Manchester United Banter Archive October 04 2018

04 Oct 2018 16:23:05
Evening all. We are without a doubt, knee high, wading through a swamp of crap. I've been on Mourinhos side of this civil war since day one. Reasons being, I have patience and I think steady improvement is the way to the top. Trophies in his first year and Champions league qualification. Finished 2nd with 81 points in the league in the second season. I can't see the improvement on the pitch and off it happening this season. Me personally, I wouldn't pull the trigger just yet, but I would completely understand if the club did.

So how did we get here? In my opinion we've gotten here because every single department that directly effects the onfield performances have underperformed.

Whether it's next week, next month or the end of the season. Ultimately Jose will lose his job. His time here will be a failure. A blip in a fantastic career. When he leaves he can point the to the success he's brought to every other club he's managed and blame our club for the reasons why this was a failure. He will have to take the lions share of the blame, but the club also has to carry that burden too.

Every United fan will proclaim us as the biggest club in the world. We all believe it. And there's evidence there to argue the point if such labels matter to you. But I think we can all agree, we don't act like the biggest club in the world.

Our name gets banded about with Madrid, Barcelona, Bayern and Juventus. Giants in the world of football. We can stand shoulder to shoulder with them, but in history alone. Our future doesn't shine as bright as those other clubs because simply, our club lacks ambition.

We got through the worst of the Glazers leveraged buy out because we had the greatest manager of all time leading the charge. Think of the club as a prize fighter, and before each fight, a vampire sucks out half of your blood. We managed to navigate those fights because of Sir Alex.

The club has spent money, there's no doubt about that. But we've always spent it at the wrong time. Sell Ronaldo, go out and buy Valencia. Moyes' first season, buy no one. LvG had players lined up for January and the club pulled the plug. We finish 2nd in the league last year. All our rivals are strengthening. Sorry Jose, no value in the market.

We can't be trailblazers and be the first club with training jersey sponsorships. Tractor sponsorships, noodle partners and everything that gives us the highest turnover in world football and then say "there's no value in the market". We've helped create this monster and now we don't want to feed it.

Our club should be primed to get the best out of a manager like Jose. Give the man what he needs and he wins leagues. Half arse it and you get this crap show we're at now. Everyone is to blame. Manager, players, board and backroom staff. But the facts will show, we failed him as much as he failed us.

We're surrounded by ambitious clubs domestically and absolute sharks in Europe. Does the club have the ambition to get to the top? Or will it be Eddie Howe? A manager grateful for his big opportunity that he takes what he's given?

I'll always be an eternal optimist. But if you guys who have wanted Jose out since day think that a change of manager will change our fortunes, I think you'll be surprised how far the rot has sunk in.

04 Oct 2018 17:05:02
great post.

04 Oct 2018 17:26:21
Great post mumbles.

04 Oct 2018 17:44:20
Brilliant post mumbles.

04 Oct 2018 17:47:03
Brilliant as always Mumbles you had me hanging off every word a perfectly balanced and articulate post mate. I think there are a few of us on here that don't necessarily believe a change of manager will make that much difference. A better brand of football; Maybe? Winning the top trophies; No chance!

I've always felt uneasy, even slightly embarrassed about wanting rid of Mourinho. He's the only true winner at our Club and will rightly go down as one of the greatest managers of the modern era.

I'm not convinced his style is outdated, Simeone's hard working and pragmatic A. Madrid side are often lauded.

Two trophies, league and Fa cup runners up isn't too shabby but we expected so much more. Perhaps that's the problem expectations are not aligned with reality. The clock is ticking and it has been for some time now!

I talk like he's already gone but I don't think many expect him to be still in charge at the start of next season. Football is a funny game and things can change quickly but I think most will agree there is an air of inevitability about it all now!

Time will tell if this was a case of the post Fergi curse striking again or Mourinho really is a dinosaur as some have suggested. Whatever the answer it is still sad to see one of the worlds greatest coaches written off, disrespected, ridiculed and under siege.

