Manchester United banter 5

10 Apr 2024 07:39:08
{Ed's Note - Ed001 has posted a new article entitled, Manchester United v Liverpool - A Quick Liverpool Perspective

10 Apr 2024 14:18:02
Ed001 - Fair assessment and even though Liverpool are an infinitely better team this season Utd do have individuals capable of moments of class if you don’t put them away!

it’s ridiculous to me that a Liverpool fan can diagnose our problems more clearly than some of our own supporters.

Many claim EtH doesn’t have a style of play but it’s obvious he wants to play a higher defensive line and press aggressively from the front. He wants to transition quickly, winning the ball high up the pitch. He also wants to try and dominate the ball in the final third that’s why he pushes so many players forward, trying to create overloads in attacking areas.

He bought a ball playing GK during the summer and whilst not perfect, Varane and Martinez can push that defensive line further forward. Martinez is also fantastic on the ball. He wanted KMJ in the summer, he probably knew Varane would get injured at some point but couldn’t have predicted he’d lose Martinez and Shaw for most of the season.

We obviously have a huge problem because none of the CB’s have the courage or pace to push that line higher, they drop deeper as the forwards press leaving a massive hole in midfield. Casemiro doesn’t have the fitness, mobility or pace to plug the gaps. In addition Rashford is a terrible presser and Bruno is often positionally indisciplined and has a tendency to jump out of position and press on his own making it incredibly easy for the opposition to progress the ball forward.

EtH has been left exposed by incompetent decision makers and negotiators that have outrageously overspent on several deals and failed to move players out. He’s also missed out on several key targets paramount to his philosophy.

Supporters must decide what they want. If they want to see more adventurous, modern football, this cannot be achieved over night especially with the majority of these players.

EtH could stop the team conceding shots over night. It’s not difficult and doesn’t take a tactical genius. Abort the high press, allow the opposition possession in their half, drop the team deeper and get players behind the ball.

The only way to implement a new style is to expose the players that can’t play the system and move them on. This is a process.

If Ineos don’t have the appetite to move most of these players on maybe a more pragmatic manager like Southgate makes sense. Drop deeper, with two holding midfielders and play percentage football. That would certainly suit the likes of Maguire, Lindelof, Evans, AWB, Casemiro, Mctominay, Bruno and Rashford but is that went we really want?

How do we want to play? Maybe that’s the most important decision Ineos have to make.

{Ed001's Note - thank you DLIB.}

10 Apr 2024 15:52:09
Good posts both and spot on IMO.

10 Apr 2024 16:15:49
Ed001 be interested in your view on Elliott's pen, whilst in full speed I 100% thought it was a pen when you watch the replay it seems Elliot wasn't contacted then initiated contact. a lot more subtly then sake. For me incidents like that and the dalot incident against Chelsea are exactly what var is for something that looked a certain pen but when looked at properly it isn't. I agree on Casemiro think he got away with it as it was so late in the game and he got some of the ball.

{Ed001's Note - I don't know on the Elliott one. At first I thought it wasn't, but then it depends on the angle it is viewed from as to what you see. But I would say at most it is soft, so wouldn't have complained if it wasn't given. It does look from some angles like Elliott initiated contact but in others it looks like he just got caught with a follow through. It really is impossible to know what is or isn't a pen these days. Look at the Mac Allister incident with the high boot as he was bursting into the box. If that is not a pen then I have no idea what is. So I just give up on trying to understand the laws of the game now as it seems the referees just makes it up as they go along.}

10 Apr 2024 17:12:31
Ed1 and DLIB - absolutely spot on. Great posts.

I know which camp I’m in for style of play. If I’m INEOS, rip it all up and get rid of the squad. I’d give ETH a chance, but don’t think he’ll get it.

10 Apr 2024 18:07:33
Great Post DLIB. I give credit to ETH for sticking with the high press when he is under such pressure to shore up and get results. I know not everyone will agree with that though.

10 Apr 2024 18:10:22
Definitely get rid of most of the squad.

But ETH has to adapt his tactics to suit the reality of what he has available.

10 Apr 2024 18:30:11
Interesting read. ETh was berating the defense when i was at the FA cup games againt liverpool to move up.

When you watch us all it takes is one dropping off the rest of the line has no choice to but drop back. Its nothing new and we have not played high up the pitch with our cb since vidic legs went.

When we decide to defend we defend in a low block, which brings its won issues and hard to do for prolonged periods without someone making a mistake.

10 Apr 2024 21:00:24
Great post Ed and equally good points DLIB. It's refreshing to see constructive discussion regarding the style of play and tactics rather than the usual ETH bash and debate we see.

I agree Ahmad, I think ETH wants us to play high but the defence always seems to drop off. Maybe it's to compensate for a lack of pace. But it's clear to see we aren't compact between defence and the midfield which is why teams have been able to play through us so easily. There is so much space.

10 Apr 2024 21:15:14
One additional thing that concerns me though is how bad we are at set pieces and in the air. We are so vulnerable at corners and free kicks. Why?

{Ed001's Note - maybe a lack of specialist coaching? Though a lot of it can simply be down to a lack of players actually attacking a ball played in.}

10 Apr 2024 22:00:07
Whilst I agree with a lot of what has been said I still think that Erik is culpable for a lot of what is happening.

If he is implementing a style of play and players are not conforming to that then why is he picking them? Why does he say we played well if they are not conforming to his style of play?

Plus he still rewards mediocrity by picking certain players who continually underperform and show little or no desire.

I spent a long time on the pro ETH bandwagon until recently when I have concerns over his ability to succeed and he is not doing a lot to pull me back onto it.

I would be happy if he stays but equally not too bothered if he goes. That’s kinda where a lot of people are I suspect.

10 Apr 2024 23:08:28
How do you think the senior team at utd would respond to rashford being dropped due to poor performance? Do you think EtH can drop bruno for mount? I wonder sometimes if he is free to make these decisions or not.

11 Apr 2024 08:59:16
Surely during the interview stage these are the things that any coach worth their salt are going to insist on. Will I have complete control over team selection? You read these stories on clubs where the president of the club gets to choose the team, like his plaything. Surely no club can run like that.

09 Apr 2024 16:25:02
Think Willy Kambala can be just as good if not better that Bratwaith, him and Licha have speed and bit of aggression about them. Hopefully Maguire, Lindelof, Varane will be sold, Evans released, so another young CB, maybe the lad from Nice. More money for a top midfielder, when Casemero, Ericsen Sancho, DVB are sold on. Then we had
Get rid of Martial too, plenty to leave, freeing lots of wages.

{Ed025's Note - i may be biased Recon but i dont think Kambala is anywhere near the standard of Branthwaite at this point but he certainly has potential mate..

09 Apr 2024 17:22:26
Kambwala looked assured and cleanly has all the tools to be a great CB, but it's far too soon to be measuring him up against someone like Branthwaite who has spent a year abroad and was one of the best CB's in the Eredivisie last season. He then came back to Everton this season and has been one of the best CB's in the EPL this season, certainly the best CB aged 21 or younger.

He has everything you'd want in a CB and he's putting it together and performing every week. Strong, quick, mobile, intelligent, great reading of the game, technically sound, great in the air.

I'd genuinely struggle to find a significant weakness in his game, obviously there is room for improvement, but there is nothing he really struggles with.

Give him a couple of years and he'll easily be the best English CB around. He's also left footed, which is a rare commodity for a CB.

I'd easily have him as our top CB target this summer, he'd nail down a starting spot with us probably for the next decade.

I think Kambwala will be a very good CB, and I'd either keep him as our 4th choice option next season or send him out on loan to play regularly.

For me Branthwaite and another (probably Todibo) should be the first two signings we make this summer. Sort the defence out and have something to build on for the next 3-5 years at least.

{Ed025's Note - he would be a great signing for Utd Shappy, the guy is class mate and with us having to sell before the 30th of June because of our commitment to PSR he may be a bit cheaper than you think..

09 Apr 2024 18:53:21
Ed025, you have a real gem of a player in Branthwaite, it's a shame you probably won't be able to keep hold of him for as long as most Toffees would like. Also that he'll probably go for less than he should given Everton's financial issues.

I think he should be United's first signing this summer, I can see a deal for something like 45m originally with 10-15m in add-ons. It won't be anywhere near the 70m being banded about in the press as I don't think there will be a massive amount of competition for him.

Liverpool can't really buy a player from Everton. Arsenal have no need with Saliba and Gabriel clearly first choice. City have the funds, but don't really have a need to spend big on a left footed CB having bought Gvardiol and Ake over the last few summers. Chelsea have bought Badiashile, Fofana and Disasi over the past couple of years, while also having Colwill and Chalobah. Which really just leaves us and Newcastle. Newcastle also have a few PSR issues and might need to sell to buy anyone for a significant fee. Which barring City just going crazy and buying a third left footed CB (which I wouldn't totally rule out) means United will have a fairly clear run at Branthwaite.

Which is utterly crazy given the talent and the potential of the lad.

Him, Mainoo and Højlund would give United a solid spine for the next decade. Get another CB and a top class CDM (both in their early to mid twenties with a few years top level experience) and United will have the base of a potentially great side.

We also have some really talented young academy lads who if nurtured well could become really top class players. It's been a pretty tough decade as a United supporter, but green shoots are starting to spring up. We aren't back yet, but we do seem to be starting to put the building blocks in place for a return to the top.

