Manchester United Banter Archive June 10 2013

 

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10 Jun 2013 23:24:48
Eds, Syds, Dillon's, etc etc

Do you people think that Manchester uniteds fc will spend more money on transfers this term than Chelsea fc and Manchester city fc and Tottenham hots fc and Liverpool fc? I think that if we do not then I do not think that we will win the competition this year, do not think the same too, all of my friends and family think it too. Whoever it shall be who spends the most on brand new transfers will win it, I maybe think it could be either one of Manchester city or Chelsea or even arsenal or even hotspurs this year, I really hope I'm wrong I really really do hope, but we never seem to spend much millions of pounds compared to them other ones, we have been lucky in winning the past couple of times, and all that is because of Alex ferguson, and now, he has retired from it, we will not be able to rely on him anymore, and now, I'm really really worried for us, all other teams have a lot of money to spend big on really really good players, and more than us do, and now it all depends on that, do all you other people on here think the same, I do. Please let me know everyone else's opinions on this matter if you please will, thank you.

Mick Dean {Ed004's Note - Not about the quantity its about the quality. Would you rather 30+ million on fernandinho or under 20 million on Kagawa, Lewandowski etc}

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Thanks ed 004, I think that bayern Munich will want to sign lewandowski this year, and kagawa never seems to play as much anymore, do u think he will next season under D. moyes? Imagine him and Strootman inter-linking play, exchanging passes through the centre midfield area

Mick Dean {Ed004's Note - He will play more}

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Ed best reply of the week , it's not about money it's about quality.
there might of been a couple who though Rvp was to old or maybe Injury prone but I think everyone would agree he was a top player, and he has shown that.
We have a good squad but we need to raise the quality of the first 11 imo.
2 players who we might argue where they will play or if we need them but all agree they are top quality would be a good summer for me
Jred

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I hope for your sake that English isn't your first language mick.

As the ed said its absolutely nothing to do with how much you spend but about who you spend it on. Nobody on this site mentioned fernandinho as a potential signing but now he's suddenly a top player because city spent 30 million on him, give me a break.

Your post sounds like you think we will finish 5th next season because other teams will spend more. Do you really think 'tots' have much chance of running the league than united? I bet your family life is a real optimistic place if your whole family agrees with this post.

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Sure our win this year was "lucky".

REDFAITH

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Well all I feel from your post is that you are not a united supporter

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Ed, your right about the need to select the right players to buy, but sometimes it is all about flashing the cash to get a player. the upcoming transfer of cavanni will be a case in point. great player who would improve any team, but with Madrid, city and Chelsea supposedly wanting him, there's going to be some serious money spent.

I'd be pretty shocked if Manchester United didn't want him in their squad but they're not prepared to spend as much money as the other teams I mentioned in order to buy him. cavanni might not be the only player Manchester United would like to sign like but won't be prepared to spend enough, whereas other clubs will.

so in a way is down to how much money the clubs spend, as long as they spend it on the right players.

Andrew b

Andrew b

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I'd rather have a +20 million transfer on someone with the quality and worth it like Mata or Modric.

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£35m for Andy Carroll or £24m for Robin Van Persie?

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Dortmund have proved that shrewd investment and developing your own can bring success.
Madrid spent millions and are they any closer to Barca or Bayern the clubs in turmoil Chealsea and City similar full of players who aren't really in love with the club but find the PROJEcT interesting!!
Dylan

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I think mick is right what he is saying, I mean I wouldn't care if we paid 60 million for lewandoski, and 40 million for strotman, as long as we get them! its not like the money is coming out ov my pocket is it?

G Duggan

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G Duggan,

I kind of understand the sentiment behind that post but think about what you just said. It's ludicrous.

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10 Jun 2013 23:08:47
Ed004 can you put this in the banter please.


In reply to my team on the team page:

What do you think of the line up though ed? realistic or not? and is it good enough to be a champions league winning team? it has pace, and players that can keep the ball and players that can all score.

I think the only other Goalkeeper that will rival De Gea for best goalkeeper in a few seasons will be Coutois.

Rafael is improving a lot, he is still a little rash but going forward he is great and he's improved a huge amount in defense.

Jones and Zouma would be a great partnership IMO, both young but will turn into brilliant defenders in a few years.

Thiago, Kagawa and Januzaj are all capable of scoring and keeping possession, the movement would be incredible and they are all technically very good.

Haven't seen much of Strootman but it's looking like he will be our midfield enforcer.

Then there is Zaha who will either become a great or he will become a Nani, but from what I have seen of him so far he just needs some fine tuning and he could be (dare I say it) a Ronaldo-esque.

The only position that have big question marks are the Leftback and Striker.

Maybe Zaha will convert to a Striker? with Powell Kagawa, Januzaj behind him, with the midfield enforcer Strootman and Thiago in the deep lying playmaker role. {Ed004's Note - There are too many things in football that can happen in 3 years. Who here would have thought we would be signing an injury prone RVP 3 years ago}

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Clubs are always buying new players and you never know what will happen to some players as they age e. g. Rooney, so it's impossible to guess our team 3 years from now.
DHK

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10 Jun 2013 22:20:15
Ed's, apart from strootman who will united most likely sign in the summer transfer window? Thanks, Graham. {Ed004's Note - Garay}

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Who is Garay replacing?
Dylan

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Rio for next season in would think or maybe Vidic?

could we see Vidic leave as part of a player swap?

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10 Jun 2013 21:26:28
This is slightly off the subject. The issue relates to a lack of development for the national team due to the "bigger teams" going abroad to buy talent. I believe that the FA should contribute to wages of international players. This was would be a incentive for clubs to use British home grown talent. Do you agree?

