Manchester United Banter Archive December 31 2017

 

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31 Dec 2017 22:21:23
Happy new year all and a couple of thoughts . Jm is our manager and I hope we judge him at the seasons end not now . To his detractors judge him fairly at the end of the season, to his backers the same I hope we all are open minded and judge him on what happened not what fits our own point of view .
I fear he's old school a bit like raffa play anyone half decent and retreat to 35 yards from goal, let the opponent's reach that point unchallenged then form a brick wall where newer coaches hunt the ball down and look to be on the front foot against anyone not just weaker sides, you all know who I'm talking about .
Let's back Jose and judge him seasons end and in a fair way.

Believable8 Unbelievable3

01 Jan 2018 08:40:13
He has had long enough to put together a team that can string 5 forward passes together, and play with some verve and style -but he hasn't done that. The players are playing well within themselves and playing some of the most insipid, slow, boring football of any top 4 team in recent memory.

Add to that the fact that he rarely looks happy, rarely smiles -which can't be good for his own well being -, looks like a homeless person and is living in a hotel away from his family then I think the chances of us and Jose having a long and happy relationship are minute.

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01 Jan 2018 09:29:09
Totally Agree Boy. The brand of football we're playing is not much better than the last few years. We were destroyed against City, parked the bus against Scousers. Tried to park it against chelsea. We can't pass with authority. We can't retain the ball. We're playing stupid tactics with two midfielders and getting overrun in most matches. So what part of improvement are we talking about.
If a good manager had our players, we will be playing better football and dare I say, be closer to the leaders.
4th place is looking unlikely as both Liverpool and Spurs are closing in.
We'll see what happens against Everton.

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{Ed025's Note - everton is a great opportunity to get back on track AAA but this united side is nothing like the one we all want to see, and that for me is purely down to the manager mate..

01 Jan 2018 12:11:32
Who would you guys like to see start upfront with your current injuries?

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31 Dec 2017 20:28:57
Happy new year to all posters and especially to the Eds who give us great info through the year, have a top night and stay safe.

Believable0 Unbelievable0

01 Jan 2018 01:23:41
Hear hear. Happy New year to all Eds and posters.

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01 Jan 2018 04:24:28
Yes Happy New Year one and all.

Hopefully we have a cracker against the Toffee's to get the year off to a good start.

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31 Dec 2017 19:22:49
Well f##k me sideways! City didn't win against the pitiful crystal palace and save for a poor penalty would have lost.

Luckily for palace the wasn't facing man city or they would have been beaten by si. oh.

Believable2 Unbelievable1

01 Jan 2018 10:06:35
That we are celebrating City dropping 2 points, for only the second time this season, sums up where we currently are. I realise that their form is freakish but our cur current trajectory is not up.

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31 Dec 2017 19:13:38
Sorry, post sent. After watching yesterday I am certain that we desperately need someone between Matic and Pogba. Allow Matic to have the defensive look while Pogba can push on. Hell, I’d have play McTominay and dropped Machtlos, at least then we can win the ball and move it forward instead of asking Pogba to ping 40 yard balls all game.

Believable1 Unbelievable0

31 Dec 2017 19:27:55
Mikki*.

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31 Dec 2017 19:33:58
We could also tell pogba if he wants to be the complete midfielder, really be considered one of the best in the world he needs to start out to putting a shift in .

Pogba has the ability, attributes to be a fantastic cm but to get to the next level he needs to go the work rate, wise up and start taking the game by the scruff of the neck .

Not just do the fancy bits when the ball comes to him.

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31 Dec 2017 19:11:11
I really believe the current issues the team is having is down to formation. I cannot understand why Jose continues to play the 4-2-3-1 and it really exposes the midfield. For me, we MUST play a 3 man midfield and a 4-3-3 would be ideal.

After watching yesterday.

Believable1 Unbelievable3

31 Dec 2017 21:41:18
I agree.

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31 Dec 2017 15:30:37
If only it were city today they would have scored 6 past palace.

Believable1 Unbelievable1

31 Dec 2017 16:02:22
big up fosu-mensah, motm today.

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31 Dec 2017 16:11:09
Crisis at City?

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31 Dec 2017 19:39:21
How many points ahead of us are they?

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31 Dec 2017 22:45:27
Its the beginning of the ebd for citeh

CRISIS.

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01 Jan 2018 04:07:23
Cheers CSM. I knew there was s positive reply coming from you. Happy new year. Stay cheerful if you can and back the team and the manager no matter who it is.

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01 Jan 2018 09:37:36
Happy new year to you too Shan, though I don't count on mourinho to make it happy or cheerful for me as a utd fan, backing managers when they look clearly lost is what got us nearly billion dollars spent and nothing to show for it record since Ferguson left.

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01 Jan 2018 12:24:30
Yeah and City have the most entertaining team trophy of the year and Spurs have the bottlers trophy? Man Utd only won three Mickey Mouse trophies last year and have nothing to show for it. I agree with you. May your wishes as a United fan be fulfilled this year.

In case you forgot, we don't have Neymar, we have Marcus Hopelessford. We don't have a Bale or Ronaldo or Hazard, we have Mata and Lingard. We don't gave Silva and DeBruyne, we have Mkhitaryan. What else do you expect from the great Manchester United with this crap bunch?

