Manchester United Banter Archive October 19 2012

 

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19 Oct 2012 23:55:28
I don't get it when people say we need loads of new players. I think if we get the tactic's right then we only need one or two more players.

Defensively we've been poor, but you'd have to expect that with the injuries we've had and the fact that we keep chopping and changing between our two new keepers. The key to a solid defence is a settled defence.

De Gea is our best keeper and should be first choice. He only has one weakness and thats coming for crosses. Gary Neville hit it on the head though when he said if he isn't good at it then it's best to leave it to the defenders to clear it and for him to stay on his line. So we just need a bit more organisiation and communication and that problem can be sorted.

Our defenders seem to almost be made of glass. Rio should move on. Vidic may not fully recover his fitness or form. Evans is great when he plays on the right side but crap when he plays on the left side of defence(i dunno if anyone else has noticed). Smalling and Jones look very promising but are young. We need someone with abit of experiance and quality to come in and give us a stable platform from which to build. IMO i think the best options would be either Benatia or Ogbonna, both are quick and strong but both have good organisational skills and can marshall a defence.

Left back is a problem but i think Buttner deserves a run of games to see if he can step up. Right back i feel is sorted with Rafael. I'd like to see a defence line up like this:

____________DDG
Rafael__Evans__Ogbonna__Buttner

With Smalling rotating with Evans when needed.

Our Midfield is our weakest area but with just one signing and the right tactics that can easily be solved.

Carrick is our main midfielder atm and that fine but he needs the right system to flourish. He isn't a DM and he needs someone to do that job in order to release him from his current shackles.

I think if we play a 4231 formation which presses high up the pitch then this would allow all our best players to flourish.

With a proper DM along side him Carrick would be released from his defensive shackles and given the freedom to impose himself on a game, his only weakness is he isn't great when put under pressure but with the three infront pressing high up the pitch space will open up infront of him to allow him to play his game unpressurised. Especially with a more destructive force along side him. He played his best football last season with Jones along side him offering him more defensive cover allowing him to play his game. Personally i'd go for either Capoue or Sandro for this role.

The three should be Rooney Kagawa and Cleverley, this role would rely on hard working players with great vision and passing ability in order to pick through teams. These three have that. Also Rooney and Cleverley show signs of being able to link up almost telepathically, and Kagawa and RVP seem to be on the same wave length too. So if we can get all four working together then they will frighten any team.

So i feel our best team would line up like this:

____________DDG

Rafael__Evans_Ogbonna__Buttner

_______Carrick__Capoue

__Cleverley__Rooney__Kagawa

____________RVP

With the high pressing our defence will be under less pressure, Carrick will be given the space to pick out his passing and dictate the games tempo, Capoue will give Carrick the freedom from defensive responsibilty and will cover for the full backs allowing them to get forward and offer some width. With Cleverley Rooney and Kagawa keeping the ball and finding the space to open up any team along with RVP's clinical finishing to get us the goals.

This plays to everyones strengths and i feel get us back to where we belong. The only play who'd need replacing any time soon in that line up would be Carrick, i think Strootman could do the trick in a year or so's time.

Let me know what you guy's think.

Shappy

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Same post as before with different names

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1- You are right, we need a new cd. We need a strong presence who can marshal the defence and be exeptional in dealing with crosses and high balls, considering this is De Gea's weakness.
In simpler terms, we need a Vidic.

Now ogbonna is a cracking player but he is more of a ferdinand than a vidic, an intelligent ball playing defender, not really a " rock ".
So taking that into account Papadopoulos is much more suited. He is 20 years old, and an absolute beast. Just looking at the dude scares me. He is not the tallest of defenders but his ability to win headers is unbeleivable. No balls go past him. And he is atm the second best defender in the bundesliga ( only second to hummels ) but beeing three years younger you can only think he will improve.

As for the midfield i do think we need a defensive midfielder, but Capoue is not suited to play on the top of the business. Beeing french im a follower of the ligue 1 and i can safetly say i have watched a lot of Capoue and imo ( and many others' ) he is not good enough for a big team. Hence why PSG never tried guetting him. He is decent in defending but his lack of quality on the ball is too evident and strong teams will target that. and his passing, dear me.
I think we better play jones there because capoue offers nothing in addition to jones and both have the same flaws. On another note i think fletcher could do the dmf job.