Karni

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It is more about building a philosophy of how England want to play, enforcing it across all levels of the teams, increasing the number of hours the youngsters can train and cancel the rule that youngsters can only go to a team within a certain radius in terms of travel. That rule alone means many have to go lower level clubs, or not to the top clubs, that is deliberately aimed by the FA to even things up for local teams but it means the kids receive lesser levels of coaching and by not playing with better levels of players do not develop as fast or as far. It also means that it is easier for the top teams to raid the foreign clubs than it is to bring someone in from our own country to develop them. Even United do that now.
It is a mess that could be changed but instead we build white elephants like Wembley and have to play every possible game there. Finally the new white elephant is St George's Park, how will it produce successful players if the FA haven't even decided what type of player they want to produce.

I am a passionate Englishman but right now I will care more about United until the FA care more about what the aim is than about how they are perceived

Red Man

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It isn't even just that. We have promising players who's first taste of international football is in Stuart Pearce's U21 team - where the emphasis is on negative blocking tactics, pure athleticism and the long ball. The U21s should be helping to develop players; instead it holds them back.

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10 Jun 2013 23:32:57
The limits on training time and on local limits is daft. It might also help having an under 21 coach who knew what he was doing and not just picked because he's "passionate". And taking tournaments seriously like Germany, Spain, Italy and Holland rather than the joke of a squad we took. Mort

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11 Jun 2013 11:01:51
@Red Man

Completely agree with everything you wrote. The handling of the youth, the laws related to taking on youngsters from specific area radius etc are just ludicrous. Its all a shambles and English clubs are at a huge disadvantage. The media doesn't help either.

At least we can be proud that United has a policy of going for young British players in the market like Jones, Smalling, Zaha and continue to give chances to the likes of Powell, Welbeck, Cleverley. Just look at the Germans and Spanish, majority of their sides consist of homegrown players and thus they can concentrate their entire transfer budget on getting just one or two top players while teams like United need to buy more players since the ones at home are not good enough.

Building white elephants like Wembley is of no use if there is no clear direction to the philosophy of football. Having the likes of Pearce and Hodgson handling national sides is just shameful.

I believe we need somebody like a Sir Alex up there in the FA who has understands the game and youth inside out to put this ship without a rudder back on course.

REDFAITH

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10 Jun 2013 20:50:57
Thiago

I watched a little of Thiago for Spain in the same way I watched Strootman a few nights ago and the young Spaniard deserves a comment. Thiago is a mobile player and it is noticeable how he moves into space, I watched how he made himself available for the pass between the German players on quite a few occasions. His distribution to wide areas was very good, shorter lines than we have to the wings but he was accurate. I questioned his physicality, so looking at that he took several heavy tackles and didn't roll around on the ground but got up. He physically seems close to Xavi and actually you can see how Barcelona might have Thiago in mind to replace him, actually I wonder if on reflection Barcelona might view Thiago as more important to keep than Fabregas. That is not because Fabregas is a lesser player than Thiago because Cesc is a more all round player but actually because Thiago could fit into the Xavi role fairly smoothly whereas Fabregas doesn't fit as easily. Thiago may be a target for us and from my brief close inspection is a good player but we may have to change the way we play to get the most out of him. Having specifically watched him he is talented but in two or three years, if that long, when the Xavi role will become fully available is he likely to yearn to go back there to fulfil his destiny?

We shall see but I wonder if Barcelona may wish to keep Thiago more than Fabregas.

Red Man

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I really like him I think he's going to be a top player
always a concern he might want to go back to barce but the truth is how many players would turn Barcelona down if they came calling,
Jred

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Red Man

I was thinking the same thing myself. I'd take either of them for United though!

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Jred

I doubt Fabregas would go back if he leaves now

Red Man

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11 Jun 2013 11:01:29
@ Red Man

Again completely agreed. I posted something similar after Spain's first game. Thiago looks better and better with every game I watch him. Positioning, movement, being available for a pass, passing ability, range, vision, ability to play in tight spaces is all top notch. I've said before he has shades of Xavi and Scholes about him in the way he just glides about the pitch and ability to see the game a couple of passes ahead.

He has no issue with physicality imo, he dives and moans the least from that Barcelona team. There have been reports that he is more highly regarded at the Camp Nou, well was at least by Pep. His agent being Pep's brother though might prove a stumbling block in signing him.

Even if he wants to go to Spain in say 4-5 years I think it would be a good deal for us. Although, something tells me he won't do a Fabregas and stay for a long time if we bought him.

I'm not too sure I would take Fabregas over him. I think with regular football and more importantly given responsibility and freedom in midfield Thiago could be a top player in just a year.

REDFAITH

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Thiago & Strootman would improve us a lot for next season. If Thiago goes back in a few year's then so be it. We will make a profit and we will have Powell, Januzaj, Pearson & Daehli ready by then.

Sydney!

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Sydney, you probably see more youth games than me, so who do you think is more likely to play a few games next year out of Daehli and Januzaj, since they are a similar age and stature. I think they may get games against some of the less physical teams like Swansea, and may get games in the cups, and maybe go on loan the following year.

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10 Jun 2013 20:19:51
Is it just me who'd be over the moon with a summer of strootman Thiago Mendy zaha and varela (not to fussed about him)

Looking at them names mixed with who's in the academy I think we can look forward to a strong team for many years to come

19JackC94

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I would be ok with that as it strengthens our midfield but would rather a big name in there.

1redarmy

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Agree

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Agree with 1redarmy, I'd be 'satisfied' yet not that 'excited' necessarily

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How quickly we've gone from we only need one or two elite quality players bc we have so much depth, to bringing in 7-8 new players and selling players for less than their real value. Let's hope the men in charge at United know what they're doing, keep most of the team together and try and add 2-3 elite players to improve the starting XI, not the depth of an already deep squad.

