Manchester United Banter Archive November 11 2013

 

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11 Nov 2013 21:34:55
Just a reminder that shappy and Sydney wanted to get rid of Wayne. That's all.

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11 Nov 2013 23:16:08
And on several occasions i've gladly eaten humble pie over it. I felt that he had lost his love of the game. And he seemed to be chasing money more than playing for glory. And as such considering his lack of motivation last season and his contract situation that it would be best to move him on whike he still had some value.

But he seems to have refound his form and he seems to be motivated and has found his fitness and form.

But and there is a but, his contract is still running out and something will need to be sorted out soon or he may yet leave.

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Kg,

I'm sure they can speak for themselves but both of them said if Rooney didn't sort out his fitness issues and his head wasn't right then we didn't want him at the club. I think it is safe to say he has sorted both of these things out and is playing at somewhere the best of his ability.

He still hasn't signed a new contract though and his agent will still want him to move elsewhere for that final pay day so it's going to be a big cjallenge to keep hold of him.

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Just a reminder this is a site for fans to post their opinions. All of which are perfectly valid. And for what's it worth, at the time posted and based on lacklustre displays by Rooney and moreover his apparent desire to move elsewhere, for the right money he should have been sold.

£40m from a non Prem team and he would've gone. Would also have gone IMO if Fergie hadn't retired.

It's the fact we didn't receive any such bids and Fergie going which led to a new challenge, and one he's clearly buckled down to, that Rooney is still here.

No-ones ever said they wanted to sell the 2010 Rooney have they?

I'm v glad he's back to top form. But he did need to get back into top form.

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See your as classy as ever KG. Another pointless post.
Thats all.

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I am still comfortable if he goes. There is no guarantee he won't have another issue - a good start to the season (a very good start) doesn't suddenly mean everything is ok

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He has had a very good start and no one can deny that. His first touch is still as abysmal as ever though. For a guy who people talk of so highly I am always shocked by just how bad his control and even his short passing are. Thankfully, he makes up for that with energy and effort and so can recover a poor first touch on most occasions. Sunday was one of the worst displays of control I have seen from a player in a long time. Thankfully his corner made amends and we were too good for Arsenal anyway.

When he goes he will be replaced and I honestly don't think we will notice a huge difference. Januzaj will probably take his number 10 role and we may go for Reus to play on the left with Kagawa going the other way unfortunately.

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Rooney looks like he can get even better and we would be mad to let him go. Without doubt the best single player in the league and he can get better 28 to 32 can be his best most effective years, the sort of player he is almost impossible to replace we need Wayne the man now not boy he once was, under Moyes he is flourishing

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Well, quite frankly, Shapps was a little OTT with a few things he said about Wayne this summer. In fact some of the predictions were extremely harsh for someone who has arguably spent his 9 best years with the club. Well I guess, its all water under the bridge. Long may his form continue.

Brendan - man united hate him, don't you? Reading your comment again, I will never have an argument with you with regards to Rooney. We are on extreme opposite ends of the spectrum. It can't be healthy ;) .

I still think he is our best player when on his game. He just lifts the crowd, the players up. I think he will finish his career with us. I completely disagree with comments that say that "It won't make a difference if he goes" or "We would be comfortable". He is easily the heartbeat of our team and has been for a long long time. One major reason why we are in the chasing pack.

Deeps.

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Oops. I meant "Man you hate him" and not "Man United hate him" LOL.

Deeps.

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Deeps - I think Brendan's observation about Rooney's control and short passing are spot-on. He's awful at both lol.

However - he makes up for it with his tenacity, exceptional work-rate and long range passing.

Note the comment around work-rate. The current iteration of Rooney is well up for every game hence its v high. Not always been the case though has it?

As others have pointed out there doesn't look to be new contract discussions yet (Eds - please correct if you understand to the contrary) hence with that in mind I still think Rooney may go in the summer.

Lets wait and see. If Rooney keeps this level of form up of course we want to keep him. Even though he can't control a ball to save his life he's still, when he turns it on, a v good player.

Katef - i'm appreciate the norm is strikers to hit their peek at 29/30 but i'm less convinced about Rooney. If he's always struggled with his weight etc his natural peek may occur sooner. I think we are seeing it now in all honesty.

