03 Aug 2023 17:42:22
After the charges against Greenwood were dropped, it infuriated me to see fans talking about his actions as if it were just a case of "boys will be boys". Sure, we all did some stupid rubbish when we were younger, but for most people, that does not include allegedly raping somebody (I use the word allegedly here, but we've all heard that recording) . Put simply, I didn't want him anywhere near the club ever again.

Over the past few months though, with all this talk about him potentially returning, I've found my opinion on the matter gradually changing. To be clear, I still think that he's a total scumbag who should be serving time inside and feel absolutely awful for that young woman who's stuck under his thumb. However, I'm no longer sure that cutting him loose is the right thing to do at this point.

The club has a duty of care to young players like Greenwood and, in my opinion, are responsible for making sure that they grow up to be functioning members of society as well as top class professional footballers. To say that they failed at the former would be a bit of an understatement and shoving him out the door would only compound that failure in my eyes.

The club should work with the lad and make sure that measures are taken to ensure that what happened does not happen again; whether that be through enrolling him in anger management classes or assigning him a mentor to keep an eye on what he's getting up to away from the pitch.

As far as I can see, the alternative would be to ship him off abroad, which would likely make the situation even worse. Greenwood would have no incentive to change his coercive and controlling behavior and his missus would be whisked away from her friends and family and become even more reliant on her alleged abuser.

Nothing can change what he did, but the club does have the power to make sure that he never does it again.

1.) 03 Aug 2023
03 Aug 2023 18:08:25
Why start a new thread on the same subject when there is one running just down the page where you could state your opinion? Disjoints the conversation.

2.) 03 Aug 2023
03 Aug 2023 19:04:37
That's a fair post, redseven ?.

3.) 03 Aug 2023
03 Aug 2023 19:46:01
Just want to play devil's advocate here but if you were accused of something but not convicted by the courts, would you be happy at being sacked from your job because of it?

4.) 03 Aug 2023
03 Aug 2023 21:36:33
No easy answer about this topic. First of Greenwood has not been convicted anywhere (except the court of public opinion) . Secondly his girl friend apparently has taken him back. We can't look into their minds and see their true feelings and motivations but as a general principle I would say that everyone deserves a second chance.

Redseven makes some good points. Like him I was appalled by the allegations made against Greenwood. I also agree that the Club have a duty of care to look after young players especially those who come from less privileged backgrounds and who don't have a strong family to keep them grounded.

If the Club feel he is genuinely remorseful and his actions back this up then I would give him a second chance. Be interesting to know if he has been doing any quiet charity work.

5.) 03 Aug 2023
03 Aug 2023 22:13:06
Not sure the club can stop him from ever doing it again. If he did do what is claimed then there is every chance he will reoffend, and sadly probably already has as is often the case in these situations.

What the club can do is duty of care and then ship him out do it does not tarnish us if and when it happens again.

Imagine the fallout if we bring him back in and the pressure of the game makes him reoffend.

Best thing is to move him on, regardless of potential and ability.

6.) 04 Aug 2023
03 Aug 2023 21:57:16
I said it before, I'll say it again, if no one cares, not the law, not her parents, and especially not her, why would any of us care?

I'm not going to do the exact count, but she practically went to bad with him right after the "incident". But here we are, throwing accusations.

We don't know what exactly happened and what was happening behind the scene, so we should simply wait for the club decision and live with it.

7.) 04 Aug 2023
03 Aug 2023 22:00:11
United having a duty of care is hollow. The club covered up Giggs antics, buried new stories for decades which resulted in a man who has no morals and uses and abuses people all because he was an elite footballer. If he was brutal, Fergie would have booted him out of the club.

Greenwood won't be sacked from his job though, he's been paid millions whilst being under police investigation. This whole nonsense about him not getting convicted is such crap. He's not a waiter at your local franchise restaurant or a window cleaner, he has a prestigious job playing football for a club with 100s of millions of people supporting it, many of whom have been abused before and the club that they support will now play a player who said "I'm having sex with you whether you like it or not you tw*t" whilst she's crying saying "No Mason".

I really think you lot need your head examined if you think this guy deserves a new contract and a position in our squad after all that? He makes a week what most people take two years of hard work to earn. Let's not get the violin out for Mason just yet.

