's being kind.

Martial, Rashford, sanchez, lukaku, with mata, Pogba, lingard in behind looks devastating on paper, but absolute garbage on grass so something is way wrong somewhere.

No desire, no urgency. that becomes a disease. like an Arsenal, or a poor Chelsea or Dortmund in recent seasons. and that is a big big worry as it soon becomes the norm for a season or in Arsenals case a few seasons.

14 Mar 2018 07:42:40
He's so far out of touch with the way football is being played these days. City have bought proper skilful players in midfield and we're playing fellaini in there. I keep saying, until United get a manager who recognizes that midfield is where games are won and can control games, we have no chance. I would get Luis Enrique at United tomorrow and let him buy a bloody midfield. Get rid of smalling Jones fellaini and add proper full backs and at least two ball playing midfielders and a winger.
Apart from Lingard, non of our midfield want to drive the ball forward with pace.
Also, we're the 2nd from bottom in the PL in distance covered. Lazy Arse tactics as we drop deep as soon as we lose the ball instead of working hard at pressing high and winning the ball further up the field.
United is all about energy, attack, and wingers. We have non of those and we have a manager who is the opposite to what we stand for.
Anyone who plays fellaini and matic in the same team at home against Seville when we needed to win, is a f. king idiot and should not be managing United.

14 Mar 2018 07:55:17
At his best Jose took on Europe with Porto.
At the moment we can manage 4 shots on target and 1 goal in 180 minutes of football against Seville.
With players like lukaku Sanchez pogba and co .
Never mind the stick poch got on here for coming up short last week . Which is looking pretty stupid now .
Moyes would of been murdered for them 2 performances .

14 Mar 2018 07:58:47
That was reminiscent of how Chelsea with hazard and co where playing when they were 3 points above relegation .

2 shocking performances against Seville and there is no excuses.
No excuses why this team and squad have played like that in them 2 games .

14 Mar 2018 08:10:10
I think it's pretty clear why certain players have struggled and other have done well. It's as simple as how we set up.

Pogba and Sanchez get it in the neck more because they are our superstars and most talented players. The real issue they have is the same one that makes Lukaku, Rashford, Martial, Mata and to some extent Lingard have equally patchy performances.

Whereas, players like Smalling, Rojo, Jones, Valencia and Young have had improved performances.

Ernest up to defend, this aids our defenders while restricting our forward thinking players.

McTominay has done a very good job because he hasn't been asked to stretch teams but to restrict them, which is a far easier task.

Our best performers this season are those who's natural game aligns with Mourinho's favoured tactics.

Until Mourinho leaves we will never see the best of our considerably talented forward players. They are being starved of service then blamed for defeats knocking their confidence making it harder for them to be effective next time.

14 Mar 2018 08:25:43
Ok so I've woke up and I'm still fuming.

I still have no idea what the hell we witnessed last night.

We lacked the bravery and courage to play.

The tactics were bizarre. When I initially saw the team I fully expected Fellaini to sit next to Matic and play a similar role to Mctominay. I had my reservations about a lack of mobility but figured Jose wanted Fellaini's extra height for defending and attacking set pieces in such a precariously balanced and dangerous fixture.

Fellaini actually played in a more advanced role next to Lingard leaving Matic isolated AGAIN. The plan appeared to be hit the ball long to Fellaini and contest the knock downs and second balls. I can even live with this tactic if it brings success but Fellaini didn't win a header all night and was totally dominated by Nzonzi. This tactic resulted in us giving the ball away on numerous occasions with Fellaini, Lingard, Sanchez, Rashford and Lukaku all ahead of the ball leaving Matic and the defence isolated. It's no wonder Seville looked dangerous and were getting into advanced positions. We played the game last night without a midfield. Lingard is not a central midfielder. He roams all over the pitch, he has no positional discipline and doesn't understand the role. He try's hard but like Pogba doesn't see danger or track runners and he just looked totally lost.

The decision to switch Rashford to the right hand side was equally as baffling and I sat watching in anger and amazement at such draconian tactics.

We need Mata to link it all together and get us playing. Without him it's just headless chicken road runner type stuff.

The team and formation against Liverpool had a nice balance to it. It's possibly the first game since Sanchez arrived that we've actually looked like a team. We got ourselves in front then defended with skill and organisation. Everybody knew their role.

I'm absolutely convinced that if the same team had started the game last night we'd have sailed through.

I just didn't get the game play last night but more importantly neither did the players and we got what we deserved. If somebody could try and explain it to me I'd be grateful.

14 Mar 2018 09:18:51
Mou post match was outrageous.
So let's get used to mediocrity.
He needs to upgrade himself and make his players play real football or he may just leave us alone.

14 Mar 2018 09:40:45
Pogba was poor last night, but he came on when José’s tactics had already firmly handed control of the game to the opposition.

This is a bigger problem with how deep the team sits, the distance between attack and defence, and the emphasis placed on caution. In the Liverpool game we benefited from poor defending to gift us goals, but the team is not set up to do anything other than contain, and this has gotten worse throughout the season. We have a squad with some top class attacking players, but the shape of the team and emphasis on not conceding means that they are never going to show their best.

We can shrug, and say this is what you get with José. But it’s obvious that his approach just doesn’t cut it at the top level anymore, football has moved on and he looks increasingly stuck in the past.

