Manchester United Banter Archive February 09 2014

 

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09 Feb 2014 22:25:24
How many people felt the game wasn't over after we went 2 - 1 up?
You just knew that something like this was going to happen.
Every time Fulham attacked ( 3 times ) they looked like scoring.

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I thought it wasnt over, why oh why I never cashed out when I was seriously thinking about it ill never know. < greed

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Same here, I though RVP had a great chance to put it away but went for the chip and missed it. Also don't really understand why Rooney needs to try that silly lob cross in the 93rd minute instead of just keeping possession and recycling the ball.

Just very strange stuff from some of the players and very out of character.

Yesterday must be devastating to any confidence we might have had left and will be interesting to see how we finish this miserable year.

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09 Feb 2014 21:59:50
What a performance from the lads. Our wingers put in 80 odd crosses and totally lit up Fulham's stingy defense for a goal, and against the tallest defender in the entire EPL too! Mertesacker is only 6'6", imagine what Young and co will do to him on Wednesday! Valencia is such a solid right back, always shuts down opponents when he comes on. I mostly admired the boys' concentration towards the end, making sure we only conceded one goal in stoppage time to salvage the draw. Bring on Arsenal lol.

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This is the third time we have dropped points because he has put Valencia at right back. He keeps making the same mistakes over and over

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09 Feb 2014 21:51:46
To get away from all this player bashing I thought I'd post a question. If DM does do the seemingly impossible and get himself sacked before the end of the season who would you want to take over until the summer (no SAF allowed please) and then who would you want after that?

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Maulensteen (when he is sacked), then Klopp.

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{Ed004's Note - One of Bielsa, Heyneckes or ideally Ferguson with Klopp, Conte or Blanc taking over in the summer}

Rene Mulensteen - at least we may learn how to defend!

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Heynecks (spelling) and then klopp, giggs, bruce, Hughes. Basically someone who knows the club and the fans

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No to Ferguson back
No to Bruce, Hughes, Giggs and people who know the club
No to Ferguson deciding who our next manager should be
Yes to somebody with fresh ideas, tactics etc such as Klopp, Simeone, Conte

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Totally agree with you bilko. Fergje should have absolutely zip involvement. For me it has to be klopp! And. Praying DM gets the boot sooner rather than later. Sick of the give him time bull he shouldn't have got the job anyway. Best Scottish manager in the league manages Liverpool.

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Roy Keane with Eric Cantona as assistant :) or failing that Carlos Quieroz

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BeachBum, Liverpool's manager is Irish not Scottish

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BeachBum, Liverpool"s manager is Irish not Scottish

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BeachBum

Are you absolutely sure?

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*hiding in shame* ill re phrase that to best Celt manager I the league before anyone notices. Either way moyes sucks worse than my accent recognition skills and needs his p45 before we struggle with a Europa league spot. We need klopp or someone who would be able to at least attract players and also have tactical knowledge that exceeds the primary school teachers level of moyes.

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09 Feb 2014 21:48:59
@ Betty. Clearly Moyes did not read my posts in the week:-)

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Probably too busy on the training ground practicing crossing lol

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09 Feb 2014 20:47:37
I hope everyone can see how impossible David Moyes's job has been this year. Today he did everything thing right, instructed the team to concede early for extra motivation and set them up for an attacking bombardment of the Fullham goal. The players played well too, them got it down the line and crossed it and crossed it. The crossed it a league record, 82 times, in fact.

Yet, Fullham repelled the ball time after time after time. It was almost as if they knew what our players were going to do before they did themselves. Now I've heard about sneaky tactics but training your squad to mind read is bang out of order. How else would Fullham know that Ashley Young was going to cut onto his right and cross it? Or that Rafael was going to overlap Mata, and cross it? Or that Carrick/Rooney was going to ping it out wide, for a cross?

The FA seriously need to look into this mind reading malarkey because it just isn't fair. David Moyes does everything right, and still only gets a point at home against the worst team in the league! Well done Rene but underhanded psychic tracts are beyond pathetic.

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Brilliant

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Danny, you nearly had me there!
I read the first line, and just for a moment I thought you had crossed over to the "dark side". lol

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It happened under Moyes though not Furgeson. It's not all Moyes fault and today we were unlucky to lose, due to poor errors defensively, but he must take some of the blame for our 8 defeats surely.?

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Thanks Danny spent all season trying to get my head around Moyes complicated and totally modern tactic do you think if we could have managed 83 crosses we would have won or were we just unlucky only managing 82?

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I think we have to give Moyes time to rebuild Acker. We don't have the right players to fit his system. Moyes has said that he wants to make some big signings in the summer, and if we can bring in the likes of Jan Koller and Peter Crouch we'll be in a much better position. If Moyes is allowed bring in the big players he wants, along with Fellaini, we'll start putting those crosses away.

