Manchester United Banter Archive June 03 2013

 

Use our rumours form to send us manchester united transfer rumours.


03 Jun 2013 23:24:53
http://www.eplindex.com/28430/scouting-report-everton-stats-indepth-tactical-analysis.html

Sorry if you've seen this before but it's a link to a short report into how Moyes had Everton set up tactically, it's an interesting read for anyone who's interested.

Believable0 Unbelievable0

03 Jun 2013 23:25:21
Hi eds, I know you're busy with silly season about to start, but I'm getting really giddy about strootman he's a perfect fit for us and would sort out midfield out, in your opinion, not bothered about figures or anything, what are the chances we will sign him? 1% being impossible 50% being maybe and 95-100% being very likely/definite, thanks. {Ed004's Note - 90% imo}

Believable0 Unbelievable0

Thanks ed.

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 22:13:26
Hey guys/eds, just wondering. If ed002 is about, what's happening with the thiago situation?have we any chance at all of signing him?looks like garay and strootman will be coming in. 2 very good players. apologies ed002 if the thiago question had been asked already I just couldn't find the answer thanks. with strootman+garay arriving do you see united buying a winger?thanks {Ed002's Note - I don't know of anything new man.}

Believable0 Unbelievable0

03 Jun 2013 18:38:50
Ed do you think we could get ganolons I think that he is better than wanyama. what about you guys? {Ed002's Note - Not without interest.}

Believable0 Unbelievable0

04 Jun 2013 03:31:26
I ve watched a lot of Gonalons in the previous couple of seasons. Great player, no doubt about that. But for some reason I just don't see him moving to us. The likes of Arsenal and Spurs would be better for him, and apparently ( Ed002 can confirm ) he would only move to Napoli or Barcelona. He's definetly not good enough for Barcelona and Napoli have not shown any official interest. Arsenal are the most interested party according to reports in France.

Mick

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 22:18:46
Hi guys

Not a regular poster here but I always read the site.
Anyways since the transfer window is gettng closer and all the rumours are hotting up I'm sure everyone is as frustrated and curious as I am with regards to Uniteds transfers, so I thought I'd post something a little bit different.

With the supposed deal to renew Nike's contract with United to be taking place soon, I was wondering what's everyones thoughts on the kits we've had for the last few seasons. I'm a huge fan of Nike ahead of other sporting brands like Adidas and Puma.

No matter how they look I'll still try my best to buy 1 each year but the kit designs over the last few seasons have been poor. In the last few years the 2007-2008 home kit and last seasons away kit are the only ones that I think look really good.

We are going to launch our new home kit this Thursday and I hope its better than the 1 circulating the internet ATM.

Shot Stopper

Believable0 Unbelievable0

03 Jun 2013 22:54:45
I think the nike kits are ugly. Not just the United ones but most of their kits.

Agree0 Disagree0

Don't let KLOOT see this post or the world will surely end.

Agree0 Disagree0

Agree with noname - never saw a Nike kit I liked.

Adidas or Umbro - classic strips.

Bring on the wrath of KLOOT upon my head!

Agree0 Disagree0

I liked our blue and black away kit (2011-12) - but other than that have not been a fan of the Nike kits. The last home kit looked like a table cloth for god's sake!

IMO the best United kits in contemporary times have been the Umbro kits from the late 90's and early 2000's. Nike are probably the best manufacturer of sporting goods/apparel in general - but they have not done a good job with out kit.

That said I will buy the shirt no matter who manufactures it - so if you're asking who would we rather produce our kit - my answer is whoever pays us the most for the privilege! I'd like us to have nice kits but ultimately would rather the club generates the largest amount possible.

redseven

Agree0 Disagree0

In my view Nike have fallen behind the other kit manufacturers

Agree0 Disagree0

My fave kit were the 85 season, all the umbro kits from 92 - 99 and the 07-09 season.
Mancunian dream

Agree0 Disagree0

I think since Nike brought out Umbro Umbro don't make kits anymore?

Adidas seem to recycle kits between too many teams and are not unique enough (exception of marseille who always have 'cosmopolitan' kits shall we say!)

same as puma, when you watch the AFCON every team has same shirt in a difft colour

ms85

Agree0 Disagree0

Ms85 - I was talking about the old adidas and umbro kits, although the three stripes still does it for me.

Forgot a mention for Admiral - some of my favourites over the years.

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 21:56:16
Great to see the unreal posts on here that we get every year in the summer, does make me laugh.
I think Wayne will stay and we will buy 2 players a CM and a wide player. Not saying it's what i'd do but what I think will happen.
I did hear that Sneijder has been seen at Carrington though

Red Daz

Believable0 Unbelievable0

Don't even start.

Andrew b

Agree0 Disagree0

Apparently Jose wants Sneijder at Chelsea, if the papers are to be believed.

Agree0 Disagree0

No but sneydger giving to Chelsea
Nomidfield

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 21:49:40
How would people feel if Rooney went to arsenal? I for one would welcome it. I don't see them as a major threat to us anyway not even with the current Rooney, plus with we get expected to heavily invest we could rinse them for more than he's worth or try raid some of there better players e.g wilshere and the ox

19JackC94

Believable0 Unbelievable0

I don't see why Wayne would see that as a move forward. The is zero chance of that happening.

Ste.

Agree0 Disagree0

They can give us Wiltshire in return? Zero chance.
Nomidfield

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 21:46:43
Ed what are the chances of Ganolons joining {Ed004's Note - Very very unlikely}

Believable0 Unbelievable0

03 Jun 2013 21:13:17
New kit revealed on June 6th. Don't forget even though it's been leaked.

Believable0 Unbelievable0

03 Jun 2013 20:27:06
I think Garray if signed will be rios long term replacement and jones will be a rightback or center mid.

Believable0 Unbelievable0

03 Jun 2013 20:01:17
Its Talk rubbish I know but this made me chuckle

Liverpool fan on a web site: "Why aren't Chelsea fans down at the ground celebrating the news?" DJ: Maybe because they have jobs?

Believable0 Unbelievable0

I never posted that!

Marky Mark

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 19:44:58
This was posted on the dodgy rumurs page ed?


03 Apr 2013 19:31:57
I have heard from a friend who works at cartington that Fergie has decided to retire at end of season and that the search for the new manager is under way! Can't believe this!

It is said Guardiola was really wanted however since his confirmation to Bayern, the candidates are Mourinho, Moyes and Blanc! Talks are going on with mendes who is Mourinhos agent about his availablilty!

I'm so shocked at this news not with the candidates but with Fergie retiring!


Marky Mark


Surly should be moved {Ed004's Note - Why?}

Believable0 Unbelievable0

Cause he was roght

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 19:31:19
Eds, quote from Rene Meulensteen from Dutch football magazine ELF Voetbal: "So far I will report on July 1. I am still under contract at the club.

"I didn't step down, and also I was not sacked by Manchester United. I am still employed. "

Do you know what the situation is?

Doc SK {Ed004's Note - Yes apparently he wasn't sacked by United and he hasn't decided to leave the club...You heard it here first ;)}

Believable0 Unbelievable0

Ha cheers Ed004, now get back to studying Syd! ;)

Doc SK

Agree0 Disagree0

Has he not been offered the youth team job
Jred

Agree0 Disagree0

Hopefully if he doesn't get an open manager's position he stays with the club. It's our only hope for any level of continuity with the staff. We're even losing our beloved kit man. Rene staying would be fantastic news.

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 19:22:54
Edds. Do we really need to waste money on a new center back ie Ezequiel Garay? I hope this don't hinder the progress of Smalling and Jones {Ed004's Note - I do not think we need another centre back but obviously someone in the club does!}

Believable0 Unbelievable0

Ed004. Sorry to drive you mad as you said you have been studing all day :) Apart from Strootman what other Midfielders do you think we could be getting in? Also what are you studing? Thanks {Ed004's Note - That's no worries am hoping for Fabregas/Gundogan/Modric but I reckon we will move for Alcantara and hoping by signing Strootman we won't get Fellaini!}

Agree0 Disagree0

Sounds good I want Thiago more than the rest I think he and Kagawa would be a match made in heaven. Ed004 keep up the good work :)

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 19:22:24
Good news renes still at the club

Red dev

Believable0 Unbelievable0

03 Jun 2013 19:20:00
Plot twist maybe? Apparently Rene has said he hasn't left or been sacked. He said he will report to the club on the 1st of July. Interesting. {Ed004's Note - Brilliant news!!! Is it sad that, that has made by day? :( and yes it has been a long day studying and listening to Syd! ;)}

Believable0 Unbelievable0

03 Jun 2013 19:30:46
It may well still happen, but as yet he is still a club employee. let's hope Moyes values him and keeps him at the club.

Agree0 Disagree0

I think we do need to keep him, when a player like RvP says he's the best coach he's ever worked with is some compliment.

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 19:02:54
Any chance of us signing Hachim Mastour? Without question will take his place amongst the all time greats

Believable0 Unbelievable0

03 Jun 2013 19:21:43
Thats a hell of an expectation to put on a lad who hasn't played first team football. Things change quickley in football. let's just let him progress.

Agree0 Disagree0

Anyone remember Freddy Adu.

That's what pressure does.

Lulinha, Kerlon, Saviola, god I could go all night.

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 19:02:54
Any chance of us signing Freddy Adu? Without question will take his place amongst the all time greats

Jaxer

Agree0 Disagree0

Impressive on youtube. But its a huge leap from dominating 15 year olds to performing against grown men.

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 18:45:48
Just seen a lot of posts from Simmo saying why are we signing a CB it's bo***cks and that we should be singing a CM. I think you will find that we are signing a CM, maybe even two so I don't know what your complaining about yes we have other CB but are they ready for the CL yet? I don't think so and Smalling and Jones spent a lot of time out last season with injuries, maybe getting in another in Garay won't do any harm if we buy our other main targets first. Just my opinion.

