Manchester United Banter Archive March 18 2018

18 Mar 2018 20:40:40
I see a lot of Jose bashing on here and in the media and it is quite baffling to me.

We just came off 2 weeks in which we beat Chelsea and Liverpool and reached an FA cup semi final. Yes, we lost in a disappointing fashion in the UCL but that's a 3/ 4 good results that we've achieved. 2 of them against tough opponents.

Liverpool's free scoring front 3 barely had a shot on target and were made to look completely impotent at Old trafford. With all the possession they had we let them create next to nothing and their goal came from a freak Bailly OG. They are behind us in the league, have spent just as much and yet there are no questions asked of Klopp but Jose is under pressure?

I see everyone praising Pochetino, talking him up as a potential United manager yet he's won nothing, his teams regularly crumble and fall at the final hurdle and time and again need Harry Kane to bail them out and are quite inconsistent without him. Yet, there is so much praise for Pochetino but talk of Jose needing to go? Do Spurs really play that much better than us?

So, one loss to Sevilla has to put a manager on the brink when he's won 2 trophies last year, put us back in the UCL, in an FA cup semi final and 2nd in the league to a team that is playing on superhuman levels? Is this Manchester United or Real Madrid/ Chelsea?

Everyone seems to think we have such great players with potential who aren't performing because of the manager, I tend to disagree.

When was the last time Pogba played a full 90 minutes in which he totally controlled the game? He has a few flashes and tricks that sometime come off but he doesn't do the basics a CM is supposed to do of positioning and consistent passing and dictating tempo and gives away the ball cheaply. For a tall guy he repeatedly loses headers on second balls. If there's one mistake Jose has made imo, its buying Pogba. His mistakes got covered up at Juve because of Pirlo and Vidal who were world class. A player who looks good in highlight reels but never delivers over a full 90 minutes and seems to be playing with his mates in the park. He is 25, the days to talk about "potential" are long gone.

There were questions about youth development when Jose came yet he trusts Lingard who is having his best season for us this year, Rashford plays every game and he is trusting a young Scott Mctominay. He's doing the best with the youth at his disposal.

Are Martial and Herrera really that great players? Has Smalling ever filled you up with confidence? And for all the talk of potential, which was the 90 minutes that made you actually see it on the pitch with Shaw? The only ones who are performing consistently imo are Lukaku (even when he didn't score he created chances for others), Matic (been solid all season but been let down by his partner), Mata (always a 7-8/ 10) and Lingard (always has movement and causes problems), Bailly and of course De Gea. The rest of them look, just like they did under Moyes and LVG, go hiding, show no movement and play it sideways instead of taking players on.

How is it that Matic gives that performance he did against Brighton but the others don't? How is it Lukaku creates for his teammates even when he's in bad scoring form? How is it that Lingard shows movement but others don't? Are these guys being told some different tactics by Jose than the others? Or is it a lack of character from the others? For all the talk of defensive tactics, Jose's Chelsea, Madrid and Inter had some really good dominant displays.

I feel the squad Jose took over was very average and needed "major retooling". He didn't start with KDB, Sterling, David Silva, Aguero, Kompany, Fernandinho already at the club and Fergie's lack of investment and the next two managers' poor spending left us in a hole.

He's found one midfielder, striker, a good center back and half a decent center back and made a big mistake on Pogba. Our spending gets very distorted when we look at the overall money spent but one must realize that a huge chunk of it was spent on Lukaku and Pogba. He hasn't actually bought that many players and the squad is largely the same.

Jose's made a lot of enemies in the media, all of whom were just waiting for that one defeat to turn the knife in. The ones who are freaking out over here have never particularly wanted him anyway. Sacking him now will achieve nothing and we will go through another huge process of starting all over again and what is to say the next manager will play the football of your dreams? The grass is always greener on the other side.

The club need to back Jose and let the players know that the manager is in charge and they have to perform or perish and will be shipped out no matter their name. That is the only way some of them will stop slacking off. Has Jose made some mistakes? Yes. But he's done better than most and does not deserve the level of criticism he's getting right now.

18 Mar 2018 21:14:35
Ken meet REDFAITH, REDFAITH, this is ken.

18 Mar 2018 21:18:24
Good post redfaith.

I have consistently said the same players who were there under LVG and Moyes have not performed. 3 different managers and not really performed. For all of joses faults, whether he is the man to take us forward or not, opinions will differ. The players are and have not been good enough for a good 5 or 6 years.

18 Mar 2018 21:50:19
Pogba Miki Sanchez lindelof ibra have all been amazing this season .

18 Mar 2018 21:52:23
For me our biggest problem at the moment is our lack of pressing and intensity. We're just so passive and seem to let even the most average of teams have comfortable possession.

I'd like us to be braver and push 10-20 yards further up the pitch. I'd love to see us play with a much higher intensity and desire especially at Old Trafford.

This was the most disappointing thing about the Sevilla game. We sat back and hoped for something to happen rather than taking the initiative and making something happen. We made it comfortable for them by being far too passive which allowed them to grow in confidence and we just let the game drift dangerously towards full time.

I honestly don't know if this is down to the tactics, a lack of desire on behalf of the players or a combination of the two.

I can't see why a front 4 of Rashford, Sanchez, Lingard and Lukaku shouldn't be able to put the opposition defenders under pressure. Once they start hunting the ball down it becomes infectious, the crowd are engaged and the rest of the team should naturally follow. Sometimes just a bit of effort and desire is enough to energise the crowd and wake everybody up.

For the rest of the season I'd like to see us start games with a higher tempo. Put the opposition under pressure, don't let them settle, be braver with and without the ball, work harder and just get some urgency and intensity back into our game I don't think that's too much to ask.

18 Mar 2018 21:38:27
Great post redfaith.

18 Mar 2018 22:11:20
Pogba has been v hit and miss, lindelof very much improved since the start but Jose seems to prefer smalling? Miki not good enough and already gone, Sanchez, no doubt is very good but not here long enough yet. Ibra won many games for us last season and has been injured this year.

I'm much more worried about the players who have been here years and consistently performed at a level that is just not good enough.

18 Mar 2018 22:13:57
'Jose done nowt wrong'

18 Mar 2018 22:19:33
Take away the likes of smalling and co that have won the epl which players have been here years and proved there not good enough.

Angle
Do you think fellaini is good enough? Do you think Jose rates him?

18 Mar 2018 22:23:36
Jose took over a squad that had just finished on the same points as city and won the fa cup.
Since then only city and pay have spent more . Mind you we got Sanchez and ibra for nothing other than there mega wages .

Not sure Jose has had it as hard as some would like to make out .

18 Mar 2018 23:40:00
Fantastic post redfaith!

19 Mar 2018 02:35:45
Yes jred and only City are above us in the table. City started with a squad that was way better than ours and was massively underperforming. I think our squad was about the level at which it finished under LVG.

I don't think you can compare the likes of Herrera to David Silva in terms of talent. Rashford/ Martial are nowhere near Aguero's level. Kompany is better than every defender Jose started with. Fernandinho is much better than any defensive midfielder Jose had. KDB is much better than any midfielder Jose started with. That's a great base for Pep to build on. Why do you think he went to City instead of us? We are a year or two behind that squad.

How many players has Jose actually bought? The spending is totally distorted by the fees for Lukaku and Pogba.

Pogba - A mistake imo. Massively overrated.
Mkhi - mistake, shipped out.
Lindelof - Getting used to the EPL. Improving slowly.
Zlatan - Short term fix. Worked well for a year.
Lukaku - Long term fix. Performing well.
Matic - Playing well.
Bailly - unlucky with injuries. Absolute rock when fit.
Sanchez - Has barely had 2 months. Too early to judge.

So I would say about a third of his signings have worked out, a third could go either way and a third have flopped.

Why is it that you see Jesse Lingard and to an extent Lukaku and Rashford always pressing defenders but Martial never does it? All of them have the same coach. Valencia has good positioning but Shaw always disappointed. The constantly dropping back instead of pressing to me is much more to do with desire and character than tactics.

Smalling's distribution is piss poor and it hampers the entire attacking structure. We've made some players sound like world beaters who've just been performing badly because of the manager when they're actually quite average. Some of them have gone through 3 managers now and are still just as bad.