Mick

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20 Oct 2012 08:09:02
Papadopoulos is a very good prospect but he isn't the vocal leader we need atm. Also the "beast" type of CB imo is becoming rarer and rarer at the top level, muscle is being replaced by intelligence. Do we need someone who scares the opposition or someone who can defend against them without giving away fouls?

Ogbonna has a edge about him and isn't afraid to get stuck in but its his intelligence and his ability to marshall a defence which is what we need most.

There are flaws in Capoue's game but there are flaws in every players game. I feel with the right training Capoue could be a great player. His passing is good but he gives the ball away when he tries to be too clever with his passing, in the set up i've surgested he wouldn't need to be clever with his passing. The issue I find with trying to sign a DM is there is a real lack of world class players in this position about.
It appears that they have been moulded into box to box players or deep lying playmakers, in short they have been made to contirbute to attacking teams rather than just covering the defence. This is fine if you have proper full backs who's first job is defending, but we have wing backs who are expected to get forward and off width, so it is essential that we have a true DM in place to cover our wing backs, a deep lying playmaker isn't defensive enough and a box to box player is likely to also be further up field when the ball is turned over so won't be much use covering.

Its tough trying to name great true DM's, how many can you name?

Shappy

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Smalling will be first choice when Ferdinand leaves.

Sydney!

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I agree with Shappy regards the DM issue, i'm struggling though to think of anyone.

Obviously M'Vila has issues or would have moved in the summer. Capoue i haven't seen enough of but i think we need someone who can do a job now rather than needs some work.

Vidal would have been perfect. The only other name i can think of but needs work also is the Argentine lad from River we were linked with Cirigliano. Or the Japanese chap but is he good enough?

Regards CB's i haven't seen much of Ogbonna only his stats, which i'm wary of as i think the quality of serie A inflates them and makes some players look better than they are. I wonder if he's have as much time and be as comfortable in England. I'd prefer signing defenders from leagues similar to the EPL so there is less of an issue of adaptability. So to me Papa or Hummels stand out more. Or even someone like Zouma from ligue 1 if we want another youngster to develop.

I'm also undecided on Strootman.

I do agree though that evolution not revolution.

Mort

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19 Oct 2012 23:47:45
'jred'

My concern is that Rooney becomes our version of Steven Gerrard and by that I mean that he almost takes over the team and everything goes through him. Rooney is a fantastic player when he plays up front as a striker but we seem to be shifting him around in a bid to fit him in somewhere. IMO either we play him up front (in his rightful position) with RVP and bring in a very strong CM to compensate for having 2 up front AND Kagawa in the team or we need to ship him out and bring in players that fit how we are trying to play. There is no point having him in the starting 11 in midfield or out wide when we could bring someone in to do those jobs better.

TK-Red

I dont think we are shifting him around in a bit to fit him in , i think its more a case of being light in certain position and rooney "filling" in.
if we sold rooney and brought in the 3 you mentioned we would be very reliant on RVP and i honestly dont think rodriguez or gotze would bring more to the team than rooney.
for me with RVP, rooney kagawa chica welbeck were fine up top , I would try for a top class CM.
I honestly think if we bought a top class CM and CB we would be a different team.
jred

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Jred I agree top CM, preferably midfielders a Dm and distributor, but you forgot the need for a top left back and left winger as well. I do not for one minute believe Buttner is the answer and god I wish we had signed Alba.

The reality is we need 100 million to make it happen and where is the money going to come from?

Shahram

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Shahram
i agree a lb would be nice i think we can live with out a new lw.
maybe if we got a top CM and CB we could control the game a bit more and get teams more on the backfoot, this may make lb less of an issue ,
jred

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'Jred'

As I said in the post above mate, I never said Rooney should be sold. I said that it wouldn't be such a terrible thing. If we had a top CM and Rooney was being playing in his natural position then we would have one of the most exciting strike forces in the league, but that is where he should be playing, as a striker.

