Manchester United Banter Archive November 21 2014

 

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21 Nov 2014 21:42:21
In the past 5 years can anyone name "world class" Rooney debate on here?

Believable2 Unbelievable1

22 Nov 2014 10:34:51
Rooney's performances are somewhat of a moot point! Can anyone think of a world class performance from England?
I'm a proud Englishman who loves his country, but I just can't get enthused about our national team,.everytime I watch them at the moment all I can think after each game is: Who's going to give me that 90mins of my life back?

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21 Nov 2014 16:50:17
In the past 5 years can you think of any quality Rooney performances for England, I can't.

The Beast
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Erm, Tuesday?

Believable2 Unbelievable0

2 good finishes don't automatically equal a great performance.

Its all about personal standards, if you think Rooney was great on Tuesday you have different quality standards than myself. He played well, but it was hardly one that sticks in the memory.

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21 Nov 2014 19:22:56
World cup qualifier against Croatia. Can't remember score or when, but Rooney was the best player on the pitch.

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Against turkey in a qualifier at i think stadium of light, ran the show

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Oh misread that question when you said last 5 years. not really bothered anyway man utd are all i'm bothered about.

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Beast your constant negativity it's taking its toll on me, I seem to open the page and all I see is posts from you constantly either bringing players down or saying x y z need to be either moved on or sacked, are you just the cliche glass half full troll or are you genuinely just this depressing?

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Anon - I may be negative but there isn't all that much to be positive about at the minute. When people come out with deluded statements to make themselves feel better and ridicule my views as part of that process then naturally I am going to defend myself.

Over the past couple of weeks I have made the following points:

1. LVG is not good enough to manage us, he is making too many simple mistakes at great consequence and playing boring football.

2. ADM should be played inside not out wide, its negative with the wingers as we have no movement upfront.

3. Rooney being captain of England & Utd is not as great an achievement if it had been a generation ago.

4. Rooney isn't as good as he used to be and he receives a lot of attention now because of how good he was, not how good he currently is.

5. We shouldn't be signing mediocre press-hyped players like Berahino.

6. International football is becoming easier at the highest level because there are so many minnows now, the records being broken don't mean as much as they used to - International football is devaluing.


For some reason a lot of people disagree with comments I make and it leads to debate. I love our club, but there are a lot of things wrong at the moment, so why should I just come on here and say we are doing great and everything is rosy when it clearly isn't - nobody can honestly say we have improved so far this season.

I'm sure people have clicked this website by mistake looking for "Fantasy Man Utd". We are in a mess and saying we aren't is just delusion.

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Oh and look at todays poll, that was because I debated with the Ed that ADM is in the same league as Hazard & Sanchez - that is hardly negative as ADM plays for us and I am betting that 75% will say "yes" across all club sites!

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Beast
You moaned about ADM when we signed him

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22 Nov 2014 09:58:10
I was surprised at Ed001's opinion on that front tbh. I've already seen todays poll question be debated on the other sites and each time the opinion has been that they are all in the same class.

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{Ed001's Note - I never said any such thing as him not being in their class. I prefer Sanchez due to his work rate and attitude, and I do think Di Maria suffers a lot due to lacking intelligence on the pitch. But I see Sanchez and Hazard both suffering at times in the regard. That is why none of them can be compared to Messi and particularly Ronaldo.}

Jred - You keep saying this, its not factual. I said he wasn't worth £60m - I thought he would be played as a winger when making that comment, look what has happened since he has been played as a winger?

As a CM I eat my words, as a winger I am proven correct.

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22 Nov 2014 11:18:33
Beast what where u expecting this season? honest answer mate.

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Beast
Until he plays on the wing and has a good game .
Like he has numerous times for madrid and Argentina

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He is hit and miss on the wing which is why I wouldn't spend £60m on him to play out wide, £30m yes of course.

Chris - I genuinely thought we would win the league before a ball was kicked. We had no Europe, a top manager (according to experts), a war chest to spend, obvious areas that needed fixing and a squad with something to prove after the failures of last season. After the window I was less confident as we didn't fill the gaps (World Class CB & CM), but still felt we should win it with all things considered, especially with the Falcao deal.

I certainly wasn't expecting the dross I have seen this season and the negative set-up with so many talented attacking players. This is why I am not happy happy joy joy at the minute mate.

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22 Nov 2014 18:25:39
Can't believe this debate still rages on, Rooney is world class! end of debate.

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21 Nov 2014 08:56:44
In coming years it won't be unusual for the best International teams in Europe to have strikers averaging over a goal a game.

The gap has grown to such an extent, with so much investment and coaching for the top players and the minnows are taking baby steps by comparison. There are so many pointless games now where the question is not "Who will win", but "How much will X win by".

Just imagine how many goals Shearer would have scored playing regularly against such weak opposition in the modern day, with no competition for his place in the team. At least when he played he was keeping top quality strikers out of the team, now you have Rickie Lambert to fall back on!

Believable2 Unbelievable6

England beat turkey in 1987 8:0
Luxembourgh in 1982 9:0
Turkey 8:0 1984
Portugal 10:0 1947
Usa 10:0 1964

I could go on and on but the point is the gap has always been huge .

How many goals would shearer of scored against these teams ?
well ronaldo has managed 52 in 118 games and i don't think shearer would of out gunned him

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21 Nov 2014 09:53:14
correct again Jred.

