12 Nov 2021 09:03:30
It has been said that one of the only positives of OGS reign so far is the clearing of several players that were deemed not needed at the club but seriously wth is he doing? If correct- sancho is training as a 73m wingback, Van de Beek is a lost soul, ronnie is miffed at the levels shown, henderson is looking to go as is lingard and cavani. He has destroyed rashford playing through injuries, never rested bruno when he could have and stuck with AWB fred and matic who are simply not good enough. He has put the club back 30 years and has failed to bring on the younguns as much as we were led to believe! Worse man management than JM and tactically so far gone he makes allardyce look good: all with a cheesy smile on his face. He has to go and asap or I think we as a club will plunder to new depths that we would struggle to come out of for decade or more.


1.) 12 Nov 2021
12 Nov 2021 09:40:00
He is embarrassing the great club.
His position should be untenable.


2.) 12 Nov 2021
12 Nov 2021 09:44:22
I'm not sure if you could have fit more hyperbole in that post even if you tried?

Put the club back 30 years?

We are 2-3 (depending on how the new manager wants to set up) players away from having a team that can genuinely win the league.

Rashford isn't a busted flush, he picked up injuries and played more than he probably should have done. But he has now had the time needed to recover and will continue to be a key player for us.

Bruno being rested every now and then would probably be good, but it hasn't really impacted his form too much. While it's tricky to rest your best player. Fine if you get the win, but becomes a stick to beat you with if the team draws or loses.

Sancho and possibly even Donny will be fine once a new manager comes in. Both top players with great potential.

Lingard looking to leave is not a problem. At best he is a decent squad player in either wide positions or at No.10. However, if Lingard leaving creates space for the likes of Amad, Hannibal, Shoretire and Elanga. Then surely that isn't the worst thing.

Henderson leaving would be a shame, but you can only play one keeper and on current form DDG deserves to play. Henderson isn't a teenager anymore though and needs to be playing every week to continue to develop. We have seen from his spell at Sheffield United that he is more than good enough to be first choice in the EPL. If he leaves hopefully the club insert a buyback clause as he might be the right man in a couple of years to take over from DDG.

Cavani when fit is excellent, but realistically he isn't going to play ahead of Ronaldo. Cavani's deal ends next summer, while Ronaldo has another year with an option for a third. I would consider Cavani leaving in the summer as making space for Greenwood.

AWB isn't a terrible player, just one that needs better coaching to make the most of his talents. A talent going to waste rather than a player lacking talent.

Fred is a solid squad player, while Matic was good enough but his legs have gone and he can't keep up with the pace of the league anymore. He does however offer great experience and is one of the few players in the squad with EPL winning experience. He probably does need to move on though.

Worse man manager than Jose? Well that's subjective. One management style works well for a certain player, but not for another. Some people need the stick others the carrot. Ask Shaw or Pogba which manager they prefer to work with and I suspect they'll say the Norwegian and not the Portuguese.

Some players praise Jose and back him to the hilt, maybe not so many recently. Which does suggest that Jose might need to adapt his style to the modern footballer.

Sadly Jose left a toxic dressing room behind where players openly celebrated his sacking. Something I hadn't seen before at any club with any manager. Ole is nowhere near that currently. Maybe the players are losing faith in him, but they don't despise him.

Ole has run his course, we tried and he was given the chance to step up and prove himself. Sadly his best isn't good enough for where we want to be. He'll be sacked in good time, hopefully not before the club have some sort of plan. Whatever that may be.

That said he has overseen an overall improvement in the quality of players we have in our first team. To the point that we are a couple of players away from going toe to toe with any side in the world.

I get that it's frustrating that the club haven't acted yet, but let's not let that make arses of ourselves.


3.) 12 Nov 2021
12 Nov 2021 09:57:23
Thats a really accuarate summary Shappy - Ole will be gone soon enough for all the failings that have been well documented, let's hope its before he does drag us down further and he can move on with a bit of dignity.


4.) 12 Nov 2021
12 Nov 2021 10:50:41
Shappy although I agree with most of what you said I can't look passed your opening line of "I'm not sure if you could have fit more hyperbole in that post even if you tried? "

then you go on and agree with a lot of what funky pigeon said except the management part and the back 30 years part? its quite confusing calling a post out then agreeing with it.


