Manchester United Banter Archive September 26 2012

26 Sep 2012 23:48:42
Well that was a breath of fresh air, an interesting and promising performance which hopefully will give the coaching staff something to think about.

I've lost track of the times i've said that we shouldn't play with wingers and wing backs, and that we need someone to play the holding/defensive role in midfield. Then the first time we do it and we play much better, we kept possession better, we dictated the game better, we played some lovely inter-linking passing moves and most importantly we were enjoyable to watch.

Hopefully now we can see that wingers are a bad idea in modern football as they leave you over exposed in the middle and they give away possession too easily. With Valencia and Young injured for the next few weeks and Nani woefully out of form now is the time to adapt our style without come back as we have no wingers to play.

The players who played tonight did a great job imo. Buttner and Vermijl were great going forward and only had one little blip defensively(which on won't hold against him as it was his debut). Wootton did a decent enough job, but it was Keane who showed once he fills out abit that he is a real prospect, he never panic's and reads the game really well.
Our midfield hasn't looked that good in a long time, i think it shows we need a three man midfield, Fletcher did a great job shielding the back four, Cleverley moved the ball around really well and kept possession and linked well with everyone, Anderson was fantastic, he was the driving force, when we needed to push them back and take pressure off us he took the ball forward and put them on the back foot. He took his goal well and his passing and link play was great to watch.
Rooney was great on his come back, he really helped dictate play and his passing was top notch, he was just missing a goal, him and Cleverley seem to have a telepathic ability to just find each other. Welbeck was superb at running the line and creating width when needed, his hold up play was fantastic and he put a shift in tracking back when needed. Hernandez has shown how much he's improved his passing and hold up play which is a joy to see.

So all in all very pleased with all the team, yes we could have been better drilled defensively but this was a make shift back four playing together as a unit for the first time, i also think we could have been abit more clinical infront of goal, but our link up play was very impressive and we looked like we could cut through them at will at times and we kept the ball so well in tight places. Had Hernandez had more luck when he hit the bar and Had Cleverley's first shot creep just inside of the post then we would have had a very comfotable win.

So what can we take from this? Well that we should use these tactics more often and try and mould our team to get the most out of our players.
We have very good wing backs so let use them to their full potential, to do that we need a holding player to sit infront of the midfield and cover the defence and give our midfield a platform to build from. With players like Anderson Cleverley Kagawa Rooney Welbeck and RVP we have players who are clever and can play great linking passing football and can keep possession of the ball. So lets play to our strengths and lets adapt to this new era of football.

If we can do this with the players we have, and maybe add one or two more players in kep positions plus then we have youth players like Johnstone, Vermijl, M.Keane, Blackett, Tunnicliffe, Powell, Lingard, W.Keane and Henriquez plus are even younger crop of lads then the future is looking very bright.

Shappy

Great post mate! Agree with everything you said. Anderson has to play against tottenham. Cleverley and ando seem have a great understanding with each other. Lets just hope SAF can see that!
DDG
Rafa Evans Rio Butt
Clevz Carrick
Ando Rooney Kagawa
RVP
I'd like to see this team against tottenham. On a different note what a great first touch has that boy Powell got!

kdevil10

We were only playing Newcastle Reserves - dont get carried away. That midfield wouldnt cope against a good team

Shappy - agree with an awful lot of what you said.

Point I would make about Nani and Young is that they are not just wingers but can play (esp in Nani's case) across a front 3.

To have a choice of RVP, Rooney, Young, Giggs, Nani, Kagawa, Chico, Toni with all except the more specialised Toni and Chico, able to interchange fairly freely is "mouth-watering".

I know I have referred back before, to the few games, at the beginning of last season when Clevs and Anderson were our midfield and we had Nani, Rooney, Young and Welbeck as a front 4. We were magnificent and that to me was the future, and with the addition of Kagawa and RVP it gets even better. My concern then was if Clevs and Anderson got injured we had no back up (untill Scholes re-signed and Carrick got over his injury) in midfield.

With Fletcher back we can now, against some teams play a midfield of three, with a choice of Fletcher or Carrick in the more holding role with Cleverley and Anderson - or just play those two on their own. I still feel we are light in the midfield however in the (almost certain) event of injuries and we and to look to replacement of Carrick before too long.

Mike

No name

When you say "we" don't you mean "ye"..

Devil Dust.

27 Sep 2012 11:39:17
Umm you mean that midfield that had Cleverley and Anderson who were the midfield who played in the 8-2 demolition of Arsenal, and Fletcher and Anderson are Champions league winners and Cleverley is the most promising midfielder to break through into the first team in over ten years. With the right tactics that midfield could do a good job against any team in the world if they can reach their potential.

Also eight of the Newcastle team are first team regulars, only three of them were youngsters, which is the same number of youngsters we had. But we brought on youngsters where as they brought on first team regulars.