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01 Jan 2018 18:17:17
Shan it is up to the manger to either get his players performing or ship them out, city have debruyne and Silva yes, but they also have stones, fernandinho, sane, delph and sterling. Compare them to rashford, Herrera, martial, lindelof, I don't see much difference there in terms of ability, yet one set is performing wonderfully and other woefully, I see only big difference there and that seems to be the managers.

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31 Dec 2017 14:59:42
Accidental send!

Our front four made poor final balls or the finishing was terrible. Lukaku, Jesse and Rashford all had simple headed chances but failed to even test the keeper. We had a few breaks with 2 on 1 or 3 on 2 and failed to execute to the final pass. Mike's lame cross was one of these, but Rashfords pass to him pushed him far too wide.

Miki was woefully bad. His confidence is in ruins, I don't know how he comes back from this.

Second half I don't know what happened, we started badly and I agree that the players appeared to down tools -maybe Jose gave them a few home truths, or maybe they couldn't understand how Miki stayed in the pitch.

Believable1 Unbelievable0

31 Dec 2017 15:31:33
I don’t think the point has been made but seeing Lukaku taken off with a head injury like that can have an effect on players. I recall the David Buust injury at OT and the players were subdued after it. Before the anti Jose police jump up and down there was more to yesterday than that but I have seen it where serious concerning injuries have a mental impact on those continuing a game.

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31 Dec 2017 16:28:50
4 games, 1 defeat, 3 draws, crap opposition. Lots of reasons but a very poor run right now.

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31 Dec 2017 19:18:34
Between 25 November 1989 and 21 March 1990, under SAF we played 17 league games, lost 9, drawn 6, winning only 2

That’s a very poor run

Happy New Year to everyone.

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31 Dec 2017 22:06:34
Back in 1872 we didn't even turn up to play Red Man, that was a very bad run! Football has moved on more in the past 30 years than the prior 130, so I don't get the relevance of the early SAF comparisons, especially those before the EPL and Utd had recovered to their rightful place.

A place the latest batch of managers are doing their utmost to destroy from the looks of things.

Happy New Year one and all, it's been another hard watch 2017, but hopefully the club will change things early 2018 and we can start enjoying our football like we should given our immense resources and stature in the game.

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01 Jan 2018 10:08:16
Blimey Red Man, I know you think the Glazers are to blame but can you not accept that Jose should be getting more out of the players we have? I don’t disagree with you about investment but Jose is not helping himself right now.

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01 Jan 2018 10:39:07
AJH

Firstly I was just pointing out that we have had worse runs.

The Glazers are a major underlying problem to our football club, appears some have forgotten amidst the football woes.

Is it Jose should be getting more out of the players? Or should the players who pull on that shirt be trying a lot harder? There is no excuse for them all not putting a proper shift in and I don’t think they are at the moment. I made this point recently but under SAF players knew they had to perform or be left out or sold, SAF wasn’t going anywhere. We have sacked two and Jose has critics so do the players feel under any pressure, it doesn’t look it. The club gave Moyes a 6 year deal to try and ward that off and it didn’t work. Some players seem to think they are above this hard work. Maybe some are not playing for Jose, but that is letting the shirt down, totally unacceptable.

I think Jose could and should show a more positive demeanour but the players should be motivated to play for the shirt, those that aren’t should get shipped out. If the club get rid of Jose the same problem will occur in 18 months when they don’t like what the next manager wants them to do. Remember most are not Jose bought players.

Tactically is definitely in Jose domain, that is where I think Jose hasn’t been as smart. A central three in midfield releases Pogba but has two issues, first who is the third central midfield player? Herrera seems half the player, not signed a new contract to my knowledge and may have his head elsewhere, so who does Jose use? Secondly that relies upon strong creative wide players depending on how we set defence up. We have Rashford and Martial who seem to be best down the left however are running up too many blind alleys, Mata on the right who lacks any strength or pace. Miki should have connected midfield with attack yet how can Jose be responsible for his appalling passing and shooting this season? The full backs, well we have relied upon Valencia who can’t cross, Young and now Shaw. Jose hasn’t hit on the right formation for the players we have, likely because they are a bit of a mishmash, bought by different managers for different purposes. So I think Jose needs to do better in controlling midfield and build from there. That is where he can get more from the players.

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{Ed025's Note - good post that red man..

31 Dec 2017 14:51:46
Reaction to the game yesterday are over the top.

Pogba had an excellent first half yesterday and bossed the midfield. He constantly linked the play across the pitch and from back to front. Mata, Lingard and Miki we fed in good positions and either made nothing of the opportunities (poor crossing/ final ball) or the.

Believable1 Unbelievable4

31 Dec 2017 14:45:42
Ashley young what an idiot another player out for couple of games now there's no need for stuff like that and how did he think he would get away with it stupid.

Believable2 Unbelievable0

31 Dec 2017 14:48:59
It seems that our player have lost the plot just like our manager.

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31 Dec 2017 15:24:28
Always got darmian haha.

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31 Dec 2017 14:12:37
TFM amazing performance, hope he comes back to the first team all guns blazing.

