Manchester United Banter Archive November 04 2014

 

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04 Nov 2014 18:59:58
I would ship out Evans and Keane and loan out Mcnair and bring in Howedes and Stones

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04 Nov 2014 21:10:54
McNair has probably the same potential as Stones, why loan Paddy out to bring in Stones from a club that would pull our pants down.

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04 Nov 2014 22:47:05
Ship out Michael Keane before he's even had a proper chance? McNair doesn't need a loan, he doesn't look to struggle at this level at all. Sometimes loans can badly hinder the development of some young players, not being under the right coaching staff and not playing alongside top players.

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McNair to me should be ahead of Smalling in the pecking order and I am sure he will be.

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05 Nov 2014 13:06:08
When fit Evans is one of our best defenders. Don't know why people are quick to stick the boot in (pardon the pun). We serm to have endless rotation of knocking particular players. I thought once cleverly and anderson went it might have died down a bit but I was obviously wrong.

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04 Nov 2014 18:32:49
God I miss united in the champions league, for a bit of comfort i backed ronaldo to score anytime, lvg please get our defence sorted in January

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Was that like 1/50?

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Lol, no I got 2/1 good odds

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I've got 5-0 at 22/1, not looking good so far lol

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04 Nov 2014 20:40:12
2/1 ronaldo anytime? You sure that's what you put on?

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I'm guessing he means 1/2 gds

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1/3 I saw him most places. I did manage to get him even money for El Clasico though so no brainer there

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No I said 2/1 can ye read, a special i got today, plus I saw it 3/1 after that somewhere else, not that it matters now

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Oh and if ye do first goal scorer do it with a certain bookmakers, double the odds if scorer scores in the first 20 mins,

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04 Nov 2014 16:33:49
{Ed033's Note - Shappy has posted a new blog entitled, Manchester United's current situation

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04 Nov 2014 22:41:40
Thanks for the effort shappy as always but I've got Xmas coming soon.

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04 Nov 2014 13:23:08
Hi Guys

Just a thought on a possible midfield enforcer.There has been some good suggestions and some not so good but I think the answer to our problem might be staring us in the face.I have to admit my personal choice would be either Vidal or Strootman.However the more I see of Alex Song the more I think he could be what we are after.I thought he was excellent against City and has been throughout the season so far.I think I'm right in saying he is on loan at West Ham so might be worth looking at for next season

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04 Nov 2014 14:31:32
Why do you think he's on loan. at West Ham, no disrespect intended. We should be aiming for the best or likely-to-soon-be the best!

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Ozwald

I agree we should be aiming for the best which is why I said I wanted Vidal or Strootman but as we can't get them at the moment and I would be over the moon if we get either of them either in January or next summer.I just think Song could a very effective job until such player comes along.

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Think Song would be a great addition people forget how good he was because he went to barca who were never going to drop any of there 3 cms or change there shape so he was left out. Was great at arsenal and showing again at west ham how good he is

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I wanted Song last summer (Moyes era), partly because he played the role we needed and most importantly he linked amazingly well with RVP at Arsenal. Not so sure that is as important now though as RVP is a year older and for me he looks 5 years older.

We need better than Song, but he is better than Anderson, Cleverley, Carrick, Fletcher, Fellaini. Probably Blind as well.

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Beast

Carrick and fellaini are better than song and that is why he is at West Ham and these guys are at United.

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Carrick had one good season, he vanished last year and is almost past it. He looked good at the back the other day though, but we shouldn't let that distort matters - he is side to side and very slow in midfield - remember our midfield being over run game after game last season with him holding?

Would you have said Fellaini was Utd quality 3 games ago? I like Fellaini for certain games, but we need more than just Herrera as a proper CM in our team that is near the standard to dominate again.

To be clear I wouldn't go for Song now, but would have last season. I was just pointing out he would have been useful last season and arguably this season as it turns out, but we need better long term.

He would have created a lot more for RVP as well who hasn't performed for 18 months.

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05 Nov 2014 00:15:40
I think carrick has had more than one good season. Ok last year wasn't great but apart de gea and the half season we got from Rooney who else can say last year they performed anywhere near the standard required.

Carrick has been very underrated over the years. Yes he's getting on a bit now but will be a useful squadman and old head in the dressing room.

