02 Dec 2015 11:57:30
Rooney is marmite at the moment. Love him or hate him. We have to face facts though, despite the formation, philosophy, style or what ever you could call it that LVG has been implementing its not his fault that Rooneys touch and passing has been poor. These are the basic requirements of being a footballer. Add to that his loss of pace his effectiveness is on the wane. He is now 30 and isn't the most athletic of players.

It makes me wonder if he ever followed Giggs's example and practised yoga/Pilates. This would benefit and add some flexibility/mobility back into his game.

Perhaps a loss of focus and desire could be to blame. The sparkle in his eye has gone.


1.) 02 Dec 2015
02 Dec 2015 12:04:46
Right now I think that the sparkle in everyones eye has gone. They look bored and there is talk that they are bored with training. I think LVG will be gone at the end of the season. We can thank him for improving our passing over the last two years and getting us back into Europe and challenging in England - but he has done as much as he can. This slow stuff just doesn't work in England.


2.) 02 Dec 2015
02 Dec 2015 12:08:02
we are not a one man team .
yet rooney seems to be the only player people go on about .
whats happened to mata, depay, martial etc .

which players are really playing well at the moment?


3.) 02 Dec 2015
02 Dec 2015 12:22:25
His BMI has been very high for a professional athlete, if you look at his lack of muscle tone and the weight he has carried in his face and midsection coupled with the increase in weight that has been observed over a couple of off seasons it's reasonable to assume he isn't very strict with his nutrition. Valencia is a good example of a player who maintains a low BMI as observed by his muscle 'tone' etc. However, this does not mean he doesn't train extremely hard, his managers have always reported he puts in the work in training, he may neglect the strength and conditioning side but there is nothing to suggest this.

Rooney has played a lot of football for a 30 year old let's not forget, this will cause obvious wear and tear. This in addition to poor nutrition will compound the problems. Life has just caught up with him unfortunatly.

As to why he plays, he's one of of not the highest earner, club and country captain and also highly marketable. One would assume he has a lot of influence over the dressing room and as such could cause a manager many problems. Normally when face ls with a player in such obvious decline a manager would have a succession plan and look to move the player on (as Ferguson tried to do) . The problem we face is that Rooney is on huge wages with a long term contract and over 30, who could afford him/want him? Also you have to consider he isn't multilingual and has many roots in the North West. We're caught between a rock and a hard place.


4.) 02 Dec 2015
02 Dec 2015 12:29:03
I think the persistent flaking of rooney is down to the fact it's been an ongoing thing for years now and everybody is fed up seeing him playing so poorly in most matches.

The others that you mention especially martial and depay who are young and just starting their UTD career, if their performances persist in such a fashion I'm sure people won't be too long in criticising them also. Right now they are getting the benefit of the doubt and tactics rather than their own personal ability seems to be hindering them.

Rooney, its as simple as that he just isn't the player he was and is consistently poor. Until we find a new manager to adjust the tactics or a better No.10 we are stuck with him whether the majority of fans like it or not.


5.) 02 Dec 2015
02 Dec 2015 12:41:30
rewz
and what about bastian .
started at munich at the age of 18 is now 31 .
for his first game he played he had the biggest shorts ever seen in the EPL ( they would of slipped of micky quinn)
he looks way overweight i can only guess what his BMI is .
how did you you find out rooneys?
bastian looks half the player he was and no where near fit, which is backed up by that fact pep has said he hasn't been fit for the last 2 years .
yet this is a player we went out and bought, made him the highest paid player in the epl to fend of interest from USA.


6.) 02 Dec 2015
02 Dec 2015 12:53:04
I am now questioning the management of these players. In the last 15 months we had van persie, Falcao, Di Maria, januzaj, Mata, depay, martial, herrera, fellaini, Wilson and Rooney available and none of them have found any form.

That's an entire team of attack minded players, in 15 months.

Rooney was always going to struggle with his conditioning and his Roy of the rovers attitude that sees him all over the pitch except where a forward needs to be is clearly getting worse. But he is only one of 11 players that have failed.