{Ed025's Note - i think he will go Shappy and possibly to United, but i feel it will be around £60m mate, we need to get £80-90m in sales before the end of june to satisfy PSR but i hope we dont get railroaded to sell on the cheap, you do have some fine young players and Jarrad would certainly enhance the United side but i still think you need to get rid of some dross you have before you can become competitive i feel..

09 Apr 2024 19:09:42
I'm really struggling to see what others are seeing in Branthwaite. Each time I've watched him I've seen a defender constantly on the floor. The last time being the fixture against Newcastle when he made a feeble attempt to tackle Isak, ended up on the floor again, and at fault for the goal.

I think he's had a poor season. Likely I'm in the minority here, and happy to be proved wrong, I just haven't caught him on a good day and Everton fans are far better positioned then me to pass judgement.

As for being one of the best CBs in the PL this season, not from what I've seen. Struggling to find a weakness? Going to ground too easily is certainly one.

{Ed025's Note - maybe you have not seen the best of him Wazza, yes he got done by Isak but hes young and bound to make the odd mistake, but let me tell you this mate the guy is excellent and whoever gets him will be getting a top top player who will improve even further and become a top international imo..

09 Apr 2024 19:42:48
Fair enough Ed like I say I haven't seen much of him, but when I have, he spent too much time on the floor for my liking. I'm sure I'm in the minority and will come round eventually, perhaps I've caught him on a couple of off days.

I'm not sure if the figures in the newspapers are true as they rarely are, but it sounds like there's a deal to be done for interested parties. I would assume if he's got that much potential we won't be the only club after his signature either.

{Ed025's Note - you certainly wont Wazza, but as Shappy pointed out you seem the right fit because most of the teams who can afford him already have decent options already on their books mate..

09 Apr 2024 20:35:16
One game. I remember Tuanzebe having a stormer against PSG and looked what happened to him. Willy had a great game, but it's just 1 game.

09 Apr 2024 21:10:54
He may well turn out to be a top top player but he is some way off that right now. Positional awareness not always that good and can be turned fairly easily. He is young and playing in a position where traditionally late 20s and early 30s is when defenders are really mature. Can Utd afford to wait for two or three years whilst he progresses?

09 Apr 2024 23:29:51
Salford I think that's exactly the sort of player we need to be looking at. Players that can peak in 2 years time.
Of course we can't ignore the here and now but when you look back at our cb signing over the years lots of huge fees at the time but very rarely the finished article.
Pallister stam Ronnie Johnson, rio vidic. We did spend big money on some flops too I'll grant you.
But in the main I would like to see younger hungry players that can grow together and a cb like him could be a regular fot the next 10 years.

10 Apr 2024 00:10:33
Not seeing the Branthwaite love-in myself. I admit I haven't watched Everton a huge amount but on a few occasions I have he's been well done more than once. But I get that his profile ie age, nationality make him appealing to a side looking to the future.
Common sense suggests we are not going to go nuts and simply clear out all of Maguire, Varane, Evans and Lindelof. We need at least 5 CBs. The debate for me should be which of Maguire or Varane go. There's this misconception that Varane is always injured, yet he's started more Prem games than any of those names. But he'll be earning more too and command a reasonable fee, and would be in demand.
I still get the shivers from SFA waxing lyrical over Phil Jones upon signing him from Blackburn. A future England and Utd captain, he said.

10 Apr 2024 02:10:41
Branthwaite would be decent. He poses the qualities of Maguire and Stone without their weaknesses.

{Ed001's Note - that is not quite true, he does have some weaknesses. He can be rash, his positioning can be suspect at times and he lacks a burst of pace to keep up with quick forwards. I don't mean he is slow, he is no slouch, but he can't accelerate as quickly as the forwards he faces most weeks. Very good player, but he needs a guiding hand alongside him still.}

10 Apr 2024 02:31:38
Is varane put of contract at the end of the year? If so I think we have option to extend, but not for a sale value, only to use him. So if he goes I think we get no fee, but save $300k a week in wages. McGuire is on over $200k a week, but would have a sales value. McGuire also doesn't fit the style of football we want to play. Maybe everton could take McGuire and give us braithwait?! ?.

10 Apr 2024 08:22:18
Where and why has this fashion come from? "Top top player". It's nonsense speak. Much like starting a sentence with, "So". Or ordering in a bar or restaurant, "Can I get. ".
Meh. I'm old, leave me alone. ?.

10 Apr 2024 08:22:22
Braithwaite has a really high ceiling he is really highly regarded by a lot of people and I totally agree that his season abroad accelerated his development. Still not the finished article but well ahead of the curve for a young cb.

@ ajh,
I'd like to see willy play from now till the end of the season. Varane is on his way so use if we need to but I'd like to see will given the opportunity to play his way into next season squad as cb no 3 or 4 or a game or 2 at rb to see how he gets on. I liked a lot of what I've seen so far from him. Strong in the tackle, brave on the ball, quick and eager to give everything he has in the tank. Confidence is not lacking in him either. Tuanzebe your right never quite made it always injured and perhaps struggled to deal with the mental side of the game.

Martinez is one of my favourite players out of the current squad but he can't stay fit for one reason or another and with the way he plays he and be missing games so it's essential that we have better cover at cb. 2 in 3 (varane Evans maguire) out ideally for me . Lindelof might hang around as we have taken the option of next season so he will leave for free at the end of next season. Martinez 2 new guys willy and lindelof would be deep enough.

New guys? I see names linked all the time and I know little about most of them but Braithwaite is one I'd love to see come in. Hard to see where the money will come from to get the fixes done.
Outside of mainoo we have no midfield at all. Cas erikson vdb hannibal amrabat all likely to leave. Leaving mainoo mount Bruno and mctom. 2 cm needed there.
200m for 2 cb and 2 cm that's brie you get to the attack or address the full back spots.

If Greenwood maguire cas vdb fernandez ericksen hannibal pellistri bring in 100m between them all be doing well. AWB mctom Bruno rashford are all players that could be sold generating profit on their book values (Greenwood and maguire fall into that category too) I would not be surprised to see one or more of those 4 sold.

Varane Evans amrabat Heaton all out of contract 500k pw saved on wages there it will take some time to get the hideous costs under control. I see credit cards and chauffeur cars withdrawn from the execs in 18 months time the running of the football side of the club will be unrecognisable and I mean that in a good way.
The holiday camp is closing down we are starting on the road to excellence we are at the bottom of the hill however with some really good youth players coming through I feel very confident for the future. Immediate term will be rocky perhaps but that's OK as long as we are making ground. I'm very confident that once we build some good momentum we will make big strides.

10 Apr 2024 13:03:59
I would love to see Kambwala get a proper run of games until the end of the season. We won't know just how good he is until he's given a chance, just like Braithwaite got at Everton.
Just look how Mainoo has evolved just because he was given a chance due to our injuries in midfield. Now he's the first name on the team sheet every week.
He's exactly what we need at the moment, fast, aggressive, 100% commitment in every thing he does and so what if he makes the odd mistake. Your learn from your mistakes.
On his last performance he should start at Bournemouth on Saturday.

10 Apr 2024 17:29:12
Fizz, I feel you, mate. Especially the 'so' thing ?.

11 Apr 2024 08:03:46
It is very irritating Noucamp.

11 Apr 2024 12:07:59
Nonsense speak? What does that mean I think there is a grammatical error there in that phrase. Particularly when referring to a written word.
Top top post.

09 Apr 2024 16:22:27


Shappy has written an article entitled, The Entire Manchester United defence needs to be rebuilt

09 Apr 2024 18:04:03
Shappy - Some supporters often talked about a ball playing GK being transformative last summer but I’ve always been of the opinion we needed at least two new CB’s.

I was absolutely gutted when we lost out on Kim Min-Jae. How you can go from him to Evans is mind blowing, two completely different types of CB. I’m not having a go at Evans, he’s done very well, but hardly the type of CB the Club needed if you want to play a higher defensive line.

If we want to play modern football we’ve simply got to get that defensive line higher. That’s a non negotiable. We need two physical, aggressive, mobile, fast CB’s that will allow us to push that defensive line 10-15 meters further forward and condense the space in midfield. They must also be comfortable on the ball.

The type of CB’s at the Club must change. Maguire, Evans and Lindelof just aren’t mobile or quick enough. It’s time they were all moved on.

We need a new No6, a mobile, aggressive, ball winner also comfortable on the ball and press resistant.

We obviously need a new CF. I often wonder if Hoijlund was the right choice of CF considering the way we play. Would a false 9 type be a better choice. Someone to drop off the front, a good dribble and passer, someone that could look to feed our wingers making runs in behind, whilst also allowing us to keep the ball better? We don’t really create chances for our No9, I expect Rashford, Anthony and obviously Garnacho to all be here next season so I don’t really see that changing. Maybe something a bit different to Hoijlund might give more options to the team.

Two new CB’s, a new No6, new CF, then a new LB.

09 Apr 2024 18:24:33
Thanks for taking the time to write this Shappy.

I agree with most of the article:

Maguire and Lindelof need to move on while they can still command a fee (and lower the wage bill)

Varane and Evans will leave for free

I think Martinez will stay, so long as he gets more protection from midfield. Still many doubts about his fitness and suitability for the highly-physical Premier league (woukd be amazing in a less physical league) . So, depending on what doctors think, maybe he might go as chance he’ll never recover to be the player he was last season.