Shappy

26 Sep 2012 23:11:19
From tonights game we learnt how invaluable it is in modern football to play a defensive midfielder..and fletcher played that role superbly. Now to the tottenham game, and no doubt changes will be made..I think we should go for the following:

-------------------lindegaard--------------------
---valencia-----ferdinand-----evans-------buttner--
--------------------carrick----------------------
---------------anderson---cleverley-------------
---------------------kagawa--------------------
--------------rooney-------van persie---------

This formation allows valencia and buttner to get forward.
Carrick can play the fletcher role and screen back four

kagawa will see more of the ball screened by midfield 3
our strongest pairing up front in rvp and rooney

I chose buttner ahead of evra as he will be able to contain lennon on that side of the pitch

I agree with nearly everything you've said put i feel it would be better to play Rafael at RB this weekend seeing as Valencia has his foot in a potective boot due to his injury. lol.

Shappy

Raphael has been superb in recent games and if you had forgotten, scored a superb goal Against Liverpool. And u still want to drop him for Valencia? Who is injured anyway.

I have been and think always will be a sucker for 442, i believe 442 is bred into United - we have tried in the past with the one up front with Scholes in behind and it didnt really work.

Last night we played with no wingers, it worked to an extent although i felt sorry for our young RB as newcastle broke down the left and he had no protection.

With spurs coming at the weekend i don't think we can play like no-name has suggested - you cant give Bale and Lennon time and space to run at Raf and Evra espeically when both like to attack more than defend.

The more i look at it the more i want to see this when everyone is fit

---------DDG/Lin------------
Raf-----Rio-----Evans-----Evra
Fletcher
Valencia---Kagawa -----Nani/Young

---------Rooney---RVP-------------

Either Fletch or Anderson sitting in front of the D not passing the half way line, play Kagawa deeper to pick up and get things going.
RVP in the last few games has been non-existant due to the midfield not producing anything for him, we need to begin to dominate the midfield if we are to get back to the team we know we can be - we have the forwards to put the ball in the net but imo the tactics are hunting RVP, RVP used to play for arsenal as the lone striker but the difference is they can keep the ball and create chances something we are struggling to do at this moment in time.

Summary - 442 :)

Giants14

26 Sep 2012 23:03:22
Always thought Anderson could still turn out to be a really good player, though kept that pretty quiet when I started on this site as I sensed he wasn't overly popular here! :)

Glad to see him play well, and hope he gets a decent run in the team now. Still misplaces the odd pass, but more than makes up for it with his driving energy.

Petty I know, but I also think his attitude, playing the game with a smile on his face, stands in stark contrast to many other players in our team, who walk round with permanent scowls,snarls and petulant pouts - you know who you are :).

It's a refreshing change, and a good example for kids watching - the game is meant to be enjoyed and these players are getting paid a fortune to live their dream. Well done Ando - hope you push on from here.


StevieK

27 Sep 2012 00:39:23
Stevie my Friend

Can we have a little performance review for Wayne the pantomine villain as well? Please Please

Deeps... (Wayne's friend :) .. Hehe

Deeps, he played well mate, credit where credit's due. Hopefully RVP arriving will give him the kick up the backside he needs - he certainly looked more up for it than of late. Maybe he's more relaxed now, knowing there's a proper world-class talent at the club :)

StevieK

ps. hope your earlier post on him wasn't directed at me! I've never wished the guy injured, and never denied he's a very good player. Maybe I'm just being paranoid :)

27 Sep 2012 09:09:30
Stevie

My earlier post was definitely not directed towards you. I am pretty clear as to what you think about Wayne and the precise reason you have a problem with him.

Was just poking a lil bit of fun ;) . And topping up your first post, i hope Ando shifts gears and is a force to reckon with. The speed with which we attack when he collects the ball from the deep is WOW.

Deeps...

Anderson needs to lose some weight and should improve his passing

26 Sep 2012 22:39:33
Petrucci, what does he have to do to get a game?

Carrick, Scholes, Giggs, Anderson, Fletcher, Cleverley & possibly Jones if he's played as DM all obviously ahead of him.

Powell was bought for 4m going on 6m & will jump ahead.
Tunnicliffe & Brady got game time tonight as full backs but I see them as being more center & left midfield in the near future. Lingard was an unused sub & Cole had some minutes this time last season.

He's such a talent great tekkers, superb control, good range of passing short & long plus one he'll of a shot when he let's rip.

Tunners is a fierce tackler, that runs box to box with great energy.

Lingard is like Cleverley a pass & move type player & keeps the ball moving.

Brady also likes a tackle & has a sweet delivery with his right foot.

Powell I've not really worked out yet, but I know it could be curtains for Petrucci.

Petrucci needs a sensible loan & he needs to play well.
Maybe Div1 then Championship like Cleverley then he'll be ready to take Carricks place as he'll be 33 coming on. {Ed004's Note - petrucci was injured tonight mate}

Brady's right foot is more or less for standing on mate.

Caolán.

Interesting, that won't help his cause either.

Do u think he would of jumped ahead of King maybe? Or Lingard?
TJ

Brady's got a great right foot. As can be seen in a few of his goals for hull and his goal for Ireland.

Percy

TJ
Petrucci is ready for premier league action. He is currently our best player outside the first team ( like poweel and lingard ) And yet he has a lot of potential even though hes older than the others but in footballing age he is quite young.

