Manchester United Banter Archive May 28 2014

28 May 2014 23:12:54
REST IN PEACE MALCOM GLAZER

28 May 2014 22:17:09
I hope there's nobody on here posting anything disrespectful about the death of Malcolm glazer, please all remember he was somebody's father and grandfather and nobody should be celebrating this day

RIP Malcolm Glazer

Second that.

RIP MG, thoughts go out to your family and friends.

29 May 2014 07:57:30
God rest his soul RIP

Some cotroversial decisions as said on here but has been a good owner and is better than a lot of them out there man really cared about the club if not investing what some thought he should couldn't have asked for a better owner RIP Malcolm Glazer

28 May 2014 21:47:19
There seems to be a lot of unrest on here about United's lack of activity in a transfer window that hasn't officially opened yet. The same names are being thrown around as certainties to be targeted by LVG, but in reality nobody knows what players he's pursuing and these expectations are only going to lead to disappointment. I do expect United to be active in this window, but I don't believe we're just going to sign from the pool of names that everyone seems to consider to be the only available candidates.

On a side note, Atletico just signed Angel Correa, the youngster from San Lorenzo. Having seen him play a little bit I have a feeling this will turn out to be somewhat of a coup for them in the future!

28 May 2014 21:29:34
RIP Malcolm glazer

28 May 2014 21:14:28
RIP Malcolm Glazer.

28 May 2014 21:07:04
Malcolm Glazer R.I.P.

28 May 2014 20:58:03
Malcolm Glazers has passed away at the age of 85, no matter what your opinions on him are I'd like everyone to respect the man and spare a thought.

28 May 2014 18:58:02
Who is interested in Adam lallana? Would like to think were interested in signing him this summer because I think he will have a good World Cup.

I don't expect him to be a starting player and I think England will go out in the group stage so I don't think he'll get many chances.

Carloto, I'm a bit torn on whether he will start. I think after the season Sterling has had (well since December), he will almost certainly start. Welbeck has done very well on the left winger for England. All of his chasing down. Then there's Milner who is a defensive winger what Roy likes. It's a tricky one.

28 May 2014 21:21:46
on BBC website .

Malcolm Glazer died this morning aged 85. He is survived by his wife, Linda and six children.

Whilst many of us supporter had serious reservations about the Glazers ownership of the club, the last season excepted, the club has had major success since their take over in 2008 and as such they are part of our history.

Condolences to the family.

28 May 2014 17:37:15
Hi all, I think frustration is what a lot of us are feeling right now as supporters. But let's be honest none of us know which players LVG has given EW to chase. Its clear to me that they are not the same targets as Moyes had. So patience is the key and the kneejerk reactions on here to every insane press and twitter report is complete BS as are some posts stating some ludicrus opinions as 'facts'
I will go down on the record now with my opinion having seen LVG work at very close quarters with a new LB and 1 top class CM he can take what we have into top 3 position through his top class coaching.
However I believe he will bring in 4/5 players mixing experience and youth and most of them will be multi functional and can play in 2/3 positions equally as well. His targets and team will all be top players and will perform to a high level. I trust him and his methods you won't recognize some of our current squad next season trust me on that.

28 May 2014 14:00:30
With Pochettino going to Spurs there seems to be an increasing opinion that Shaw will follow. Cast your minds back to last summer and Moyes attempt to bring Baines with him and the ridiculous price that they paid for Fellaini. It doesn't quite work like that and the previous club tend to play hard ball in these situations and demand over inflated fees.
Having said that it seems unlikely to me that United will land Shaw. In recent seasons we have found ourselves in similar situations where a transfer has lasted almost the entire close season, with the usual deal done etc. and United do not get their man.
To name a few: Thiago last season, Hazard before that and let's not forget Sneijder. And the great Ronaldinho was courted for an entire summer to end up at Barcelona. So do not get too hopeful with Shaw.

I don't see Spurs as a threat. Just Chelsea.

Red squirell,

What about the players that we did get?