Dalot will probably stay. Think AWB will be sold - not good enough for United.

Shaw’s injury record a huge concern, but maybe Shaw and Malacia can be rotated until Harry Amass bulks up a bit.

Thus only guaranteed remainder will be Kwambala, who probably needs a loan in a less demanding league for a season.

Possible defence next year:

Goalkeeper:

Onana
Patrick Schulte
Ben Mee

Left-back:

Shaw
Malacia
Amass

Right-back:

Dalot
+ incoming (Denzel Dumfries? )

Centre Back:

Kwambala
Possibly Martinez, depending on medical assessments
Incoming? (Branthwaite, Todibo, Silva, Inacio? )

As an aside, wondering if anyone with knowledge of the youth teams knows who the next break through youngsters might be? Obviously lots of excitement about Lacey, Ibragimov, etc, but seem a bit young at 16 years old.

Wondering if anyone has any insights who might be the next youngsters fast-tracked into first team contention?

09 Apr 2024 19:24:15
DLIB, I actually think Onana has had a very understated impact on the team. He's done much better than most give him credit for and unfortunately he needs more technically sound defenders who can receive a pass under pressure turn and move the ball forward.

Kim Min-Jae would have been a phenomenal and transformational signing for us last year. Unfortunately when we've been as far off the pace as we have been it will be tough to compete with the likes of Bayern Munich for top players.

As for Højlund I think he's been a very good signing, and to be honest I didn't see anyone else on the market who would have been better other than Kane. Yet we all know Kane would have cost us 40m more than he cost Bayern, that's if he would even want to join us over the Bravarians.

Osimhen for me will flop in the EPL, and there are so few other proven strikers. Maybe in hindsight we should have gone for Gyökeres, but could you imagine the fan backlash if we tried to sign a striker from Coventry for a big fee?

Højlund will be a great player for us, we just need to start playing for him. We have too many greedy wide players who would rather shoot themselves then give someone else a better chance.

Personally I think the striker signing is probably the hardest to get right this summer. We need someone who is good enough, can challenge/ rotate with Højlund but won't cost the earth. If they are capable of playing in the wide positions as well then that would be a huge bonus as I can't see us signing all the defenders and midfielders we need then signing a ST and a winger. One who I think could be a really smart signing if we can get him for the right price is Bryan Mbeumo from Brentford.

He's the really good EPL level player, has some room for growth and can play right across the front line. For 40-50m he'd be a really smart signing, unfortunately I doubt we could get him for that price. Openda has had a breakout season at Leipzig, but again would cost a fortune. Jonathan David could be an option, can play across the front line, and might be a little cheaper than some other options. Another who could be an interesting and potentially cheaper option is Terem Moffi from SJR's Nice. He's at that same stage Openda was at last year, done well in Ligue 1, however top clubs aren't quite yet convinced to sign him and he might need a year or two at a stepping stone club before a top side comes in and spends big on him.

Which means we might be able to get him for around 30m this summer, which if he kicks on would be a steal in the current market. But we might need to take more of a gamble on a forward as established ones have a starting price of 50m and EPL proven ones probably starting at 60-70m.

The No.6 position is so key as well as that position unlocks the whole team, they shield the defence, and allow the other midfielders to play to the best of their ability. For me I can't see past Florentino Luis, he'd be expensive, but I don't see a better option out there. His all round game and proven ability in being the foil for midfield partners like Enzo Fernandez and now João Neves makes me think just how good could Mainoo be alongside him.

Athletic, quick, mobile, aggressive, technical, with a top level passing range. For me Florentino is the guy who could get closest to Rodri as the best CDM in the world. 24 years old, 25 at the start of next season, just starting to enter his prime and has a great amount of top level European experience. He could be the guy to guide Kobbie and give him the license to get forward more often, and we've all seen what he can do when he's around the opposition's penalty area.

Dream summer for me probably looks something like Branthwaite, Todibo, Ait-Nouri, Florentino Luis and Bryan Mbeumo.

Three EPL proven players ready to step up a level, plus two great players with a good level of experience and just starting ot enter their prime from the continent.

Rebuilds the defence, solidifies the midfield and offer flexibility and quality in attack. The list might not be flashy as some might like, but all 5 in my opinion massively upgrade us and with a limited chance of them flopping.

09 Apr 2024 19:27:36
Wallace, I agree that AWB isn't good enough, but I can't see us replacing him this summer. Given that Shaw and Malacia have been out pretty much the entire season and we cannot even be sure they will be back for pre-season means we have to sign a LB this summer. I'd love for Amass to be ready, but as talented as he is I'd be stunned if he really was ready to play EPL football, he's only just turned 17. Literally only a handful of players have ever been ready to play EPL football before they were 18.

Two CB's for me is an absolute must, Branthwaite being my preferred top target, along with someone like Todibo.

09 Apr 2024 22:35:30
Like I said in an earlier post, new back 4 and a real No6. All of a sudden we’re back in the game.

Our defence is awful - Maguire, AWB, Linekof are all not right for our style of play. Varane is always out, and sadly Martinez is crocked too. Wonder if we played him as our 6 next season?

10 Apr 2024 00:12:14
Again, 'Varane is always out'. he's our most played CB in the league!

{Ed001's Note - that's not a fair stat to use as it is skewed. You seem to forget that he is the first choice, so he goes straight into the team when fit, while others that you are comparing him with might well sit on the bench for weeks while fully fit and available. How many of his appearances has he actually been fully fit for?}

10 Apr 2024 02:25:36
Branthwaite, Todibo, Ait-Nouri, Florentino Luis and Bryan Mbeumo.

Plus a backup GK and Frimpong.

Perfect window.

Shappy what do you think the outs will look like?

10 Apr 2024 03:03:13
Shappy

I'd be shocked if we got Branthwaite, Todibo and Ait-Nouri in one window.
Ait-Nouri will likely cost over £50m, Branthwaite £60-70m, Todibo maybe £40m.
That's a potential outlay of £150-160m in one summer for three defenders, I'd be stunned if that happened.

The consensus is that this summer we'll also need a CDM and a CF - that'll surely be another £100m+.

SJR is expected to bring a level of nous and shrewdness we've been starved of for many years.
I doubt very much that he'd consider paying over £250m on 5 players unless he can raise at least half that figure through sales.
Greenwood and Sancho could be easy sales, Casemiro would be, Rashford could be if PSG were serious.

Like yourself, I'd rather keep Maguire than Lindelof.
I know the latter has a little more finesse, but he's hardly Varane and possesses not a single standout attribute. He also makes Onana look uneasy by staying too close or moving to foolish areas that draw the press because he's scared of receiving the ball under pressure.
Maguire, for all his faults, never goes missing and can occasionally slip into a beast-mode level of physicality that few CBs in the PL could dream of.

Nice optimistic post mate.

10 Apr 2024 06:03:59
Be good to see how many games Varane finishes too. He can’t be trolled on as the back e if our defence. Time to go.

Ork - I agree if we have to keep one. Ideally I’d ship both out as neither good enough, but Lindelof needs to move to Italy where he’ll have a fine career. He gets bullied in the Premier Leagie, has little pace, and is prone to switch off too many times.

10 Apr 2024 08:03:09
Lots of good posts all.
It is tough to know who we will bring in as in reality we have potential holes and questions all over the park.
Defence definitely needs addressing in all positions but I doubt we will do that all in one go. CB is key and depending on how Martinez injuries look I expect us to bring in a top end player as well as someone younger with development. I would allow that second player along with Kambawala get some decent minutes next year. Right back can wait, whilst AWB is top quality is his good enough for year 1 of the new rebuild. Left back is more important and we can't go through another seasob like we have done. Shaw/ Malacia need more cover or replacement even if they both stay. Shaw/ Martinez if fit are able to cover the 2 positions so that would be a bonus next year.

Other than that we need Holding midfielder/ second striker as well as right winger depending on what happens with Rashford/ Antony once the hierachy is finalised/ potential new manager.

Probably all too much in one window so get a few key ones done, keep bringing through from the youth, clear out the dead wood and then go again in the next 2 windows.

10 Apr 2024 08:48:35
I think there is a stat around somewhere that varane and Evan's have been the most available ed. Evan's clearly not first choice these days, although we would have been screwed without him.

McGuire, martinez, lindelof and Shaw have all been unavailable for far more games.

Kambawala I'm not sure, and possibly he was available more but not first choice, as you say.

The real question is McGuire or varane. Often fitness is given as a reason to select McGuire, who over the course of his season has had a pretty good fitness record. Varane is more money, but younger and better and enables a higher line.

The brave choice is get rid of both and bring in the new. Can't see Ineos doing that though!

10 Apr 2024 11:52:19
Eric, I wouldn’t paly Martinez as a No.6 and I doubt EtH would either as he moved him from midfield to defence because he wasn’t dynamic enough to play in midfield in the Eredivisie. The idea that he’d then be good in the far more dynamic cut and thrust of the EPL midfield seems a bit of a stretch.

Spenno, while Varane isn’t quite at the same level as Phil “the crock” Jones in terms of injuries, he isn’t someone you’d bet your house on being fit and available for all the remaining games this season. He’s also out of contract in the summer and will only stay of he has assurances of being first choice. Which given that he struggles to play 180 minutes a week for a sustained period is just something we can’t promise. Let him go this some and bring in someone who suits how we want to play, is young enough to be a fixture for the next 5 years and someone who’ll be fit most of the time.

