Manchester United Banter Archive July 16 2018

16 Jul 2018 21:04:59
Any news on Mata moving out this summer? Any potential inquiry's or interest?

16 Jul 2018 19:02:38
The sharkopod was very interesting. No surprise that we value Martial highly. The valuation for Pogba will be through the roof no doubt, especially after the world cup.

I doubt Pogba will go. I don't see anyone paying up for him at the moment. The likes of Real Madrid have their focus elsewhere, Juve have already spent big and PSG might be restricted in what they could do with FFP unless they sell Neymar.

I can see the sense in the editor's advice of the club needing to look at player exchange + cash deals as they could suit all parties. If PSG lose Neymar, I can see them going for a Martial. Equally I can see them going for Pogba to add star quality in case Neymar goes.

Could a swap deal involving Verratti or/ and Meunier be done? It could suit everyone. Similarly I see Martial could be used in a deal for Alderweireld to break the deadlock in those negotiations. Maybe Spurs will be willing to come down on their price of Toby if they are etting Martial in return?

I see us being interested in Willian and Chelsea pursuing Martial in return particularly if Hazard leaves for Real Madrid. I also see why Jose likes Perisic. Lukaku would have had a better output with him in the team imo.

The left back slot is interesting and I would be delighted if we got Philip Max and moved on Shaw (time has come imo and he has had enough chances) .

The option of Toni Kroos, if possible could be a great signing if it happens. We have lacked that kind of midfielder who can control the pace of the game and pass teams to death. That is one aspect which Pogba lacks imo and against teams that sit back he isn't as effective.

Varane is another target of ours and if Real are interested in Pogba perhaps something involving him/ Bale/ Kroos or a combination of them could be on the cards.

Overall if we come of this summer with a right sided forward, a CB, LB and maybe a CM then it would have been a great summer with more balance added to the squad.

16 Jul 2018 19:22:32
Unless juve get a lot for pjanic.

16 Jul 2018 19:46:19
I agree with the positions we need to address. The board would be foolish to sell Pogba. If the team does not start the season well, it could be Mourinho that is gone. After just showing what he is capable of, why would the club be in a hurry to get rid of Pogba? Interesting possibilities you mention, but it would be hard to imagine Real letting Kroos or Varane go.

16 Jul 2018 21:45:56
I think he will stay another season.

Would be a fantastic window if we can get, Toby bale and one of the full backs of max and Sandro.

I still think we are still short in the centre of midfield.

16 Jul 2018 16:22:55
Interesting listening to the newest Sharkopod but looking at it, I'm starting to see why ED002 thought getting Jose in was a huge panic by United after LVG.

If United get rid of Pogba and Martial, which they are trying to do, then we are going backwards. Jose has the ability to demotivate anyone who isn't fully developed as a player. You can say it's the players fault but under LVG Martial and even Luke Shaw looked like they were going to be amongst our most influential players, then Jose comes in belittles both of them, strips them of all confidence and now they are both looking to leave/ being forced out.

As for Pogba, we have seem him do everything for France and be that complete player that we wanted. Work rate, intensity, better decision making, it's Jose's job to get that out of him.

If Jose has convinced the board to get rid of Pogba (which according to the Sharkopod it looks like he may well have) we will be getting rid of THE stand out player of our team. A player that has just got man of the match in a world cup final. Can you imagine being one of our other players and hearing the news that 'Pogba is being sold but don't worry we kept Fellaini'. You would be so demoralised, I know I would be.

Another reoccurring theme in the Sharkopod was a conflict between Jose and the board. It looks like Jose keeps wanting 'experienced' players and the club keep blocking or aren't committed to the moves due to low resale value. I personally agree that the players he's looking at are incredibly short term minded, but from the perspective of the board, if they don't agree with the managers methods, then he shouldn't be in the job.

From the outside, the club looks a mess to me and in the next couple of season I think we're going to implode like Chelsea in 2015/ 16. I truly hope I'm wrong but I can't understand selling our two players with the most potential in our squad.

Great managers get the best out of their best players, Jose at the moment is the destroying them.

16 Jul 2018 16:57:32
Fist of all sacking of LVG was down to supporters (toxics fans), the club had no other options than sacking him due fact supporters were turning on him.

I did listen the Sharkopod, I didn't hear were it suggested Mourinho has conviced the club to sell either Pogba and Martial.

In case of Pogba I think Ed002 had put this clearly, all parties ( Pogba and club) see this is the right time to move on.

Martial wants out and the club won't be against is will, which for me is better way. The club has tried to extend his contract unsuccessfully ( Martial agents did say that) .

Both are good players with great potential, but things are not working at utd. I can't say letting them go would be going backwards as this will depend on who replaces them, so you can't come to conclusion as they haven't moved yet and we don't know their replacements.

