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03 Sep 2023 20:56:57
On a positive not Hojlund looks a real threat. Can’t wait to see him in the starting line up. He did great for Garnachos goal that never was, wonderful close control, strength and vision and then a good pass as well to start the move. A target man to aim for who can fight with defenders, battled for every ball, won a few battles, the difference in our play from when he came on was obvious. Looking forward to seeing him in the starting line up on the future.
24 Aug 2023 19:40:54
Just seen a post on the Liverpool page and thought it might be fun to try something similar here. So…
1. Best moment as a United fan (you have to been alive/ old enough to watch it lol)
2. Favourite player you’ve seen play for the club.
3. Most underrated player that’s played
4. Player you were sad to see leave the club
5. Player you wish we signed that we were linked to
6. Best moment being a United fan and why
So I’ll start.
1. Winning the champions league final in 2008. Was in a pub surrounded by Chelsea fans and was just an amazing moment.
2. My favourite player was Rooney. Immense talent and just depicted everything a United player should be, gave absolutely everything in every game in his prime and just incredible to watch.
3. I think Michael Carrick was so under appreciated, I remember having a conversation with my brother about this and he thought he wasn’t good enough, but I just thought he was integral in the team and was gladly proven right.
4. Obviously sad to see Ronaldo leave for Madrid. In his prime he was unplayable and I just knew there would never be a replacement to live up to him. Best player of all time in his prime imo.
5. Was so gutted when we failed to sign Ronaldinho. I remember reading the newspapers every day in the corner shop I worked at, hoping desperately for the news we had signed him. When he went to Barcelona I was devastated and remember just being in a mood for about a week lol.
6. Best moment for me as a United fan was the 8-2 win over Arsenal. I’d gone to my best friends house who was a massive Arsenal fan to watch the game. And although it was all in jest he was overly confident and a touch arrogant. To see him sink into his chair as the goals kept coming was quite a special moment haha.
1.) 24 Aug 2023 20:33:19
1. 99 for me, we had my favourite group of players.
2. Cantona, I remember crying for days when he left
3.paul Scholes, a lot of people underrate how good he was. If not then park ji-sung for the same reason.
4. Tevez because he went to city.
5. Kane, we would have won a lot of trophies with him in the team.
6. The cl final 99,I don't even have to explain it. The emotions that day were mental.
2.) 24 Aug 2023 21:26:17
1. 93 Steve Bruce. waited so long and we just knew finally a title
2. Scholes. just a brilliant player
3. Carrick. the fact united only realised how good he was when he wasn't there. Never been replaced
4. Mark Hughes. thought he'd stay another year plus he was like Scholes, one of my favourites
5. Zidane. oh I wish Eric and fergie got him instead of juve. Could you image Zidane in that midfield?
6. Has to be Barcelona 99.what a night. Every united supporter who went has a great story about that night. With a huge smile.
3.) 24 Aug 2023 21:51:17
1. Best moment as a United fan (you have to been alive/ old enough to watch it lol)
The treble in 99. Specifically listening to extra time of the FA cup semi final on the radio, and people running out of their houses into the streets when we equalised against Bayern.
2. Favourite player you’ve seen play for the club.
Rooney followed very closely by Scholes.
3. Most underrated player that’s played
Park Ji Sung, he was so good at his job.
4. Player you were sad to see leave the club
Ruud van Nistelrooy, I still remember the hours long phone calls when the news broke.
5. Player you wish we signed that we were linked to
Ronaldinho is the obvious one but the. We would t have signed Ronaldo. More recently I wish we’d signed Son of Spurs 5 years ago.
6. Best moment being a United fan and why
Same as Q1.
4.) 24 Aug 2023 22:00:43
99 cl final. Had the pleasure of being there a great night.
Robson and Scholes were my fav players to play for united.
Beckham ability was underrated by many. He was a top player imo.
Tevez gutted to see him go as I am gutted Greenwood is going. Rvn also.
Batistuta And Ronaldinho were 2 big misses imo
Best moment as a fan was 77 fa cup final. My 1st winning cup final to be at. Was only 8 and I remember it so well.
Sadly I have very little respect for a lot of the club employees today. The glazers ole ralph and a good amount of the players have done their best to destroy most of what made United great.
I'm happy to sit back and wait for the last of oles weak minded crew to be sold and hopefully the glazers and then we can start to rebuild with intent.
5.) 24 Aug 2023 22:27:57
1, Late in May in 1999…. Ole scored a goal in injury time, what a feeling, what a night.
2, Scholes……pure genius
3, Ronny Johnsen……classy centre half and never got the credit he deserved
4, DDG……club legend and got treated like a t**t
5, Gazza……would have had a statue at United
6, See answer to 1
I’ll add in an extra question.
7, Worst signing
Angel Di Maria for me. Came in for all the wrong reasons and lacked any form of spine.