Mick

26 Sep 2012 22:31:34
No matter what happens, it's always Man Utd's fault. It's Man Utd's fault that City lost. It's Man Utd's fault that Liverpool is in the relegation zone. It's Man Utd's fault that other managers like to harrass Mancini. It's Man Utd's fault that Suarez is victimized. Its United fault that Terry Retired from football. They are at fault for everything. Devil of a club I must say.

What does Mancity losing have to do anything with us?

27 Sep 2012 09:14:30
He is just referring to Mancini's petulant rant. He is just being sarcastic.

Deeps...

26 Sep 2012 22:28:18
Cleverley and Anderson have to be the CM pairing! It's so glaringly obvious that they suit the team better than Carrick and Scholes. I'd like to see us line up against Spurs like this:

______De Gea
Rafael_Evans_Rio_Buttner
__Cleverley_Anderson
______Kagawa
__RVP_Rooney_Nani

But obviously we'll get some boring line up.

Percy

RVP would be wasted on the right. If we were to play that front 3 then for me it would be:

Nani_RVP_Rooney

TK-Red

You'll love this Percy mate but i'd take Nani out of that team and play someone as a DM to shield the back four likr Fletcher did tonight, It was that that gave Cleverley and Anderson the freedom to play. If you remember at the start of last season we played Anderson and Cleverley together and they played well going forward but we were left over exposed in the middle.

Shappy

If I remember correctly, while we played that midfield last season we swept literally every team we played aside. Don't use them as an example of a bad midfield pairing, it's just silly.

Percy

We scored alot of goals but we conceded a lot too, i don't think Anderson and Cleverley are a bad midfield pairing i just feel we'd need someone else in their to give them a platform to work from and to cover the defence as by themselves they leave the defence without any cover at times.

Shappy

Both Anderson and Cleverley matured since last year and offer more cover, but also our defence was a shambles at the beginning of last season. Now our defence is pretty solid.

Percy

27 Sep 2012 08:01:50
How have Anderson and Cleverley matured as footballers during a year that they were out injured for? They are about the same as they were last year, very promising but niether of them does the defensive work required in midfield. Last night Fletcher made the most tackles and interceptions he was also always available for a pass so we could keep possession. Having a third man in midfield is vital to us being able to retain possession. We always complain about the number of passes we make back to our defence but if we have someone in midfield shielding the defence then we pass to him instead thus we aren't passing so far backwards and inviting teams on to us. It allows us to press higher up the pitch and makes us more compact.
And we our defence was a shambles as you put it last year due to our injuries, we never had a settled defence. This year we have Vidic out again along with Smalling and Jones plus Rio and Evans have also had spells out injured already and we've only played five league games, so I don't see our defence as any more settled this year. So now as we only have Rio and Evans as our only fit CB's I don't think it a good idea to over expose them thus stretching them to their limit making more likely that they will also get injured.

Shappy

26 Sep 2012 22:16:37
Away to Chelsea is good, if we could manage to beat them early on in the competition it would give us a huge confidence boost and may even take us to the final!

Don't lose hope.

-JakeW

26 Sep 2012 22:15:30
Rooney wasn't a number 10 today he was the playmaking CM. And he was outstanding! If Cleverley doesn't prove up to it (which I dont think he is) then I still say Rooney should play that role, he was Scholesesque today!

Dan

That ball to welbeck was just something else!

Caolán.

26 Sep 2012 22:09:22
Firstly well done to Wootton and Keane especially when Cisse came on and Newcastle put the ball regularly into the box.

What was noticeable was the more youthful spark from younger players but suddenly we played a different style. No flat four across the middle with a switch from side to side relying on a winger to cross the ball but a more fluid approach with no line hugging wingers which gave more control in midfield meaning less pressure on two exposed central midfield players. It meant Anderson and Cleverley had a little less responsibility so could express themselves a little better. Hernandez disappointed me again, his touch isnt what it should be. Rooney looked to have regained his focus and I like the look of Powell.

Let us not go overboard about a tight home odd goal win against a weakened Newcastle team but at least some of our youth got time and maybe that is a message to SAF , youth and a change of style can work.

Red Man

Hernandez touch was poor? What were you watching mate?

Caolán.

26 Sep 2012 21:56:45
Impressive performance from everyone tonight. If I was to write a script it wouldn't be too far off what we have just watched. Three kids at the back against Cisse and Ameobi was daunting, but they were excellent. Four debuts tonight and hopefully we get a decent draw now for the kids. Probably get Chelsea ;)

Sydney!

Looks like your prediction came true re: Chlesea, shame really for the youngsters.

Gav

Well done Syd you jinxed it. Lol

Shappy

Chelsea it is syd

Learch

26 Sep 2012 21:52:52
Everyone was talking about Rooney in a central midfield role (tonight he did play well) but what about Welbeck in the centre of midfield? Possibly in a similar role to Yaya Toure. I mean he's good with the ball at his feet and could make surging runs similar to Yaya.
CRS {Ed004's Note - No don't think it could work. The only forward I could see playing in midfield is Rooney tbh}

Playing one of the best CF's in the world in CM is a no no, maybe when he is older and lost his pace a bit, but for now we need him up front with RVP.