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11 Jun 2013 08:56:06
I wouldn't be satisfied with that summer
Yes they are all quality additions that would strengthen us a lot but to be thruthful our wingers couldn't organize a booze up in a brewery and for me this area needs addressing more than the middle does and there is only one solution to this problem and it is (dare I say it) Cristiano

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Although I still think we need another wide player as well as Zaha, hell if we signed Thiago we would be signing ALREADY one of the best midfielders in Europe (he would walk into most sides in Europe bar Barcelona including ours) and potentially a world star worthy of the 7 jersey. 1redarmy do you not consider Thiago a big name then, just because he isn't playing week in week out, hell even my mate who is a Newcastle fan and not massive on football has heard of him!
Invisible STuey

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KG

I don't believe we need that many but need 2 or 3 top players for the 1st eleven. I think we might have an issue moving guys like Nani and anderson and end up keeping them because of the cost of replacements.

Shahram

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10 Jun 2013 19:10:31
Edds or anyone in the know?

What happening with the likes of.

Sean McGinty
Marnick Vermijl
Bebé
Federico Macheda

thanks

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Wasn't McGinty released?

Expect the others to be sold.

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Mcginty released other 3 still with us I would expect vermijl to stay but the other 2 to go
johndenton

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I don't know he might off but his name wasnt on that article.

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Vermijl is refusing to sign a new deal. Perhaps this is another reason why Varela was signed.

McGinty is looking like being released soon. Bebe & Kiko will be sold if a buyer can be found.

Sydney!

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Looks like we are having a bit of a clear out

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10 Jun 2013 18:16:53
no sentiment attached, who is the better player between rooney and van persie. I wuld go with rooney. say urs and why.

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Rooney has/had the ability to be the much better player but I think he has wasted it by his unprofessional attitude to fitness and looking after his body. Therefore I would have to say RVP as he has kept himself in top shape and on top form. I think Rooney is now on the decline whereas RVP is at his peak.

Brendan81

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Rvp of now and Rooney of 3 years agoish. I say RVP now as he is more calm on the ball and has a much better sense of composure. Rooney when on form is better all round though.

1redarmy

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Right now? If so - RvP

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Rooney has won more, scored more goals, contributed more to his team is on for the record for his country ( at the same stage in their respective careers) so yes definitely van persie for me ; )

Roonbest

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Rooney is world class, imo was as good as ronaldo when he left utd. he seemed to slip a little of late, fergie had it in for him since transfer request back in the day. on form rooney would have disposed of r madrid for you this season, rvp is not even in the same league.

B O H

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10 Jun 2013 20:28:30
Do me a favour. RvP is twice the player, athlete and person than Rooney is.

Whistler.

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I think at the moment it's got to be Rvp, was there any better striker in the world last year?
Jred

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Yes there was: Falcao, Lewandoski and Cavani were all better than RVP.

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At the moment its RVP, but their career striking numbers are pretty similar, while Rooney has done so while being an all-around player, dropping deep and out wide when needed, and creating countless goals for teammates. RVP is better at the moment, but when both are in top form and healthy Rooney is better as he can simply do more for the team.

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RVP

Better passer and miles better control.

Shahram

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10 Jun 2013 17:56:01
on the talk of us signing garay, moyes has been looking at toby alderweireld (think spellings right?) how realistic and how good is he? I mean I know he plays for ajax (must say something) yeah?
cheers, Scott.

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I believe alderweireld is off interest too a couple of clubs around europe. I don't believe he is off united quality just yet and will probably end up at somewhere like liverpool if he does go this summer.

scout.

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10 Jun 2013 17:45:35
{Ed004's Note - I know this has been debated extensively on this site and I know they are a lot of conflicting opinions and I personally think he should leave. However, if we were unable to sell Rooney this summer or he refused to leave or if the club persuade him to stay, all possible scenarios, do people think a fully fit Rooney, who will get a proper full pre season under Moyes who will ensure all players are fully fit etc (hopefully), have as much of an impact as signing RVP did last summer. In people's opinion would it be like signing another world class player for the team as Rooney this year was injured, off form and not fully fit. Now when I say fully fit I mean to the standards of a few years ago ie can run all day, willing to bust a gut back and his first touched worked on again I'm not sure he could regain all his speed but he is still quick enough the likes of Gotze etc don't rely completely on their pace and we could sign a winger (Di Maria) to inject pace in the side}

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Ed004 If he didn't stay fit for 1 of the best managers and motivators ever why would he stay fit for moyes?

You have to remember for 3 years now rooney's performances have dropped. And Fergie continued to play him over & over. And just for a few games he was left out or subbed off, he demands a 2nd transfer request or informally hints at the notion, basically threatening the club.

This guy is a rotten apple and isn't good for the rest of the squad he think he's entitled to his place?
Ronaldo has scored 180 goals in the last 3 seasons! Rooney gets paid more! It doesn't make sense either for footballing or economic reasons. We could pay the wages of 3 top players with rooneys. Its time for him to leave even if its for £20mil because he will get worse.

I think back to that bayern munich 2nd leg where wayne played injured and I think that ruined his career we lost the champions league and Premiership that year. : (

Sulei {Ed004's Note - Yes I agree in hindsight he should never have played that game}

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He'd be better than what we saw this season but, I still feel he is on the decline and so we need to get the maximum transfer fee as even if he signs a new contract, what we can get for him is going to decline rapidly in the next season or 2.

My opinion only though.

Brendan81

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10 Jun 2013 18:24:12
I think he has to go Ed. The poor fitness, weight issues and lack of effort are symptomatic of mental issues. I think he's lost his motivation and fallen out of love with either the game or the club. If that's true then how do you get him going? Also where do you fit him into the team? He wants to play as a striker but if we move to a 4231 then van persie is automatically first choice as the 1. I think Kagawa has to play in the hole as he has better vision and the better short passing game. So straight away we're back to last season and having to crow bar him into the team somewhere. Its just easiest to cash in I feel and develop the team. MrE {Ed004's Note - I would play him in the 3 behind RVP if Kagawa played out left he would just come into the middle during the game and baines (hopefully) would provide the width. At times this year Rooney and Kagawa linked brilliantly at times though I think now is the time to leave}

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I think its too many ifs and buts for a player who has asked twice now for a transfer earns 200k+ a week an can't be arsed getting himself in shape

CAIN

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That's a big 'IF' Ed4 but actually, I do think it could be a big boost to us 'IF' he turns things round.

