Manchester United Banter Archive December 13 2017

13 Dec 2017 22:47:45
Well. That was all very. ordinary.

14 Dec 2017 08:26:31
It was Stevie. I remember few years back when United had lost the league and Fergie saw the celebrations of the champions at the time and used it as motivation for our players. We subsequently went out and won the league the following season. Instead of mourinho complaining about city's celebrations, he should also have used it to motivate and anger the players. Didn't happen.
One thing that's becoming clear is how little work our team does in comparison to other teams. It was clear on Sunday and last night. Other teams, particularly city, spurs and Liverpool work so hard at winning the ball. They also work very hard at creating space. Our team does neither. In fact, I would hazard to guess that we probably are in the bottom three when it comes to these two stats. There is no substitute for hard work.
On the positive side, Mctominay was excellent and I'm delighted to see Angelo Gomez has signed professional terms with us.
Difficult game at West Brom but we can win it and go on a run. Manager is needed now more than ever.

14 Dec 2017 09:03:47
All the teams that are working harder than us apparently are all below us except city.

We can't be that bad.

14 Dec 2017 10:54:19
I just didn't like the fact that even yesterday, we were more interested in hoofing the ball upfield, rather than playing through the middle.

Intensity was a bit low, so was the build-up play. And I really think, Mou should work on pressing teams, rather than staying so compact and so further back in their own half.

14 Dec 2017 10:59:01
Good win last night I thought, the conditions were bloody awful and Bournemouth played well, was never going to be one for the purists, Liverpool drew 0-0 in similar conditions against a worse team, good result after Sunday, no doubt we can go on a run with a fresh Pogba coming back in for the Christmas period, doubt we will catch city though so even if we win every game from now some people will moan.

14 Dec 2017 12:17:14
At this stage last year our goal difference was plus 7 and we had 8 fewer points. Style aside, if it wasn’t for City’s ridiculus start we would be celebrating being top.

14 Dec 2017 12:32:22
Liverpool and Arsenal both dropped points.

After the city match this midweek round had potential banana skin written all over it. Swansea are no where near the team we have seen over the past 2 seasons and it was a cake walk for city. Bournmouth are a far stronger team than Swansea, make no mistake, it was an excellent 3 points in the context of the week and the conditions.

Take the points and move on.

14 Dec 2017 13:39:00
we have all seen what a massive loss Pogba has been this season. we have 1 more game without him and then as GDS2 has mentioned he should be fresh and ready to help us kick on over christmas. Add to that Shaw will hopefully get some more game time along with scott Mc before we potentially do a little business in January and improve the squad further.

14 Dec 2017 13:51:09
It's almost as if the world hasn't ended because of 1 defeat, who would have thought?

14 Dec 2017 16:50:45
Guys, I've no issue with where we are. It was simply a comment on last night's performance. Very flat, and a draw would not have been undeserved. However, I'd take another 20 1-0's between now and the end of the season.

14 Dec 2017 16:52:57
And to be fair, the conditions were the same for Bournemouth, and it didn't seem to put a dampener on their performance. Glad to see Shaw get another good run out. Just hope it's not purely for selling purposes. And the young lad, McTominay hasn't put a foot wrong since the start of pre-season.

14 Dec 2017 20:11:24
Bolger, all the other teams are not Manchester United. If we worked harder, closed down teams quicker and worked at creating space, we will be much better. And we should be much better, surely you must see that? Were you honestly ok with last night or Sunday performances?

15 Dec 2017 01:27:33
We need the players to dominate mourinho uses what he has half this side r never good enough blind Rojo shaw Fellaini Smalling Herrera this season Carrick is finished Jones to an extent young even Lingard

Even Valencia. when mourinho replaces these players we will be back just time and money let city run away it ain’t sustainable pep will bottle it once Jose has his team.

13 Dec 2017 22:12:14
A typical performance, but a few decent individual performances. I thought Mcyoungkid did very well, Shaw was quality yet again and I'll give Lukaku his dues today, some ropy touches at times but on the whole played well, moved well despite being isolated, won a lot and did well for his goal.