I am coming to the conclusion that lvg is a forward killer. He doesn't seem to know how to coach or motivate them.


7.) 02 Dec 2015
02 Dec 2015 14:18:58
Hey Jred,

I have a medical qualification, and have spent most of my adult life having a keen interest in physiology and performance. I've aso been a gym rat for 15 years. Look up bodyfat % in Google images there are some excellent guides with pictures and explanations. I can only speak for rugby but body fat % is monitored closely as it has a direct effect on performance, if a player goes above a trigger point (bodyfat %) they are put on the fat list, meaning strict diet control and extra training the trigger point is usually position/person specific. Carrying excess weight puts unessasary strain on the body causing additional wear and tear, lowers you maximal capacity and can affect a players decision making later in a game.

My post was merely in reply to the OP as to why Rooney's performances may have dropped off and the reasons as to why he may be continued to be picked.

Unfortunatly in written form it's hard to convey tone but please be assured this was written to be in no way inflammatory, aggressive or condescending.


8.) 02 Dec 2015
02 Dec 2015 14:19:42
Excellent points jred.


9.) 02 Dec 2015
02 Dec 2015 15:06:13
Rewz
I get my BMI checked annually for my job, and train a lot I can get by with out checking google.
Muscle mass will increase your BMI AS will the internal fat on your body and around your organs which can give surprising results .
On a side note I know some fat lads with great fitness levels and unfit skinny lads .

Why has Rooney performance dropped of this season? It could be a number of reasons but one things for sure I haven't seen many 30 year olds that are better than they where when they where mid 20's .

If we judged every player by the same standard that's set for Rooney only ddg will be on the pitch against west ham.


10.) 02 Dec 2015
02 Dec 2015 15:33:44
No jred, rooney can't even control a ball, that's how bad it's got with him. Most of the UTD players I can sit back, watch their positioning, movement and overall contribution.

The system that LVG has implemented does not really give any of our players a great chance to show off their main attributions. Most of us on here can see that the system really does not help some of the underperfoming players. Even Martial is starting to look lost.

But Rooney is beyond that. His touch, control, passing ability and even enthusiasm have been on the wane for some time.

I loved rooney, as have many posters on here and we each have our opinions on his 'transfer requests' and the apparent fall out with fergie towards the end of his reign but unfortunately he really has deteriorated as a footballer (and has been consistently getting worse over the past 3 years) and I will judge each and every other player the same.

Clearly there are limited players within our team, also players who are hampered by LVG. Rooney is not either, he has had a massive influential place in this team defined by both his position and captaincy and his contribution to the team or lack of costs us dearly and hinders other players opportunities.


11.) 02 Dec 2015
02 Dec 2015 15:46:18
Angle
Rooney can control a ball the over dramatization of the situation by people like yourself is why it's pointless having a debate on this page .
So I will take a tip from the ed and just cut and paste
(Jred note-everyone keeps shouting rooney shouldn't be in the team but it makes little difference if he is or not its just a gripe people have .
he is out of form and no longer carrying the team, but the team are no different if he plays or not.

last night rooney got subbed, "thank good the site shouted " and on comes depay who has prob been our worse player all season, had one of the worse games i have seen in a united shirt against psv but people where happy.
it doesn't matter who comes on as long as rooney goes off . strange . anyonebutrooney

do we look a better team with rooney in it . no
do we look a better team with rooney out . no
do we look more or less the same team no matter who plays . yes. )


12.) 02 Dec 2015
02 Dec 2015 20:51:45
You might think it is over dramatisation, I myself think that it's just pointing out the obvious. I would love nothing more to see him pick a ball, drive at the defence and score a scorcher.

Rooneys ball control is terrible, that is very obvious.

I think if LVG allowed the players some more free reign we would play better without rooney. Unfortunately it doesn't matter who plays in that front 3 because the forwards are too rigid and stagnant.

Yes depay hasn't been great for these 4 months, but it's 4 months, not 3 years. If depay continues with this form throughout the year and into next, people will be calling for his head, but we can't do the same with rooney because?