Believable5 Unbelievable0

31 Dec 2017 13:58:26
I have never rated woy Hodgson but he has palace up for it today. If only our boys had that level of desire. Loving the fact that Mensah is playing well.

Maybe recall the lad and give him some minutes in our first team.

Also looks like city have a few injuries. Don't wish injury's on anybody, but it might help the rest playing catch up.

God awful penalty.

Believable2 Unbelievable0

31 Dec 2017 14:51:02
If only we showed half of the desire Palace did. Also, palace crowd made 10 times more noise than we do at OT. Sad but true.

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31 Dec 2017 19:24:18
We should get hodgson in we will all get exactly the kind of football we want.

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31 Dec 2017 13:14:51
Hello guys. How many of you feel the need of a little proven goal scorer to ease pressure on Lukaku. I think selling Rooney and Not buying another Striker was not ok. Ibra was never going to come back till 2018.
I still say we need to add 1 Striker and 1 LB this window and then should add more in summer.

Believable2 Unbelievable1

31 Dec 2017 14:52:27
Vardy would have been nice. But I'm hoping and praying for Dybala.

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31 Dec 2017 15:27:03
Dybala is the dream but I would snap your hand off for Vardy. Not cup tied either.

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31 Dec 2017 17:33:30
I think vardy is more likely than Dybala that lad won’t join.

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31 Dec 2017 12:53:11
Fosu-Mensah is having a terrific game against City, Sane can't get a sniff. Sell Blind and Darmian, get Fosu and Pereira back from their loan spells and promote Tuanzebe, strengthening the team without spending and it makes sense.

Put Fosu-Mensah in a midfield 3 with Pogba and Matic; he's strong, fast, box-to-box, and it'll allow Pogba to roam free, which is what we need if want to get the top 4, which is not looking like a certainty right now. Oh, and Andreas Pereira has a brilliant dead ball delivery, which is something else our dire teams needs right now.

Believable7 Unbelievable1

31 Dec 2017 13:10:10
Couldn’t agree more Scholes.

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31 Dec 2017 13:38:53
Mensah should be played as RB, he is playing well there and its the position he has played at Utd and Palace. If he keeps improving would be long term replacement for Valencia.

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31 Dec 2017 13:49:43
You were right until you started putting square pegs in round holes again.
CM? not just yet.

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31 Dec 2017 14:12:10
Didnt Fosu-Mensah play in midfield for the youth team FZZ? he's better in midfield i think, excellent at running and carrying the ball forward, like a powerhouse. But i do get what you're saying about square pegs in round holes, has happened far too often in recent seasons.

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31 Dec 2017 14:17:09
Yeah Scholes he is a midfielder and defender, but at the moment he's playing very well as a RB, and i just said CM not just yet, maybe a season or so yet.

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31 Dec 2017 13:24:31
Would rather let TFM see the loan out he seems to be getting decent game time, coming back in jan for 2-3 games only to sit on the bench for rest of the season when valencia comes back will do him no good.

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31 Dec 2017 14:33:09
I agree csm. He has been injured and out of the palace team too just got his place back.
He is versatile but much more comfortable playing centrally either at cb or midfield.
I was hoping be would be an understudy for matic this season perhaps he will secure that role when he comes back in the summer. With carrick gone its a role that is up for grabs. He will learn a lot if he plays a lot of games at palace tbis season.

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31 Dec 2017 14:40:19
Well said CSM, but is rather see him get game time over Blind, Darmian, Rojo etc.

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31 Dec 2017 19:38:25
Scholes that issue would be sorted if we buy a lb in Jan. Young and Valencia cover rb and new lb and shaw cover lb, neither of blind or darmian play, frankly darmian should be sold in Jan and tfm stays where he is, he has played nearly all of their games against big teams and that is a great experience for him, something he won't get at utd right now.

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31 Dec 2017 12:49:32
I think some of the criticism of Martial, and Rashford in particular, is going a bit over the top. They're young lads. Inconsistency is part of growing up.

They're also playing as attacking wide men, and nine times out of ten, they'll not get past the defender, often to the fans' frustrations. But they only need to get past once. Giggsy didn't beat his man every time, and he was one of the best.

Better decision-making will come with time and experience, and in the meantime, if we truly believe in giving our young players a chance, we just have to accept that they're going to have good days and bad days, as they continue to learn their trade.

Believable4 Unbelievable0

31 Dec 2017 12:56:48
On the whole i agree with you, i am more than happy to be frustrated in the short term in the expectation they realise their potential in the long term.

But that leicester game bordered on the farcical to be honest. The amount of times we had 3 on 1s or 3 on 2s and rashford and martial couldn't execute properly was worrying.

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31 Dec 2017 13:20:28
The worrying thing about rashford is that he doesn't seem to be learning from his mistakes he consistently makes the wrong choices.

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31 Dec 2017 15:25:59
I agree about Rashford but! artial ha been patchy for well over a season. i'm not sure rotating them helps their confidence or gets them settled into a run. Rashford was hot earlier but has really dropped off, Martial has shown the odd flash but has not been great all year.