Believable0 Unbelievable0

03 Jun 2013 19:26:11
I still don't see why we need six centre backs next season unless we are moving to playing a back three? So for me if Garay does sign then we are probably going to see Vidic leave.

Has he fully recovered from his injury? Maybe he won't ever return to full fitness.

Agree0 Disagree0

Clueless! Maybe more appropriate than astounding

N. I. Devil

Agree0 Disagree0

Sorry mr no name so where is the proof that we are signing two central midfielders, please send me the link and I will stop complaining.
You must know something we don't, are you a personal friend of David Moyes? Please tell!
NI Devil. Cluless. believe me I know more about football than you ever will. Don't just post a silly little message like that, back your argument up or can't you do that?

Simmo

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 18:25:34
And the prize for the most astounding comment of the week goes to Paso with the immortal 'Best is nowhere near the level of Ronaldo'.

Believable0 Unbelievable0

Best was different class, one of the best I've seen, and I'm old enough too have seen most of them.
We've got to remember that the pitches he was playing on were nowhere near the standard they are these days. The man was a magician.
Nomidfield

Agree0 Disagree0

George Best in this day and age with the training, technology, pitches etc would have been hailed as the king of football he was that good. Put Messi or Ronaldo in that era they would be embarrassed by him.

Agree0 Disagree0

I stand by what I said - Best is nowhere near the level of Ronaldo. Just like he is nowhere near the level of Giggs or wee Jinky.

In the offensive third Best was on par with almost anyone who has ever played the game but outside the final third he was mediocre to good at best. A large number of fans are blindsided by the fact that he was a United player but I can name a number of players who were better than him as footballers.

AJH my comment may have been startling to you but I would be happy to say the majority of football fans the globe over would actually disagree with your 'astounding' claim.

Paso

Agree0 Disagree0

Nomidfield

The old excuses of pitches/balls/boots is tiresome. I grew up in the time of rock hard mitre balls, slanted pitches, and mud bogs in penalty areas. This does not mean that I am a better player than some who play today but instead am just a bit more physical on the pitch.

Players today are much better athletes, they can run for 90 mins (unless you watch a rooney game from the last 18 months). modern players are also a lot more techniquely gifted than the older generations. I would quite happily say that a midfielder in the mould of say Essien would have been one of the 'world class' elite if he had been playing 10/20 years earlier.

As I stated in my original post these are subjective views and so no one is right and no one, to an extent, is wrong. I believe Best was a world great but don't believe he is in the top bracket, there are half a dozen inside forwards/wingers who I believe are/were better players than he was.

Paso

Agree0 Disagree0

Well Paso depends how old you are but Busby always said Best could play anywhere, anyhow wtf is wee jinky?

Agree0 Disagree0

Nevermind thought you may mean Johnstone, sorry you are deluded

Agree0 Disagree0

Paso, I think Best was a better dribbler than Ronaldo and that's saying something. He also had better balance and poise. But Ronaldo is better in the air, and has a better shot.
All in all though, I think best would have been better than Ronaldo if playing nowadays.
Its all subjective though, we'll never know.
Nomidfield

Agree0 Disagree0

Best was an unbelievable player, paso u don't know what your talking about. He played in an era of waist high tackles and he still waltzed thro them. Where do u rate maradona en? because after he was named greatest player of all time he said no number two and shouted Georgie best, Georgie best! Messi good, ronaldo great, George Best enough said!

Agree0 Disagree0

Nomidfield, I would also say Ronaldo is better defensively, and positionally, he has a much better conversion rate, and a better turn of pace, he has also had continued success as a player rather than the few years of great play Best gave us trhis is probably due to the more professional approach from players today.

In defense of Best I will say that he had a bigger love for the game and was probably more mentally prepared for what would be waiting for him on the pitch.

However for the whole 'if Best was playing today' argument I feel the best example of Best in modern day football is a young lad who now plays for west ham due to his off-field behaviour not being deemed acceptable by the powers above.

Pardoe
I believe SAF/some england manager also said something similar about Rooney but would you put him in the best ever category based on that?

Paso

Agree0 Disagree0

Blimey Paso, now you are comparing Best to Andy Carroll.

Agree0 Disagree0

Subjective topic, my ar*e! :)

Georgie was the greatest ever.

If he played now, with a nearly no-contact game, you wouldn't get the ball off him!

Agree0 Disagree0

AJH
My tiredness is kicking in after a seriously long couple of days so if that was sarcasm then sorry I missed it, but Carroll is not the West Ham player I was refering to.

Paso

Agree0 Disagree0

Paso your a goon that much is for sure, jinky cudntve laced georgies boots, law who played with both said best was the best, next you'll be saying falcao is better than the king, get back to the scouse site person.
mick the red fireman.

Agree0 Disagree0

Words fail me
Jred

Agree0 Disagree0

Clueless! Maybe more appropriate than astounding

N. I. Devil

Agree0 Disagree0

Wow words fail me also Jred. The manner in which the majority of peoples response have been worded show that I am probably a little too old to be conversing with most of you. You jump at insults readily because you can not back your opinions up with well worded arguments.

I believe George Best was good but not as good as some here have claimed.

In the original thread I'm sure someone (shappy?) stated Zidane was part of this 'world class' grouping, but left out Scholes. Does any one jump on their back? Even though Zidane has, like most midfielders of the modern age, said that Scholes is the best player they have played against.

So Mick the red and Mr. Noname Law and Maradonna may have actually been stating their opinions, which is subjective and differs from person to person. I think Cruyff was a better player than Best others think differently. I don't harras them about it, but instead ask why.

StevieK Best wouldn't have made it onto a field today, his off field antics would have scared any side off from actually developing the player no matter how talented they are.

N. I. Devil to be clueless I would need to be completely ill informed on the subject whereas I am actually well versed in the 'Best is not the best' conversation. But up here you have to be when the best place to watch the football is either Laverys or the Hatfield, and all the patrons will argue to the death over how much better he was to all other players!

Finally Mick the red fireman - I don't know who you are. I don't know what you want. If you are looking for an argument, I can tell you I don't have the time. But what I do have are a very particular set of skills; skills I have acquired over a very long career. Skills that make me a nightmare for people like you. If you refrain from calling me a scouser, that will be the end of it. I will not look for you, I will not pursue you. But if you don't I will look for you, I will find you, and I will troll you!

Paso

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 18:14:50
Eds and others, genuinely speaking where do you think we will finish in the league and the champions league next season?

Obviously winning the Champions League looks impossible at least next season but will we practically be challenging for the league?

My predictions:

PL - 2nd/3rd (Hopefully we win it)

UCL - Quarters

FAC/COC- Moyes has to deliver at least one of these trophies maybe even both


What does everybody else think of our chances in these competitions? {Ed004's Note - Ill answer once we act in the transfer market}

Believable0 Unbelievable0

03 Jun 2013 18:40:03
There are so many factors to take into account. New managers not just us but at City and Chelsea too, a new style and new tactics, new players ect. I would need to see what players everyone signs and how we try to play for the first couple of months and how the team adjusts.

I would expect to see us finish somewhere in the top three and at least get into the knock out stages of the champions league after that it will depend on our draw.

Agree0 Disagree0

PL 1st or 2nd.
Cl Depends on summer signings
The rest who cares but I guess FA cup will be nice.


Shahram

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 18:13:28
I would like to ask No Midfield if he will change his 'name' if we buy two good midfielders?

Believable0 Unbelievable0

It will be my pleasure to change it to "Gomidfield". Of course, I'm happy to accept any name you want me to change to, maybe suggestions by other posters?
If we do sign two TOP midfielders, then I'll be the happiest man in the world. Of course, add Ronaldo or bale and lewindawski, and I'll be delirious.
Nomidfield (soon to change, hopefully)

Agree0 Disagree0

He can be 'NewMidfield' then.

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 19:28:11
The artist formally known as nomidfield. Lol.

Agree0 Disagree0

Good suggestions guys, I shall unveil it when the transfer window is closed!
Nomidfield

Agree0 Disagree0

Grumpy Gills? ;-)

Agree0 Disagree0

Would be a shame to change your name nomidfield after all this time

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 17:48:09
Hey all, bored at work and when I was scanning through the rumors I realized that I don't know very much about either Strootman or Garay. I know Strootman is a box to box CM but has anyone seen his style of play? Is he a decent passer, good decision maker? YouTube clips aren't the best for a real understanding of a player. Also Garay, there seems to be some devide. What kind of CB is he, pacey ball player or a good reader of the game who is positionally great.

Cheers,
Sparty On {Ed004's Note - Unfortunately I haven't gotten to see much of either especially lately as I have been very busy however, Strootman seems to be a very powerful box to box midfielder who is very good defensively. He seems to be a very good passer but he is not the type of player to hit a 40 yard ball over the top of the defence he will keep the ball on the ground and moving quickly. I'm pretty sure PSV have scored a lot of goals this year and their style of play is something I hope we are moving towards (very quick and all players interchanging), now Garay I have seen nothing of bar the last 20-30 mins of the game vs Porto and against Chelsea but he seems to be very good on the ball, like he could play midfield for most premiership clubs, but he is more of a Rio style defender and would be the perfect partner for Vidic if the club deem Smalling, Jones and Evans not good enough to replace Rio yet. He seems to be decent in the air and had 9 goals in 31 games in La Liga before moving to Madrid and that is very impressive for a centre back}

Believable0 Unbelievable0

Thanks Ed for giving me a little more insight. Sounds like Strootman is exactly what we need and Garay is more than capable, although I hope Moyes gives Smalling and Jones a shot first, rate those two very highly! Excited to see what Moyes has up his sleeve, hopefully Strootman, Baines/Shaw, and a younger talent, like Zaha.