Mata did ok for Mata, but he infuriates me so much with his hampering of fast play, so slow and sets everything back - he would be such a good player for a team that plays to his strengths which is the opposite of how we play. Defence looked solid although DDG needing to pull off far too many decent saves against this type of opposition for my liking. Lingard and Martial were poor imo.

Bournemouth will feel aggrieved not to have gotten a point, at least we got the 3 despite playing some pretty poor and slow football again.

13 Dec 2017 22:24:25
Fair assessment Beasty. I love Mata, but he needs to go and play in Spain or Italy now.

13 Dec 2017 22:48:58
I think it shows beast how much we miss pogba in midfield.

He got a lot of stick last season on here. But man we don't half miss him on the pitch.

13 Dec 2017 23:15:05
Shaw was decent had a good 2nd half. I agree lukaku worked hard. A win with others dropping points unexpectedly is a good night.
We just Have to keep winning games at the moment.

14 Dec 2017 00:25:36
Mctomminay is a decent back up for Pogba for now. He helps the team keep some of the patterns of play because he is prepared to carry the ball forward from central positions and play riskier passes. Herrera and Pogba are completely different players and it is too disruptive when Pogs is out. Lad played well today, some championship clubs looking to loan him, but he might get some game time for us as back up to Pogs.

13 Dec 2017 19:05:25
Shaw, McT and Jones start tonight.

13 Dec 2017 19:12:09
hope Mct has a blinder really good opportunity to do himself justice in a must win game, could be a good player from the little i have seen from him and hope Shaw as well plays well Lukaku to end goal draught.

13 Dec 2017 19:21:57
I want a Lukaku hat-trick tonight. Shaw to assist two of them.

{Ed025's Note - romelu is good against the lesser lights syd so you could be right, its a pity he cant do it against the better teams mate...#flat track bully..

13 Dec 2017 19:35:28
025 - True mate.

13 Dec 2017 19:50:34
Great news. Really high hopes for him. He has the world at his feet very few get this opportunity even fewer make the most of it. He has to be over the moon.

13 Dec 2017 15:00:29
Let's put Sundays game behind us, it's in the past and you can't change the past, but you can learn from it.
The focus is Bournemouth and getting 3 points tonight. We need to focus on getting back 2nd place and closing the gap on City if they drop points.

13 Dec 2017 08:35:32
AJH,

There are things that you have mentioned in a post yesterday that I agree with and then there are things that I might have a different opinion on. So here's my two cents worth of whatever is popping in my head:

Yes, we have done well if you compare us to last season. We are in the knock-out stages of the CL, the FA Cup is still there and even the League Cup (for whatever it counts) . The PL is obviously a different story. Now I'm not going to whine about what has happened, coz it has and there is nothing that one can do about it. There were games where we should have done better.

Liverpool was in my opinion 2 massive points dropped. Stoke was another disaster (strong word, I know), Chelsea were not totally confident when we played them, I think, they were coming after a loss to Roma (not too sure) . And then the recent one City. We all know what we felt about that and we know Mou messed it up big time. And I think, it is safe to say that out of the 4 games mentioned above, Mou messed up all of em (slightly harsh, but just my opinion) .

Now, coming on the argument about winger vs midfielders, I think we need both and I think Mou knew that. He knew offer little from the sides going forward, all of us know Valencia can't cross the ball and Young is not consistent enough, though is better than the others that are there. We also know that Mou tried to sign Perisic and it did not happen for whatever reason, maybe it's the money, maybe Inter did not want to sell, who knows.

But what one does know is the fact that when you are the manager of Manchester United, are you not supposed to have a back-up plan in case Plan A doesn't work? And that was for the left side of the team, what about the right hand side? Was Bale plan A, if not then who was it? If that didn't work then who was the back-up? Surely, you can't just have one option, right?

For the centre of the park, the problem is we have solid holding/ defensive midfielder in Matic and then we have Pogba, who is not your typical holding midfielder, rather, he might just be a box to box midfielder. Now, we all want Pogba to showcase what he's worth inside the oppositions half and not get bogged down by too much defending. But, when that happens, it makes Matic look vulnerable and he can't really do the job alone then.

