Manchester United Banter Archive January 23 2014

23 Jan 2014 22:41:47
Has anybody seen Kloot lurking around here lately? I'd love to get his views on the Mata deal. If it goes ahead we will have spent more this season than any other in the clubs history!

I don't think I've seen Kloot since the 4-1 derby defeat.

23 Jan 2014 21:56:51
Can we not assume Mata is being signed for the left? We have let Zaha leave on loan and if Nani goes this week, then that's two wingers out and Mata in. For me he will play on the left or Adnan on the left with Mata on the right.

As much as my preferred formation is similar to that of Chelski's - Nani is still here and we still have Young and Toni V. That's effectively 2 LW options and 2 RW options (given Nani's versatility).

If Nani does go then I think you're right.

I think we will play quite narrow and with Rooney dropping deep, Mata and Januzaj will be a perfect combination to interchange. I do think Mata will be predominantly on the right and Januzaj on the left, but the movement will be immense and cause plenty of problems for any defence.
This is of course if we do sign Mata ;)
Hopefully Nani goes with a load of money in a part exchange for another player!

I'd go 4231 with mata starting right of Rooney and januzaj on the left. Obviously they can all interchange but mata is more useful cutting inside imo whilst januzaj is useful going down the outside as well as coming inside. I feel januzaj is better at beating a man whilst dribbling so this way we still keep an option of width down one of the flanks whilst also being able to stay narrow and compact, when required.

HB - I think that's most people's favored formation. Unfortunately what most people want does not matter and it will all depend on how Moyes wants us to play.

CAM, I love your idea of immense movement. Thanks for the chuckle

I agree that a 4-2-3-1 is the way to go with an interchanging three of januzaj, Rooney and mata. Each can give width if needed and can play centrally of the others drop deep. HOWEVER, this style of play will only succeed if we make two or three additions to the side. Rafael can provide width on the right, but we need a new LB who can provide some attacking width but be more defensively capable than evra or buttner. This width on the left will be crucial in a narrow formation. Also we clearly need a CM who can go box to box and both tackle and provide offense and trailing runs on counters. I wouldn't mind two from gundogan/guarin/Vidal/pogba/etc but one is fine as long as carricks injury isn't too bad. But we need that strong cm pair to sit behind the amazing attacking four because januzaj and mata are both defensive liabilities. But imagine being a defense with rvp/Rooney/januzaj/mata coming towards you with the freedom to attack knowing they have defensive cover. Spend what's needed on a cm, get a LB for a decent price and were set for a while. Only a cb or another cm in summer. Not far away, but not close either with my current faith in moyes and co.

23 Jan 2014 21:31:33
My mate works at the OT Megastore staff are working overnight printing thousands of Mata shirts. They have been told to get all the 7's and 8's prepared as Mata will chose from either when he signs. Also big Rumours going around Old Trafford staff that This isn't going to be the last of the signings as the amount of shirts arriving for sale is twice the amount that arrived for the signing of RVP.

You've got to love the shirt sales/megastore type rumours! Those shop assistants are always 1 step ahead of the game =D

If you want to know who we're signing, just pop in and ask! I hear that they're the first to be informed by the club, before Moyes!

Been a while since i've seen one of this good old fashion rumours.

I think the megastore staff have been negotiating the deals. Bought time they got one right.

23 Jan 2014 21:16:33
Dear friends!

Just want to say that how much I love this site and comments of my fellow friends. Really learnt a lot from this website about football. I feel that this website is part of my life and you all become my family. In the beginning of the season I said that Chelsea for me are in self destruction mode by not playing Mata is a big time mistake. I also made my predictions about PL.

My predictions were

1 Manchester United
2 Arsenal
3 City
4 Chelsea/ Spurs

but now it seems that United will be at 3rd or 4th which still is an achievement in my eyes.
And Chelsea even did a bigger mistake by selling Mata to us.

I am hoping to get Vidal next!

Best wishes to everyone hope this is the beginning of a good time for United.

Love for all

king of desert

Not sure i'm as optimistic as you in terms of finishing 4th and certainly 3rd, however, really enjoyed that post.

Its not all doom and gloom even if it seems that way at times!

I don't think we will get third place. That would mean Arsenal dropping 15 points more than us over the last 16 games. We could sign Vidal, Gundogan, Coentrao, Garay and Mata this window and still not manage it!

Thanks King and I agree - I think everyone loves this site, despite our nip picking and differences of opinion. Everyone's wants the club to succeed and it's great to have a place to come with so many opinions on how we achieve or why we aren't achieving that goal.

23 Jan 2014 20:43:03
Juan Mata best midfielder in Premier League.
In Moyes we trust.

Can`t remember, is Mata our first spaniard?

Scratch that

Haha imposter How stupid do you feel right now XD

*cough* A certain First team player comes to mind

Lol moment of madness

Theres only been 3 others apart from mata if he signs. Ricardo, de gea and pique

23 Jan 2014 23:12:49
Pretty dopey, first name on the team sheet too,

Maybe now we'll be more appealing to the Spanish players. I like the look of Tello too amongst others. lol

23 Jan 2014 20:36:17
Mata press conference put back until Monday apparently, oh how my mind is hoping that is to unveil someone else also!

I hope so. Fingers crossed!

I hear the deal will be announced tomorrow and that he will be revealed to the press on Monday.

23 Jan 2014 11:26:25
I was thinking. Instead of us having to ask question upon question and simply annoying the Eds sometimes, why not create a section of the website where the Eds could provide updates on transfer targets etc? Just a thought

{Ed002's Note - Not worth it, we have tried.}

Ed002 - Would it be possible to create profiles for the ed's similar to those of registered members then? At least that way we could click on your profile to see any updates you've posted across the sites rather than you having to answer the same questions over and over again?

I imagine it gets rather tedious!