Cheers,
SpartyOn {Ed004's Note - I rate Smalling very highly that's why I'm surprised with the Garay link tbh}

Agree0 Disagree0

Same Ed unless it is because of the injury concerns because last season we did come up short at times.

Agree0 Disagree0

I personally rate jones higher than smalling although I do rate the pair

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 17:45:12
banter please edd. has anybody got any latest about who is going to be on moyes back room staff? seems to have gone very quiete! joey

Believable0 Unbelievable0

03 Jun 2013 16:40:38
just heard bets have been stopped on strootmans new club - he' surely utd bound now. what a player, just what we need.

Believable0 Unbelievable0

A web site!
Dylan

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 16:16:40
Hey Ed, this is probably a very stupid question, but if fans decided donate money to the club to fund transfers and decrease debt, would they be allowed to use the money?
I was just thinking about this because, just say out of 660 million fans worldwide (just googled it and don't know if its entirely correct, but would be roughly around that), 250 million of them donate the equivalent of £2. That's £500 million.
Our debt is roughly £360 million as far as I know, so we would have £140 million to spend on transfers, so:

In:
Cristiano Ronaldo - £70 million
Gareth Bale - £60 million
Rafael Carioca - Free (He's contract expires this year so not sure)
Kevin Strootman - £15 million

Out:
Nani - £20 million
Anderson - £8 million
Bebe - £1 million

Spent - £145 million
Earned -£29 million

So, would it be allowed with the FFP rules Ed, or anyone else? {Ed004's Note - The club have no chance of getting the fans to raise money to clear the debts and I'm not sure about the rest of the FFP rules etc}

Believable0 Unbelievable0

The fans already give their money from buying tickets, shirts etc. That's the only way to help the team financially.

Nicolas_United

Agree0 Disagree0

You were right, it is a stupid question.

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 15:44:32
I think by the time the new season starts everyone will be as bored with the "Rooney debate" as they were with "Sneijdergate".

Speaking of which wouldn't he be a great replacement for Rooney;-) lol.

Believable0 Unbelievable0

You're right shappy. Best to wait and see what happens in the summer. In Moyes we have to trust.
Nomidfield

Agree0 Disagree0

Do you mean Schneider?

Pedroknight

Agree0 Disagree0

Shnoeder.
Nomidfield

Agree0 Disagree0

Would love Snyder to join! Would be a perfect player at our club.

-JakeW

Agree0 Disagree0

Are you guys talking about shnodier?

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 16:15:13
Adding to Ed4's comments on Moye's beliefs:

Copied and pasted from DMail:


Moyes stressed that upcoming coaches must take as gospel the old football maxim that matches are won and lost in midfield.
But he also argued that more attention than ever should be paid to the engine room, given the unprecedented tactical variety of the modern game.
Unsurprisingly, the new Manchester United manager was left enchanted by Bayern Munich's play en route to the 2013 Champions League title, but the tactical innovations of the Swiss side Basle have also left him entranced.

'David likes his coaching to be "game realistic", said Fleeting. 'He was talking about how everything these days goes through the middle of the park, so we try to play everything through that area (in our coaching).
'If we were working on attacking wide areas, you still have to recognise that everything goes through the middle at some point - because that's where the game is won. If someone is going to play three men in there, you're going to want to play four in there.
'Then there's all the different shapes of a four-man midfield, while the Barcelona system, where they move about and there isn't that consistency, is more common these days.
'David spoke too about Bayern Munich and how much he admires their flexible style of football with Franck Ribery, Thomas Muller and Arjen Robben. Basle, too, and how they play with a three but with one coming in off the side.
'I phoned David from here one night recently and said: "That's us started on all that rubbish you were talking about".
'He said: "As long as it helps you out Jim, I'm not worried" then he invited us down to Carrington, as we've been to see him at Everton's Finch Farm the last three years. '

Fingers crossed for that midfield engine!

Wallace

Believable0 Unbelievable0

Better get the cheque book ready but don't hold your breath for world class signings.

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 16:04:17
Question here.
Just wondering, if Evra was to go to Monaco/PSG and Vidic off to Russia. Who would you give the captains armband to? Carrick?

Believable0 Unbelievable0

Jones or Evans

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 17:15:47
Evans.

Agree0 Disagree0

RVP or Carrick

Agree0 Disagree0

Rio.

TRUMORS

Agree0 Disagree0

Evans and Jones always injured. Rio might not play a lot. So Rooney :-)

Agree0 Disagree0

It would most prob go to RVP with carrick deputising, then jones getting it in 2-3 years when RVP retires

Agree0 Disagree0

De gea

Agree0 Disagree0

Sneijder

Agree0 Disagree0

I'd give it to the new midfield general we'll be signing this summer 'cos whoever he is he's going to be a natural leader as well as the best midfielder ever. I know this because utd always spend the big money to buy the best players for the positions we need them. 'cos utd are the biggest club on the planet and there's no way they'd settle for second rate players, no matter what it cost

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 14:54:25
If we keep rooney for the remainder of his contract (2 years, correct if wrong) then his wages alone are going to cost 26million and we will not be able to command a transfer fee, therefore lose him on a free. So let's say that is negative 26million.
If we sell him for 25 million, then add the wages we will save, this totals 51 million. So a 76million pound difference.
So the question is from a business point of view. Is keeping Rooney going to be worth 76million. I. e from merchandising and success on the pitch etc?

However this is not factoring in getting a replacement for him

Believable0 Unbelievable0

Also Rooney's asset value is nil or very low so selling him and buying a £25m replacement will add £25m to the club's asset value. So the difference in theory could be closer to £101m. I am sure the club will do what's best for the club. If Rooney was playing at his best and keeping himself in shape it wouldn't even be a discussion, all would want him to stay.

Sydney!

Agree0 Disagree0

Syd
can you explain your comment please, I've no idea what your talking about
Jred

Agree0 Disagree0

This is the most ridiculous argument I've ever read.

Rooney's wages (160k + bonuses) equate to around £8.3m a year before bonuses. Anything he earns over that is a result of him scoring (which is good for the team) or appearing (which - according to the manager's decision to play him - is also good for the team). That's a base of £16.6m over 2 years.

I imagine a top level replacement would command just as much - so regardless of whether we keep him or sell him and replace him - we're going to be spending £16m+ on wages for our second striker over the next two years.

Now on to his value to the club. Without his goals and assists I've no doubt we would not have won the league. Of course RVP was more important - but when he went through his drought it was Rooney who kept us going. The winners of the League get around £16m whilst runners up get around £14.5m - so as far as I can see that's £1.5m he's brought in before we even look at sponsorships and merchandise (he is the face of the club), shirt sales (Rooney 10 – was responsible for 6% of all personalised shirt sales in the UK last year and would have been higher if it weren't for the fact that RVP was a new signing), and other performance related financial bonuses (champs league and cup performances).

What it really comes down to is resale value. He's worth about £25m to us now and so a decision not to sell him (assuming we don't offer him a contract extension) could cost us £25m (or around £8m-£10m if we sell him next year for £15m-£17m which seems feasible given how much we paid for RVP and Rooney's status). There's also nothing stopping us offering him a new contract now and selling him in two years or indeed just keeping him on until he choses to retire.

Forgetting for a moment that there are probably only 2 or 3 strikers in the world who are hands down better than Rooney - a top striker would cost us between £30m and £50m (assuming they are young enough to have any real resale value later on in their careers - so max age of 26/27).

Now take into account that there are no top strikers really available. Lewandowski (who I personally feel is not as good as Rooney anyway) is off to Bayern, Falcao has just moved to Monaco, Neymar is off to Barca, Suarez would never be sold to us (nor would I want him at the club and again - I don't rate as highly as Rooney) and Cavani looks likely to go to Real, Chelski or City for £50m.

I suppose we could go in for Cavani - but that would cost us £50m up front. He's 26 and so I imagine would be given a 5 year contract at £150k a week minimum (at least £39m over the 5 years) but would have very little resale value at the end of the contract.

Assuming we kept him for the 5 years he'd set us back £89m+. If we kept him for 4 and then sold him on at 30 for £15m (which I think is very generous) he'd cost us at least £66.2m.

Compare that to us signing a young striker with potential for £10m and paying them £50k a week over the next four years (£10m + £10.4m) as well as keeping Rooney on for the remainder of his contract before letting him go on a free (£16.5m + £25m) and you're looking at £61.9m+ minus whatever money Rooney brings in through the aforementioned which I have no way of calculating (but would guess is at the very least £5m per season).

Personally I would rather go with the latter and in four years be left with a top young striker with bags of resale value at a cost far less than signing another top striker like Cavani now.

redseven

Agree0 Disagree0

He sells lots of shirts though, that'll make the club a hell of a lot

Agree0 Disagree0

And Syd -

If it's possible for the club to sell him for £25m then Rooney's asset value is surely AT LEAST £25m?

It's actually a very difficult number to calculate and would require taking into account the money he brings into the club through sponsorship, shirt sales, merchandise, performances, etc - but yeah. It's all very much subjective.

Selling one asset for £25m and buying another for £25m would not increase the club's overall asset value by £25m. It would - in the simplest manner - stay the same.

redseven

Agree0 Disagree0

Bloody hell guys;that's a lot of math. I think we should simplify with a formula: R+B²= 0
R (Rooney) B (Belly)

BornInToIt

Agree0 Disagree0

Jred, redseven, if a player is bought for £50m on a five-year deal his asset value is £50m. A year later his asset value will be £40m, then £30m and so on. As an asset Rooney is currently worth zip or a very small amount. If you was to sell Rooney and buy a £25m player his asset value will be £25m. So the club as a whole is worth £25m more than it was previously. If I have got this wrong then it is not by a lot, this is pretty much how it works. I'm pretty sure Sharkey explained this to me around 3/4 years ago. My memory is pretty good, but may have forgotten one or two details.