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Halesini

While I agree that his short passing and control are a bit hit and miss, the statement I was referring to was

"Sunday was one of the worst displays of control I have seen from a player in a long time."

That for me is a statement that shows how much Brendan loves Wazza ;) .

Deeps.

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Ha ha Deeps I honestly don't hate Rooney, people think I do as for the past year my posts on him have been mainly negative, but that has been because of his performances not my hatred. I supported him through his granny love and the world cup sending off etc, as he was a United player and was giving his all in the red shirt and that is all that matters to me.

As of late he hadnt been showing that same commitment etc with his poor shape, apparent lack of interest at times and verbally and privately stating his desire to leave. Therefore, my support and respect for him, unfortunately, has decreased. If we are talking hatred there are only 2 players at United I really can't stand and they are Young and Nani. I have aired my views on them on numerous occasions and would let them leave for free to get them out of the club.

Also, when I said it was the worst performance of control, I meant from a player who is thought of so highly in the game, not just any old player. I also agree with Halesini. Most players are at there peak between 27 and 30 but I think Rooney has peaked and is starting the long road down again. His performances this season have been good but most of outfield players have been pretty poor so it wouldn't take much to look good. He has scored some great freekicks but open play wise he hasn't set the world alight and as I say his first touch and short passing are hugely frustrating, for me anyway. I think the emergence of Januzaj has lifted us this season more than anything and for me he is my player of the season do far. I think starting next season he could easily take Rooneys number 10 role and due to his excellent first touch and passing, we wouldn't miss Rooney half as much as people think. Obviously, we need a few more players to make us great again, but if we were to get say Hummels, Coentrao, Herrera and Reus and Rooney left, it wouldn't be a problem in my eyes.

S to sum up, I don't hate the guy but I haven't liked what I have seen and some of the things I continue to see. He has improved his attitude and effort again but he is not the player we saw a few years ago and he won't be again in my eyes. I think he may leave but if not I won't be upset unless he is handed a pay rise.

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11 Nov 2013 19:45:44
Great result. Right back in race.
In Moyes we trust.

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11 Nov 2013 18:20:05
Not United related, but I wonder who everyone thinks will win the Balon d'Or this year? Likely to be Messi again as he is Fifa's favourite man on the earth! What will be more interesting is who will win it next year? Messi is set to miss 2 months so will be some way behind other candidates for next years prize by the time he returns to action!

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I just think is fifa tinkered guff and I was more interested in the simple world player of the year, European, South American etc.
Either Messi or Ribery will win it but I couldn't really care less. I've got my own opinion on Messi which some people here will know. Either way Barca and Bayern would quite a bit of influence within uefa and fifa so will be a close call. The Germans will expect a bayern player to run close even though that player should be sweinsteiger IMO who was pushed forward.

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Messi this year, Neymar the year after.

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11 Nov 2013 20:12:05
Clearly the outstanding candidate is Bebe.

On a serious note there really is no point paying attention to FIFAs silly little popularity contest. Messi will win it and he will continue to win until he retires, as he is FIFAs golden boy.

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I think Lahm or Ronaldo, either would be deserved imo

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You don't think there is a chance blatter might try to award it to himself.
who do you think will get the goal of the year award "puskas"
im thinking zlat will probably win it but i'm hoping nemanja matic or juan manuel olivera get it. both scored great goals, even di natale scored a nice goal.

as for the ballon I hope cr7 gets it but that won't happen. I would put money on ribery. got the treble, scored a few and got a lot of assists. I still wouldn't leave out blatters "good boy" messi.