Mata, Berbatov, van Persie, Kagawa, Jones, De Gea we did alright didn't we?

GDS2
Of course those players were ok. The point I was trying to make is that in the last few seasons we have got drawn into prolonged sagas to sign players. We always ( according to the media ) are favourites to sign the player but the deal is never done. And some of these were with David Gill so Woodward cannot always be blamed.

RS, you genuinely see Spurs as a threat for Shaw? Can't say for definite but he is going to be playing for Chelsea or us next season and even with this summer set to disappoint a few due to lack of 'world class' signings, I tend to feel that Shaw will end up playing for us because there's less competition for a place in the first 11 and Chelsea have looked at, and put a fair amount of ground work into numerous other targets that would be more worth their money imo. Only factors that make him more secure are that he's English and Prem proven which are the two reasons I want him

Does it not depend if Shaw wants to work with Pochettino? He will have seen how well people like Bale of got on there and will also know that he is a guaranteed starter as the left back options are awful at Spurs. I could quite easily see him moving there. Not confident at all at the moment with this deal.

Fresh

You can be such an old lady and believe every rumour you read. Spurs are not the type of team to spend 30 mill on a left back.

The rest of you need to settle down and the moaning is unbelievable. The window closes in 3 months, so relax and enjoy the world cup and things will take care of themselves including shaw.

Correct cgu. Let's see what the world cup brings. And if lvg doesn't get the right players, then I will let him know!
All my mates in Portugal are laughing themselves at me as they know I'm a complete nutcase when it comes to United, so it is funny that Mr lvg is living 20yards from my gate.
Any dodgy team decisions and he'll know about it! Haha.

28 May 2014 11:36:07
Please tell me I'm not the only one really worried about the shaw deal. This should have been wrapped up 2 weeks ago. It's embarrassing, other clubs sign players in the space of days and we take forever! Why is this? I've seen some people say the club doesn't want to be held to ransom, if Southampton want between 30-35 million just pay it. In today's market you have to expect to be asked to pay these prices. I'm really worried we won't end up with any new players, mainly because off late we have been really poor in the transfer market! I personally think we should get a director of football in and give ed his old job back.

EW has his old job still plus his new one. If he screws up this summer I have no doubt that MU will look for someone else to look after player recruitment.

Not so sure I agree with just handing over between 30 and 35 million for an 18 year old left back

It's the norm now. United have become an embarrassment in there transfer dealings.

Bilko, why is it coming out of your pocket? Would you prefer Luke Shaw or £30m-£35m off of the debt in bond buybacks?

I would be far more concerned about paying £24m for a 30 year old CB (Miranda).

This is getting out of hand. Shaw is ridiculously overpriced, and not as good as some left backs we could be targeting.

Ricardo Rodriguez, Alex Sandro and Leyvin Kurzawa are superior players, while Moreno and Kolascniac are just as talented. They do not get as much hype because they don't live in England, and don't have the tabloids following their every move.

Not to mention the window has not even opened yet, and he is with the England squad on international duty.

Mick1, careful mate. Like Shaw is the only left back in the world. £30m for an 18 year old is a bargain.

Mick, first of all the three you have mentioned above are all 3-5 years older than Shaw, Shaw who has already proved he is EPL standard and Shaw who is willing to join MU.

"Not to mention the window has not even opened yet, and he is with the England squad on international duty"

Completely irrelevant of course simply because negotiations have been taking place now for well over a month and deals can be agreed before the window is open, not sure why it matters that he's on international duty? I don't see your point?

Yes I think he is overpriced because he is English but tbh I would prefer we got English and kept an English feel to the team rather than be like city with spot the English

Betty, that's irrelevant. MU have identified Shaw as being the LB that they want and wasted weeks on him. It will be another embarrassing blow for the club if they mess this up and of course Ed Woodward is the man who is in charge of such matters.