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31 Dec 2017 17:20:23
I disagree Tony I don’t get why martial gets a tougher ride than rashford. Rashford has been terrible this year and has lacked consistency. I agree martial can be inconsistent but he has contributed much more and has been on of our better attacking threats. Rashford seems to get off easier because he’s an English talent but he is the one for me that needs to get his head down and start working harder. Maybe martial gets more criticism because of his price tag and because he has more talent. I don’t think rashford has the talent to be a top top player.

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31 Dec 2017 17:35:01
I agree completely! Rashford especially, he’s your best player after De Gea and he’s not even 20 yet! Maybe look more at your Pogba/ Matic/ who seem to get an easier time.

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31 Dec 2017 17:47:20
I don’t understand why people rate rashford so highly especially you John. Maybe I see it differently but for me he relies so heavily on his pace to get past players and lacks the natural skill and ability to get past a player. Martial has this in abundance but he just fails to show it on a consistent enough basis. Again I find rashford’s decision making and finishing as wasteful and not good enough. Martial is a better finisher and a more natural one. One thing rashford does display is fantastic work rate and I commend him for that. Shearer said an Interesting thing yesterday that rashford needs to gamble and be alert that split second quicker than the opposition defence to get into the box onto the end of crosses. He does not do that. In fairness to him he hasn’t played a lot centrally so that is something that can be developed. So in a nut shell I think he will become a very good player for us but I do not think he will reach the heights of say an Mbappe, Asensio or perhaps sane/ Dembele. Whereas I think martial has the ability to do that. I think we hype players up too much in the British media and rashford is just another one like Ross Barkley or Jack Wilshere.

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31 Dec 2017 12:47:42
Watching the City game and TFM is looking quite the player at right back. I think most see him as a centre back in the future but could he be the replacement for Valencia next season or is Jose likely to keep faith with him?

Believable0 Unbelievable0

31 Dec 2017 12:58:00
Having a good game.

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31 Dec 2017 13:03:21
We can say by summer we will see new full backs. either now or summer. TMF will be used as squad rotation player at max.

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31 Dec 2017 12:38:41
Hi guys just wanted to add my thoughts on our midfield issues.

It’s basic school boy stuff that you learn to win your key battles against your opposition man all over the park as a bare minimum. When was the last time we out fought, out ran and showed more passion than the opposition? It is embarrassing the way our players jog around the pitch not busting a gut to run that extra yard. City are a team full of ‘top’ players and the way the work together as a unit in attack and defence is outstanding. i'm sure if you see their running stats it will be up there with the hardest working teams.

If we can’t even dominate the midfield battles then how are we expected to control and win games? People blame pogba for vacating the midfield and I agree with that but isn’t it the manager’s job to spot this and do something about it? Ken is right pogba had two incredible midfielders next to him in Vidal and pirlo with him who acted like the perfect foil for pogba to showcase his real talents which we have played 90m for. When was the last time he scored a long range 25 yard goal for us? Coutinho is banging them in and I’ve seen pogba do similar at Juve so we know he can do it? We are not using the talent we have in the squad effectively and that is down to the manager.

Too many times this season the midfield has been non existent. In the city game De Bruyne was able to pick up the ball from just inside our own half and was able to charge towards the heart of our defence on our 18 yard line. These are basic things that have not been fixed. If Jose isn’t fixing these things now then what chance is it he is able to get us back to the top? The team seemed to have stopped working for him and it’s very worrying. I have said many times I’m a massive Jose fan but this isn’t the Jose Mourinho of old. He is a shadow of himself and the appointment was not a good fit. Right man wrong time as he should have come in after Fergie. I think for both parties it would be best to part ways at the end of the season and bring someone in who is young, passionate and hungry. Someone who encourages attacking flair football with energy and enthusiasm. That’s all us fans ask for.

Believable3 Unbelievable1

31 Dec 2017 13:07:03
I would try a 4-3-3 with blind at holding. which was his initial position. Although he is slow he is smart and tidy on the ball.
I have seen lot of players are victim of versatility like Nani, Rooney, blind, to name a few.

With Pogba and Herrera with licence to dectate free. I ll even try Martial in the center than Rashford who is better at finishing and beating his man.

But. we can just say. manager is manager.

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31 Dec 2017 12:27:36
Just been down the local park. Two teams with "managers" whose only credentials were having the enthusiasm to found and hold together a team. Works with them on fitness, picks the team based on fitness, form and availability (more to do with work commitments than injury) .
No real tactics that I could work out. Just 22 blokes determined to win. I enjoyed it and it lifted my spirits immensely after yesterday's dross. >and it didn't cost a bean. I am seriously considering this as a better relaxing weekend than watching, hoping against hope, spending heaps and being disappointed. No, not disappointed - yesterday was what I have come to expect.
I am going to invest in a lightweight folding chair (I am in my 70's) a decent flask and an insulated box for a homemade pasty or pie. That should cost much less than one ticket for Old (cost a packet) Trafford. Been robbed for too long and no end in sight.

Final post. I wish you all well. Banter on.

Believable7 Unbelievable1

31 Dec 2017 11:59:19
Ed002 or Ed001, just wanted to ask a question as I enjoy reading your opinions. Who do you think is best suited in your opinion at the moment to be the next United Manager the fans crave?
For me it’s Conte, I understand the hype with Poch but I wonder do we have the type of players he likes? His teams work so hard etc yet all our players look lazy. I think Conte would be a great choice if something was to happen at Chelsea.