-JakeW {Ed004's Note - I didn't say we should. Just the only one I could see adapting tbh}

I was thinking this. He's strong, fast, good at dribbling, a great winner of the ball and can pass well. If his goal scoring doesn't improve, I think it could suit him well!

Percy

Dembele adapted well from CF to CM

TJ

Sorry, but Wellbeck never looks totally in control of the ball IMO. Likeable local lad, and could carve out a good career at a decent mid-level club, but I just think he's out of his depth at Utd - certainly when you compare him to others in similar positions at the big clubs home and abroad.

StevieK

26 Sep 2012 21:47:46
That's more like it. What I would have liked to see last season really, giving the youth some game time. (Is it true that 9 of the players involved against Crystal Palace have now moved on? I read that somewhere, didn't imagine it could be true...)
Cleverley gets a goal, Fletcher gets much needed game time, and the young defence held firm apart from Cisse's goal (which was a shame cos it would have been nice to see Powell and Tunnicliffe earlier- maybe even Lingard).
Vermijl and Buttner provided good width, with Vermijl in particular putting dangerous crosses in. Chica's all-round game seems to be ever improving.
MOTM is Anderson or Cleverley for me, not just because of their goals but all round play.

A lot of positives tonight.

APC

26 Sep 2012 21:42:41
{Ed004's Note - Loving this formation no joke.}

id like to see a 4321 formation ed.. something like this..

de gea
rafael CB CB buttner
carrick cleverley anderson
kagawa rooney
RVP

JK92 {Ed004's Note - I think in the next window thought we would need 3 midfielders. I think Cleverley, Anderson, Carrick and fletcher should probably be squad players at best. I don't think any would start at Barcelona, Madrid, Bayern and Chelsea etc}

26 Sep 2012 21:39:11
Been good tonight enjoyed it. And some of those youngsters are good. Fletcher has shown what we need in there. Anderson has been good but last 10 or so was goosed so still a little fitness to gain from matches! And surely buttner has to start more games.

Nozzla

26 Sep 2012 21:30:45
I feel when rooney doesnt play we dont look as threatening. A prime example is tonight, as soon as he came off we look less threatening

James

26 Sep 2012 21:21:20
anyone else think keane looks like a young roy when he signed from forest back in 93, the resemblance is uncanny, even down to the haircut

26 Sep 2012 21:01:53
I posted yesterday, that Cleverly and Anderson should be given a chance, that we need some youth and dynamism (is that a word) in the centre. POINT PROVEN

That point was proven at the beginning of last season. It is only injury and fitness that has kept them apart.

TK-Red

26 Sep 2012 21:00:47
Finally cleverly scores! Nice finish!

Caolán.

26 Sep 2012 20:51:21
Lol! That's more like Ando shooting! (I mean row Z beginning of second half ;)

DodgyBanter

26 Sep 2012 20:45:31
Thats the sort of Midfield I like. Defensive midfielder helping the 2 cbs and letting rb and lb to push forward. Beautiful football. If we have to bring sub, hopefully one more goal before 60mins. Bring Tunnicliffe for Fletcher. Powell for Rooney.


Red Samurai

26 Sep 2012 20:41:53
Really happy with the first half, youth has been given a chance and they've done well. We've played some really nice moves and it all looks promising. The formation I think has made a big differance, and Fletcher holding shows how important having someone holding is. Hernandez has really impressed me too, his passing has been good and he's vision has been top notch.

I'd expect Rooney and Anderson to come off, i'd love to see Lingard and Powell come on. Lets hope.we can get a couple of early second half goals so we can bring on a couple more youngsters.

Shappy

Hey Shappy ! Great comment, and in only 6 lines ! :)

Mike

Well it was only half time. lol

Shappy

26 Sep 2012 20:37:07
This has to be best half of football United have played for a while! We are attacking for most of the part with Pace :)

James

26 Sep 2012 20:35:03
Anderson has really impressed me, made good runs and passes! It's such a shame he didn't score his first attempt (Anderson literally scored while I wrote that) Well now that has topped it off! Anderson is showing determination, that is the Anderson we know, if he could stay fit this season he could easily become a regular in the league!

Overall decent game, nice to us do well in the midfield, Newcastle are defending well!

The main difference is that we have no wingers and boy that has helped, the fullbacks are pushing up the pitch and we have more suppliers in the middle of the pitch.

Hope second half is as good!

-JakeW {Ed004's Note - Loving this formation no joke.}

I hope SAF will take this performance into account for the Spurs game.

-JakeW

26 Sep 2012 20:34:57
Always get stick for supporting Anderson, he's shown what he can do this half - good passing, strong, good finish

Also looks like he's lost a lot of weight and could be a very useful player for us this season

=v1

26 Sep 2012 20:31:02
what do we think of anderson now then?

26 Sep 2012 20:29:36
I like Pardew but please will he just shut up bellowing!

Andy S

26 Sep 2012 20:20:59
Just when u think u have seen the worst utd performance today step up this team. Before people bang on about youth all the midfield and attack are established players yet they still struggle to create or retain possession against newcastle reserves. Tom Cleverly is awful what does he do a midfielder that can't hit the target from 10 yards absolute pathetic.

