30 Jan 2022 23:21:28
Re Greenwood

First off as most people have commented any form of domestic abuse is vile. That said I would prefer to rely on facts not just Instagram messages before condemning anybody so will withhold judgement on Mason pending the results of proper independent investigation by the police and any subsequent conviction. / acquittal. Innocent til proven guilty is a cornerstone of our society.

What this case does bring into sharp relief is that the standards of discipline and player responsibility at Utd have slipped alarmingly since Fergies time. I know we are in the era of instantaneous social media but even so I do think Fergie would have imposed a stricter club code of behaviour on the younger players especially.

It's something that applies to other clubs too I suppose but we are the most famous club in the UK if not the world so the spotlight will always be on our players.

Surely all the clubs players Premier League and PFA have got to carry me together and work out a way to both educate younger players better about their behaviour and also protect them.

It's been obvious for years that giving young men unfettered riches when they often come from relatively poor / unstable backgrounds and with little education is not likely to end well.

Why can't there be a salary cap for all players under say 21 or even say on a sliding scale to under 25 so that they only get access to a limited percentage of their salary. The rest would be invested for them for when they are better able to handle big sums of money. These kids need proper guidance or they end up destroying their own lives and the lives of family around them. You wouldn't give a loaded shotgun to someone not trained to handle it properly.

I know this may all sound very idealistic and not realistic but someone somewhere has to grasp the nettle. Go back to basics. Let the kids clean the older players boots. It won't kill them. Get them all off social media. Get them to go to hospitals once a week and take part with the local community. Build them up as people. In touch with the world not isolated from it living in a bubble of money and glamour which is not real.

If all clubs got together they could make a huge difference. The ultimate winners would be the young players themselves and the clubs as the players would be more rounded more responsible more grateful have longer careers and be decent human beings.

1.) 30 Jan 2022
30 Jan 2022 23:45:53
Salford this kind of behaviour has been going on for years. Maybe not to this extent.

Keane had a dust up before the 99 cup final- Rooney many over the years.

2.) 31 Jan 2022
31 Jan 2022 00:24:31
Realised I hit send too early.

I agree with absolutely everything else Salford- but unfortunately these players are always going to be surrounded by yes men and people who don’t have their best interest at heart, only looking for a few quid.

3.) 31 Jan 2022
31 Jan 2022 00:26:22
The fact the lass had hindsight to record it shows this is no isolated incident. You have to err on the side of caution of innocent til proven guilty with such a sensitive subject. The evidence is there to see. Forget the fact he's ruined his career, he's ruined that poor girls life and that should take precedence. **** him.

4.) 31 Jan 2022
31 Jan 2022 01:27:12
Salford, if you're not condemning him you're defending him. Waiting for a "verdict" because innocent until proven guilty is the cornerstone of society? Like another poster on here you lack any sort of moral compass. The cornerstone of a society isn't what you can prove in court, it's treat your fellow man/ woman/ child with decency and respect.

This isn't another story of "footballer accused of XYZ" this a girl in an incredibly abusive relationship having the foresight to gather evidence to stop her abuser. A single solitary young girl is taking on a multi millionaire sporting prodigy in a scenario that's normally impossible to prove.

Look at the pictures and listen to the audio. If you're still sitting on the fence waiting for a verdict then you're a part of the problem. Use your brain and see what unfolded in real time. If it was fake it would have been buried. If it was fake we would have woken up to s statement from Greenwood claiming his innocence. Read the room, sponsors and his club have put the wheels in motion to have him gone.

To think for one second that rich famous people don't get away with abhorrent behaviour all the time is incredibly naive. This girl has nothing to gain by lying in public and everything to lose.

Use your head and don't post nonsense defending this scumbag.

5.) 31 Jan 2022
31 Jan 2022 02:15:59
Mumbles 100% the victim of any crime comes first. And in no way am I condoning violence or defending Greenwood. I haven't seen the footage nor do I want to. If its so overwhelmingly clear that Greenwood has done an abhorrent thing then he has to suffer the consequences. But like anyone I want him judged in a court of law by hard facts. Not in the court of public opinion. I firmly believe in the rule of law and if this girl has had the foresight to document the claimed abuse then hopefully it will be shown in court and the guilty party get sent down.

Nobody in their right mind would condone this sort of thing. I qualified as a lawyer and was always told to listen to all the evidence and to both sides before making up my mind who was at fault.

Greenwood may or may not be as guilty as hell. I cannot prove it either way. Nor can you. Hopefully it will all come out in court.

Regarding the steps Utd have taken well that's just obvious commercial sense. They cannot afford to see the clubs image tarnished. As for Greenwood not making a statement he is presumably receiving legal advice to stay silent as he is under police investigation. Silence is not definitely of itself an indication of guilt. Every single word he might say in his own defence will be picked up and twisted by the press to feed whatever line they are taking. Guilty or innocent the likelihood is that if he opens his mouth to the press he damages his position.

Also yes money talks as does fame and it has helped people escape justice and will do in the future.