{Ed002's Note - It is not going to happen, sorry.}

23 Jan 2014 19:55:17
So the tv have been reporting all day that Mata will be having a Medical on Friday, signing and 4 and a half year contract. I really hope this goes through as I believe it will become a catalyst of a new United team. We may see a similar effect on what happened to Arsenal with Ozil.

Also something weird to look at is Wayne Rooney has just followed Juan Mata on Twitter. Is there something he already knows? I hope we manage to keep Rooney as it has shown this season that we need more than 2 world class players. The more we have the better.

I am still confused though, why have we gone for Mata but supposedly no news on a Left back and a Central Midfielder? I hope we manage to fix these positions too.

Rooney knows what we all know.he is 100% guaranteed to be a United player tomorrow.

Apparentlyy negotiations for Vidal are on going and with their interest in Guarin I wouldn't bet against believing these reports.

DD, I would love to believe that but there is still a part of me that says it might not happen. After this season I guess it's difficult. I hope tomorrow when I am home from College I see it all over the page.

And Fresh if we signed Vidal, I would be over the moon, to think I was hoping for just a LB or CM this Janurary, now look at us! It's difficult to process all of these potential signings right now!

Phil Neville started following him too Weggy.

Fresh

I hate to be negative but don't believe vidal is on the cards at least not in this window. Hope I am wrong.

The Mata transfer makes sense for all though, he needs regular game time for the world cup, we need him to hopefully qualify for CL next season and Chelsea could do with a lot of money for an unused player and increase our chances of taking points off THEIR title rivals.

Any other deal for players such as Vidal, Gundogan would be very tricky because the player or club are in no rush/need to move/sell.

Coentrao is the only other likely transfer I see this window unfortunately.

23 Jan 2014 18:44:20
I have read a few articals today suggesting Moyes wants to offer Rooney a new Contract with a Pay rise but he has to play in midfield, which would allow Mata the number 10 roll, now, in my eyes this is (if true) a genius offer from Moyes. if accepted then we would have the box to box midfielder we so desperately need, who can pick a 60yard cross field pass, score goals & defend whilst also saving money to spend in other areas. if not accepted then he would know where he stands in regards to rooney's summer sale.

I would honestly be delighted if this was the case. He has all the right attributes to play in the midfield, and it would allow the likes of Januzaj, Kagawa, and potentially Mata if he signs to get game time in the no 10 role. Not sure how Rooney would view this change of position however, and although I hope he stays I have a feeling he'll leave this summer.

Rooney's best position is as a number ten, Vidal's best position is midfield, Mata's very good at coming in from the wing. I think we should play players in their best positions. No more square pegs. That's where we have been failing for a while and to be fair Moyes has pointed that out early on and he's doing something about it.

When you have the likes of Adnan, Mata and Rooney, they can be fluid in attack. Just like Willian, Hazard & Oscar.

Mata out wide is terrible lacks pace and can't beat a man has to play centrally a I pray Rooney signs a contract really don't want him at CFC

Disagree Syd. I think Rooney would be the "complete" midfielder. and as I said would save us a lot of money to use in the other areas. And Mata could play behind the striker.

Rooney is pretty average in midfield mate, he has played there a lot over two years and only impressed once or twice. Plus he likes to score goals, so he will want to play as a striker. I think SAF wanted him in midfield and when Rooney refused or said he wants to remain a striker, I think SAF tried ushering him out the door. I think there is a good chance Rooney will leave this summer, but I'd like him to stay for a couple more years and play in the hole.

LOL, that last sentence didn't sound right ;)

Lol Syd we always knew how you felt for Wayne, deep down (no pun intended)

Sydney, I hope Rooney stays and now we (almost) have Mata I'd like to see him play more as an out and out striker rather than a No 10.

His record has been really good in the seasons when he's been tasked with just banging in the goals.

If the team can get back to where it should be, we'll be playing 60 or so games a season and I don't like the idea of Wellbeck and Hernandez playing so many games when RVP cannot. Switching Rooney and RVP around at centre forward wouldn't result in the same loss of quality.

Kagawa and mata can cover the No 10 position and we'll need a left winger like Reus which we already know.

Its time to get back to when there were no squad players, just a group of quality players who were all worthy of the first team.

Andrew, Van Persie is a much better out and out striker than Rooney and I would want both Rooney and RvP playing at the same time. I want to see Rooney return to the hole with Mata on the left, Adnan on the right and RvP upfront. If we can sign Vidal then Vidal and Fellaini/Carrick/Jones will mean Rooney doesn't need to drop so deep like he used to and could stay upfront meaning RvP doesn't get isolated.

23 Jan 2014 18:33:28
Curious, if you could have one of the following players announced as a United player by next week which one would you prefer?

-Vidal
-Pogba
-Gundogan

VIDAL

Vidal. All day long.

Vidal. Then Gundogen in the summer:)

Vidal hands down!
How about you ozwald?

Vidal - but only because Gundogan has been out injured since August and will not be at he his best until the summer anyway. Scratch that. Vidal regardless.

That's a hard choice any of them would be good but for me Gundogan would be perfect he sits back and is a better defender and his positional play is near perfection he would set the attack and protect the back

Vidal

Well Vidal looks popular, not surprisingly. I'd love Vidal and either Pogba or Gundogan in the summer as with Fellaini we would have the best midfield 3 in world football behind arguably one of the best front 4's in world football when fit.

Vidal all day long. He s a warrior. Exactly what we need.

VIDALLL

Vidal - I agree with his big headed comments about himself.

. Gundogan.

*sneaks away*

Vidal. But wouldn't say no to the other two.

I don't know, Vidal at the moment is without a doubt the best overall player.

Gundogan's back injury makes him a little less attractive.

Pogba I think would take it for me, he's quite a bit younger and not far behind. Going to be in the top 3 midfielders I think in 4-5 years time.