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Fully enjoyed that lol

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Danny

Agree mate. We've been saying all season that our tactics are predictable and one-dimensional but I think yesterday, against the worst team in the league, was surely the concrete proof some posters needed to see.

Why did he sign Mata? We all thought it was because he was going to edge away from the boring, predictable wing-play but instead he's sticking to it.

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RS, to be fair, up until we went 2.1 ahead the game was impossible. Fulham parked the bus big time and we needed luck to get back into it. What I was annoyed with was the fact we tried to defend our 2.1 lead instead of pushing for goal number three. It was more negativity. Moyes barking orders out telling the players to pass it around. With 15 minutes left the last thing we should have been doing is slowing down the clock. We should have continued our attacks and finished the game off. Now people can say it's easy to say that in hindsight, but how many times does this have to keep happening before the manager changes his ways. MU attack attack attack, Moyes defends defends defends. The best form of defence is attack. That is the MU way.

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Syd,

Agree mate. I'm done to be honest. I was in support of him, and criticised the level of players in the squad (which I still stand by) but this group of players are superior to the results and style of play Moyes is producing. We are not the 7th best team in the league, we should be able to compete with the top 4.

How many times do we have to have this conversation? It's now a regular theme after every game-predictable play, one-dimensional, negative once we go ahead, lapses in concentration, players lacking in confidence, manager in lacking in EVERYTHING. Confidence, tactical nous, adaptability, leadership.

Time to call a spade a spade, if he can't rescue the season he should be gone this summer.

Our expectations of him have gone downhill all season, from a title challenge to top 3, to top 4 and now even he seems resigned to battling for a top 7 spot.

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Made my day Danny

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09 Feb 2014 20:07:55
If There is an unluckier manager than DM at the moment then I would love to meet them. I would take exception to one selection today and that is Young in place of Januzaj. Apart from that I thought the team was ok. The issue is that we have forgotten how to defend. Evra still leaves too many gaps when he goes forward, therefore the other defenders are worried about positioning to cover him and forget what they are meant to do. If Fulham defended any deeper we would never have had an offside given against us. But three attacks in the whole match and they score from two! Really poor defending. I am sure when I was young defenders used to mark players??
Sadly the attention will all be on Moyes rather than the players after this. Now that is not to say he is blameless or that I believe that he has not made a lot of mistakes. But on this ocassion to be fair to him it was not his fault.

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GB62 so we now need luck to beat the likes of Fulham (the bottom team) at home we have come a long way under Moyes unfornunately in the wrong way

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I agree completely I would love to see him do well but today was the final straw, i'm not sure who you could get to replace DM if he got the sack but even with the supposed influx of world class players next season(which i'm not sure will even happen) I can't see us being much better

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Instead of buying world class players, why don't we buy some "luck" then we will win every game easy.

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09 Feb 2014 20:00:00
Wasting mata same as kagawa, we sign mata and drop januzaj, then play mata as a winger, what a waste, how many times do you cross a ball till you realise its not working, no plan b, no direction, subs baffling, young and evra were workin well down the left, if arsenal beat us midweek the pressure will mount, how long before the papers merge moyes head with some form of vegetation, this isn't a moyes bashing just honesty.

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09 Feb 2014 19:56:26
I see lads slating the defence on here and rightly so but when you have a Midfield pairing of Carrick and Fletcher than what protection are they getting.
They both look like they are running thru quicksand and if the truth be told they are very very poor.

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09 Feb 2014 19:51:39
Hiya again, just got in from the game & am gutted that once again our management were outwitted by someone not deemed good enough. Rene knew all you have to do is run straight through the middle & our woeful cm will dissappear or back off to give you a clear run at our even worse central defender's ( as I said the other night but was shot down ). Unfortunately Ddg seems to like punching the ball or saving with his feet, for gods sake man catch it or if it's on the floor dive!. There were a few boos at the end but in general most people feel sorry for Moyes, but the sympathy won't last indefinitely & I genuinely hope a few quality signings in the summer can help us turn things around. We need 2 quality centre halves & at least the same in the midfield. This also pains me to say but Pelligrini at city has done a brilliant job so far & they play football that we can only dream of at the moment. He started at the same time as Moyes but looks light years ahead in terms of tactics and motivation. So is it the players or the management team that is at fault for our current plight?. I'm waiting to be shot down again.

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Rene did not outwit us and can say all he wants, he parked the bus. He played with 11 guys inside their 25 yard line for christ sake and prayed they could hold out. We obliged by a lethargic opening, gifting them a goal, chasing the game, poor finishing upfront, and then gifting a second goal.

City actually play very similar to us in a 442 with overlapping halfbacks, who are much better than our halfbacks both defensively and offensively.