Ork, I’d be very surprised if we didn’t sign at least 5 players this summer. We are in the unfortunate position of being in need of players in multiple positions regardless of where we might lack quality. At centre back we will see both Varane and Evans leave on free transfers. Martinez is an injury concern having missed pretty much this entire season and the last couple of months of last season. Which leaves Lindelof and Maguire (neither good enough), both of which could leave this summer, and the young lad Kambwala. We need a minimum of two CB’s this summer and would be surprised if we signed less than two.
We’ve also spent the majority of this season without a special-ist LB, Shaw continues to struggle to stay fit, while Malacia is having an injury nightmare. Neither are guaranteed to be fit and ready for the start of next season, in fact its likely that at least one if not both won’t be fully ready for the start of next season. We will need to bring in a quality LB option.
Casemiro is declining and is our only special-ist defensive midfielder, he also could leave this summer. Therefore, we need at least one signing here, ideally two. I’d expect to see one CDM sign then either Casemiro stays another year, or he leaves and someone like Dan Gore is promoted to be a squad option.
Either way we are now at for signings, and this is before we address the issue of only having one striker in the squad (Martial will be on his bike this summer) . This is actually the hardest area to recruit this summer in my opinion. There are several reasons for this, from the typically high costs of forwards (and our limited budget to sign one), to the fact that there are very few great or even potentially great forwards available making it a very competitive market.
Finally, there is the chance that Bayindir might leave this summer, in which case another back up keeper will be required. This might be the 6th and probably final signing I see us making.
There are arguments that we need to upgrade RB, and they are valid. But I expect we’ll keep Dalot as first choice and AWB as back up next season. Likewise, there are valid arguments that we need another wide player, especially with Sancho and Greenwood almost certain to leave. Yet its highly unlikely we will sell Rashford due to there being no one who can afford him and his wages. He is a conundrum, as on form he is one of the best forwards in the league, we just need to work out how to get him back into form. Garnacho for me has nailed down the right-hand side position as his spot for the next couple of years. Long-term I expect he’ll switch back to the left-hand side, yet currently playing on the right is forcing him to play with his head up more and that is helping develop him into a far more rounded threat. He needs to stay there for at least another season or two. If both are on form, then we have more than good enough first choice wide options. The issue is that the quality in depth is questionable in Antony and Amad. The realistic solution is signing a forward who can primarily be back up for Hojlund, but also a rotation option on both flanks. The only other choice might be playing Mount wide at times (something he’s shown he can do to a high level at Chelsea) .
In terms of raising funds, I think we can easily raise 100m through sales, maybe more depending on who we sell. We will also massively slash the wage bill this summer which will help with PSR. Finally new owners are permitted to make a financial investment into the club in their first year, this can be used on signings if the club want. Which means the new owners have one chance this summer to boost the transfer kitty if they want, which I expect they will.

Utd Road, I think the outs will look a little like this:

Williams, Alvaro Fernandez, Donny, Pellistri, Hannibal, Shoretire, Greenwood and Sancho will all be sold, raising probably around 100m (60-70m for Greenwood and Sancho, 30-40m for the other 6 at around 5-10m each) .
Those eight will be joined by Heaton, Evans, Varane and Martial all leaving on free transfers. While Amrabat’s loan will not be made into a permanent deal.
Which means that’s 13 players leaving, raising around 100m and saving about 78m a year on wages. None bar Varane have played significant minutes or been a real contributor to the club this season.
We then have a list of players who could leave either because they want first team football, or because the club have received decent offers for them.
Bayindir may want to leave to play first team football. If he does it’ll be a minimal fee and the club will have to find a replacement.
I’d expect one of Lindelof or Maguire to leave, but not both. Neither are good enough to be first choice, but both have some qualities as a back up 4th choice CB. Really, it’s a flip of a coin over who stays and who goes. It most likely depends on what offers we receive.
Casemiro could well leave, he is declining and on a massive salary. The club could be caught in a situation where if they don’t sell him this summer and he struggles again next season or even declines further then there won’t be any takers for him in 2025 and the club might be forced to keep him until the end of his contract. He wants to play regular football, and if we buy a first choice No.6 this summer, he will be a back up player to them. SJR has bee outspoken in his criticism of signing Casemiro, which suggests he will be on his way this summer.
Eriksen could leave to play regular football, as could McTominay. Again, I’d expect only one of them to go and not both. This could go either way. Eriksen is technically the better player, yet its McTominay whose had the bigger impact. Eriksen would only raise a nominal fee, whereas McTominay would bring in a decent fee (20-30m maybe) .
Outside chance that Amad pushes to leave, but I’d expect the club to resist a sale given the lack of depth in wide positions.
Players like Antony, Bruno and Rashford who certain sections of the fan base want sold won’t be sold this summer in my opinion. Either because they are just too important (even if not in great form) or because the club will lose too much money, or because they is no interest from clubs wanting to buy them.
So, on top of the 13 leaving (Williams, Alvaro Fernandez, Donny, Pellistri, Hannibal, Shoretire, Greenwood, Sancho, Heaton, Evans, Varane, Martial and Amrabat), I’d imagine Casemiro will leave, maybe bringing in a 20-25m fee maybe. My preference would be for Maguire and McTominay as they would help raise another 40-50m between them, and I feel Lindelof and Eriksen are the better players. Yet I get the feeling it will be Lindelof and Eriksen who leave maybe bringing in 15-20m at most. Which to be fair Maguire and McTominay have contributed more this season, so I wouldn’t be against that. They just have to be squad player’s next season. Amad will stay in my opinion, while Bayindir will leave and be replaced with someone like Patrick Schulte if the current rumours are anything to go by.

10 Apr 2024 11:52:24
I don’t see why not dodgy. Just depends who the new coach will be and how they may fit into our new style.

Ps I’m fully expecting ETH to go now based on Ed2’s comments. Potter, de Zerbi or Nagelsman it is.

10 Apr 2024 12:04:14
Varane is out of contract and leaving in the summer DB.

09 Apr 2024 12:36:41
Branthwaite for £70m now apparently.

I think that's about right, any takers?

09 Apr 2024 13:16:47
lol. Any other nationality and it's halved.

09 Apr 2024 13:29:06
Havent seen enough of him, everyone was raving about the lad at Wolves 2 seasons ago now at Brentford supposed to be the next big thing, he hasn't set the world light =70 mill is a lot of money.

Although I still say I would go with a front line of Rashford (reluctantly or Another) Diallo, Hojland Garnacho, Antony (reluctantly) if it meant spashing our budget after sales on 2 top Centre halfs and a quality defensive midfielder. not ideal but in short term that would improve us before we look at other areas.

This is where the new regime have to show what they can do regarding recruitment.

09 Apr 2024 13:29:41
There's a reason Everton have the 4th lowest goals conceded in the league.

09 Apr 2024 13:32:59
I’d pay about three fiddy.

09 Apr 2024 13:48:14
I would sign him in a heartbeat. He has everything we need in a CB, strong, good in the air, quick, mobile, good on the ball, great defensive instincts and reading of the game, communicates well and shown some potential leadership qualities.

He's also young and English and its good to have a few of those at the core of your side, and he has the talent and the ability to be first choice for the next decade.

You look at Liverpool and they have had Henderson, TAA, and Robertson (British) who have been core first team players, along with the likes of Gomez, Jones, Bradley, Elliott in and around the first team.

City have had Stones, Walker, Foden, Grealish, Sterling, and Rico Lewis in and around the first team.

Arsenal have White, Ramsdale, Rice, Saka, Smith-Rowe, and Nketiah in and around their first team.

While Newcastle have recruited a core of British players since their takeover, Gordon, Trippier, Burn, Livramento, Barnes, Wilson, Pope, Hall, Targett, and Willock.

To be a top side in the EPL you need a core of top class British players (Homegrown), you should have 3-6 players who should be in and around the national side.

Currently we have Maguire, AWB, Shaw, Mount, Mainoo, McTominay, Rashford, Greenwood and Sancho.

Of that 9 only 3 maybe 4 have a medium to long term future at the club (Shaw, Mount, Mainoo and Rashford) . The other 5 will almost certainly leave either this summer or next, while the 4 I've said could have a longer term future there are question marks over the longevity of Shaw, while Rashford is in poor form and could well be sold if a good offer comes in. Leaving only Mainoo and Mount as players who will definitely be here in 3-4 years time.

Therefore, we should be looking to snap up the best young British talent to become core players for the new team we are trying to build. Branthwaite looks a level above any other British player who may be available this summer, with the majority of the best young British players already playing for the likes of City, Liverpool, Arsenal, Chelsea or Newcastle.

Other potential British players we could sign might be Alex Scott, James Trafford, Adam Wharton, Archie Gray, and Evan Ferguson.

Ferguson would be far too expensive, Trafford could be a good option of Bayindir leaves this summer. Archie Gray looks the pick of the bunch but would be very difficult to sign from Leeds and he also plays in a similar position to Mainoo, its not ideal to have too many young and inexperienced players in the same position.

It's feeling like we missed a trick with Antony Gordon and Cole Palmer looking at how they have played this season. I definitely wouldn't want to miss out on Branthwaite this summer when many of our rivals probably won't be in the chase for him. Liverpool is a no go option for an Everton player, Arsenal are very settled, as are City, while Chelsea have recently signed several young CB's. Maybe only Newcastle would rival us for his signature this summer.