6.) 24 Aug 2023 22:45:58
Some great answers so far. Obviously I knew 99 would be high on everyone’s list of greatest moments. The reason I didn’t pick it myself was I would have been 13 and not really into football much and didn’t really appreciate the moment.
Scholes was close to being my favourite ever player but Rooney just pipped him for me, purely because I just loved his attitude on the pitch. He played with venom.
Agree definitely with Beckham being underrated. Many still underrate him sadly. I think his lifestyle detracted how good he actually was on the pitch.
And RVN leaving what a great player and so sadly missed. He probably would have been my favourite ever United player if he finished his career with us. Absolutely deadly. Such a sad day when he left.
Oh and Zidane at United, just imagine him next to Scholes. We would have been unplayable.
7.) 25 Aug 2023 00:30:47
99 league, Fa cup, UCL final, what a few weeks that was to be alive.
Scholes and Vidic.
Rooney, still can't believe some fans don't class him as a legend of the club. He was fantastic, but somehow people put him down for not being ronaldo. He was a proper baller who you could put in goal and he would do everything to be the best keeper. Rashford should take note.
Luka modric - was the perfect scholes replacement. What a player, I thought we could get him. Would have won a few more titles and UCLs if he had joined in my opinion.
8.) 25 Aug 2023 01:02:55
Barca 99
Robson
Irwin
Stam
Gazza, Ronaldinho was very close but we went for Gazza. Gazza and MU were made for each other and Fergie back then was what Gazza needed and to be honest we needed a Gazza then.
Best moment was Arthur Albiston watching me play cricket and then have a word and complement my game after. He had no idea who i was or that i was United fan, was playing in my first LL match for Rishton as a kid, got to remember back then we had Michael Holding Allan Donakd, Jason Gillespie turn out playing for us! A throwaway moment for him but for me it was magic.
9.) 25 Aug 2023 03:52:00
1. 2 May 1993
2-4. Jesper Olsen
5. Shearer
6. 9 April 1986, first visit to OT. We lost to Chelsea, think Kerry Dixon scored the winner.
10.) 25 Aug 2023 07:56:20
1. 99 Final
2. Robson absolute warrior
3. Irwin Stam and Steve Coppell
4. Ronaldo
5. So many Gazza Shearer Ronaldinho Zidane Nedved
6. 99 winning league in 93 and knocking those pesky Scousers off their perch.
11.) 25 Aug 2023 09:49:25
1. 99
2. Scholes
3. Ronnie Johnson, quick man marking machine.
4. Stam, Ronaldo, Forlan, Veron. There are many.
5. Zinane, Ronaldinho, Riquelme, Di Canio, Gazza, Batistuta. can't pick 1.
6. Away leg against Juventus in the semi of the CL against a great Juventus side.
12.) 25 Aug 2023 13:07:49
1. Being behind the goal where Ole scored the winner at the Nou Camp in 99, seeing the ball going up into the roof of the net.
2. Ronaldo, because his debut was something I had never seen the like of, knew we had a great on our hands and he propelled us upwards.
3. Billy Foulkes. Knew him, wonderful man, what a story, yet the stories of 68 are almost always about others
4. Ronaldo the first time, definitely not the second
5. Brazilian Ronaldo
6. 1984, Stretford End, Stapleton getting the third goal to beat Maradona’s Barcelona 3-0. What an incredible experience that was.
13.) 25 Aug 2023 18:28:48
1.99. The trip itself was Planes, Trains and Automobiles stuff, never mind only getting hold of tickets just as Bayern scored.
2. Gordon Hill.
3. Dennis Irwin.
4. Stam
5. Batigol
6. First game. Dad was a Leeds man, but all my uncles were Utd men. They got me to OT, before my dad got me to Elland Rd. The rest is history.
06 Aug 2023 15:04:25
I understand the above points about arguing with officials not changing corruption but what it does do is bring attention to awful decisions. It creates a talking point and highlights the corruption. It forces the cameras to focus on the incident and force replays of the contentious decision. Take that away and you’ve got refs who have complete immunity. Which in my opinion is why the FA want to “clamp down” on players arguing with officials.
1.) 06 Aug 2023 16:53:30
You're obviously quite young but that's ridiculous. The problem is in the process to make complaints and it to be a learning process rather than having this binary thing of brilliance vs corruption. The reality is rarely either. I think you'd find that if referees were better rewarded and we'd a clearer retrospective on their performance that included team representatives we'd see a big reduction in poor decisions.
2.) 06 Aug 2023 17:18:38
I’m not sure if you’d class nearly 40 young or old, but my age has nothing to do with it. I’m discussing obvious corruption here, these errors by referees are not simply ‘mistakes’, it is corruption. It’s not ‘inconsistency’ is targeting certain players and clubs. Fabinho for example for Liverpool would be allowed countless fouls before being carded, but Casemiro would be carded for the first foul committed. This is just one example of what I’ve seen and there are many more. Solksjaer highlighted this himself at one point and pointed out the ref guidelines for United were targeting our players. I’m not just talking about United here though. This is across the board. The FA is a corrupt organisation, and refs and VAR are being used to influence games and manufacture results.