The difference is they also have Toure and Fernandinho, who sit in the middle and alternate with one going forward and one holding. They do put a lot of crosses in and play down the wings but the difference is generally that their personnel is much better and their midfield is stellar. Their forward quartet gives them a very nice range of players from big target men to incredible Aguero.

One other big difference is instead of wingers they have guys like Nasri and Silva, who are very skillful attacking mids and can play through the middle if they need to but also pacey enough to go out wide.

Our team by legacy of our play has always had many wingers and not many are good enough to play central and thorough the middle with the exception of Janusaj I would say.

People can criticize the number of crosses we are putting in all they want, but when a team packs the middle of the pitch you need to go wide.

I thought our crossing was quite good yesterday but the issue is our central midfielders have no pace and do not join in when we go forward and tend to sit outside the box and when they go forward we are wide open and any team can run at us. I also think Rooney and RVP are not in good form and lack sharpness at the moment.

Our achilles heel is the fact that for us to get any penetration we have our wingers and halfback up the pitch and that leaves the core, which is the 2 cm and 2 cd exposed. In our case it is one of the weakest areas that needs new players and we are suffering for it.

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09 Feb 2014 19:46:06
Forget the.attack and forget the midfield. A decent team is built from a solid defense. Vidic is leaving, Ferdinand is finished, rafeal is not good enough, evras going( he's been awful for Years). Smalling is not good enough.on the ball and modern and jones is yet to be played in one position consistantly, is he a future DM or CB( very.vulnerable from crosses). Evans is a sound defender but very poor ball distribution. Smalling has time to improve to a United standard CB but moyes has a huge rebuild in defense this summer.

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Maybe but this is not the reason for this year's issues and problems. That reason is spelled MOYES

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Agree mate, Evans, Smalling and Jones (while I like all 3 and they can improve) would get absolutely massacred by a team like Bayern or Barca. It would be an abattoir out there, our defence can't even keep a clean sheet against the worst team in the league who spent 90mins out of 95with 10men in defence.

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09 Feb 2014 18:32:47
Tongue in cheek; let's go win the Champions League. lol

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Funnier things have happened in football.

It would be great if we won the CL and Liverpool missed out on 4th place; although, that said, Liverpool will probably finish in front of Arsenal.

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More chance of a dead horse winning the national TBH

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The only way we might win CL is if we do a Chelsea and bump the manager now

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09 Feb 2014 18:23:03
If any of the EDs are around, With all the players that seem to be sent to move do you think there will be several players bought in the summer.

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{Ed002's Note - Yes, I am sure there will.}

09 Feb 2014 18:00:39
Only themselves to blame. Soon as the second goal was scored, there was no urgency to close the game out with a third goal. Just tried to run down the clock. City keep going like they are always 2.0 down. The top four is no longer achievable. I really hope we don't get the Europa. DDG, what were you doing? Just put it out for a corner. Cannot believe how non-existent Cleverley was. It was like he wasn't even on the pitch ;)

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You can not seriously blame De gea for that ffs.

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If Jose didn't enjoy west hams '19th century' tactics he would have loved playing against Fulham today ;)

I believe a huge issue has come to the fore today which we all knew was existent but didn't know quite how bad it was . The defence. How is it that we concede 3 chances to bottom of the league and they score with 2 of them, it's awful! Nobody else to blame today as nobody expected to be playing that insane set up from Rene. The midfield and forwards did what they could with what little space they could find and they manage to grind a goal ahead with ten minutes on the clock and the defence + de gea (wow) can't cope.

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I blame cleverley and wellbeck syd :) seriously though just in from the game and we should be embarrassed by that, plenty of atmosphere with the singing section in k stand but on the pitch we were flat.we had no plan b we just ran down the same channels all game, there goalie didn't have a save to make till the 40th minute.im not a moyes supporter and I've nothing personally against him but even though we need some quality to start competing with the top teams, if we can't beat the likes of fulham with the players availible then something is seriously wrong.

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Our defence is poor it's was there for all to see today

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Agree Syd. Yet again we go ahead and rest on our laurels. Fulham were knackered, a third was definitely achievable and then we could've taken our foot off the gas.

Thing is, when Bent scored, I didn't even react. I've just kind of come to expect this of us this season. When Vidic leaves, we'd better be replacing him because the rest of our options aren't going to keep more than 5 clean sheets a season between them. Not saying Vidic was flawless today, but still.

Yet more dropped points. Yet another predictable performance. We've got some amazingly creative players, I just cannot see what sticking to traditional wing-play is achieving when we could be playing a fluid, interchangeable trio behind the front man.

Speechless.