None of us know exactly what his issues are from the outside but the 2 most obvious factors seems to be:

1) fitness, staying in shape etc. - he seems to have lost his burst of pace;

2) psychologically (is this a word, lol?) - he seems to have lost his 'spark' from being one of the best around.

Now the reason I see a possible positive turnaround is that IF Moyes decides he wants Rooney, I'm sure he will address both of these issues, i. e.

1) we know he is a stickler for fitness so will likely put Wayne on some kind of regime to get fitter;

2) IF he wants Wayne to stay I'm sure he'll put his arm around him and make it clear he is going to play a big part/be played in a favourable position.

I do worry that Rooney's decline will come sooner than other's due to his body shape and how much football he played at a young age. BUT I do think Moyes could get him into better shape than he is now. If it's really that hard to ship out Wayne and find a genuine replacement I'd rather he stayed (possibly sign an extension) then we can reassess after next season.

Some poster's will feel he doesn't deserve any more chances - which I can understand to a degree - but we MUST make sure that we get the best out of any transfer. So if we can't get an able replacement, and if Wayne is ready to work hard, and if Moyes wants to keep him and thinks he can get him back in shape (lot's of if's I know) - then I'd be happy to see how he does next season.

Of course, if we could get in Isco & Lewandowski then I'd be happy to see the back of him ;) but that's unlikely. {Ed004's Note - Yeah there aren't many replacements available for Rooney ATM Gotze would have been perfect but he is Bayern bound}

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The issue I have with Rooney is that he has come out and said he's a striker and that's his best position which is fair enough but when he plays up top, he keeps dropping so deep to pick up the ball and to get involved, we lose a man further forward. This is why I think CM is best for him but then there are better CM's out there then him who'd I prefer.

So if we do adopt a 4-2-3-1 formation which I think we should, I would prefer Kagawa in the "number 10" role behind RVP, so would Rooney be satisfied with playing either side of a central player in a 3 behind RVP? A 3 of Rooney, Kagawa and Thiago would be amazing if they get the balance and shape right.

I think a new manager, new ideas, new training methods may help Rooney so see how he comes back after the summer and give him til January then maybe cut our losses if it's not working out?

A fit, on form Rooney will always be a game winner against any team in the world, we just need to see this from him. {Ed004's Note - Would a 4231 of Di Maria, Rooney, Kagawa in the 3 supporting RVP work then? Those 3 players can drift around looking for space etc and Rafael and Baines can provide the width. Strootman and Carrick will be strong enough so that Rooney doesn't have to do as much work defensively and Kagawa and Di Maria can tuck into midfield to he out number the opposition}

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I would love that to happen, yes it would be like a completely new signing. A front line with a fit, in form Rooney and RVP would strike fear into the heart of any club we came up against.

If we saw the Rooney from a few years ago, next season would be a real thrill. We have seen glimpses of what he and RVP are capable of when they play together (goals against AV and Reading spring to mind). Imo it would be as good as signing another world class striker, honestly, the Rooney from a few years ago was world class. Alongside RVP and some good wingers I think we could have the title wrapped up again. Especially if we sort out the midfield issues so he can actually play up top like he wants to.

People forget, although he wasn't great last season he still did get a good assist and goal tally and the season before he got 26 (not exact) goals. I think if he stepped up his game he could still be a good player for us. If not, he can go, I really don't care for him if he is not willing to put the effort in for the team.

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Im with HoneyBadger on this one.
I personally think we should sell but only if a suitable replacement is bought. not neccesarily a striker but a top class attacking player who can change a game.
I just feel that the best for everybody is to sell and its not really an easy decision because we all know what he can be capable of but he only has 2yrs left on his contract and in his present condition doesn't deserve an extension on his current wage. so do we give him 6months to prove himself? That would knock 5 or 10mil off his value as his contract would only have 18months left and he'd no doubt be cup tied for the remainder of this season if we did want to sell in january.
Its a tough call for moyes but personally if a move can be agreed this summer and we can get £30m then I think it would suit everyone

BABY FACED ASSASIN

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Agree with Mr E and Ports, Kagawa has to be the number 10 in the hole, not Rooney. That's leaves him on the side of Kagawa.

I think Kagawa on the left is a bit of a waste in all honesty.

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Ed004

I think Kags, Rooney & Di Maria behind RvP could be lethal and it's what I've wanted secretly for a while - bearing in mind I think some of the names on here have been unrealistic IMO.

Kags & Di Maria would both naturally come inside onto their stronger feet, so Evra/Baines and Rafael can overlap to provide width. Di Maria possesses the ability to dribble past defenders which we have missed.

I know many have questioned the possible partnership of Strootman & Carrick which is fair enough but I do think with such a 'solid' base that the front 4 would have more freedom to attack. Rooney has had to drop too deep at times because we have lacked that IMO. (BTW, if Gundogan was at all possible I'd take him over Strootman all day long. )

In summary, it won't happen but I think a summer of Baines, Strootman (or ideally Gundogan) and Di Maria would answer most of our problems. If Rooney stayed and improved his game we'd be a pretty tasty outfit! {Ed004's Note - With Garay also looking signed it would enable us to push higher up the pitch and press high up the pitch and therefore Carrick and Strootmans pace would not be an issue as there is not enough space for opponents to run into}

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Agreed Ed004, also they would provide better cover for our fullbacks IMO which would allow our wide forwards more freedom rather than having to track back so much.

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I think there's a lot of rash judgements here from people who don't know the man and have no idea what was discussed between him and ferguson.

Wayne Rooney is a human being who like the rest of us is susceptable is being a little bored and disinterested in his work. the guy has played almost non stop professional football for 10 solid years.

u can cite his wages but after a while £200k probably becomes just a number.