04 Oct 2018 17:53:31
a manager that will play attacking football and give the fans value for the money we pay every season,

we pay for our tickets are tv subscription, out internet to stream we buy the kits ETC

what were getting in return is sending us to sleep.

im not asking to win every game. but there is no effort, litrally there is no life in united.

its depressing and the manager is the main reason.

04 Oct 2018 18:44:07
Mumbles that's a fantastic post mate!

04 Oct 2018 18:44:23
Mumbles, your posts are great but I disagree with this one, it’s a selective view of Jose’s time here. It ignore all the players he has bought, all the bizarre selecti No, the constant sniping at players, the moods, the whinging. Whatever else is wrong with our club, the Manager should be getting more out of these players than he is. Wherever he goes, he will struggle.

04 Oct 2018 18:50:45
Great post mumbles.

Really good point about our finances being at the top but ambition well below.

Most on here agree with the need for a DoF and this is something that Woodward has known about for over 2 years but still nothing has happened.

They wouldn’t wait that long to sign a sponsorship deal for anything.

04 Oct 2018 18:54:51
Phenomenal post mumbles.

04 Oct 2018 19:15:15
AJH. He picks fights at all his clubs. Maybe that's why he prefers a team littered with senior pros, he knows a bit of tough love isn't going to see them clamp up.

I'm not absolving him of what he's done wrong. He's done plenty wrong, we all know that. My point is that the club should be set up for a Jose type manager to come in and thrive but it's not.

Jose Mourinho sacked by Man Utd is what the headline will say. But the underlying problems will still be here with an unambitious board, only doing the bare minimum to stay competitive within the top 6 and not to push us into that top spot.

Jose will lose his job and will deserve to lose his job. But there would be a few others on the chopping block if I had my way.

04 Oct 2018 19:53:22
I think if the club wanted him gone they probably have the ammo to do it now without too much of a backlash which would suggest it isn't their preferred outcome . The problem being each passing result is going to start causing a twitch in their trigger finger and once yr seriously contemplating it then it's hard to back him with things like forward planning if in the back of yr mind pulling the trigger is even a possibility and results are dictating it must be .
The man has a record to be proud of in football and if he goes he will point to the fact look what happens when I'm backed but on the flip side we all have eyes it duznt look like it's heading in the correct direction to many, and what constitutes being backed splits opinion.

04 Oct 2018 19:54:32
I don’t agree, I think only City have spent more. We have bought badly but there has been no lack of funds. This ‘poor Jose’ narrative is nonsense.

04 Oct 2018 22:34:13
Mumbles, good post, but I'm in agreement with Ajh. Mourinho was superb in his earlier years, but recently, he's been fractious and not as successful as people make out.
Titles in italy came when juve were not at their best and had some political stuff going on. At Madrid, he had a superb team handed to him, yet only won one title 11/ 12. During his last spell at Chelsea, he wom one title, then started the same rubbish we have currently at United and they were 3 points above relegation when they sacked him. Conte, won the league with the same team.
So he's always been second best to Guadiola, and massively underachieved at Madrid. His finest moment was winning the CL with Inter, yet that was done with backs to the wall approach which the Italians love to watch.
I honestly think he's lost the plot, this will be his last big job.

04 Oct 2018 23:16:47
I'm not going for the "poor jose" narrative. He's going to lose his job because we can't beat the weaker teams in the league, he's lost the dressing room and quite frankly doesn't seem like he wants to be here. My point is if we could go back and and swap Jose for Pep. City would have still won the league last year.

Our board aren't serious about challenging at the highest level. We pretend we are.

05 Oct 2018 00:16:54
What a great post Mumbles.

05 Oct 2018 08:44:09
If the Manager can inspire and motivate, and money is spent wisely, then there is no reason why we can’t conpete. Both those things are currently missing.