19 Mar 2018 02:56:46
Well said redfaith. Well reasoned post.

19 Mar 2018 06:22:28
Great post redfaith.

19 Mar 2018 07:35:42
Red faith - just to play devil's advocate, why would you want to change these rubbish players whose achievements you list or is every success down to José and then when the fans complain about results / tactics its the players fault. Who picks Fellani, who picks as some say the overweight Shaw, who chose to change a successful team against Liverpool for the Sevilla game. You say Smalling's distribution hampers the whole attacking structure, yet José thinks he offers more to the team than his own signing, Lindelof.
Some posters point out that during a 'normal' season we would be challenging for the title, are our players really as bad as some make out. Yes we need changes but I don't buy into the wholesale changes some advocate. For me our failings are a mix of both the players' and manager's faults.
You mention transfers, something I remain unconvinced about with José and think that his record with us is questionable at best.

19 Mar 2018 07:40:11
Have a word Jose sets up the team they play as he wants.
It's not the school yard, they work on how there going to play who there up against what positions they take up depended where the ball is on the pitch .
Jose has bought 8 players or more to the point MAN UNITED have bought 8 players . Take bailly Jose had little input in to buying him .

A third of our new signings have worked out? So 2 thirds haven't 2 out of 3 . That's pretty poor.

19 Mar 2018 07:45:51
This season.
Sanchez poor
Lindelof poor can't get in the team ahead of smalling *who gets dogs abuse in here . But is ahead of lindelof
Bailly been injured most the season like Jones.
Miki sold
Pogba shadow of the player he should be
Ibra awful played 2 games
Matic done well
Lukaku done well .

It's a team game and to suggest that it's only the players who were at the club before Jose is nonsense .
2 players signed since Jose come to the club have done well this season.

19 Mar 2018 07:47:29
Tony, what have you started? Can if worms comes to mind haha. My opinion in mourinho is that he plays rubbish football but somehow gets results. However, we're at the counting part of the season. Every result matters from now on. Will we beat Spurs at Wembley? Will we go there to offer an attacking threat or will we play the same rubbish and lose. Spurs are not Seville. They're much better than Seville. So it'll be interesting to see what happens.
On the player front Redfaith, city had invested better than us, that's a given. They also don't spend a lot on one player but they buy a lot if very good players at good prices. However, mourinho has been here 2 years and in that time, we needed two full backs which he has not sorted (city bought three in one window) . We needed another commanding centre back alongside bailly, not sorted (city bought Laporte) . We needed a winger or two, not sorted (city bought Sanè and Silva) . And most importantly, we needed a midfield and that's definitely not sorted.
So what has mourinho done to warrant our appreciation and respect. He's bought mkhytarian who flopped badly. He bought Pogba who was a world star at Juve and is now flopping terribly. He bought lindelof and he's been below average. And he gave Zlatan a new contract when it is clear the guy is finished. Matic, lukaku and Bailly are the successes. I could have told you that matic and lukaku will succeed as they're PL proven bailly was a good buy. So more than half his expensive purchases have flopped. I'm not mentioning Sanchez here as it's too early to judge.
The way the players are performing does not fill any of us with hope. It is mostly a collection of expensive players playing like strangers. Is that not the manager's job to get them to play as a unit? When mourinho holds a press conference, he insults the fans, the club, the owners, the management, the refs, the press, the medical staff and his own players. He also comes across as extremely thick and lacking in any common sense or clarity. So if the same applies to his tactics and man management, then is it any wonder the players are confused and disillusioned? Is it any wonder the fans are bored and disinterested?
It's one thing supporting the club and another supporting the manager in his actions. I support United passionately and will do till the day I die, but I cannot support a manager who is clearly out of touch and who is harming the reputation of our beloved United.

19 Mar 2018 08:40:03
Lets see what happens in the summer
I hope to see ibra fellaini and carrick leave/ retire
Im also hoping that at least 5 of the following are shown the door. Smalling blind darmian shaw jones herrera mata martial rojo.
I hope that valencia and young become occasional starters covering for new signings.
Ideally i would like to see tuanzabe tfm and mctom in the 1st team squad and 5 new signings
Rb lb cb (depending on out goings) cm×2 rw
Dont care if the signings are big names that cost a lot or if he signs players that cost little. The criteria must be that they fit the system and managers demanding style.
Preferably i'd like to see a couple of proven winners with good big club experience with the right mentality come in along with a couple that want to prove they can move on to the next level.

19 Mar 2018 09:19:34
Good post AAA. Ken, at last; I think we agree!

19 Mar 2018 09:23:08
Dont see what the summer has to do with how the team performs in the present .

Fellaini is a interesting one why would anyone want to get rid of a player the manager would like to keep?
Rojo? We have just given him a new 4 year deal which would suggest the manager is happy with him . So again why would anyone want rid of him .
Surely he must fit the managers system.

19 Mar 2018 09:39:33
Aaa. Pep got the support from tge board to clear the decks completely and replace all the aging under performing players in 1 go.
He could not turn zabaletta kolorov sagna clichie navas nolito fernando ya ya ieanacho managala into the team he wanted. Their board supported him fully. If all those players were still there city would be like they were last season.

Ed002 has said we tried and jose wanted 2 get 2 new full backs and a cb last summer. But they would only spend so much and the board would not allow him to purge all the players he wanted to release.

This summer he must be allowed to do that.

When was the last time that valencia young shaw smalling jones rojo fellaini herrera darmian blind etc enertained you all here 3 4 5 plus years. These guys are not capable of doing that just like the city players pep sold and replaced.

I agree that the football is poor but no manager could get those above to entertain you. A couple of them have a title under fergie but were bit part players at best during that time.

Your right jose needed them replaced. He identified that but has not veen allowed or ed woodward fsiled to secure the replacements. Ed002 has told us that.

Do you really think he has not told the board they need replacing. Of course he has. He is not to blame for the fact they have not been.
As i said above let's see what happens thus summer. I don't nor does anybody expect us to play like city if and when that happens. But the style will be better considersbly ove no doubt about that.

The most succesful manager in our history abused tbe board and owners and threatened to sue them until he was but back in his box. He served several suspensions for abusing refs both during games and in post match comments. Our revered ex club captain ripped into supporters for their lack of vocal support. Jose has said nothing really that most managers don't say at some point.

Lots of people are frustrated me included but i think we need to give jose the support he needs. Lots of players been failing for years. He knows that he wants to do what city did last year and clear the decks. Until he does that this squad will go nowhere just like city's squad went nowhere last year.

19 Mar 2018 09:59:12
So Jose wants rid of fellaini and rojo?
Wanted rid of Valencia? A player that he has made captain and if fit plays .
People don't rate smalling but Jose rates him more than lindelof every game .
I think people get mixed up with what they think should happen and what the manager actually does .
Sanchez pogba lukaku martial etc and a no other manager could get more out of them?
Why is it always pep this pep that? Ranier won a title with a far worse squad than this .

Conte won the league with a team that Jose had 3 points of relegation . They never bought 10 new players they got a manager that could get the best out of the players he has .
If Jose is going to be successful next season he will need to get the players he has, regardless who they are playing

Pogba and Sanchez are top players 100% but no good if there not playing well .
Make no mistake if them 2 alone where playing well this would be a better team to watch .
But it's just excuses over and over again .
Lindelof was going to sort cb out
Pogba was going to sort cm out
Sanchez was going to sort the attack out .

19 Mar 2018 10:02:54
I agree with pretty much all the things u say ken as do many others, clear out players that haven't done much the last few years, get new faces in and get the fullbacks flying forward to give us more width the thing I don't get though is u back the guy giving the players u want out new contracts, he also looks as if against anyone decent the fullbacks aren't given much liscence to bomb on unless we are behind and he selects the very players who haven't hit the heights like Fellini and smalling over his own buys. I like yr ideas ken I'm just not so sure the guy u back is the one that will implement them .

19 Mar 2018 10:03:40
Lot of teams in the league play better footy than United .
With half the resources and players we have .

19 Mar 2018 10:09:24
Slate
Nail on head pal.

19 Mar 2018 10:17:54
You confuse me jred. Yesterday you posted jose has done nowt (i think that means nothing where you come from) wrong. Doing ok. Yet you then slate him and many players at every given opportunity. I think you are a complete wind up merchant or else suffer from mutltiple personality disorder. 😂😂.