I think that with a good summer break and the shake up with a new manager there's every reason to be optimistic about the return of a fit and firing Rooney next season. if he does get his sh*t together then I agree his impact in tandem with rvp could be like a new stellar signing. there were enough glimpses of what those two could do together to see how good it could become.

Rooney just needs his mojo back. he is not fernando Torres!

Andrew b:-)

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Has to go and will go it is just the start of the fun and will not be here come August.

Shahram

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10 Jun 2013 16:56:43
moving on from the strootman/fabregas debate (cos dylan would never accept), let's have a bit of banter who would you pick between oscar and mario gotze and marco reus and why. would is the best {Ed004's Note - Gotze because he is on his way to the very top. Was my dream transfer signing this summer behind Messi and Ronaldo. Then Reus then Oscar.}

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Reus, we need a player that can run at the opposition and he has it all IMO, his touch is great, his dribbling is exceptional and he has an eye for goal.

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It would depend, if we sold Rooney, Gotze would be his ideal replacement. But as it's going it looks like Rooney is staying so therefore Reus would bring much much more to the side with his pace and skill.

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10 Jun 2013 16:25:34
Who is this mendy kid that we are linked with. Is he any good. Do you think that we will sign him.

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10 Jun 2013 15:30:49
It's not exactly a gamble when we can sign him on a free transfer and possibly make a profit by selling him if it doesn't work out for him. _________________________________________
10 Jun 2013 12:43:18
My point was mick that they were all cheap players who were going to be a gamble as they were little known or unproven in england. Kleberson and Hernandez were totally unproven in a top league or in europe. Bebe and Obertan were talented but had flaws that made them gamble. None of them were the best in their league, or the highest rated players but all had talent. that's why they were gambles.
Shappy
________________________
bebe was 8 million and kleberson was 7 million ten years ago, neither a cheap gamble of a player, just as nonsensical as your original post_____
mick the red fireman. ____________

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10 Jun 2013 16:48:58
Kleberson was bought as a replacement for Veron who we spent 28m on so a player bought for 21m less than his predecessor sounds like a cheaper gamble to me.

If Mendy wasn't on a free i'm pretty sure we wouldn't be interested in him. So we aren't in for him based on his amazing level of talent but because he is cheap and available with enough talent to make offering him a contract worth the gamble.

We have a history of signing little known players with talent who can be seen as a gamble. Tosic was another example. Mendy I think falls into this catagory.

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I think he just has a problem with you in general Shappy lol.

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Kleberson was not bought as a replacement for veron, we also bought ronnie that year, its not an argument it just seemed like a post for posting sake and it made no sense, this is a player for the fiture not a cheap bargain to go straight in, he would be more expensive than bebe or kleberson if he wasnt available for free, if we even do sign him.
mick the red fireman.

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10 Jun 2013 17:52:36
Veron was a DM/box to box midfielder who we sold in the summer of 2003, we then signed Kleberson who was also a DM/box to box midfielder in the summer of 2003. They were similar players bought and sold in the same summer, that sounds like Kleberson was bought in to replace Veron to me.

And I was replying to a poster who was asking what people thought of the potential transfer of Mendy.

My view is that he played last season in ligue 2 and is a talented young player but would totally be a gamble as he hasn't played at the highest level. He has potential, but from what I can find out he is hardly the next big thing. I also highly doubt that we would be interested in him at all if he wasn't available for free. So we would be signing him on the back of how much he would cost rather than how talented he is. We have done this several times before most recently with Bebe, but before him was Obertan and Djemba-Djemba and Liam Miller and to a certain extent Hernandez and Kleberson.

I won't get drawn into how much he would cost if he wasn't available for free as that's just conjecture. But I would expect it to be less than 7m.

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Shappy

I thought Veron was a attacking midfielder / no 10 and the reason he was so crap at Utd was that Ferguson played him as a holding midfielder?

Have I got this the wrong way round?

Andrew B

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10 Jun 2013 18:46:02
Veron was a box to box player, as able to put a tackle in as he was at scoring or creating a goal. But his role within the United team was to sit deeper alongside Keane and have Scholes play further forward. In theory it should have worked well but he didn't adapt to the pace of the premier league or his slightly more restricted role at United.

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Veron was a deep lying playmaker. he was nt a dm.

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Veron was not a dm he was central midfielder I watched him a lot at parma, kleberson was not bought to replace him, saf said we never had a dm in his time at the club enuf ssid, your point was to me was totally way off the mark, as for the child who said I have a problem with you is a joke, I come on here a couple a times a week I just had a prob with your point.
mick the red fireman.

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10 Jun 2013 20:14:10
Well we have gone abit off subject with who played where and what. But Kleberson was a midfielder and was purchased within weeks of selling Veron who was also a midfielder. They may or may not have been like for like but Kleberson was Veron's replacement. He played the games which Veron would have played if he was still at the club and Kleberson wasn't. So I don't see how you in any way can argue that.

As to what you original point was, I think it was you took exception at me calling the potential signing of Mendy a gamble. Well in what way would you say Mendy is a safe bet? Is he that good that he'll obviously be first choice and an amazing player, or is it that he will not cost a lot but still be a gamble.

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Veron wasn't a DM Fergie just thought he would play him there and it didn't work out. He was more of a CM.

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10 Jun 2013 14:34:21
guys just a thought here, would we really want lewandowski? I mean after all we've established he wants to play for bayern so if he joined united would he really be happy and looking to play for us? Just a thought

Davethered

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It wouldn't bother me if we got him for £25m, he scored a load of goals for 3 seasons then wanted to go Bayern.

I know it might bother some though that we aren't his preferred choice.

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Sorry but what are ure sources for knowing he wants to play for buyern?
Chris the REDman

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I admit we don't need him but he has so much quality it's difficult to pass up a player like him. Personally, a link up w/ Kagawa and Lewy sounds crazy plus RVP.

