29 Sep 2012 17:57:55
This is probably one of the most fragile united lineups I have watched in recent memory. No edge whatsoever out there. Somehow, I see us eking out another 3 points and learning zero from our experience. Results aside, this is unsustainable.
Windy City Red
29 Sep 2012 20:27:14
agree Paulo...been saying this for two years since ronnie left...we have not moved on from losing to barca first time in european final...we have not replaced scholes or giggs.... the qulaity is lacking and formost...fergie must stop being arrogant and change his backroom..what phelan does i have no idea... but things need to change drastically otherwise finishing in top 4 will be a task... i know people will say god its doom and gloom...but look over the past couple of years .."have we improved and have we quality players in place..... answer is NO..either fergie changes his personell or we will struggle ...
stockport red
It's the midfield as someone should be telling fergie. Perhaps mike phelan is trying the midfield he was in. As someone said of him when he was bought, he'd be good if he could pass the ball. Wtf did we not sign Martinez.........it's time fergie tells everyone the truth. When Bryan Robson was finished he was replaced by Roy keane........giggs is finished but is still in the team.....worst still he's in the midfield , a place he would never get near when we had a proper one. As for carrick, he is so ordinary it's unreal and slows the game down all the time.........hope fergie signs a proper midfielder or 2 as we haven't signed a decent one since Roy keane!
Piss poor fact
I agree pal i think this is one of the weakest united teams in years....rio just ant up to standard was evra even playin the first half...carrick was poor giggs is finnished and nani was the same as he is every week cant beat the first man with his crosses or corners....but on the other hand i really thought the second half was like a breath of fresh air....rooney and paul scholes controlled the game and it took the pressure off the back line..scholes really was fantastic and rooney gave vp and kagawa that extra boost that they needed to get into the game....i think carrick played well and last season he done the job but we need real quality that us the supporters AND the players deserve....does any1 understand why fergie started giggs in a big game like this when he hasnt played in weeks...and he had cleverly and anderson on the bench who both scored recently.....it baffles me....cheers
Well, Just been to the game, the most depressing first half I have ever seen. Is someone (anyone) goingto take Giggsy to one side and have a word, don't sully the great memories we have by trying to go for too long. For some 3 seasons now midfield has looked second rate at best. It is fine buying young lads for the future, however, we need a top centre mid player and quickly, and don't anyone dare say "Fletcher is back". Whilst we are on this, also send Micky Phelan on his way too, he is s decent guy, but not good enough for United, and also don't say we won this, this and this whilst he has been coach, we have also been played off the park by a number of so called "lesser" teams than United, whilst Mick has been coach. Today really was the pits, only when Rooney came on did we look like getting anywhere. The truth is fellas, we need some new blood, and its not just a player or two. Oh buy the way, I have supported United for longer than most posters have been alive, and right through the old second division days. So it ain't new scarf territory.
Finishing top 4 will never be 'a task' for man united, not bought quality!? Van Persie, kagawa. Today's 2nd half performance was the best this season by a mile, when we were 4-4-2 granted the first half was abysmal but have faith u plastic fan!
The two worst players at liverpool last week giggsy and nani both start absolute joke
johndenton
Plastic fan?!, get a grip sunshine, we were crap, have been for a long time, about time persons like you realized this before posting!
There are a lot of problems with the side currently I would say. Fisrtly the style of football we have been playin gfor the last two years. It isnt enjoyable to watch unless we are chasing a game as until then it is too much about possesion and too slow, pedestrian and predictable. SAme today 1st half awful, we then chase the game at a higher tempo and look like scoring. We should be playing high tempo football with the players we have its what has made us so exciting to watch for so long.
What I do hate to write though is bar Scholes who still oozes class, the rest of our older players shouldnt be playing. Everybody knows Evra cant defend nowadays, Ferdinand was showing signs of waning last season but still a very good defender but on the evidence of this season so far he looks shot and I hate to say it Giggs last season struggled, he can still conjure up moments of magic but they just cover up the fact that watch him now closely and most of the time he actually gives the ball away. Is it sentiment or what Ferguson is showing as he has always known when to get rid of a player, not the last two seasons though. I wonder if he is holding on to the experience before he departs as on the positive side, the foundations are still there we have De Gea, Rafael, Fabio, Jones, Smalling, Cleverly, Kagawa, Powell all promising young players and the core of them ENglish and we do seem to have some very good youth players. SAdly though I think youngsters aside, the older players just arent good enough and forgetting the future what do we have, possibly only Rooney and Vidic that are world class? I can see why a proven player like RVP was signed, Im not sure it was the position needed signing as great as he is. Valencia is ok, not great but ok, and personally I dont get why Anderson isnt getting games at the moment, it is his last chance but he has looked good the brief time he has played, but Carrick, Nani, Fletcher, Evans, Welbeck, Hernandez, Young they are not Utd quality and before I get shot down as a plastic fan, ask yourself this, since Ferguson won his first trophy how many of those players, and also how many of the older players as they are now would have got in any of Fergies other sides for example 1995, 1999 or the side of 3/4 years ago? (yes yes Carrick was in one). Once our injured players are back Im intrigued to see what selections Fergie makes as I really dont believe the best eleven players we have are the ones that will be played
Invisible Stuey
Well.. what have we learned over the past couple of years? speed kills.. and what do we not accomplish with carrick, scholes, and giggs operating in basicly the middle of the park?