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Beast

Carrick did not vanish last season but difficult to play in a team with an ageing back 4 that was mistake prone and a limpd. k of a partner in cleverly. I have to disagree and he is still a quality player.

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No problem disagreeing with me MrE and GCU. He was without doubt top quality 2012/13, and he maybe had one other above average season with us since he signed.

Most fans were calling for his head pre-12/13, last season was a shambles, but surely that's when you want your experienced, quality players to do their stuff, just because everyone else failed it doesn't excuse Carrick, like it doesn't excuse the others.

Carrick doesn't create many chances at all from midfield, he gets over run, but he does have a good brain and can read like Gerrard, just not mobile enough and certainly nothing more than a bit-part - My point is Song would be picked over him if choosing a CM by most people if you take away club loyalty.

I do think he will do better in an LVG system though, but it will be a case of wait and see, rather than expecting great things from him, he isn't reliable enough.

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05 Nov 2014 13:24:40
Beast I think most of those calling for his head suffered from what I call the 'british' problem. I.e. a lack of understanding of certain more technical aspects of the game. Because he isn't a blood and thunder player of the mould of Keane some people don't rate. Over on the continent where perceptions are different he's a more appreciated player.

I do fully agree he's in decline and now should be a rotation option. Maybe last season he was asked to watch Leon osman videos.

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04 Nov 2014 11:36:11
Guys what sort of player is Enzo Perez? Being linked semi regularly right now.

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Quite simply not a good enough one, there is a reason why he's nearly 29 and never played in a top european league. He is a hard working box to box type player but he neither has the ability to impose himself on the opposition nor the technical qualities to dictate a game through his passing or create or score the vital goal to win a game. He's an Argentine Scott Parker.

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I did wonder with his age why he hasn't moved on yet. Cheers.

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04 Nov 2014 15:59:51
Totally agree with Shappy. A good pro, but defo not top draw. We should be aiming higher.

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04 Nov 2014 21:14:56
Argentine Scott Parker lol. I agree especially for the prices being mentioned.

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04 Nov 2014 10:36:13
Long time since iv wrote on here.

With regards to our current CB dilemma there is only one name that stands out for me and I am supprised he is not mentioned more, SHAWCROSS !!
let me go throught this.
1) Already has ties with the club
2) Premier League experience
3) He is a natural leader, which we need, been stokes captain from a young age
4) Price tag shouldn't be to high
5) looking to break into England squad and as much as I hate to admit it may have to move from stoke to get in roys eye line
6) Although would be brilliant now he would also not block the progression of the likes of Jones blackett Keane mcnair and Thorpe
7) A no s#@t defender whom will not be bullied

He is the stand out for me

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A penalty waiting to happen and fairly reckless. No pace. That's why he shouldn't come in.

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He has been holding defenders in the box for years and finally has been found out now.

His every move will now be scrutinized even more than before. Do we really need a defenders against whom the Refs are baised negatively?

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04 Nov 2014 12:06:21
No he's a dirty player.

To be honest I don't fancy most of the quick fix options touted on here like him and vlaar.

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I don't mind him being a bit dirty, so what if he gives away an occasional penalty, we give them away now with a bunch of pansies playing? My major concern with Shawcross is his footballing ability, we are going to want to play from the back, he isn't very good at this and it's just a small upgrade on Smalling/Jones at the moment. Although he is English and the benefits you mention are intriguing, I think we need to be signing better players, or relying on the youngsters to get games until we can. Another benefit is his aerial threat on set-pieces (like Skrytl), our current CB's do not compete attacking wise, hence we get few goals from our CB's.

Both Rojo and Blind will turn out to be squad players, we don't want to add Shawcross to that list now we are finally getting rid of some of the deadwood. We do need a real man back there though, I think Vlaar will be who LVG goes to short term, fits in with our injury credentials, but will be phased out next season!

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I think you are right beast, Vlaar over Shawcross for me as well, but just as a quick fix. Vlaar has all of shawcross' attributes but isn't as reckless and dirty. More experienced and a better leader imho. Have to say though that i hope a quick fix wouldn't be necessary and that we seal long term deals fix relevant targets.