19 Mar 2018 10:20:14
Slate, i think its a means to an end at the moment. that's what i'm hoping anyway. 😂.

19 Mar 2018 10:22:22
Conte won the league with the players jose won the league with at chelsea i don't get your point.

19 Mar 2018 10:41:40
I think Jose great at deflection Ken we lose to a team badly Seville that most thought we should beat so Jose then goes into a rant implying the players he inherited aren't as good as others so blame the last guy and it's not Jose's fault, but he duznt mention about 130 millions worth sitting on the bench who weren't selected because he picked the very players he's implying were left to him who aren't good enough ahead of them . If pog and lindlehof had played would have been harder to blame previous managers signings. He picked the team then used it as an out.

19 Mar 2018 10:46:38
So slate says he doesn't think jose is the man to bring us forward i respect your opinion slate. Jred says you have hit nail on the head so agrees with you i assume (but nobody can be sure) but yesterday posted he doesn't think jose shold be fired and is 'doing ok doing nowt wrong'.
So if you agree with slate that jose is not the man to take the club forward but you still don't want him fired because he is doing ok. What is is you want jred? You agree he is not the man but don't want him fired so do you want everything to stay the same? Its an interseting viewpoint pretty unique.
Some want him fired some want him to stay and finish the job but not at all surprisingly you are singing both hymns😂😂😂😂 now that's comedy gold.

19 Mar 2018 10:35:48
Ken
I've said over and over again ed1 tried to tell you yesterday this is just Jose doing what he does.
He is doing nothing wrong other than being Jose why are people surprised?
He is doing what many people said he would before we signed him, it's why a lot didn't want him .

You confuse what you would like to see with what the manager actually does.
Slate hit the nail on the head .

Jose managed to get a team of hazard and co 3 points of relegation .
He won the league getting the same players to play well.
Conte won the league getting them players to play well.

That's what he and any manager needs to do . The rest is just excuses .

You don't rate Valencia the manager made him captain and plays him, you raved about lindelof but want rid of smalling . Jose picks smalling over lindelof
You've gone on and on about selling fellaini manager has backed him .
Want rid of rojo we just give him a new contract .

19 Mar 2018 11:07:42
I think I want pretty much all the things you'd like to see happen to happen ken they all make sense to me I don't dispute any of the things u want, I'm just not so sure Jose will do them that's all.

19 Mar 2018 11:32:04
Im hopeful slate. 👍🏼 we will know this time next year.

19 Mar 2018 12:02:34
I feel a lot of the criticism toward Pogba is fairly harsh. He was instrumental in the success we had in the early season, he came back from injury flying, picking up a MotM performance against Newcastle and played a big part in destroying Arsenal before being sent-off. It's here I believe there is an issue. Since he came back from suspension, he's not put in the same kind of performances, the red card felt severe, was more likely a booking. After that sending off, his competitive edge has lacked, almost like he is afraid to be physical, which is a big part off his game. Maybe this shows signs there are issues with his personality, and that he wasn't able to pick himself up from that, but judging the player's ability, on a part of the season, rather than the season as a whole, seems unfair (after all he's still rating our highest player over on WhoScored, and that cannot be down to his latest performances) . Without that suspension, there's no reason to believe he wouldn't have continued churning out fine performances, but I feel that red card has hurt his confidence a lot and it feels as if he is questioning himself more, pulling out of challenges more, not being as aggressive or competitive.

19 Mar 2018 12:15:50
Josè has spent a lot of money and we set up against a very average Sevilla, like we were playing Barcelona under Pep at the Camp Nou defending a 2.0 lead. Truly embarrassing and the manager got it very very wrong. These are the tactics a massive underdog will play. They were the underdogs, not us. Jose has been slammed by the media and rightly so. You could tell by his lame 12 minute rant that he knows he got it wrong. Sadly this will continue under Jose, wrong manager long-term for us. But probably the best stop-gap option that was available. He's already falling out with players and we seen this at Chelsea. Imagine being Sanchez, Pogba etc and being told to defend all game. Not to push forward and protect a 0.0. I said the same when we played Liverpool last year. They were there for the taking and we were cowards playing a cowardly manager's cowardly tactics.

I'm hoping we can get our stability back and then employ the correct manager who plays the way we play. Pointless buying the likes of Sanchez when we are not letting them flourish. Such a Pity.

19 Mar 2018 12:31:53
We scrape a lot of wins. When was the last time we played even once like City and won convincingly? It's not like we don't have the talent in the team. Imagine Pep with the likes of Martial, Rashford, Sanchez etc. There are fractions within MU who know Jose is not the right man. But issue is the guy they wanted is managing our neighbours. Playing proper football.

19 Mar 2018 12:39:41
I'm not picking anyone out but over the last few days posts herrera is now a surplus player. The player that most on the site wanted as this seasons captain. I admit he hasn't been great but he also hasn't had a run of games. I always persoanally feel he's one of the players that makes himself a nuisance for the opposition. Chases everything and puts a shift in. what's changed.

19 Mar 2018 12:51:31
Ken
Again your stretching in a vain attempt to prove a silly point .
Slate hit the nail on the head when he pointed out that all the things you want aren't the things the manager (who can't do any wrong in your eyes ) Is actually doing .

19 Mar 2018 14:20:02
What are u talking about can't do any wrong in my eyes.

18 Mar 2018 19:38:02
So many mixed messages and opinions out there regards Jose being the right man or not, for winning trophies clearly he still has that knack but will he bring us the top trophies?
Is it more about style of play than winning, playing the right way will surely bring success anyway?
Can Jose play the way we want? Is it due to the personnel that Jose isn't or is he hindering the talent?
Are the media making Jose's life harder or is he bringing it on himself?
So many questions that are hard to decipher, the one thing that has always been the case is fans wanting to win vs fans wanting to see good football so it beggars belief really the powers that be since Fergie have hired such polar opposites to the United way!
Anyway I realise just a rambling but thought I'd put it here.
To answer a question below in more than 1 word, Jose until year 3 then Jardim, unless any Ed's have knowledge of succession plans the club may have in the pipe line already as the did with LVG > Allegri?

18 Mar 2018 20:17:45
What about the fans wanting us to win playing good football WRD? I think that forms the majority of us and there is no reason that shouldn't be the case, lots of other teams do it with inferior players to our own. We have a fine tradition of doing it.

Do any of us trust a plan by the club for the long term benefit? I mean they have hired and signed people completely wrong for what we stand for, waste no end of money whilst doing it. I don't think the decision makers are fit for purpose, so I have zero faith in any plan they may or may not have. I believe the only plan they have is make as much money as possible and ensure sponsorship deals pay out in full by hook or by crook.

19 Mar 2018 07:05:54
Could not agree more - football is an entertainment and that is our « football legacy ». Jose serves up nothing worth watching and yet we have attacking talent that is stifled.

19 Mar 2018 13:05:26
Yes beast is what I said, playing good football should bring success anyway.

18 Mar 2018 19:32:10
So there we have it, spurs away Would be happy with a point. Oops it's a cup match isn't it!

18 Mar 2018 19:55:15
Ticket allocation will be 50/ 50 at least, best hope we make a brilliant atmosphere on the day for the lads!

18 Mar 2018 18:59:19
Clearly there has been a shift in how some fans feel about Jose Mourinho.

let's put aside the pro and cons of his reign. I want to ask a question to see where people are on this right now.

One word answers, no reasons why, or attempts to explain your view. Just a simple name.

Who do you want to be our manager at the start of next season?

I'll go first, Leonardo Jardim.

18 Mar 2018 19:01:52
Pochettino.

18 Mar 2018 19:01:53
Been saying Jardim since LVG reign.

18 Mar 2018 19:05:43
Allegri, pochetino or conte. Otherwise stick with jose.

To be honest i don't really have a problem with joses tenure so far but he seems to be making it his personal mission to tick off the players, fans and club in general.

Wish he'd just button it and focus on improving the team for next season.

18 Mar 2018 19:10:20
Jardim.

18 Mar 2018 19:14:33
Jose Mourinho.

18 Mar 2018 19:24:01
Unlikely, but Diego Simeone.

18 Mar 2018 19:26:17
Jose Mourinho.

18 Mar 2018 19:28:24
Jardim.

18 Mar 2018 19:29:10
Mourinho.

18 Mar 2018 19:29:24
or Beast ;)

18 Mar 2018 19:21:29
Jose Mourinho.

18 Mar 2018 19:44:33
Luke Shaw’s Dad.

18 Mar 2018 19:46:27
Mourinho.

18 Mar 2018 19:46:41
Nagelsmann, only problem that some players might think they are bigger than him.

18 Mar 2018 20:35:36
Jose =BORN WINNER 😆😆.

18 Mar 2018 20:37:17
Frank de Boer.

18 Mar 2018 20:50:49
Mourinho.

18 Mar 2018 21:05:43
Poch, jardim, Tuchel in that order. Let’s hire a young manager who instils attacking football and respects the values and traditions of our club.