Much like in EtH's first summer, in hindsight we should have coughed up the 70m West Ham wanted for Rice rather than sign Casemiro. Not only would he have had better longevity, he'd have been a long term leader and been a core homegrown player for us.

We need to make sure we are front of the queue for the best young British talent, especially when they are already good enough to be first choice for us and they play in a position of need. Not going for Branthwaite this summer will much like with Declan Rice be looked back on as a missed opportunity.

09 Apr 2024 14:16:45
Did you just call Evan Ferguson British?

It’s like seeing colonialism in action. You start by saying English players, then expand it to British players and then expand Britain to include Republic of Ireland. Oliver Shapwell on the march for domination ?.

09 Apr 2024 14:35:03
Oliver Shapwell. Too funny ???.

09 Apr 2024 14:39:32
Shappy wash your mouth out.
British??.

09 Apr 2024 15:01:41
Can imagine him at City tbh sadly.

09 Apr 2024 15:17:38
I like that Branthwaite has had a bit of a football education abroad too. It’s good seeing more British youngsters going and playing in Europe, really think it helps them. I’d sign Branthwaite definitely in the summer if we have the chance. He’s the sort of signing City would make.

09 Apr 2024 15:32:43
i see a bit of chat about the lad Tosin at Fulham out of contract in summer, don't know about him but tabloiads say Spurs and Lpoll keenon him as a highly rated centre half.

09 Apr 2024 16:17:17
Hands up guys, that was a brain dead moment. Given that he's got 12 cap for Ireland I doubt he'll be doing a Rice or Grealish any time soon.

I was using British and homegrown interchangeably there and I really shouldn't as the two are not the same thing.

Danny, Ideally you want an English core to an English side, just as you should have a Spanish core to a Spanish side or an Italian core to an Italian side.

I think with English sides that extends to the home nations and Ireland as the shared language, culture and upbringing are so similar that you can create a unified core of players who have been brought up in a similar way. I think it helps to create a more unified dressing room and create a team spirit.

Fortunately we have some players in our academy who could also break into the first team squad over the next few years that would help with the homegrown quota down the line. Players like Shea Lacey, Harry Amass, the Fletcher twins, Elyh Harrison, Dan Gore, Charlie McNeil and Ethan Wheatley could all make it into the first team squad. Although Amass, Lacey and the Fletcher twins seem most likely to actually be able to push for a first 11 place.

09 Apr 2024 09:36:03
Question: why do other teams get so many shots against Utd?

09 Apr 2024 09:49:54
Because we empty the midfield and man mark.

09 Apr 2024 10:25:39
I’m not defending this as it looks damning but you need to add some context to it. Below are the shots on targets in these games compared to shots taken. You can interpret stats however you want but I think teams put question marks on Onana, know we are a team that can be got at and probably not the most resilient when we concede and therefore it’s the shoot on sight idea.

Liverpool - 28 shots, 7 on Target.
Chelsea - 28 shots, 10 on Target.
Brentford - 31 shots, 5 on Target
Everton - 23 shots, 6 on Target.
Man City - 27 shots, 8 on target.

Compared to our shots on target, there’s not a great difference in the matches bar the city game and the Chelsea game really: Everton 8 on target, Brentford 5 on target, Chelsea 5 on target, Liverpool 5 on target.

We certainly need to address this but I do think the media want to make it seem more damning that what it is. Liverpool conceded with our first attempt on goal on Sunday! But that statement makes it appear worse than actually the context of how it happened.

09 Apr 2024 10:45:30
Good post ports.
The epl is the quickest in the world particularly when moving the ball forward.
The amount of turnovers we concede is huge and allows teams into our final 3rd a lot more because of our inability to keep the ball.
Again epl nature is that most teams try to score or get a shot away as quickly as possible when is possession.
We give possession away so cheaply and consistently that it allows teams 'pot shots ' in a quick transition phase.
That's the reason in a nut shell imo.
Time and time again we lose possession and offer up half chances.

09 Apr 2024 11:01:04
So basically it's down to deliberate tactics and team selection from ETH?

09 Apr 2024 11:52:17
Ken, precisely that, we give away the ball so cheaply. Sometimes the opposition don't have to do anything.

I read that casemiro gave away the ball 16 times, I mean that's inexcusable.

Of course a different level, but I play CM in Sunday league, and I go made if I give it up once, but 16 at his level, Jesus. I don't mind giving the ball away up high as much when we are trying to do something but Case was giving the ball away do much in his own half.

Again, I know maguire had a good game defensively but on the ball, with no pressure he also was susceptible to giving the ball away. It just invites pressure. If we can cut that out, opposition chances will be less.

09 Apr 2024 13:04:37
In part its due to the tactical set up, and in part its due to a lack of personnel to play the tactics to an elite level.

The idea is that we have a in possession shape of a 3133. This should give us more passing options centrally, while also in theory making us strong defensively in central areas with the only space being wide. It allows for us to have more players further forward, which supports the implementation of a high press. Essentially football tactics is about creating numerical overloads.

Most teams in the EPL currently play in a 3223 type shape or variation of, with a box midfield made popular by De Zerbi. Essentially they have 5 players in the defensive half and 5 in the offensive half.

The 3133 should give us an extra player higher up the pitch giving us a numerical advantage and allowing us to control the game in the opposition half. This comes at a cost of having one less player in our defensive half. Which is why EtH wants to play a quick build up play out from the back with vertical passes to move the ball into the opponents half as quickly as possible where we should have the numerical advantage.

If you can get this system to work then we will be able to dominate games in this league as it would force the opposition to either change shape or to allow us to have control.

There are three reasons why this isn't working perfectly with our current team and what is leading to a lot of shots.

In the first instance our defenders lack pace and mobility so have a tendency to drop 10-15 yards deeper than they should be playing. This creates space in front of them that the midfield has to deal with.

For us the one midfielder we have shielding the defence is Casemiro, and there really isn't another player in our squad who has the skill set or understanding to play this role. Unfortunately he is in decline and no longer has the mobility, pace or stamina to cover this space on his own, especially when that space is made bigger by the defence dropping deeper.

So with a deeper defence and a declining CDM there is a lot of space for the opposition to attack in front of our defence. The more space there is to attack the more frequently the opposition can attack, which will inevitably lead to conceding more shots.

This defensive weaknesses has been exasperated by a forward line that while presses well, often makes poor decisions in possession leading to turning over the ball more often, giving the opposition the opportunity to attack that space in midfield with greater regularity.

This has been helped somewhat by playing Garnacho on the right as we are less predictable down that side now, as such we lose the ball less often down that flank. Ultimately we have too many players in attack who are looking to shoot rather than to create chances. That makes us to predictable, and when the opposition know what you will do it becomes easier to step in and win the ball back.

While Bruno is a chief culprit for losing the ball, he is also (until Garnacho started playing on the right) the only forward player who was looking to pass the ball rather than shoot all the time. Which means that if we drop him then we lose a lot of creativity and would probably score even less than we currently are.

What we are doing well though is that while we concede a lot of shots, they tend to be low chance shots either from distance or from a wide angle. While our defenders are poor at marking the space in behind them, they are very good at marking the space in front of them. Meaning that while the opposition regularly get to run at our defenders they rarely dribble past them. Meaning the shots tend to be low quality chances. which is why we might concede 26 shots in a game, but only 6 or 7 are on target. While the majority of those on target shots are ones the keeper can save without too much trouble.

The vast majority of the goals we concede actually come from set plays rather than open play. Where the chaos and decision making of our defenders is put under more scrutiny. We don't react quickly enough or we fail to pick up a player who finds a yard or so of space in a good position.

So while we concede a lot of shots from open play, they tend to be poor chances with very few goals actually conceded. If we can get better at defending set-plays then we would probably have a similar goals conceded record as the top three sides.

Our real issue this season has been less about goals conceded (only four teams have conceded less), and more about our in ability to score goals ourselves (8 sides BELOW us in the table have scored the same amount or more than us, as well as the 6 sides above us) .

Its an inability to create and score goals that is the major issue.

As to what we can do to fix it this season? Well there is nothing we can do defensively without changing shape, but then that would just create new problems.

This is the issue with our squad, there are no tactics that will negate all of our weaknesses and take advantage of our strengths. Whatever we change while negating one weakness will expose another. That is the problem with a poorly constructed squad, there are too many holes for a tactical set up to try and mitigate.

What I would look to do is drop Rashford and bring in Mount. For me Garncaho has to stay on the right hand side as that has been the only thing in attack this season that has worked. While Hojlund needs to continue at CF as he is the only option.

Bruno and Mount should be the other two as both are hard working creators who should be able to help us have more control and create better chances in the final third. This should also lead to us losing the ball as often meaning the defence gets worked less. Which should lead to less set plays conceded, which as said is how we concede the majority of our goals. I'm not sure if its better to play Mount LW and Bruno in the No.10 or the other way around. Mount has more experience playing wide, yet he is less likely to give away the ball. While Bruno losing the ball wide can actually lead to our pressing trigger to press when the opposition have the ball near the touchline. So I'd be tempted to try Bruno LW and Mount in the No.10 for a game or two and see how that works, if its not working then switch them.

For me that is the only really change we could make that might make a difference without totally changing the structure and tactics (which will only present new problems to solve) .