14 Mar 2018 06:45:01
So having slept on it I don’t feel any better. My supportive post on Jose last week asked him to let the players play, sadly last night he reverted to type and did what we feared he would.

We were playing the team who are 5th on the Spanish League and we didn’t really attack or press them. There was clearly a huge fear they would score, our approach didn’t work did it?

I thought Jose’s comments after the match were outrageous, a shrug of the shoulders, these things happen, when a different selection or set up might have given us a completely different result. I take Ken’s point that some players are not good enough but I firmly believe our players are better than we are seeing. The issue last night was the set up, careful, tactical, defensive. 2 ponderous midfielders meant thee was little link up and we were dominated through the middle.

I’ve said if before, if Jose has a plan then I don’t see what is. Losing is one thing, losing like that is unacceptable.

Agree5 Disagree0

14 Mar 2018 06:58:58
I do agree it was a horrible performance and to show that level of nonchalance afterwards really twisted the knife.

14 Mar 2018 07:03:57
Those comments to me seemed like Mourinho's we will make it difficult for newcastle moment, if the man after spending 300mn asks us to get used to cowardice and mediocrity then something is really wrong, i have been critical of him but i have always wanted him backed in windows and given a chance but this for me is the last straw.

Mourinho plays rubbish dour football which is as bad lvg's or moysie's just with much more expensive players so the results aren't as bad, time to get rid as we didn't spend 300mn for boring defensive cup wins.

{Ed025's Note - boring defensive cup losses you mean CSM, out of the CL with a whimper and thats just not good enough for a club of united,s stature mate..

14 Mar 2018 07:17:47
We did win the europa league and mickey mouse cup last season ed and are still in the FA cup.

{Ed025's Note - thats true CSM, i was expecting more than being a mickey mouse cup team for a club of uniteds stature though mate..

14 Mar 2018 06:30:51
So having slept on it I don’t feel any better. My supportive post on Jose last week asked him to let the players play, sadly last night he reverted to type and did what we feared he would.

We were playing the team who are 5th on the Spanish League and we didn’t really attack or press them. There was clearly a huge fear they would score, our approach didn’t work did it?

I thought Jose’s comments after the match were outrageous, a shrug of the shoulders, these things happen, when a different selection or set up might have given us a completely different result. I take Ken’s point that some players are not good enough but I firmly believe our players are better than we are seeing. The issue last night was the set up, careful, tactical, defensive. 2 ponderous midfielders meant thee was little link up and we were dominated through the middle.

I’ve said if before, if Jose has a plan then I don’t see what is. Losing is one thing, losing like that is unacceptable.

{Ed025's Note - i agree AJH i have said all along hes not the man for united, he sets up his teams not to lose as opposed to win and thats just not the united way, for me he is a dinosaur and miles behind the likes of pep, poch and yes even klopp, football has moved on but he has not and we all know its not easy but i dont know how people still defend his anti-football philosophy, its not like he has had financial restraints and i believe the players are there but they are playing in handcuffs and not allowed to express themselves, this is not an "i told you so" rant but a real concern as to where the famous man utd is heading mate..

Agree1 Disagree0

14 Mar 2018 06:33:27
Wow, pressed send and then just read Lukaku’s comments that some players were hiding! All is not right in the camp it seems.

Agree1 Disagree0

14 Mar 2018 06:47:15

I posted last night long before I knew about his comments that I felt some players didn’t look comfortable under the pressure on the stage that is OT. They need to be found out and replaced.

{Ed025's Note - its not the players red man, get rid of the dinosaur in the dugout and the club can progress but until that happens be prepared for mediocrity mate..

14 Mar 2018 07:00:01
Taking cue from the manager ajh, when manager says to be thoroughly outplayed and beaten by dross like sevilla is something that is ok and something utd are used to, players aren't exactly going to be chomping at the bits to perform well are they.

14 Mar 2018 07:47:52
Agree fully with ed025 and csm. He is so out of touch with the way football should be played. He should go back to Italy where everyone wants to defend as they enjoy watching that kind of crap.

14 Mar 2018 09:25:50
Lukaku meant the players have their heads down in the dressing room not that they were hiding on the pitch, he clarified this later in the interview, just a language thing.

14 Mar 2018 09:56:28
Ed 025
very rarely disagree with any of the eds but it is the players also.
Pogba came on and gave the ball away in a dangerous position 1st touch, sanchez : say no more the rest of the team look disjointed and lethargic with flourishes from some but in general, and not usually someone who refers to stats but we are the lower end of mobile in the premiership in terms of workrate! The shower last nite epitomised the JM way and basically his way has been shown to be outdated and sussed out by other teams. We are not the force we were and are quite a way off with a very possible danger of turning into an arsenal or pool if we don't get on the right tracks soon. We will probably be linked with a 100m bid for sevilles goalscorer last nite as well as every other player that wants an improved contract or last big deal but we really need to get in players who want to turn up and play: that will make them stars and man utd worthy of the jersey, but more importantly, put the club back to where it is competitive again.

{Ed025's Note - he was a good manager once cooky but has not moved with the times, the likes of pep, poch and klopp play expansive attacking football which is great to watch and im afraid united is a borefest, it does not take brains to buy players for £100m and pay them mega bucks mate give me a good team player who plays with his heart every day, i hope united ditch him and get a manager befitting of the great club united are because the EPL needs a strong united..


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