A couple of things bother me about the way the girl acted. If she was abused by anyone over time why stay with that person? Maybe her attacker scared her and she was frightened to leave him. Or maybe she was prepared to put up with some abuse in return for a lavish lifestyle. Difficult questions to answer and again I repeat there is no justification for abuse.

More importantly though is why choose to release any footage on social media. Why not go to the Police and show them evidence and let them take action. Only if they failed to do so would I resort to going public.

Thank God I am not in her position. What must she be feeling right now? Its horrendous. For her and her family. But she put herself in the full glare of the media and she must have realised how much attention it would draw. She had not made it easier for herself that's for sure.

Overall though it comes down to a lack of education and control in such young football stars. They need to learn to respect people especially women and football as a whole including us supporters are all to blame when we idolise overpaid prima donnas to the extent that they feel they are untouchable.

{Ed0666's Note - for a lawyer I’m incredulous at your naivety. You ask why she would stay in a relationship while being abused? Regardless of wether she was scared or just collecting Louis Vitton handbags she shouldn’t have to suffer alleged domestic violence within the framework of that union.. As to why release footage on Social media and not go to the police maybe she thought that she was dating a multi-millionaire who has money and power and friends in high places and her allegations would be covered up but if she puts her circumstances on Social media it’s there for all to see and can’t be hushed up. One thing I do agree with you is that this is just allegations at present and nothing has been proved in a court of law.

6.) 31 Jan 2022
31 Jan 2022 07:09:15
Get a grip Salford. Why did she stay in the relationship? Why do many people stay in abusive relationships? Fear of worse retaliation and threats, emotional blackmail and even truly loving and hoping that person will change. What an absolutely disgusting sentiment to question that poor girl. Absolute prick comes to mind.

7.) 31 Jan 2022
31 Jan 2022 07:29:37
Salford I can’t believe what you are saying there, it’s like it’s partly her fault for staying if it’s true. There are countless numbers of women and men stuck in abusive relationship and not 1% of it is there fault. Nobody is saying throw him to the wolves till all the facts are out but statements like that should never be said unless you are stuck in a relationship like that nobody knows what it’s like or how hard it is to get out of one.
The problem with these you kids they get the world before they have even kicked a ball in top flight football and are treated like they are something they are not I wonder how more players are doing things like this and nobody is saying anything.
When you get Ronaldo making a statement like the you players don’t listen to players like him says it all about the young players coming through nowadays.

8.) 31 Jan 2022
31 Jan 2022 07:57:30
I don't know how much more the club can do - I am sure there are some lessons to be learned going forward but these young men on 75k a week as reported are off home at 3pm each day to do what they please and you can't know what they are up to who they are with and what their morals are or their attitude towards drugs, women, booze, gambling.

We don't know what goes on behind anyones closed doors including managers, journos, club directors so how can the clubs police this?

Plenty of photos last week of players jetting off for a break from all clubs, all going out ont booze and looking to meet girls no doubt as many of us did as young men- there will always be one lad or a hanger on who will do something very questionable with the vast majority being decent lads. Who knows how these lads have been bought up, was violence or booze a factor in their childhoods.

Anyone looking at what's happening in USA with their young mega wealthy NFL nad basketball players will see its a problem everywhere with common factors :young men/ money/ celebrity/ ego/ entitlement - a bad apple will alwazs be a bad apple, holding clubs to account is going to be very difficult.

9.) 31 Jan 2022
31 Jan 2022 08:12:45
The last part of your statement about all footballers need to respect and be educated is disrespectful. The vast majority of young players are. You get the odd wrongun in all walks of life football hasn’t made MG do what he has allegedly done! And neither has being rich! How must your own Marcus Rashford feel with statements like that being flung around? You sit there and think he dragging your clubs name through the mud yet you aim the same disrespect to all young footballers. It’s not a football issue he is just a footballer.

10.) 31 Jan 2022
31 Jan 2022 08:21:24
My only suggestion to Salford would be to go and look up the photos and audio. It's not easy to see or hear but the only thing that would make Greenwood innocent is if its not him in the audio.

This isn't a scenario where its a 'he said, she said', which is the very reason many don't say anything as its so difficult to prove. This is someone, most likely him, on tape pressuring the lass into sleeping with him.

As for why she put it on social media, that's her prerogative but maybe she felt that was the only way she would get heard, which in itself is a problem.

If by some miracle the lad is innocent then ill hold my hands up, but the audio in particular is pretty damning.

What ever has gone on I hope Harriet can get the support she needs as none of this is on her and no one deserves to be in a scenario where they are beaten by a 'loved one'.

11.) 31 Jan 2022
31 Jan 2022 08:55:36
There are no excuses, while the legal process and the social backlash are different things and they must remain separate entities. The fact remains the photos, video and sound clip exist and if you have seen them then you will have likely seen the main bits of evidence that any jury would see. In cases like this there is rarely any evidence as explicit as this.

As such I think it's probably fair for people to be allowed to draw their own conclusions from what they see and hear.