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I never understand anyone ever putting up anyone bar Messi everyone so far up his arse

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A shame ibrahimovic doesn't get a shout

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11 Nov 2013 17:58:38
hi all, Some of the transfer targets wanted by so many of you in the summer are hardly setting the world alight, with the exception of Strootman and last minute.com de rossi (both playing in a very poor Italy league) very few of the others are ecelling this season. reus very average against arsenal and may crash out of CL, gundagon hardly kicked a ball, herrera out of the team as is Khedira, lemala wants to go home as does Moura, contraoe can't get a game ahead of Marcello. Draxler, thiago hardly kicked a ball all season, cesc has done well when selected . erikson proving why nobody else took him with 1 good game every 4. perhaps Moyes was right to bide his time and get to know exactly who he needs and who he needs to move on. I called for patience weeks ago and have resisted to post with the usual kneejerk reactions to some poor displays. I think Moyes is very astute andwill get the right players in the question is can he keep us competitive until then and just in the last few weeks he has been proving he can. but I for 1 am glad he has not jumped in and signed some of the media darlings.
Ken

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Careful, Ken. Backing the judgement of a long-established Premiership and his backroom team, over posters who watch a bit of football and read a few papers?

You're asking for trouble, mate.

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So Reus was average in one game, and Gundogan hardly got a kick in 1 game and their not good enough?

Wow i'm glad your not a scout if your basing assessments on players on 1 game.

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11 Nov 2013 20:22:46
Hardly fair when half the players you've mentioned have had injuries keeping them out of their respective teams. Herrera has had a couple of niggling injuries and apparently his head has been turned by our attention. Gundogan has had a back problem and has been restricted to only a few appreances. Lucas Moura had a decent season last year but has been dropped this year as a new manager has come in and changed formation which has left him without a place in the team. Lamela has been unfortunate in that he is stuggling to adapt and other players who were previously squad players have really stepped up, that is also why Eriksen has struggled to nail down a long term place.
Coentrao was a target because he was always second choice to Marcello and he wanted to play more games. But let's be honest just because he isn't playing for Madrid atm that doesn't mean he wouldn't be a better player for us considering our lack of quality options in his position.

But I get your meaning in that we sometimes don't give our own players enough credit and tend to think that the cow in the next field looks better than our own cow. Or something like that.

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Don't fancy your cow much Shappy ;)

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Some good points there ken although I don't agree with some of it. Here are my views :-

1. Strootman - He is a good player but nothing out of this world that we should feel sorry for ourselves to have missed out on. He could have been a decent signing for us, but looking at his attributes he is more suited to the Italian league.

2. De Rossi - I think the club was looking at him as an alternative to Fellaini since Everton were being so difficult to deal with. His age is a concern and having played in the Italian league for so long, whether he would have adapted is anyone's guess. A top player, but for how long?

3. Reus - He is an excellent player. End of. We would be lucky to have him, but he was never really targeted in the summer and is at the moment happy at Dortmund and won't be allowed to leave. I would definitely take him over Kagawa on the left. He is only going to improve.

4. Gundogan - He would be the perfect signing for us, the only reason he hasn't excelled this year is an injury. But, there was never any chance of getting him in the summer with Goetze gone. He will have a year left on his contract this summer and it should be interesting to see if we throw our hat in the ring. Don't think he was targeted last summer either knowing that it was nearly impossible to persuade Dortmund to sell.

5. Herrera - He is a player I have watched quite a lot and he would fit like a glove. His form before the United bidding fiasco was excellent and he was their best player last year. Their coach has brought a couple of players in and has tried to change the system and it hasn't worked. He has also been used in a position that does not suit him.

The coach and president of the club have made some public comments about Herrera which haven't helped at all. It is almost as if they are readying the fans for a sale of Herrera. Maybe their stance on the buyout clause will have changed.

6. Draxler - His best position is behind the main striker, where Rooney and Kagawa play. Just like Ozil, we never needed him. There was no real interest in signing him.

7. Thiago - He is a very good young player. United's offer was of no interest to him and he waited to see what else was on the table and was waiting for Bayern to make an offer which he wanted. We know this. Its pointless blaming anyone for not signing him. He would have been a very good signing though.

8. Cesc - Its well documented what happened there. He would be an excellent signing. He has been making noises about not being a first team player. The injury to Messi might change that a little bit, but with Barcelona interested in Koke, I wonder whether Fabregas will move next summer after the WC.

9. Moura - He is a good player but at that pricetag is not worth it.

10. Coentrao - Still a target, a very real possibility this January. The only reason the deal didn't go through was because Real Madrid failed to sign his replacement. His form has been patchy since he has not had a consistent run of games.