TK-Red

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There are plenty of players who are surplus to requirements and available for a price. If we found buyers for Anderson, Kiko, King, Nani, Bebe & possibly Evra and Hernandez then we would have a decent amount of funds. Not to mention older players leaving would lower the wage bill somewhat and that is important when buying new players.

People forget how football finances work. When a player is signed their fee is amortised over the length of his contract, for example Kagawa over four years is £3.5m a year. BUT if we were to sell players then ALL of their fee is subtracted from the revenue in one-offs. So selling the above players for say £40m and us having a £100m spend (net) would show us making a £20m or so profit in player sales for the financial year, because the £100 is split between five and only £20m has left the club in that financial year whereas the club received £40m for outgoing players.

So I wouldn't worry about money as we have plenty of that. Not as much as the Sugar daddy owned clubs of course as they are funded by their owners as well as their revenues, but we can easily go and spend £100m (£60m net) next summer if we needed too, perhaps more if Scholes, Ferdinand and Evra were to leave to cut the wage bill. Lets not forget we have spent a large amount since 2010 approximately £45m a year (net) so with us being in the best financial health since the Glazer takeover why wouldn't we spend £100m in the summer if the manager wanted it?

Sydney!

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Tk
i would agree he should def be up front, imo an RVP Rooney partnership could be as good as any in europe.
i also think a front 3 of RVP Rooney and kags could work very well
jred

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Syd

"When a player is signed their fee is amortised over the length of his contract, for example Kagawa over four years is £3.5m a year"

Is that true or is it just shown that way in the accounts? I assumed it was just accounting practise and that the fee would be paid up front unless specifically stated otherwise in the agreement between buying/selling clubs?

Gav

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Its just shown in accounts , the full fee is usually paid upfront, have a look at the united accounts it shows the full amount for transfers going out the club year after year.
The amortised fee just show's how much the product/player has cost over the length of the contract

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Gav, it is usually just for the accounts, but that's my point mate. As long as the accounts look good the Glazers will spend.

Off out now for a beer or 15, take care lads.

Sydney!

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19 Oct 2012 22:09:36
It seem's Leeds United are keen to regain their place as the countries most hated football club. Lets just hope that person is banned for life.

TK-Red

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He was banned from all grounds in the country when he was 16

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19 Oct 2012 21:51:38
This should be our line up against Stoke

De Gea (Is Lindegaard injured?)

Rafael Ferdinand Evans Buttner

Anderson Carrick Rooney

Kagawa

Hernandez RVP

Anderson should start due to his strength plus Rooney can do that as well. Kagawa should be in the hole as that's his best position. If Lindegaard isn't injured then he should start, and Buttner because he is quick and Evra is not good now. Cleverley should be rested because he played in both games for England and we'll need him for Cluj and Chelsea. Hernandez is quick and will be able to get in behind Stokes defense.

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Cluj? We play braga on Tuesday.

Would you not play Valencia? I think we will stick to wingers at home as that is how we break teams down. Stoke are good at the back and we need to use the whole pitch to get in behind and break them down early.

GDS

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Cant see chicha valencia or kags starting they had a long flight remember

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19 Oct 2012 20:54:03
Just couldn't help but post this. I was in a well known sports shop that has been taken over recently and they are selling all acquired stock 50 percent off marked price. Racks of lfc shirts remain that can now be purchased for a staggering £3! And still hardly any takers.....did make me chuckle.
All replica tops, shorts etc still available....apart from one club....yours truly....which had sold out at non marked down prices.

Supasub

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19 Oct 2012 18:45:45
I've been reading a lot of posts about how some player is United quality or not. So lets take a look at the players currently in the team, if they are good enough for our club. And just so you know this is my thinking when I see teams like Barca, Real, Bayern etc.

Lindegaard- Good GK and to have a second choice like him is a privilege.

DDG- I saw him with Athletico and he was great but he hasnt done much after coming to OT. You might say he makes some terrific saves but so does Vorm and many other keepers from time to time. Believe me if Pool had paid 17m for DDG you guys would have been on their site everyday making their lives miserable. I still think he can improve but how long can we afford his mistakes, that I'm not sure about.