That doesn't make him legally guilty, that's a separate process as I have said.

Like many have pointed out the fact that she has been able to document this proves that it isn't a one off incident.

I disagree entirely that him being a footballer, or famous or having a lot of money have lead to him doing this. Acting like that comes from deep within someone's psyche, it's a part of who they are and how they grew up. Things outside of any clubs control.

The vast majority of abusers aren't footballers, aren't wealthy or famous. They sadly are our neighbors, colleagues, friends and family members. This sort of thing goes on under cover, hidden from a society that for the most part would prefer to pretend it doesn't exist.

While Mason having fame and fortune and the power that comes with those things will have contributed probably in the mind of the young victim when she thought about how she could speak out, it certainly isn't the thing that made him act that way.

She is the one who deserves our protection, she is the one who deserves our care and comfort. She is the one who needs that, as she is confronting something that we all prey our mums, sisters, partners or daughters never have to face.

Any such language used to urge caution, to justify what he did, to suggest people need to wait for a legal verdict, etc only works to make life harder for victims to come forward as that sort of language proves that people within society won't believe them, and would prefer to not have to deal with this issue.

12.) 31 Jan 2022
31 Jan 2022 09:42:38
Totally agree Mumbles.

A very very small percentage of women come forward in these circumstances and an even smaller percentage of those claims actually lead to convictions. Women need to be supported here and encouraged to come out more because it is completely unacceptable.

13.) 31 Jan 2022
31 Jan 2022 09:44:36
Salford, you've shown your hand here mate and it's quite frankly disgraceful. "100% the victim of any crime comes first" and then you list off reasons why you think she could be lying? Again, for someone who has qualified as a lawyer you don't seem to have the relative skills to grasp information. Have you ever even seen, read or known anyone in an abusive relationship? It's incredibly complicated and difficult to leave your abuser. You're literally blaming her for being abused.

Who thought you in law school Lionel Hutz? You're thought to look at all the evidence and hear both sides of the story before making your mind up, only to not review the evidence at all and throw out statements about why the girl could be lying? Ed666 is completely right. You are incredibly naive.

14.) 31 Jan 2022
31 Jan 2022 11:46:41
I have read a lot of asinine posts on here and elsewhere on internet and written quite a few of them myself but salford yours takes the cake, i won't judge him guilty just yet but let's cut youngster's pay just to be safe also let's treat them like some sort of an unpaid intern we can bully, clean other people's shoes? really? Paul gascoigne wass a 52 year old when he forcibly kissed a woman on subway because he pitied her for her looks. But sure its just a problem with just young people who can't handle money. The second post i won't even touch, you have gone from i won't judge the accused based off clear audio and photo evidence but i might wonder aloud whether the victim is a stupid gold digger.

15.) 31 Jan 2022
31 Jan 2022 12:45:06
CDM, it doesn't sit well that a poor women's abuse is being used as a stick to beat all young footballers. Or to push an agenda such as wage caps, or salary restrictions etc.

To try and push this off as a crime only committed by young privileged people who have money and fame seems odd.

I've sat in a court room as a juror for a sex crime case. The defendant wasn't young, uneducated or extremely wealthy, he wasn't famous or had any sort of influence or power. He was an accountant in his fifties. Yet he still felt he could do as he pleased to a young girl as society doesn't speak up enough for the victims of these crimes.

People are quick to make excuses for the perpetrators, or blame the victims. And thus the cycle of abuse continues. Unless you're speaking out against it then you are a part of the problem.

16.) 31 Jan 2022
31 Jan 2022 12:45:17
Salford, a victim of domestic abuse will suffer on average anywhere up to 35 incidents of abuse before calling police. When I joined, I used to think, why do they put up with it, why don't they report him, or at least leave? It was so frustrating at times seeing horrible bullies smirking at the victim and us, when they realised they were getting away with it again.

I soon realised it is nowhere near that easy. Fear, finances, children, cut off from friends or family. The list is long. It takes an incredible amount of strength to finally make that decision to say, no more.

17.) 31 Jan 2022
31 Jan 2022 18:05:22
Chelsea fan here in peace.

There's no denying that what Greenwood has done is absolutely disgusting and vile. Domestic abuse and rape has no place in the modern world. However Salford, your comments of why she would just put up with it and not leave him are out of place and naive at best.
Having seen my best friend being in an abusive relationship, I can tell you that leaving is easier said than done. The abuse never starts immediately, it is a process which enables it to become the new norm in the relationship. Many people in abusive relationships are either too afraid too leave, or in my friend's case, too in love with the person to realise that something is wrong.
Furthermore, assuming that the rumours of the club knowing about it since 2020 are true, which I genuinely don't hope is the case, then it would also go a long way towards explaining why she posted it on social media, as she might be afraid the club would find a way to cover it up if she went to the police.

18.) 31 Jan 2022
31 Jan 2022 18:33:27
Just realised I didn’t read Salford’s post properly. Very little of it I agree with. I have a daughter and shudder to think anything like this would happen to her.