26 Mar 2018 14:40:31
{Ed's Note - Timbo has posted a new article entitled, Is Social Media ruining Manchester United and Football in General?
26 Mar 2018 15:43:23
Good post timbo. I agree with you, not only football but it has the whole world in trouble.
I hate these twitters and so on.
I have a Facebook page but don't get involved in that crap.
These pages are the only social media I take part in.
As for the players now they love themselves and football is becoming a circus from it.
But what can we do they move with it. I know if I was a manager while they are training and taking part in games I would ban them from being on their phones.
26 Mar 2018 16:06:27
I agree wholeheartedly Timbo but sadly it's a necessary evil. I think it's tradition that every generation can't fathom what the new generation is in to. I'm 31 and I can't stand social media. Never had a twitter, instagram or Snapchat account. I deleted my Facebook account last year because it's a fake environment.
Sadly nowadays it's one of the only ways that kids communicate. Whatever made you decide to support Manchester United 50 years ago is not appealing to the next generation of fans. Whether that be the heroic story of the Busby Babe's. Or Best, Law and Charlton getting Old Trafford on the edge of their seats. Maybe you were born under the shadow of Old Trafford. Maybe it was one of your fellow countryman that donned the famous United shirt that drew you to us. Maybe it was Fergie's 90's teams that caught your eye?
The majority of kids don't care about any of the above (at the moment) . They want the team that has the most Facebook fans, twitter followers etc. And the kids are the ones that hound their parents for the two new kits every year and the tracksuits and all the tat that we can put our logo on.
United capitalised on their success in the 90s which made them a global "brand". We don't play with a blank cheque book. To dine at the top table in football, we need to bring our own money and if that means having an official tractor sponsor, then that's a necessary evil in my book. The soul of football is long gone or maybe it never existed in the first place!
26 Mar 2018 16:10:25
Good article. Twitter is killing society. Everything's so polarised. Brexit, Corbyn, Trump etc etc. Its just full of people so busy screaming insults and smears that there's no debate. Everything's so extreme there's no middle of the road. Nothing to do with football. But its getting there as well. The vileness around subsections of fans making insults about clubs tragedies, the abuse directed at players for having a bad game, homophobic or racist comments from players as well as fans. The constant whining from fans about shiny new signings. United's own twitter account made some comment in January regards the upcoming fa cup game an it was full of eejits just saying announce Sanchez announce Sanchez.
26 Mar 2018 16:13:50
it isn't ruining anything. Timbo you are an old man doing old people stuff which mainly seems to be criticizing today's youth about how they behave, that's how the generation before yours responded to whatever changes they saw in your generation and that is how my generation will behave about stuff footballers would be doing 25-30 years from now.
26 Mar 2018 16:42:43
Csm I have to disagree with you here. I've never seen so much false behaviour than I have on social media. I was at a restaurant the other night with the wife and there was another couple there we knew. now you could see they were arguing and things weren't right between them.
Anyway I looked at them and for 3 seconds they were smiling for the camera they took a selfie.
Anyway my wife was friends with the girl. up on Facebook she wrote. out with Dave having a ball and named the restaurant. pure bull.
Then you see people putting up pictures of what they are eating, who gives a toss.
Then for me the worst of the whole lot. children Christmas morning opening their presents. wait kids don't open them untill I get my phone and show everyone what we bought you from santa. aren't we great parents.
False bulls##t.
Then you have aww my child is 6 years old here's an iPhone
It's everything that's wrong with the world.
26 Mar 2018 17:10:20
I've got to agree with Leahy. I've had friend requests from people I was at school with that I haven't seen in 20 years. For a good reason. Why should I help people I never liked, never spoke to, or who bullied me, get more friends. And yes the rubbish people put on there, especially regards their offspring. Who really cares. Its really all about them not their kids.
26 Mar 2018 18:06:56
Mort, you're spot on about everyone's views either being far right or far left. Football has become like that. After the Sevilla game I couldn't look up the football news, I barely came onto this site (though I still read the majority of posts) and it was so hyperbolic. If it's not the greatest thing in the world, then it's the worst thing in the world. That's the problem with 24 hour news, most of the time there isn't enough news to fill the day so they engineer stories. That's why this site is fantastic. Everyone voicing their opinion and no ulterior motives behind the scenes. Unless the eds are the illuminati?