3.) 06 Aug 2023 18:20:10
Pretty big accusations to be throwing about without any proof, fella. Go on social media. Every fan thinks their club is always on the wrong end of decisions. It was certainly the case amongst opposition fans when they played us under Fergie.
4.) 06 Aug 2023 18:40:23
So if plYers don't shout at refs, the refs have complete immunity? From what exactly? Give me an example of the corruption you are referring to.
5.) 06 Aug 2023 19:09:40
Yes they have complete immunity AJH. Take away the last avenue of public criticism and what are you left with? An organisation that can do what it likes and nobody is even allowed to voice their complaints publicly. Or else they throw the “bringing football into disrepute” card at you. The referees and FA do that all by themselves.
As for an example let’s take Man Cities persistent tactical fouling. They do it consistently and very rarely get punished. Against Arsenal today Rodri did it twice, and not one card for either incident, and it’s not just today this is a regular occurrence. I’ve seen however many other teams be carded and even sent off for these exact same fouls. Yet City do it week in week out and rarely get anything again at them given. This isn’t just inconsistency, it’s obvious corruption as different refs all around the country are allowing them to get away with this, yet other teams week in week out are punished for these same fouls. There are loads of examples. Liverpools FA cup run last season was littered with disgraceful decisions. Penalties not given against them. Goals unfairly ruled out, extremely dubious penalties given in their favour. No doubt I’ll have people calling me biased as I’m a United fan, but I’m just talking about examples that stand out from recent memory. I’m sure Brighton fans would agree with me here on the Liverpool FA cup game.
6.) 06 Aug 2023 19:19:11
Oh and just to add to the absurdities from todays game, whilst Rodri got away with fouling Arsenal players and potentially stopping goal scoring opportunities, Partey got carded for kicking the ball 5 yards towards where the foul took place. Footballs becoming increasingly absurd.
7.) 06 Aug 2023 19:37:34
That isn't corruption, it's poor referring, and possibly poor VAR decisions, which is not corruption. And effing and jeffing at the ref doesn't make any difference at all.
8.) 06 Aug 2023 19:55:39
Poor refereeing from every single referee in the country who are making the same “mistakes” which always seem to benefit or disadvantage particular teams? I used to believe it was simply negligence, but it’s happening far too regularly for it to be merely negligence.
9.) 06 Aug 2023 20:42:23
It's worse that you're nearly 40. Most people that say and think in that way grow out of it long before then. If this is how you view things then the world is probably quite a tough and anger-inducing place for you. Quite genuinely I'd urge you to take a step back. There are certainly plenty of wrong decisions and plenty of room for improvement at all levels of refereeing but calling it corrupt is unfounded.
10.) 06 Aug 2023 20:55:57
I know too many people who just simply drift through life with their eyes closed Don. They don’t see the corruption because they don’t want to see it. The world is corrupt from top to bottom. Anyway I’m not going to go down this route as the thread may get moved to the talksense forum haha.
11.) 07 Aug 2023 09:09:56
Not whilst you’re involved in the thread.
06 Aug 2023 12:53:19
Noticed yesterday people were stating that they would inflict greater punishment on players for arguing with officials. I completely disagree. Firstly football is a game of passion, take away another outlet for players to vent there frustrations and passion for the game is just another nail in footballs ever growing coffin.
Also refs these days are a disgrace. Corruption is rife as demonstrated by the Barcelona scandal, and I personally think refs in the PL are being told to target certain players and clubs, and to take away any right to question them on the pitch is ridiculous in my opinion. They are already seemingly immune as soon as the game is over so the only time they can be questioned is on the pitch, and that should never be changed.
1.) 06 Aug 2023 13:12:17
There is lots wrong with the game. Being able to vent at officials will not end corruption in the game. You will always have some sort of corruption to a dagree due to the eye watering sums of money involved.
You mention the Spanish game but no amount of arguing with officials on the pitch will stop say Messi, Barcelona, Real Madrid, the Spanish national team, nike and certain doctors from doing what they do. That has to come from the very top. It runs through the game at various levels. I think captains speaking to the referees only is fair. They can speak for every player and raise other things at half time along with a coach/ manager.
Referees should be more accountable at the top of the game bit how do you do it? They will still make the odd mistake even with the help of Var (which is also clearly not idiot proof and is overused/ wrongly used imo) .
2.) 06 Aug 2023 13:14:21
Rugby is also a game of passion and yet they act more like gentleman and question decisions in the correct way. For me it isn’t about questioning officials, it is more about how it is done.
Screaming in someone’s face or crowding around them is never the correct option. Leave it to the captain to speak to the referee alone and in the right way. Set an example for the people, especially children, watching.
3.) 06 Aug 2023 15:04:43
Utter rubbish
Rugby is a game of passion, the NFL a game of passion. Players get themselves fired up. Have you seen the Haka or Ireland at Croke Park against England. the Welsh belting out the national anthemn Ray Lewis pre game entrance then speeches to his team. Guys in tears during the Anthem, both players and coaches.