So by your reasoning Syd, if Southampton came back and said we want 40m and Shaw said he wanted 150 grand a week the club should just say fair enough and pay up

No Bilko, but the amount Southampton have wanted has not changed and Shaw's personal terms would have already been agreed in principle beforehand. MU have a figure which Southampton will accept and we have spent weeks trying to get it down. EW decides what we are willing to pay, but clearly he thinks he can earn some Glazer brownie points by knocking them down, Luke Shaw could have agreed to join us in April if we just paid what Southampton want. I am not saying we should do this in every transfer, but this is an important player as this is a player the club badly want.

28 May 2014 14:06:41
I like Shaw and I think he will be an outstanding player, but there comes a point where you have to say he becomes too expensive.

Would you for example prefer to sign Shaw and for go signing a second midfielder or a winger as we don't have the money to pay 35m for Shaw and still have enough to sign all the needed players?

Or would you rather sign Rodriguez for 15m and have the 20m needed to sign a second midfielder or winger?

Imo shaw will be the best lb in the world for a number of years, I think he is an exceptional young player.
He could also be in the first team for 10 years so 30 mill spread over 10 years is good business much better than spending 20 on robben for example when u only get 3 years for the price

Syd, they might be older, but they are also better players. Shaw is the most over rated player in the country bar Rooney imo.

He is a young, promising, potentially world class player, but there are slightly older players who are already arguably world class. They are more experienced, and not as expensive.

And the " they are older " argument is hardly pejorative. Kroos for example is older than Veratti, and I'd rather have him.

The only thing Shaw has going for him when compared to the continental talents is that he is premier league proven. But so is Fellaini. Mata was not premier league proven when he joined chelsea, neither was Silva.

All I'm saying is, even if we miss out on Luke Shaw, there are other, arguably better, alternatives out there.

And it's completely plausible that the deal for Shaw is hitting a rough patch ( I guess it probably is ) but people are starting to get all testy despite the fact that the window has not even opened yet, and there are better alternatives out there, is intriguing.

Others are freaking out about us not getting Kroos or Fabregas, but there are so many other alternatives who would in all likelihood be much better fits it's unreal. We have no idea what is going on behind the scenes.

I would personally rather have Witsel than fabregas, because one is a near world class box to box midfielder, the other a highly talented attacking midfielder who has been disappointing for 3 seasons now.

The over reactions over the slightest tweet or express rumor is unreal. Just wait and see and stop moaning over every single unreliable rumor.

Syd, how would personal terms have already been agreed? MU would need to agree the fee first for Southampton to give MU permission to talk to THEIR played. You are distorting the facts to support your argument.

Shappy, there are more than enough funds to buy Shaw and other players this summer. Especially now it looks like we will not be spending mass amounts on the likes of Cesc and Reus. So I don't think your theory applies here mate. Not this summer anyhow.

"Syd, they might be older, but they are also better players."

That's my point Mick. How good will Shaw be in 3-5 year's time?

They are currently better players, just like currently Reus is better than Adnan.

But none of this is relevant. The club want Shaw, not Sandro etc.

Betty, via his agent Shaw would be aware roughly of what MU have offered him salary wise. Obviously if/when a deal is agreed with Southampton, then Shaw will sit down himself and iron out all of the details and officially agree personal terms.

28 May 2014 15:06:31
Syd realistically we need a LB one or two CBs, at least two midfielders and at least one winger maybe two that's potentially 7 players maybe more. We can't afford to spend 30m+ on all of them and there will be a budget.

Shaw has huge potential and has played well for a player of his age. But there are several players in the Premier league who are currently better left backs atm. He could fullfill his potential but he may stagnate. How many youngsters have we seen come though our academy who looked like they could be world beaters but they never made it?

Yes Shaw has played well this season but based on his current level of performance is he worth 35m? No.

He may improve but then he might not, its a very important time in his development, a move to a big club for a huge fee may put too much pressure on him.

Also I don't agree with this its okay to over spend on him as he'll be our LB for the next 10-12 years, will he be given a 12 year contract? No so he'll more than likely be our LB for the next 5 years he may stay longer but he could move before that also. let's no just assume that if we sign a young player then they wilk want to spend all their career with us, maybe he'll want to move abroad at some point, maybe he'll want to play for his boyhood club or maybe he might have a falling out with our manager and want to leave.