Where did Fellaini show up from? He will be moved on as he doesn't fit with united style of play. Yes, he destroyed us with Everton but think of how he did that. He was essentially playing as a second striker taking down all of the clearances and causing havoc inside the box with his physicality. And he's above average as a defensive presence for an attacking mid or #10 but that doesn't mean he's capable of being the midfield general we need as the backbone of the team to allow our skill players the freedom to flourish. He'll go to another team that fits him and score a bunch of goals but he won't have that success at united for the reasons above. Carrick and a new signing as the 2 in a 4-2-3-1 and maybe carrick to a lesser role if we bring in two from our group of cm targets.

23 Jan 2014 17:42:25
mata is quality at 25 he has got years ahead of him .this is a move in the right direction.well done utd

Is Mata Champions League Cup tied ED

{Ed004's Note - Yes}

Agreed. You can never have enough world class players. Also, he's settled in the UK, so no language problems, no culture change. He also knows the way we play and knows the pl very well. So, he'll be a great buy.
One last thing, with the gea and mata in the side, the chances of acquiring further Spanish players must be better, and that's a great thing.

23 Jan 2014 17:27:07
Arsene Wenger says he's confused as to why Mourinho is selling Mata to a main rival, erm. Cole, Toure, Van Persie, Clichy, Nasri, and Adebayor, jesus Arsene give your head a wobble :) haha

23 Jan 2014 17:25:10
Its not all doom and gloom guys, the future is bright I'm sure. This week could see Mata arrive and maybe Rooney will sit down and sign a new contract. Both would be a great boost for the club. We also have one of the best young talents in the world who I believe could be a future balon d'or holder, Januzaj.

A front 4 of RVP, Rooney, Mata and Januzaj would gives us the fear factor we have been missing. With this we can make the top 4! And who knows we might get another new arrival before the end of January (hopefully Contraeo, Vidal or Gundogan).

The future's bright, the future's Man utd's!

23 Jan 2014 16:58:42
What are everyone else's views?

{Ed004's Note - Although it is a pressing issue at this moment in time I think it's best this is not discussed on the site as it may lead to people taking offence to it. I understand you have expressed your views in a non-provocative way however, it's an issue for another site. Lets just think of how good the signing of Mata will be mate ;)}

Im currently looking at my computer which is sat on an oak kitchen table.

Behind is a set of white pvc doors and I can only see a little way into the garden because it is dark.

Anelka ed?

{Ed004's Note - Aye}

Testicules?

Andrew B.
Top stuff

23 Jan 2014 16:38:08
Went on twitter for the very first time yesterday to look for info on the Mata deal.

Think I'm hooked now - Supposed £40m bid for Vidal all over the site.

My testicles are starting to twist round each other with all the excitement!

What's your twitter name?

Screwballs? lol

Twitters a savage place to be during transfer windows. If anyone puts their twitter names on here, and I'll follow. I'm paddyjryan if anyone wants to follow.

While I can't see it happening, if we signed Vidal too, i'd probably cry.

I've only just had a wee gander at it. I think I'm @stevenjk33!

Just read we are offering kagawa and cash to Dortmund for Gundogan. However never listen to IndyKalia he chats so much tripe.

23 Jan 2014 16:23:05
All this talk of Mata is makng me laugh. You think one player is really going to change things. The only way Mata will change things, is if you make him your manager

Thanks for your concern.

WHY LAUGH? Is he going to make us a worse team?NO. Will he make us a better team?YES. NO MORE NEGATIVITY.

How's the Salah deal going?

23 Jan 2014 16:48:30
Looks like Mata is in the bag just Vidal Reus Gundogan a centre half & left back & were back in business

Mata is just the beginning red81, MU are planning a huge build in the summer.

Salah will be a great player for Chelsea ;)

Haha You So Funny.

However No One player won't Correct everything. But its a step in the Right direction.

Let's see how much of an influence one player can have when Suarez goes to Madrid in the summer

Thanks Sydney, that's so sweet of you :)
Enjoy Mata, lads. He's an amazing player as well as a genuinely good person. I wish him the best at your club, use him well. ;)

Sorry I forgot that we played the first six games with out him and did not lose. Did we not also play you in that time. Remind me. What was the score Sydney. If and I say if Luis goes, we still have Sturridge, borini will be back and we will add to the team with the 100 plays mill. And if salah does not want to join us then that is fine. Liverpool do not beg players ever. You either sign for us, or regret it.

Red81 - "you either sign for us, or regret it"

Cheers mate, that cheesy line just cheered me up no end.

Like something out of a bad mafia movie :)

Red81, like I said. Clubs with massive piles of cash and good academy set-ups do not wither away. We may have a blip which is understandable given our manager of 27 years has retired, but we will come back stronger. Mata is just the beginning of a massive build and even with us spending £150m-£200m over the next couple of years, we will still break-even comfortably with the FFPR. Liverpool do not meet the FFPR and could be thrown out of the UCL if you manage to qualify. You do not have a penny to scratch your arse with lad.

Make sure around come may. We can have a chat about both of our league positions. Even better. Stay around for the next couple of years. I'll copy your messages and wait till I can paste them back. I believe that your not the best at making predictions as this season have proven

RED81

After your terrific start to the season and Suarez being on fire and pretty much most things have gone your way, including the wonderful spanish fouls.

Come may and if you for some reason have finished 6th and a summer to look forward to with your main guy looking to jump ship, would you say you are progressing?