13.) 02 Dec 2015
02 Dec 2015 21:34:15
i thought rooney was 1 of our best out field players last year and was the best under moyes .
but rooney is judged different to other players by yourself, if he isn't the best on the park he is judged poor .
when picking the team on saturday lvg won't be thinking how a player played 2 year ago it will be based on who can do the best job on the day .
rooney isn't playing great but whos playing better, depay?
never mind calling for his head (dont get me started on supporting your team ) what has depay done to force rooney out the team?
someone needs to push rooney out the team and depay mata etc haven't yet.
martial has in the 9 pos .

in the games rooney has missed we have played no better, I've got to the point i'm not bothered who starts as it makes little difference .
#anyonebutrooney drop him for depay, whos playing crap, mata whos no better, herrera whos injured just drop him . even if the team plays just the same.


14.) 02 Dec 2015
02 Dec 2015 21:53:24
Well 2 things that need to happen for us going forward.

Most importantly LVG is gone either end of this year or next at maximum. And we need to find the new rooney, the player that is going to take games and make the difference just like Wayne used to. You are right someone needs to force LVGS hand to drop him.


15.) 02 Dec 2015
02 Dec 2015 22:21:55
angl
i should point out i'm not having a go i just don't think it makes a difference at the moment if rooney plays or not i aslo don't see anyone in the squad any better at the moment .
its a bit like kagawa people wanted him in the team but he never took his chance .


16.) 03 Dec 2015
03 Dec 2015 06:20:10
You can't really talk about being judged differently then compare Rooney who plays every game up front with someone (anyone) who gets 20mins every 4 or 5 games if he's lucky in rooneys guaranteed position. Give someone a few games upfront and i'd expect us to score a few more. Rooney isn't taking any chances he's simply to slow and poor on the ball these days to hit anyone on the break.


17.) 03 Dec 2015
03 Dec 2015 10:22:03
rooney shows better ball control with grannies than he does with a football :) his 1st touch at times is shocking.


18.) 03 Dec 2015
03 Dec 2015 11:08:07
Jred

I know your not having a go mate. I always enjoy your posts and never is there any offence taken.

Kagawa is a great example, he should have been a very useful player. I think fergie was starting to get results from him and was using him correctly. I believe he preferred Kagawa in the no.10 role. Unfortunately never came to fruition.

I will however stick to my point that i don't believe any of the players have got a fair crack at rooney's position. No.10 position. I would like to see a fair run of games given to Herrera there, it's hard to judge a player playing an odd game or two in that position.

Also when Martial was starting upfront, the impact he made forced LVG to put Rooney back at no.10 and now again Martial has been moved out wide at the expense of Rooney.


19.) 03 Dec 2015
03 Dec 2015 11:56:38
angle
has martial been moved due to rooney? or do you just blame him for everything .
lvg picks the team ?
martial can play 9 or out wide but its not just about 1 person .
was martial pushed wide fir rooney or did lvg maybe want more pace down the wing for a certain game?
i don't no .
im not a big fan of mata on the wing, i don't think he is a winger the team looks unbalanced pace down onside none down the other.
maybe it is rooneys fault or maybe for some games lvg may of though rooney 9 with martial wide is a better combo than martial 9 and mata wide?
as the regulars will tell u am a fan of herrera wanted before moyes, but his best postion is 8 box to box, united fans have turned him in to a 10.
herrera should be playing with scheinderlin . not bastian and carrick which is an issue to me.


20.) 03 Dec 2015
03 Dec 2015 12:45:37
Of course, like I mentioned in many posts before, LVG has to take the stand and drop whoever is underperfoming. Moving Martial out on the wing was a dumb move.

But for definite, rooney for some reason has a stranglehold on his position in the team and I would like to see another player get in there for a run of games. It's not rooneys fault of course, only the manager can do that. But I what I am saying and have been consistent is that with him there, then no other player seems to get the opportunity afforded to them to play in that position.

Again that's not rooneys fault. If it was it would make my posts a lot more understandable lol ;)