18 Mar 2018 21:19:39
Jose.

18 Mar 2018 21:54:40
Poch, Jardim, Simeone or why not Zidane if Real get rid off him.

18 Mar 2018 23:15:13
Big Sam.

19 Mar 2018 01:10:07
Ancellotti.

19 Mar 2018 09:08:18
Ralph Hasenhuttl.

19 Mar 2018 12:51:45
allegri but i think that ship as sailed.

18 Mar 2018 18:11:12
Just a bit of fun and no offence intended but every time i see victor moses hereminds me of the predator 😁 anyone else got any lookalikes ( go on the foxes)

18 Mar 2018 18:40:37
Anderson when he first game to United looked like a predator.

18 Mar 2018 19:01:09
Moses looks like Predator's moody teenage daughter!
Okazaki looks like MR. Miyagi
Bakayoko looks like a donkey
Giroud looks like Rylan Clark from Big Brother.

18 Mar 2018 19:05:23
If Lil Wayne works hard on his body then he has the potential to look like Anderson.

18 Mar 2018 19:06:03
Peter Beardsley looks like Hayley from Corrie.

18 Mar 2018 19:11:23
Vardy looks like steptoe.

18 Mar 2018 20:36:55
Harry Kane = a young Bruce Forsyth 😆😆.

{Ed007's Note - Mesut Ozil and Marty Feldman.}

18 Mar 2018 20:56:33
Firmino looks like gok wan.

18 Mar 2018 18:02:15
Let’s forget all the Jose talk and get back to the important questions. Does Fabregas have the worst comb over in the League. I vote yes.

18 Mar 2018 18:19:05
It's not even a comb over it's just an over.

18 Mar 2018 18:20:29
If your talking dodgy hair doos ajh pogs fellaini and luiz are some of the worst. But yeah fabregas is right up there. I thought you would admire his dimples though 😂.

18 Mar 2018 20:40:55
I think Fabregas sold his hair to Conte and Zola 😲😲.

18 Mar 2018 11:59:34
Ed001 what are your thoughts on Brendan Rogers? I’ve been slated a lot off my friends lately because I think he would be a good shout for the managers role at United.
I appreciate he’s been at Liverpool so there’s slim chance of it happening but I think he’s a modern young manager who actually plays the right way that united fans would want.
I realise pochettino is flavour of the month and the one everybody wants but people forget he’s just gone out at the same point we did in the champions league and his spurs side bottles it more often than not.
For me I think BR would be a great fit.

{Ed001's Note - I think you would hate him after a few months. He is at least as ego-driven as Jose (everything that goes right he claims credit for, everything wrong is someone else's fault), he can't organise a defence and his chosen style of football is awful to watch. It is lots of passing but no penetration at all. Sideways, sideways, back, sideways, sideways, back. That is what you watch with Brendan.

Having said that, I am sure he would have learnt a lot from his time at Liverpool and maybe he would not be as bad as he was but I still edit the Celtic site when 007 is sleeping (which is about 22 hours a day....) and they moan a lot about the defence and passing for passing's sake. So I would not be convinced he would be right for United, even if the fans would accept him. Though I would be surprised if he was not given a chance as Busby was a Liverpool captain and legend before he ever became manager for you, so he could point to that and I would think it would lessen the issues.}

18 Mar 2018 14:24:47
Mac_man? Where did you come from? This has got to be a wind up right?

{Ed001's Note - that was my thought too.}

18 Mar 2018 14:35:35
Except Pochettino, who do you think would be a good fit for united ed1? Not that a change of manager seems likely, just your suggestion. For me Mourinho is not here because everybody wants him here, he is the board's choice, he wants to dominate at united. Looking from far far away it just seems like we don't have a better option and neither does he? If anyone gets a better choice, it could easily be over is what it looks for me.

{Ed001's Note - I did answer with three on a previous thread - Sarri, Jardim and Nagelsmann.}

18 Mar 2018 14:49:30
Come on Mac man you have got to be kidding me? Rodgers is awful and shouldn’t even be mentioned as a potential united manager. I could make 10 managers I would prefer than him.

18 Mar 2018 16:11:34
Can I just make it clear that Mac Man and I are not related.

18 Mar 2018 16:18:33
Thanks for the answer ed01. Of that 3 who would you like to see in charge of this squad and why?

{Ed001's Note - who would I like to see in charge? Mike Bassett, I mean the man is THE legend!

Seriously, if I was picking one looking at it as I was involved in the process as a director and was making a recommendation it would be Jardim. All three have their pros and cons, but Jardim has experience of winning the league, he plays exciting, attractive, attacking football and is very good at developing young players. United's strength has always been an ability to integrate players from the academy and win trophies with them in the team. Jardim would be the man most likely to continue that tradition.}

18 Mar 2018 16:18:45
Did see it Ed but that was after I had sent the post so apologies.

{Ed001's Note - no worries Deep, just saying in case this one ended up being deleted you would still have the answer to hand.}

18 Mar 2018 16:45:10
I did see it and was thinking maybe that needn't be posted Ed. On topic of potential managers, I think we should also try and have someone in a DoF kind of role for transfers because Woodward still looks lacking in that department. He isn't a football guy so seems to want a marquee signing over the sensible deal. And that position seems to have nearly noone. I think one of the eds said like very few people actually want to work for United and we are viewed kind of like a "poison chalice"

{Ed001's Note - I would think having a good, strong, football man in that role would go a long way to resolving the problem.}

18 Mar 2018 16:53:16
Mike Bassett but only if he signs Benson and Hedges.

For me it would be Jardim for same reasons Ed said.

{Ed001's Note - Benson and Hedges - classic gag that one.}

18 Mar 2018 17:27:50
It was good that one. Some brilliant gags in that film. The training complex one, the airport scene. The argentine player called Bastardo.

{Ed001's Note - the captain who was a racist football hooligan was based very heavily on a certain Stuart Pearce. And I do mean very heavily based.}

18 Mar 2018 18:39:28
you never mentioned Max Allegri Ed001, do you rate him?

{Ed001's Note - yes but he does not play United-type football either.}

18 Mar 2018 18:41:00
I always saw a touch of Vinnie Jones in him as well. The Beckham and Gazza ones were more obvious. Didn't know Pearce was a racist.

{Ed001's Note - he was given bans for racially abusing other players. He used to go on trips to Ireland on hooligan rampages with a group of lads. It was said he never got injured playing football while with Forest, yet he picked up a fair few injuries.....}

18 Mar 2018 11:39:28
I have b n as disappointed as all over the last weeke or so. I thought the Liverpool win had set us up to beat Seville, not to be. Hugely disappointing. But it was just one game.
So a question to the ED's and regular posters. If we accept that Mourinho gets another year, gets a good budget to improve the team/ squad, what do people think it will take to make this team truely competitive (with the likes of City, Madrid, Barca, Bayern, Juve) next season? I personally don't rate PSG very highly.
Who does he need to bring in to fix the issues he has talked about over the last week? Looking forward to the answers and opinions.

{Ed025's Note - there is only one way for united to be truely competitive mike, and thats to part company with the manager mate..

18 Mar 2018 13:01:21
It’s a good question, and what Jose would like and us fans may want will certainly be different!

Jose needs players that will carry out orders effectively and to get us near to that level, playing how Jose wants to play we would need at least 5 first team players. Two new fullbacks, two new attacking players and a CM.

I’ll go with Meunièr and Danny Rose for the fullbacks, Willian and Perisic as the attacking players and Jorginho for CM.

I’m not saying I agree with the above or that those signings would make us competitive, it’s just my opinion on what Jose himself might like to see happen.

18 Mar 2018 12:56:55
Personally i'd be devestated if Mourinho left, but if that were to happen, who would be your pick for manager Ed025?

{Ed025's Note - i think poch would fit well scholes and i also like paulo fonseca who i believe is going places mate..