23 Jan 2014 16:13:57
Does anyone know anything about carrick's injury? thanks.

23 Jan 2014 16:08:49
if mata signs it will be a major boost de gea rafael jones evans coentraoe vidal fellani januzai rooney mata van persie would be a brilliant creative hardworking young with experience team the defense is solid but jones and evans are like vidic and evans were the players that have to leave are vidic ferdinand evra buttner carrick anderson permantlyend of season yound macheda bebe and a few fring players bring through the youth they have shown there good enough aworld class centre back could be added tothat team over time

23 Jan 2014 15:53:27
23 Jan 2014 11:27:43
Arsenal Fan here. I posted this on the Arsenal site and I thought I would share my thoughts with you boys here too.
Just got to say this about last nights penalty shoot out Manchester United v Sunderland. 10 penalties 7 missed! . Don't get me wrong I've played football too, but let's have it right that's a discrace and an insult to any working man that has to slog his guts out for a fraction of what these players get in a day. These men get the best medical care, best diets, best training, fantastic salaries, and a dream life to millions of fans . For them to put on a display like that from 12 yards makes me wonder what fans are paying for sometimes . Think about it a 75% FAILURE RATE . And just in case anyone thinks I am anti Utd and Sunderland if Arsenal was putting on a show like that I would have been twice as hard on here. If I were paying their wages I would be thinking of a way to cut their money down by 50% to liven their ideas up a bit. Unbelievable discrace.!

It's 70 percent failure rate

As much as I hate to agree with an Arsenal supporter, u are spot on.My four year old daughter would have at least hit the target.lol.

Goldboy, if you pardon the pun you are "spot on" pressure is part of being a Manchester United player but! missing four out of five penalties is terrible! (if the staff at OT are still looking for Welbecks effort try the car park opposite the ground!)

MICK1. Sorry mate 70 percent let's not fall out over 5 percent LOL. I genuinely feel gutted for you boys having to go through a display like that.

To be honest I looked at the penalty takers and thought only Fletcher will score. Van Persie and Rooney were missing penalty takers. Mata if signed would take penalties. Carrick can take a penalty. Vidal if he could be signed is an exceptional penalty taker. I didn't think we would win the shootout, but it was closer than I expected.

Even Giggs would have been a good penalty taker

Asides from fletch who out of them has ever taken a pen before. Not going to get too down about it but things coulda been different. Buttner can take pens but was replaced giggs was on bench and is fairly reliable at them too and chicharito was injured. don't really think we can moan too much and be all like rafael, jones how come you didn't do better than that. Like I said they've probably never had to take one before. And also I kno his mistake cost us however hats off to mr de gea for his performance in the shootout!

Domi, you are spot on, Buttner is a fantastic penalty taker and if he didn't get injured we could have brought Giggs on in the final minutes. Both are very good penalty takers.

Our friend has a point. Professional players especially after we had saved the first one, need to show some f. guts and heart and not wilt like tulips under pressure. Bambi started the whole thing and you know how much I like him:)

23 Jan 2014 14:56:08
Just an observation but we were not playing very well before Carrick got injured.

While he was injured, we actually managed six wins on the bounce and generally playing a little better and confidence returning.

Since Carrick has returned to the side we are even worse than before he was injured.

We just sit far too deep and concede possession far too easily.

Now I'm not slating Carrick as he has been a very good consistent player for the club but at the moment I think he is slowing our play down too much.

As I said just my own observation, there is a lot more going on that I can't see and I'm no football manager, just a fan.

Carrick does slow the play down too much, but he's still probably the best we have right now. I think we will start to see Fellaini more as Moyes will want to prove he wasn't a mistake. Fellaini and someone like Vidal could work pretty well IMO.

I think Carrick will be a squad player next year.
I think he's struggling with the pace this season.
Like Syd said I think we will see a lot more of Fellaini now. let's hope that injured wrist was effecting his game and he comes back a better player.

I think your right syd vidal fellani partnership could work very well. its amazing the time fletch had off wit his problem an in only a couple of games back he is still 10 times the player carrick is. if you think i'm bashing carrick wel your right he has no place on the team IMO.

CAIN

Carrick was always slow but now he is geriatric! Don't think it is a coincidence that when he was out injured and we had more energy in midfield the performances and hence reresults improved! But the concern here is if we can see this (not saying it is that simple, but sometimes it can be that simple ) why can't the chosen one?

I agree Carrick is the best of what we have but I am also glad that a few others are taking the stance of him being out of the side is a better scenario for the team than him in. Before the december injury I talked about how it could have been a perfect scenario to try out different combinations in the centre and lo and behold we went on our best run of results all season.

Now with Fletcher back and looking good, we could get a more mobile and creative CM and we will look a lot better than where we are now. Herrera could be the answer if he is available. Although we all want Vidal/Gundogan I can't see either moving this window.

23 Jan 2014 14:11:48
Have to say Gary Neville was spot on with his assessment of United last night;
No creativity
No tempo
Not quick enough in midfield
Just not enough quality in the squad

Yes RVP and Rooney returning will help immensely but it's the lack of someone creating that has let us down all season and relying on an 18 year old Januzaj is simply unfair on him and pretty shocking for a club like ours.

Juan Mata alone is not the answer but he is the beginning of the surgery needed at United! I'm happy to have a player of his calibre, hopefully a sign the glazers are seriously going to reinvest.

Rio, Vidic, Evra, Buttner, Nani, Young, Cleverly, Giggs, Anderson, Welbeck all not good enough with respect to how world class as some have been.

Bring through Michael Keane, Tyler Blackett, Davide Petrucci, Nick Powell, Wilfried Zaha and Jesse Lingard.

A CB, LB, 2x CM minimum of top drawer talent to come in and all of this could be 18 months in the making so keys enjoy the ride!

23 Jan 2014 13:49:19
So lads, as we all know we have a GOD GIVEN RIGHT to be top of the league and winning titles every season, so what has happened? Where has it all gone wrong? Has God abandoned us in our hour of need?

Or are we just having a major transition and need to stick by the manager while he replaces average - good with good - world class player?

How many people from other teams have said we think we have a god given right on our page? Not one United fan (apart from me above) has posted on here saying we have a God given right and nobody has probably ever said it in their life apart from trolls from other teams posting on here.