Rafael, Smalling, Jones- Good players to have in the squad. Not world beaters but are young, learning and fill the team with a lot of energy.

Vidic- Great captain and still the best defender in the world for me.

Rio- Served the club in his golden years and now its time for him to move on.

Evans- Season before last I wanted him out, but last season was a turning point in his career. He gives it all on the pitch and now is an important part of the team.

Buttner, Powel- Still a lot to prove.

Evra- Not required anymore. We lose a midfield player trying to cover up for him in games.

Carrick- He shouldnt be in the team. He is a good player but is too slow and requires a lot of time on the ball. Loses the ball under pressure. He might be good for Italian league.

Fletcher- To play in the league against mediocre teams. Nice to have him to cover up for injuries.

Scholes- Shouldnt start a match. Still got the magic so should be brought in after 60 minutes if we are in need of some inspiration and creativity.

Giggs- Needs to retire after scoring a goal this season in the league. He has scored in every season he has played so just give him a damn penalty.

Anderson- He has the skill and qualities to succeed and strength to last against a physical team or to bully around with other players. But he should understand that losing weight does not decrease your strength. Its absolutely pathetic to see him after 60 minutes.

Cleverly- He looks good because our midfield is pathetic. Dont think Barca or Real would want him in the team. But still would give him a couple more seasons. And obviously if you can have Fletcher as your squad player then why not cleverly.

Kagawa- Truly brilliant though still finding his feet here but he is a quality addition.

Rooney- Right now cant dream of a United team without him. Play him at any position and he'll be in control.

RVP- Just play him as a striker upfront. Last few games he's been playing behind the striker and sometimes drifting out wide. Wont be able to score as many goals by suppressing his natural game.

Welbeck- Keep him for 2 more seasons, see if the lad comes good. Hope he does.

Chicarito- He needs crosses and lots of those to score goals. Though now he is working much more hard on other aspects of his game as well. Good to have a player who comes in as a substitute and chips in some important goals. Should be given a couple of years more to prove his worth.

Nani- I am a huge fan but now I think he needs a change in scenery. Has been a huge disappointment this season.

Valencia- Someone said he is the best traditional winger in the world. He is not, it has to be Jesus Navas. He is good at one thing only and that is crossing in ball but lately doesnt seem to do that also. No doubting his ability but he should start considering for the RB spot. Would be great to have him and Rafael fighting for that spot.

Young- Why did we ever buy him??

Having these players would be a privilege for so many teams but they have to be better if they want to be at United.
And just so you guys know whatever I think of them I'll always support them till they wear our jersey.

SHAITAN

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"Buttner, Powel- Still a lot to prove." They've been at the club how long and one of them is merely 18.

And Rafa is the best player in the league in his position, well on the way to becoming a very good player.

Don't think your criticism of Carrick necessary, he does a good job when he has the right people alongside him in midfield, which isn't Giggs.

Also don't agree with Fletcher, its good to see him coming back from a very serious illness and he is a player that we have missed a heck of a lot.

Think you need to see Cleverley more, again he needs the right people around him, links up well with Rooney and Welbeck.

Disagree with Valencia.

Nani disagree, been a huge disappointment all career not just this season.

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Disagree with nearly everything you said sorry.

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Carrick no good? Buttner needs to prove himself! Powell also ? Welbeck two seasons and then off ? For gods sake give the guys a chance mate.
Our midfield is not good but cleverly and carrick can do a very good job. Also Raphael has been superb this season. Valencia can tear defences apart.
If we can sort our defence and add one world class midfielder then we'll be fine.
NoMidfield

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Navas better than Valencia? i could safetly say i heard it all now. I guess fergy was right after all : we always think other peoples' cows are better than ours.

Mick

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Mick Navas is better than Valencia just watch him, he can pretty much do everything you want from a right winger playing against a left back, he would destroy Evra/Buttner and most left backs.

He will end up ar Barca or Real in the next 12 to 24 months and everyone will be raving about him.

Shahram

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19 Oct 2012 16:18:47
KLOOT,

Me and you haven't seen eye to eye in a very long time in regard to our views and the way in which we vent our passion.

