20 Nov 2013 10:26:29
Well we've had quite abit of discussion about Dembele on here, but I feel I may have been misunderstood by some over it.

I'm not saying Dembele is the answer to our midfield issues, just that he could be a valuable player for us if we were to mive for him.

The simple fact of the matter is we will have to sign a midfielder in January.

Carrick is out for another 6/8 weeks and there is no garentee that he'll return then or if he does that he'll be ready to play a key role. He is 32 now and an injury such as his at this stage in his career could take longer than expected to fully recover. Remember Vidic took much longer than expected to over come his injury and he is a similar age as Carrick.

Fellaini is delaying an operation but he will need to have it done in January, that will put him out for anything between 6/10 weeks depending on how the opertaion goes and how quickly he recovers from it.

Jones has pulled out of England duty with an injury.

Anderson just seems to have disapeared off the face of the earth, which with his arse is actually quite impressive. But seriously Moyes clearly doesn't rate him at all.

Fletcher is about as likely to return as I am of winning the lottery, and even if a miracle does happen he won't come back the same player as he was back in 2008/09.

That leaves us with midfield options of Cleverley and Giggs. And the scary thing is that its not inconsivable that Carrick and Fellaini will both miss most of what's left of this season.

Which means if we don't sign anyone in january then our midfield options for the rest of the season will most likely consisit of Cleverley, a fat Brazilian, a Forty year old and a young defender playing out of position.

So now it becomes apparent that we NEED a midfielder in January or we will really struggle to keep up with the top teams this year.

But the problem is that the best midfielders in the world won't be available in January as either their club won't be prepared to sell a key player half way through a season, or a player won't be prepared to risk their world cup place by moving in the january before the world cup.

So we are left with having to sign a player who either falls just short of world class or a player of potential but is unlikely to make his national team squad for the world cup. There are very few of the young players available and it would probably be a bad idea to sign a young player then place the pressure of holding our midfield together on them.

So our best option seems to be to sign a player who maybe falls just short of that world class level.

So if not Dembele then who should we sign in January? As with no midfield signing in january then we may fall short of champuons league qualification. And that will seriously effect our abilty to sign a world class midfielder in the summer.

1.) 20 Nov 2013
Fernando from Porto.

2.) 20 Nov 2013
I agree with you there Shappy we do need at least 1 player my only problem with Dembele is what if he couldn't handle being at United, christ he could become as second cleverley and chances of us buying yet another midfielder are then almost zero

3.) 20 Nov 2013
You're spot on, Shappy. This is potentially a likely scenario, if the worst was to happen, which is why midfield reinforcements should have (yet again) been top of our list this summer. We messed about too much, and January isn't a good time to target the CMs we need. I don't expect any midfielders to come in until the summer.

4.) 20 Nov 2013
I agree with all of that, but as I said in my earlier email, it's disappointing to have to recognize that this might not have been an issue at all if the club had not been spending one Ronaldo every year on financing costs!

5.) 20 Nov 2013
I am not interested in paying £20m+ for another Belgian who offers little more than we have already got. I want us to send £30m on a player that will make a difference. Gundogan, Koke or Herrera are players that will make a difference to our side, not sure Dembele will. We shouldn't be buying players who are marginally better than what we already have, we should be buying the best that are available to purchase. There is a reason RM want Gundogan and Barcelona want and Koke. There is also a reason why Barcelona made Herrera the player to replace Cesc if he was sold. These are the types of players we need. Busy, box to box types that will burst forward with the ball. We need an upgrade on Cleverley, not another Fellaini.

6.) 20 Nov 2013
20 Nov 2013 11:45:06
Fernando could be a good option, I just wonder whether he drives forward enough, he likes to sit deep. Our main issue is that midfield is far too static, we need some movement and drive. I think Fernando is just a better version of Fellaini imo.

Dembele is excellent at running with the ball from midfield. And I know people doubt his quality but he regulary gets into the Belgium national team which contains other midfielders such as Witsel, Fellaini and Defour. So he can't be that poor.

7.) 20 Nov 2013
I'm with Syd, let's not waste money. Top class players or don't bother. let's not knee jerk

8.) 20 Nov 2013
20 Nov 2013 12:18:11
The summer has been and gone and its pointless moaning about what we didn't do then. We need to focus on what we can do now. With our current injuries we are actually in worst shape now then we were the day the window slammed shut, and it doesn't loom like its going to improve anytime soon unless we bring in a new player to cover for the long term injuries we have suffered.