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{Ed002's Note - Manchester United has a manager Mac, when they don't would be the best time to discuss the replacement.}

31 Dec 2017 11:54:32
This is a question open to discussion and honest to god not a dig at the manager .
I wanted Jose at the club, think he is a top manager, any of the regulars will know that .
But looking at some stats before the game got me asking myself this question .

Going in to the game United had scored more goals at this stage of the season than any of Jose Chelsea teams .

Only 2 of Jose chelsea teams had conceded less.

In 2005 Jose won the title with Chelsea with a record 65 points a record that still stands . they where 6 points better of than United going into the game last night .

The last time Jose won the league with Chelsea they had 3 more points than us at the same point of the season .
So the question is, is this season about par for Jose at the moment and has football maybe moved on .
Jose won 6 league titles and 2 CL in 8 years at the start of his career .
He has won 2 league titles in the next 7 .

Dies his style still suit the modern game?

Believable2 Unbelievable0

31 Dec 2017 12:03:58
*record 95 *.

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31 Dec 2017 12:07:10
Interesting stats jred. I too wanted him but I honestly thought we're going to get a fired up mourinho with players dying to play. Instead, we've got the mourinho who got sacked by Chelsea and who is already picking fights with the fans, the players, the press and the management. His methods are outdated. He's a goner I'm afraid.

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31 Dec 2017 12:28:55
The question is, is there a better manager then Mourinho available and who will do a better job? .

I think we will be stuck again in the same situation if we changed managers.

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{Ed002's Note - Perhaps get rid of the toxic fans who did all of the damage ruining the club's plans would be a start?}

31 Dec 2017 12:29:04
Interesting read jred. I think football has moved past him. I too am a massive fan of his and have always wanted him but as AAA just said, I think we have not got the Charismatic inspiring Jose of old but the grumpy miserable one that got sacked from Chelsea. I think we have to appreciate the premier league has got much stronger and there are now 6 big teams vying for 4 European spots. It is much more competitive than back in his first spell when there was only really us and arsenal to compete. City’s project has blown even Chelsea out of the water with more funds, ambition and even vision from a club that we have ever seen. I think the writing is on the wall for Jose and he will be off to PSG in the not to distant future.

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31 Dec 2017 09:32:22
Does the lowering of US corporate taxation make it likelier that the owners will sell Man Utd and if so so do you have anybinsight as to r.

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{Ed002's Note - No, if anything it would make it beneficial to keep the club. In reality it will make no differece.}

31 Dec 2017 12:08:57
We're clutching at straws here. It also depends on how the Glazers have structured their business assets.
I'm afraid they won't be selling this cash cow anytime soon.

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31 Dec 2017 10:12:42
Gotta love the constant media coverage suggesting this or that top player is going to be sold by clubs in January, many of them on the brink of huge European fixtures. Seriously, Dybala? Rose? Coutinho? Sells papers I guess.

Believable1 Unbelievable0

31 Dec 2017 09:35:04
I’d love to see the player stats for yesterday; we were very static particularly compared to Southampton who were passing and running. I saw the debate on Pogba and whilst he hit the odd flashy pass I think Matic touched the ball twice as much as Pogba in the second half which is ridiculous. These are the kind of games Pogba needs to grab by the scruff of the neck but for me he went missing again.

I love Rashford but he was poor yesterday, the crowd cheered Martial’s arrival but he added very little, and Miki looked low on confidence.

I’m not sure what is wrong but our recent form is worrying. Chelsea passed us yesterday, Liverpool are breathing down our necks, we need to turn this round quickly but right now I’m not sure how we do it.

I still don’t understand retaining Ibra and remain unconvinced by Lukaku. As has been pointed out spending is one thing, spending wisely is another. It seems there will be a Mourinho / Woodward bust up shortly, whilst the Glazers are in charge I cannot see excessive investment so things could get uglier and I really don’t see Mourinho being around next year.

Believable4 Unbelievable0

31 Dec 2017 10:15:43
Hi AJH,
Good post, here are my thoughts.
1) Lukaku - he looks over weight to me, even for a big guy. The best ‘version’ of Lukaku I remember was one that ran at defences, held the ball up well, laid the ball off and then ran into space or in behind to receive the ball. He is too static now and that may be José’s influence but I’m more inclined at this stage to suggest he lays off the weights and gets the cardio up.
2) Ibra - for me this situation isn’t unsurprising but I did think keeping him on was the right decision because of his off the pitch influence in terms of confidence. However, I suggested he was kept on along similar lines to Owen was, a kind of pay as you play contract. I still think he will prove useful but not as a first 11 player. He will probably leave at the end of the season.
3) Rashford - I got slated at the beginning of the season for suggesting Rashford went out on loan this year. My suggestion was fuelled by my prediction that his game time would be limited this year under José and although he has featured in games he is rarely getting a full 90 mins. He just needs game time IMO and he looked enthusiastic yesterday. He is our hottest prospect and I’m worried he is not continuing to make a decent rate of progress this year.
4) Pogba - he looks worried to me. Worried about a another injury perhaps but he isn’t anywhere near 100%. Yesterday Mata was dropping off to receive the ball more than he was and that isn’t the Pogba we know. He tried to look frustrated but deliberately IMO, he just didn’t want the ball yesterday.
5) JM - having his worst spell as a manager and has been for several years now. The game has changed again, big question over his head now is can he move the game on again and start dictating the way championships and competitions are won. He looks frustrated to me and potentially running out of ideas. However, we shouldn’t write him off just yet, after all, like a great man once said “Form is temp, class is permanent”, and even h Pugh I don’t like the guy his record speaks for itself.
Happy New Year to everyone.