I'm not saying he isn't a good player but he currently isn't worth 35m and he may not ever be worth 35m its a gamble.

Wouldn't it he better to gamble 15m on a player who is currently better and has a similar amount of potential?

I'm also with Mick I would much rather sign Witsel over Fabregas or Kroos both of whom i'm not sure how they fit into van Gaals teams compared with the other players we have.

Personally I don't have a problem paying this money for a quality left back who will potentially play 10+ years.£3m a year see reasonable to me.
My issue comes with the penny pinching on one player and the paying over the odds for another. Down the years we have lost out on plenty of top quality and when you consider what itwould have cost to keep pogba it is criminal to then go the other way and pay crazy money to others (Rooney for example as good as he is)

What bothers me is not the fact that we're unwilling to pay £30m or £35m for a young lb. it's that the club continually seems to think that the transfer market will suddenly start working the way they want it to. We are always chasing players when it is common knowledge that their current clubs are looking for huge, inflated fees: Fellaini and Baines last season, Hazard and Moura the summer before, and Shaw this time round.

The club pursues this players despite having no intention of matching their clubs' values, and then acts as if this is somehow surprising. The market is what it is, and some players, especially EPL players, are going to have inflated values. But there are, as Mick points out, plenty of other options. The question is, why does the club invest so much time and energy into chasing these players if they feel the valuation is too high in the first place?

Yes we would like Shaw, but if we're unwilling to match the valuation, then move on to someone else.

Shappy, I agree we cannot spend £30m+ on 7 players, but we can spend it on Shaw.

28 May 2014 16:18:39
Danny we can't just pay whatever the selling club wants, if we did that then these clubs will just keep asking for higher and higher fees. If Southampton want 35m for Shaw and we just pay it, then when we want to sign another player then their club may ask for 40m or 50m or 60m at some point we have to say enough is enough and we won't pay what they ask for.

Shaw would earn 100k a week and that would be considerably more than Adnan. He is younger and in no way better than Adnan. Y

That would create a real problem with our pay structure now and in the future. Shaw may well turn out to be a great player but the fee and wage amount is far to excessive.

The point Shappy is that the club has set out its stall that it is after world class players and are willing to compete at the top end of the market. Inflated fees are the hall mark of the top end of the market, and only clubs willing to pay those fees will have any success at the top end.

The problem with United is that they seem to pursue top end players without any willingness to pay top end prices, and that means we are chasing our tails for most of the transfer window. It's not a case of the club saying enough is enough, it seems to be a case of the club continually being told in advance what different clubs value their best players at, and still bring surprised when they don't lower their valuations to suit our purposes.

The reality is that this summer unless we spend the substantial amount of money required to buy a few top players, we will struggle to get back into the top 4 next year. The owners have to decide if they are willing to make the investment required to get us back on track because our current position is a direct consequence of their penny pinching.

Flint, who says Shaw would earn £100k a week?

Danny, I agree there but the money is just part of it. A part that does not bother me as much as some others.

I don't mind the club overspending for certain players, especially young local talented lads who might play for us for years. Us, as supporters, are not really in the loop when it comes to the club's finances, and his price does not seem that big of a problem given how much money we generate. We arguably over paid for De Gea ( who was as expensive as Neuer ) and for Jones ( I still believe he will become an absolute legend at the club ) but when it pays off, the price seems irrelevant.

I don't think Rodriguez would cost significantly less. He is a great player, playing for a big club with history in a big league, whose financial situation is relatively stable. There's no way we'd get him for less than 25 mils.

Kurzawa would end up costing just as much as Shaw, if not more, since he is playing for a club with limitless financial backing.

What bothers me the most is the over reaction on here because we seem to have " failed " to get him especially since the window has yet to open. There are other alternatives, and failure to get Luke Shaw is in no way a bad reflection of our pull as a club.