18 Mar 2018 15:01:36
Do like the way Spurs play their football under Pochettino but he hasn't won a trophy in his managerial career, bit risky. I THINK it was Ed001 who said his teams lack discipline and crumble under pressure, not to mention that when he's had a say on transfers at Spurs they haven't worked out too well, at United he'd have a bigger say than he does there.

Leonardo Jardim would be my pick, but only once Mourinho leaves in 2/ 3 years, get rid of Jose now and i feel as if we'll be in a continuous vicious cycle whereby we get rid of managers every other year, appoint someone with a completely different set of ideas and ways of playing, give them a few hundred million and then after a while the fans will be on his back aswell, process will just repeat itself.

Since Sir Alex left, the past few seasons just seem to be a blur, constant mediocrity and players not trying hard enough, not good enough and lacking effort and commitment. Now Mourinho's questioning these players, whether we as fans or the players, 'pundits and journalists' agree with it morally, it may just be the kick up the a**e they need, Jose's only here for a few years, he doesn't have to 'endear' himself to the fans but as long as he sorts out the mess, leaves the club in a strong position then i couldn't care less what he does or says. I just don't understand why fans are complaning of the way we are playing TWO years after Jose was appointed manager, we knew this is exactly how it was going to be when he first came.

Ideally:
•win the league under Jose
•leave a strong squad for the next manager
•Appoint Jardim/ Maurizio Sarri to 'restore the attacking style play' we were so accustomed to.

Just my opinion fellas😬🤷‍♂️.

18 Mar 2018 09:04:28
Where do I start, I've not read down but I can imagine this post will be similar to many others but I wanted to remain on my own opinion and not influenced.
Firstly we won and we are in an FA Cup semi final, fantastic.
Secondly, we seem to be talking about Jose's pressers more than the team of late, I would say it's Jose at his best deflecting from the teams shortcomings at present but yday Jose called out the majority of his squad.
Is Jose right to call them out, yes probably he is, once they step over that white line the players need to stand up and be counted.
Jose rightly points out that Matic, DDG and RedRom, probably Young are the ones standing tall.
BUT, even if he is right, why say it in such a humiliating fashion, don't get me wrong these egotistical footballers don't deserve protection but to question a players desire is strong.
Jose says he coaches the players to attack and be quicker and more aggressive in attack yet we've rarely seen this in display so why are such talented lads not consistently playing to their ability?
There is only one common denominator and that's the coaching.
I've been a big defender of Jose and have bought into winning is what matters but I am beginning to see that Jose's way of managing isn't sustainable, it implodes, the players lose faith and to answer my own question Jose is now deflecting from his own shortcomings.
I want this to work, it appeared a marriage made in heaven but a few years too late.
He will win things but it will never be pretty and it'll always end in divorce.
It genuinely hurts me to say it but as much I've loved Jose maybe he isn't THE guy to be a UNITED manager.
BUT who is out there and I am loathed to keep changing manager but I worry that come post Jose in 2 years how much catching up we will have to do.
Don't get me wrong the players do need the mentality to show their talents on the pitch also but when the manager is in the press slagging you and your team mate off, let's now forget how close knit a dressing room, why would they want to go on that pitch for Jose.
Matic, RedRom, Zlatan all José backers, that's why he brings them in so he has some control of a dressing room but again isn't sustainable.
I really hope I am wrong and another summer of investment will 'finish' the squad and we suddenly play expansively, I rather doubt it and in the meantime talented players like Pogba, Sanchez, Rashford, Shaw will have been fed up and moved on.
Before anyone says 'oh but we can't keep having transision' I too have said this but post Jose it's going to be another transision and overhaul of players and mentality anyway.
Well that's my say, I hate to go against Jose as I'm a fan but he needs to show us why he's been this serial winner, an fa cup and League cup quite frankly is the bare minimum this great club should be in the hunt for.

18 Mar 2018 10:16:29
I don't understand the big omg he's slagging the players off in public

He's right to single then out and say they were crap if that's what kind of performances they give.

The managers are constantly under scrutiny if the team is under performing so why should it be different for the players.

If I'm under performing in my job I get told I am.

There comes a point where enough is enough there on large amounts of money and it's the fans who are paying each week to watch underperforming players

They should show a bit of pride and show there worth rather than hiding and blaming the manager.

{Ed001's Note - not one good manager in business publicly humiliates their staff. Do you think that is a good way to motivate them to perform better next time? Or do you think it is a good way to turn them against him?}

18 Mar 2018 10:29:14
Welsh it is not wrong to question a players desire if the player is choosing not to live up to the badge. Maze is the first to criticise performances should they be sub par but sometimes you look at the silver lining and most of the time that lining is this - did that player leave all he could on that pitch, did he give 110%? If that answer is no then his desire should be questioned.

Maze is glad to an extent by the public barrage by Jose. Moyes has issues and kept it in house, LVG likewise. Churning over managers and spending s*** lots of cash is not the answer especially if your squad is talented but lacks the mentality to play at this level. Jose is no mug and stands up for himself, sometimes rightly other times wrongly but at least he is consistent.

18 Mar 2018 10:53:27
Ed001, what’s your take on José during the last week, is he losing it a bit, or intentionally sabotaging things with the players and fans?

For me, it seems like his standard deflect attention from his failings by blaming everyone else, but surely he’s aware that his words and actions are alienating a lot of fans and players.

{Ed001's Note - this is just the way he is. He had success and so his ego built up but he has lost the people around him who keep him grounded, so he has become egotistical and forgotten what made him the special one. What he needs is a no man, someone who turns to him and tells him when he is being an idiot. When he primed MUTV to ask him the question so he could read his prepared statement, there should have been someone to tell him it was a mistake.

He reminds me of Clough after losing Peter Taylor, he is succeeding because of the aura left around him, rather than because of what he is doing. He needs to be held down, rather than having Woodward hanging on his every word and nodding along. He was brilliant, but he was proving himself then against all the jibes of being just a translator and having Johan Cruyff against him and his style of football. Now he has nothing left to prove and believes in his own legend. It has become all about him and how he is the greatest, so if it is not going well it must be someone else failing.}

18 Mar 2018 10:57:25
Good post bolger and maze i agree with both of you.
Some of the best businesses have a name and shame policy many of the big plc corporations produce public and share holders documents highlighting areas within the business that are under performing its very common indeed. These are big billion dollar corporations. Divisions that are under performing are highlighted in public and those that run those divisions are challeged very publicaly to turn their performace around if they don't they get replaced. Simple. Its the same for jose himself if he is backed and doent turn it around he will be replaced very publicaly.

18 Mar 2018 11:11:19
Cheers ed, it does seem like he’s on a downward spiral that can only end in one way.

18 Mar 2018 11:16:58
José is a coach, not a manager. Fergie was the complete opposite. Depends what we want. Would be nice to have someone who could do both.

18 Mar 2018 13:01:44
I just think if the players can't take a bit of a roasting for not performing at a club where the fans expect the best then there playing for the wrong team.

18 Mar 2018 13:00:40
ED01 - IF you could pick 3 potential managers to take over and take the club forward who would they be?

{Ed001's Note - Sarri, Jardim and Nagelsmann. Though I would love to see Dyche or Graham Potter get a chance with a big club to see what they could do, neither look ready for a club as huge as United.}

18 Mar 2018 13:10:18
I agree bolger. But i think its clear over the past few years we have plenty of players that are at the wrong team.

18 Mar 2018 07:13:31
I’m getting a bit bemused at the moment. Jose is spoiling for a fight with his players and seems quite happy to tell everyone about it. He says he asked for a more direct quicker tempo last night. The weather was shocking and he could have been conciliatory but instead he called pretty much all of them out publicly.

Now some of us might say he is right (not me) but to do it so publicly suggests one of the following:

1. He has run out of patience with players not following his instructions and feels he needs to publicly shame them.
2. He is lashing out following the criticism directed at him after Tuesday. “It’s not my fault guv, it’s them lazy arse players”.

I’m struggling to think of another reason but given how he exited Chelsea, alienating your whole team seems a little foolish; whatever the reason, he seems completely confident that his position is secure. I think his ego is bruised and even if he is right about desire, personality, and ability, there is no need to be so public or obvious about it.