Sydney! {Ed002's Note - I suspect Sharkey said that it (a) depends how the club choose to write down the value of the assets, and (b) it also depends how the club account for the additional costs of insurance, wages, housing, etc.. And critically Sharkey would have pointed out that players are intangible assets and do not impact the value of the club. So, if Manchester United sold Rooney for £26.2M and do not replace him, the value of the club remains unchanged.}

Agree0 Disagree0

Sydney. That's not how asset values are based in the slightest.

It's a little different in football than it is in business - in a sense that there is no fixed 'value' attached to a player. A piece of machinery, for example, is easy to valuate as it has a price which is relative to every other piece of the same make and model (ie, a brand new black BMW 5 series is worth as much as another brand new BMW black 5 series).

However, no two football players are exactly alike and so a players value as an asset is usually derived by his cost, age and contract. As we know however, a player's cost is determined by how much the buying club is willing to pay. For insurance purposes - that's fine - but taking into account the fact that clubs are willing to over pay for players - it's not a good measure of how valuable a player is to a club in the slightest. For starters it does not consider ability, commercial value, longevity, etc. These things will have been considered by the buying club when putting together an offer - but they are entirely subjective.

Andy Carrol and Fernando Torres each spring to mind here. By your reckoning each are worth more as an asset to their clubs than Rooney is to us? Bale cost Spurs £7m in 2007. Would your calculations not make him worth £1.8m (losing 20% of the base value every year) as an asset?

Quite simply - If another club is willing to pay £25m for Rooney - he must be worth at least £25m to us as an asset. To argue that losing Rooney would not devalue the club is absurd and to argue that reinvesting the money on a player that we deem to be worth as much (£25m) would increase the value of the club (or it's assets) by £25m is equally so.

redseven

Agree0 Disagree0

Redseven, selling Rooney would not devalue the club.

Sydney!

Agree0 Disagree0

Thank god somebody know what there talking about, fedup read syds posts :-)

Agree0 Disagree0

Sydney -

The club's value (on paper) is based on the share price. If we were to sell Rooney and fail to replace him (or replace him with somebody who is not as good) - I would fully expect investors to sell their shares causing the share price to fall and thus the club's value to fall with it.

Outside of changes in the share prices - the club's value would neither fall nor rise with any signing or departure alone - and so to say that selling Rooney would not devalue the club and that signing somebody else for £25m would increase the value of the club by £25m is completely inaccurate.

That's not to say however that Rooney's departure would not decrease the commercial value of the club to perspective sponsors. It could mean the difference between someone like Chevrolet offering us £40m a year rather than £45m - and would devalue the club (or decrease the amount which the value of the club would rise).

redseven

Agree0 Disagree0

There is some way the player's asset value effects the finances and their asset values do drop considerably once they have lived out their initial contracts.

What a club values their player at is a different subject altogether.

Sydney!

Agree0 Disagree0

Sydney -

For insurance purposes and what not that's all well and good - but for a realistic valuation of the club itself it is worthless. As asset values are only used for overall valuations of a business, insurance or financing - I don't know why we are discussing them at all.

Let's say for example - somebody was considering buying Spurs. By your logic - as Bale was signed 6 years ago - his worth is little over 1 million as an asset now and so were he to leave the club for nothing by mutual consent prior to any potential takeover it would only change the overall value of the club by £1m-£2m.

That is, of course, ridiculous and I'm sure that's not how you meant your original comment to sound; but by including this theoretical value to the (incorrect) amount in the original post you changed the context.

As the original post already included the club getting £25m for the sale of Rooney you were effectively trying to count that £25m twice (ie, losing £25m cash and a £25m player). The £25m cash would purchase the player however and thus we would only technically be losing one of the two. Otherwise by the same logic one could argue that we would also be losing £25m worth of debt repayments or £25m worth of developments to the training facilities. Indeed - anything which the club could spend that £25m on.

Given that a top striker would command similar wages - the most we would be losing would be £25m - and that is assuming we let him go for free. There is no reason I can see why that would ever be allowed to happen. I firmly believe that if he doesn't go this summer he will sign a 2 year contract extension before the end of this year or go next summer for £15m-£20m.

redseven

Agree0 Disagree0

Ed002, isn't there a way the intangible assets affect the club's finances? I know I said I wouldn't ask you another question, so I will ask Sharkey instead ;)

Sydney! {Ed002's Note - In the big scheme of thing the answer is "No" Syd. Transients move on to be replaced by other transients with a nominally similar value.}

Agree0 Disagree0

Are MU looking for €30m for Rooney? Or just a random figure? Hmmm?

Sydney!

Agree0 Disagree0

Ed002.

I just noticed you mentioned Rooney being sold for £26.2m when everybody else has being talking about a theoretical £25m. Is there something you know that we don't?

redseven {Ed002's Note - Perhaps an error on my behalf. Please ignore it.}

Agree0 Disagree0

Syd
Honestly on this subject do u know what your talking about
Jrdd

Agree0 Disagree0

Ed002 -

Cheers for clearing that up. As one of the few still hoping that Rooney will stay - you had me a little worried that a deal was in the works.

I see the logic in him leaving - but believe that at this point him staying is still the best course of action for both him and the club.

redseven

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 14:39:55
If reports are true I really don't get why we are wasting 20 million EUROS on the center half Garay.
This is the last position we should be throwing money at, we have so many options in Ferdinand, Vidic, Smalling, Jones and Evans all capable players.
The priority should be the central midfield area and this has been a priority for 3 seasons now.
I have posted on here previously before seasons have started that it wouldn't suprise me one bit we don't strengthen AGAIN in this area.
I don't even think one central midfielder is enough, we need two players of real quality bringing in.

Bo**ock to wasting 20 million EUROS on a bloody center back!

Simmo {Ed004's Note - Maybe Moyes feels that he needs a centre back thats comfortable playing the ball out of defense as apparently Garay is brilliant at doing that?!}

Believable0 Unbelievable0

Maybe he's got more money to spend on players than people actually think and if the rumours are true, Strootman £17m, Garay 18m, Thiago 16m, Di Maria 17m makes around 65-70m to spend without sales.

Agree0 Disagree0

Maybe Simmo, you shouldn't start getting into one of your self-righteous, rabble-rousing rants, until the summer is actually over and we can all see how the transfer window has unfolded.

Is, "if reports are true", really a strong enough basis to start throwing the toys out of the pram? {Ed004's Note - I'm also pretty sure last summer a lot of people were totally against us signing RVP so I don't see Garay as a bad move aslong as we still address our other main areas and I think Moyes will address them}

Agree0 Disagree0

It doesn't matter is he's got 200 million pound to spend, it's a waste of money which ever way you look at it.
We don't need a center back!

Simmo

Agree0 Disagree0

Jonny Evans is also good at bringing the ball out of defense, so is Rio when he bothers to try.

We should be spending 2 x £30 - £40 on two top draw midfielders plus 2 x £20 - £30 mill on two exciting wingers who can beat a man and get a bloody cross in. A decent left back wouldn't go amiss either.

£130 mill or so spend, sell Nani, sell Young, sell Anderson and keep up with the big boys in Europe (we are a big club aren't we?).

Andrew B {Ed004's Note - I reckon you will be bitterly disappointed if you are expecting the club to spend 130 million this summer}

Agree0 Disagree0

LOL. that made me chuckle "self righteous, rabble-rousing rants"
It wasn't a rant Mr StevieK!
Just getting it off my chest in writing.
I think your the one having the rant, is it the time of month?
Booo Hooo

Simmo

Agree0 Disagree0

It is actually. That noticeable? :)

Agree0 Disagree0

Who complained about signing rvp? Rvp is one of the best strikers around, so whoever complained must have changed their minds by now. I think some fans were a bit concerned due to rvp's injury record, but his ability has never been in question.
As for garay, I spend time in Portugal, and he's a good defender but certainly no better than Evans or Rio, and definitely not worth €20m.
Nomidfield {Ed004's Note - Many people questioned last summer whether signing RVP made sense due to the fee, other midfield positions needed addressed and his injury record}

Agree0 Disagree0

Ed004 is spot on, bizarrely there were loads of poster's against RvP signing because of his age and previous injuries.

I personally can't see the need for a CB right now but we are merely fans, Moyes 1) has a better knowledge of what's going on behind the scenes and 2) is better qualified than any of us as to what is required to improve our squad.

At the end of the day any transfer will divide opinion but so long as we're seeing a decent level of investment in the squad I don't see how we can moan. Moyes has worked hard to get to where he is and has therefore earned the right to make these big decisions. I certainly wouldn't want him to do what he feels the fans want just to keep us happy.

Agree0 Disagree0

Garay is tall, strong, composed/very comfortable on the ball (similar to Rio), good at intercepting balls and good in the air. why would you not want him?

Evra could be off to France soon, Vidic maybe to Russia, Rio will be retiring at the end of next season (if not sooner) so having an adequate and experienced (domestically and in europe) replacement already bedded in can not be a bad thing.

Garay can also play as a defensive midfielder so could cover if jones does not work out there (which I think he will) and he does get a lot of goals for a centre back, I believe 9 in 30 odd games last season, and with RVP taking our corners we do need that arial threat from set pieces.

i think Garay coming in is a good move and to argue that he would not be needed because we still have rio is absurd, why should we wait a year to replace someone who will not be with us for long and risk losing out on who we want, then have to wait another year to get the best out of him while he adapts to the EPL?