What game are you watching? shahram

What game are you watching troll?

Sydney!

I'd say this post is now void after the end result, sure we weren't strong in the air but a win is a win

What game have you been watching? We played really well, some nice touches and moves and our midfield looked much better. I can see why you didn't leave a name.

Shappy

26 Sep 2012 19:35:19
Delighted with the team line-up! He is giving youth a chance and also Anderson/Cleverly get a chance to show what they can do together.

Fresh!

To be honest dont think wooton or mkeane hav a long term future at the club

26 Sep 2012 19:01:33
Sorry for posting so much tonight but..

Valencia is injured for a few weeks so, this could be the turning point for Nani? Maybe we will see his form return and if so, will it be used for the shopping window or will he earn himself a place in the team?

-JakeW

Hopefullly he plays on the right

Lol turning point all right. more bad football to watch from nani.shahram

Support the player Shahram!

-JakeW

26 Sep 2012 18:54:44
Man Utd starting lineup: De Gea, Vermijl, M Keane, Wootton, Buttner, Fletcher, Cleverley, Anderson, Rooney, Welbeck, Chicharito.
Cant say im not a bit disappointed, really wanted to see the likes of petrucci and lingard but rooney's back.

Mick

Petrucci is injured, Lingard on the bench.

Sydney!

Thats a shame, hope its nothing serious. This guy has been really unlucky with injuries so far.

Mick

26 Sep 2012 18:45:30
Didn't see Petrucci, he could well be injured.

Sydney!

26 Sep 2012 18:24:10
Rooney set to start and Lingard on bench according to Jesse Lingard's dad.

G.A.G.U.S

26 Sep 2012 17:31:47
Really wanna see Powell play in an attacking midfield role for the full 90 tonight. He's impressed me every time I've seen him play, and playing him in his favored position could show us how much potential he has. Anyway it should be a close game, I'm going 2-1 to us.

Viva la Kagawa

26 Sep 2012 16:52:22
Tonight is a night for a mix of youth and players who need game time but can bring experience. I've seen teams with Kagawa, Rio, Evans etc in and I think we would be mad to play them with the games we have coming up. Not just this weekend but over the next month.

Gk De Gea
Lb Buttner
Cb Keane
Cb Carrick
Rb Vermijl
Cm Anderson
Cm Fletcher
Cm Powell
Rw Henriquez
Lw Macheda
Cf Hernandez

Bench
Johnstone, Veseli, Cleverley, Brady, Petrucci, Welbeck, Blackett.

I'd love to see that team plenty of possible future first team players in the squad. It gives Fletcher a game, Anderson game time and options off the bench. Probably won't happen and we will have a few more first team players in there but I'd like it if Fergie put some faith in our current crop of youngsters because they could be brilliant.

Rjmanutd

After being bored sensless watching our 1st 3 home games im hopeing the younger players put a decent show on tonight and play without fear.
johndenton

Carrick is a very important player for us at this time and he's played in basically every game. But other than that you have picked a team that is basically our reserves.

Hoppy

26 Sep 2012 15:59:04
Maybe with Valencia's injury my case for no wingers in a formation could be worth a try...

_____________DDG
Rafael___Ferdy____Evans___Evra
____________Carrick__________
_____Cleverley____Anderson____
____________Kagawa__________
_______Rooney____RVP________

If we do use wingers still then will it be Welbeck on the left and then Nani back on the right?

George

I been wanting to try this formation out for a while, I do think our players need to get used to having a CAM in the team though and actually utilising him to do something with it

26 Sep 2012 15:03:48
Appears Valencia out until 20th october with foot ankle injury according to physioroom
Jones and Young due back then too hopefully

Pardoe

26 Sep 2012 12:21:33
_---------------ddg-------------------
Rafael----wooton-------rio-----buttner
----------cleverly----fletcher----------
-----powell------kagawa------welbeck
---------------hernandez--------------

Rooney for kagawa
Henriquez for Hernandez
Ando for fletcher

I wouldn't mind this tonight

1redarmy

It won't happen mate. We will not risk our only RB (Rafael), one of two fit CB's (Rio) and Kagawa is highly unlikely to play too. With no Rooney who would play in the hole if Kags got injured? Spurs has to be the priority and if we lost any of Rafael, Rio or Kagawa we would be risky three points in the league. I would love to see Rooney play a part, that would give him a chance of starting at the weekend.

Sydney!

I'd be happy with that, but I think Ferdinand and Rafael will be rested.

Hoppy

26 Sep 2012 11:40:57
My line up for today-

DDG
Rafael Carrick Wooton Buttner

Anderson Cleverley

Lingard Powell Welbeck

Hernandez

I'd like to see how ando, clevz and powell work together in mid-field.

kdevil10

I know the League Cup (Carling, Capitol or whatever its called) is used to field some youngsters and i like seeing the lads get the chance- but why put Wooten out beside Carrick?
Evans and Rio are both fit, putting a youngster out against Ba and Cisse with Carrick beside him is just cruel.

Would like too see Powell and Buttner start which i think they will , maybe see Henquiez?