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31 Dec 2017 10:20:39
Miki has been poor for most of his time here he constantly gives the ball away also I am beginning to think that perhaps we all got carried away with rashford he constantly makes the wrong choice and doesn't seem to learn by his mistakes.

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{Ed025's Note - hes only a kid yet 79..

31 Dec 2017 12:19:54
Guys. Zlatan was a disaster. We should never have re-signed him.
Agree on Mourinho, he looks devoid of ideas and frankly, I can't stand looking at him or hearing him moan. It's getting me down, so God help the players.
I disagree on Rashford. He is a young kid. We can't be making hasty decisions because he's not tearing defences apart. If Rashford was under Pep, he would be in double figures.
We need a change of direction which unfortunately requires a change of management and ownership. If I was in charge, I will be scouting Barcelona for their coaches and bringing them to the club to change our brand of football. I think giggs and scholes will make a good managerial team and are more akin to the ways of our club.
As a lot of the posters keep saying, the current mourinho and United are not a good fit.

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31 Dec 2017 07:39:49
Can I recommend reading an article by Oliver Holt this morning.

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31 Dec 2017 08:30:32
There was one by Andy mitten before the last match that is really worth a read too red.

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31 Dec 2017 08:35:41
Great article red man. He is not too far off with that. Shame he writes for the scum that is daily fail.

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31 Dec 2017 09:11:30
Read it too, Woodward should stay on the commercial side for sure, but JM will always seek out conflict its what he does.

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{Ed025's Note - and its become boring all this "poor me" attitude he has BFB, he needs to grow a set and stop blaming everyone else mate..

31 Dec 2017 09:29:07
Getting beat of Chelsea or man city is one thing but to be struggling against Southampton Bristol etc is another .
Southampton had there main striker out and there best 2 defenders, pogba cost the same as half there team and monthly wage bill would buy Bristol.

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31 Dec 2017 09:43:58
Forget competing with Chelsea city Barcelona Munich for a minute, we are struggling against Leicester Burnley Southampton Bristol .

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31 Dec 2017 09:47:06
I agree jerd. But crap happens in football, not the first time a lower league team has beaten us and won't be the last. Happens all the time in football regardless of who or what a team is worth in wage or transfers. On any given day anything can happen. I've seen a lot of this about bristol and I think it's massively disrespectful to a team that is playing well, doing it's utmost and had a fantastic day against one of the biggest teams in the world. History tells us results like that happen all the time.

But all in all, I'm not happy with this slump, for me it has to turn around or lots of heads will roll from top to bottom.

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31 Dec 2017 10:00:11
Angle
It does happen and all teams go through a slump, they normally don't blame the board, quality of there squad etc etc when they are struggling against so called lesser teams operating on a fraction of there budget .

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31 Dec 2017 10:13:01
Jred

The board and investment is a long term underlying problem that affects the future of the club and you seem to struggle to grasp it. Your point is at a lower level and keeping it simple. However, the powerhouses of European football make sure they have the best players available and buy in a position of strength. We let our position of strength wane because of years of underinvestment leading to us having a sub standard team for a European giant, or supposedly a giant.

These giants all have poor runs but underlying it is a plan, a structure that ensures it won’t be for long. That is what we have lacked and the board have that accountability.

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31 Dec 2017 10:23:59
I agree that we haven't played well recently but why do teams seem to also try harder and play better against us if Southampton played like that every game they would be nowhere near the relegation zone.

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{Ed025's Note - united made them look good 79, they are not a good side but put them up against an uninspired team who is littered with players who think the world owes them a living and any team will look good, it was more a case of united being poor than them looking good mate..

31 Dec 2017 10:28:20
Angel

Thanks I also read the Andy Mitten piece I think yesterday. There is a bigger picture that is starting to be seen and I for one am glad.

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31 Dec 2017 11:12:36
Redman
It's smoke and mirrors pal that has been rolled out the moment the manager has hit a ruff patch .

Let's get everyone to look at what's happening off the pitch, so they don't talk about what happening on the pitch

You keep going on about underinvestment that was 5 6 years ago .
We have spent over 600 mil in the last 4 transfer windows. And you go on about " years of underinvestment "

Football is simple really.
The manager and players should be concerned with the now and why this very expensive very well paid group of players are or on this current run Man United v Bournemouth. 1.0 
West Brom v man United. 1.2 
Bristol city v man United. 2.1 
Leicester v man United . 2.2
Man United v Burnley. 2.2 
Southampton v United. 0.0


Never mind city barce or co we have spent enough to have squad to be better than our current form .
What the club needs to do to be the best in Europe or best in the EPL is one thing .