09 Apr 2024 15:21:07
Great explanation Shappy.

However, I'd make some different changes. I'd play Antony on the left wing and mount at no 10.

Id put Bruno on the bench and tell Rashford to find a new club.

09 Apr 2024 16:29:29
MancMan, I don't think Antony would be any good on the left unfortunately.

His problem is he is one-dimensional due to him being very one footed. On the right as a defender you know he will cut in on to his left foot. You just need to deny him that space. While on the left he will tend to try and go on the outside most of the time to also stay on his left foot. So you just deny him that space as a defender.

Also to go around the outside you need to have significantly more pace as its a longer route which you need to cover in less time than the shorter route the defender needs to take to cut you off. Antony has quick acceleration, but not great top end speed. Which makes it hard for him to sprint past defenders on the outside, as they can often catch him up.

He would be just as if not more ineffective on the left than he is on the right.

As for Bruno, while its frustrating watching him lose the ball as often as he does, I think if he had less responsibility to be the creative player due to other creative players being there to share the burden then he might give it away less. While adding a really good presser and hard worker like Mount in place of Rashford means that even when we do lose the ball in the final third we would be better able to win it back.

Like I said, its not a perfect solution, but its probably the best we have given the players we have available.

09 Apr 2024 16:55:38
Shappy, you see Anthony v Cucerella? He rinsed him on the outside every time. I think he’s quicker than you are giving him credit for. Yes it’s just one game but if the penny has dropped for him, I don’t think he’s as one dimensional as you think.

09 Apr 2024 17:28:13
Ports, by no means am I saying he's slow. But to regularly beat a fullback on the outside you have to be significantly quicker than them. Antony has great acceleration, but he doesn't have that elite top speed.

Cucurella isn't the quickest of full backs, and he kept making the same mistake of getting too tight to Antony. Which once Antony used his acceleration to get away from him he was never going to catch him.

Ultimately it doesn't really matter if Antony has or doesn't have the qualities to play on the left if he doesn't want to play there. He body language and demeanour showed he was not happy to be on the left, and unless that changes he will not be able to be successful playing in that position.

09 Apr 2024 20:11:40
But Shappy, utd need to work on getting service to Hojland and if Anthony is deprived of the option to cut inside and shoot then he has to change his focus.

Plus there's nothing to stop him coming inside and laying the ball off to a runner from midfield.

Thirdly, I'd like to see him play some games on the left just to see what it looks like

Also, if it pushes Rashford out the team then it's definitely a good idea.

Finally, it make him work on his right foot so he has the option of coming inside to take a shot.

09 Apr 2024 07:39:09
{Ed's Note - Ork has posted a new article entitled, The case for keeping Erik ten Hag at Manchester United

09 Apr 2024 06:49:22
Random left field thought but when Martinez is fit could we, as a trial, put Kambwala into a CM alongside Mainoo?

09 Apr 2024 07:20:12
I'd keep Kambwala where he is personally. Let him continue to develop as a CB. He did well at the weekend.

Martinez I'd happily play as a holding midfielder though. Mainoo offers too much further up the pitch to just be a sitting midfielder, McTominay can't play as a 6 and for as great a career as Casemiro has had, he looks like he has aged an extra 10 years and now needs glasses due to how often he misplaces passes. Martinez may not have the stamina to play in midfield in fairness, but at the same time, it's not like we've had much energy in there all season.

09 Apr 2024 07:42:46
Rjmanutd

Height, pace, tackling, heading. Kambwala looks a player who could anchor midfield. Worth a trial because we need someone who can sit, and give defence cover plus has pace. Not sure Martinez with his injuries works.

09 Apr 2024 09:51:11
One player I was thinking who could do a really good job in the defensive midfield role would be Dalot. When he drifts in there, he receives the ball really well from the CB’s and often keeps possession. I’m not suggesting we should play him there and not a big fan of moving players out of the natural positions but a few times I’ve seen him in that position, he get’s the ball and move it forward nicely. If we were to get a player in there til the end of season. I’d play Mount. He moves the ball quick, he gets stuck in, he’s mobile and I think he’s bright enough and disciplined to play the role as well. Not a long term solution but maybe good alongside Mainoo and keep Fernandes just ahead of them.

09 Apr 2024 09:54:46
Unfortunately Red Man I don't think we will see Martinez again this season and with our defensive injuries Kambawala will be needed in defense. I think he has performed well when he has had chances and should definitely be part of the first team going into pre season.
We have so many holes to fill that having another acadamy graduate in a position to fill (even a bench role) will massively help.
We can then look at bringing in another first team centre back whilt we sell/ release a couple from the existing crop.
Going into the summer we definitely need a holding midfielder to either work as double pivot with Mainoo or to allow him to be the more forward of the 2. Lots of options out there depending on how the new set up wants us to play and what money we have.

09 Apr 2024 10:03:25
Big willu is a cb. I've no idea why he would be triallex at cm.
Don't know if his passing range is up to it his 1st touch his technique his ability to take the ball under pressure his dribbling ability his body movement.
Crazy idea imo. I think if he had those abilities it would have been trialled before in the under age set ups
He has played rb.
The difference between playing as a defender where your facing the play the majority of the time and playing in midfield is miles apart.
He is big quick but is playing cb and midfield is the world of difference and requires a lot more than one might think. Itss like 2 different sports requiring 2 completely different skill sets
Id suggest we don't try to continue putting square pegs in round holes.

09 Apr 2024 10:53:31
The way Martinez is going with injuries i'd be tempted to splash a large part of our budget on 2 centre halfs ( see a lot of media talk about TOisin at Fulham being a steal as out of contract in summer- don't know much about him ) and use Martinez for cover at CH and LB if he is going to miss large parts of the season.

All teams need a settled back 4 especially the CH positions.

09 Apr 2024 11:23:38
Think we’ll sell Martinez in the Summer (ETH take him back to Ajax?! )

Wonderful attitude and character but sadly not up to the sustained physical demands of the Premiership the way we’re playing and being so exposed - unless gets more protection from the midfield, then might be Ok.

09 Apr 2024 12:03:16
Absolutely not. It's a terrible idea to trial a kid in a new position that he's never played when he's got less than 180 first team minutes, especially when you consider the inexperience of the midfield partner you're planning on playing him with.

You can't seriously think a midfield of a 18 year old with less than 20 appearances, alongside a 19 year old with only 2 starts playing in a position he's never played before, is a good idea.

It's frustrating to watch Casemiro struggle, but we literally have no other legitimate choices.

09 Apr 2024 12:24:26
While I'm sure both Kambwala and Dalot would do a job at DM, I think they'd each be better developing their respective games in their natural positions with an onus on being steady and productive in all nearby defensive situations - CB and RB who can each step in to support a midfield under pressure.

Bfbw
Tosin would be a great addition to any PL squad - especially on a free.
Irrespective of who arrives for the right side, we need back up and decent competition for Martinez - Calafiori of Bologna or Buongiorno of Torino - each available for around €30m - would be perfect, although Juve are already busily chasing a deal through for the former and there's a big pack of clubs scrabbling away for the latter. The left side needs an astute purchase. Another name for that position - Pavlovic at Salzburg.

As for the right side - Varane's definitely leaving so will need to be replaced. Bremer, while an expensive option, is near to peak and could be a huge immediate upgrade.
If it weren't for the need on the left, I'd pay the little extra to get Antonio Silva instead of Bremer now that Real are focusing on Yoro, but I guess over £100m on two CBs in one summer would not be the SJR way.
If Lindelof goes as well, which is looking increasingly likely, I'd certainly be looking at experienced PL bargains - Tosin fits the bill snugly.

09 Apr 2024 12:30:04
Thfb Toisin at Fulham has a feel of a smalling purchase.

09 Apr 2024 12:31:49
Lindelof will be staying i'm pretty sure of that.

09 Apr 2024 13:18:22
Martinez played as a holding mid at Ajax. But frankly I think most Utd fans would just be happy to see him in any position right now.

10 Apr 2024 17:31:24
C'mon Red Man. I thought we'd got past the stage of square pegs in round holes.

10 Apr 2024 20:26:09
Nou

Trying something towards the end of the season where we are not going to win the league is just an idea. Who put John OShes in a different position?

Don’t try don’t find out then, but just a suggestion to add pace and steel in CM trial.

08 Apr 2024 16:13:48
I’ve finally see EtH’s style of play.
He’ splaying the classic 4-1-5 formation
Four at the back
A static midfielder
And 5 upfront
The 5 up front to stay there, remember not to track back ( this will only drag the opposition in to our half )
The static midfielder to remain static ( and he’s doing a good job at that)
Rashford to play the ‘possum’ role and to come alive once or twice during the game ( that’s a sneaky EtH tactic )
Antony, as we can see, has been heavily influenced by the great Blackpool winger of the 50’s, Jack Russel, who was brilliant with ball at his nose.

08 Apr 2024 15:14:29


Ork has written an article entitled, The case for keeping EtH at Man Utd

08 Apr 2024 17:01:49
1. I challenge every anti-Erik on here to provide names of managers who've dealt with the same pressures in little under 2 full seasons.

What's the point? What does this prove? We only focus on our own, but off the top of my head I would say Spurs have had a bad season with injuries but are likely to get top-4.

2. I further challenge them to explain why these pressures should be considered so trivial that they must be completely ignored when the opportunity for criticism presents?