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 13:14:06
Edd002. In your opinion, What players do you see coming and going this transfer window? Thanks :) {Ed002's Note - Try the search engine.}

Believable0 Unbelievable0

Very suttle Edd002 LOL. Come on drop a few names :) {Ed002's Note - I did that - which is why I have no interest in doing it again - months ago.}

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 13:55:47
The whole rooney debate should really wait until January

I personally think hell stay and maybe moyes can get him in shape and playing well!

Obviously he has treated club badly but his silence on this matter should leave a doubt weather he does actually want to leave, most players come out and say it very quickly!

Another debate is if we get strootman and maybe keep Anderson see if moyes can get him fit and playing well like his first year!
yes I no he doesn't deserve a second chance but I really think under moyes strict training regime we will see fitter players

I honestly think we are only in for strootman and a defender and rooney will stay and nani and maybe evra could be sold

Believable0 Unbelievable0

I too think that Moyes could give one or two a chance. Moyes potentially doesn't want to make too many changes. Anderson & Rooney may have until January to prove themselves. Strootman will definitely come in and if Garay comes in then Jones is definitely going to have to get used to midfield. Could we also go in for Thiago?

If we have midfield options of: Carrick, Strootman, Cleverly, Jones, Anderson - would there be room for Thiago? As well as Powell although I think that he will have a loan. We may go for a winger like Sanchez instead of Thiago.

Agree0 Disagree0

Omg! If the best club manager in the history of the game can't motivate Rooney what hope does moyes have?
Rooney needs a change for himself imo, he has stagnated at united and prob feels a move is the only way for him to feel reinvigorated again.
Id love him to show us that form of 3 years agi again but sadly he has had ample opportunitys to do it and tbh has not.
Chris the REDman

Agree0 Disagree0

The thing is I believe under fergie although we won't etc our team was lazy in periods

Were as in moyes lazy players will be gone

rooney, Anderson, nani, all deserve there chance under moyes I think

Agree0 Disagree0

I can see Rooney leaving, but not Anderson. Selling Rooney could see us generating 30 million £, as well as not having to pay his gigantic salary, whereas the sale of anderson would give us very little, and I believe he is not on an astronomic salary. If Moyes can get the best out of Anderson, then we would have a superb midfielder in our squad, but I fear it is too late. When the best manager in the history of football was not able to do so, I have my doubts Moyes will have the ability to do it. People tend to forget that Anderson still only is 25 years old, and has plenty of years with football in him, if he is able to regain the fitness he once had when he played for Porto, and his first couple of seasons for us.

ZigZag

Agree0 Disagree0

I wouldn't be surprised if anderson's on £60 - £70k a week. The guys had plenty of chances and for whatever reasons hasn't produced.

Next!

Andrew B

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 12:57:40
My turn to throw in my 10 pence on the Rooney debate. There seems to be two sides, love him or hate it. Personally though I am indifferent. I can't stand him as a person, but I respect what he has done for the club. The whole scenario boils down to a few things:

1) Can we get a suitable replacement?
2) If he stays will he give us 100%?
3) Can we afford to not cash in on him and let his contract run down?

The answer to the questions this summer is 1) Probably not. 2) Maybe. 3) No.

The short of the matter is that this summer we are unlikely to sign Bale ever and Ronaldo will be next year if ever. Reus won't be leaving Dortmund and Fabregas will stay at Barca, so we don't really have any ready made replacements. Others like Ozil are likely to go elsewhere. So a replacement is pretty unlikely, if not impossible. This is one problem.

The next problem is his commitment to the club. Is he fully in the game? Does he want to be here? Some say that he has handed in a transfer request, others say that he is being pushed. If he is being pushed then he may be willing to still give 100% and start a fresh under Moyes. However, will he have any respect for his former manager and if he does want a new challenge we are paying 250k p/w for someone who really doesn't want to be. Which is the lesser of two evils, he leaves and we save money, or he stays because we can't replace him but he doesn't give 100%?

The 3rd problem is purely to do with money. We could £30 million for him this year, next year however it is likely to be half of that. As it stands we are in control of negotiations, this flips next year. We will have to accept a pittance.

All the signs point towards a Rooney exit. BUT, what if he gets himself into shape, puts his head down and starts to work? We will once again have a very special player on our hands who, with RVP, will work very well in tandem. Whilst I agree we can't mess around with him and pander to him, we do have to appeal to his ego a little more, as Perez is doing to Ronaldo. Moyes may well do this and could bring the best out in him.

Believable0 Unbelievable0

Nice post Fresh. I understand where you are coming from. So to answer your questions.
1)Bale Ronaldo Reus
2)No
3)No

I don't believe he is commited to the club but he is commited to the wages as he knows he might not get the same pay elsewhere

"Lesser of the two evils" I would sell him and use his wages to try and temp Ronaldo home

I think he has dug a hole to deep to get out of it, he will never be the same again even if he does get fit! Fans ie me would rather have someone who wants to play for the kit not getting pi$$ when he's on the bench or sub off

So what I would like is us to sell Rooney for £25m and we save 250k. Then see if Real would listen to an offer of 50m for Ronaldo and give him the 250k a week, if this don't work either wait till next summer or put a bid in for Bale

Agree0 Disagree0

Fresh,

Not very often I agree 100% with a post on here but I can't fault your opinion or write it any better myself. That is exactly how I feel. There seems to be people trying to push others to one end of the love or hate bandwagon, but I am quite on the fence just like yourself. {Ed004's Note - I'm on the fence as well. He still has a bit of speed granted it isn't half as much as he used to have but he needs to lose weight and show his commitment. Unless he goes away works extremely hard in preseason and loses a tonne of weight and gets into proper shape then he should be sold. If he goes and works hard for the team off the pitch then I will happily keep him otherwise he must be sold as the example he sets for youngsters would be a disgrace!}

Agree0 Disagree0

Great post Fresh.

You have summed up more or less my thoughts on the Rooney debate.

We only know what's going on by what has been released - Ferguson has stated he put in a transfer request, papers have reported rooney as stated this is not the true and Utd are pushing him out - no one will really know the truth until a decision is made but it doesn't look good for him having already putting in a transfer request a couple of years back.

A replacement is unlikely at this moment in time but if things change and Rooney is sold - we will be further linked with every tom, dick or harry out there but a replacement is a must.

If he works hard and gets his fitness and form sorted, I want him to stay, there's no better on his day but i'm afriad to say those days could be well and trually behind him.

It'll be an interesting summer either way - at this moment in time I would be more surprised if he left than stayed but that is only my thoughts and have nothing to back it up.

Agree0 Disagree0

Ahhh a balanced opinion very fresh
Jred

Agree0 Disagree0

Cheers guys.

I doubt that SAF would of come out and said that Rooney has asked to leave if Rooney hadn't asked. The Rooney camp obviously did not want it to come out as it has been denied. However SAF has let the cat out the bag and has made the situation more public which is better for the club and worse for Rooney. Since SAF has told everyone it now means that we are in a position of strength that could force Rooney to sign the deal we offer him, or, if he does leave, we can say 'he wanted to and we got a good price for him'. Now is the right time to sell, but its just those nagging thoughts in the back of my head that think that he will come good again.

Agree0 Disagree0

Fresh

Really good post and I agree with everything but have just a different view on how people benchmark him. Why on earth do people think we need to replace him with the likes of Ronaldo and Bale is beyond me as he is not in their league.

The market is a great indicator of players ability and value and players being touted at 50 million and up are in a different class to him. I believe if he goes a 20 million striker and a couple of good midfielders and wingers will have us never looking back.

Sometimes I wonder is this a wayne united team or Manchester United Team. We have had players in the past that were bigger and better than him and we have moved on.

I think it is the angst of losing something that was good rather than good today, kind of like most divorces LOL.

Shahram

Agree0 Disagree0

Good post fresh. All we ask us if Rooney goes, then we must have a ready made replacement, otherwise, it will not be a good idea to let him go.
Hopefully Moyes can solve the problem, one way or the other.
I'm looking forward to seeing Moyes in action, I think he'll whip the lazy players into action.
Nomidfield

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 12:41:28
Ok, I've watched this site every day lately & all we get on here is people slagging off Rooney. I can understand to a degree but we don't know the full story & his silence on the subject should make people at least wait before slagging him off. As a player he is still class. If he has asked to leave then we should consider letting him go but at a top price to a club abroad only. However the way I see it is that this season he has been asked to play in different positions & yes I take on board the "He gets paid 250k p/w" merchants but I have to say sometimes that is not what unhappiness is about & those that are quick to criticise should understand that a player needs to feel wanted & part of the team not just a bit part player, playing in any position regardless. He is a top player & yes needs to get fitter, but I'd rather keep him at the club than see him in another club's shirt proving a point against us! If he goes elsewhere he will be their main focal point of attack, surely we can do the same as his understanding with RVP grows. Maybe it's me, but I do feel we haven't used him to our advantage this season because RVP has come in & done brilliantly too. If you consider we should be looking to strengthen midfield & with RVP & ROONEY, we can continue to dominate. We have lost Scholes, Fletch & Fergie, surely we need to hang on to our best players & add to the squad to ensure continued success at this critical stage of our club's history. Come on lads, we need to stick together & support the boys, they need us to!

MAD DOG!