I would also send out nani tonight - warn him to buck up his ideas or he'll be playing more in the league cup than the prem or CL.

Giants14

Giants, what more cruel is putting out Evans and Ferdinand and losing one or both of them for the Spurs game then having to play Carrick in defence.

Do you want us to beat Spurs? Who cares about the Capital One Cup.

Sydney!

Exactly Syd!, We only have two fit cbs at the moment with important games coming up.We can't afford to risk rio and evans in a less important capital one cup game.

kdevil10

Sydney

Of course i want to beat Spurs, that a ridculous statement.
Both Evans and Rio are fit so why not they are professional sportmans at the end of the day - they might get injured then might not although i agree that we shouldn't play them but why put carrick in defence - i hate us playing players out of position, if SAF decides to rest Evans and Rio then put two youngsters in who can actually play the position.

Carrick in D is lost - no idea of positioning, tackling or heading which is not his fault he's a centre midfield player.

I wonder what team fergie will select, if it was a lower league team it might field a few youngsters but Newcastle can do damage so i wonder if he'll put out a better team than some people will be expecting.

Giants14

Giants, I like to see peeps in their own positions too, but Michael Keane is not quite ready and would be destroyed in defence. Wootton is physically ready and due to us only having Evans and Rio fit it would be ridiculous to risk either in the League Cup. What would you prefer Carrick in the defence tonight or in defence at the weekend?

Sydney!

26 Sep 2012 11:30:28
There are many knee jerk responses, not world class, not United standard, wouldn't have played in previous squads.
The bare bones are that Scholes is a genius but cannot play three games on the trot, Powell has been ear-marked for the late running midfielder type and Cleverley has his footballing brain. Keane could not been replicated in one player and neither can Scholes.
Fergie has ignored Evra's defensive liabilities as he has been the most potent attacking force down the left, against Liverpool this became too evident. He should move further forward and let Buttner get acclimmatised in defense.
Rooney is not on the wane, he like Evra has simply had too much responsibility.
One concern is the amount of injuries being picked up in the Autumn, the new medical centre should help.

Evra has been the most potent attacking force down the left?

Really?

How many assists has he chipped in with in the last two seasons? How many goals? Evra is useful as a spare runner down the wing but that does't matter because he can't actually cross the ball. Evra is compotent going forward but certainly not good enough to play on the wing. For most of last season Young was held back because Evra was neglecting his defensive responsibilities. He is a liability and doesn't even have the decency to acknowledge how poorly he has been playing. Evra is not good enough to play at this level anymore. Two seasons of increasingly appalling performances is enough.

Evra's decline has been compounded by Fergie sticking to a system of two attacking full backs without a defnsive anchor in midfield to cover them. How can we possibly develop a more fluid system when our wingers are told to play with one eye on covering the full backs?

Danny Pughnited

DP, I know I read this geezer's post and another of his posts earlier saying Evra has been good defensively. I just ask people to watch a 2007 game with Evra at LB and then tell me he is good defensively. He was a world-class player.

17 assists and 3 goals for an attacking LB in nearly 300 games is pitiful. A goal in every 100 games and 1 assist in every 18 games is dreadful stats. Buttner has got 1 assist and 1 goal in 1 game.

Sydney!

U can't say that Syd, Buttners assist was a shot going wayward n his goal was pretty lucky too, he might go the next 300 games without an assist or goal so I fink ur wrong in what u say, Evra was a world class left bk, he's still good, I hate how people get on his back! He's been loyal and great for us

Big Mac

Mac, I know what you are saying and I am not really focusing on Buttner's stats, but just highlighting that Ev getting from box to box was exceptional, but he has always been poor in the opposition box for scoring and assisting. I didn't mind that as long as he got the ball up to Ronaldo or whoever and as long as he defended well, but now he is struggling with both attacking and defending and cannot understand why he is still playing for us. I fail to see what he has offered the team for the past two and a half seasons. He is loyal, but that is kind of irrelevant.

Sydney!

26 Sep 2012 10:37:40
Tony is injured :( what does fergie gonna do,
last season we had an almost full time premier league equivalent team injured or
is that because of recent bad form of valencia he is made to sit out of the game in the disguise of injury.
why do i feel everything in the world is against us, i am keeping cool about but deep down we need to sort our priorities and work it out.

*Reddy

Don't panic too much. If Valencia really is injured then we can shift Nani out to the right, put Kagawa on the left and Rooney can come back into the middle. Plus Young will be back soon and we have Cleverley who can play advanced aswell as young Powell. We are much better equipped to deal with injuries than last year.

TK-Red

Well said TK-Red ; but i would play Rooney on the left and leave Kagawa in the hole.
With Anderson and Cleverley in mid field.

Even better than we started last season with! :)

Mike

I would be relatively happy with either if I'm honest Mike. The difference in quality in our squad from top to bottom is much smaller this season so aslong as we don't get 15 bad injuries then we should be fine.