In these sports the treat the ref with respect. If they behaved like 16002844 they would be kicked off the field.
Footballers disrespect of the refs is nothing to do with passion, its due to the authorities ignoring it.
Take a rugby player or NFL player who are literally smashing the crap out of each other and then will call the ref Sir when addressing him.
And if anyone does start jawing at the ref, their teamates and opposition will step in and take them away. The respect is invrained in the athletes. If football carded people for jawing at the ref it would stop immediately.
The crowd would still be as passiinate, the players would stip fight and scrap to win, they just wouldn't be throwing paddies like a toddler screaming at the ref.
As for refs, simply mike them up and record the interaction between ref and VAR like cricket.
Then after every weekend have th head of the refs explain decisions both good and bad. Take all the ambiguity out so fans can understand why. Its common for fans to be uo in arms about oerfectly correct decisions because they don't understand the rules. The pu dits don't either amd so this compounds the problem because just cause Micah Richards or Roy Keane don't know the rule and so use the interpretation from when they played.
If we are transparant then Micah and Roy can stop talking about the ref being erong but the debate can move to the rule being wrong, which it might well be and that is the real debate.
Explaining right and wrong decisions will improve fan knowledge will increase ref professionalism and consistency and highlight the rules which need changing. No long term bad will come of this, it has worked in other sports, why doesn't football follow.
4.) 06 Aug 2023 15:41:16
Oakbark, I understand your points, and I don’t know much about the NFL or Rugby for that matter, but I do know that what I’ve seen in football reeks of corruption in the last 10 years or so.
Under these new rules that are being proposed we would have likely never seen Drogba justifiably screaming at the ref and shouting at the cameras “it’s a f**%*%g disgrace” for fear of a ban. It was an absolute disgrace in that champions league game and that’s just one example. I’ve seen far too much corruption in the last few years and it’s left me disillusioned when it comes to football these days, and I actually enjoy seeing players arguing what I see and I think they see as corrupt decisions.
Managers and players aren’t even allowed to criticise refs and decisions really without fear of reprisal, and that’s why we see them acting like robots in front of the cameras and not saying their true feelings. I don’t want to see that seeping onto the pitch as well.
Frustrations at the ref affect performances, players don’t perform well if they’re feeling hard done by and carrying around frustration. Being able to vent that frustration is an important part of the game, and I don’t see any problem whatsoever with refs getting shouted at for disgraceful decisions. This modern society seems to want to stifle true emotion and passion and everyone’s afraid of offending, and becoming far to easily offended themselves. Snowflake is the perfect description of modern western man imo.
5.) 06 Aug 2023 18:26:26
It's nothing to do with being a snowflake. Unless you think rugby fans and players are all snowflakes! I'm as old-school as they come. But old-school to me also means behaving in a certain manner when you represent the club on the pitch, or just behaving in a certain manner full stop. Showing respect for someone doing a difficult, undervalued job is not being a snowflake.
6.) 06 Aug 2023 18:37:26
I couldn't disagree more. Venting at the ref is a stain on the game, both by players and managers. It's not about beint a snowflake, it's about the example it sets, i5 suggests that type of behaviour is ok, we see it triclking all the way down to Sunday League, referees being threatened or even assaulted.
It's only football that has this problem, it needs stampimg out with a zero tolerance approach.
7.) 06 Aug 2023 19:14:58
AJH, I keep hearing this argument about it trickling down to Sunday league. You seriously think some 30 year old blokes playing for the Kings Head on a Sunday morning, after going out getting hammered the night before, are going to care that Fernandes of Man United doesn’t back chat the ref, before they attack a referee?
That is about personal responsibility and being able to control your temper. Sadly something too many people can’t seem to do these days. It has absolutely nothing to do with professional footballers.
8.) 06 Aug 2023 19:33:36
JE888 having played rugby for 11 years before having the ability to play taken from me, I can tell you the treatment refs get is important.
Football refs are treat like absolute sh1t. I’ve played low level football and seen refs attacked. Never happened in my time playing rugby.
Ultimately, referees are human beings. Would you advocate walking about to Harry Maguire and screaming vile abuse at him after a mistake? No you wouldn’t. Without refs we have no game, ask yourself why would any young person want to be a ref?
9.) 06 Aug 2023 19:40:36
Yes I do, kids imitate what they see and it is deemed 'acceptable'. It is getting harder and harder to find refs for grass roots football because of the abuse they get off players and spectators.
We aren't going to agree, you think it is ok, I think it is llcompletely unacceptable and should be stamped out.
10.) 06 Aug 2023 19:58:40
These are not kids, they are grown men, and if you think that potential jail time for assault isn’t going to deter them from attacking a referee, but stopping players in the Premier League from back chatting refs will, then I really don’t know what to say to that.