Believable0 Unbelievable0

You are spot on Mad Dog, I have been saying for some time that we must let Moyes assess and sort the situation out before making harsh judgments.
We are always told on this site that we must support our players while they still wear the shirt and yet a lot of people seem to slag him off all the time.
He had been asked to play in all sorts of positions and his form is bound to dip. We saw Carrick and Fletcher, two excellent midfielders, playing in central defence, and that was a disaster. We saw Kagawa played wide left and that didn't turn out too good. Jones played in midfield, when he's actually a defender.
Rooney is a fantastic player at the peak of his playing life, if we sell him, can anyone of the rooney detractors let us know who we can replace him with? And please remember, that we we will not spend more than £35m for replacement. So who do you suggest that can play up front, in midfiled, out wide and still score 16 goals in a season with many assists.
Nomidfield {Ed004's Note - I disagree with Kagawa wide left as he played there a few times most notably Norwich and West Ham and had very good games for us there as he came in off the line and found space in between the oppositions midfield and defense making him very hard to mark. I reckon Baines, Strootman and Di Maria/Gaitan are all very likely at this moment in time. Now if you have time go look at the Daily Mails article on David Moyes and him talking about the midfield being the engine. This has given me optimism that he will address there and he talks about Bayern and Dortmund playing through the midfield and the full backs offering the width. Now in a 4-2-3-1 were our best team would be De Gea, Rafael, Smalling, Vidic, Baines, Strootman, Carrick/Fabregas?, Di Maria, Rooney, Kagawa and RVP the 3 behind the striker are all very fluid and can play anywhere in the attack numerous times I have seen Kagawa out wide right when he has started on the left and the full backs are good enough to provide the width imo. Now this all depends on Rooney and what happens with him. If he is sold we NEED a replacement in the 3 behind RVP, however, a fully fit Rooney along with the other two will be able to press and harry the opposition and there is a lot of attacking quality there}

Agree0 Disagree0

Top post!

I completely agree with everything you just said.

Agree0 Disagree0

I think Rvp and Rooney can be a very good combination.
I also think that Rooney playing as the lone striker for Chelsea with Oscar Mata ans hazard would work very well to.

people may want to be careful what they wish for
Jred

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 12:15:13
Garay, Thiago and Strootman will be our signings. Expect Fabio to be used on the wing next season and Zaha will be a first teamer

Believable0 Unbelievable0

Fabio on the wing? Are you mad? Why on earth would be be played as a winger.

Agree0 Disagree0

Fabio couldn't even get in the QPR team so I doubt he will make it into the squad next season. I personally think he will be sold.

Agree0 Disagree0

Why the hell are we buying a center back?
Waste of 20 million EUROS.
Spend it on the area where we need it most, the central midfield area.
Boll*cks to buying another center back.

Simmo

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 11:56:59
Just want to chip in on the Rooney debate.

I think we should be in control of his future, not him, If we want him to stay then we should make him stay, make him play and if he doesn't perform then we keep him on the bench until he realises that he needs to step up.

I do find it hard to read some of what you say about his ability, I don't think he can lose that and you forget he is a player who could overtake Bobby charlton as our top scorer should he stay.

I do agree that he is a thick man and a sad excuse of a professional of the field but he still has the match winner in him.

The only way we should sell him is if it means getting someone in at the levels he is capable of, people are saying yeah but RVP is much better but surely it is better to have Rooney and RVP than just RVP. If we sell we need to get someone like Ozil, Reus or Cavani but seeing as they are players out of our reach I don't think we should sell.

1redarmy

Believable0 Unbelievable0

How can we be in control of his future when there are few teams that can match the salary he is on.

He has only 2 years left on his contract. If he doesn't sign an extension this summer he should be sold.

Sign a new contract or be sold. Don't sign and rot on the bench for two seasons. Get fined every time you step out of line. After two years of limited football he'll be a shadow of himself.

I personally think if a proper replacement can be purchased he should be sold. He has peaked as a player, his value will only go down from here. It may also benefit his career if he gets a new challenge.

KB

Agree0 Disagree0

Why would you keep him just to keep him on the bench? It is inevitable that he will under perform, especially if he doesn't want to stay, so why would you want to keep him just to pay him to sit on his arse. Is that to make sure no one else can bring him back to his best, because if that is the case we then become the spiteful and sad excuss of a club, we all hate, as we are keeping a player just so no one else can have him. I know Rooney's wage is bealt up on a package but, we will still be paying him 100,000+ to sit on his arse.
Personally, I would love Rooney to stay and give everything he has for the club again, but we all know he has this disloyalty streak in him. Its not so much that he is a thick man like many arrogant and jealous people label him. If that was the case me and you must be considerably smarter, yet I have no skill I truly excell at that allows me to earn the amount of money he does or perform and cope with the huge amount pressure he has to overcome everyday of his life?
I also love how people say if we sell him we must buy a player of equal quality! Yeah that is a certain, but like Ronaldo each player can not be replaced exactly. You can attempt to purchase a player in the same role, with similar playing styles. However, there is certain factors which effect how they play for their new club, good or bad. Climate, lifestyle, team mates, management style etc. Can the city of Manchester attract Ozil, Reus and Cavani, probably not. If we where to replace Rooney the replacement would come from England or maybe Eastern European more than likely, as they are the players that know Manchester United and the history it has or Support Manchester United.
If only Moyes can motivate Rooney like he did at Everton, because let's face it Manchester United made him the great player he is today, but it was Everton who nurtured him, giving him the potential and skills for us to work with. I believe if Moyes persuades him to stay, we will see a much more comitted Rooney.

aaallj5

Agree0 Disagree0

Correct aaallj5. And you know and I know, that we will not be able to replace him.
Talk of Cavani, Lewndawski, Falcao (gone anyway), Ronaldo and Bale will all come to nothing. It is just talk on this site as we all want the best players at ManU.
So if we sell Rooney, Who do we replace him with? Some people have suggested we don't replace him as Moyes likes to play one man up front, are people serious? What about if RVP gets injured? Hernandez cannot play upfront on his own, Welbeck is not an out and out striker and doesn't score enough goals. So we have to invest in a top striker. Namely, Lewindawski. But does he want to come to United and do we want to pay the fee that dortmund will want?
Nomidfield {Ed004's Note - I reckon Hernandez is fine up top as long as he has someone supporting him from midfield and Kagawa would be a perfect partner and Welbeck, Cleverley, Young etc can all play in the hole}

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 11:51:38
Where are the sources about Strootman? I can't find them tbh.

Believable0 Unbelievable0

This is exactly what i'm thinking. all the regular posters and the edds seem adamant that strootman will definitely be joining us but I have not read anything on the net anywhere regarding it being close or that we will sign him apart from this morning where have stopped taking bets. where is everyone getting this news from and why are you guys so confident? {Ed004's Note - Try the search function for Ed 2's comments etc}

Agree0 Disagree0

They've convinced each other, generally speaking this type of transfer is being leaked don't for one minute beleve it will happen.
He's not good enough!
Dylan

Agree0 Disagree0

Dylan,

So give me your detailed analysis on the player as to why he is not good enough? {Ed004's Note - There is no point arguing with him and starting this debate again the poster has made his mind up about the player and I do not think anyone on here will be able to change it in the slightest}

Agree0 Disagree0

Dylan you're really starting to wind me up now, how can you judge someone to not be good enough if you've never seen them play?

Agree0 Disagree0

In my opinion he's no better than Anderson (if he's fully fit)from what I've SEEN of him granted not live there are better alternatives depending on the Bale /Ronaldo situation then he wouldn't improve us.
Please move on I will never be convinced if he ends up at OT then he will get my full support
Dylan

Agree0 Disagree0

The Dutch sports journalist who a web site use regularly was on today regarding Michael Laudrup owing Ajax money from years ago at the end of that discussion he was asked if any Dutch players would be coming to the premier league.
Now I believe a move to United by any of their players would be headline news guess what he never mentioned it!
Granted he was cut short having mentioned the Chealsea kid on loan and Brumma (spelling)
Dylan

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 10:30:46
Interesting lessons from last nights Brazil game. First, Rooney, apart from his deflected goal, was peripheral and looked out of his depth. Secondly, Phil Jones was clearly unhappy in midfield. It's time club and country let him settle at his best position as a centre back.

Believable0 Unbelievable0

Another Rooney hater move on mate

Ross

Agree0 Disagree0

Played up front on his own, at times in the first half he was the only England player in the Brazil half.
Never had a great game but was involved in both goals
Jred

Agree0 Disagree0

"Apart from his deflected goal"

Lol, that's it then? Standing still while scoring the deflected goal. May be he just stuck a foot out from the dugout and it flew into a deflection? Who was that headless Nick running at the Brazilian defence?

Deeps.

Agree0 Disagree0

Certainly not a Rooney hater Ross but sad that a once great talent is being wasted. Fags, booze and inappropriate eating left him a stone overweight last season and I don't think he's recovered. He's not a naturally fit athlete so he really has to work hard. Shouldn't be too difficult really for £250,000 per week!

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 11:32:58
If that goal defelected over how would people feel about Rooney's performance? Was it world class? Did he carry the team on his back to a great result? Did he even look that interested? {Ed004's Note - I turned the game off at half time England were that bad! They need to adapt the German module of developing youth. Scrap the current team bar a few Hart, Cole/Baines, possibly Carrick/Lampard, Rooney and they're the only players I'd keep. The English side will not win anything the next 10 years the way they are going anyways so why not set up the youth so in 10 years we have a young and very good technical side so that means no Walcott!!}}

Agree0 Disagree0

The point is Deeps it was a deflection and without it I don't think it would have gone in. Credit to Rooney though, it was a good run and shot.

Agree0 Disagree0

Rooney 'looked out of his depth' seriously? I don't know many forwards that would have had a world class game with the service England provided last night. I personally feel he has lost his hunger and needs a new challenge, then you'll see him get much fitter and sharper for both club and country. I also hope he stays, incredibly talented footballer.