Loved the poem by peashooter, sometimes things like that can really cheer the mood, and different to a lot of the other stuff posted on here recently. Last night was ridiculous, and it is all too familiar, this season is a write-off, let's enjoy the ride and support the lads to finishing top 4 and see who we sign in the summer. Next season is huge for us.

I do not want to be premature but seems the Mata deal is all but done, what a great signing. If we spend 120-150 million in these 2 windows and signed 5-6 players then we have the right to judge David Moyes. If the players still can't play for him then it might be time for him to go, but as it stands 'Every single one of us, will stand by David Moyes'.

We are 6 points behind the champions league spots. We are signing a world class player and we have 2 just coming back.

This is obviously the start of our downfall. Championship next season imo

23 Jan 2014 12:30:10
Banter Please,

Our standard of football (I did not see the game last night and going by what I have read) has been average for over 3 years now and I would say getting worst.

Whilst there are varying opinions on players, formations and people's favorite players and dislikes of some, there seems to be a never ending criticism of things after every game, in arms of even substitutions now a days.

Then you also have the easy out by venting our frustrations and anger which is by blaming moyes for being completely useless and not fit for the job.


All of the above brings me to a question.

1. Has anyone ever considered that this group is just not good enough and we are looking at moving many of them on, DM demeanor definitely resonates that he does not rate many of these players.

2. Has anyone thought about the possibility that maybe the club knows that many need to go and even SAF knew but held off on a major transition until they got a new manager given the fact that he was retiring and no point in starting something that you would not finish.

3. Is it a bad thing to see a clear out, after all reading the posts there must be 8 to 10 players that will get a majority consensus of being good enough.

4. Did SAF get the last drop of usefulness out of some of the aging players and an RVP inspired season to mask the real issues?

Finally, ed002 made some really interesting comments the other day and how our current situation is no different to what teams like chelsea, arsenal have gone through last few years and now almost done with rebuilding.

23 Jan 2014 13:20:44
I was just saying at work that we needed a season like this, to wake a few people up and force the chequebook out.

Good post GCU, our team has been weakening for 2/3 years but this has been masked by one or two great players and the charisma of SAF. We've also been unlucky in not seeing Hargreaves, Anderson or Bebe develop as we'd hoped. We've also lost Fletcher for a long time.
Mata is the start of the rebuilding and I think the Summer will see major change.

GCU, I posted earlier and said the only players who would definitely be at United next season, if I were manager, are DeGea, Rafael (1 more season to get back to his best), Jones, Smalling (squad player and see if he develops into a better player), Carrick (only a squad player for me now though), Fletcher (another squad player), Fellaini (needs a proper chance), Rooney (if he signs a contract), Januzaj, RVP, Kagawa (if we are going to use him correctly), Mata (if we do get him). Anyone else, apart from the youngsters, I wouldn't be too bothered if they left.

I wouldn't normally even think of selling more than 4/5 first team and squad players in a window and replacing them, but on this occassion I would be happy to. We need a brand new start and if Vidic, Rio, Evra, Buttner, Nani, Young, Welbeck, Anderson, Giggs, Macheda, Bebe all leave in the summer and we replace with a quality CB, LB and 2 x CM's i'd be very very happy. Then add Powell, Blackett, Lingard, the Keanes, etc to the squad and we'd have a great mix of quality first teamers, a few squad players and then some youngsters.

Brendan,

Agree with the players staying, I have a feeling Kagawa might leave as well though, even when used correctly he has still not been great and I am not sure he will be used correctly unless we sign a much quicker passing and moving box to box midfielder. So many times he gets the ball and looks for a one two and the player passing it back to is stood where they were when they passed it. Pass and move is no more for us and that does not suit Kagawa at all. I also think Powell will stay and I can't imagine we will let Welbeck go either.

I am not advocating clearing out huge numbers in one go but can see us pushing out 10 players over two seasons and not necessarily adding that many.

We do not need 24 squad players with only handful of good players but more like 20 good players with a handful of great players.

The reality is in 24 months we might be looking at a United team that is so different to our current lineup with a few surviving the transition.

I have always and still maintain maintain we will spend money on the right players and they will come.

If we do pull of a couple of signings in this window, we are looking at a massive summer. If I remember correctly we will have 150 to 200 million funds available given what we had from last year and end of this fiscal year. Our financials fro this year are based on making it out of the group stages in CL and 3rd place premiere league finish.

I believe there is some upside to those numbers given the possibility of making CL quarters and League Cup Semis, which were not in the forecast.

The downside is obviously getting knocked out of the FA cup and league position, although the money between 2nd, 3rd, 4th is nominal by any measure.

Missing CL will affect our revenues for next year by about 9%, that is quite a bit but can be offset by the business activity side, which the new ownership has proved to be very good at.

Finally, as someone pointed out earlier by our standards things have gone shocking for us so far. Take our injuries, some questionable referring, individual howlers on the pitch and we are only 6 points off and it is not the end of the world and still have a lot to play for and lot to look forward to.

Now, off to play some golf

We are certainly average at the best but when you're unable to beat the likes of Sunderland(no disrespect) with a squad that won the BPL last season is something to look up to. I won't even mention the manager because it will sound whining.

But I doubt we can make to the top 4 or even 5 by playing like we do. Our football is so boring and clueless. The manager has a lot to do since he didn't bring anything positive in terms of tactics and gameplay till now.

GDS I totally agree with Kagawa, but if we get Mata and say Vidal in summer then if he is played in the number 10 with these 2 and Janujaz I think it could be successful. I counted Powell as one of the youngsters coming back into the squad, definitely not one to let go of. Welbeck needs a mid table team, he is awful. First touch crap, passing crap, shooting crap, control of the ball when running with it crap. The only time he does anything of note is when he doesn't have time to think, I'm pretty sure he is totally brain dead.