Ask any other Ed or go onto any other page and none of their fans would touch him or someone who has done what he's done.

Honestly, people defending him saying he made a mistake. Some mistakes you don't get to make and still keep your multi million pound job and stay in the public eye.

Again I'll say it, if it was your daughter, I would hope you'd have a different view. He should leave the club!

8.) 04 Aug 2023
04 Aug 2023 03:23:48
Mumbles. If it were my daughter I’d do my best to remove her from the situation. Sadly, it appears that her own father would rather have a rich and famous son in law than a happy and healthy daughter, but let’s just imagine for a moment that he had tried his hardest to convince her to escape the situation and she’s flat out refused.

In that situation, if it were your daughter, would you want her shipped off to Italy (or wherever Greenwood ended up getting loaned out to) or to stay in Manchester (or in your case, India, iirc? ) where you could keep an eye on the situation for further signs of abuse and continue in your attempts to help her to see sense?

As for the club having no responsibility nor any kind of ability to prevent him from reoffending, that’s just ridiculous. If he really wants to come back, he’d agree to any conditions the club gave him, whether that be him and his missus going to couples counseling or him laying off the booze, if that’s a contributing factor. Of course, he could still go on to do it again (from what I gather, reoffending rates are pretty high for stuff like this), but I think I’d rather see the club try and fix a situation that they in part may have helped to create than simply wash their hands of it and almost certainly condemn the poor girl to a lifetime of abuse (if he gets fired or shipped out because of her posting those videos, do you not think he’ll end up resenting/ blaming her and eventually taking his anger out on her again? ) .

To be clear, I don’t think Greenwood deserves a second chance. For me, there are some things you just can’t come back from and if she’d opted to leave him it would have been an easy decision to get rid. However. With a woman and innocent kid involved, I think keeping him close would be the best option.

9.) 04 Aug 2023
04 Aug 2023 03:34:20
Despite only joining recently, I've been an observer of this site for around 2 years.

I've seen plenty of tetchiness and bite being displayed by so many of you over the Greenwood case, and with good reason.
I've seen spite.
I've seen insults, some direct, some implied.
I've even seen the odd brutal comment from an Ed.
This microcosm is perfectly representative of society, everybody has an opinion, but some won't be tolerant of an opposing view.
It's a shame, but that's just the real world.

Now step away from the real world.
Here is a young man with the world at his feet, being accused of something heinous.
There's something almost poetic being reflected here - perhaps a Bellerophon/ Pegasus scenario, he may well be his very own allegory.

I don't know the guy, nor do I know his gf or anyone else involved.
I only know the details I've read.
Does that mean I know the truth?
No, and the very same does absolutely apply to all others who have only read the ratified details they've been fed.
He might well be even worse, but further pertinent details might be considered unfit for the public ear.
That said, there may be details to the contrary that haven't been made public - likely not, but possible.

Now, here's where I find things to be a little strange. The Depp vs Heard case in the UK concluded with Depp being ruled to have assaulted Heard in 12 of 14 alleged incidents.
But let's be very clear, that guy is still adored by plenty (women, men and all the soppy little fanboy man-crush plebs), still has his career, still has all the prospects he had before.
Yet, Amber Heard, in part because of the reverse decision over the pond, has pretty much found herself in the bin.
Why is that?
They're both known to be as bad as each other, but the 'Star' gets a pass, weird no?
So please don't anyone tell me that society as a whole takes women's safety as seriously as presumed because, as proven, that notion is absolute garbage.

The football world has plenty with dubious morals.
There are convicted predators playing pro football.
There is/ was a convicted double child killer from reckless driving playing pro football.
Don't give me standards, the football world is reflective of general society - most good, but some not, and some of the some are just dirt.
This is where the second chance suggestion has some foundation.
While Greenwood might not deserve the adulation of fans, certainly not from kids seeking role-models, he does deserve to resume his career.
For an employer, or rather an employment sector to dismiss or barr an individual, there must be something legitimate to work on.
Unfortunately, an allegation is only legitimised by proof and/ or conviction, so by the framework of law he does deserve to resume his career.