5.) 12 Nov 2021
12 Nov 2021 12:00:03
dio- you put exactly my thoughts on shappys post .
Shappy - not only do you sit on the fence, you build it knock it down and so on and so on everyday. One minute you agree then totally disagree the next!
Your posts are frequent, elegantly put but always start off on one side and flip 180 toward the end.
Only a few on here have valid insight to what really goes on the rest is opinion and feeling/ belief: the guy is forever smiling embarrasingly after lack lustre performances by the team he is paid to coach- that is fact.
I never said rashford was a busted flush as you state but that he was overplayed whilst injured, fred agreat squad player/ / matic legs have gone but experienced= what benefit is that at the moment? Lingard leaving isn't a problem- he can run his contract down as can pp? Cavani -one of our most hard working players when on the pitch who again has 6 months as you rightly say left on his extension - but look at the club fgs, our main thret is one player ronaldo - he cannot do it on his own. Awb started out as a winger in youth football and he can tackle one on one but positionally needs to because e wanders all over trotting back and when ging forward he's like bambi on ice! Watch him - very few pass to him in a forward position because they don't trust him. Yes shappy my expanded views that explain my op that you agree with quite a lot but justify it by making excuses and hoping they can get better. We all want the best for our club but this clown must go and quickly as not only has he failed but he is also dragging anything that is / was good, down.


6.) 12 Nov 2021
12 Nov 2021 12:36:59
Funky pigeon it really confuses the conversation for me when he does it (granted its often) as for me all he done was reword your post and made it twice as long but it didn't add anything to the conversation that wasn't said in your post and I could understand if he carried on from his hyperbole part and disagreed but he says it then goes on to agree with 90% of what you said or the hyperbole part wasnt in there as you can't all it hyperbole then agree with the comment. Sometimes I feel he just needs or wants to be the centre of every conversation on the page which isn't always a bad thing either.


7.) 12 Nov 2021
12 Nov 2021 13:20:48
Shappy weren't we 2 to 3 players short of winning the title prior to this season starting?

We got 2 to 3 players and I see no title challenge and we are still 2 to 3 players short.

Stop making excuses it's getting silly now.

we will always be 2 to 3 players short under the Glazers.


8.) 12 Nov 2021
12 Nov 2021 13:29:15
He has put the club back years no hyperbole about it.


9.) 12 Nov 2021
12 Nov 2021 13:51:50
Okay let's break down the hyperbole into easy to manage chunks.

Sancho training as wingback? No evidence for it. Over the top hyperbole.

Donny as a "lost soul", over the top hyperbole. He's not playing much. Neither is Dalot, Lingard, Mata etc. Are they "lost souls" as well?

Ronnie miffed? No evidence for it. Hyperbole.

Bemoans players looking to leave, then names two squad players who everyone expects to leave and a 34 year old injury prone striker with less than 6 months left on his deal. Hardly big news, just thrown in to make it sound like the place is falling apart.

Destroyed Rashford, massive hyperbole. The kid is fine. He played when he probably should have rested. Yet everyone ignores the fact that in order to play both the player AND the medical department need to declare him fit to play. The manager can't just dangerously send out a multimillion pound asset out to be injured because he feels like it.

Put the club back 30 years? Hyperbole. I doubt he's put the club 12 months let alone 30 years.

Worst man management. Hyperbolic opinion, nothing more, while little actual evidence more than hearsay.

Tactically makes Allerdyce look good. Again hyperbole, pick a name of an unfancied manager and say Ole makes him look good. Allerdyce may be a better manager, but nothing will make his football look good.

Then contradicts themselves in their own post after saying the club has been put back 30 years, then says the club will struggle to come out of Ole's management for a decade or more. Still hyperbole, but at least knocked 20 years off their original statement.

The entire thing is just hyperbolic over the top screaming to such an extent that I first wondered if it was an attempt at satire.

All of it opinion, most of it over the top and unreasonable.

All you had to say was Ole has proven himself to not be good enough for where we want to be. Now the club is potentially creating further issues by not moving to correct that mistake.

If the club hire a top manager who is the right fit for the club and they back him, making 2-3 good key signings then we have a squad more than capable of not just winning the league but winning any tournament we enter as well.

We have a top class keeper in DDG and a potentially top class keeper in Henderson. While Heaton is an excellent back up to either. The next manager will have the choice between two excellent options.