Shahram

At the risk of being called a heretic, I actually think Moyes is a better judge of footballers and what we need than Fergie. If and that's a big IF, the Glazers back him, he knows what kind of personnel we are in need off. I thought Fergie's emotions clouded his judgement on some ocassions. The chickens have come home to roost man, and sad yet true, it was a Fergie controlled poultry!

Deeps.

23 Jan 2014 12:23:29
I must admit that Moyes wasn't my choice of manager but I seriously think that this guy is having the worst luck.
Last night's performance cannot be blamed on him. The team were terrible, they couldn't put more than two passes together and they were sat so deep in there own half for the most part of the second half it was frightening.
It was just dreadfull, nobody got the ball on the floor and just made a simple pass. Yes our defence defended well BUT the amount of times Evans and Smalling hoofed that ball out to no mans land instead of puting there foot on the ball and picking out a pass was unbelievable!
I think Moyes needs to be judged when he gets everybody back, he's had terrible injury problems.
If we get RVP, Rooney and Fellaini back in the squad fit and raring to go. Add Mata and hopefully a new central midfielder I seriously think that we will be fine and go on a really good run and make 4th spot, I also think if everyone is fit we will progress in the Chamions League.

Some of the blame has to be on Moyes imo. He took off Kagawa, who was having a decent game, and introduced Valencia, therefore minimizing our threat down the middle, and allowing Sunderland more time on the ball.

When Kagawa was taken off we had a 54 % possession, we finished the game at 45.

I know possession doesn't win games, but it does kill games off. We should have kept kagawa, continued playing through the middle, kept possession, and killed the game off.

In the second half, when the game started opening up a bit, I don't think any of our players are as capable of putting together a quick counter attack and finding space to run and pass into as Kagawa.

Hold the press! I agree with Simmo! Hope this is the start of something beautiful, mate :)

Sorry Mick I have to disagree.
Kagawa wondered around the pitch like a lost soul. Even when he swapped with Wellbeck he still had no infuence on the game in behind Hernandez.
He just isn't right for this team and for this league.

23 Jan 2014 11:50:54
If we sign Juan Mata today, as expected, it will be a massive move for the club. Not only will we be bringing in a proven top class EPL player, we will also be proving that we still can sign top players and that we are willing to pay big bucks to bring them in. As Gary Neville claims this could be key to convincing other top class players to join us now. However, as good as Mata is, signings alone cannot save our season.

Last night was pathetic: another poor performance and another trophy fallen by the wayside. Blame the penalties if you like, blame De Gea, but we cannot ignore the tactical performance on the sidelines. First half was simple, we needed to score and didn't want to concede. So we had a patient attacking plan. We didn't play very well but we did enough to score and never looked like conceding.

As the team emerged for the second half, however, everyone could tell that something had changed: we dropped back deeper and Sunderland were taking the game to us. Quite simply, at half time the manager told his team to sit on the lead, for a full half and two periods of extra time. This is possibly acceptable if you are playing one of the best sides, but when playing one of the weakest sides in the league you need to kill the game off. Moyes didn't and we paid the price. So off came Kagawa, who had a decent first half but was wasted when Moyes gave the order to defend the lead, on came Valencia, and the game plodded on to its inevitable conclusion.

Last night wasn't a one off either, there has been far too many occasions when we have tried to hold teams and it has bitten us in the backside. But the consistently poor standard of performances, the predictability of our attacking play and inability of our defence to stop shipping goals all point toward the need for drastic changes. Moyes looks like he is being backed financially, but he still needs to prove that he is capable of doing better. Mata is a great signing, but a good manager would identify the problems and start implementing some new ideas soon. Moyes needs to start changing things from the training up if he wants to salvage anything from this season because whatever he is doing now simply isn't working and it hasn't been for the last seven months.

So you were in the dressing room at half-time, Danny?

23 Jan 2014 11:42:37
United's been built on Fergie's mystique
but the squad he bequeathed was really quite weak
With Rio and Ryan, a pair of antiques,
and Adnan and Nick, who haven't yet peaked
last minute goals they once scored, they now leaked
the edifice wobbled, the foundations creaked
Moyes, his successor was harshly critiqued
but United will rise again

If you want to win titles, be strong at the back
but if you want to win fans you have to attack
Busby and Fergie both had the knack
of creating a style that both won and attracts
they forged a spirit that papered o'er the cracks
get out the cash, it'll take stacks and stacks
to replace the skills our disjointed team lacks
and United will rise again

Arsenal and Chelsea are crowing like cocks
as United fans suffer a succession of shocks
City are rampant like a case of the pox
Moyes under pressure his heads on the block
The market's not happy, there's a dip in our stock
it's not looking bright, to the bank we're in hock
but we were all raised in the school of hard knocks
United, we'll rise again

23 Jan 2014 11:01:14
Would mata coentro r Vidal b cup tied 4 champions leauge? I know Vidal played in it but juve r out now. Not to sure if the others played in it this season?

{Ed004's Note - Mata yes the rest no}

Thanks ed004 could you also give me your opinion on Powell if he'll stay out on loan r come back he's havin a cracker of a season at Wigan

{Ed004's Note - He will stay out on loan however, I haven't got to see him play this year. Ed 1 thinks he is a special talent and could be ready as soon as next season}

Ed04. I am unsure if coentro has played for RM in CL this season but I know Vidal has played for Juv.

as such he would be cuptied

{Ed004's Note - Juventus are out of the champions league and therefore it is possible for the club to register 1 signed player from a team that has playing in the champions league as long as they have exited during the group stages. Therefore, Vidal and Coentrao are both applicable to play in Europe for Manchester United}

Hi Edo4.

it may be my reading of the rules but they state.