16 Jul 2018 17:19:13
we turned on LVG because his football was atrocious and he was rubbish.

16 Jul 2018 17:24:45
Ah, the revisionism of the LVG era begins. In a few weeks, I'll be reading that his football style was like a breath of fresh air, innovative and forward-thinking. We were just to dumb to see it.

16 Jul 2018 17:51:19
Personally I think the board is stuck in a hole when it comes to Jose and the changes he wants made to the squad. Selling young, valuable players and replacing them with experienced players on high wages with little resale value is never going to happen when Jose's position isn't exactly secure. If he were to leave the next manager would have a tougher task then when Jose took over.

Nevertheless, the club has to bring in players that they know Jose wants to work with. If Jose thinks he isn't being backed he may have a 15/ 16 esque meltdown as you say.

I think the smart route for the club is to stump up the cash required for Alderweireld and Sandro/ Max. This would give us a more than capable squad and if things haven't improved by next summer, time for Jose to go.

16 Jul 2018 19:21:32
O agree completely with RedNeck. Selling Pogba and Martial will be an absolute disaster. If we're going to replace martial with Mbappe, then it is acceptable, but we wont.
How on earth are we allowing a manager who will not be here this time next year, to sell one of the best midfielders around. And replace Pogba with who? Savic? He's not fit to lace Pogba's boots. Pogba is coming to the stage in his career where he's maturing, and we want to sell him!
I too think the club is going in the wrong direction. I've been saying it for two years. It looks like we're not learning from past mistakes and it seems that Mourinho is going to be allowed to turn the club into a laughing stock and saddle us with players on high wages that are impossible to get rid off.
I've already written the next two seasons off as i can't see any progress will be made this year.
If that is what toxic is, then so be it. But I'm not going tp spend well earned money to massage the huge ego of our manager, when we all know he's in the wrong on most things.

16 Jul 2018 21:10:52
The glorification of Martial again, a player who has not shown that he has what it takes to be the major game changer United need, disappears when it matters too often for me. For sure he shows plenty of skill at times but so did Peter Barnes. The French National team didn’t recognise the immense talent and he had the summer off. Will he realise what he has or will like Ravel Morrison let it go to waste? We need winners, players who get us over the line and Martial just hasn’t shown that, only so many times can you take a horse to water. No doubt he will score a great goal and all the drooling will start yet in the other 9 out of 10 games he will float, failing to make a real impact. It’s his talent, it’s up to him but owes performances to us not the other way round.

16 Jul 2018 21:19:08
AAA

Martial has everything to prove

He hasn’t shown anything to build a side around. Keep him and see if he takes that step up but I really don’t think he had shown a reason to get so wound up about. Building around Pogba is different, but he needs pace on the right to give the outlet.

16 Jul 2018 22:13:06
While Pogba is undoubtedly a World Class player, there are too many conditions attached to getting the best out of him: play him on the left, needs a Kante or Matuidi next to him etc

Jose is not one for allowing such indulgences - he wants warriors and people who’ll run through a wall for him. Maybe another manager would be more lenient towards Pogba. However, JM is our manager, like him or loathe him, and he is under intense pressure to achieve success by the fans, media, board etc, hence why he likes to bring in experienced players whom he can rely on.

Not saying this is right but can understand why JM lost patience with Pogba - and I think Ed002 did say a while ago that there is a realisation at the club that his future belongs in Spain or Italy.

{Ed007's Note - Would a truly world class player need certain conditions and certain players beside him to perform?}

17 Jul 2018 07:42:45
Ed07 no and to be honest he doesn't it's all excuses .

{Ed007's Note - I've never watched Pogba and thought to myself that he had a great game and when you spend that kind of money you expect a player that will boost the squad's overall ability. I don't think Utd would be a poorer team without Pogba and that says it all for me.}

17 Jul 2018 08:47:15
You’re right of course Ed007: maybe we’re all blinded by his potential not what he has actually achieved yet.

It’s up to him whether he develops into a world class player - hope he does it for United. If not, another season of frustration and accusations.

{Ed007's Note - At 25 now Pogba should be at the top of his game but when have you ever seen him dominate an opposing midfield? All the razzmatazz surrounding Pogba seems to blur the lines between hype and his actual ability.}

16 Jul 2018 14:11:52
Now the World Cup is over (and a very enjoyable one at that) we cast our gaze back to domestic football. My question for you is who, realistically, would you like to see us chase whose caught the eye?

If I could sign anyone in world football it'd be Mbappe and Modric, however with my realistic hat on I think Lozano and Pavard would go along way to making our squad more competitive. Whilst he didn't play I'd love Alex Sandro and think Alderweireld or Godin are the best centre back options. I hope we don't get bamboozled into buying Maguire, one tournament wonder who'll be found out against the top sides due to his lack of mobility.