However, over the past month I've found myself agreeing with pretty much everything you've said, maybe bar the Tom Cleverley debate.

The Moon.

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Moon we follow the same team support the same shirt have the same dream we just disagree on the little points. I AM KLOOT

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Get a room guys...

AJH

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19 Oct 2012 16:00:56
Pretty impressive that our new £13m Carrington upgrade is mostly being funded by Toshiba in a lucrative sponsorship deal. I do wonder if we could do the same with the South Stand and have someone like Nike fund the project if we give them naming rights to that one stand for ten years.

Sydney!

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The actual premises upgrade isn't being funded by Toshiba at all is it? It's the equipment that is, with £12m worth being provided?

rpc

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The work cost £14m and the Toshiba sponsorship is worth £12m. They are not directly funding the build, but their sponsorship covers most of it and they are supplying the state of the art equipment too, that is correct mate.

Sydney!

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I have been supplying materials to the job long before toshiba came on board
johndenton

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19 Oct 2012 11:58:46
To answer some of the questions raised below regarding my favourite players. Yes I am guilty as most people are of looking back with rose tinted specs. For any of you to question George Best's contribution to Manchester United is staggering. He was a wonderful player who in later life struggled with drink but let me tell you he did it all on the pitch way before he lived that kind of lifestyle. He wasn't doing magazine spreads after only playing a couple of games in the shirt. I also noticed that someone put Morgan down mockingly. Willie Morgan was a fabulous winger who was twice voted fans player of the season in a team that contained Best Law and Charlton. There are players in our present team like Vidic Giggs and Scholes who have brought nothing but pride and honour to the shirt. There is potential in some of the team to get up there but only potential. Then there are players who I believe are simply not good enough for our team and would get no where near an international side if they were playing for a mid table team. When it comes down to it Sir Alex picks the team and he gets it right alot more often than he gets it wrong so I have to have faith. As for me I just pay my money and support the shirts home and away. I have been very lucky as I have seen some truely wonderful players who were born to wear the red shirt and have done so with pride and realised that it is not about the Bentley but the badge. Then there have been chancers who should never have got near a shirt. Players who had the right agent and right deal so that everyone was happy. One thing that really worries me and I don't think I will find much argument is a lack of captains in the side.
In the 70's we had the imperious Martin Buchan then we had my personal favourite captain Bryan Robson who carried a team and country almost single handedly for a decade. Roy Keane was everything that was great about United during the 90s and who can forget his two finest moments beating Arsenal single handedly in the tunnel at Highbury and that night in Turin when he dragged us to the final. Since Roy there has been a massive void. If you are interested i suggest you read the excellent book "Captains Club" which discussed all the merrits of our club captains since the war. I AM KLOOT

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We do need someone like Roy back, Evra is a useless vice-captain and due to Vidic's injuries it's hard to keep him as a permanent captain, we need someone who just like Roy never stood down and always put up a fight. I just can't think of any play we could get which would fill his boots.

-JakeW

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Absolute spot on.Some people think you dont have the right to criticise & they think because they pull the red shirt on that they are automatically ahero & good enough for utd.Robson was my all time favourite.Best Law & Charlton were before my time.Some of these clowns who are playing for us now should be nowhere near a utd shirt

Blackpool Red

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KLOOT - you hit the nail on the head my friend, in a previous post, with one of the all-time cracking lyrics -

"If I hadn't seen such riches, I could live with being poor"

We've been truly spoilt over the years :)

StevieK

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Great post Kloot I wholeheartedly agree

Pardoe

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Ive been saying for a while we are a good team but not a great team, we have good players but not great players.
united players are always getting over hyped, non of them are bad players but how many of them are really up with the best in europe cos thats the level we should be looking at.
jred

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Kloot,

Very interesting read mate and I agree with pretty much all of your post. When you post like this it comes across like you care a lot more than some of your other posts. When somebody questioned your passion for the club the other day I was shocked because I think it is obvious to anyone how passionate you are, you just sometimes air your views in a different way to others.

We also share a great hatred of the scousers, although again, you choose to let yourself go with the abuse!