I really don’t know what to think any more. We need strengthening, but we also need to get the best out of those we have. Take Shaw. He gets a run of games, plays well, earns public praise, and then is dropped for the next game. Eventually recalled last night, I thought he played well, and he gets hooked at half time. I really don’t understand Jose’s approach here, and yes, it does smack of bullying (psychological) .

I think we are seeing a mini meltdown, the difference at United is that Woodward is not a football man and might not realise the implications of what might happen. Jose is one of the world’s best, if he says the players are rubbish then the players are rubbish, blah blah blah.

I suspect we will hear murmurings from the dressing room in the coming days, a unhappy camp will not lead to high levels of commitment and effort, irrespective of what they get paid. The Manager’s job is to inspire and motivate his players, something Jose seems unable to do right now.

18 Mar 2018 07:29:35
Couldn't agree more AJH. His footballing ethos and style have been widely debated but very few seem to be interested in how he actually man managing the squad.

You mention shaw, we can see the exact same thing with martial, rashford and lingard. Martial and lingard were our best performers until sanchez arrived, consequently both have been reduced to bit part players who have had their position changed every game they play and then he throws them under the bus by telling us they are not following his directions. Rashford had a great Liverpool game on the left, he is rewarded by being switched to the right in the next one and dropped in the subsequent match.

All mourinho defenders are quick to point to fergie any time people criticise mourinho for something. Remind me when Fergie consistently threw his players under the bus the save his skin?

Paul scholes refused to play in a game because he was pissed at being dropped for a game, and the only time we heard about it was when scoles himself revealed this after retiring, that is man management, then people wonder why SAF never faced player revolts and why mourinho got fired from his last 2 jobs due to player revolts.

18 Mar 2018 07:46:26
Sir Bobby was right, this is not the type of character we want at our club. Would anyone like to work for a nut case like him? He has the mental maturity of a small child. I told them to play like you wanted and they are not playing properly. It is not my fault.

He has the audacity to talk about our heritage. We are a club of great heritage and diplomacy. We do not want to be the football equivalent of the Jeremy Kyle show.

He talks about developing young players – yes knob say, your public bullying has really helped Luke Shaw! That lad has family and friends, who have to watch him being publicly humiliated.

18 Mar 2018 07:55:44
Ajh, the manager is right.
I don't know exactly what your problem is with the manager being so honest is?
Shaw was not great last night and was caught out on 3 occasions and berated by the manager just before half time. I would imagine he has lost patience with his lack of effort desire and commitment.
He has said some of his players lack the right attitude to be winners and can't cope with the pressure of and are not showing the required dicipline and mentality to represent united.
Is he wrong? I don't think so.

Martial is flakey doesn't work hard enough and I've never seen him grab a game and dominate it or dominate his opponent. He hides and only takes part in the game ehen someone gives him a pass. Then more ofen than not he runs up a cul de sac.

Valencia is finished pace has gone its only his great attitude and experience that is getting him through games.
Jones fellaini blind shaw darmian ibra are squad passengers that offer nothing not even decent competition to poor 1st team starters the likes of valencia young and smalling.

You say he is bullying certain players that's BS. you seem to be happy to give players that have failed this club for years more time and to fulfill potential they showed years ago but nothing since, yet come down hard on the manager that has us in our best league position in 5 years and in our 3rd semi final in 2 years. a huge achievement with such a rag ball rovers squad.

You and others keep saying we have great attcking player's. Who are they?
Lukaku on for seasons best goal haul as is rash as is martial so they are all playing to their level.
I think the issue is you think their level is higher than they have ever achieved. Martial won't make it at united or in the epl. Magic in his feet but rocks for brains. He will thrive elsewhere i hope but i'm not even convinced of that.
Get in the right support and players to compliment sanchez and pogba and watch them flourish.
Jose knows what he is doing.
Poor players need to be exposed we have 8 or 9 stealing a living for past 3 4 or 5 years they need to be called out and removed. If that us bullying in your view then your entitled to your opinion.

Jose is far from perfect but his 3 titles at chelsea were not with boring teams nor were his madrid side boring. Far from it. Check the stats goals for and against and compare them to fergies title winning sides.

Some of our players are good players but have not coped or performed for united. I don't care if they go on to play great elsewhere as long as their replacements perform better than they have for us.

City spend the most recently and are having most success.
When chelsea spent tbe most they had the most success. For 25 years united were biggest spenders and they had most success. Who spends more in spain than Barcelona and madrid?
Who spends more in italy than juve over past 6 years.
Mmmm who is winning the titles i those countries.
Who has biggest budgets in france? Oh psg they are doing very well domestically.
Liverpool and city spent more than us this year and city are reapong the rewards.
If you were a city fan last year would you be slagging pep of for showing stalworths like zabeletta clichie kolorov fernando navas nolito the door.
Has pep bullied ya ya or stones?

I hope the board let jose do his job and support him if they do he will get us our title back.
If not get a new manager in but the fact remains the same the crap players must go and decent profesdional ones need to come in.

{Ed001's Note - goals don't stop a team being boring, the old Wimbledon team scored goals but they were hideous to watch and Jose's teams have all been very similar. No idea why people lie about what Jose has produced with this complete fallacy that his teams were not boring. He was sacked the first time round by Chelsea because of it, he was booted out of Madrid because of it. So why deny it and come up with nonsense? Did you not watch his Inter side bore teams into submission?}

18 Mar 2018 07:57:41
I picked Shaw because he seems to have done what was asked of him and then got immediately dropped. Rashford is a good shout, after a great game against Liverpool he should have been told “you played great son, do it again” but instead he was moved to accommodate Sanchez who has been awful, and then dropped. As for Martial and Pogba, they are clearly very talented players, so why are they playing so poorly / inconsistently?

As I said in my opening post I’m just bemused at the ludicrousness of it all. If press reports are correct then a 30 year old Perisic is one of the answers. don’t see this ending well.

18 Mar 2018 07:58:35
Agreed guys. To be honest, I'm fed up with the whole saga and with mourinho and the sulky and moods. It seems like the place is under a depressive cloud. He's watching our neighbours and the red Scousers play scintillating football close to home and earning all the accolades and his style is being criticised and he in turn is taking it out on the players, the fans, the press and even the medical staff and management.
I'll be honest, until Fergie retired, if United won, I used to be elated and if we lost, I'll be depressed for days. Last night, we won to get into the semi final of the FA cup and I've got no emotions. I watched a boring match where we won but created little excitement and for a defensive set up (supposedly) we allowed them 14 shots to our 8! This is becoming a bit of recurring theme. We are a defensive team but teams are having a record shots on goal against us.
Attack is the best form of defence but I think this is lost on mourinho.
He tinkers with players and tactics too much and then wonders why there's no cohesion or commitment. His man management skills are embarrassingly bad. I've lost the plot with him and I expect most of the players have too.

18 Mar 2018 08:23:10
Ken

You say we have crap players, I say we need strengthening but Jose should be getting mor out of the players we have. You seem to have absolute faith in him and his methods, whereas I think he is yesterday’s man. The last Champions League knockout game he won was with a Real Madrid against us and how long ago was that?

After 2 Cup wins and significant investment I expected to see more progress. People will point to us being 2nd and the goals scored vs last year but after a bright start we have got progressively worse. Jose will always find a way to grind out results and he will be able to point to stats but he is being overtaken by a lot of younger more innovative coaches.

To call put the whole team publicly smacks of someone who has lost control and is unable to influence his players, if you think Jose is the answer then fair enough, but I don’t.

18 Mar 2018 08:31:59
I disagree 001 his chelsea sides to me were not boring. i'm not making it up or in denial that's my honest opinion.
Its not a lie. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I would rather have titles and medicore play than have exciting football and end up as also rans.
Ideally i would like both.
But the fact remains no manager could have this squad higher in the league this seadon than jose has united.
If he set up with tbis squad to go toe to toe with the best teams they would be getting battered and would be where arsenal are now imo.
Will it improve when he gets his players in. i'm of tbe opinion it will.
Will klopp win anything with the best liverpool team for a decade. I di t think so. Will poch at spurs i don't think so. Are they doing better than united at the moment not really. Sure at tbis time tbey are better to watch no argument from me there. But that's not enough for me. Its all about winning.
We have some shicking professionals at unuted that need removing. Under performing for years. Nobody has called them out or rattled their cages.
Tough calls need to be made.
When jose goes i won't look back too fondly at some things but the club are light years behind in their thinking on certain issues and I've no issue with the manager being aggresive with the players or board in his attemp to wake them from their slumber.