11.) 06 Aug 2023 20:06:24
Caolan, no I don’t condone it one bit, but this is more to do with the type of characters you get playing football in comparison to rugby and other sports. Rugby tends to attract middle class private school boys and farmers etc. Football at lower levels attracts thugs, not all but many. Also in rugby the aggression is left on the pitch, the players take their frustrations out on each other, whereas in football the frustration gets taken out on the ref. I’m not condoning it at all, just explaining why the sports are different. Personally I think what happens at grassroot football is more of an indictment of modern society and culture than it is of a reflection of televised football.
12.) 06 Aug 2023 23:54:16
JE888. Maybe that assumption you have of rugby is based in England is correct. In Ireland it’s Most certainly a game for everyone. Perhaps that’s why Irish rugby is flying at the moment. I also make these comments after our national team captain has been banned for comments made to a match official that I would guess are made 20/ 30 times a game by players in football.
I have seen gaelic players give vile abuse to officials yet on a rugby pitch they keep their mouth shut and respect the official.
If players can verbally abuse another human and not at least get a yellow card, then the same will happen at all levels. Only the captain should be allowed to speak to the referee.
I can tell you that what you see on tv influences the whole way down. Kids view players as their hero and will follow their hero’s actions on the pitch.
The big difference is from a young age in rugby you’re taught to respect the referee and get on with it. In football it’s not the same.
13.) 07 Aug 2023 03:54:22
Wow! Condoning bad behavior to that degree. It’s about respect. If you bring in new rules then that will permeate to lower divisions. Rules are rules. The abuse referees and linesmen get is just disgusting. It needs to stop. People condoning it are part of the problem.
14.) 07 Aug 2023 05:09:17
And corruption? Have a spell!
15.) 07 Aug 2023 09:18:04
I think the ref should be allowed to berate and abuse players when they make a mistake by losing possession, oops my bad, act in a corrupt manner by misplacing a pass etc. I can see the full officiating team crowding a player calling him a cheat for a mistake. What a load of utter nonsense you speak. And trying to justify appalling behaviour because of the council estate type of person drawn to football is not only dumb but also rude and incredibly demeaning. Pathetic reasoning.
16.) 07 Aug 2023 12:57:42
Fizz ??? second time this week.
04 Aug 2023 08:20:22
Hi all, so used to post on here a long time ago under a different name, but forgot the password. Just wanted to weigh in on the Greenwood debate as it seems many here have appointed themselves as judge jury and executioner.
Firstly a few facts. Greenwood was not taken to trial because of “new evidence” that was brought to light. Nobody knows what that evidence was. His girlfriends phone was hacked and the audio leaked onto her Instagram.
She didn’t upload it, and she did not press any charges. The charges were brought about by the CPS and police. She did not press any charges and they did not at any point “break up and are now back together” as I’ve seen mentioned.
They were together the entire time although the police and courts issued a none communication order against him, which they both broke, as was widely reported. There was no evidence of any domestic violence, pictures were taken from her Instagram, which you can only assume were Halloween pictures with incredibly obvious fake blood dripping down her face and falsely and disingenuously attributed on social media to “domestic violence”.
If the CPS at any time thought those pictures were evidence of domestic violence he would be in court, but the charges were dropped. Her own dad publicly stated that he thought the allegations were completely false. Those are her own fathers words, but social media as always knows better of course.
Finally all anyone has ever heard is a 20 second edited clip with zero context and nobody knows what happened before or after except those two people. It could have been quite literally anything. Role play, a little bit of a forceful advance by Greenwood, I’m sure many other reasons.
The one thing I take from it is in the audio she doesn’t sound distressed at all, and just calmly says no. Anyone who was under any threat of “sexual abuse” as has been bandied around on social media, would not be acting in such a calm manner. Anyway I’m only making this post as I’m quite disgusted by the witch hunt going on.
I don’t really care too much about football anymore, but I do care about a young man’s life and character being scrutinised based on basically nothing. I don’t for one second believe he is guilty of anything, and I’m tired of the court of social media ruining peoples lives. Anyway, that’s all I wanted to say.
1.) 04 Aug 2023 08:57:00
Always good to hear the other sides opinion i guess.
My non professional non judicial opinion of MG is he seems a wrongun but i don't know if that is enough legally to dispose of his services or stop him playing for the club again.
One way or another the club needs to make a decision about his future soon as i wouldn’t want it dragging on for another season start.
2.) 04 Aug 2023 09:09:13
Sorry mate. That’s clutching at straws. He did it - no point in justifying. No one ever came out and said he did not. If she had told the police that it was Halloween and had other witnesses he would never be charged.
Completely agree that it’s 3 lives which need to put in the centre of this - Mason, the girl and the baby. It’s up to the club and his parents and families to do what’s best for everyone. It’s got nothing to do with Football.
3.) 04 Aug 2023 10:41:39
Lets just be glad AngelRed is not working for the CPS. I seem to remember CR7 had similarities to a case of his own which money made go away and let's not forget Rhodri the poor guy.