GDS

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I started out in the Robson/ Whiteside era. Seen some good and not so good players.

And Captains Club is a good read.

Mort

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Kloot one of the best posts I have read in a long time mate.

Shahram

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19 Oct 2012 10:23:01
Interesting to see that Shawcross is in the final 18 months of his contract, I firmly believe that he would still have been at the club if Pique hadn't been the one that we chose to sign. A summer target perhaps?

Fresh!

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Shawcross simply not good enough.Another mediocre player

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Shawcross is one of the finest Centre Back's in the League.

Fresh!

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Do you actually watch football.He's another clogger who would be torn to pieces if he played champions league football

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Not good enough, if Shawcross is the answer, we are heading backwards.

AJH

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19 Oct 2012 10:15:33
Predictions for the January market boys and girls! What do all the regulars think will happen? I'm going for Nani out to Milan, Macheda and King sold with Fischer coming in and also Strootman. Anderson will still be here come February, however he is veey much on trial still and will probably slip below Powell and Petrucci in the rankings before long.

Fresh!

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If we sell Nani in January then we need to bring in a replacement in January IMO. This diamond formation will only get us so far and selling Nani would leave us with only Young as natural Left winger.

TK-Red

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Sell Nani and use the money to buy Rodriguez or Isco. That would be my ideal exchange.

-JakeW

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I agree that we would need to replace him - however, if we sell him in January we'll get a better price that we would do in the Summer. We won't buy a major signing in January (e.g. a £30 million player). We may be a little short, but at the end of the day, Nani isn't offering us much anyway and Welbeck can always play on the left.

Fresh!

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If Nani does go in January i see us buying in young Ince.

I'm not convinced he's as all that as his manager makes out but thats his managers job, get the best deal he can.

However we can mould him like we can with Powell.

I would though like to see a good purchase in the summer with the Nani money. Not necessarily like for like as long as it gets spent on the team, we have plenty of other areas needing investment.

Mort

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19 Oct 2012 09:18:34
just seen on a website Man utd,spurs,chelsea tracking ryan Shawcross.Any views peeps.

-JEB-

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19 Oct 2012 07:35:00
Well guys we are almost there with pl games coming up and lot's of players back from injury. I fully expect us to beat Stoke this weekend but the real test is Chelsea and our first look at one our main rivals and how we play against them will drive what the club does in January.

On another note how many would take 50 Million for Rooney and let him go.

Shahram

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Won't let him leave for 300m

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I wouldn't sell Rooney for 50 Million, The cash would end up just like Ronaldo's.. It would disappear.

-JakeW

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What a strange suggestion? Sell Rooney fr £50m? Why? Have you ever watched rooney for ManU, he always tries hard and has dragged us out of many a hole. Sell him and buy who? Another Berbatov, who could not be arsed to run 5 yards?
We need to keep our best players and add some more world class players to the squad. Sell Macheda, Hernandez, Anderson, Nani and all the other dead wood, and buy some world class talent.
Selling Rooney will be the most stupid thing saf could do and I'm sure he wont.
NoMidfield

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Sell rooney and buy a natural midfielders which is where he is going to be played more and more going forward. The question is,do we have better option using the money to buy for the middle of the pitch than turning rooney into a midfielder.

He has lost his pace and no longer the striker of 4 or 5 years ago, who can play upfront in a 451 or 4411 format.

some no name said not for 300 million, I say you need to get real. Anyway it was just question and no need for people to throw the toys out of the pram.

Shahram

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It's not that ridiculous. For £50million we could probably bring in both Rodriguez and Strootman. Then sell Nani and bring in someone like Lewandowski, for arguments sake. Rooney is not the be all and end all of Manchester United.

TK-Red

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Thank you TK, it was exactly what I was thinking. Buy a Goetze and Strootman. Sell Nani and get Munian or Isco and then buy lewandowski and Hummels and sell Macheda, Anderson,Bebe. Our outlay would be about 20 million for a hell of a team.

I would take the above team without rooney over the current team with Rooney in it.