{Ed001's Note - if you say so, but forgive me if I don't believe you as no one at the time ever had anything good to say about their style of play. I also think you are talking nonsense about no one doing better than Jose. It is a far better squad than apologists like to admit to, but I give up as there is none so blind as those that don't want to see the truth.}

18 Mar 2018 08:44:48
I watched his inter side win a treble. Just because 2 opinions differ ed001 it doesn't make 1 a lie. Winning is most important so if i say klopp is not a good manager if he fails to win is that a lie.
AAA. see where spurs and liverpool players are in 18 months if they keep failing to but medals on the mantlepiece.
Im not making the argument that our football is good at the moment nor do i like the style. With better players that fit his system it will improve somewhat. It won't be like city but i'm ok with that as long as its better and we are winning.
Fergie had a couple of spells when the team was in tramsition when the football was crap but he kept us competitive through his great management skills. We are 2nd this year with a really poor squad a worse squad than fergie had when he was finishing 2nd or 3rd. that's down to his management.
Im 100% behind him and ill be 100% behind a new coach but whether he stays or goes one constant remains anywhere between 6 and 10 players need to be removed from our squad. Nobody could have this bunch of average joes higher than 2nd.

{Ed001's Note - if you really believe that then you need to get a life. It is a game and if winning is all that matters then I fear for you. As for the nonsense about Jose's squad being so bad, it is just delusions. You have no one anywhere near as bad as players like O'Shea. Just lots of excuses. In fact I am done. This is pointless may as well talk to a brick wall.}

18 Mar 2018 08:50:08
Who has passed him out ajh. Looking at the table at tbe moment he has passed out klopp poch wenger and conte so far this season.
So when have our players (ex fergie players excluded) ever done better at united?
Is rash on for a seasons best goal haul? Is lukaku? Is martial? Is ddg up for most clean sheets?

18 Mar 2018 08:54:42
How many knock out ties has he played since then?
How many has golden balls poch won?
Or how many has klopp won?

I don't like a lot of his methods but at the moment i think that's what's required. I don't like his persona. But i think its what's best for the club in the long run at this moment in time. No other manager has got the better of pep. Give him the tools and he will. He left mafrid in much better shape than he found them. He will do the same here.

18 Mar 2018 09:15:20
Ken, me thinketh you doth protest to much. We won’t agree on this, let’s let others have their say.

18 Mar 2018 09:16:56
Ken Madrid, Barca, PSG, Bayern and City don't have to choose between winning stuff and playing well and after the money Jose has spent and wants to spend neither should we.

18 Mar 2018 09:10:07
I fear for you ed if you think the objective of playing any game is anything other than to win.
These are professionals its their job and business not a game its their livelihood.

In my business i have fired really nice guys who do their best but don't achieve what i need them to and i have a couple of arrogant dicks that run their areas with an iron fist and surpass their goals and targets. A lot of my customers don't really like these guys but they deliver for both their customers business and mine so we all do well.

Some soccer supporters forget its a results business you have said that yourself many a time on here. So if its a results business can you achive those results without winning?

{Ed001's Note - I have never said that you play to do anything but win have I? You are not playing the game though, you are watching for 'entertainment' not playing or do you forget that you are not a footballer? This is nothing to do with business, it is a game and you should remember that. It is an entertainment that millions watch for that reason. If you want to be bored but only care about winning, why not follow some other sport and team that do win? Clearly because it is not only about winning or you would just follow any old sport.

If it is all about winning, why not just cheat? I mean it doesn't matter, the ends justify the means right? Dope up the players, dive, scratch, break legs, etc as it is all about winning is it not?

The point is that results can be achieved in more than one way, but this is meant to be entertaining so why not entertain along the way? Instead you will make excuses pretending that your hundreds of millions of pounds worth of talent is actually crap instead of admitting it is the man in charge that is choosing tactics that make it all look like dross. Your strengths are all in the attacking third, so why does he choose to stifle them and play defensive? Because it is his way and nothing will change except the excuses and the people that will get blamed.}

18 Mar 2018 09:20:29
Ken - as you say each to their own and as a José supporter maybe you can explain the following:
We beat Liverpool and in the biggest game of the season so far we bring in Fellani, move Rashford who was outstanding against Liverpool and drop Mata and McTom who both played well.
We are spending nearly £1m a week on wages to have neither Sanchez or Pogba perform, presumably that's down to the failures at Utd and nothing to do with José.
You want José to make numerous signings, if we are to offload 8 or 9 then we need replacements. So far we have Miki come and gone, Pogba and Sanchez under performing, Lindelof can even displace the rubbish you say that Smalling, Jones etc are. Lukaku has done well, Matic has done well, Bailly, he misses at least 30% of games. So where does your confidence come from that José can get the transfers right, so far his record is poor in the transfer market for us.
Now I don't think any of the above are down to the rubbish players you say we have.

{Ed001's Note - it should also be pointed out that Jose has never had full control of transfers anywhere he has been in the past.}

18 Mar 2018 09:27:42
Jose melt down wasn't as bad as that.

18 Mar 2018 09:37:59
Ed because winning by cheating isn't really winning is it?
So manchester united isn't a business? that's delusional.
You have said its a results business.
I totally agree that the best way to win is by doing it with style. No argument from me on that.
But i'd rather win with less style than not win at all.
As for me thinking our players are poor despite the hundreds of millions spent on them i find that a strange comment from yourself given that on a continual basis you have opinions on players saying they are poor and not worth what clubs pay for them. Is it not ok for someone else to have an opion like that that?
What do you think of mangala? Despite his price tag? If a city supporter says he is poor i'd agree despite the 40m or whatever it was city paid for him. Or carrol that liverpool paid 40m for. Was he not poor? Did king kenny develop him and make him a good buy? No he was poor and moved out the door.
Sometimes players move and play badly poor buys, bad fits no matter what they cost.

{Ed001's Note - you do not work for Man Utd. What are you wittering on about this for? This is delusional. It is not your business, you are not a player. You are a spectator. Is it really so difficult for you to get this? You are wasting my time with this. It is not difficult to understand that have as much involvement as you do when you sit at home watching a movie. I can just imagine the mind numbingly boring long winded crap you would choose to watch.

The thinking players are poor is just deflection away from the issue. Your squad is not as bad as you and all the other apologists are trying to make out and pointing out one or two overpriced donkeys is not going to change the fact. It is certainly better than your recent performances would suggest, as your early performances showed. The question should be 'why has it got worse under your messiah jose?' If Jose is so good, surely they should be getting better, not worse?}

18 Mar 2018 09:38:17
Well jred atleast Ken didn't do a 12 minute monologue so as Ken would say it is an improvement.

18 Mar 2018 09:39:41
Here, Ed001. Leave big John out of it! 😁.

{Ed001's Note - he was bloody awful though.}

18 Mar 2018 09:48:02
The bit that gets to me most is the opinion that we either play good football and win nothing or play boring football and win trophies. It doesn't have to be like this. As City, Barcelona and Bayern are demonstrating.
And I'm sorry Ken, I can't agree that we don't have any good players or that only mourinho can have us in 2nd place 13 points behind City. I think if Pep was manager, we'll be top and we won't be having this discussion. Also, after 2 years in charge, pep would have addressed our deficiencies at full backs, midfield and wings.
Mourinho has had two seasons and we're still playing like strangers. He's still changing players every week. We're still not pressing high and still not working hard enough. We're still allowing Brighton to have 14 shots and Seville over 20 shots at our goal. We still cannot retain the ball for more than 6 seconds. It's shambolic and there's only one common denominator, Mourinho.

{Ed001's Note - that is exactly the point, good football and winning football are not two mutually exclusive things. You can have both.}

18 Mar 2018 10:14:38
As i said above that's the ideal they are not mutually exclusive.
Jose is not my messiah at all but he is the mager we have and i can see things from his point of view.
If you think the likes of valencia young smalling fellaini martial blind darmian can bring scintillating football i disagree.
Performances are poor the style is poor but so are a lot of our players. You may think they are good enough to bring great entertainment i beg to differ.
We have a manger, a proven winner if he is backed by the board i belive things (the play) will improve and the trophies will come.
You support your way and ill support mine. Happy always to read your opinions but you must remember they are not gospel. Nor are mine.
I don't always look at things from a pure spectators point of view ed001. I try to have a more rounded view and take into consideration what the club and business require or else i'd say go out buy messi and co but that's not practical really is it?
Nobody is always right not even your good self. I may support in a different way to you and get out of it what pleases me.
I would get more pleasure watching my team win 1 nil than lose 4 3.
Id get even more pleasure watching them win 4 nil no doubt about that.
One of the best games i watched as a neutral this season was liverpool against city when liverpool beat them. End to end stuff great attacking play but where do you think that game ranks for city supporters? i'd say its one they want to forget.