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Ur blaming de Gea? Seriously? Absolutely vidic's fault for both goals, defending like a Sunday league player all running after the same ball.
Shame on you Sydney, and I always thought u spoke sense

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Gagus, I am not blaming him for the game, but it was harder for him to palm it to Bent than it was for him to tip it for a corner. Sometimes it's best to be safe than sorry. I think we need write this season off as a bedding in period for Moyes and look to build for next season. I would like to see some youth players get a run out.

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I am not blaming DDG for the game or 100% for the goal, but I do think he should have done better. Like I said it's harder to palm it out than it is to tip it out for a corner.

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I think we'll finish exactly where we are. We don't have what takes to win when it really matters. When the other drop points we can't even beat the might Fulham at home. Tough luck. This season is over now.

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Bedding in period. FFS! I can't even be bothered with a pithy reply to that.

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Agreed unitedred.

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It's ridiculous, if he's good enough for the United job he shouldn't need a bedding in period

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Big Mac, I agree, I still don't believe personnel is the real issue this season. I do think there is more to all of this. All season the players have struggled. I don't think we would have struggled under SAF, but we were certainly getting worse under SAF. It's a real shame SAF isn't 20 years younger and he isn't building this new MU.

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DDG saved a difficult shot from 8 yards out which was well struck so are we really going to blame the goalie for that?

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09 Feb 2014 17:01:18
Likely to finish 7th, 38million spent on mata, no champions league, an abismal style of play and a manager that regresses players ability. Manchester united have huge revenues to.which the glazers have cleaned( debt) and filled up their pockets. 100million to spend, not a chance will moyes( who will be there next season) be given 100million without player sales involved and needed. Interesting summer for united

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Finally DM took some chances and it worked. score one more please. don't try to safe it in.

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It was all 1 way traffic Al, they parked the bus and hit on the break, it isn't easy to score with the outfield on the goaline.

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Once again we don't kill off the game and just drop deep to save the points. with Valencia at rb and rooney at ms we can't stop trying

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Fulham brought a DOUBLE decker to Old Trafford . to get their FIRST league point since 1st Jan 2014 Tactics :-DDDDDDDDDD

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09 Feb 2014 16:59:44
It's time for the most ardent United fan to admit we are dreadful with no idea of how to create chances and break teams down! Let's get it straight Fulham are the worst team in the league and playing a perfect game here!
Apart from De Gea, Jones, Adnan, Mata, Rooney and RVP we need new players for everyone else! I wouldn't be surprised if Roo and RVP left either. Our midfield is so poor Rooney and mata dropping deep, it's just too poor! No tempo, no creativity. Only so long you can say 'give him time' he's had 2 windows, it's a title winning squad, I don't see any of the other top teams who are in 'transition' as bad as us. The glazers patience isn't limitless and would you trust Moyes and Woodward with £100m+?

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That's because Chelsea and City are getting enough funds to buy in top players each time with attractive employee package. Beside, they aren't teams with "iconic" manager in the past anyway. Take a look at Liverpool. They have gone through tough time. If Wenger retires, I bet you Arsenal will go through tough time too. So comparing with those clubs is just wrong. But I do agree DM is a bad choice.

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09 Feb 2014 16:53:18
Losing to Fulham at OT. Surprised? No, not really.

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09 Feb 2014 16:51:26
Let the bashing begin!

Played well just can't score.
I don't get the Mata tactic though, it seems he did it earlier in the season with Kagawa and left the left wing open, now the exact same is happening down the right.

Still think we will win this, its only a mata of time before we score.

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09 Feb 2014 16:50:15
Nothing but get it wide and lump it into the box, total caveman tactics .
Mata is going to end up as wasted as Kagawa has been.

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There are 20 people in the box, the only place there is any space is out wide.
I have never seen a team defend the box with so many people.

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Maybe we need Peter Crouch then. let's get him, Drogba, Carroll and maybe we'll be able to beat any team.

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09 Feb 2014 16:49:07
I know, let's try crossing it. Only half time but FFS!

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09 Feb 2014 16:49:01
Well we are 1-0 at home to Fulham and the first half is almost over. If we can't beat the bottom side in the Premiership what hope for Notes in retaining his job. There is still a second half to go and we can win the game. Come on UTD.

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09 Feb 2014 16:46:42
Well! Story of the season.

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09 Feb 2014 16:17:38
First time to post on here, love the site and think the editors do a great job.

Does anyone have any further news on Rooney's contract? Would be a thought summer if we lost Rooney as well as vidic.

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09 Feb 2014 15:39:42
Is Moyes playing mata on the right wing?
Why does he feel he cannot play a more consistent team

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MUTV has it as 4231, but it seems pundits on sly seem to think he's on right wing and will drift so the right will have problems.

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He's playing quite a free role

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The style of attack Moyes promotes is really predictable. Get it out wide and cross it in, maybe hope for a knockdown. It works if you are West Ham or Stoke but not for what was until recently, a top club. More guile and creativity is needed or United have no chance of even making top six.