Nobody stopped sucking Ryans leftc toe when he was playing very close to home. Is his assault case finished.
We all make mistakes nobody is perfect so give the lad a chance and wait for his story to tell when he comes back.
4.) 04 Aug 2023 10:42:21
We've done this to death and need to move on but seriously? 'Role play, a little bit of a forceful advance? '
My understanding is charges were dropped because the main witness (his girlfriend) chose not to proceed. CPS won't prosecute without an actual victim.
Whatever, as I said down the page, everyone can have a second chance but the circumstances of the incident and how it is addressed remain important and relevant.
I fully get your witch hunt point, and have some. sympathy with it, but your dismissal of the whole issue is somewhat trite.
From what I am told by people allegedly in the know, he has always been full of himself and not a particularly pleasant individual, buy he isn't alone in that.
5.) 04 Aug 2023 10:51:43
As with any incident but especially these type of ones we never fully get the full story/ picture and end up making our judgments based on what we are aware of.
I am in agreement with DSG that based on what came out and other stories about Greenwood I am not sure he has a great character.
Also, the length of time it has taken for the club to investigate/ come to a decision etc also leads me to think that they are not convinced by the innocence story.
Unfortunately I come from a position of seeing domestic abuse happen to my sister from her ex partner and the convincing lies that were told, controlling behaviour and how long it took for her to eventually be strong enough to walk away.
This positions me to have clarity that I do not want anyone involved in this behaviour at my club. does it mean that I may be blinded to this being a different situation. possibly!
But, with what I have read and until I am provided with information that categorically says otherwise I think they should move him on.
6.) 04 Aug 2023 11:34:48
Ever thought that she was trying to stay calm so as to not provoke him?
Obviously everyone is entitled to have an opinion. However, I feel like you are looking at things from a perspective where you don't want him to be guilty. Obviously others might look at it from a perspective where they want him to be guilty.
Ultimately the case was dropped due to "insufficient evidence", which just means that the evidence doesn't meet the threshold for the CPS to take the case to court.
Unfortunately I've had experiences where I have been exposed to victims of domestic abuse. I was happy to be able to help in whatever little way I was able to, but it's incredibly distressing to witness.
Judging from everything I've heard about Greenwood I really wouldn't be surprised if he was an abusive person.
7.) 04 Aug 2023 11:38:41
So why didn’t the girl come out immediately and say otherwise?
8.) 04 Aug 2023 12:59:49
Footballing wise alone, there’s an awful lot a coach like ETH can do with Mason Greenwood if he stays.
We’ve been very wasteful of chances, and prior to this incident, he was the club’s most clinical finisher with the a unity to strike the ball with both feet equally well.
Footballing wise alone, his return to the squad would be exciting and a great addition to the forward options.
9.) 04 Aug 2023 13:50:59
If we are going to talk about the case, this is why they dropped charges:
“In this case a combination of the withdrawal of key witnesses and new material that came to light meant there was no longer a realistic prospect of conviction".
So no, not the "insufficient evidence", but new evidence that came to light. So, perhaps not everything is as it seems? This would make me think it didn't happen as it was portreyed.
Also, withdrawal of key witnesses. This is a strange one to me. First of all, seems there were more than one witness. This would make me think it happened, but they got payed off or something. On second thought (but seems unlikely to me), maybe with the new evidence, they knew they don't have a strong accusation and withdrew.
Perhaps this topic should really be banned from the forum.
10.) 04 Aug 2023 14:07:46
Where to begin with this thread. I think its fair to say that both or all sides are guilty of assumption amd or spinning things to oresent as fact.
You can prosecute without a victim, don't assume that the victim was ever onboard.
Dont assume who the witness or indeed witnesses were whi withdrew their statement or statements were either, one of the charges bought in this case (coercive and controlling behaviour) actually has CPS guidance wanting testimony from Family and or friends.
Greewood was charged with Attempt raoe, sexual assault, ABH anf coercive and controlling behaviour and these were the charges layed before the court on the remand hearing last October.
There were comments atzributed to the female when the post was taken down saying that she had been hacked. These were also taken down quickly but we ca not read anything into why because the Police woud have advised to do this and not to comment further.
There were comments attributed to herfather by way of a statement but it does not say as it says here. You cam all read it for yourself. You can also see a lot of interpretations of what he said, all of which are BS and supporting the orevailing belief of who is reading it to find a way it can support their view.
11.) 04 Aug 2023 14:12:19
Absolute stupidity of the OP. Sorry. But role play. I’ve heard it a few times before, and I can’t fathom how someone can be so obnoxious to think what they witnessed was “role play”.
Do you honestly think, that a professional football player would lose out on 18+ months of their formative years, under a new manager, over a simple misunderstanding?
Do you not think, if it was role play, that the couple would’ve come out that very same day of the leak, to tell the world that it’s a huge mis-understanding?