What the manager could do to get the best out of this squad is another

In fact forget money, and the bigger issues (because that's a different discussion) and ask some very basic questions.
Is this team playing well? No
Are most of our players playing well? No
Is our style of play attractive to watch? No
Are we winning games? No
Are we a better team now than at the start of the season? No
Are our players improving during the season? On the most part no
Do we look to be going forward or backwards over the course of the season?

Has the manager currently got his team motivated, and playing well to the best of its ability? No
His players playing to there potential? No . Not just the so called lesser players but the big name big investment players like pogba and lukaku? Nope.

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{Ed025's Note - i cant argue with that jred..

31 Dec 2017 11:49:51
Red Man - I asked the same question the other day and wasn't surprised not to see many replies. How much do you think we should let José spend, £300m, not enough? £600m and if he wants more do we spend £1bn. At what point do we judge the manager and stop blaming lack of investment.
Yes we have underspent but let's look at Jose's signings:
Bailley - he has missed nigh on 50% of games this season, is he or when does he become injury prone. Doesn't matter how good he is if he doesn't play then he is no good to us. When fit he looks a quality player.
Lindelof - too early to judge
Pogba - for my liking he doesn't influence the game enough, especially the big games. Is he being played out of position?
Miki - least said the better, it hasn't worked out for him or us, so wish him well and move him on.
Ibra - not sure why we signed him this season expensive wages and a squad place taken up.
Lukaku - seems to be living up to his flat track bully reputation, not seen in the big games, personally I think the tactics have influenced these performances.
Magic - looked a great signing in the first few games but as the season has gone on his influence deteriorates almost weekly. Again I think tactics are a major factor with how he performs.
So all in all for me even spending £300m José isn't getting the best out of his signings so how much do you want us to give him to spend before we judge his management.

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31 Dec 2017 12:02:45
Jred

I have been pointing the higher level issues out for a long time on here so it isn’t just because we are having a poor patch. It is very relevant because our manager was very very clear at the start of the season that he was looking for another wide attacking player and the board did not deliver it. As we approach another window the manager, the very experienced manager, has flagged about our need to spend. Spending has been limited under the Glazers, you say it was 5-6 years ago, which flags a lack of understanding. It goes back to when the owners bought us and had to rely on borrowing to finance it, then put the debt on the club, we have not been strong in the market all through their time. Feels like I have to repeat myself, but Ronaldo was replaced, how? He had just won the Ballon Dor and won four more whilst his replacement now plays right back and can’t cross a ball. The owners failed us for years and relied of SAF

The board lacked a plan, so appointed two wrong managers, lacked a direction in how they wanted football played so wasted money on transfers of players who don’t fit. It is all relevant but you say football is simple, simple on the pitch perhaps but it seems the bigger issues escape you. Football is corporate now, but planning is vital even in small business, yet you dismiss it, want to keep it to the simplest level. That is fine but fans ignoring or perhaps not understanding the bigger picture is part of the reason we have the situation we have, both on and off the pitch. If you can’t see it then perhaps replying is a waste of time.

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31 Dec 2017 12:25:34
Can't argue with that Keanoh. I must have been the only person who didn't want Matic. He always looks slow and cumbersome. And now we have pogba who is just strolling around.
This team needs a big kick up the Arse. And I'm not sure mourinho is the person to do it.

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31 Dec 2017 12:34:22
Keanooh

The answer to your question could be long but given my wife is waiting for me to take her out, I will try to be brief.

I would hope and expect Jose has provided his thoughts to the board, a SWOT type analysis around the team, identifying what he needs and why. He clearly identified a wide attacker in summer and the board failed him. Most of us have identified a general lack of true world class talent, so that player would likely need to be top end. Depending what he identified, but I would suggest it needs to not be squad fillers. The board need to look at what he recommends and decide whether they agree, if they do and trust him (after all that’s why they appointed him), pay the money. If they don’t he will likely go, either forced or walk. If he gets the players as he identified then he needs time to bed them in, if then it isn’t working his time would be up. That is when we judge him for me. I have provided such things to boards in my roles, you hope they support you especially if it is put together thoroughly, but a board would also know that if they don’t follow the recommendations and it is that lacking piece is the item that fails a process or makes the team less effective then they have partial accountability for the failure.

As to his signings, Pogba is better in a central 3 in midfield enabling him to get forward and create, maybe that is why we have been linked with that Serbian midfield player, again depends what Jose has identified. Miki is the main disappointment for me.

In summary the board need to decide is Jose right in his assessment, if he is, provide the players, then judge him.

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31 Dec 2017 01:56:34
Well. As if spending Xmas with the in-laws, in deepest, darkest Scottish Borders wasn't bad enough. What a load of aul keek.

How many saves did the away keeper make again?

Utter pish.

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31 Dec 2017 00:37:21
Hey ed2, would like your opinion on Jose at united.

What do you think of how he's setting up the team ect, are united fans wrong to think they'd be better suited with a different manager.

Also seems like you got it bang on regarding Ibrahimovic, I thought you were crazy when you said they shouldn't have took him on and his performances for the wage he's on is showing that. Cheers.