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Stamford, it's two rows of five. Fulham are parking the bus. If you cast your mind back to the West Ham game the other day, then you will know what I mean. When the ball is pinging around in the six yard box, we just got to hope it falls to a MU player, so far it hasn't.

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09 Feb 2014 15:38:27
The line-up I expected. Nice to see how Tunnicliffe gets on in midfield.

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He will probably have a blinder and everyone will be screaming about why we sold him.

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Well now I know why we sold him.

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09 Feb 2014 15:27:42
Reading the wish lists for next season I think we need to bear in mind you can't simply change 6 of your 1st team and expect it to work. I'm with Ed on this one, this is going to take 18 months. There is no miracle quick fix to our problems.

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AJH

Agreed but the minimum would be a LB and 2 Midfielders and CB. I can live with the rest of them even the wingers if we have to for another season.

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The majority of the work should be done this summer.

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09 Feb 2014 15:21:20
Team announced, Young starts again in place of Januzaj. It's a small complaint I know, but it irks me that one goal seems to erase a series of poor performances and gives the guy a 'fresh start'.

It's this kind of attitude that's kept guys like Nani, Anderson and Young around. One good performance in 10 games and it's a new start for them. then another series of poor showings.

Anyway, 3-1 to us I hope!

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Hmm really lethargic and suddenly everything is down the last side and nothing from the right hand side.

As I write this Fulham have just scored. Hmm The plot thickens :)
Fletcher off the christmas list after that one.

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Well 45 minutes to score 3 or pack it in for the season. Lot's of possession but the strikers are never in the right place or a step late. To be fair he final ball has been pretty good but nothing to show for.

Fulham playing a new formation 1-6-4 but can not hold out for 45 minutes and once we get one the rest will come.

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09 Feb 2014 15:18:48
We break our transfer record for Mata, who the last 2 games has essentially replaced Adnan. What did Young do to warrant another start and what has Adnan done not to start 3 consecutive games? Why can't we start our best players? Also, Mata on the wing is such a waste. Would rather see RVP up front with Adnan-Mata and Rooney. Will we eve see our best players on the pitch together?

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09 Feb 2014 15:18:18
Why does moyes constantly start Young?
What's he playing at

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09 Feb 2014 15:13:05
Starting lineup

De Gea, Rafael, Smalling, Vidic, Evra; Mata, Carrick, Fletcher, Young; Rooney, van Persie.
Bench: Lindegaard, Ferdinand, Giggs, Valencia, Kagawa, Januzaj, Hernandez.

I had valencia instead of young but looks like Mata playing on the right in 4231 or could be 442 pr 4411 depending on how you look at it :)

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{Ed004's Note - Was hoping for Kagawa or Januzaj ahead of young tbh}

09 Feb 2014 15:10:59
Was just reading and probably not very likely but would you swap Van Persir for Cavani?

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Definitely, if RVP wants to leave. Otherwise, no chance.

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09 Feb 2014 15:08:09
So 4-4-2 again, I really do despair at some of Moyes line ups. let's hope it works out more like 4-2-3-1.

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09 Feb 2014 14:48:43
You know we have hit rock bottom when a player like oxlade chamberlain is mouting off about setting things right quickly against us on Wednesday.

I hope every one at the club reads what he said and we give them a stuffing so next time these guys who have achieved zero shut their mouth when Manchester United are coming.

C'mon lad let get 3 in row and host City at home.

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I can't see any problem with what he said. He said they had a bad defeat and they need to get back on track by winning on Wednesday. He didn't say that it would be an easy game or that they expect to win, he just said that they have a great opportunity to set things right.

What was he supposed to say? We lost badly and we just hope we don't lose as badly on Wednesday?

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09 Feb 2014 14:30:37
With Vidic confirming he is leaving in the summer, I was just wondering can anyone think of anyone who would be a like-for-like replacement?

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Benatia or Schar from Basel are both a good shout. Both better with the ball than Vidic and both tough as nails.

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Like for like? Has to be Kyriakos Papadopoulos from Schalke. Just as scary, just as intimidating, and just as injury prone

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09 Feb 2014 13:12:44
hi ed002, with vidic leaving and with garay not being purchased I was thinking of cb options. I may be wrong but I recall utd having an interest in the brazillian cb dede. I was wondering if interest remained or if his recent move put an end to any interest. thanks

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{Ed002's Note - There remains some interest from elsewhere, but not MU.}

09 Feb 2014 12:31:46
Hi eds if the papers are to be believed moyes will be handed a kitty of 100 million to spend. Do u think its true and if that will be enough to overhaul this squad?