"One player from the above quota of three who has been fielded in a UEFA
club competition group stage match for another club in the current season
may exceptionally be registered, provided that the player has not been fielded:
a) in the same competition for another club;

Would that not mean they could not play?

THANKS. for the great job you all do

{Ed004's Note - I am nearly 100% certain that Vidal would be allowed to play since Juve are out?}

23 Jan 2014 08:46:14
Hi eds I've a few questions to put to you I'd like your honest opinion please.
1 is kagawa all they say he is IMO not produced in 2years
2 would Rvp have signed for us if he knew fergie would retire
3 if we get mata will Hernandez go IMO touch of a giraffe
4 is moyes tactically naive or has he lost the dressing room.last season we won the league with same squad

{Ed004's Note - I thought Kagawa was playing well last night he kept the ball and was involved in some good plays one leading to us hitting the post from a delightful cross. However, Moyes does not rate him IMO and I think he will be sold unfortunately. I don't think he would have signed without Fergie. No Mata plays a completely different position. I couldn't answer the forth question}

23 Jan 2014 09:46:50
Love the picture going round of the smashed house window, with the line underneath:

"Here Welbeck, you're paying for that."

U got a link for that buddy

No, mate, sorry. Just being sent to me by my supposed friends. Tried looking on Google for it, but no joy.

Yeah had no luck with google meself, cheerz anyway m8.

23 Jan 2014 08:58:30
Chin up & chest out boys. I know it sounds like sour grapes but half of me is glad we're out. At least now we can concentrate solidly on getting that 4th spot & ensuring we're ready to go next season. Hopefully next week we'll see an interchanging front three of Mata, Rooney & Adnan behind RVP. Can anyone tell me a better top 4? That'll be hard to handle no matter who we play & there's goals galore in that. If we can somehow wranlge vidal away from Turin then we really will be a force again.

Believe lads.

23 Jan 2014 07:28:02
You probably need to get back to basics. Moyes was appointed your manager before the season started. He inherited the team that won the EPL. The club had the summer to sign new players. You signed Fellaini.

Why are you strugglng so much?

Moyes has failed to impress so far. Do you stick or twist?

At the end of the day who else would you bring in who is available?

Sign Mata then look to rebuild in the summer.

Just develop a new mindset that getting top 4 is a success and accept that Citeh and Chelski will most likely contest EPL title for the next few seasons

23 Jan 2014 02:19:45
Really don't understand why united think they need Mata. When rooney and RVP are fit he is going to have to play on the wing, and your wingers don't interchange or even cut inside much, which is where Mata is most effective. You have Kagawa, Januzai to play that #10 role if rooney isn't fit? You still have young, Nani, valencia, zaha, even welbeck to play on the wings. Really don't get the transfer if it does go through.

Cool story bro. Mata is head and shoulders above all of them lol, why not? Plus they'll be moved on soon enough, if there are takers ofcourse.

I think we have gone for Mata because he is available now. Simple as that. The much needed players i.e Koke, Vidal, Reus, Gundogan etc might not be available till the summer by which time Juan Mata will have gone elsewhere. So I essence we have chosen the pudding before starter and main course. (poor analogy I know! )

No idea who you support but would you not want him at your club? Of course we have other areas which need strengthening but its all about raising the quality of the overall squad and Mata certainly does that.

I think signing him signals the end for Kagawa but more importantly, it will release Rooney to play more as a centre forward which is probably where he is most effective. To me this is like signing a new centre forward because we've not seen him in this position with enough regularity. As an added bonus we will probably see less of Wellbeck and Hernandez because of this.

Last but not least; this is a real statement of intent by Utd and will certainly help to attract other top targets.

We need to bring in about 10 - 12 top draw players over the next couple of years and Mata is a fantastic start to this process (I know Fellaini was the first but he's made so little impact we may well have not bothered).

I hope this goes somewhere to answering your question.

I believe it might spell the end of one or two of Rooney/Kagawa/Van Persie. Undoubtedly Mata is a quality player more creative than any player currently at United. Moyes is getting the chance to assemble the players he wants to play the way he wants, and I think we'll see a decent amount of faces leaving Old Trafford in the summer.

You's done well at old Trafford earlier in the season didn't you, you know facing an average side and all that!

Perhaps a change of approach and moyes wanting to leave traditional wingers behind as most of ours are useless. If he can take his blinkers off about welbeck aswell and bench him we may start getting somewere

The short answer is - we don't. His is the last position that we need to be strengthening. However - when a player of his caliber becomes available you sign him and figure out what to do with him.

We missed out by not snapping Ozil up in the summer and so I'd be very surprised if we made the same mistake again now. Arsenal did not need Ozil - but look what he's done for them (in terms of galvanising the players and fans as much as his on field performances).

I think we will move to a similar system to Chelsea. Our wide players are terrible at crossing and our front men are not particularly adept in the air. Having an interchangeable front three behind the main striker (Januzaj, Mata and Rooney) will work for the rest of the season. Then I envisage us replacing Kagawa with somebody like Reus in the summer.

Call me radical but I think its possible to change from one formation to another?

Really Caolan? After less than a week ago? After 1 of 4 penalty against a cellar dweller? After all the utter rubbish you lot have watched this season, and you're going to pick that part out of Cali's post and try and debate the fact?

Moyes may be fighting a losing battle but your m*sterbating with your ears with that one mate.

23 Jan 2014 00:46:24
Have to say, I really think Hernandez has let himself and the club down. He's had a great opportunity over the last month or so and he hasn't taken it.

You'd have to wonder what's going on in these players heads off the pitch as well as well.

Just don't think he's a united standard player.

In my opinion Hernandez has shown passion, work rate, ability and loyalty throughout his United career and he should be loved and respected for that. He has been lackluster this year but it can't be easy to pump yourself up as is his style when the whole team is flat. Saying that I didn't get to watch the match tonight, however he performed he doesn't deserve heavy handedness.