What do you guys think?

16 Jul 2018 14:24:43
Fresh, modric is the dream signing, and Mbappe will be unbelievable. If we get these two, then I'll have more hope of competing with City.
But realistically, we won't get either.

16 Jul 2018 14:40:44
Not really a fan of Pavard myself, had a touch of the Darmian about him for me.

Griezmann was top quality, Kante of course. I don't think we should sign Willian but he looked a different player for Brazil. Meunier was very good and Hazard obviously. I don't think we can afford to go too far off the beaten track, the consistently top players are the usual suspects. I'm gutted we didn't see more of Dybala, as he is great and with Ronnie going there it might have been a golden opportunity for Woody to get hyped up by the media. I also liked the look of Akanji CB for Switzerland as a wild card of sorts, but internationals are a different beast.

16 Jul 2018 15:16:07
Apart from a great goal, I though Pavard offered very little going forward, always going back when in decent positions. We already have players who can do that.

16 Jul 2018 15:45:57
Beast I think the same about Pavard. Very good player but not the right player. I think we are looking more for the overlapping offensive minded players for fb and Pavard seems happier to sit 5 to 10m behind the ball, similar to Damian, and although he would offer us a more defensive option I'm not sure that's what we need.

Of those mentioned Sandro and munier seem to be a better fit and not just for the big name.

16 Jul 2018 16:06:07
In terms of our outside backs, I think we need someone with the stamina to get up and down the flanks for 90 minutes. I still think we need a left back with that profile, hopefully someone with good ability on the ball and able to cross well. Shaw, when fit, is a decent defender, and can run with the ball very well, but he is rather limited and one-footed in tight space, so he usually just plays it backward. Sandro might be heqded to PSG, and Ed002 mentioned Philipp Max from Augsburg who seems to be a very good crosser of the ball. I am having a hard time thinking of other left backs.

At center back, we have a lot of players that are not good enough for our ambitions. Lindelof could become a very good ball-playing CB and should get more minutes this year. The only addition I would hope for is a veteran that can lead the back line, either Alderweireld or Bonucci.

At center mid at the moment, we have Pogba, Matic, Fred along with Herrera, Fellaini, and McTominay. The one type of player missing in that group is a player who can run the game, like a Modric, Scholes, Carrick, Pirlo type. No way that Madrid will let Modric go. One young player I like is Youri Tielemans from Monaco, but I think he will need another year before moving anywhere. Not sure if we could other players in that mold, like Thiago from Bayern or Pjanic from Juventus.

Up front, I would be happy to get Bale, but supposedly it depends on whether he will be promised a major role in Madrid's attack now that CR7 is gone. Perisic impressed at the World Cup, as much for his attitude and work rate as his ability. But it never happened last year, and the rumors have only been floated because of his performance, and not from MUFC in any way.

16 Jul 2018 16:51:23
Pavard good in a back three but plenty better. Vrsaljko of Croatia should be signed asap . A perfect Jose type player strong, full of energy and a fighter. 😆😆.

16 Jul 2018 19:26:31
Muneier is twice the player Pavard is. Very consistent and loves gping forward. Not a Mourinho requirement I'm afraid.

{Ed001's Note - Pavard is a centre back playing out of position to help the team out. He is not a right back and that is why Perisic slaughtered him on Sunday.}

16 Jul 2018 19:55:37
I didn't know that Ed001, I just thought he looked very defensive-minded. Fair enough, then.

{Ed001's Note - yes mate, been a highly touted player who Bayern tried to sign months ago for a month this summer. Not sure if a deal was agreed or not now. I thought I was told he agreed a move, but nothing has come up, so I am beginning to wonder if I remembered it correctly.}

16 Jul 2018 12:26:25
If you missed it yesterday; latest Sharkopod - Megasharkopod vs Godzilla where Ed002 tells you the latest Summer 2018 football transfer rumours.

16 Jul 2018 00:05:09
Thanks for the sharkopod Ed002! So after listening to it would you all be happy with this.?
Outs Ins
Shaw. Alderwerield
Smalling Philipp max
Jones. Kroos
Martial Lozano
Darmian Bale

I’d be over the moon with that! Probably won’t happen but would be awesome!

16 Jul 2018 00:12:11
Id rather keep Martial and not go for Lozano if we are not biying another striker and give Martial the games at center forward.

The rest can go and the players you mentioned as ins will be a a good window for us.

16 Jul 2018 00:21:51
I wasn’t really thinking about martial as a striker as he mostly plays from the left. Lozano for me would work better on the left as he works his socks off and has the quality too. Still I will be happy if martial stays but Lozano would be a great replacement if he were to leave.