I think he'd be wise to resume at another club, but how many British clubs would want to risk the wrath of public opinion?
Would he want to go abroad when he has a young family?
Would he instead prefer to stay at United and try to show the world he isn't dirt?

Will I continue to support the team if Greenwood stays?
Yes, of course I will because my opinion is of little consequence to the real world as it does not qualify as knowledge.

10.) 04 Aug 2023
04 Aug 2023 07:23:10
Mumbles, I often agree with your posts, but not this time.

First of all no one has all the info and knows what happened.

There can be a lot of scenarios which might have happened, but you seem to hang on one which suits your opinion.

Even if it happened as you assumed jt did, why do you care so much? Why do you ask questions like "if it was your daugter"? Is it at all relevant what would you or me do? She has parents and her parents apparently agree with her staying with him and getting married. Why would you then care?

A lot of you here talking about morals and the right thing to do and what not, but if a person chooses to selfdestruct, even if you try to give her advice and help her, why would you care?

Not to mention that there might be a different side of a story. Not saying it happened like this, but what if she is a gold digger and blackmailed him, because he wanted to leave her? What if she cheated on him and he lost it? What if he was going through mental abuse and he lost it? What if they were role playing? What if all did happen and she accepted money to cover it up? What about her morals there? What if, what if.

To me, it is a done deal. I have my own problems to start caring about random famous/ rich people or their spouses. I have zero influence. She choose him. Her parents allowed it. The law doesn't care. Most of fans (United fans) won't care, although you maybe think they do. Opponent fans could try to use it to get an edge, but that is a different story.

11.) 04 Aug 2023
04 Aug 2023 11:35:46
Mumbles, I've made my feelings on him clear before, so no need to cover old ground.

I've worked with victims of DV every day for the last 20 years. Some of the views on here make me want to throw the phone at the wall. I've taken many abusers to court, even when the victim doesn't cooperate, because many times, the victim needs someone else to make the right decision. Abusers have been getting away with it for years, because 'the victim won't make a complaint'. And this can be for a myriad of reasons. These reasons are well documented.

Problem is, there's a high burden of proof to meet, and more often than not, without a complaint, the PPS will drop the charges. They like an open goal, to be honest. Figures and all that. But I still know the guys are abusers, even though they're not legally guilty of anything.

I'm annoyed as well, because, even at my age, I got emotionally invested in the lad. I watch a lot of the youth football and I've saw him come through the ranks, always knowing he was going to be a top player. I had a real sense of pride when he made his debut.

That makes it even more difficult to say I don't want him about the place, but there you go. I have neices and young female cousins. If I turn a blind eye to this just because he kicks a football for my team, or play semantics over the legalese, then I disrespect them.

This started off as a one sentence reply, showing favour for Mumbles' position. Maybe I should have left it at that ?.

12.) 04 Aug 2023
04 Aug 2023 12:22:45
Trololo, it's all good to have different opinions on the matter, I have a line in the sand and for others it's somewhere else. Like in every walk of life, some people have crappy parents.

I don't think he should represent the club and I have my reasons, some think he should. I would assume he will wear a United Jersey again, funnily enough Rashford was dropped for a game for being 45 seconds late for a team meeting, I wonder what the internal punishment is for raping your girlfriend?

13.) 04 Aug 2023
04 Aug 2023 13:39:54
Fair enough Mumbles, I respect that. Perhaps if you look from the other side of that line, the angle would be different. That is my whole point.

Its not just about parents, it is about her as well and her choices. She has other relatives, friends, probably enough people to tell her she is doing a wrong thing. If it is a wrong thing at all. As I said, we know very little about it and it is easy to jump to a conclusion.

Did he rape her? Or he treathen to do so? Or it was role play? Or a joke? I could bang my head and take pictures and blame someone else for doing it, it proves nothing. Perhaps I could find someone with similar voice and create fake audio as well.

My point is we don't know what happened. He wasnt charged, they are now together, married, with a child. We have no say in that. Nor should we. I wouldn't like for someone to decide what is good for me and what is not. I would like to hear advice, but in the end, it is my choice. If its a good one, great for me, if it is not, it is my own bad and I can live with it. You shouldn't really care too much about him or her.