Shahram

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I'm torn with Rooney. Clearly he is a naturally talented individual who can influence games more than most. But...he seems to have head issues, and has not delivered consistently enough. No issue with his attitude or desire, he just seems to get distracted and I don't think he has justified his fee and frankly, if £30M was back on the table, I would probably take it.

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So would I probably Shahram. As much as Rooney has been a major part of the club, he isn't irreplaceable, especially now that we have Kagawa and RVP who both play his roles. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying I want him out, far from it, but if we were to get a big offer like that then it would be foolish not to consider it baring in mind what we could do with the money.

TK-Red

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We would be worse team with out rooney, why should a team like man united have to sell to buy. As a fan I would rather watch top players than have cash in the bank. Remember ronaldo and 80 mill , be careful what u wish for. Jred

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Shahram

How much are you spending?

Goetze, Strootman, Munian, Lewandowski & Hummels?

On conservative pricres i make that around 110 million, you'd be lucky to get 70 million for Nani and Rooney and thats assuming you can get 50 for Rooney. The likes of Macheda, Bebe and Anderosn would go for peanuts.

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Jred, whe did Rooneylast influence a game like Ronaldo did? To compare them is ridiculous, Ronaldo is in a whole different league to the somewhat inconsistent Rooney.

AJH

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'Jred'

Why should a club like United have to sell to buy? Its not ideal but the fact is that we cannot go out and buy in those 3 top class players without selling first. Not even City would buy those 3 without letting a player or 2 go. Its a 25 man squad remember.

TK-Red

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AJH
i didnt compare them , although i would say rooney is our best player at the moment.
we sold ronaldo for 80 mill and bought who ,whats better having a top player like rooney or cash in the bank.

when has rooney influenced a game like ronaldo , when has any one influenced a game like ronaldo?
Rooney has carried us at times over the last 3 year.
TK
I dont think strootman is that much better than what we have and I think rooney is a better player than Goetze and rodriguez.
yes its a 25 man squad but its the first 11 we need to improve and for me our first 11 would be better with rooney in it.
I dont think selling our best player is the way forward.
over the last 3 years rooney has scored 34, 16, 35 goals and to be honest with better players around him i think is capable of more.
rather than sell him i would continue to try an add players of his quality to play with him.
jred

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'jred'

My concern is that Rooney becomes our version of Steven Gerrard and by that I mean that he almost takes over the team and everything goes through him. Rooney is a fantastic player when he plays up front as a striker but we seem to be shifting him around in a bid to fit him in somewhere. IMO either we play him up front (in his rightful position) with RVP and bring in a very strong CM to compensate for having 2 up front AND Kagawa in the team or we need to ship him out and bring in players that fit how we are trying to play. There is no point having him in the starting 11 in midfield or out wide when we could bring someone in to do those jobs better.

TK-Red

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19 Oct 2012 22:56:01
TK - Tell me how have we fared when we have played with RVP and Kagawa in Wayne's absence?Brilliant players that they are, i trully think that they dont bring what Wayne brings to think. Pure passion and an unrelenting desire to win.

Shahram - You asked for an opinion. So there is no reason why people should throw the kitchen sink at you. But my answer is no not for 50 million.

Jred - Can't be more in agreeement with what you said :)

AJH - While i like your posts, there is something that i have observed. "The Rooney Contract" theatrics has always had a say on what u speak about Wayne. Your dislike for that incident kind off blinds your view. Just my opinion.

Deeps...

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Deeps. Possibly it does, but I do think he also relies on past glories or the odd stunning goal / game. He's a great player...I just expect more consistency and domination from someone who is rated in the £40M bracket. It's nothing personal, I just don't see it often enough.

AJH

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Spending

Goetze 28 , Strootman 18, Munian/isco 18, Lewandowski 22, Hummels 25. Total 111.

Sell Rooney 50, Nani 20, Anderson 10, Macheda 3, Bebe 2. 85 Million

I admit Rooney is a fantastic player and a big part of our team today and hence the 50 million price tag. I also believe it is due to a lack of what I call world class players in the team and many good squad players. I am not a big fan of his as a person due to his transfer request and off the field stuff and do not believe he is ever going to be a leader on the pitch like some of the greats who have led our club. As they say a leopard can't change his spots.