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Why not offer to play him for 3 years and then let him go to Bayern if he still wants to. We did something like that with Ronnie

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That just sounds sad. This is Manchester United we aren't a stepping stone to another club for Lewandoski. If he wants to come and play for Utd great, but if he's going to be joining us so that he can move to Bayern a few years later NO!
DHK

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10 Jun 2013 14:23:57
Mendy to United sounds to be on, I have to admit I don't really care for French second division football enough to know if he is good so if someone could inform me that would be great.

I don't mind us signing him on a free though as we can get a sell on fee if he doesn't meet the required standards. The one question I do have though is what if we sign him and Strootman and they are both class? Does that mean no Carrick as I can't see us playing 3 deep midfielders?

I am encouraged by the fact we are continuing with tradition in terms of signing young players but I still, like many feel the need to see a big player come in. I have given up on the Ronaldo dream for now, Fabregas and Modric seem out of reach to me and I'm not sure about Di Maria.

I have said before I will be happy with Strootman and Thiago coming into the midfield and I think these two are the only realistic buys we can get. I feel Lewandowski is a player we would welcome but don't need, Garay is the same as I feel until Ferdy and Vidic do go we have sufficient cover and Baines will depend on Evra staying.

My last point is about Januzaj, I hope we loan him out this season as we should have done with Pogba. There is no point in giving him a squad number, getting his hopes up and then shooting him down with a capital one game and a subs appearance. If he is as good as we think the way to keep him happy is to let him play for someone like Wigan or Bolton for experience and game time.

Feel free to pick at that.

1redarmy

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3 deep midfielders? Who is the other one? And I don't think anyone will be displacing Carrick for the 1st 11 any time soon.

RedDub

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RedDub,

Carrick, Strootman and Mendy all play a deeper position.

1redarmy {Ed004's Note - I reckon we will play a 4231 so will need players who can play deep so having options of those 3 and Cleverley and possibly Alcantara would be fantastic and all are young enough to get better}

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Carrick is 31/32 and one of our better players whilst Mendy is a 20 yr old who has been playing in the French L2 - I wouldn't worry about Carrick losing his place to soon. If we're going to play 2 deep CM'ers then I'd think we would need at least 3/4 good ones to rotate in any case.

HB

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If we do get Thiago, Strootman, Mendy. We would have a strong midfield for the next 10years!

Deep Midfielders: Carrick Strootman Mendy
Central Midfielders: Cleverly Thiago Powell
Attacking Midfielders: Kagawa Januzj

Looks to good to be true

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If Strootman and Mendy are signed, Strootman will start with Carrick (4-2-3-1 dependent). Mendy I imagine would be cover.

RedDub

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I like the sound of that, DmR. 17

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10 Jun 2013 14:23:32
Very informative article. Thanks Again. Want more.

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You're welcome.

Nicolas_United

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What's this about?

HB

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10 Jun 2013 14:23:32
Thanks for sharing, this is a fantastic blog post. Much thanks again. Awesome.

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What's this about?

HB

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10 Jun 2013 13:09:01
Everyone sugests next year we will try copy the German style with 4231 with carrick and strootman been the main 2 with ab option to push the wide players higher and adapt to a 433 style. I agree this would be a great system to use but I was thinking, what if over the season we seen strootman really shine and make carrick look inferior, could we end the year with a Spanish/ barca style of 433 with the strong holding player been strootman, two creative players in front of him with kagawa and Thiago then our fire power up top possibly zaha Rvp and welbeck.

Was wondering what the eds and some of the regular posters opinions of this would be?

19JackC94 {Ed004's Note - The wings are no where near good enough for Europe. Welbeck and Zaha wound not score enough}

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Eh yea and I would imagine they were delightful to work with ; )

Roonbest

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Last comment was ment for the below post

Roonbest

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10 Jun 2013 12:06:29
Never really seen it discussed but would people
Have welcomed mancini as a candidate for the hotseat
At utd? Proven winner and knew how to deal with big personalities?
Think he showed some class at times too?

Roonbest ( banter please eds)

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I would say he had no idea whatsoever of how to deal with big personalities. Tevez, balotelli etc.

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The reason Mancini was fired was because he DID NOT know how to deal with big personalities. His refusal to take any blame for the performances of his team and constant criticizing of his players in the press was appalling - and to me showed a complete lack of class.

As for him being a proven winner - how much did he spend? Ultimately I believe that with the funds he had available to him he should have won everything available to him during his time at City. One league title and an FA Cup (not to mention his record with City in the Champions League) was embarrassing for both himself, the club and the owners.

I would not want Mancini anywhere near our great club - not even as a kit man.

redseven

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Ahahaah no! The weakest manager ever.

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Won more than moyes ever did, but the answer to my originsl question is obviously no he would not have been a welcome candidate

Roonbest

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I believe Moyes would have won much more than Mancini had he been in charge of city. Moyes is a much better manager.

Ste.

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10 Jun 2013 11:08:37
Lewi signs July 1st, gets the number 9 and kicks off our transfers.

Mendy joins on a free transfer

Rooney leaves for Bayern for a whopping £35million! Freeing up #10

Thaigo joins soon after getting given the number 10

Strootman soon follows and get the departing Andersons number 8 shirt

The glazers dig deep into there pockets and fork out to bring Ronaldo back

Ronaldo joins. And we win title number 21.

Happy days!

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And we wake-up : (

Sydney!

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Dream on!

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I could actually believe all of that would happen apart from the Glazers digging deep to sign Ronaldo, there is no way we will sign Ronaldo IMO.

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Lewi moves to Madrid

Mendy joins on a free

Rooney stays

Thiago stays at Barca or moves to Madrid

Strootman signs

The Glazers dig deep and sign Leighton Baines

redseven

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Happy dreams! Wish it would happen though.

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Nurse, he's out of bed again!
RedSince68

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How about,
Varela signed £1m
Mendy signed £free
Strootman £17m (should be 10m at most)

We sell nani and Anderson.