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{Ed002's Note - So nothing will have changed much. He knows there are still a couple of people at the club who are not 10% convinced by him. is opinion of living in Manchester will be unchanged. Ibrahimovic has turned out to be worse than expected - a retainer plus an outrageous match fee pl taking up a place in the squad has choked any chance 0f a winning season out of the clu. He needs to change a number of players and he knows it. If the club were to offer him a package to move on he would I am sure be open to it kning there are several high profile vacancies coming up.}

31 Dec 2017 05:58:21
cheers ed, I don't see him going to PSG, they do not seem to mesh at all so could you shed a light as to which job openings there would be?

Cheers.

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{Ed002's Note - It is not relevant at this time Standard.}

31 Dec 2017 09:45:30
Ed
Any idea what the thinking was in given ibra a contract at his age with that injury?

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{Ed002's Note - No.}

31 Dec 2017 11:22:51
The odds of psg are coming down, a few bloggers in europe are saying its a case of when not if, i think he should stay and honour his contract, but if the vibe from the boardroom is out of tune, jose isn't stupid, and the whole guardiola thing doesn't help matters., i think you got to back him to the hilt, maybe an amazing transfer or 2 in january, the divies over the road should hit a sticky patch, and just crack on, my only question wpuld be, should pogba be captain?

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31 Dec 2017 00:24:19
Where's the Paul Pogba we saw at Juventus? "
"He was all over the pitch, he was tackling, he was fighting, he was sprinting to people, he was scoring goals from 25 yards out. (Now)  He's just strolling through the game. "
Scholes

Pogba said he wanted to be the best in the world when we bought him .
Like many of our players not playing to his potential. Good on the ball but not interested when he hasn't got it .

Matic is meant to be a defensive cm but he is playing the opposite, looks great on the ball, starts the moves from the back great, looks yards of the pace with out the ball.
Teams are running rings around them.

The opposition get at our back 4, 9 times out of 10 . Our cm with supposedly 2 of our star players can't defend or control the game or possession.
It's a major issue for us .

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31 Dec 2017 01:00:03
Agree with all that jred. Every game we are dominated in the middle and we will never win anything if we can’t control the middle of the park. I am bewildered why Jose does not stick another man such as Herrera in there just to shore up the team and protect the defence who are getting put under so much pressure. Something really is not right and it’s affecting us hugely. We need to snap out of this fast otherwise it will be a very miserable season.

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31 Dec 2017 01:44:08
Park i'm amazed as well cause pogba can't play a 2 man midfield, So do we blame pogba or the manager there.
When we conceded a last minute goal last week cause the defence couldn't organize it, was it the players fault or the manager, basic stuff really and their supposed to be the professional.

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31 Dec 2017 01:44:08
Park i'm amazed as well cause pogba can't play a 2 man midfield, So do we blame pogba or the manager there.
When we conceded a last minute goal last week cause the defence couldn't organize it, was it the players fault or the manager, basic stuff really and their supposed to be the professional.

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31 Dec 2017 01:49:32
I agree with all of that also.
The pogba at juve was the child prodigy turning into a man. He was also flanked and protected by 2 hugely talented and experienced midfielders 1 of whom imo is in the top echelon of his entire generation in pirlo. He maybe and partly due to his price tag was expected to take a leadership role but has not yet grown entirely into that role. Plus the team shape is different so he does not have the same freedom.
He vacates the midfield and matic is caught out of position trying to cover too large an area.
To me it's obvious that to get the best out of oogba is when there is another midfielder alongside him and matic sitting behind them.
Fellaini did ok and the team looked better with that extra midfielder in there. I thought it would suit herrera too. That shape leaves the option of playing a 10 and 2 up grind or 3 across the front line. A midfield 3 like that also suits a back 3 .

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31 Dec 2017 10:47:41
Agree ken and Leahy. It’s basic school boy stuff that you learn to win your key battles against your opposition man all over the park as a bare minimum. When was the last time we out fought, out ran and showed more passion than the opposition? It is embarrassing the way our players jog around the pitch not busting a gut to run that extra yard. City are a team full of ‘top’ players and the way the work together as a unit in attack and defence is outstanding. i'm sure if you see their running stats it will be up there with the hardest working teams.

If we can’t even dominate the midfield battles then how are we expected to control and win games? People blame pogba for vacating the midfield and I agree with that but isn’t it the manager’s job to spot this and do something about it? Ken is right pogba had two incredible midfielders next to him in Vidal and pirlo with him who acted like the perfect foil for pogba to showcase his real talents which we have played 90m for. When was the last time he scored a long range 25 yard goal for us? Coutinho is hanging them in and I’ve seen pogba do similar at Juve so we know he can do it? We are not using the talent we have in the squad effectively and that is down to the manager.

Too many times this season the midfield has been non existent. In the city game De Bruyne was able to pick up the ball from just inside our own half and was able to charge towards the heart of our defence on our 18 yard line. These are basic things that have not been fixed. If Jose isn’t fixing these things now then what chance is it he is able to get us back to the top? The team seemed to have stopped working for him and it’s very worrying. I have said many times I’m a massive Jose fan but this isn’t the Jose Mourinho of old. He is a shadow of himself and the appointment was not a good fit. Right man wrong time as he should have come in after Fergie. I think for both parties it would be best to part ways at the end of the season and bring someone in who is young, passionate and hungry. Someone who encourages attacking flair football with energy and enthusiasm. That’s all us fans ask for.

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