Granted Jose ballsed it up big time against Sevilla, the three great results before that are glossed over and now Jose is the worst manager in the world. Sometimes it's alright to say "we were crap, let's move on".
26 Mar 2018 18:45:36
Social media has given a voice to the previously voiceless - this is praised by vested interests, but its pathetic. Got to ask yourself why they were voiceless in the first place? Probably because they have very little of value to add and were busy working in their jobs that they were content with until this new timewaster and friction creator came along.
Social media arrives and now it's possible to achieve celebrity for mundane things, develop a following for your uninformed belief system which further entrenches ill thought out views. Furthermore, these people now see their contemporaries every hour of the day pretending their life is soooo much better than it really is - which creates resentment and a false sense of importance. It's all a con feeding into everybody's desire to be valued.
Society is getting worse because Indians think they deserve to be Chiefs, and idiots you would normally walk past on a busy high street now have a podium to scream their idiocy. These idiots are not ridiculed like they would have been before social media, because at the same time we have things like political correctness protecting and encouraging stupidity without consequence.
Idiots are encouraged to believe nothing is good enough anymore - people have lost sight of what their station is in life and set their goals and aspirations to ridiculously high levels on account of the BS they see all around them. Not achieving instant gratification makes them depressed, then they delude themselves that their failure is somebody else's fault, which ultimately perpetuates the issue for the next poor sucker that reads fiction believing it is fact.
Corporate's, Media and Politicians love social media because it allows them to profit from ill-informed sheep. Most certainly will not have read around a subject that they suddenly want wholesale changes made to in society. It's collapsing though as people trust things less and less, what was a glorious triumph for the people behind social engineering is now failing because people see how easy it is to lie/ mislead - if they can do it then why can't the press, politicians, businesses - the genie has been let out of the bottle.
Fools think they are special, nobody can be critical for fear of being called a 'hater' and the good, interesting, honest people are being drowned out by the morons. I fear for the next generation. Where we could read a book to learn something, they have to read 5-10 books to learn the same because of all the agendas at play - who knows what is real anymore?
It could have been good, it should have been good - but corruption and political correctness have destroyed it and many more things to come undoubtedly.
{Ed025's Note - what a great post, i believe everyhing you say there beast well done mate.....maybe you should put it on facebook?.. :)
26 Mar 2018 18:37:59
Timbo, I enjoyed reading your article mate but I'm afraid Social Media is here to stay.
We live in a world where celebrity is king and you can now become famous by just posting some pictures on line.
I understand the sentiment but maybe the more troubling reality of social media is how it's being used by advertisers, multinational companies, news agencies and even terrorists, other extremist's groups and politicians in an attempt to influence everything from what soap powder you buy to how you vote.
Let's be honest we all hold a morbid fascination with other people's lives and most people on here have admitted to having some form of social media account. It's pretty easy to remove yourself from the drivel by just deleting your accounts. My general rule of thumb is if something doesn't enhance your life then just get rid.
In terms of social media in football I don't really have a problem with it as long as the players are doing the business on the pitch. If players are more concerned about the number of followers on their Facebook, Twitter or Instagram accounts than the quality of their football then it's up to the manager to sort this out and move them on if it becomes detrimental to their performance.
26 Mar 2018 19:19:49
Leahy do you think pretentious behavior is something gave create because it didn't, it is as fake as it was 50 years ago just because you can see it on a small screen on a larger scale than when you were unaware of it for most part doesn't mean Facebook created it.
Mort tell me which one's worse you go to a friend or colleague or whatever's house and he drones on about his offspring or you see a post about the same. Atleast with the post you don't need to sit through it.
About the friend requests, if one of those people met you on street tomorrow and said hi whether you shrug and ignore them or reply back is on you, Facebook has nothing to do with it. If you don't want you don't have to accept it.
Beast there is lot of bad rubbish happening because of social media but do seriously think that social media caused or even enhanced it. Every thing is a weapon in the right hands. Yet you completely ignore the good it does, stuff like the united airline incident or police brutalities in usa won't see light of the day without social media.