It never ceases to amaze me the things some people will believe in order to fit a narrative, and how stupid some people make themselves look. We’ve all seen/ heard the evidence. We’ve all heard the stories that the club are considering how to integrate MG. But because he’s a very good player, some people are happy to put logic to one side and believe some made up bull crap that would’ve been quashed immediately if it were true ?♂️
Done to death as AJH said, but role play is the lowest IQ take I’ve heard throughout the whole saga.
12.) 04 Aug 2023 14:28:47
The worry in footballibg terms is the 18 months or so out of the game at a critical time in his development will be impactful. No saying its insurmountable but it isn't going to help.
Ten Hag is very possible exactly what Greenwood needed three years ago rather than Sideshow Solksjaer.
13.) 04 Aug 2023 14:42:14
This is why cases are tried in courts and we do not, based on social rumour, simply put alleged miscreants in the stocks and pelt them with rotten tomatoes or worse, whether guilty or not. We all have an opinion on this. I've stated mine. To whatever extent the allegations were true, if, after a year and half of charges, withdrawal, and internal investigation, the girlfriend, parents of girlfriend, the people at the the club (manager and team mates), and the sponsors are fine with him coming back, then I don't see why we shouldn't be too. It's time to give the lad an opportunity to show he's learned from this experience. And, IF the couple are now actually happy together, it's surely a bad idea to send him off on loan to a different country where she and the child will be socially isolated, or, staying back in the UK, separated from the father. He should get a shot at redemption and I think a disciplinarian like ETH is probably the best option to keep his feet on the ground and help turn him into a successful human being.
14.) 04 Aug 2023 23:09:54
The thing is there is not one of us who can say what has happened here with complete certainty. The only two people who know what goes on in the relationship and MG and the girlfriend.
The evidence we saw if true is repulsive. We have no context and we will never see all the evidence that is out there.
I worked on these kinds of cases for a while when I began practicing and I lasted a year. I couldn’t do it. I’ve seen the impact abusers have had and not had a conviction. I’ve seen the impact on people falsely accused.
I’ve said it before, the club can’t win. However there are countless athletes who have come back from similar allegations. There are players who have played in the premier league with similar allegations and some with worse. Footballers are not people to look up too.
I will support the club in whatever decision they make, because I don’t support a specific player. I could try and say I’d not support him, and part of me thinks he’s horrid. However if he scored in front of the kop i'd celebrate, as would all of us on here. Like I say the club can’t win here, and just like these types of legal cases, no one wins either (the majority of the time. )
15.) 04 Aug 2023 23:22:21
Regardless of the arguments either way. The lad is clearly bad news. Move him on and let someone else take the pain. We are in danger of setting a precedence here and giving young kids no example to achieve.
Now, Greenwood aside…….
As I have said this is the perfect opportunity to show these privileged kids that the club will not condone any bad press for any reason. They are paid an embarrassingly insane amount of money and if they cannot behave for 10 years and be set up for life then they don’t deserve to wear the shirt. There are kids out there that would live like hermits to play for United.
Yes yes I know, Best, Cantona, Giggs, Ronaldo, Rooney bla bla bla. But that’s all in the past. Like it or not it’s a changing world and the club needs to change with it.
If I had my way, any player caught for anything worse than farting in public would get to hand his shirt over. Again it wouldn’t take long for the message to get into their heads. How else are we going to stop this increasing trend of misbehaviour when it is almost condoned. I mean these clowns even got to keep their wages! How is that teaching them a lesson?
Grrrrrrrrrrr!
16.) 05 Aug 2023 10:01:41
This is a debate with a lot of strong opinions. Mine was expressed previously, that he would be best going out on loan this season. However, the club need to make a decision. Now.
It has been an unsavoury situation, however, innocent until proven guilty underpins our system and whether we agree or not, he is not guilty of any crime. Are we really arguing that he should be prevented from going about his job? Or to treat him far worse than actual guilty criminals? Is there no understanding of him at all? He is still a young man, forever tainted by this, maybe it will humble him a bit, maybe having a child will change him, maybe he can show he has learned and help others. Yet he has committed no crime in the eyes of the law.
He has already missed months of his career and yes that was his fault, but a decision must be made now he is legally innocent. In honesty, it’s not at all savoury, I did not like it one bit, but I may shift my opinion to seeing him stay and playing, he will have a very tough time whatever he does and will need strong support, that may come best from our club. The club will need to have the women’s team on board, the club fully behind the next steps, the PR very good, but reality is we shouldn’t keep him from playing. He may not become the player he could have been, but if the club give their full support to him, he could play for us again, even this season.
17.) 05 Aug 2023 11:24:06
great post JE.
Mumbles you keep talking if you had a daughter I appreciate that's a consideration for many
But what if you had a son in this situation?
01 Sep 2023 23:15:46
I stand by what I said last night Ahmad, he’s not a United fan. I think a rival fan coming here to troll and spread negativity. I agree no United fan talks about our players like he does.