Agree0 Disagree0

I have to disagree with you Ed004, I can see England winning something in the next 10 years, as long as we get a manager that has a clue about football.
I do agree we need to get rid of the deadwood, that are not even good enough for a squad postion to be honest. Players like, Walcott, Milner, Jagielka, Johnson etc.
However, if you look at the young players we have coming through, under the right management could be a very capable team. I don't think we will possess World class talent like Spain or other countries, but we will have a team unity like Italy and German teams of the past.
Players like Wilshere, Powell, Danny Rose, Kyle Walker, Jones, Smalling, Zaha. Not really outstanding world beating players, but they will lack the jealousy and ego of the players from the past 15 years! This under 21 European championship will highlight this unity, and I have a feeling we could win it, if Pearce gets it right for once.
I only think England can acheive this if we get a strong confident manager and not yes man though.

aaallj5 {Ed004's Note - I don't suppport England so talking as a Neutral I can't see England winning anything for a long time yet tbh the next world cup should be a stage were youngsters are played and given time to develop and get rid of old guard like Terry, Gerrard, Lampard etc and I'd say Rooney but there is a lack of striking options for England and I don't rate Sturridge highly at all}

Agree0 Disagree0

Come on guys, how can rooney "carry the team"? We were playing Brazil not some park team?
Rooney can't do everything on his own, it is a team game.
He scored a goal and was involved in the other goal, so what else do you expect of him.
England played crap in the first half, surely even the biggest rooney hater cannot blame this on Rooney alone. The whole team and tactics were wrong.
Nomidfield

Agree0 Disagree0

"First, Rooney, apart from his deflected goal, was peripheral and looked out of his depth. Secondly, Phil Jones was clearly unhappy in midfield"

Paulo, this is my point. Jones had a shocker of a game except for hacking Neymar down twice or thrice. See the difference in how people are judged? Phil Jones can play like sh!t and be decalred as unhappy, but Rooney can have an assist and a goal and be "completely" out of depth. Rooney may well leave and I won't lose sleep over it, but this site reeks of double standards and frankly that's sucks!

Deeps.

Agree0 Disagree0

Sorry Eds - The site does not reek of double standards, some of the posters do! Apologies

Deeps.

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 15:37:46
I'm not blaming Rooney for the result or how the team played. What i'm trying to do is put some perspective back into it. Some people saw the goal and thought Rooney played well, i'm just saying if you look alittle deeper then it becomes clear that he didn't play well.

Agree0 Disagree0

Sorry you think it's double standards Deeps. The reality is that Rooney is 27, played in his preferred position and should be at the peak of his career now. Phil Jones is 21, was played out of position and is at the very start of his career at this level. Accordingly it is ok to judge their performances differently although I thought they both had poor games. Sorry if you can't see the difference.

Agree0 Disagree0

Paulo

Played out of position? Sounds familiar. I am sure you can guess the rest. Both of them had poor games, yet it was Wayne weighing in with an assist and a goal. I can see it mate, but it isent difference it is just bias. By the way, Rooney had an average first half and a better second half. Far from being brilliant!

Deeps.

Agree0 Disagree0

It would be great to see a fit, sharp, committed Rooney again but I don't think that's going to happen at Utd. Perhaps a new start would remotivate him, I'd wish him well, he's been fantastic for us in the past.

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 05:31:12
Just out of interest, who does everybody believe will be the next "Big Thing" in football. The next player to reach the level of the likes of Messi and Ronaldo and dominate the game for years.

Personally, I believe it will be Hachim Mastour of AC Milan. That lad has some serious serious talent, and at the age of 15 should be nowhere near that good yet. It shows in the fact AC have requested to be allowed to play him already. I really believe he will be the next dominant player in world football, or one of the few dominant players of his generation.

Watching him play is like watching an ice skater, he just glides across the pitch with the ball glued to his feet. Quite like Zidane I must add, except with more skill in his game.

Believable0 Unbelievable0

El Shaarawy of AC milan is the player I think can be the next player to reach that level.
Thibaut Courtois of Chelsea is another player I think can be world class.

i hope Adnan Januzaj can also be a class player

sid

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 09:36:09
I don't know if we will see anyone on the same level as Messi and Ronaldo for quite awhile. If you consider the other players to have reached that level your looking at Zidane, Pele, Best and Maradona. With Ronaldo and Messi that makes only six players in the history of football that you can put in that another level genius catagory. I think it will be many years before we get someone who can actually aspire to that standard. Neymar was touted but looks like he'll fall short, and who remembers Freddy Adu? a lot of players get touted to be the next best player but most never get to the level expected of them. let's see just wait and see who fullfils it.

Agree0 Disagree0

Halilovic isn't too shabby either, or Musonda from chelsea. He's seen as a cross between Xavi and Iniesta

Agree0 Disagree0

Definately not Neymar jesus that kid is overated massively. all the talk Pele gives about him is a joke IMO

ms85

Agree0 Disagree0

I have to disagree shaps, I think a lot more than 5-6 have reached that level u could easily add zico, Socrates, ronaldo (the Brazilian) ronaldinho and nedved for a while to name a few.
My next up and comer would have to be monsoir (spelling) if he reaches his potential
Chris the REDman

Agree0 Disagree0

Hachim Mastour, Viktor Fischer

Deeps.

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 11:30:31
Chris mate I would say they were all good players, you could even put Eusabio in that list. But I think they just fall short of that ultimate level. Would you have had any of them over the likes of Best, Pele, Maradona, Messi, Zidane or Ronaldo? I don't think so. With these players we are talking about players who are on a level above world class. Players who can carry a team to greatness consistantly, in every game they have a huge effect on the outcome of the game. Players who can make an average side great and a great side unbeatable.

Agree0 Disagree0

I think Ronaldo and Messi are better than Pele and Maradona to be honest. They won't be recognised as much though as they may never win world cups.

I don't remember any players scoring 60+ goals a season, we call 30 goal strikers legends but they are beyond that.

I think it will be a while until we see such great players again, it seems the only players we can call greats of the game are world cup winners. (I don't agree with that by the way)

1redarmy

Agree0 Disagree0

Players liek Ronaldo. Messi only come around once a decade, we are lucky to have two at the moment. Agree with Redman though, Ronaldhino was at the same level all be it for a relatively short period of time and Fat Ronaldo certainyl was before him. Never heard of Mastour and only knolw Hallovic from football manager. I am interested to see how Neymar develops at Barcelona though. The few games for Brazil I have seen have usaully left me underwhelmed to be honest, but saying he is massively over rated is harsh, time will tell as though underwhelmed it is obvious to see he is very talented. Not that I see any being at the Ronaldo/Messi levels, the snippets I have watched (motivated from football manager) I do think there are a fair few top talents who will be very very good players: Maher, Clasie of Holland - Varane, Zouma of France - also good to see a little cameo of Bernard last night who is being hyped up in Brazil and is another FM legened ;) Personalyl and sadly if he settles in Europe I can see Moura becoming a top top player in the next couple of years lightning fast and very skillful, if he can develop other areas of his game he could end up livign up to the hype he has had
Invisible STuey

Agree0 Disagree0

Zico was the best Brazilian footballer I've ever seen I would put him on the list cruyff maybe as well
Jred

Agree0 Disagree0

I agree with you partly '1redarmy' when you say "you don't have to be a World cup winner to be a great player, " if that was the case then BEST and GIGGS couldn't even be mentioned in the same breath as the rest, but we all know that if those two where in an England side or any other team, there would be a good chance that team would have won the World Cup, even England, especially with Giggs.
However, I don't agree with the 60+ goals Messi scored. Now Messi is a true great and to even get over 40 goals for a season makes you a legend, but to me Messi will always fall short. Its stupid I know, and I admire his loyalty to Barcelona, but I think any player that is not English needs to perform in other teams around Europe. Personally, I believe many English based players are over looked by the rest of World football, as they look down on us, which is unfair when you consider the talent we have in our and have had in our league over the past few years. I am sure we are all in agreements that Scholes, Beckham, Giggs, Keane should have been winning European and World player of the years, but where over looked for more exoctic and adaptable foreign players.
To me Messi has it very easy in Spain, its less physical and he is allowed to play. Now could he cope with the physicality of The Premier League, like Ronaldo? Could he cope with a more tactical and cynical game in Italy, like Zidane coped with? After that what other leagues is there as they don't match the standard of England, Germany or Italy? Spain is the Scottish league, Barcelona managed to gain 100 points this season does not highlight the lack of competition.
Ronaldo managed to cope with different playing styles, lifestyles, climates, fans and pressure and only has only 1 ballon d'Or and Player of the year. Yet Messi gets it every year? He is the darling of the football Worlds eye when really he will be a legend, but has never allowed himself to gain new challenges, the biggest challenge for Messi is when the Barcelona team is dismantled and rebuilt. When Barcelona lose Puyol, Xavi etc we will see his ability to adapt and mature, like Scholes, Giggs and Ronaldo.
Lets face it he can look very average for Argentina, where as Maradona inspired them to when the World cup on his own. Maradona also could play in different leagues with success.

aaallj5

Agree0 Disagree0

Your post is laughable. Beckham for Balon d'or? Really?
For proof rhat Messi can survive in the premier league we need no further proof than your last Champions League final debacle.
The English league is poor and United's Route one style of play makes it so much nore apparent.

Jauganaut

Agree0 Disagree0

I also would like to add a few names to the different class category - Cruyff, Gullit, Van Basten, Koeman, Matthaus, Muller, Beckenbauer, Eusebio, Batistuta, Jinky, Romario, and so many more players. Each I have named was feared by the opposition and would have made any side better no matter what time in history we are talking.

On the basis of comparing similar positioned players take 2 from the 'best ever 6' stated above by shappy, Best and C. Ronaldo. Both are amazing players that have entertained fans for years, but Best is nowhere near to the level of Ronaldo. Yes he had a great control, and yes defenders were able to be rougher but Ronaldo not only scores goals, but dances round players, makes unbelievable assists, tracks back, is good in the air, is a model professional, and for an inside forward what more can you want from a player. No disrespect to Best as I have enjoyed watching his career highlights over and over again but he really is a long way from Ronaldos level. Jinky is a player who I actual place ability wise above best, and most people who have seen both play would agree with me.