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mbd              

04 Nov 2014 21:21:45
Beast its not so much him giving away pens but picking up cards as well. I agree also on his (lack) of technical ability.

I have to disagree on vlaar. Based on last season no one even dreamed of mentioning him. Yes he had a moderately good world cup playing in a system we played for a few games. But even as a stop gap I don't think he's good enough.

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04 Nov 2014 09:13:30
Read a reply from ED001 regarding why Liverpool and Arsenal did not go for Gary Medel when they both needed that kind of a player.

Makes me think that are we just going to keep trying for Vidal or Strootman? Are they ever going to come?

Medel is a very good player and a very good price and is kind of a player we are missing in the midfield.

Did we make a mistake by putting all our eggs in Vidal's basket? :=P

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Our biggest mistake was not closing the Kroos deal that was apparently agreed. He would of been brilliant in the middle for us.

I personally think that the Vidal ship has left the harbour and that we either now go for Strootman or preferably Khedira.

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I like Kroos, but he wouldn't be the answer for me. We need energy desperately and/or a tank, Kroos is sluggish, good at recycling the ball, but he needs a lot of movement and offers little defensively or on the counter. We are already far too slow in midfield.

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Khedira is a bit of a headless chicken and I don't think he will improve the team significantly.

Don't think that the Vidal ship has sailed. I would look closely at the Mata, Rvp, Fellaini situations in the summer too and if we can use them to get some top center back or midfielder.

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Medel really isn't a great player, he just had a good World Cup in which he played centre back, he's not great on the ball and is far too hot headed, he's like a poor mans mascherno

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{Ed001's Note - he has been playing great for Chile, in Spain, for Cardiff and now in Italy over a period of years. He is very good on the ball, I have been watching him play for years and been singing his praises all that time. Bielsa made him into a top class player, who gets far less cards than people think these days. Oh and he is a lot better than Mash, he has positional sense for starters.}

Medel is one of those guys that doesn't stand out but does a lot to influence a game. Not a bad player but having moved to Inter so recently I couldn't envisage him moving on.

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04 Nov 2014 16:08:37
Medal for me is the player Liverpool needed most this window, he's so under rated

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04 Nov 2014 09:01:52
NoMidfield, it's The Artist Formerly Known as StevieK here. I was banned after an argument with one of the Eds, but I still read the site occasionally.

I noticed your post about your father passing away, and I contacted the site to be allowed to post. I very rarely agree with you on football matters, mate, but I know what you're going through, and just wanted to let you know I've been thinking of you and your family since I saw your post.

Hope you're as well as can be at this time, and keep your family close around you. Sorry again to hear your news.

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04 Nov 2014 11:33:19
My thoughts are with Nomid at this difficult time also.

Stevie, I wondered where you had gone, are you banned for good? I hope they let you back for good, your input is missed.

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04 Nov 2014 13:47:16
I think so, mate. I've still been keeping an eye on the site, and frequently cursing under my breath :)

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04 Nov 2014 15:06:28
Not at me I hope ;)

Well I don't remember what your argument was with an Ed but I hope you are forgiven soon enough.

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04 Nov 2014 17:43:25
Dnt bans just last a week or so?

Anyways I hope your good stevie mate I'm sure u will be allowed (lol) back soon.

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04 Nov 2014 20:54:37
Sorry, didn't read GDS's post properly. Thought he was asking if I was allowed on again. It would appear so.

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Streviek. Many thanks for your kind message. It is a very difficult and sad time. But my dad was always positive and wanted all to be happy around him. So that's what we're doing during the funeral on Saturday.
Whatever the ban was for, I hope the ed's can find it within to allow you to come back. We need all the United family on here and we all want our team to win.
Many thanks again and good luck to the Reds for the rest of the season.

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05 Nov 2014 00:00:08
Chris, how's the wee man, by the way? All good, I hope?

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05 Nov 2014 07:47:29
No bother, NM. Just get through the funeral on Saturday, then take it from there. It's not easy, obviously, but you sound like a family man, and I found it helped enormously having a close-knit family around. Good luck to you, mate.

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04 Nov 2014 05:18:01
Ammunition here for The Beast http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2818611/Manchester-United-damning-statistics-records-broken-Louis-van-Gaal-make-stuttering-start-new-era.html

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Thanks Ginja - doesn't make for pleasant reading when they are all lined up like that. It hasn't even gone into the indecision being witnessed which is my major bug bear.