I dont know what the hell SAF was thinking putting Giggs in their when you have Bale and Lennon running down the wings. Also, why Rooney didn't start is beyond me! We need Vidal and a Pacey left winger then our squad will be complete.
Dan
Big difference if we had Valencia fit. He would have been much better than Nani at shutting down Bale with Raf on the right. {Ed004's Note - I don't agree with that... I don't think Bale did much all game apart from the goal and the shot leading up to the third which Valencia wouldn't have been able to do anything about imo}
I think the management is well aware of the real problem, - a complete lack of pace and agility in central midfield. Watching bale and vertorgen run into our half yesterday was really laughable.
If fans can see the problem, tactical experts aren't going to have a problem identifying our weakness either. Its naive to believe Man United management dont know the real problem. Ferguson pretends after matches that there's some other problem, simply to deflect attention away from the real issue. Thats kind of obvious really.
The real reason we havent done anything about the present situation is not due to a lack of understanding on the managements behalf. The simple truth is that there is a hyper inflated transfer market at the moment in combination with the fact that we have very weak owners. That has meant we must find players at "good value" as a necessity. Kagawa and van persie fit that description, but in signing them, we have used our budget for the season.
Now the only option is to spend next season's budget in january (which i hope we do) or, to find solutions within the squad. I think the experimental formation in the league cup was no accident. They were testing out a plan B, and i hope we activate it sooner rather than later having seen the first half against tottenham. The current formation just isn't sustainable with the "old guard" of midfielders.
Its about time questions are asked about the manager. Poor team selection has once again lead to a poor performance and the blame lies at the managers door! A manager who once promoted youth and gave them there chances in the big games looks like he is giving that up by continuing to field a aging paceless midfield. I believe that with the right team selection and tactics we would have a great footballing team but the manager keeps selecting our old has been players instead of giving game time to our young players who need big game experiance like playing away at anfield and at home to spurs. The team who were so average against liverpool were always destined to get out paced and closed down to easily by a quicker spurs team. I believe if the manager continues to play the same team and ststem we are in danger of being in a scrap for forth instead of challeging for the league. Our best midfielder who has made more tackles and interseptions then anyone is cleverly and he was once again warming the bench, its no surprise our performances have been so average since he droped cleverly just like our performances dropped when he got injured last year. Come on fergie! Get back to being the manager who didnt pick teams on reputation and who was not affraid to change systems to keep the ball instead of sitting deep and trying to counter attack all game. It is simply not good enough at the min
G.N.G
Agree piss poor performance we won't finish in top four if this keeps up, lets face it we're up to our ears in debt and can't afford the top quality replacements any more thats why we're still stuck with giggs and scholes and why we're being linked with tom ince (an ex red) for 5 mil lol. {Ed004's Note - Yet we have been able to spend 50 million two summers in a row...sigh*}
The first half was how we played last season and this but the second half, wow was like going back 3 years, brilliant dominating football. The best I have seen us for ages and I am one of our biggest critics at the minute.
I think the problem tactically is this:
We have always tended to have a cavalier approach to our game, we can't do that now as our players are too old (that Fergie plays for some reason), and he is now trying to be a master tactician and isn't very good at it. He is afraid to rely on the youth because he isn't forced to, he had no choice in the early 90's as it was all we had so I think this faith in youth tag he has is a bit of a myth - probably why Bale and Ramsey never signed amongst others.
I'm willing to bet he gave them an all mighty telling off at half time and ripped up the tactics board, "Just go out there and play!", he would have screamed and all of a sudden the shackles were off and we looked like a dominating attacking force again. If we do that consistantly in a few weeks when these negative tactical thoughts are out fo the sytem we will be a force again. Rooney for Giggs was crucial and I'm hopping to be proved wrong about Rooney, as he looked like his old self coming on.
I think that first half was the best thing that could have happened to us, as the sending off last week saved us from a pasting and Fergie has thrown in the towel trying to be a tactician and just motivates, what he is good at. Fingers crossed we keep that attitude up and get the youth in.
Sween