Barcelona failed to get Luiz, Real Madrid failed to get Aguero/ Falcao. And yet they have the biggest pull in the world.

Getting a player requires both clubs and the players himself to be willing to make a deal. There are so many variables, and all clubs fail to get most of their primary targets. As long as the club manages to address the issues in the team, it is of no importance how many times they fail to do so.

It's just the over reaction that's a bit annoying. The possibilities for strengthening are practically endless, so are the reasons for which a deal might fall through.

Woodward is already being slaughtered on here for his failings this summer despite the fact that the window not being opened yet, and the manager still on international duty.

We have failed to get Neuer in the past, but the fall back option turned out to be quite alright, didn't it?
We failed to get Shearer and we got Cantona instead.

All in all, no need to panic or get worried just yet, there is still plenty of time to sort out what we need in the squad.

"Woodward is already being slaughtered on here for his failings this summer despite the fact that the window not being opened yet, and the manager still on international duty."

That's not true. I have clearly said that if he messes up this summer like last summer, then he will be pulled off player acquisitions and so he should be. We cannot afford any screw ups this summer.

"Getting a player requires both clubs and the players himself to be willing to make a deal. There are so many variables, and all clubs fail to get most of their primary targets. As long as the club manages to address the issues in the team, it is of no importance how many times they fail to do so."

You mean address the issues like EW did last summer? Good one Mick.

There isn't many variables in this case. All we needed to do was offer Southampton an acceptable amount, at least that was the case before Friday. Now after dragging our feet for weeks we will have Chelsea to compete with.

Sydney! Are you Peter Kenyon?

28 May 2014 19:48:52
Syd you forget what Ed02 has said. He said that Chelsea had asked to be kept in the loop of any developments involving Luke Shaw. That means if Southampton were to accept any fee lower than the one they quoted Chelsea back in January then Southampton would let Chelsea know and they could in theory agree to match that fee.

So unless we just paid the fee Chelsea that Chelsea wouldn't pay then there was always a chance that Chelsea could get involved.

The only reason we fear Chelsea getting involved is because Shaw is a boyhood Chelsea fan and we know if given a choice he will choose them over us.

Chelsea were supposedly quoted 35m so unless we are prepared to pay that then maybe we should look else where as we are likely to end up competing with Chelsea in a long drawn out pursuit which we will ultimately lose.

SouthRed, Peter Kenyon, now that's a man who can get deals done. Shame he's a judas.

Shappy, exactly, which is my point. We have had weeks to get a deal done, we have dragged our feet and now Chelsea are in the loop as of Friday. If we had got the deal done Chelsea wouldn't be an issue now. But like Danny said, all this time wasted on Shaw, we could have went for someone who could have been bought weeks ago. Instead we waste weeks, actually months negotiating and it looks like we have fluffed it. We cannot waste so much time on transfers Shaps, we have a lot of building to do this summer.

Sydney

Let me guess so if shaw signs then you will obviously have a different story to tell and how woodward heeded your warnings and people annoyance at the club and dropped his pants and signed him right :) Some of you guys are unbelievable.

Every team out there needs to buy players and last time I checked with the exception of PSG no one has done anything of note.

If MU sign Shaw then it's irrelevant isn't it? Duh!

Syd, you're right when you say the two clubs and the player have to agree. In Shaw's case, if United pay what Southampton want, then it only leaves one party to make the decision and that is Shaw himself. I can't see him rejecting us, so if we pay what Southampton are asking, then the deal will go through.
The stumbling block are United. If we pay the asking price, then he'll come.

28 May 2014 08:46:45
Looking at the posts about Shaw down the page, talk of Woodward getting the sack is nonsense. The club will not pay massively over the odds for the player, end of. The club is a business, and hey will pay what they feel is a fair price. They are bound to try and negotiate a lower price. Southampton are not actively looking to sell the player. They have quoted a price for interested parties, that's all. If moneybags Chelsea won't pay it, why would we? If Southampton decide to negotiate and sell for a lower price then I am sure Chelsea will re-new their interest. We have no divine right to sign players just because we are Manchester United.
At the end of the day, Shaw is still only 18 years old. He is a very good player already, but he is not a £30m (guestimate admittedly) player. With Luke Shaw, you are paying for potential, coupled with the fact that Southampton don't want, or need to sell.
If we get Shaw I will be delighted, but I am not holding my breath. But if we don't, I wouldn't expect Woodward to lose his job over it. We only see what we read in the papers and online. None of us know what goes on in the negotiations, so just chill out and wait to see what happens.