26 Mar 2018 19:37:53
Beast great post, I agree with ed it should be put up on Facebook.
I read it to my 2 oldest girls.
Kids follow like sheep, the want designer clothes because the friends have them, and the celebs have them.
People don't even look like themselves anymore if that makes sense they look mock, it was like the time Charlie Chaplin entered a Charlie Chaplin lookalike competition and he came 3rd.
{Ed025's Note - love it leahy..
26 Mar 2018 19:55:14
Leahy did you never want anything your friends had when you were young?
26 Mar 2018 20:02:10
Cheers Ed.
CSM - See this is the trap, everything has to be either/ or.
Social Media has many good points, nobody with a brain will deny that. It allows people to connect across the world, learn things they would never know about and maintain friendships/ relationships that maybe they couldn't do otherwise. But it is not used for that in most cases. We are now seeing provable evidence of how it's used as a propaganda vehicle as well, which should further highlight it's real purpose.
To use your examples (but I do get your point) . I remember seeing the Rodney King beating that took place in 1991 and launched the riots - before social media. There will be things missed and advantages to getting good causes or bad practice out in the open easier like those you mention. Things like the UA incident would have been picked up by the media if social media didn't exist imo, as the victim would have launched a legal attack on the company and there were dozens of witnesses. Social Media causes far more problems than it solves, (we still have police brutality and we still have companies acting inappropriately with their customers btw) .
The media is late to the party now so they have to over-dramatize or trick people to read their article in order to get views. It's a mammoth job separating truth from fiction even with what were formerly trusted sources. Investigative journalism is virtually dead because short cuts have to be taken and agendas have to be reinforced because eyeballs of sheep are not loyal or patient.
Like most things in life there are two sides to the coin. But yes I believe overall Social Media is enhancing problems in society in a big way for the reasons I mentioned in my first post. Little things don't matter anymore, jealousy is the most powerful emotion in my opinion and social media is a jealousy weapon of epic proportions. It also helps reinforce dangerous or incorrect information, corrupting society.
Watch a quiz show on TV today, then watch Bullseye from the 80's - it's amazing the difference in intellect of contestants (before social media) . We are being dumbed down and social media is a weapon assisting with the process.
26 Mar 2018 20:11:52
Social media gives everyone with an opinion the right to air that opinion. No matter how stupid that opinion is. Everyone now believes that the rest of the world wants to hear their inane ramblings on everything from policing, to the medical professions, to how to run a government. Before social media, these people, quite rightly, had nowhere to spout their nonsense: A. because they couldn't be bothered to write a letter to their local newspaper, because it would take time away from essential Jeremy Kyle viewing time, or B. even if they could be bothered, they were too illiterate to do so.
{Ed025's Note - very true mate..
26 Mar 2018 20:16:07
Csm I did but I got what I needed not what I wanted.
26 Mar 2018 22:24:53
Never forget the immortal words of our ancestors, which we will all mutter ourselves given enough time.
"Things were better in my day"
There's good and bad in every new development. However, all are forward steps and therefore progressive. It it just becomes harder to appreciate that when your being left behind.
Our biggest fear is the unknown, and as the world moves beyond us we start to fear it as we no longer recognise it. I've spoken to many a chap who will gladly tell me life was better in his day, then I point out that in his day millions were dying across Europe, bombs were raining down on families in their homes, food was rationed and children were torn from their mothers breast to be sent to live with strangers in the countryside. And compared to those in concentration camps across Europe we had the best of it. Even when I present them with that they still try and claim that it was somehow better then than now.
The world doesn't get better or worse, only different. Either embrace it or fear it. It will change no matter what. Would you rather live in fear or happiness, that is the only choice you have.
Or do what I do and drink a bottle of port and become all philosophical. Lol.
{Ed025's Note - give me swig of that shappy...nice post mate..
27 Mar 2018 02:30:58
Beast always love to read your post but your 2 posts above are the best since no football is involved š¤£š¤£. Tells me youāre a logical person š.