01 Sep 2023 17:45:49
Hojlund might not score bags of goals by himself this season, I don’t think any of us are expecting him to, but I reckon he will change our style of play enough and give defenders real problems in the box that it will create space and open up chances for our other forwards. I’m not sure we need another striker, if Rashford can push on from last season, and Antony can build from what I see personally as a positive start and contribute more, add Bruno who is always good for 15+ goals, and then Hojlund maybe 10-15 goals himself, I think we will be absolutely fine in attack this year.
01 Sep 2023 16:42:19
Sorry but I trust the manager over you mate. He works with the player every day. The coaching staff will know if he’s ready. You do keep referring to Rashford, but forward players are different. A mistake at the top end of the pitch is far less likely to lead to a goal. We can’t just throw a young kid in to a top 4 challenging team with no other player who can adequately cover that position and hope for the best. It could destroy his confidence if he doesn’t do well.
Young players need bedding in. Who knows, he may get a chance and take it with both hands during Shaws injury. He may do brilliantly and keep anyone else out of the team. However he may get a chance and not do well. Then we’ve got a player who is faltering and struggling game after game and no real alternative. If that was the case he may never recover his confidence for the club.
He may end up wasting all the talent he has because we forced him to step up too soon. Have some patience. Ten Haag gave Garnacho a chance. I’m sure Fernandez will get a chance as well in time, if he’s good enough. We’ve had high hopes for many players in the past and few have worked out. Rashford so far is pretty much the only academy graduate in over 10 years who’s made the grade. Why put all this pressure on the lad?
01 Sep 2023 13:11:19
You’re seriously trying to say that because a player did well in the championship you’re automatically ready to start for a club challenging for champions league spots in the Prem Sim0? If that’s the case why don’t we just go and sign Burnley’s left back, they were gray last season in the championship, but now they’re looking like favourites for relegation. There’s a huge step up between the leagues, and I trust Ten Haags judgment as he sees the kid every day. I’d be willing to guess you didn’t watch a single Preston game last season, but you’re demanding our young kid who played for them starts. I’d also be willing to guess you’d be the first to criticise the club if we did play him and it was a disaster and ruined the young man’s confidence and potentially his career, and asking why we didn’t look to bring some cover in for Shaws injury.
01 Sep 2023 12:07:01
KDWR Shaw was our player of the season a few years ago if memory serves me correct. You can pick out a couple of games of any players career and point at bad performances. I’ve always felt when Shaws been injured we’ve been weak down that side, especially in the final third. He may not be the greatest defending full back, but attacking wise he has a great understanding and link up with Rashford. We will miss him over the next few months.
05 Sep 2023 04:08:18
True GTS. I’ve got to admit I thought it was multiple accounts and the same guy.
04 Sep 2023 22:41:49
Chris1 he’s so far made a list of every player slagging them all off. Taken the side of Sancho over Ten Haag, claimed Fred would be the best player on the pitch if we played against him, said the De Jong refused to work with Ten Haag because he knows him and that he’s a terrible manager, said that United had no budget and the signings were all terrible and they’re all Ten Haags fault. He hasn’t said a single positive thing about the club players or manager. He’s an absolute troll baiting us all and it’s worked. The site now is just full of negativity. I guarantee if we won yesterday he would be nowhere to be seen.
04 Sep 2023 19:24:24
So you’re telling me UA that after the absolute shambles the season before under Ragnick and Ole, you expected 3rd in the league and a trophy? ETH is not accepting “mediocrity”, he’s a top manager and there have been signs of where he’s trying to take us. His Ajax team played excellent football, when he took them to the Semi final of the champions league (only losing on aggregate) they were a revelation. They played excellent football and massively over achieved given where they were before he took over and the squad they had. Anyone who is criticising the manager after 1 season is an absolute joker, especially after the season we had last year which was by all accounts a success. Klopp took 4 years to win anything. Pep didn’t win the league immediately either. Arteta took 2 and a half years to get Arsenal playing the way they are today. If after 4 games into this new season which hasn’t even been that bad, you’re criticising the manager I think you’re an absolute joker.
04 Sep 2023 19:00:31
You do talk some absolute tripe Trafford. His substitutions aren’t the best? His subs yesterday nearly won us the game. Last season I think we scored more goals from the bench than any other team. Ahh yes winning the Dutch league is garbage, the Dutch have no idea how to play football. Only the premier league is any good. Alienates players? Who a sulking sancho who was told to buck his ideas up. He’s been outstanding for us since he joined right? Best player I’ve ever seen in a United shirt. Well worth nearly 400,00k a week. Worth every penny. Seriously he’s been awful and someone needed to call him out. His reaction last night has shown his true colours though and why he’s never lived up to his talent. I suppose if Sancho leaves he will be our best player like you said about Fred the other day ?.
04 Sep 2023 18:40:02
Such a shambles that we finished 3rd last season and won a trophy. 4 games in to a brand new season with a big injury list and the toys are already out of the pram. I’m amazed you can’t sense the irony in you saying the players are sulking like babies.