If Ed Woodward has another disappointing summer like last summer, then he will be taken off of transfers in the future and MU will use somebody else. It's not nonsense at all. He has to be held accountable for failed transfer windows, it's his job.

28 May 2014 11:01:28
Syd, are you on the board at OT? Thought not. You know no more about what goes on behind the scenes than anyone else. My original post said that Woodward would not get the sack if we don't sign Luke Shaw. If Southampton are asking an unrealistic price for Shaw, I don't think the club would, or should be held to ransom. Shaw is not the only left back in the world.
I agree that last summer was a disaster, due in no small part to Woodward. But he seems to be highly regarded by the Glazers, and if they wanted to get rid of him for being incompetent they would have done so already. The press and the fans always love to make a scapegoat of somebody, and Woodward has been that man. He needs to get the deals done this time around, but the deals have to be right for the club. He may well be in charge of transfer dealings, but I would not expect him to have total control and an open cheque book.
Ed02 has already said there is no deal for Shaw, so why would he lose his job over a potential deal that may not happen anyway?

BS, Woodward is highly regarded by the Glazers but not for his transfer dealings. He is highly regarded for his marketing skills and getting the best sponsorship etc.
My guess would be IF we have a poor transfer window that someone might be brought in to handle transfers with Woodward continuing with his other duties which is extremely good at.

The problem, Betty, is Southampton have been open from the start about the price they are willing to sell Shaw for. It was enough to convince Chelsea to end their interest in December, but Woodward decided to maintain an interest and pursue the deal. That means one of two things, either the club are willing to match (or close to match) Southampton's valuation, or Woodward thinks he can haggle them down.

If it is the former then the deal should be tied up quickly, if it's the latter then Woodward is just embarrassing himself and the club again. If the club isn't willing to pay close to £30m for a lb, then they shouldn't be wasting their time negotiating. Woodward needs to get over this idea that he can be some maverick negotiator, and either match valuations or move onto other targets, otherwise it will bite him and us in the backside like it did with Fellaini last summer.

Scapegoat? It's his job for Christ sake. He's in charge of player recruitment, he deals with the negotiating and if that goes pear-shaped again this summer then he's the one that's responsible, just like he was largely responsible for last summer's mess. The Glazers do not decide on who we buy and for how much, that job is Ed Woodward's job. If we have another disastrous summer, then he will no longer be in charge of player recruitment and nor should he be.

RedDub, exactly.

Betty, in not paying over the odds and saving money, United are now losing money by not being in the CL! I don't think we are in any position to bargain at the moment. If we need a player, we need him, end of. Once we are back in the big time, we might have to clout to pick and choose who we buy and what we pay for them. Right now, we have to get back into the CL and money, for the first time with the Glazers, seems to be of no importance.

I don't like Woodward but has anyone actually stopped to think that it is the players that don't want to join us? Is this is the case then what can Woodward do. nothing.
The hardest part of the deal is convincing players to join the club, if that doesn't happen then it's a no brainer.

Maybe we've met the valuation, maybe it's Shaw that needs convinced? Maybe Shaw, like Robben, see's OT as "not a option"? Just sayin'!

Nonsense Simmo, you do not enter into negotiations with clubs for players who have no interest in joining you. That is known before negotiations start. Once negotiations start it's up to Ed Woodward to get the deals done. We have spent a lot of time negotiating deals for Kroos and Shaw. Next we will be hearing that LvG doesn't want Shaw either. It's utter nonsense, it's because EW is penny pinching at a time when penny pinching should not be happening. We are desperate for players and we should be paying whatever it takes.