And that's it. And that is why Woodward said no major change required. Glazers delighted as they can stash more money in their pockets.
Chelsea and city contest the league while we fight it out with arsenal and spurs for 3rd and 4th spot.
You never know!
Nomidfield

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10 Jun 2013 10:41:39
ED002 or ED004,
Could you please give us a list of who you believe are United's transfer targets this Summer. I appreciate this list might be extensive in terms of players that a being tracked but in that case could you perhaps just list the players who you think we will bid for this Summer. Many thanks again for your time. {Ed004's Note - Garay, Strootman and Di Maria}

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10 Jun 2013 10:05:12
Hi all. I'm a first time poster gr8 site. read every day. I was just what other fans think about the situation with rooney arsenal and chelsea have been linked strongly in recent days but I think he is stil one of the best players in the world and would not like to see him leave old trafford for another english club or any club for that matter. but I understand no one is bigger than the club and if he wants away we must buy a top quality replacement such as ronaldo or bale. I think we do need a big signing this year with chelsea. city. and arsenal geting stronger moyes needs all the help he can get from the board. a great summer in my opinion would be baines. garay. strootman. tiago and bringing ronny back. but what ever happens in moyes I trust.

Scotty utd

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I don't think Bale will be joining United any summer, and I don't think Ronaldo will join United this summer, unfortunatly. However, I agree with, if Rooney leaves, the club need a "world class" replacement (I really hate that word). For me, Lewandowski would be a perfect replacement, as both he and van Persie is good at linking play and holding the ball. Him and RVP can interchange with being on top, and Hernandez would be the perfect substitute. We need to strengthen the midfield this summer, it got to be priority number 1!

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10 Jun 2013 10:04:42
Just looked at the other pages and it would seem that Chelsea's main targets are Hulk, Cavani and van Ginkel. Citys page is almost non existant tbh.

On to us though interesting to hear David Gill speaking of Zaha and how he can play wide or in the middle, I wonder if he'll get more game time than we think.

Welsh Red

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Being able to be played in the middle will not help him get more game time as we have Kagawa and Rooney ahead of him who would want to play there.

Then if Hernandez or Welbeck are brought on to play up top RVP will drop into the hole. So in my opinion being able to play centre won't help him that much.

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10 Jun 2013 09:35:40
Seen on one of the football sites that Galatasaray have given up on Nani because they can't have him for £6m. That is ridiculous, I know he is inconsistent but he is still worth way over 10.

I would sell for £15m and I am sure someone will buy.

1redarmy

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They said United want E10 mill

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That's what I though when I saw this too. He might be inconsistent but there's no doubt he has great talent. And who knows how he will be perform while being motivated by a move to a new club.

Nicolas_United

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10 Jun 2013 08:21:04
Did anyone read Irwin's latest comments? Very interesting if what he says is true.

REDFAITH

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These comments were?

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That fabregas is our no. 1 target.

DIscountdave

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He writes a piece of the Sunday World in Ireland - its a rag with little credibility but in one article they quote him as saying “United are going after Fabregas as keenly as they did Van Persie last year – Cesc will be their big summer buy, ” wouldn't read anything into it myself, just a headline to sell papers.

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Irwin is quoted to be saying - united will fight heaven and earth to sign fabregas - quoted from ESPN website

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Fresh,

United will do everything to sign Fabregas

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But, we may fail.
JS

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10 Jun 2013 08:05:09
Can someone correct me on this if its wrong but adnan Januzaj has been rated at the 6th best young player in the world by fifa with phil jones in 10th! If true amazing but I'm not sure how official I just got a text from a mate. Cheers guys!

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I saw this doing the rounds on FB yesterday most names on the list were playing 1st team football so its a big plus for him to be high on the list as a reserve team player.

ms85

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I don't know how official it is. I just think its peoples opinion. this was the list created.

. NEYMAR (Barcelona) 2. ERIK LAMELA ( As roma)3. LUCAS MOURA (PSG )4. MARIO GOTZE (Bayern Munchen) 5. ISCO (Malaga) 6. ADNAN JANUZAJ (Manchester United) 7. DAVID ALABA (Bayern Munchen) 8. MATIJA NASTASIC (Manchester City) 9. KYRIAKOS PAPADOPOULOS (Schalke 04) 10. PHIL JONES (Manchester United)

I think in few years time januzaj would be near the top

Singh

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Surely every list is people's opinions? There is no way of definitively saying somebody is better than somebody else, especially when the list is players who all play in different positions. Good to see adnan getting noticed though, the lad could be a star.

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10 Jun 2013 07:22:20
Eds, can anyone of you can do a profile on Guillermo Varela? {Ed002's Note - Try the profiles page.}

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09 Jun 2013 23:00:32
ED002, please forgive me if I am wrong here, but I recall being told something myself back in December about Dortmund and United having an understanding or meeting regarding Lewandowski and his future, in particular the very potential transfer of the player to United. Do you see United signing the player this summer? {Ed002's Note - There was no deal or agreement in December as I have previously explained.}

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Ed002 you mentioned a few times a while that you thought Lewandowski would be one of our signings this summer, do you think this may still be the case or would you not put him in that list now?

Thanks

Brendan81 {Ed002's Note - I will stick with the list of players I originally said.}

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Ok thanks ed

Brendan81

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10 Jun 2013 11:34:10
002, I have searched for your list, but have either passed it over and over, or cann't find it at all.

Would you please repost your list? {Ed002's Note - I said Garay, Lewandowski, Begovic, Strootman and Gaitan.}

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10 Jun 2013 01:01:27
Hi all, great site visit everyday! Been reading quite a bit around Mendy from Monaco, and that he is available on a free and will be signing for us shortly? Any body got any further news on this?
Apparently the new 'Makelele', might be just what we need and at 20 years old represents a great prospect.

Nik

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10 Jun 2013 07:46:10
To me he looks like one of those gamble transfers we go for every now and then. Like when we signed Obertan on the cheap, or Kleberson or Bebe, or Hernandez. Sometimes like with Hernandez these gambles pay off. Most the time though they don't, like Bebe and Obertan. let's hope if we sign Mendy that he is like Hernandez, were due another one of these gambles paying off.