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{Ed002's Note - The squad will be rebuilt over 18 months.}

09 Feb 2014 10:54:08
Interesting reading Moyes's comments about Phil Jones. Basically says that he is a useful defensive midfielder for us at the moment (probably due to a lack of alternatives), but sees his long term future at centre back. That may seem obvious to many, but it is good to hear it from the manager. The sooner Jones is played there, the sooner he can settle in and develop into the really top class defender I think he will become.
Moyes also recons Jones and Smalling will become the regular centre back pairing for England, perhaps giving us some insight into his long term plans for United.

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I don't see the love affair folk have with Smalling. I think Jones is class and if allowed to concentrate on centre half only will blossom into a real class defender. Can't say that of Smalling. He's a squad player at best and why we haven't been in for, in order of preference, Mangala, Zouma or Garay as a long term partner for Jones is yet another mystery.

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Three aspects really worry me about jones.

1) he is prone to injury ( has he had a single injury free season yet? The same could be asked about smalling).

2) his awful positioning. Probably in part due to his lack of playing time in 1 set position.

3) he is prone to lapses in concentration. Again probably not helped by not playing regularly in one position.

My view is we need another cb. A powerful no frills cb who will stick his head anywhere. Preferably with a little pace. Basically a young vidic. No idea who.

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I think smalling can be class we need to buy 1 centre half true but if smalling and jones in there right posistions saving us millions I would buy 3 fullbacks 1 centre half 2 midfieldes and then youse are youngsters and we will be back next season this doom and gloom aboat moyes is not the united way get behind him and good things will happen

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Smalling is a decent option at the back. He might be more imposing than Evans and Jones, especially from headers, he's not as talented as either.

Jones is a top call battler. A Vidic type defender, all action, he can tackle, head and dominate opponents. He's quick to react to danger and despite his lack of experience at the back, he's the most likely out of all our defenders to make a real name for himself.

Evans is the most gifted on the ball. He's 2 footed, technically sound, and very talented, perhaps the most talented of the trio. But if someone was to tell me Evans has ADHD, I would not be surprised. Despite the fact that he can read the game quite well, his lapses in concentration can be shocking at times. And yet, he is our best defender.

Smalling is not as talented or as good as either of them, and I don't see him as a first choice central defender for a big team.

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Huggy, don't you think Jones is a powerful no frills centre back. And he will certainly get stuck in. Infact, that has been the reason for most of his injuries. That is something he will learn with experience, when to commit himself and when not to. Some of our greatest leaders on the pitch have been the same eg Robson and Keane.

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Totally agree mate. Jones, Evans and Smalling are too error-prone and nervy to win us trophies on their own. All are good but we need world-class, we need Vidic of 3 years ago. I saw us linked to Semih Kaya of Galatasaray and checked out some video of him. on the fence really, he's a good age, has top-level experience and is a real no-frills bruiser of a CB. Reminded me of Vidic in many aspects. More importantly, he's affordable unlike your Mangalas and Hummels. Not saying he's our answer but there are guys out there who, with the three we have and Michael Keane, would give us a solid set of options at CB.

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All three are like china and spend more time injured than they play. I cannot see how we can go in to next year depending on them especially since we use them as backups for right back when rafael is out.

I think we need a top CB and maybe the young lad keane as a minimum.

Jones out of the 3 is clearly the best and will get better as he gets older. For a CB he is baby and like good wine will mature with age :)

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The 2 of Smalling and Jones reminds me of what Rio and Vida would have been like together when they were in there early 20s.
Jones is the Vida type where he goes for anything and sticks his head where he can.
Smalling is more calmer like Rio, he doesn't have the control of the ball like Rio does/did, but he has a lot of time yet to still work on his floor play.

I'd be happy with Smalling, Jones, & Evans our future, with another CB coming in to provide some competition.
Once there's a pairing week in week out we shall see what Jones and Smalling are made of.

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Hi Betty, as I said above I think jones lacks concentration, positional sense and is too injury prone.

If I am being fair, we have not seen enough of him at cb to see if he is the long term solution. It does not change the fact that with vidic and rio potentially going we need an experienced solid dependable cb back there to help them and give them time to develop.

If it had been me buying a cb the summer we signed jones, I would have bought varane. It's a personal view.

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I'm with cgu on this one, too prone to injury and really, Not top quality.

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Huggy, Jones is exactly the player you yearn for? He is a young Vidic who sticks his neck out. Only he is better going forward than Vidic.
Jury is out on Smalling, he seems to split us supporters. I believe he isn't the answer to our Defence at this time. A bit sloppy, but will get better. I'd prefer a Evans/Jones myself.

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Basically, I completely agree wiv Mick after reading further lol. Impeccable view Mick

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If we can keep them fit and playing with confidence Evans and Jones, with Smalling and Keane as back up would work.
The problem is we cannot keep them fit or instill confidence in them so we need to buy at least one CB. Mangala or Hummels would be ideal.