Syd I know exactly the level of players we should aim for, but very few if any are available in January Koke and Gundogan definately won't be, Herrera could be but only for 35m. And to he honest he is the poorest of the three and signing Herrera in January will near enough rule out a summer move for one of Gundogan or Koke.

So maybe its best we go for a powerful box to box player in January, as we have no one in our squad like that. That way we can make a move for a player such as Gundogan or Koke in the summer to give us a complete set of midfield options then.

9.) 20 Nov 2013
If we want a unhappy CM from spurs i'd take Sandro

10.) 20 Nov 2013
Shappy, people aren't questioning whether or not Dembele would be a good addition to the squad. What people are questioning is why we would spend upwards of £20m for a good squad player when we could sign a top class guaranteed starter for another £5-10m.

You're talking as if Dembele is a cheap, safe option. He isn't, he is a very pricy squad player. We made this mistake with Young, and I'm not saying that Dembele would flop like Young has, but there is no point paying big for a squad player when we can secure a top class player for slightly more.

11.) 20 Nov 2013
20 Nov 2013 12:42:26
No one wants a knee jerk reaction but we could very well be looking at the scenario that come January that we could be left to deal with most of the rest of the season with just Cleverley, Anderson and Giggs as midfield options. And when you consider that Anderson can't complete 90 mins and Giggs is 40yo then really we will be relying on Cleverley as our only midfielder.

This is as much about having midfield numbers and options as it is about the quality of those we sign. We could have 30-35 games to play with just Anderson Cleverley and Giggs as our midfield options. And bear in mind that two of those three are like to leave/retire in the summer. Which means even if you discount the injuries to Fellaini and Carrick come the summer we are going to have three first team midfielders in Carrick Fellaini and Cleverley of which one of those will be almost 33.

We need 2/3 midfielder come the summer. So why not bring in a quality squad/first team option in January as we can't buy a player of the highest quality in January. That way we at least give ourselves the best chance of having something close to a successful season.

Or of course we could sacrifice this season completely and put our faith in the Glazers to buy at least two world class midfielders in the summer.

Lets live in this little place I like to call the real world.

12.) 20 Nov 2013
20 Nov 2013 12:49:12
Danny, there are no world class 25-30m players available in January. And we NEED a player in january or we can write off the season after christmas.

And there really is no need for Dembele to be that expensive. Spurs want Hernandez, we can just say a straight swop or no deal. With our record of selling players for well below their actual value I wouldn't expect us to get much more than 12-15m for Hernandez if we were to sell him. Even if he is probably worth closer to 18-20m. So a swop deal would be a cheap alternative.

If Spurs want more than 15-18m then there is no point if pursuing it any further.

But the fact of the matter remains we will have to sign someone in January or we will badly suffer this season. And with few options available imo Dembele becomes a real option.

13.) 20 Nov 2013
Syd,

I agree, but what would you propose we do if those top-class midfielders go elsewhere? We CANNOT keep starting season after season with this same midfield - there are other players out there who'd improve our midfield. History tells us that if Madrid or Barca want a player, they get them - I don't see us being able to rival those teams for Gundogan, Koke or whoever else they earmark as one of their future first teamers. So what do we do then?

Give Anderson a new, improved contract?

Persuade Giggs to sign another extension?

We need to act and have a Plan B if and when these targets go elsewhere.

14.) 20 Nov 2013
Herrera is available for that amount. He is a top class midfielder and provides exactly what we lack. So why would we sign Dembele instead of him?

As I've already said if we swap Hernandez we will need to sign a new striker because Hernandez is the only outright striker in our squad aside from RVP. So we would just be swapping one problem for another.

If we need to sign a cm in Jan, then Herrera is the top choice. Dembele is a slightly cheaper option, but he is not a better one.

15.) 20 Nov 2013
I would rather pass on Dembele and keep what we have until the summer. Then look to buy a much better player in the summer. Dembele isn't going to add much to what we already have now and it would be another £25m wasted.

16.) 20 Nov 2013
With regard fellaini I read that their is a two year window for his operation. He won't be absent if that's the case and may even get a chance to settle in the team

17.) 20 Nov 2013
Red Sky, should we have bought Fellaini in the summer for £30m or should we have gone and bought someone like Herrera for an extra few million? Someone we desperately need?