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Obertan and bebe were complete unknowns, kleberson was a world cup winner hardly a gamble, hernandez was a regular for mexico, mendy is one of the most sought after youngsters in france, I feel youve lumped a few names together there shappy to make a nonsensical point.
mick the red fireman.

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It's not exactly a gamble when we can sign him on a free transfer and possibly make a profit by selling him if it doesn't work out for him.

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10 Jun 2013 12:43:18
My point was mick that they were all cheap players who were going to be a gamble as they were little known or unproven in england. Kleberson and Hernandez were totally unproven in a top league or in europe. Bebe and Obertan were talented but had flaws that made them gamble. None of them were the best in their league, or the highest rated players but all had talent. that's why they were gambles.

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09 Jun 2013 23:34:46
Jred, I will explain it like I would to a five year old child.

Cesc, Thiago & Modric are creative midfielders.

Strootman is more like a Khedira, Sandro or a Busquets.

It isn't a case of Strootman or Cesc, WE NEED BOTH TYPES.

TK, HB, Shappy, Mick, Redfaith & myself cannot make it any clearer to you.

Sydney


Syd after a thread that was quite interesting and most people made good points there is always one that lowers the tone.
Most people made decent points it seems as normal you just can't accept anyone else point of view.

As I have said I don't see strootman and Carrick as a very good partnership imo
I think Carrick and fab or Carrick and modric would work better imo.

Also the OP for this thread was
"Who would people like to sign fabergas or strootman hypothetical of course "

It's not real life it's a banter site, you talk about football you have a crack.
Some times I put a post up just to see what people's opinions r.
I think you take this site way to serious, you need to get out more.

Jred

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Sydney he's a poor mans Khedhira Busquets do Barca play with a similar player in their midfield?
No one is saying we don't need him where just of the opinion there are better options available
Dylan

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Busquets is overated IMO can't handle a tough game he dives on the floor like a girl.

ms85

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10 Jun 2013 10:41:31
Syd! You are banging your head against a brickwall. I wouldn't waste your time on these pair. Its like trying to explain the off side rule to your gran it's hopeless.

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You have been writing several posts saying you would prefer a Cesc Fabregas type player instead of a Strootman type player. Many on this site have said to you that we need BOTH types of midfielder this summer as we are short in both areas. You keep making it a question of Cesc or Strootman when the rest of us believe we need a Strootman type midfielder AND a Cesc type midfielder.

Many of us have also said we would be disappointed with just Strootman. Several of the posters have said they would be delighted with Thiago and Strootman this summer. It's not a case of preferring Thiago to Strootman, we want both players to join as we need both types of players to challenge on all four fronts. For me a summer of Baines, Garay, Strootman, Thiago, Di Maria & Lewandowski would be a great summer.

Sydney!

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Possible worst thread of the day: Sydney points out the obvious, without noting the obvious that a lot of posters simply think Strootman isn't good enough where as the other names mentioned probably are. Icing on the cake MS85 makes a factual point in Busquet diving around the floor like a girl, very true. in the same sentence as can't handle a tough game and is over rated manages to ruin factual point with utter drivel. deary me
Invisible Stuey

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That list smacks of desperation too many in one window all expecting to start so potential problem with team morale when rotation is used
Are you forgetting Anderson Giggs Fletcher Powell Cleverly Carrick Jones to accommodate your wish list would keep Gill & Woodward very busy!
Can only see 2 signings but quality
Lewandowski
Alcantara
Zaha (confirmed)
No need for drastic action
Dylan

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Stuey,
90% of the time you watch Barca play and the going gets tough they resort to falling on the floor to slow the game down. i'm not sure the physicality of the prem wouls suit him that's what I meant.

ms85

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Dylan, Anderson & Fletcher are unlikely to be MU players next season and Powell looks like he will be going out on loan. We are short in midfield so we will need two midfielders this summer. We need a creative midfielder and we need someone who can do Carrick's job. If Evra leaves we will need a LB and DM knows Baines well. When Nani leaves we will need another winger and we have discussed Di Maria with RM recently. We know the club have been talking to Benfica regarding Garay. We know United have an interest in Lewandowski. A lot will depend on outgoings, but I think if the club get their own way that these are the changes they would want to make. I would be over the moon with all of them. Unless Rooney, Evra, Anderson & Nani are sold I doubt we will make this many changes.

Like I have been saying for a while, outgoings will determine our buys.

Sydney!

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Nani possible but the others are on big contracts in Andersons case he needs to knuckle down get super fit and who knows? I believe Jones will. Play in midfield if req, d not the ideal situation we know but with top players around him no problem.
I'm confident that Nick Powell will be given every chance in pre season games to show Moyes what he's capable of and will prove to be worth a place in our squad this season
Dylan

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I expect Nani & Anderson to go. We may be left with Rooney if no suitable offer comes in or we miss out on Lewandowski. But I think the club want to offload him. Evra is out of contract next summer so I think he will go this summer if anyone wants him.

Sydney!

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That's a lot of changes to a squad that won the league and robbed of another tie in champs league.
Zaha for Nani (Sir Alex thought he would be staying remember)
A replacement for Scholes and if Rooney goes maybe Lewandowski
Dylan

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SAF has been trying to flog Nani for over two years Dylan. We have also been talking to RM regarding Di Maria. So that's clear we are looking at another winger. We have been talking to Benfica regarding Garay. That indicates we want to sign a CB.

So you think one signing, I think at least four more after Varela.

Sydney!

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Sir Alex retired claiming that the club and playing staff where in fantastic shape and your telling us that OldvTrafford will be busier than Manchester Airport this summer.
I think I'll side with Sir Alex Zaha and 1 or 2 top class if they are available and if we sign anymore it will be kids with potential who I wouldn't count if there not in 1st team squad
Dylan

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