A player we should look at for the future is Lascelles at Forest. Very good young player. He is quick and plays the ball well, and also very dominant in the air.

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Id put Rafael Jones Evans and new left back as our defense for many years Jones as captain

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Patzi, please read all my posts above. As I said I think it is too early to judge jones as a cb. I still think we need an experience no nonsense cb in a similar vein to vidic. This is as well as jones no instead of jones.

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Blood hell God I'm starting to agree with some of the things you are saying. I'm getting worried!

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Evans is better than Smalling and Jones could be much better than both imo. I think we need a top centre back in the summer and for the other 3 to fight it out to partner him (assuming Rio also leaves).
We also need to stop playing Jones and Smalling out of position - centre back, sub or nowhere.

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09 Feb 2014 10:50:00
Well guys I have to pay respect where its due, Liverpool yesterday for the opening 20 were pretty damn good. I would say that they don't have a better squad than us but showed yesterday when confidence is high and belief in the manager is there you can play good attacking football and get the results.

That is a team commited to their manager and who in return have been given confidence in their ability.

This is what we are lacking. We just don't BELIEVE anymore.

Moving on to today I have to say if Moyes rests any players I will be making the guys round me at OT hearing a full on a-z of swear words.

I know we play Arsenal mid week but before then we need 3 points today or our goose is well and truly cooked! No good us resting Roo and RVP today aiming to get 3 points at Arsenal if we don't nail the points today.

We should be full strength every game and be going for it. let's face it we have nothing to lose and no choice really.

Today will be a good chance to see Moyes intentions not on the pitch but by the team sheet!

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Our Goose was cooked about 6 games in lol. We have to win every game. Period. Are we capable of doing that? Realistic objective answer is absolutely a no. Given we have to win every game and will need to rest key players for Champs League also I just can't see us finishing higher than Everton let alone Liverpool.

Fair play to Rogers he's really galvanised a team who apart from one seriously world class striker look a team of good rather than spectacular players. However Rogers is continuing the very attractive attacking football he had at Swansea.

Believe me it's my worst nightmare to have a resurgent Liverpool back near the Top Table but bottom line is they are better, much better, than what was a Championship winning side only a year ago.

I accept we have an ageing squad with key areas in LB and CM that haven't been addressed for 3years+. But we HAVE to look at the manager as to why those same players are not playing to the levels they have previously.

My personal view is the players look at their trophy haul and look at Moyes and think, as surely most here did when he was appointed, 'how the hell did you get this job'?

I really really want to be absolutely wrong but I will say it loud and clear now: we will win nothing with Moyes in charge.

We need a top level attack-minded manager, ie one who can replace the great manager who graced the role for the previous 27years.

Moyes is not the man. Getting behind him etc won't give him the required talent and man management skills required to succeed at the very top level. I'd like to run a 100 metres in sub 10 seconds. Having 75000 people wish me on to do it though week in week out ain't going to make it happen though is it!

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'We should be full strength every game'

It's a squad game and I'm sure you would be the first to moan if people get injured because they are overplayed. I would take 2 1-0 wins with a couple rested today than 5-0 today and lose to arsenal because the players aren't fit. Rooney and rvp have just come back from injury, if moyes thinks there is any chance of them missing the arsenal game if they play today then expect to see them on the bench.

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Id rest one of rvp and wayne if we had too play mata or kagawa in the hole

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GDS2

Rooney and RVP are not match fit and only way to get there is they have to play 90 minutes. What good are they if you start treating them like mink vases. At this level when a striker is half a step slow because of match fitness, you can look quite ordinary against average defenders.

I am hoping we see both complete 90 minutes today and ready for Wednesday.

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Whatever formation will do today as long as we win with some ease.

I believe Fletcher, Carrick, RVP Mata, Rooney will start. That leaves one position and I have a feeling it might be Valencia on the right which means mata on the left. Rooney hates playing out right or left and will not stay there and will always drift towards the middle.

I hope we don't get any injuries to the back four as that will mean Valencia or Carrick, moving into defense and neither are defenders.

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Id like to see Mata in the hole Kagawa on the left Valencia on the right and Rooney up front with Carrick and Fletcher in midfield a defense of Jones E

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Evans Rafael and Buttner

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09 Feb 2014 09:47:30
Hi Ed IYO Will Rooney Sign A New Contract Thanks An Advance

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{Ed002's Note - I would think so.}

09 Feb 2014 09:26:59
The other day I asked our Ed how long Jagielka had left on his contract due to Vidic/Rio leaving the you lot and how it's a cert Moyes will come sniffing!
Opened the paper this morning to see Coleman is his next target.

Moyes has dismantled a title winning side and will probably end up 7th at best, £200m - Cavani, Koke, Kroos, Draxler, Mangala, IIkay, Gundogan, Shaw, Barkley, Coleman?