{Ed001's Note - those players are fully capable of playing good football, if used correctly, just like any player is. Plenty of lower league and non-league sides can get their players playing great footie, so why can't internationals in the Prem?

You can look at things however you want, but it is irrelevant to the conversation as you are nothing but a spectator and we are discussing a spectators view nothing else.

As for your mention of the LFC-M City game, what do you think City fans would prefer - the odd defeat like that or play like United and still only finish second?}

18 Mar 2018 10:25:09
Dont you guya think its the players fault for chooaing to play for Unites when they knew the style Mourinho was going to play.

If a player doeant like a style of play or tactic then tbey should choose a club which auits them best.

I know a lot of these players were already there before jose joined the club but i am aure they couldve let the club know that they would want to leave and don't like the way Jose would get them playing.

Everyone knowa Jose is very arrogant in terms of how he has managed all of his life so the players and the manager should equally share the blame.

18 Mar 2018 10:34:28
I also should add if this isn't going to work out then it would be best to get rid of Jose then getting rid of half the team as we would again be rebuilding for next few years.

But we got to be careful here and make sure the next decision is made correctly because this could completely backfire and we would still be in the same position in 4 years down the line.

18 Mar 2018 10:38:32
"I would rather have titles and medicore play than have exciting football and end up as also rans. " So, if that's the case Ken, why bother watching at all. Why not just look up the result after the game and leave it at that? In fact, why not just wait until the end of the season and take a quick look at the league table.

I went to the match last night and sat frozen and bored for 2 hours. Now I'm wondering why I wasted my money and time. It wasn't as bad as Tuesday but it was still a depressing experience. I live 2 miles from the ground but the guy sat next to me has a round trip of 12 hours driving and he comes to every game. Don't you think he should expect just a little entertainment for his trouble?

Football is called the beautiful game for a reason and when it's played properly it's a joy to behold. Think of all the thrilling games and moments over the years both for Utd and elsewhere. That's what the game is about not grinding out boring draws or narrow victories.

Ken, I'm sorry to learn that you're quite happy without the joy of football in your life. I'm not and I think I might give Man Utd a miss until next season because I'm just bored bored bored silly with the crap football and the stupid circus.

Mourinho out!

18 Mar 2018 10:41:05
Ed001 woah woah woah. John O'Shea. leave it out. I'm not having you bad mouth a living legend of the Irish game.

When Johnny goes marching down the wing o'shea, o'shea.

I've been really hurt by this thread, think I need a lie down 😂.

{Ed001's Note - oh bless. If it helps, he might finally find his level next season when the Mackems are in League One...}

18 Mar 2018 11:01:46
BTW Ken, just out of interest; do you go the matches?

18 Mar 2018 11:31:38
I’m with Ed001. In the words ofRussell Crowe in Gladiator, “Are you not entertained? ” Well, no Jose we are most certainly not.

18 Mar 2018 11:52:08
About 6 a year manc man i was there last tueday night. I live in ireland and travel a lot. i'm in india this week sri lanka next week but ill get a couple more in before the end of the season. Why do you ask?
The atmosphere is crap has been for last 25 years to be honest. The crowd atmosphere is the only thing i envy lfc for. I think they start every home european fixture 1 up because of the crowd.
I enjoy lots of aspects of football manc man. I can enjoy 2 good defencive performances in a nil all draw.
Defending is also an art and skill. I hear people on here moaning all the time that the art of defending is lost.
I didn't enjoy the tip tappy stuff bacelona played without messi to bring some magic i found it boring i much prefer the city style to Barcelona there is more pace to it.
Ive loved watching madrid for last couple of seasons i think they were better to watch than Barcelona at their best much more exciting but maybe not as pretty.
If you don't enjoy it why go to watch it?
I do enjoy watching united i agree its bern a bit boring recently but i tend to look for positives. But winning is for me the most important thing. Ideally win with great style. Fergie won to cl finals but we were crap in both particularly in the noucamp i was there. 1st half v chelsea we were good then fergie parked the bus at 1 nil and nearly cost us the title. Did you turn off your telly or stop watching those games? Did you not celebrate winning those finals?

18 Mar 2018 12:17:02
Lol ed he must be about 40 now auld johnny. One thing, he always did a job and played way above his station. Fergie had that knack.

18 Mar 2018 12:01:01
Angel Jos is a great bloke i played golf with him twice in charity events and was a good squad player at united. Never blessed with great talent but gave his all for both club and country.
Not everyone at the club can be a superstar but i don't remember him costing us too often scored some important goals and was a good pro never over weight never got too big for his boots. He knew he was lucky to have been in the right place at the right time and he maximised the opportunity afforded to him they were his own exact words. The clubs history like most clubs is littered with good pros like john o shea. Players that give their all follow their manager. Too many 'johnny big balls' types around now that think they are better than they are. Think they know it all but really they know f all and would be better advised to keep their heads down and do what their told.

18 Mar 2018 12:11:03
Ed 001 Sheasey nutmegged figo, and scored a winner at the kop! No bashing of an Irish legend on St Patrick’s weekend! 😂.

{Ed001's Note - I thought it would be the best time as you would all be too drunk to notice....}

18 Mar 2018 12:41:21
Ed001. As we agrre, teams can play entertaining football and win. In fact, I'll go as far as saying that most teams leading their respective leagues around Europe play entertaining football. Now there's a thought. Barca, Bayern, psg, city. Is that not enough proof to the Mourinho supporters that things don't have to be this way.
Hand on heart, how many on here watched Liverpool demolish Watford with fast, aggressive football and not enjoy it? I tried not to enjoy it as I don't like the Scousers, but you can't help thinking that their brand of football is what we like to watch at United.

18 Mar 2018 15:43:31
Ken, I asked because I wanted to know how much effort you put into wathcing Utd and it turns out to be quite a lot. I find it surprising that you are content with such a low return of football/ entertainment for the time and money you invest.

I think we just enjoy the game in different ways. Two good defensive performances sounds like football hell to me. I'll take a 4-4 thriller over a 1-0 bore win anytime.

18 Mar 2018 17:10:58
I understand your pint of view manc man and i do spend a lot supporting the club. But its the club i support not whatever the current team is. Ill always be going as long as i gave breath in me.
Ive played in numerous games here in ireland (well 3 times😁) with united legends teams i hope to be playing again in july as my company sponsor some of these games and its great fun.
I love football have worked within the industry and hope to get a role permenantly when i retire in 30 months time at the grand old age of 50.
I don't watch just to be entertained i go to learn to observe and i enjoy that.
I have often gone to games united and other teams and just watched 1 player for 90 mins. To study what he does and his movement off the ball.
During euro 96 i went to see germany play just to watch klinsman for 90 mins. I didn't follow the ball at all i wanted to watch him.
As you say each to their own.

18 Mar 2018 17:54:38
I whole heartedly agree. When allowed to do so the team play more than half decently. Tight defensive tactics against "lesser" teams and they are really not interested. It is not what they came here for. This is practical unspoken dissent and it will only be a matter of time before there is a public blowout of some sort. Until the last few weeks I have always maintained that it would be next season that we would see a real Jose team.

Sadly with no consistent progression towards really competing at the top level, I live in hope, but rational thought gives me grave doubt. With hindsight whatever one thought of LVG, there is case to be made that his signings, on balance, were better (and better value) than JM. I don't think Jose is happy here and I think in recent days he is playing for the sack and a big pay out.

I know many will argue that league poison doesn't lie, and that we are improving, but for me our league position owes more to wins and draws won by luck and by the skin of our teeth due to grim defending to see out games rather than any real improvement. Also we need to recognise where we might be without DDG.
In fairness to our players, I do believe they are better than they are being allowed to be. This belief is what has made me come to the point that Jose is not our future.

Rant over. Differing views respected. I really hope I am wrong. If not, the immediate future is bleak.