MU need to strike a deal with a top midfielder between now and the summer or wait until the summer. We should not be buying more Fellaini's that will improve the squad, but not the first team.

Anderson out, Herrera in would be a good bit of business. We can try to sign Gundogan and Koke now until the summer, but when they choose to go elsewhere or they turn down MU, then we should sign Herrera.

18.) 20 Nov 2013
Sydney, we need both.

Fellaini is not average. He is a very good, solid player, who needs an energetic playmaker next to him. I think we'll see the best in him when he plays next to Cleverley.

We needed Herrera to replace Cleverley as first choice, and a partnership of Fellaini, Herrera would be great. fellaini would provide the physical element, and would go around mopping up loose balls and stopping attacks in their tracks, while herrera would be allowed to drive forward with the ball, maximizing his effect on the game using his energy and technical ability.

Shappy, we don't need Dembele because if he is to come, it would be to replace Fellaini. He doesn;t have the passing abilities or energy levels to be a play maker. He is too static. A midfield of him and fellaini would be just as static as the one we have at the moment and while he can drive forward, he's not good enough at it to warrant a place just because of it.
All in all, he's too similar to Fellaini for the 2 of them to play together

19.) 20 Nov 2013
Syd,

I think youll find I was one of those baffled by us signing Fellaini instead of Herrera, especially given the price of both.

If we quibbled over a few million when pulling out of the deal for Herrera (when we KNEW his cost the day we contacted his club), what's to stop that happening again? Think how much Gundogan for example, is going to go for - its going to be a bidding war and one we will not win.

I ask you again - what happens if Gundogan, Koke and Herrera go elsewhere? Do we face reality and sign a player off 'list B', if you like, or do we give Anderson and Giggs new contracts and start 2014/15 with the same midfield options?

20.) 20 Nov 2013
Red Sky, what happens if like Oezil, Gundogan becomes available and RM look elsewhere and because we have wasted £25m on Dembele, we no longer have the funds and space in the squad for him? Now we have Fellaini and Dembele and Carrick all fighting it out for one spot, whilst Cleverley is still playing alongside one of them. Dembele is not what we need. So why buy him?

21.) 20 Nov 2013
Red Sky, if you were baffled by the Fellaini signing, then why would you want us to buy Dembele? We need a Herrera type, not another Fellaini type.

22.) 20 Nov 2013
Red Sky, what happens if like Oezil, Gundogan becomes available and RM look elsewhere and because we have wasted £25m on Dembele, we no longer have the funds and space in the squad for him? Now we have Fellaini and Dembele and Carrick all fighting it out for one spot, whilst Cleverley is still playing alongside one of them. Dembele is not what we need. So why buy him?

23.) 20 Nov 2013
Syd,

I'm not particularly bothered about Dembele mate. My point I'm trying to make is, we need to get down off our high-horses with this attitude that only THE VERY BEST, world-class talent will do at OT. because so far, we aren't doing a very good job of attracting these elite players - my point is, we may well need to consider other options than likes of Gundogan, Koke and Herrera.

As if those players do go elsewhere, we either sign someone off a B list or go into yet another season with a weakened midfield with Carrick & Giggs even older.

24.) 20 Nov 2013
Red Sky,
your last post is spot on. We have been spoiled over the last 20 years, and many of our fan have become football snobs. There are LOADS of players out there who would improve our midfield significantly, but we are too good for them according to some of our fans. I almost posted something similar to your car analogy from earlier but couldn't be bothered. Not sure about the Porche bit though, I think some of our fans would go straight to the Bugatti Veyron!
The obsession on here with "world class" is getting silly. I mean, what is world class anyway? In my eyes world class would refer to maybe the best 2 or 3 players in the world in each position. That gives you a very small pool of players to choose from. And as much as I love them, Manchester United are not the only team in the world looking to sign new players.
If only world class is good enough for United then we really are in the rubbish because we need a whole new team.

25.) 21 Nov 2013
Betty Swollocks,

That's my point. Come the summer, we are going to need at least 2 CM players (if we have the money) - so when Gundogan, Koke and Herrera decide Barca, RM are the better option, we have 2 choices.

Look further down the list and strengthen what we have, or go into 2014/15 with an even weaker CM line-up.

I don't see how any fans can justify the latter!