So, does this mean that we let go of the two in the middle formation? Instead, do we look at a three man midfield? Possibly, Matic + Another CM (no name here) + Pogba and with that, we have a 3 in the front? Lukaku + Martial + Rashford (Mikhi + Lingard + Mata as subs, whatever suits people) . Do you think this formation can work? This way, not only do we solve the problem of being outnumbered in the middle, we also have pace on the wings, which is good.

One more thing that I have noticed every time we play is that out team just doesn't form triangles when we play a short passing game. There is support through the lines, but never through the middle, which baffles me, coz if you want to play a passing game (I don't mean a 'Barca-ish' game) you need to create triangles or maybe that's just my thinking.

All in all, I think results have improved, but nothing drastic has been changed. We are defeating teams we are supposed to, but it's the defensive minded approach against the big ones that are costing us. Certain players need to step up and take command of the game, certain players need to put in some extra hours in the training ground.

13 Dec 2017 10:08:28
I think the meltdown has been a bit over played. We were beaten by the better team on the day, the one that is further on with there plan, and one that can out spend us.

2nd is nothing to start crying about, and Jose will know what he needs but just doesn't have unlimited funds and time to do it. If he did our midfield would have been fixed and so would our RB and LB positions a bit like what city did last window with RB LB and midfielders brought in.

Lastly I don't think our midfield can go toe to toe with sides without pogba. Herrera is no where good enough this season he has gone backwards and i'm not getting into Fellaini, I don't think he will play much now he wants to leave.

13 Dec 2017 10:48:42
FZZ,

I'm not talking about there being a meltdown, I'm just stating a few things and by no means is that me panicking.

I don't think City can outspend us. They are attracting good players, but so are we. I don't know for sure, but I doubt city outbid us for any player, at least not since the time Mou has come in. I think a lot has to do with the player wanting to work for a particular manager (not too sure) .

City spent a bomb in the summer and they didn't really sell their players for a lot of money, so it wasn't like they balanced their buying through selling. United did the same. Yes, we need a RB and LB and that means clearing deadwood, but I think the budget was available to Mou (Again, just what I think) .

I agree, our midfield without Pogba is incomplete and whenever he isn't playing we can see how we simply by-pass our central players. Maybe, Mou could try and strengthen our central area in January.

13 Dec 2017 11:04:43
It will be interesting to see how we progress in midfield JMS model this season was to have 5 pogba matic Carrick Herrera and Fellini . Mctommay has been used maybe due to the Carrick issues and Mata Miki and lingaard are more of a ten or wide players . Come the seasons end Carrick and fellani may not be with us and Herrera is using up most of his credit for his good form 7 month ago . Pogba and matic look as good as any two in the league but quite often face 3 . Without either matic or pogba it's easy to fear the worst against good sides.

13 Dec 2017 17:39:37
Raghav, good post mate. I think, we have the players to compete but for whatever reason we rarely leave look fluid. There have been spells and moments but nothing sustained, even the 4-0 wins were a little stop and start.

I think there is potential in our team that remains untapped and it is up to Jose to get it out. I’m not sure he will though, he will ship some out and ship some more in, which seems a little clinical. I want to see what he’s made of and what he can get out of the players we have.

13 Dec 2017 06:04:48
{Ed's Note - we have posted a new article entitled, Premier League Preview Wednesday 13th December 2017

13 Dec 2017 06:14:51
As usual interesting and great preview Eds though I can’t fully agree with some or the predictions. But predictions are predictions and individual opinions and I totally respect that. Hope some of the Eds are not too emotional in their predictions 😂. That said you never know until the game has ended. That’s why the ball is round. Anything can happen.
That said I expect a couple of surprises from the away games for bigger clubs. Not sure there will be any mauling but could possibly turn out to be a disappointment for these big clubs playing away games.
My rationale is that the lower table clubs are not as easy to be walked all over anymore. In any case, as always many thanks for the insights and predictions. Great jobs. 👏👏.

{Ed001's Note - I have no idea how they decide what to predict but there must be some emotion attached I would assume.}

13 Dec 2017 15:14:17
Sure Ed I totally respect that. Without emotions would be boring as well 😉
In any case interesting and reminds me that everyone is different and that’s the beauty of humankind.
Thanks again.

{Ed001's Note - you just have to remember, no one's perfect. Well except me obviously, but I am the exception that proves the rule.... ;-)