Same with Maradonna/Messi and Pele. Pele was a world class player but again messi/maradonna could both do so much more on a pitch than him.

I know controversial and subjective statements but that's what this whole 'world/different class' tag deserves.

Paso

Agree0 Disagree0

Well 'juaganaut' I love how people judge a player on one game, and that teams somes up the league they play in! If that's the case let's judge Messi on his games against Chelsea, when he was non existant? How about when he played inter milan and was marked out the game.
Saddly we will never see Messi challenge himself in a new league, but there's one thing that has to be asked, could Messi cope with the constant physicality and unpredictability of the Premier League? Ronaldo could! It would be interesting to see Messi up against City, Stoke and so on, very strong teams on a weekly basis.

aaallj5

Agree0 Disagree0

But Messi has played so many other teams from different leagues in the champions league and schooled them more often than not.
Are you saying that world class players cannot have games where no matter what they do it just doesn't work? If so why hasn't Ronaldo woven his magic and won Madrid more league titles?
The Irony is that you are doing exactly what you are accusing me of by overlooking overwhelming evidence

Jauganaut

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 05:27:15
PEOPLE WHO ARE FAVOURING ROONEY SALE NEED TO GET A GRIP. Why a team sell its best player? Even if he is pain in a$$ club need similar replacement to have similar influence both in dressing room or in the field. Now lewy is almost bayern bound can u people see a single striker who can replace him? I don't think so. Keeping him get him back to his high morale is wiseness. Talk about leaving and holding clyb for ranson talks are BS. We need wins in every trophy. That is all has to be the summary.

So in short no replacement available no rooney sell to be granted.

R9dio17

Believable0 Unbelievable0

Best player? What planet are you on?

Agree0 Disagree0

R9dio17. Get a grip! Rooney has shown that although he has talent he rarely performs to the level should be hitting regulary. Ok he scores a goal while playing for england and all of a sudden he is the best thing since sliced bread. don't think so. Why should we keep someone who clearly doesn, t want to be at Utd. The danger that he would become a rotten apple and cause disharmony among other players in the squad. His attitude should not be tolerated especially when you have young lads coming thru the youth system who look up to the senior players, if he stays we will have more Pogba situations to deal with. We are one Utd and everyone that has the privelage to wear the jersey should respect and honour it.
Red Paddy

Agree0 Disagree0

Van persie is our best player

nikz

Agree0 Disagree0

Ooh my head is sore after reading that!

I am not the grammer police and I am not an english teacher but sweet mercy, use a comma or full stop sometimes.

Agree0 Disagree0

All I can say is "Deflection"

Agree0 Disagree0

R9dio17. Get a grip! Rooney has shown that although he has talent he rarely performs to the level should be hitting regulary. Ok he scores a goal while playing for england and all of a sudden he is the best thing since sliced bread. don't think so. Why should we keep someone who clearly doesn, t want to be at Utd. The danger that he would become a rotten apple and cause disharmony among other players in the squad. His attitude should not be tolerated especially when you have young lads coming thru the youth system who look up to the senior players, if he stays we will have more Pogba situations to deal with. We are one Utd and everyone that has the privelage to wear the jersey should respect and honour it.
Red Paddy

Agree0 Disagree0

Hes TWICE held the club to ransom now and NOBODY I repeat NOBODY is bigger than Man Utd. his attitude stinks his belly is growing and his pace is non existent time to go wayne time to go.

ms85

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 10:27:09
He is still a very good player but he has started to decline. On top of that he seems to have lost his spark. He just seems uninterested with football atm. And unless he can get his motivation back he will continue to decline at a fast rate.

The problem with Rooney atm is he isn't good enough to demand a first team spot. We tend to play with one striker and someone playing in behind the striker on last seasons form RvP and Kagawa will be first choice. So where does he play? He hasn't got the right attitude to be a sqaud player but his application isn't good enough to be in the first team. So what do you do? Do you pay a player more than anyone else at the club and play them as first choice when the effort and effect they have on the game isn't good enough. How would you feel if your Kagawa or Hernandez and Rooney is doing a half arsed job and getting paid and played more than you?

He may still be a good player but his attitude will rip apart the team spirit within the club.

So do we keep a player who can't be bothered to do his best, is declining in his ability, and is getting paid the most. Who's biggest contribution to the team is to destroy the team morale?

No unless he can get his head right and put the effort in then he has to go.

Agree0 Disagree0

U people have not catch the point. point is u don't have a decent replacement available in the market. and without reinforcement selling him is nowise.

Rodio17

Agree0 Disagree0

I m not starting a debate that who is a best player at united.
I m simply saying no other striker is available of his caliber

I think I m clear now

Rodio17

Agree0 Disagree0

Shaps

Based on last season's form, would you play Kags over Rooney? I am not too sure, certainly not based on last season. let's not even get into the stats mode. I think you are only considering the last 5 odd games. Kagawa has the potential, but I see people majorly overplaying his "impact". He has yet to adapt to the physical side for me and above all our playing style does not suit Kagawa.

Deeps. {Ed004's Note - That's the thing I would rather build my team around RVP next season and I think Kagawa will be better suited playing behind him as he is more creative and I would use the sales from Rooney and Nani transfers to fund two new signings to play around Kagawa and RVP. I reckon a front four of 2 of Di Maria/Sanchez/Lamela/Bale/Ronaldo/Reus, Kagawa and RVP and we would have a team that could play the same football as Dortmund and Bayern and that's assuming we sign Strootman and hopefully Lewandowski}

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 12:10:33
At our club we have always worked on the idea of if we can't bring in someone of sufficient quality then we promote from within.

Now how many games did Rooney play as a striker last season? I'd say around 5/6 at most. So why do we need a striker to replace a player who hasn't played as a striker? Surely Hernandez could get a few more games, he deserves it after all.

With Kagawa playing in the hole then Rooney could struggle for games there. If we sign Thiago as well then he can play there. So with RvP and Hernandez upfront and Kagawa and Thiago in the no. 10 role then do we need to replace Rooney? Plus there is Welbeck, Zaha and Powell who can play and need games.

I'm not so sure we need to sign someone.

Agree0 Disagree0

Hernandez is a super player, but he cannot play in the same style of rooney. Rooney can play alngside, behind or on top on his own.
Find me a striker like him and then we can argue whether we need him or not.
I think it will be absolute madness to sell him.
Nomidfield

Agree0 Disagree0

03 Jun 2013 00:47:47
@Brendan81
Every one to there own but I have yet to see you make a post that isn't a dig at Rooney.
2:2 away against Brazil and one of our players scores and you are negative about it.
I can remember trying to defend some of our really poor players in the 70s/ 80s.
Why, because they where United players yet you feel the need to moan about a player that United fans would of dreamed about 20 /30 year ago.
Modern fan only supported United while they win forgot that we support our own. United we stand
Jred

Believable0 Unbelievable0

Rooney was awful last night. To be fair most of the players were.

Sydney!

Agree0 Disagree0

Syd

If Rooney was awful last night, I must say except for The Ox, the rest were p!55 awful! You really have to forget the notion of Phil Jones playing in midfield I think.

Deeps.

Agree0 Disagree0

A goal and an assist from zero service playing against arguably the best centre half in the world (Thiago Silva) for a team that has no creativity and no Andy Carroll to suit their long ball tactics. I don't think he was as bad as everyone is making out.

Agree0 Disagree0

Deeps, I have watched Rooney very closely in the past two games and he has been no different than he has been all season for us. He was involved in both goals as you would expect him to be playing the furthest forward. He is still capable of individual magic with the ball at his feet, but his all round game is just tragic. Poor control, sluggish, poor movement. He is a shadow of himself from the 2009/10 season and that Rooney will never return again. We have certainly seen the best of Rooney which is a real shame given his young age. I would only sell if we could get a top player in beforehand. It's a real shame we look to have missed out on Lew as he would have been a massive improvement for the attack.

Sydney!

Agree0 Disagree0

Syd

Thats a terrific bottom level we are talking about, aren't we? 23 goals and 17 assists (club and country). Surely, surely this cannot be the end of a player who even when being sh!t (as you say), has such incredible numbers. Now you will say stats don't tell the entire story and I agree. But for a player playing in his position, they have to have some credence. I bet if RVP would have scored that goal, people would have said "Quality players make/deserve their luck". There are very few players in world football that can replicate Rooney's contribution to the team and even fewer who are ready to come to United, let alone be a "fan". We will have to be careful what we wish for. You didn't answer the Jones question?

Deeps.

Agree0 Disagree0

7 goals in 7 games fir England now
Jred

Agree0 Disagree0

Rooney will score goals, it's his overall play that is poor. Go and watch Rooney from the 2009/10 season and tell me if you can find a single game in the past three seasons that shows him playing that well? Sorry lads he is still a top player IMO, but he is in decline and has been now for a couple of years. Add that to his poor attitude, not keeping in shape, sly contract tactics and then tell me why he deserves the salary he is getting or the salary he wants. Rooney in 2009 was IMO world-class. Probably in top five best players in the world. My fave player by a long shot. Last night I wasn't sure if it was Wayne Rooney playing upfront for England or his father. I'm not "slagging him off" it's what I am seeing with my own two eyes. If we were to sign Lewandowski tomorrow I wouldn't give a monkey's if Rooney went to Chelsea as I know his best days are behind him. The only thing I do not want to happen is flog Rooney and not replace him in the team with a better player.

Sydney!

Agree0 Disagree0