As for the subject above I like what I read from everyone. It sort of tells you the āage groupā of the posters. My take on media (not necessarily social media but a bigger picture) is that we can undo all the technological advances and we need to evolve and move with it. Any good thing always comes at a price and potential downside. Use it wisely and life will always be better. You cannot stop the bad guys also using it to help themselves afterall you canāt know white (color wise) unless there is a black and you canāt know good unless there is a bad. It depends really on who is using.
So media (again not necessarily social) is good but depends on who it is helping and who is exploiting these technologies. My kids are so far ahead of me even though I was with working for Big IT corporates for the last 20 yrs. My son beat the crap out of me in computer games since 10-13 yrs ago and I feel the younger generation picks up faster than the generation b4 them. The last generation developed it but the current are the ones born out of it. Itās their way of life, period. I am learning things from my kids as well and thatās a joy š¤£.
So like someone said above if you donāt like what you read just move on to the next read and I practice that. I do read other news but ultimately come back here to read all the posts as I trust the bare minimum responsibilities of the Eds on this site. I also get to know some of you through here without which life would have been boring and mundane. Wouldnāt it be really boring this week if we donāt have here to post during this week? š¤£š¤£š¤£
So for me thanks to media (may not be social media) like this also exists and I am happy to know all of you.
27 Mar 2018 06:44:31
Great post Beast. I like some social media but I tend to use it as a restricted group of people I know and like, itās a good way to communicate daily with people you might not otherwise keep up with. Iāve also got 2 teenagers so WhatsApp and Snapchat are regularly in use. But it has become ridiculous. Someone I know has 175 followers on Twitter (who he doesnāt know) or as he says ā175 people who are interested in what I have to sayā. I find it a bot bizarre that heās played by this but also that 175 people are bothered enough to ālistenā to his nonsense. I get why people might follow celebritiesā every uttering (not for me) but your everyday Joe spouting his opinions into the world seems pointless.
I partly blame 5 Live, ācall now and give us your opinion, we want to hear from youā all day every day. If I am listening to a political debate I want to hear from the politicians and experts, not Joe from Coventry who thinks the Middle East problem is really easy to solve. Everybody feels they are entitled to tell us what they think no matter how inane, irrelevant, or plain stupid it is. Another modern phenomenon is the lack of shame people have. If they shout their view loudly enough then you will have to listen and if you donāt agree then tough titty buddy.
I had to post this paragraph form Beatās post again as it is so goo.
āFools think they are special, nobody can be critical for fear of being called a 'hater' and the good, interesting, honest people are being drowned out by the morons. I fear for the next generation. Where we could read a book to learn something, they have to read 5-10 books to learn the same because of all the agendas at play - who knows what is real anymore? ā
Amen.
27 Mar 2018 07:42:55
Wow! Some amazing insights and responses that stretched way beyond football. The conclusion appears to be social media is an unacceptable evil but we have no choice but to let it flourish. Is that a fair summary?
{Ed001's Note - god no, people could just stop using the likes of FB and Twitter that allow free reign to bigots and abuse. Or simply keep their own circle of friends and 'followers' to genuine friends. It is not that difficult to delete FB, no matter how far apart your family and friends are. If they mean that much to you, then surely they are worth the extra effort to phone or email occasionally, rather than the lazy easy option of just adding them on FB?}
27 Mar 2018 08:01:02
Well said Ed.
Doesnāt mean it is there that you have to use it. I deleted my FB account and even the biz LinkedIn. Those wanting to link with you especially the so-called headhunters usually are using the linkups into your other contacts but unfortunately not you š¤£. So whilst social media has its merits it all depends on who is using and what for.
Just use it if it helps and not if it doesnāt. Just like a car, drive if you need to else walk, take a bus or train. Thereās always options and other benefits š.
{Ed001's Note - well said, though I have noticed that very few people who have a car use anything else, even if they are only going 100 yards down the road!}
27 Mar 2018 09:26:20
What a read first thing over breakfast - really thought-provoking comments.
Unfortunately, social media is only part of the problem in todayās disposable society, where instant gratification drives a world that never seems content enough to reflect upon what it has - and always wants more. And Football seems caught up in this.