I just don't see it myself seeing that all of those players will be playing in Europe next season.

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Dortmund have yet to secure a top 4 finish, with Schalke unlikely to do so at this moment in time.

Coleman will not be in Europe and neither will Shaw, but all these players will either be playing for or joining a Cl team. Gundogan is probably the exception since not many top teams would risk buying a player who's been out with a serious injury for a year, unless they're quite desperate, which we are now.

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{Ed002's Note - Gundogan is one of three players Real Madrid are looking to buy in the summer.}

Ed002

If Madrid are in for another rMidfielder who is leaving or maybe Available, and where do you think Gundogan will end up :)

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{Ed002's Note - If you want to ask about Real Madrid players, try the Real Madrid page.}

Contentious I know, but I would like to see RVP and Nani and some cash being used to secure Vidal, cavanni filling the gap. Ricardo Rodriguez at lb, mangala or benatia at cb and maybe Herrera in as carricks long term replacement.

I would love shaw, but he will be going to Chelsea. Do we need a straight midfield destroyer? Matudi? Carvalho? Not sure.

If Rooney stays I think kagawa needs to go? Swap deal with reuse. Chicharito also needs regular football. I love him, but he needs first team football. Give henriquez and Keane a chance to fill the void.

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Well that's never a good sign.

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RVP has 2 goals in less that 2 games since his return, he is a clinical finisher 1 that hardly misses when he's has a goalscoring chance, there is noway we should be wanting to show him the exit without him wanting to.

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FZZ, I agree that RVP has a frightening goals to game ratio, but he also has a pretty awful injury record (taking his career as a whole) and his age is against him. Our team is desperate for a player like Vidal.

I am suggesting that we sacrifice one quality player for another, but only if we can secure another world class forward.

It is worth bearing in mind if you can get world class midfielders in and a decent defence, you can challenge for the league with average strikers. Look at arsenal and Chelsea.

I would not want giroud, ba or Torres in our team, but I would like their league position.

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09 Feb 2014 08:28:35
Okay, I think today's game will be a very, very good indication of how Moyes will be tactically guiding us for the rest of the season, if not his reign.

Do we set up according to the opposition's weaknesses, or to our own?

I don't see both Rooney and Van Persie starting with both of them being out for a while, and he might opt to rest one of them for the Arsenal game.

But who should play behind them?

Now Fullham are best equipped in the defensive midfield position, and struggle against pacy wingers.

Our wingers are horrible, and our best players are attacking midfielders. Should we go with Fullham's weaknesses or to our strengths?

That shows how much Moyes is adventurous, and trusts our strengths. If he is so, I see Kagawa, Mata and januzaj behind Rooney, in an interchangeable front 3, running riot in the center.

If he prefers to set us up according to their weaknesses, and not our own strengths, it shows a certain tactical capability, but at the same time his lack of trust in his players, which is never a good sign. I understand setting us up a certain way against the big teams, but we should be playing to our strengths against the smaller teams, no disrespect to Fullham.

Therefore, if we do end up playing with Young and Valencia, that means he's playing a system set up to take advantage of Fullham's lack of pace, and not our own, obviously creative players.

What front 4 would you play?

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Good post Mick. Interesting to see what he does. His comments of "We would take any win, ” Our form at Old Trafford hasn't given us that [right]." Now that doesn't give us a lot of hope!
We are talking about playing Fulham not barca for gods sake Moyes. What sort of message does that set out to our players? Even more so, we are telling the opposition that we are desperate and any win will do, instead of saying I have every confidence in my team to get a very convincing result.
Why does he come out with such crap comments?

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I've been saying, since we bought Mata, I want to see Janu on the left Mata in the middle and Rooney on the right behind RVP. It suits our team plays our best (most creative players ) at once. Those 3 could interchange go wide or cut in its very flexible. I'd like to see 4321 with Jones and Fletcher in mid but 4141 works too with Fletcher in mid and add Valencia to the 3.

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Er that's 4231 my bad.

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Top shout Grund. Moyes can't majestic the same mistake with Mata that he has with Kagawa. Mata is a better player thru the middle, Rooney can adapt to the right.

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Top shout Mick that would give us a fluid, mobile and potent attack against a week defensive unit and would almost guarantee goals .Im not sure that's how we will go I still expect to see Young or Valencia if not Both :(

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08 Feb 2014 23:29:33
Ed002. just wondering, if you get a chance over the next few days, could you do a follow up to your excellent post before the window opened of Manchester United's transfer targets? I.e whether interest remains in players mentioned/new players have come on the radar/interest has moved elsewhere. Be great if you're up for writing another piece, I know everyone on here thoroughly enjoyed the previous one! Cheers!

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{Ed002's Note - I will be travelling this coming week - remind me after that.}