Nobody is ignoring them. There's enough evidence without them to suggest ETH is out of his depth with the decision making he is making.

I'll ask you a question back. How did ETH justify starting Rashford yesterday?

08 Apr 2024 17:40:46
BRD, who should have started ahead of Rashford at LW?

Garnacho has really developed and had a massive impact on our front line when playing on the RW. On the left he still tries to cut in and shoot too much, making him too predictable and easier to mark out of the game. It has been since he moved to the right where he can go either inside or outside where he has become undropable.

So, who starts LW if not Rashford? Antony out of position? Amad?

I think we currently find ourselves in the odd position of having lost two key RW players in Sancho and Greenwood, while Antony has struggled, and yet it is a lack of depth at LW that is a problem right now.

08 Apr 2024 17:58:46
BRD

Spurs haven't had a decade of Ed Woodward making decisions.
Say what you want about Levy, but he's not a football moron like Mystic Ed.
For example, he would not have kept Jones, Bailly and Martial for as long United have/ had.
Injuries are literally the only field for valid comparison with Spurs - their squad hasn't been riddled of overpaid, overpriced, underperforming, ageing mercenaries for years. We still have that kind of squad so the any further comparison is rather weak.

As for Rashford, I think the decision was based only on big-game experience. He'll count that as a mistake and will likely devote greater thought next time.

I've never said he's made no mistakes - he's made plenty, but so has every other manager.

08 Apr 2024 19:08:38
Good post pal.

08 Apr 2024 20:13:05
“ So, who starts LW if not Rashford? ”
My granny would put in more effort and passion. She’s been dead a good few years.

08 Apr 2024 21:02:43
Yesterday was yet another example of ETH making basic errors, failing tactically.

I am no Antony fan but the decision to play Rashford was ridiculous. Rashford hid in the first half. That is just a terrible management decision and it’s not the first. He took Garnacho off, took away the out ball, but the penalty came after Bruno missed a tackle on the left.

I watched players jogging back because they were not part of a coordinated pattern moving the ball, meanwhile Liverpool moved as a team, it was stark.

Then ETH comes out of a game, where we played as if we were a relegation threatened team at Anfield to say he was proud. I see Keane called him out on that. Proud. When it comes to success being giving a top team problems in their title chase and the manager feels proud, that’s unacceptable.

ETH had £400m spent plus loans and we lack a back up centre forward, no left back and Mount bought without an obvious position. It lacks structure, yet suddenly ETH is trying to now make out it’s all part of the plan, talking up what is happening. He seems to have suddenly realised the pressure and trying to throw positives out there.

I watched Hojland with interest yesterday, in the warm up he didn’t hit the target that much, stick it in the net. Yes it’s only warm up but no one seemed to be guiding him. I remember watching strikers warm up in the past and they were not as hit and miss. In the game Hojland hardly won a header, the ball didn’t stick to him. He is raw but all the above seems to indicate he isn’t getting the level of coaching he should be and there isn’t a plan to have a coordinated attack.

I stood by ETH until Brentford, a disjointed uncoordinated mess.

08 Apr 2024 21:15:29
@ shappy he started garnacho on the left v Chelsea and Anthony on the right it went well I think that's a valid argument.
But that's up to eth. Rashford scored v Liverpool in the last game so he made his choice.
@ ork. We all have our opinions, for every positive stat in favour of eth there is a damning negative one.
We could play that ying v yang forever.
Because none of us really have a clue we can only comment on our gut feelings and on what we see.
Taking aside the hap hazard poor football and lack of cohesion and awful defending blah blah blah because there are some mitigating circumstances for some of that, I look at it from my own viewpoint.
I would not like to be stuck in the trenches with eth.
I would not blindly follow him over the hill.
I would not trust him to have the answers, I wouldn't turn to him if I was in trouble and I would doubt a lot of what he is saying to me, I have too many doubts after 18 months of first believing then hesitating then doubts, and now certainty that I wouldn't follow him over any hill.
He is not a leader I would follow anywhere.
I'd love to be stuck in the trenches with pep klopp fergie wenger young Jose, simione emeryeven mad conte (for the craic) . They are guys that have their players running over the hill with double back packs if they have to.
I see traits in his leadership that I don't like or agree with and I would not like to work under him. ( just to say I don't know him or any facts for the politically correct brigade) I've formed my opinion on my perceptions like we all do. (That's how you form your opinions too)
I think he lacks charisma and he does't help himself with his press conferences.
The relationship that flows between fans manager and players the unity I long for is not there.
I don't believe in him I don't see a sustainable successful future under him at all.
I see a few cup wins and palatable football ish but nothing near enough to close the gap on not only our peers in England but also Europe.
I can't see any compelling reason to stick with him. We are 13 points behind where we were last season.
Our players are not any fitter.
We don't pass the ball any quicker.
We don't defend set pieces any better. we don't score more goals. We don't dominate possession. We give a shot away every 3 mins.
He has lost 24 games out of79 in the league.
Rotten cl campaign.
No cl next season
I can just imagine if Southgate took off a winger in the euro final when leading and brought on a midfielder and lost what the reaction would be and imagine if he did it twice 3 days apart. I dare say he would be getting pelters for negativity.
I agree if martinez or Shaw had been available all season it would have been better but that does not explain enough away imo.
Disclaimer
Mine is an opinion of 1. It is based on my perceptions. I admit its based on my subjectivity. I think and hope that the new management will be aligned with some of my observations and feelings and perceptions.
Nobody should be too irked by others perceptions / opinions because they are based on little or no knowledge or facts and are totally invalid when it comes to the decision makers.
If not they are seeing something I'm not then that's fine. They know more than I do.
The only person who is in the position to change my opinion of eth is ETH himself.
On sancho I think the club, eth and particularly sancho all handled the situation badly. The club will suffer the most in the long run.
Not taking sancho's side at all but the whole thing got out of hand because it was let get out of hand.
I think eth will always be only around the corner from his next ronaldo / sancho / varane (a lesser but still by all accounts a difficult situation) / rashford type stand off.
Football fans only have 2 things belief and hope.
With eth I don't believe I only hope.
I think it's the same for the players I believe that's evident by what their producing.
Leading to mediocrity is hard enough leading to greatness is not easy and I don't think eth has got it.
Change now.
In business and I assume its the same in sport as it will be for us all.
You regret the things you don't do in life a lot more often than the things you do, do.
I would not be sticking because of a fear of the unknown. If the known is not a as good as it can be never fear the unknown.

08 Apr 2024 21:27:30
Injuries aside, if the club can get their house in order, 6 signings this summer should transform our team.

Back 4, a real No6, and a forward. Anything else is a bonus.

08 Apr 2024 21:34:55
BRD

How have spurs had a bad season with injuries. They had maddison and van der ven out for about 6 weeks and 2 of those weeks was during the international break. They have spent 387 mill pounds in transfers since summer of 2022 and bought 13 players and sold Kane and Dier.

As i write this they have 5 injuries, 2 being back up keepers 3 players who are squad players. They play once a week since november as they were out of both domestic cups and no europe.

The minority who is making a lot of noise about the manager getting sacked seems to gloss over things that has made it difficult for us this year and giddie up everyone else out there.

Its like Fergie said the neighbors cow is better.

I have zero doubts if we did not have the nature and timing of our injuries this year, we would be ahead of teams like villa and spurs and playing much better football. Its been a year of compromise every game.

08 Apr 2024 21:55:26
Good post that Ken.

Shappy, 'who starts LW if not Rashford? ” Antony?

You've bigged up the virtues of the right footed Garnacho playing on the right (and I agree) . Why can't it work having the left footed Anthony playing on the left for the same reasons?

08 Apr 2024 22:04:55
Newcastle have lost the most player days to injuries this season followed by 5 clubs tied exactly
Spurs United Palace Chelsea and Liverpool.
City are in the bottom 3 and have used the least players.

08 Apr 2024 23:33:33
No point arguing with the Anti-Eriks.

9 Wins, 3 Draws, 3 Losses in 2024. One game off our third cup final in 2 years, all whilst playing bad.

3 individual errors in our last 2 games cost us points but again its ETHs fault.

Old Trafford roof leaking? there's only one man to blame.

09 Apr 2024 01:03:17
I love those stats kurtis.
In our last 16 league games since 6th Dec we have won 6 drawn 4 lost 6
Or in short won 6 of our last 16 league games.
As I say for every good stat you trot out to capture a period a damning negative is there to trump it.

09 Apr 2024 03:25:16
More points than Klopp and Arteta in the EPL after first 50 games.

It is absolutely okay to suggest that maybe we should give the guy a bit more time, and move out some players who don't fit and bring in more that do.

But winning points isn't enough. We have to judge him on style of play. Quick, better fire him and bring in southgate so we get a better style if play.

09 Apr 2024 05:49:15
I think some people should stay clear of statistics as they clearly have no idea of data quality to avoid skewed results.

Anybody can pick a window or scenario to force their point but it is meaningless unless it is quantified against the bigger picture.

For example you could say that two managers have not lost in 20 games so they must be as good as each other. But one could have drawn 20 games, the other won 20 games. Pick the right column and they both look as good as each other.

As Tumble says. You can pick a hundred different arguments and manipulate them how you want.


For example:
61% win record in league last season
48% win record in league so far this season.

Statistically he is going backwards, or is he?