Iām as guilty as anyone for not appreciating what I have: I update my phone and TV, though ones I have are perfectly good enough; endlessly flick through channels to find something instantly engaging, rather than being patient and waiting for the plot to develop; many other things also, from buying things on the credit card and not saving up to using processed foods in cooking rather than starting from scratch using proper tasty ingredients. My parents must squirm and be so disappointed: what happened to all the things they taught me?
And this constant demand for instant gratification is everywhere: news, politics, culture and leisure to name a few. I was at the recycling centre Iāve the weekend and the sheer waste was obscene, with perfectly decent stuff being chucked. Look at the car market now: people donāt keep their bangers going, they just sign up to a PCP or lease and change every year or two.
Consequently, Itās a ticking time bomb for the next generation: these so- called āMillenialsā get grief for being allegedly pampered and narcissistic but whoās encouraging them to be like this? We are. We canāt be bothered to put the effort into teaching them how to value their possessions, how to realise that patience is a virtue and that there are other people out there so much worse off than us.
We need to step out of the consumption circle, take a break, think about whatās really important. Taking a weekās holiday away from our phones should be compulsory as we reconnect and reassess. Yes, You Tube videos are funny for ten minutes but your mates are hilarious for a lifetime. Yes, itās great to binge on Football rumours but it all get a bit sinister with request after request, hassling others just because we havenāt got the patience to search for ourselves. And getting a Facebook update can be mildly interesting but better to grab your coat and meet them down the pub.
Thus, I think that social media/ our constant need for the latest news is certainly not helping Football but itās more of a response to how we live nowadays in a materialistic, disposable and superficial society, full of instant sound bytes, opinions, pictures, tweets, etc - but where little else has any real substance. The players are caught up in this but so are the fans. Although, you might argue that Football is something that has all the qualities that could bring everyone back together: excitement building up to a game, patience through the season, social interaction and shared joy and celebration at a good result.
However, unless we do more to raise these concerns now, weāll leave a very dangerous and frightening legacy for our children. We think weāre being good parents keeping them plugged in and charged up but ultimately weāre not doing them any favours at all.
27 Mar 2018 09:51:23
Good post Wallace.
There's good and bad in it, your dammed if you do and your dammed if you don't. but as ed said if you aren't happy delete.
Ed 033 if your about and have time I'd like to hear your opinion on this thread.
{Ed033's Note - Part of the agenda is to get everyone to worship degeneracy and become degenerate through influencing them at schools, colleges, universities, mainstream media and government policy in general. Social Media is a great way to see whether their influencing is working.
Obviously we should be all be engaged in working towards excellence and not degeneracy. However, if you look at Social Media as a whole, we can see their degeneracy influencing is working really well.
27 Mar 2018 11:03:11
A very fair point Ed001. My summary was more about United than society in general. Facebook truly is a paradox though as the best way to instigate such a campaign (at zero cost at least) is via social media. I think many people would drop Facebook in the current climate, however its akin to recycling. Many don't bother simply because they believe others don't.
Personally, and not meaning to come across as arrogant or expert - just positioning my outlook, as somebody currently studying forensic psychology who has studied social psychology I honestly see social media as big as a threat to society - if not bigger - than artifical intelligence.
Too many people are just not wired for such diverse (and so many) 'relationships' - even just online. In the end we seem to harvest more hate than compassion whether based on envy or just simply being in a different social group. It takes vey little difference between people to foster hate.
27 Mar 2018 18:16:18
Good posts.
Timbo - Regarding your last point seeing Social Media as a bigger threat than AI. I think they are one in the same mate, social media is turning the lesser minded into robots, regurgitating what their masters tell them, policing dissenters of the narrative, working/ consuming/ watching then repeat until death.
Corruption is everywhere and has always has been, but this time I fear it's different because the top dogs have figured out how to stop any meaningful dissent, (let the minions fight the minions over nothing issues online) .
More and more people of character will start to think 'what's the point'. Lazyness is being encouraged everywhere, it's Turkey's voting for Christmas at the minute.
{Ed007's Note - :-D KT won't be gong anywhere anytime soon, Danny.}