Guys, my OP was in response to the idea that Woodward will be sacked if he doesn't tie up the Shaw deal. Quite frankly, the idea that Woodward's career depends on a deal for Luke Shaw is, in my opinion, nonsense. Whether or not the club should pay over the odds for the player in not the point, and is a completely different discussion.
But I will make the point that many of the people on here lately who say we should pay whatever it takes so land our targets are the same ones who slated the club (and Woodward in particular ) for paying too much for Fellaini. You can't have it both ways.
The club, like I said, is a business. Woodward is the man in the spotlight when it comes to transfer negotiation, fair enough. I am not privy to the running of the club, but I seriously doubt that Edward Woodward has carte blanche when it comes to signing players. There will be other people, board member, Glazer or whoever, as well as Woodward who decide on how much the club are willing to spend on any given player. If the collective decision is that the club won't match the asking price, the Woodward's hand are tied. Deals are not done between two club representatives on the back of a fag packet down the pub.
There is a difference between Woodward "cocking up" a deal, and failing to meet an asking price because the CLUB are not willing to pay it.
As for being a scapegoat, well maybe that is a bit of an exaggeration, but you gat my point. Woodward took the brunt of it last summer, but we don't know what went on in the negotiations last year.
I don't remember too many people shouting for David Gill's head because we missed out on Shnyderer, Lucas Moura, Eden Hazard etc etc. I know they were different times and different cirmustances. But the whole situation NOW is polarised, in many ways, because of the failings and poor decisions of the pre Woodward era in the transfer market.

Thomas, MU have not agreed a fee with Southampton. MU would not enter lengthy negotiations for a player who didn't want to sign. It would be pointless wouldn't it.

Syd, you are now saying that we should pay whatever it takes. You appear to have changed your mind, as usual to suit your argument. Do you remember posting the following:

4.) 28 Aug 2013
MU do not pay over the odds for players. Whatever way you look at this Fellaini isn't worth £23m. If he was worth £23m then Chelsea, Arsenal or MU would have paid it. IMO he is a £20m player. But to Everton he is worth a little more because they overpaid for him originally and he has improved under their care. There is a difference in paying an initial £23m for a player or say £18m initially with the rest in add-ons. To be fair Everton will probably allow MU to pay in installments and that would mean there's more cash to spend on other players. I would be happy with Coentrao, Fellaini & someone like Oezil.

Sydney!

Betty, Luke Shaw was our main target this summer. This was the target that was happening no matter who our manager was. This is a club buy and someone we desperately want to sign. If this falls through due to EW twiddling his fingers then his job will be under serious threat. I am not saying if Shaw agrees to join Chelsea that EW will be sacked the very next day, but he will be judged come September after the window is closed and if it's unsatisfactory, he will be pulled off of player recruitment and rightly so.

MU have significant funds to spend this summer and we have NEVER been out of the top four whilst under the Glazer ownership. We couldn't be more desperate right now. Comparing this to our situation 2-3 years ago is not the same. David Gill and SAF would have made 2-3 signings before the WC because we are in desperate need for reinforcements. EW still has time, but if he messes up again he will be pulled off of transfers in the future.

It's EW who decides what the CLUB are willing to pay. That is his job.

Betty, you need to try and keep up mate. We had won the league then and could offer UCL football. NOW after finishing 7th with no UCL we have to pay whatever it takes to get the standard of player that we need to get us back into the UCL.

Betty, the reason Woodward / Moyes and United got slated for overpaying for Fellani is because had the club moved quicker we could have secured him for the lower release clause. The fact the club and Moyes / Woodward acted so slowly is why most people where annoyed. By acting slowly, the window to buy Fellani at a cheaper price passed and we panicked and paid more.