TK-Red

26 Sep 2012 09:39:25
this is the team id like to see tonight.

...........de gea/johnstone..........
vermijl....wooton...keane....buttner
......cleverley..fletcher..anderson....
................petrucci/lingard...........
..........welbeck...chica/henriquez....

subs:de gea/johnstone,carrick,tunners,januzaj,macheda.

phil

Powell needs game time
johndenton

Sorry i forgot powell,him in place of petrucci/lingard.

phil

I wouldn't be surprised to see Carrick in defence tonight and Buttner or Fletcher at RB. Or could see Buttner on the LW tonight. Rafael, Evans, Ferdinand & Evra will not be risked. With Valencia injured Nani will not be risked.

____________DDG
Fletch__Carrick__Wootts__Blacks/Brady
___Clevers__Powell__Anders
Welbz_____Hernandez_____Butts

Petrucci / Tunnicliffe / Rooney.

It's a tough one to call tonight.

Sydney!

Why would powell deserve a start over petrucci and/or lingard? Just because he came with 4 million price on his head? Petrucci and lingard were our star performers in the reserve league ( petrucci in particular ) and have been with us for years and deserve their chance ahead of powell.

Mick

Mick,who said he deserves to be ahead of petrucci or lingard?id love to see any of the 3 but realistically its going to be powell after the gaffa sid he'll play a part in the game.

phil

26 Sep 2012 09:07:45
NAME IN 6 FOOT LETTERING ON THE NORTH STAND, STATUE HAS BEEN APPROVED AND IS IN MANUFACTURE
SCHOLES AND GIGGS FINAL SEASON............... This simply has to be all the indications that you need to confirm that SAF is stepping down at the end of this season - 25 years in charge.

Personally, about 5 years too late in my opinion as he has been stale and in decline whilst younger more innovative managers are leaving him looking more and more anachronistic.
The club and squad are unquestionably in a much weaker state than they were 5 years ago with far too many unanswered questions and inexplicable decisions having been taken.
Why have we so many long term injuries ?
Why have we failed so often in Europe ?
Why have we failed to strengthen the midfield ?
Why is Ryan Giggs now considered a CM in big games?
Why does SAF seldom get off the bench during games?
Why have we not got a first choice settled team?
Why do we not know in a game who is penalty taker?
Why do we lose young (real) talent like Pogba?
Why did we buy BEBE for £7m ?
Why are the Glazers "great owners"
Why did we blow a winning position last year?
Why is watching United boring now ?

There is a lot to be concerned about and our current points tally definitely flatters to deceive.

Absolute spot on mate.We are one,we speak the same language.Watching utd bores me now.Its only the fact most of the other teams are poor that we are still near the top

26 Sep 2012 12:23:09
Fantastic post. Since 2007 Fergie has only lifted 4 premierships, 4 community shields, 2 league cups, the champions league & the club world cup. Lets send him before a firing squad & appoint Brendan instead Lol ;)

Red Spark

My word some people are just so stupid. SAF has won 4 league titles, 1 champions league and been in 2 other finals. Yeah he is soooooo past it he should have left 5 years ago.

Aaronaldo7

26 Sep 2012 08:16:34
The Problem with Nani.........

Brought in 07 for 18 mill on the back of Carlos' recommendation. We were told that we have a Ronaldo v2.0 on our hands. The problem with this statement is this.............for 6 or 7 games a season we do have v2.0 but thats it. Other times he is the most inconsistant player that we have in the squad.

Some days, he will run the show. Dribbling, crossing and passing will be world class. He can hit a ball with two feet and his pace can cause defenders nightmares.

Usually, he tries to much with the ball, his crossing is woefull and his set pieces are shocking. He looks like he can never be arsed to get back and when he does its a token gesture.

We also have Ashley Young. Both Nani and Young prefer to play from the left. Don't get me wrong, I am not Youngs biggest fan, I do not think he is a first 11 player but Young will give more defensively and set plays in general are better than Nani's.

I heard Young is on about 80k a week with us. Nani is on more than that now. And he wants more. Why should we pay out for a player that only turns up when he feels like it - over a player that, well, you know what your going to get - cut back inside and a shot/cross.

I'm just fed up with hearing how Nani is world class etc......No he is not. World class players do it week in week out for their team. He is a good player, a squad player. He will never be out on Ronaldo's shadow.

If we can get 25 mill for him, then lets take it. Lets reinvest and get a player who will work his balls off and give us a more regular threat.

Jamesmack8

Jamesmack8

So after saying all that you still reckon some manager somewhere, who knows much more about football than you do, is going to go to his chairman and ask him to pay 25 million pounds to bring him into his squad? Hmm...not sure you completely thought that one through to be honest.

Flimbo

25 Sep 2012 23:23:27
According to the mail (I know), Valencia is injured.

Percy

I wouldn't doubt it mate. The luck we are having with injuries this season it's almost certain to be true. I think Young will be brought back earlier than planned now. Young on the left and Nani on the right. We will need to hope Nani can get through this bad patch. If Valencia is injured I wouldn't be surprised to see Buttner play LW tonight. Just to see how he does there.

Sydney!