Had a chance over the past few weeks you say? How? Welbeck has started every game, chicha scored in both his games he has been involved in (for more than 5 mins) How is that letting himself down? Infact its the midfields service, bar januzaj, who has let him down, moyes for not starting him, who has let him down.

I appreciate that he was probably tired but I was disappointed that he didn't take a penalty.

Hernandez is a quality box predator, if there's no service coming into the box he can't produce what he's good at

23 Jan 2014 00:24:17
We may improve, we may get top 4 this season but I'm telling you all now (I'm sure most will already know ) this manager is not going to get that extra bit that makes all the difference between winning and losing cups/titles out of this team, he is not capable/lucky/clever enough and I think consistent top 4 finishes are all we can hope for till the men in power realise that he is a decent manager but not the winner you need to be at a club like utd!

Give Moyes time midfield is rubbish, why take kagawa off, when his the only one who can keep hold off the ball

Totally agree with you.

Lag away didn't keep hold of the ball at all. He was no better than any of the other midfielders. I was surprised when he was subbed because I already thought he'd gone home!
DM just cannot get a tune out of this team. They seem to have refused to accept change! Still in denial I think. I don't seem to be able to move away from anger!

Kags was one of the few making runs past defenders that januzaj played through balls and when he came more centrally, actually tried to play through balls to hernandez
yes he needs to bulk up a bit as he can be easily disposed, but his movement was actually pretty good and got in good positions a few times. we looked a lot more threatening when he was on the pitch, personally I think welbeck should have come off for valencia not kagawa

I don't think he touched the ball in the second half

The manager is tactically and motivationally inept and is bereft of the experience needed to manage at this level. It is obvious for all who wish to see it.

Redman

Always the managers fault huh. I saw the penalties and have to wonder what these players are made off and how embarrassing.

Careful there as your theories might be getting knocked off one at a time.

1) 30 million cap on any player is about to go
2) "Club will not back the manager with funds is about to go too"

You will have to go into permanent hiding if for some unexplainable reason with RVP, Rooney, fellaini back we end up winning 10 on the trot suddenly :)

22 Jan 2014 23:54:12
What a strange night for all sunderlands possession we were so comfortable in defence. I saw someone say Smalling was so poor tonight you can't of watched the game as he was rock solid and they didn't have one clear chance all game it was 1 shot on target 1 goal and what a howler it was he didn't put his body behind the ball he got it all wrong. Our only hope of a trophy now is champions league? Imagine that who knows as chelsea did it with their worst team in 10 years. Gary Neville said u watch united this season and you can't keep thinkin that the team hasn't done enough the simple fact is they haven't got enough and I think he's spot on we haven't nowhere near. The worst thing about tonight is you just knew we would get stung absolutely gutted its been story of our season but I think signin Mata will lift every1 and he will make lot of chances an has few goals In him too. 30 chances in 13 games he's created this season more than any of our players. Bad day for us lads but we will bounce back stronger and nights like this makes u appreciate the good times that bit more

{Ed004's Note - I get that he was a bit sloppy in possession and a bit dodgy with the ball a his feet etc but his tackling, positioning and heading! was very good tonight. How many times did he dominate a set piece and power through the crowd to win a header? I think the lads lacking massively in confidence as he never looked comfortable on the ball other than that I thought he had a solid game}

But there yourself you have highlighted the problem it doesn't matter how good his positioning or heading or tackling is if when he wins the ball he passes it straight back to them he was also very lucky not to be sent off tonight

{Ed004's Note - That'll improve when his confidence improves, he matures and ultimately gets more game time at cb}

Smalling is a great defender, he just needs the right player with him to tell him what to do.

none of our team are leaders.

Put it this way it certainly was not Chris Smallings fault we did not make the final tonight. All the attributes are there for him and he will become an excellent CB. I saw quite a few people saying kagawa didn't deserve to be taken off but I think on a consistent basis he doesn't offer anywhere near enough so does not deserve a place atm. If you watch Japan games he plays on the left yet he's much much better for them. I think it could just be the premier league and he will never adapt, however I sure do hope I'm wrong because he's definitely a talent just hasn't shown it yet.

Yeh exactly mate if we created lot more we could of hammered them tonight as defensively it was so comfortable, well 1 poor shot on target all game with extra time tells its own story. Nm there's reason to be positive as we are going to win the champions league haha. Lol. Bond what is your opinion on Mata he will certainly help us create chances. With him rooney rvp an fellaini to come back I'm sure we will be a much better side. Things surely can't get worse anyway

If we can just settle on smalling and evans at cb with contrao (hopefully if not then buttner) and rafa either side then that confidence will come, then have jones and fletcher infront of them and you have a pretty solid foundation to build on.
there is little point plating vidic and rio now as they will be moving on.
if we can get someone else like a vidal, gundogan or dante in then great but if we have have to wait till summer, we may as well play the lads who will be here next season as often as possible to try and bring them on a bit

dags

I agree with those that say Smalling shows some really good defensive capabilities, there have been many a cb that's only job is defense and with the ball at their feet the only expectation is a safe pass to another defender with better passing ability. I think he should be encouraged to do this, there is no shame in it, he also should not play right back for similar reasons plus he cannot finish or cross although admittedly we do not have much depth in the position.

23 Jan 2014 07:58:00
Ay3 people like you realy anger me, backing the manager of moyes calibre. He simply is not up to the task. I could understand if he was a winner before coming to United but he has never won a trophy, only managed 1 final in 12 years at Everton.
What is phill Neville and the rest of the coaching staff experience? None
And as for wellbeck he is a Sam Allerdyce type player.
If we stick with moyes we will have a good chance of going down not up. I predicted top 7 at beginning of season now I'm going top 12

Draig

You are a trip and highly strung out :)