I'm just hoping Palace get a hammering and it gets us going again, after all they have a dinosaur in charge in Warnock and LVG knows how to out smart those guys for sure, just like he did Arry at QPR.

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04 Nov 2014 02:54:54
Its no secret we need defenders and a Leader at the back. So let's Imagine we can have who we want apart from players in the EPL. Which 2 players would you choose to sort out our Defence.

obviously Mat Hummels would be Nr1 so he is at the top of my list.

Would you change or add to my list?

MATS HUMMELS
DIEGO GODIN
MANGALA
NEVEN SUBOTIĆ
BENEDIKT HOWEDES
HOLGER BADSTUBER
LUKASZ PISZCZEK - RB player
MAREK SUCHÝ.
JEROME BOATENG
YEVGENI MAKEYEV
SALVATORE BOCCHETTI

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04 Nov 2014 06:17:27
Sorry to be a pain redevilfan, but Mangala is an EPL player playing for city.

I would add chiellini, garray, varane or thiago silva, Antonio rudiger.

A very obvious list I know, but we need proven quality to get some stability back in our defence.

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04 Nov 2014 07:11:04
Godin & Hummels for me would sort out our defence a lot

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I personally prefer Eastern European and German defenders as they seem to be a bit stronger and harder wearing like Vidic. What we need is our next Vidic.

I don't think Hummels is attainable, not until we are back in the CL. For value for money I would take Howedes who reports suggest we can get for £14 million which is an absolute steal. I also think Subotic is worth a move too but realistically we will only get one.

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04 Nov 2014 13:29:39
Hummel's Dede and van dijk for me to swap with Jones Evans and smalling.
With McNair and Blackett as 5 defenders when we are in champions league and all other competition.

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04 Nov 2014 01:14:35
Did anyone watch Monday Night Football? If so, what did you think about Gary Nevilles assessment of RVP?

For those that missed it. Yes he needs to do more, however in his defense his runs are by and large the same but the vision to pick him out is not there without Scholes and Carrick.

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04 Nov 2014 07:12:48
Hang on! are trying to tell me rvp is not a washed up has been? Cause I won't have it. 😊

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I didn't see it, but from what you say it surely looks like an indictment on our "playmakers", Rooney & Mata who are meant to be feeding these runs.

I think it is just a matter of perspective, RVP looks knackered after a 10 yard run, I doubt he is as willing a runner as he was when Scholes was playing. Mata & Rooney may not be as creative as many people like to assume as well.

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But Beast; Carrick and scholes sat deeper than mata and rooney.

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mbd              

RVP doesn't look the same player, but I must admit it was enjoyable to see Carrick play on the weekend - he looked so assured and calm. I think we could do with him stepping back into the team to be honest, even if it is at the expense of Blind.

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Yes but we played with wingers then. Mata & Rooney are playing in the hole and the primary objective in that position is to feed the runs of the strikers, link up play and create chances. None of which is happening enough.

I understand what you mean about the deeper role seeing the runs clearer and its not a like for like comparison, but in effect those two are doing the Scholes/Carrick type job now, the formation has changed.

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I have been thinking the exact same things that Neville highlighted about our players not trying to look for Rvp's runs. Blind does not have the passing range of Carrick and I think it will get better once Carrick starts in that position.

In his first season the players were clearly instructed to look for Rvp every time they got the ball and it made a huge difference.

Although I think if fit and anywhere near his previous form, Falcao will offer a lot more than Rvp.

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He's not completely blameless, he's had the chances to score and 2 years ago they would have gone in, he should have 6/7 by now if you look at the chances he's missed

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04 Nov 2014 14:46:40
Would be nice to see Carrick in the holding role alongside energetic midfielders like Fellaini and Herrera. Although having said that Blind has had some fantastic games for us that I think some people have forgotten about already, controlled the midfield in a few games. Just lacks the eye and skill for that killer pass unfortunately.

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I get your point Beast.

Anon you are spot on as well!

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mbd              

Why do people mention Carrick in the same breath as scholes. No where near as creative as scholes.

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