Just more MOTD / Knee jerk comments

Some of the minnows playing now are miles better than the minnows of 30 years ago in the main they are well structured financed and coached, I would go as far as most of the so called minnows of today would batter the minnows of yesteryear

IMO no England Dutch German or Spanish etc international centre forward will average a goal a game. If Messi / Ronaldo can't do it why would anyone else.

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21 Nov 2014 10:13:27
Beast,

That is one of the most desperate posts I have ever seen to try and prove a point. Even if 'in the coming years' players are scoring over a goal a game (which is very very unlikely in my opinion), then what does that have to do with Rooney getting the record now?

I am sure when Charlton got the record everybody didn't say well it means nothing because in 50 years teams will be playing more games and have better fitness levels so are likely to score more, what a useless record. As I said earlier, I have grown up with Bobby Charlton as England's leading scorer and looked on him as a legend despite only seeing him on video and DVD.

I agree there are a few 'pointless' games, but generally teams get to play only 2 per qualifying campaign, home or away to Luxembourg, Gibraltar, San Marino or Liechtenstein, that is how the seeding system works.

A lot of the time England (and other elite countries) play their friendlies against top sides in order to generate more income, so that means there are even less games where the score will be 7 or 8-0.

Which world class strikers was Shearer keeping out the England team?

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21 Nov 2014 10:48:11
Cole played 15 times for England and scored 1 goal.

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Ian Wright, Sheringham, Cole off the top of my head are all ridiculously better than Rickie Lambert. We haven't had a striker since Owen to rival Rooney because we have very poor options, (can you believe Heskey was our alternative?).

If Shearer was playing for England 2004-2014 - he would have well over 75 goals now in my view and much better performances in the mix.

In the past 5 years can you think of any quality Rooney performances for England, I can't.

Everyone admits how bad the England team is currently, yet we are destroying our group with ease and playing with players that wouldn't have competed with Gerrard, Beckham, Neville, Terry, Rio, Lampard, Cole, Scholes - these are the players Rooney had the luxury of playing with during his prime. I think Peter Crouch would have had a better record playing with those guys the amount of times Rooney has.

I went to San Marino recently for a weeks trip, I'm sure I saw their goalkeeper driving our hotel shuttle bus, their Striker was waiting my table and their captain was on pot wash. The gulf between Rooney £300k a week and the postman CB for San Marino £300 a week, has never been as big. In Charlton's day and even Linekers sports science was nominal, coaching was virtually none existent, now the best players are given infinitely more advantages than players from Lithuania, Estonia, San Marino, Slovenia etc etc etc. I bet we fly to our away games in first class, private jets, the others are using budget airlines, I wouldn't be surprised if Estonia ferry it over to us and stay in 3* hotels!

Hodgson will earn more in a year than the whole Estonia (equivalent) team and management combined. Would that have been the case in Charlton's day?

The gulf is widening, I just think the performances are worsening because of the growing importance of club football in players thinking.

20 years ago Internationals was the pinnacle, now the Champions League and Premier League is what players want more, hence it's not as hard to break records anymore internationally.

Rooney has underachieved given the circumstances.

Lets just move on to Arsenal because we clearly aren't going to agree on this point.

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21 Nov 2014 11:47:31
You aren't really making a point to disagree with mate, just rambling about how poor San Marino are, a team England have beaten by a lot of goals for a long time anyway.

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Gds
Your wrong, the last post is the most desperate post.

Beast
Shearer and sheringham played in the same team ?
Shearer would of scored 75 goals in the last 10 year ? Even tho he only scored 30 in the 8 years he played for england.
Ronaldo has 52 goals in that period
Messi 45 and rooney 46 but shearer would of had 75.

by the way like rooney shearer was also a top player

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21 Nov 2014 12:23:10
jred,

Can't tell if that's a joke as we are making the same point.

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21 Nov 2014 12:52:20
Id love to see his explanation for puskas goal record in internationals.

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21 Nov 2014 13:48:46
jred,

Sorry mate, thought you meant my last post was the desperate one, I get you now. Anyway, Beast has realised his points are running out so we should discuss the Arsenal game now ;)

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21 Nov 2014 19:04:34
I bet Beast watches Maradona's 'greatest goal of all time' v England and only sees poor defending 😊

It seems to be fashionable these days to discredit other peoples achievements. Its possible to discredit anything if you try hard enough.

My opinion is that you can only beat what's in front of you and Rooney is about to break some records which have stood for a very long time, which nobody else - no matter how easy the conditions have supposedly become - has managed.

I'm not a massive Rooney fan but he's one of our best players and his achievements for club and country are admirable.

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Beast I honestly don't get it ! I have been on this site now for nigh on 4 years and regardless of what is happening at the club you are not happy.
I agree that we have hardly set the world alight in the last 5 years but as a fan I always try to find the positive even if just to make myself feel a little better and it seems that you scour the internet to find negatives to post on here. Is it for a reaction?? Do you really buy into the things you are posting?? I don't really get why you even watch us atm it obviously brings you nothing but hurt.

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21 Nov 2014 23:53:13
As I said the other day, Lineker, Shearer and Owen all failed. I remember Linekers last tournament where is expected he'd break it. Similarly half the media jizzed over the possibility of Owen breaking before all the injuries wreaked his career.

Rooney will break it. Fair play in doing it. Doesn't mean I have to like him off the pitch but I can respect an achievement made on it.

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