Betty
it looks like u hit a raw nerve

Jred, it seems like it! If they read my OP properly they might understand the point I was trying to make. Ed Woodwards career does not depend on the his success in trying to sign Luke Shaw. Quite straight forward really :)

No, but whether or not we have a successful summer will decide whether or not EW remains in charge of player acquisitions. Quite straight forward really :)

Sydney, are you sure your not Ed Woodwards monkey boy. you seem to know a lot of inside information on all the failed negotiations / transfer dealings that are currently happenning/not happening at United? Maybe we should all address our questions to you from now on.

Simmo, it's a little thing called "common sense" and being able to process information given to us from the editor. We know we are interested in Shaw and we know that we are yet to agree a fee with Southampton after several weeks of negotiation. This has all been confirmed not just by almost every media source available, but by the editor. We also know that after the Bayern Munich game in Munich, club officials from both MU and BM held a meeting regarding Kroos. Again this was mentioned in the media, but more importantly it was confirmed by the editor. So we have spent weeks/months trying to sign these two players and clearly a deal for Kroos couldn't be agreed and we still haven't agreed a deal with Southampton for Shaw. It is Ed Woodward's job to conclude these deals. We wouldn't be negotiating these deals unless the players were willing to join MU. Therefore if the deals fall through, then it's down to Ed Woodward. And IMO his penny pinching tactics.

All the Sydney has said here is correct. Anyone who thinks the club will spend weeks trying to thrash out a deal for a player without having been told via agent or the like that the player wants the move and a rough idea of wages is living on another planet! Also all this support for Ed Woodward is rediculous! He showed his incompetence last year, and the way he's going again we will have a similar window this time! This is the guy who couldn't get any player we wanted lad year and therefore ended up going back to Fellaini who he could of got £5m cheaper 10 days earlier! He's a good businessman and good with the sponsorship side of things. But clearly player recruitment is not as easy for him! If he messed up again it should be the end of him in that role.

Also the likes of Shappy and Mick saying we shouldn't pay £30m for a young player like that, I think this season it's a case of having to pay a little over the odds. Clubs know were desperate and will automatically hike prices up. How much revenue have we lost this year alone in missing out on Europe? So spending £30m on 5 or so players isn't the end of the world if it gets us back in UVL.

Stand, I am just waiting for the "Shaw is not on LvG's wishlist" headlines to appear. Another player we have failed to get due to penny pinching.

Don't get me wrong I am not all for paying over the odds for players, but I suspected this summer would be different. We badly need players.

Surely we have to weigh up the pros and cons, spend an extra few million on players or risk another season out of the UCL costing another £50m.

Exactly. Fully agree. Miss out on CL this year £50m. Miss out another year or even two and it's another £50-£100m. Every year it gets harder and harder to get back in it. And if were struggling to attract the best players now imagine if we miss out again? There's no room for penny punching this time, and if we have to spend £5m more that people want for too signings then so be it as far as I'm concerned.

My point exactly, shame others cannot see my point.

28 May 2014 08:13:14
This new poll is interesting regarding barmby as I'm from Hartlepool where he was on loan end of last season so watched him quite a lot. There is no doubt the lad had talent as he scored some absolute crackers aswell as clearly shining albeit within a poor season for us at Hartlepool. Regardless of this I failed to see where he would get into our u21s atm and for that agree he should have been released I just fear that Leicester is to big of a step for him straight off and he maybe should have tried for regular football in low level championship first

28 May 2014 03:03:36
I think a partnership of clasie and carvalho behind the more advanced mata/kagawa would be ideal in a 433 system, with carvalho providing the steel in midfield, clasie the engine and ball movement and mata the creative spark (along with the forward 3) I think this would provide a good balance especially if another midfielder such as McCarthy could be brought in in place of cleverly as back up.
Lastly I found lvgs comments about kagawa being one of the best players in Germany and that he could be so again here, quite interesting, EDs do you think kagawa will be employed more as a no. 10 come left forward interchanging with januzaj and mata? And what do you think this would mean for Rooney?
Personally I would sell rooney, as I don't see him fitting in with lvgs ideals or systems and would go a long way to balancing the books for more needed signings (mine would be martins Indi, clasie, calvalho and Shaw. Maybe another winger and midfielder depending on sales)

Dags