11. Eriksen - He is a mercenary and its well known that he will jump at any chance to join one of the Spanish big two. His best position is again behind the main striker and we didn't need to strengthen there.

12. I'm surprised you did not mention Lewandowski, Di Maria, Garay who were very real Sir Alex targets before Moyes came.

13. Moyes' recruitment process - He likes to have detailed reports before signing players. It was always going to be difficult once he changed targets in the summer. Garay, Di Maria are being reviewed by him and may well be options in the summer.

Everyone is so quick to talk about Spurs and City's strategy from this summer and how they got their targets, yet it doesn't look like they have significantly improved to me, at least not from what I have seen so far. Of course, they might improve with time, but the 100mil or so spent by both clubs doesn't look to have elevated them to a level that would have been expected.

We need to give the new management time and only judge the results of the transfer strategy after the next few windows for all the clubs mentioned.

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So Fellaini was a good buy then Ken?
We paid 27 million pound for him.
Im not saying Fellaini is a bad player but I could never ever see him fitting in with United's style of play. It was a panic buy and a bad one at that.

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Ken, good post, but wouldn't back moyes's judgement so far based on our purchase of fellaini m who has been the worst of all the players you mentioned.

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11 Nov 2013 17:55:27
I know most of you have probably seen it but I thought i'd mention it for those of you that haven't, check out Paul Pogba's goal against Napoli the other night. Simply incredible.

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Yes it was good but Pogba was always going to go within 2 years max whatever happened. He will be another zlatan with more clubs than Peter stringfellow.

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Even he admitted that it was a hit and hope. You really need to get over Pogba he was the past, no need to bring him up every time he does anything remotely interesting!

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Was pogba at united? I can't remember!

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Come on lads it has been 4 or 5 days since someone mentioned pogba, cut him some slack!

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Haha! What?! All I said was that it was a good goal, just like Januzaj's against Sunderland it takes technique to hit a ball on the volley. At what point did I mention anything about his past or future? Give me strength.

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Oz,

This is a Manchester United site, whenever Paul Pogba puts his underpants on somebody posts on here, we know you didn't mention about his past or future, but you didn't mention all the other good goals this weekend by players who didn't play for us, so there was obviously a reason.

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Yeah the reason being I'm a fan of his, I like the way he plays and I know a lot others do on here who used to watch him in the reserves so what's the problem? You lot act like he's f**king voldermort, the one who should not be spoken of haha

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Ha ha! Great reply Oz! We can still comment! Granted he would have been another Viera every summer with regards to him leaving or not! he's a massive ego as well. Would love to still have him but it's in the past. No problem with anyone bringing him up in posts. The circumstances for leaving shouldn't dictate our fans mentioning him on a fans forum! After all, don't many mention Ronaldo?!

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11 Nov 2013 17:40:10
great team performance yesterday, still long way to go, but still got the spirit, got to say to our arsenal friends, you had us going a bit in the 2nd half, and fair play to your honesty, if there's one thing I wish is for jonessy to stop thinking that he's Bryan Robson, every time he goes into a tackle he ends up limping, got to time them tackles a lot better, so lads its going to be a long road to tread but as always will get, never give up we have faith in Moyes

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11 Nov 2013 13:54:45
One thing that was interesting from Arsene Wenger's pre match interview was that he mentioned Rene Muelensteen was key in convincing RVP to move to United. That got me thinking about the amount of influence coaches had on Sir Alex's transfer targets and whether there was a bias in buying players who played in certain countries.

With Queroz we targeted Nani, Anderson and the likes from Portugal.

With Rene becoming more influential later on we targeted Sneijder, Buttner, Jetro Willems was a target and obviously Strootman was earmarked as a signing too, and RVP was signed as well, all from Holland.

I wonder whether this might change under David Moyes, and how his recruitment system will take shape and effect at United. We have already seen Phil Neville going out to have a look at various left backs, Coentrao and Moreno in particular. We know Moyes is a keen follower of German Football as well. The pattern in the next few windows should be interesting to see.

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While it might make it harder to persuade certain targets from various countries to join I don't think it will change who Moyes will actually go after.