1. Season is not yet over. He could win all remaining games.
2. He could lose all remaining games.
3. He could draw all remaining games.
4. He could get sacked

Unless you consider all the causal factors you are kidding yourselves either way.

But what we do know is that Klopp and Pep moved forward with a clear and tangible plan. Within 4 years Klopp was a double Champions League finalist.

Can you hand on heart say that ETH will be there?

09 Apr 2024 06:47:03
Dodgy

Recommend reading what Rio Ferdinand has said on ETH team set up.

So move out some who don’t fit and bring in more that do. What was ETH doing with the £400m spent and the loan deals, including Amrabat? And it’s a dogs dinner team right now. Chaotic. Is that the plan, chaos?

09 Apr 2024 07:40:29
Guardiola has 75 wins since start of 2022 season in all competitions, eth is second with 62 wins and Klop has 57. He has gone through player issues, change in ownership structure, injuries to players we cannot solve for and bad rub of calls imo. Its been a season of one player back 2 more out and never a stable consistent first 11.

Other clubs have had injuries too but they have better alternatives as replacements imo where in some areas we just have none.

I acknowledge its not a thumping 3-0 and control i would like to see when we play and some of the games have been awful awful. its a squad that has gaps and weaknesses both technically and physically. You can either blame the manager or think he needs time to retool. The current crop of managers who have done really well, were all given time to build a team of their players.

I will support whatever the decision even though i might not agree with it. I suspect the same group here will be at it again with the new guy soon thereafter. its a pattern with united and instability breads poor football. IMO we are 2/ 3 years away from playing the kind of football everyone wants.

Finally what managers say in public and what they say privately are often miles apart and you guys hanging on to every word he says to criticize him is laughable. I am told privately he wants a quite a few players gone but not in his hands and difficult sticking point atm.

09 Apr 2024 07:47:11
Really don’t know how anybody can defend the tactics at the moment. I thought Ole’s were bad, but ETH is making him look like a tactical genius. League form now feels worse than the season Ole was sacked.

Regardless of injuries ETH is looking either stupid or naive with his formations. Players can’t mark a piece of paper at set pieces and are woefully out of shape and position during transitions. There’s just no defensive discipline - and that’s supposed to be ETH’s strength. Discipline.

Over 500 shots against us this season. Speaks volumes. That’s not a skewed or irrelevant stat. It’s cause and effect. I’m sick of his ridiculous post match analyses. If he’s being genuine then everybody should be worried.

Do I want ETH gone. Yes. Two reasons. Firstly he isn’t good enough to win PL or CL. Secondly, I want INEOS to flex their thinking and bring in a coach of their choosing. I don’t care about comparisons to other clubs or stats against Arteta or actually winning a trophy at the moment. I want a competent manager that makes competent decisions. They seem so rare now.

Final point. All of these comments about injuries. Our midfield has been our issue all season. Bruno. Never injured. McT barely injured. Amrabat. Barely injured. Mainoo obviously relatively new addition. Casemiro missed 17 matches. Dalot (who moves into midfield) never injured. Plus there are some good fringe academy players available. Point is our midfield has hardly been ravaged by injuries. I get Mount long term but he’s never had him to miss - and he’s hardly a defensive linchpin. So why despite the choices and consistent availability is the basics of our midfield still so bad? Coaching and/ or tactics. Were they Woodward’s fault. The Glazers?

09 Apr 2024 09:06:05
Exactly. Facts BRD. 500 shots against. No skewing that data.

Bad run of calls? That’s just a noise factor. Immeasurable and random number. Same with injuries. Hard to measure the the actual effect they have had. Yes they have had an effect but how much, factually.

Also since 2022 is also irrelevant. It’s 2023/ 34 season. ETH won most of those last season. This season his win rate is 48% in EPL.

Another rubbish stat skewed to make an irrelevant point.

09 Apr 2024 10:07:42
Why not trend those figs to show the decline ahmad.

09 Apr 2024 12:17:24
MancMan, Antony and Garnacho are very different players.

Garnacho is fairly two footed and is comfortable shooting or crossing with his weaker foot. He's also a far more technical dribbler, capable of keeping the ball closer to his body and quickly shifting left or right.

As such he is capable of playing on either wing. Playing on the right has just made him play with his head up and assess his options more. When he plays on the left he is overly focused on cutting in and shooting. So playing on the right has made him a more rounded threat.

Antony has no right foot, he will always look to play onto his left. When playing on the right that means cutting back in field, on the left that would mean going wide 95% of the time and he would be just as predictable. Another difference is that Antony doesn't have that blistering pace often needed to go around the outside and make enough space to cross. His dribbling style isn't as technical as Garnacho's, it's more of a push and chase style with him looking to use his acceleration over a short distance to get a yard of space. Over a longer distance his lack of top end speed means defenders can get back at him. It's why he doesn't try and beat a player for all out pace. He gets half a yard ahead of a player and if he can't shoot or cross at that point instead of driving into the space he turns back to square up the defender again. If he drove into the space the defender would likely catch him up.

Antony in my opinion cannot work as a left winger as he doesn't have the all out pace to beat a fullback around the outside or the ability to use his right foot and mix things up.

He might be able to be adapted into a left wingback role, where his work rate is a huge benefit, but he doesn't have the same defensive responsibilities as a fullback, and he can work in conjunction with a LW player to play quick one twos on the the overlap to get space to cross with his left foot.

But he lacks the technical skills and outright pace to be an elite winger, and he doesn't have the defensive capabilities to be an elite fullback either. There is a chance he could play the wingback role to a high level if he worked hard on developing his skills in that role. But from looking at his body language when asked to play on the left hand side in the FA cup game against Liverpool he doesn't seem particularly happy to play in a position outside of his comfort zone.

08 Apr 2024 13:47:33


Shappy has written an article entitled, What Does The Manchester United Team Need To Improve

08 Apr 2024 15:03:19
I've not opened this yet shappy it will be read in a bit but you can write 20 paragraphs on stuff that's not a problem so I'm expecting this to be very long because the subject matter is a very long list. ???I'll enjoy the read later. ?.

08 Apr 2024 19:16:01
Good post Shappy.

08 Apr 2024 19:59:47
Shappy - Casemiro looks spent. I don’t know if he’s injured, just not fit enough or if his weaknesses are just being brutally exposed more by a different system in midfield but his mobility and speed look to have sadly deteriorated to a point which has almost become embarrassing for a player of his pedigree and stature.

Players just breeze past him with ease, he can’t run, turn or recover and has resorted to desperate lunging tackles. It’s almost sad to see such a decorated player exposed in such a way. He’s also been very poor in possession as well this season.

With the return of Mount from injury, perhaps we’d benefit from Bruno dropping deeper. He has the tenacity and running capacity to fill the position and his ability on the ball might help us in the build up. I think he’s played deeper on a few occasions and always done pretty well in my opinion.

Whilst by no means a perfect solution, Casemiro just doesn’t look right and Mctominay presents other issues. It would allow Mount and Mainoo to play their more natural positions and asking Bruno, as captain to do a more disciplined job for the team makes sense, rather than an inexperienced youngster or a player new to the Club returning from injury.

Thoughts pal?

08 Apr 2024 21:12:26
I wouldn't play Bruno deeper as his tendency to play the dangerous pass would potentially lead to turn overs close to our defensive third. It works occasionally but isn't something we should look to do too often.

If I was going to drop another player deeper alongside Casemiro it would be Mainoo as he has the intelligence and ability to play that role even if he lacks the experience.

However, at this point I don't see much point in trying to be pragmatic as there isn't much to play for at this point with UCL football a massive long shot at best. It makes more sense to try to better imbed the preferred playing style.

We just need to sign a better No.6 than Casemiro.

08 Apr 2024 21:37:56
Think ten Hag’s best shot at hanging onto his job is trying to show there is a positive style and proof of this progress and plan that he assures us exists every week. I’d take any of that over any win or European spot!

08 Apr 2024 21:56:24
Shappy - I didn’t mention being more pragmatic. I tend to agree with Spenno, we need to see evidence this style of play can work.

If not Bruno then Mainoo needs to drop deeper and Mount come into the midfield. Little point in persisting with Casemiro now in my opinion. He just doesn’t have the fitness, speed or mobility and will likely leave in the summer anyway.

I say let’s see what a more energetic and mobile midfield can do, plus he needs to justify why he spent £60m on Mount.

If EtH he can string a few performances together in the remaining fixtures and evidence this system can work it might just buy him more time.

09 Apr 2024 14:55:08
DLIB, dropping an extra player into midfield in an attempt to increase defensive stability is definitely a pragmatic move.

It's not a decision born out of being more attacking or to create more chances but to mitigate a weakness and add defensive stability.

We have seen that in build up Mainoo or Dalot has dropped in along side Casemiro making the 3133 into something more like a 3223, then as the ball progresses that player (Mainoo or Dalot) moves further forward so we have more options higher up and the ability to press teams higher and better.

The problem comes when we lose the ball then the opposition evade the initial press and release the ball into the midfield. Now those players who formed the press are behind the ball with just Casemiro left to cover the midfield, often outnumbered.

The only other option is to drop a player into midfield alongside Casemiro all the time, but then that's one less player further forward and it lessens our ability to press high, meaning we will likely have teams be able to attack our midfield more often, and potentially with more players (as more can move forward as we have less players pinning them back) .

So it doesn't necessarily solve our problem defensively, but it would definitely reduce the effectiveness of our high press.