There is enough quality in defence that if properly organised that we should be defensively one of the best sides in the league. AWB if coached and developed has potential. Varane is top class. Shaw is top class. Maguire has his faults, but in the right set up will be fine. While the likes of Telles, Lindelof, Bailly and Dalot offer good squad options. With players like Laird and Mengi in the youth set up who look like potential future stars.

In our forward line we have Ronaldo, Cavani, Bruno, Rashford, Sancho and Greenwood. Six great options. We have depth in Martial, Lingard and Mata. Maybe all three need to go, but they at least offer some depth.

Look over at Liverpool, after Salah, Mane, Firmino and Jota what depth do they have? Origi and Minimino. Maybe Elliot if you want to include kids.

If you look at our kids on the cusp of the first team squad you have Amad, Pellistri, Elanga, Shoretire, Hannibal, McNeil and Hugill.

The area we need actual work is in midfield. McFred aren't good enough. While Pogba and Matic are likely to go soon. We have Garner coming through who's talented. While Donny does have the skills to make an impact, it's about getting the right balance for him to be able to do so.

Bring in 1 or 2 midfielders and better coaching then suddenly we have a top side, easily a match for Liverpool, Chelsea and City.

In no way is this side set back 30 years, or even 10 years. Hire the right manager and make a few good signings next summer and next season we can challenge on all fronts.


10.) 12 Nov 2021
12 Nov 2021 14:54:03
GFM, it depends on whether you get the right 2-3 players. Swap Ronaldo with a top class CDM and suddenly our line up could change from:

DDG, AWB, Varane, Maguire, Shaw, McTominay, Fred, Sancho, Bruno, Rashford, Ronaldo.

To:

DDG, AWB, Varane, Maguire, Shaw, Rice, DvdB, Sancho, Bruno, Rashford, Cavani.

Similar quality in attack and defence, but a much better more balanced midfield capable of going toe to toe with most sides if coached properly.

That's just changing one of last summer's signings with another. The

If we hire the wrong manager and they decide to sign a CB, RB and a ST no matter who they are we will struggle to compete with the best as we will still have our main weakness in McFred.

However, if we hire the right manager and they sign one or two midfielders and a RB say then our main weakness has been fixed in midfield. Then we have a side capable of challenging on all fronts.

That's not making excuses but simple understanding of football. To improve you need to bring in the right players in the right positions. Hardly rocket science so I'm sure you can keep up.

I agree under our current ownership and with how the club is currently set up whether we are capable of making simple decisions correctly might mean we are forever chasing the next manager as the right one who'll fix everything.

However, based on the squad we have now, the potential of the players in that squad then we are only a couple of players away from having a side that can really go to any stadium anywhere and win any game.

If people really think that Ole has put the club back years then they won't be expecting the next manager to even get us close to top four or challenging for any tournaments.

This club should always be aiming to win things, if the next manager has a realistic chance of doing that next season then we aren't years away from where we should be. Simple as that.


11.) 12 Nov 2021
12 Nov 2021 15:20:05
shappy- youve just repeated your earlier post!
Furthermore contradicted it and then used Liverpool as a comparative yardstick.
You doubt, your opinion, no evidence, cavani is a one of six great options, rashford is fine (maybe but he still isn't performing as well as he can, walking to the halfway line when losing the ball v liverpool), Donny has had very few minutes after he was signed FACT, changed agent FACT but he's fine
Contradicts themselves 30 year bavck- yes the football is poor to watch as it was early fergie years and we won nowt then- knock knock, doesn't mean it would take 30 year to put it right though, shappy not AKA carol vorderman!
Then we have your opinion in the club according to shappy; varane top class, agree but up until now phil jones is carrying less injuries this season, shaw class but off form, maguire and Awb - howay shappy it was the verve who said the drugs don't work fella, you're proving they do! Then we have good squad options when they are mooted to be either surplus or available- but FACT they aren't that good as they get slated regularly But you may care to ignore those posts eh? finally the youth- I will agree they have potential but that's all . If they don't get minutes what use are they really? They gather experience and odd cup minutes in a cup by the way we are already out of, and then blank. You earlier state fred was a good squad player and matic adds experience, then above you say mcfred isn't good enough and matic likely to go!
We do need players in mid- the right ones but that isn't the only area to be a top side competing against pool and chelsea- possibly city, leicester city that is. How long can we keep on a fEw more signings then now and when? Seriously.
When players are walking off the pitch moaning, punching tunnel roof and starting to argue on it then its a sign that not all is well in the camp. Youll probably twist it to plan c as per usual and I can't be arsed with yer ramblings today mate, I'm too disappointed with my club and the direction its been driven.