25 Sep 2012 23:22:01
This is my predicted team for the game against Newcastle tomorrow night...

-----------------De Gea-------------
M Keane-Carrick-Evans-Buttner

---------Cleverley-Anderson-----

-Nani--------------------------Brady

----------Welbeck-Macheda------

Subs: Johnstone, Wooton, Fletcher, Lingard/Cole, Henriquez, Hernandez

Think it's too early to start Fletcher, especially against a physical side like Newcastle so I reckon he will get 30 minutes... Carrick will play centre half as with Vidic injured and I think he will save Ferdinand tomorrow, can't see him throwing Wooton in. Macheda will get the nod like last year and he has been scoring for the reserves and I think it is the right time to give Brady a game on the left.

RedKnight

Fergie has already said fletcher is going to get 90 mins, and mike keane is a Cb so he will most likely be used in his best position, rafael will probably start at RB. i think henrequez may start with welbeck or chicharito to add pace up front, but hey you might be right :)
mr KENNEDY

Finger on the pulse there RedK - all over the press that Fletcher will start tomorrow - direct quotes from Fergie ;)

25 Sep 2012 23:59:54
After looking at videos of past squads on youtube for a few hours this evening I realised that the current squad is absolutely threadbare in quality with only Rooney, Van Persie, Vidic and Scholes the only players to be proven on the world scene. The general level of performance in the past 12 months have been nothing but bang average to hopelessly poor and even worse in 1 or 2 as well and unbelievably they seem to be getting worse by the week now which is worrying.

People have been arguing and some are only short of claiming that 3 points at Anfield is like winning a cup final when in fact it couldn't be further from the truth as the current Liverpool team are, like us, nowhere near as good as they were 5/6 years ago and we should be going to Anfield and embarassing them rather than allowing players like Jonjo Shelvey to boss us around and nullify our attacks and we would have been walloped if he wasn't sent off unfairly!

Why the hell didn't we sign the players we so obviously needed to upgrade the squad? What's the excuse for playing Evra when he has been habitually awful for the past 2 years? Why is it that in past times SAF would move on the deadwood as soon as they showed signs of a decline in performances yet now we play a 40 year old winger in CM against Liverpool at Anfield?? It can only mean one thing - The management team have gone stale and they are happy with mediocre performances as long as we are in a top 3 position in the league and that might be ok for a season but its becoming evident that fans are unhappy with the ongoing problems with tactics and performances and I hope SAF does something to turn things round as we all know he's going soon and I'm sure the last thing he would like is to be asked to leave rather than retire.

Flimbo

I agree with just about all that. Jred

25 Sep 2012 23:40:21
There's no way you can have 5 injury prone defenders in one team. What's going on? How are we getting these injuries? It has to be something to do with the training they're getting.

G.A.G.U.S

GAGUS

Rio is 34 and Vidic 31 in a few weeks. Rio has suffered back problems which the management have known about for several years and Vidic suffered a major knee injury at an age when recovery becomes more difficult. All through the transfer window we knew that and then Smalling suffered an injury yet we did nothing, the same nothing as in central midfield and replacing Nani. We haven't thought it through.

There again SAF likes experience so Rio and Vidic were probably expected to play until they are 38

Now we have to give Wootton and Keane a game or two but SAF is going with experience all the time so that seems unlikely, more chance of Carrick at the back and the 'like buying a new £20m CM' return of Fletcher.

Red Man

Red Man, at the beginning of the season we had a fully fit Vidic & Ferdinand. Jones & Evans had minor problems and were due back in days and we had Carrick who can play there. I saw no need to buy a CB and I cannot remember you saying we should buy one either. This isn't the manager's or the Glazer's fault, it is just bad luck. CB's in the 80's and 90's played til their mid 30's so with the sports science we have nowadays why can't Vidic and Ferdinand play for longer? Ferdinand was exceptional against Suarez at the weekend. Why would we get rid of a perfectly good CB just because he birth certificate says he's 34? We are looking at Ogbonna who is meant to be a very good player. We also have Evans (23), Smalling (22) & Jones (20) so I wouldn't worry too much about our future. I hear Buttner can play CB too, we have Carrick & Wootton. We will get through this, but lets not blame it on anything but bad luck eh?

Sydney!

Sydney

I did point out in summer the situation with Rios back and the risk with Vidic returning from a major injury. It will be interesting whether any youth players get a chance

Red Man

Red Man, I do remember us chatting about it, but towards the end of the window none of were hoping to see a CB.

We have an issue with CB's in our youth as that is an area we are lacking and have been for sometime. Most are too youth or not physically ready and the only one that is ready is Wootton, but he isn't much cop. I think we will see Wootton and Carrick at the back tonight.

Sydney!

25 Sep 2012 23:07:08
Been a lot of talk of our youngsters playing tomorrow I'd like to compare a few of them to players around the world and see what you all think.
Will keane- ruud van nistelrooy
Tunnicliffe- Roy keane
Petrucci- xabi alonso
Lingard- Iniesta
James Wilson- Ole Solskajer
Daehli- Iniesta
Pereria- A younger Xavi
Janauj- not sure who.
Michael keane- Wes brown for the 08 season.
Powell- Scholes
Henriquez- is he an ole Solskajer or ruud?

Please feel free to comment with your own version and if I have missed anyone( which I probably have) please add in.

Caolán.