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11 Nov 2013 13:17:44
Yesterday, I can say I've never been more proud of a team performance from Manchester United. David moyes at Everton was known for getting his teams to give him 100% and yesterday for the first time I believe everyone on the pitch have it their all. Yeah you'll slate cleverly but the guy came on and worked hard out arsenal under pressure. He did a similar job to jones in the first half therefore ozil didn't get a kick. I felt smalling had his best game for us in quite a while, missed a great chance but also made a great challenge on giroud too. Jonny Evans is for me just a magnificent centre back now top quality. Hopefully vida is okay (any news?). I was so impressed with the back 4 yesterday, I worried when vida went off we'd maybe conceded but Phil jones and Evans played out of their skin. Finally it was good to see Wayne and Robin both run their socks off, at times I've question rooneys commitment but I firmly believe he wants to be here under moyes and he will finish his career here. I was also estatic to see Robin celebrate his goal, after a years worth of abuse from arsenal fans it's about time he properly shut them up! Great performance and slowly but surely we are climbing the table again!

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Caolan2 I certainly agree that rooneys performance was good (as it has been all season) but still have a niggling feeling he doesn't want to be here long term. I could be wrong and hope I am but either way I don't mind if he is giving his all as he has been doing.

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11 Nov 2013 12:49:45
Well that was good wasn't it? Big pat on the back to all the fans at the game yesterday, when we were struggling to get possession in the second half the fans were the 12th man roaring the team to keep going, I loved every second of being there and the team proved a lot of the doubters wrong.

This team will not finish outside of the top 4, we are 5 points off the top and we have already played liverpool and city away from home. We didn't do great in these games but we have enough time to put that right. Everybody knows the issues and who we need to buy but the doom and gloom merchants after every game we lose get proved wrong time and time again season after season.

I thought Jones was fantastic first half, reminded me of the games Phil Neville played against Arsenal when he used to up his game and be the star man against them. Phil could be our midfield battler if he kept that form up when playing in that position. Even in the 2nd half I thought he did well after we lost Vidic who was fantastic himself before his injury.

Credit to Moyes, he got it right yesterday, team selection and subs. I wanted Januzaj to play but I understand why he didn't and bringing Giggs on to keep the ball on the left wing worked really well. Fellaini coming on to hold the ball up worked a treat as well and he got into the game pretty quickly despite only being on for 8 minutes.

Finally, the Arsenal fans who posted on here over the last week are what football should be about, they were honest and spoke openly without having blinkers on about their own team. That would never happen with Liverpool, City or Chelsea fans, or Everton fans over the summer who seemed to join in with the petty 'banter', and it was refreshing. To come on after the game and say well done showed their class and good luck to them for the rest of the season, as long as they don't finish above us!

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11 Nov 2013 08:30:44
Whats all the fuss with RVPs celebration yesterday. He's a United player now and scored a beauty so deserved his celebrations. He has shown enough respect to Arsenal fans in the past 2 seasons. The abuse was too much and the arsenal fans should have seen that coming.
Anyways the performance yesterday was good and Jones was the shining star. Evra was ok untill the last when Sagna was just putting crosses into the United area but thankfully their strikers coudnt connect to any of those. Kagawa never crosses with his left foot and always cuts in. He will be played on the left wing only and he should put in some crosses with his left otherwise he too would become very predictable like Valencia.
Arsenal just didn't settle into the game. Maybe it was the nervousness or it was playing the same team thrice in a week. Mertesaker was missed and Vermalen just wasn't match ready. Credit goes to our defenders and mids who dealt with Arsenal and didn't let them settle in. They are still 5 points clear and they have a team which will bounce back. But things aren't looking bad for us either.

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Well first game this year I've seen us play as a team and Rooney and Jones were truly excellent heck whole team put in a shift happy guy here.

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I would just like to say fair play to the Arsenal lads who post on here. I think you have shown a lot of magnanimity - compared with other rival team supporters who frequent this site.

I still think you guys are right in there come the end of the season.

I think you're a sticker away from being something special, especially when you get the likes of Walcott back.

Our Javier would suit you lot down to the ground.

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