16 Jul 2018 01:09:28
Pogba on the out lost as well potentially going off what ed said.

16 Jul 2018 01:43:25
After all the big names thrown around as usual, perhaps the most important name on that list is Philipp Max.

16 Jul 2018 06:53:32
Cheers Ed!

I'd be delighted with a couple of the names mentioned. Alderweireld, Max/ Sandro, Kroos and Bale added would be an unbelievable window. Lozano is also a very interesting player, if Martial goes which I'd prefer not to happen he would be a great replacement.

16 Jul 2018 10:20:56
Can't say I am excited by the possible ins. Alder only if we sell Jones or smalling first and if Shaw is determined to try and prove himself he deserves the opportunity to try. Kroos great player but where would we play him and would rather keep Tony than sign lozano. Bale wd at least fill the hole we have on wide right provided he was willing to play there. Personally would prefer a genuine right winger.
Sorry if this comes across as negative but just giving my opinion. Oh and would definitely look to keep pogba.

{Ed004's Note - I found it quite a concerning Sharkopod. Would be gutted to lose both Pogba and Martial. In particular Pogba who bar Modric was probably the most complete midfielder at the world cup. I'm now at the stage were hoping we only make 2 more signings in Bale and Toby with a few out goings such as Darmian, Jones/Smalling and Blind. Seeing reports this morning that Shaw will get preseason to impress. If I had my way I'd let Young go (would be very harsh) and have Valencia/Dalot on one side, Sandro/Shaw on the other}

16 Jul 2018 10:44:26
SELLING pogba would be stupid.

Obviously the manager and the player had a fallen out last season but when he's given the licence to roam forward he is very good.

I think most of the players mentioned if sold would go on to become better players elsewhere and we will look very very stupid.

For all martials so called strops he is a very talented player. We paid over the odds and for all lvg negatives he along with Shaw was one of the few positives.

I would be gutted to loose martial and pogba.

Jose needs to loosen up otherwise I can't see him lasting past this season like many have said on here.

{Ed002's Note - Pogba is also happy to move on - time has come.}

16 Jul 2018 10:57:35
Great update as always Ed. Thanks for pulling together.
The Pogba transfer like all of them needs a willing seller (concerning but we seem to be), a willing player (as Ed says Pogba seems ready to leave) and a willing buyer to match or get close to our valuation. This is where I think it may da down. Barca, Juventus and PSG maybe interested but are they willing to pay the money? Maybe some player movement to be involved to help.
If Pogba leaves we will surely bring another CM in, if not I think we are done in this area.

16 Jul 2018 11:58:22
Morning guys, big thanks to Ed 2 as always for taking the time to do the Sharkopod.

I know many have reservations but the one name that still jumps out for me on that list is Gareth Bale. I assumed with Zidane leaving then Ronaldo being sold to Juventus that Bale would be staying at Madrid but maybe that isn't necessarily the case.

I think we should do everything we can to make this deal happen. I honestly believe a fit Gareth Bale can take us to the next level.

I think Ed said we might need to get creative and I wouldn't be against using Pogba and cash in some kind of deal to get Bale and maybe even Kroos or Varane. I know it sounds like fantasy football and in reality player swaps are rare but every player has a value and maybe some kind of deal could be done.

I really like Pogba but I think he's plays in moments or spells. You get a brilliant cross, pass, dribble or shot then nothing for long periods. Whilst he's a fantastic footballer I'm not sure he influences the game enough to build a team around. His stock will never be higher and if the Club are seriously considering letting him go then perhaps now is the right time. I certainly wouldn't be against allowing Pogba to join Madrid if we would somehow do a deal to bring Bale and Kroos the other way.

{Ed002's Note - Clubs are looking more toward including players, like they do in Italy, as there is simply not the cash around. Manchester United have so far resisted this but may, as you say, need to reconsider their thinking.}

16 Jul 2018 12:13:35
I'd be happy to see Pogba go, I can see swap deals with cash for the likes of Kroos/ Real, Thiago/ Bayern, Veratti/ PSG, Pjanic/ Juventus - I'd prefer all four of those players to Pogba and if it means we get a bit of money on top to help buy SMS or one of the three not involved in a deal, then we would be doubly strong.

If Martial isn't fancied then I'd be happy to see him go and we spend the money on a RW, as we have Sanchez for the left. I like Martial but no point in him rotting.

Most important signings we have to make are for a RB and LB (if Shaw doesn't cut it), happy with Mick from the Dog and Duck rather than Young out there, so anyone is a bonus. Wouldn't mind Sidibe on the right from Monaco.

16 Jul 2018 18:17:54
Pogba to Madrid, bale and kroos the other way.