12.) 12 Nov 2021
12 Nov 2021 16:06:33
Funky, so let me get this right. The club has been taken backwards 30 years, to a point where we didn't have a squad that could challenge, was devoid of quality, and needed rebuilding top to bottom. Yet in 6 months time we could have a side ready to challenge on all fronts but without having to do all the work of rebuilding the side top to bottom. Or at least that seems the long and short of it after decifering your ramblings.

Either we have a side that is nowhere near challenging like it was 30 years ago.

Or we have a side that with minor adjustments could challenge on ALL fronts.

It can't be both.

I didn't contradict myself anywhere. If you think I did then I'm sure you can post what I said and what I said that contradicts that. If not I'll just assume it's simple deflection.

It's fairly simple, we have a squad that with a couple of good signings and a capable manager will have us challenging on all fronts.

If you want a contradiction then you can't turn around and say that Ole has destroyed this team, made the squad worse, and has them a million miles away from competing. Then in your next breath say that Ole should be sacked because we have a team capable of challenging and the reason they aren't is because he has them underperforming.

Forget the manager, with the squad we have we should be challenging for most trophies but probably just falling short due to the lack of quality in midfield.

The fact that we aren't is proof that the manager is underperforming and cannot get the best out of the players he has.

Bring in a manager who can, plus adding that quality in midfield and suddenly we are not just capable of challenging but of actually winning things.


13.) 12 Nov 2021
12 Nov 2021 17:20:19
typical shappy- i never said the things you post its your deluded interpretation. I never said we were 2/ 3 players and a good/ better coach from competing on all fronts RTFP. At no point did I say "If you want a contradiction then you can't turn around and say that Ole has destroyed this team, made the squad worse, and has them a million miles away from competing. Then in your next breath say that Ole should be sacked because we have a team capable of challenging and the reason they aren't is because he has them underperforming. " FORget the manager- you're a joke - you were running your lips all over him not long back now you say he is under performing!
And its as simple as adding quality and a decent coach you say? Really? I hope you are right but a0 never said it was B0 don't believe its that simple. Ole should go because he cannot coach- simply put and yes it is demoralising for pros but yet again shappy you see what you want to see and interpret what you want to. You have your opinion and that is proven to change on a regular basis, fine but don't try and point score by being a liar stating things have been written when they havent. The club and ole have declined and the longer the results continue to be poor, we don't promote youth as many seem to think we are in a positon to do so and the football is dismal to watch, then we at best will be static but certainly not improving. Time takes time and the longer we fail to address issues, then players who are ok/ in form will certainly get older and then their positions need to be addressed. We all (mostly ) understand that players are transient employees of a club but the manager doesn't have to be if they are capable.

{Ed001's Note - I am struggling with his assertion that 30 years ago United didn't have a squad to challenge for a title. Surely 30 years ago would be the 1991/92 season, where United were only just beaten by Leeds to the league title?}


14.) 12 Nov 2021
12 Nov 2021 17:57:47
Shappy if you don't think Donny is a lost soul under Ole then there is no point discussing stuff with you. Ronaldo is miffed and there's ton of evidence if you want to look at it. You watch the games i assume. Did you not see Ronaldo mocking Oles actions? Ole has just one action that he makes with his arms. Ronaldo mocked that a couple of times during the game as if to say what nonsense do you keep doing all the time.


15.) 12 Nov 2021
12 Nov 2021 17:49:14
ed001 - you're correct i later stated the early fergie years my bad maths. My op was my opinion that OGS hasn't got a clear direction or the skill set to coach the club and that is having a knock on effect with the players. Every few months its said we need 1/ 2 players to chalenge etc we are just a dm short but that wears thin and the longer we go on treading water the players who do or are capable of a performance are frustrated and get older which inevitably leads to the need to recruit more. I know this is the same at all clubs but given the money spent, the expectations the fans have and the lack of progress over the past 8 seasons, imo we should be at a better level.


16.) 12 Nov 2021
12 Nov 2021 19:19:31
Funky, wow your knickers are twisted.

If you can't see that saying Ole has set the club back 30 years is hyperbole then there probably isn't much point carrying on a discussion as you don't know what it is.


17.) 13 Nov 2021
13 Nov 2021 00:08:20
What daft thread.