The question is really have we seen the best Rooney or is he going to be better in 2 years time. If you look at the players mentioned that gives us a team that will be incredible and young when you add rafael, DDG, Smalling, Jones, Evans, Powel, Kagawa, Valencia, Cleverly and let's say 4 or 5 players coming through the academy and the additional players that we would buy in the normal course our transfer activity over the next few years.

I guess the whole thing depends on whether people think the team is great with a few changes or needs a big overhaul. I am of the latter view and as the season goes we will find out more. One thing for sure is that we will not have the money to buy all the players everyone talks unless we are willing to cash in on a major player.

Something tells me once we get a new manager a lot of this will happen.

Shahram

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19 Oct 2012 00:17:42
Sorry just read this from yesterday I think you were responding to my post...

"I don't get it, your saying he (Young) wouldn't be good enough for top 6 but he took villa I top six he was their best player, I'm not saying he is a world beater but what he has is pace and one hell of a delivery, he is ye best crosser at the club he dived twice last year but fergie has it out of him, and he isn't predictable because I remember on more than one occasion last year he dummies his man and got to the line and cut a ball back.

Caolán"

What I actually posted was that Ashley Young would be the 'jewel in the crown' (quote) of any team outside the top 6 e.g. Villa but at United he is just 'average-to-good' (quote unquote). I stand by both comments and think they're actually quite complementary of Young. As you said he is no world beater but is a decent player with a sometimes decent cross. Perhaps you misread my post as you actually agreed with most of it, lol

Gav

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Oh I did misread your comment gab I thought you said he is only good enough for the top 6 sides. Didn't read the part were you said he would be the jewell for one of them!

Caolán.

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Lol no worries. Anyways I'd be happy to sell Nani at some point and replace him with someone like Rodriguez, then keep Valencia and Young to have 3 decent wide/attacking midfield options

Gav

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19 Oct 2012 00:13:44
18 Oct 2012 14:05:21
hey utd fans ,expect to see more of dan wellback and little hernandez this season, especially since wayne chubby rooney cant seem to last more than 70 minutes in a game these days, his best days are behind him i think.............lfc

Made me laugh as basically every scouser still thinks gerrard is the best midfielder about well, if Rooney is past it well gerrard should have hung up the boots years ago.

Dave

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18 Oct 2012 23:30:00
Anyone seen the U21s tonight? they were 1-0 down against a very poor Bolton side until the 80th minute but were able to get 2 goals.

Powell had a decent game and scored a good header, cole was mom and linked up well with lingard ( Their linkup play was truely a joy to watch ) and i was impressed by Veseli. But the side wasnt able to cut through the middle, Possession without real threat. That doesnt happen often with our U21 side.

Petrucci's absence was really felt and we lacked the threat he used to offer with his vision and passing through the middle. They were a different side without him. I guess you only know a player's true worth when you lose him. Hope he gets a chance before he gets fed up and leaves. I think he will become a special player.

Mick

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Couldn't agree more mick and if it wasn't for his injuries he would be starting imo, surely he must be highly thought off in the club as he is under 21 captain?

Caolán.

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Hello Mick, as you seem to be very informed about our youth players, in your opinion who are the best underage players at the club, say from #1 (being the best) to #10. I have to say I do not see enough youth games to make an informed decision. Anyone else? Sydney, I remember you rating Tunnicliffe very highly, would he still be your #1 hope for the future?

J Bones.

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Its very difficult to put it this way, especially for the academy players but here it goes:

1- Henriquez
2- Daehli
3- januzaj
4- Blackett
5- Petrucci
6- Perreira
7- Tunicliffe
8- Cole
9- Michael Keane
10- Lingard.

Now this is my personal opinion and a lot wouldnt agree, but based it not only on talent ( januzaj would be first by a mile ) but also considering their workrate, improvement and a bunch of other stuff.
And their are others worth mentioning : Veseli, pre injury will keane, robbie brady, jack barmby...

Mick

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Thanks Mick. Lets hope we get 2 - 3 of these stepping up to make the grade!

J Bones.

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