05 Oct 2018 10:45:33
if we would have gone for pep mumbles how would city have won the title.

they wouldn't have bought the players he has or play the brand of football they play.

the fact is jose has spent a shed load of money and has not improved the standard of football we are playing.

and its only going to get worse. by xmas we will be miles of the top 4 my guess is prob around 12 points and he will be a gonner.




give klopp or pep the job with this team and we would be well up there on all fronts.

the fact is jose is the problem. the players don't want to play for him his style is depressing.

and the fans are starting to voice this. enough is enough its time to change his way of doing things or get rid.

05 Oct 2018 17:13:12
Moneys been spent but its been scattergun. How many purchases have been what managers have wanted and how many have been down to Woodward trying to sign names to impress or push merchandise? Van Gaal was similarly hsmstrung. Which is why we need a director in.

{Ed002's Note - Woodward does not pick the players.}

05 Oct 2018 17:22:08
I think the rot set in last season when we went to Anfield and played for the draw. That for me was the turning point.

05 Oct 2018 19:51:56
None of us really know, Mort.

04 Oct 2018 10:39:07
{Ed's Note - figodasilva has posted a new article entitled, Southampton vs Chelsea 7 October 2018

03 Oct 2018 23:07:03
Question for Ed001 and fellow supporters, something away from all the doom and gloom lol, but did any of you see Lionel Messi tonight? I absolutely love him! How can you be that good, i genuinely cannot get my head around it.

{Ed001's Note - no mate never saw anything other than an after match report.}

04 Oct 2018 07:26:55
He is a phenomenon scholes. Watching him play i find myself asking 'how did he do that'
Great player.

04 Oct 2018 08:56:29
The only player in world football (perhaps ever? ) who picks the ball up on the halfway line and you think, 'oh, this is a chance here. '

04 Oct 2018 10:16:26
Run out of words Ken for him. And how are you feeling now mate? If you manage to find some time, try watching some of the highlights Ed, on another level he is, i'm sure you might have realised he's my absolute favourite player. 😬.

{Ed001's Note - he is a great player but I am not a fan of highlights.}

04 Oct 2018 10:39:19
Too selective for you?

{Ed001's Note - yeah, I like to see how they got themselves into position to receive the ball in the first place. What a player does off the ball is at least as important as what they do on it, imo. Cruyff used to say a player only spends, on average, 3 minutes on the ball in a match, so what they do in the other 87 minutes is what makes the real difference. I agree. The runs off the ball to open up space, the tracking back when the ball is on the other side of the pitch etc etc all make the difference between great players and good players.}

04 Oct 2018 11:15:39
Great post Ed001 fully agree!

{Ed001's Note - I really dislike the advent of highlight reels, it makes players who offer little look like world beaters, while genuine quality like Kante, for instance, get ignored for years after they have become truly world class. Highlights don't show, for example, how the opposition react to Messi when he doesn't have the ball. How he draws players over to him as teams are terrified of giving him time and space and so open up gaps for his team-mates to exploit. That is just as important to Barca as his impact when on the ball imo.}

04 Oct 2018 11:21:12
Great great great player. However, he will always have the 'one team' tag hanging over him. Seems all his snr team achievements are with Barca. Unlucky with Argentina as well.

04 Oct 2018 14:05:11
Bang on Ed001, skills and dribbles on highlights are very deceiving, like Match of the day, one good moment possibly clouding over a poor performance. And as you say, players like Kante go unnoticed, Busquets aswell, do a pointless skill in the middle of the field gets you plaudits nowadays.

{Ed001's Note - Pogba has made a career out of being a highlight here....}

04 Oct 2018 15:02:38
Genuinely the first name that came into mind, him, Shaqiri, Isco, J. Rodriguez aswell.

04 Oct 2018 15:32:03
Messi is a once in a generation player, and we have been lucky to have seen him at is peak. I don't think he has been unlucky for Argentina rather than the side have had a poor attitude. You watch how the Argentina side play when Messi is unavailable, they work their arses off. Yet when Messi is on the pitch its like they think "I don't need to work as hard, Messi will win us the game".

Too often the weakness in the Argentina side is them sitting back waiting for Messi to carry them.