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03 Jan 2016 14:58:56
I'm backing United to go on a run now. (Not financially, I'm not an 1diot) . I think we could be looking at just one loss in the next 10. That takes us up to a difficult run of City Everton and Tottenham.
And rather bizarrely, I think our drab style suits the big games best. I also think entertainment and goals will pick up.
Lastly I reckon we'll pick up 1 signing at most in jan, and it could be a big spend.
That's 4 'I thinks', what do you reckon I've got wrong?

Nizza

1.) 03 Jan 2016 15:19:10
Nizza. I hope you're right but I don't share your optimism. We've had a close window against one of the worst teams in the PL. And they pinned us back for the last 15mins as if we were playing Barcelona.
They had several chances to equalise.
So what makes you so optimistic about the next ten games?


2.) 03 Jan 2016 16:10:41
Schmid, maybe it's time to change your name again. No Faith? No Optimism? Hell, what about No Hope?


3.) 03 Jan 2016 16:47:19
Schmid, blind faith and a lack of investigation into logical scenarios.
Let's see.


4.) 03 Jan 2016 17:10:22
No betty he is going to change it to mazerollojmb😄😄😄.


5.) 03 Jan 2016 18:04:34
Oh Ken, you are a wicken man! 😈.


6.) 03 Jan 2016 20:17:59
Ken is the wicker man?


7.) 03 Jan 2016 21:34:00
Optimism is one thing.
Blind faith in our red tinted spectacles is another.
We will struggle to reach Top 4.


 

 

11 Aug 2015 19:33:34
Ready for everyones favourite time of the day? A bit of LVG bashing.

I'm not convinced by him, or his style of football, or his transfers, or his match day decisions. But I also think that he may well deliver trophies by the end of his three year contract. That's what he was hired to do, and might well do. Perhaps not in a fashion that's to everyone's taste.

A question directed at those who really don't like him: How bad do you think it will get? Will he ruin our club? Will he leave us in such a dire situation that it takes years to fix and become competitive again? What do you predict will be the legacy at the end of next year, worst case, and realistic expectation? I'm interested to hear what you think the damage could be.

It's open season on LVG right now. Go to town. And hopefully no one will knock you for it, because after all, I did ask.

Nizza

1.) 11 Aug 2015 20:15:12
worse case is that lvg spends a load of cash on players that don't make the grade and we win nothing .
the glazers then sell the club in 2017 like the ed has mentioned to an USA investment company that wil buy the club the same way the glazers did .

leaving us with an average team who haven't won anything in 4 years new manager and no cash to spend


2.) 11 Aug 2015 20:29:30
Nizza

I think LvG is generally doing the right things, letting go those who needed to go, adding in areas like midfield where it has been needed for years. He is putting in a plan, a structure to the club. For all the criticism he has given young players chances.

It will be interesting to see the results of what his changes to the youth structure mean to bringing youth through the system in 5 to 7 years. Little seems to published about what he is doing there.

At the present we are short in several areas, areas that if addressed could easily change our play, there are still three weeks to address these areas.

People say he is abrasive, well what was SAF? He put many noses out of joint, managers, players, fans , the press but he delivered, although might have done more in Europe. It could be said the mess lvg inherited needed some noses put out of joint in order to put it right

So I don't think he will ruin our club, I think I said when appointed he was more like a turnaround director brought in to steady the ship give us direction in a short space of time, basically the short sharp shock that was needed. He is giving the building blocks for the next manager in my opinion, the one that can come in and polish the marbles rather than have to crack the mould.
We are more likely to be competitive because of what he is doing than in spite of it, and we may appreciate what he has done more in a year or two. I don't expect the next manager to pick up the mess LvG did that is for sure.
This season he needs to buy the right players for this campaign and worry about future seasons if he is retained next summer.


3.) 11 Aug 2015 20:29:40
Did I get last Saturday's result wrong , did we actually lose
6 - 0 to Spurs ? , because that's what it seems like on here ever since


4.) 11 Aug 2015 20:50:18
That's a bit harsh Nizza. Other than the odd exception, nobody hates LVG. There are just some general concerns about his obstinacy around his philosophy. He really is a top bloke but his history suggests he struggles to engage and lacks emotional intelligence. Allegedly he is abrasive and as we have seen from his press conferences he can be a little indiscreet. He may surprise us all and everything will be fine. Or he won't and he will be gone. We have a great squad now, it won't get really bad.


5.) 11 Aug 2015 20:52:17
I don't think he will do any real damage apart from not achieve a major trophy. I think the positives so far are he has off loaded players that are Surplus to requirements and in doing so reduced the wages. I mean The likes of Nani and Anderson. I think it's hard for us fans to see what his philosophy is when he starts the season playing players out of their position. We saw plenty of it last season with Rooney playing CM instead of playing Hererra and now he's at it with Memphis, I can't see what he is trying to achieve in doing so probably 99% of comments and tweets regarding this think he's got it wrong with Mata and Memphis in the wrong position. It's also alarming that we have failed to either recruit or feel the need to recruit a quality CB already, don't think I've read a comment or article where anyone thinks we are strong enough back there. I fully appreciate Ed may be working on something before the end of the window but again why have we allowed it to go on this long. until the window is over we won't know who we may have so that will have to wait a couple of weeks. A lot of people have been accused of moaning too early but the worrying thing is even with the new players brought in we the game against Spurs was the same awful spectacle that we are now accustomed with over the last two seasons. can't remember the last time I got excited when a player had the ball thinking some magic was going to happen. all those hopes were pinned on ADM and that never came to fruition. So I don't think LVG will do any long term damage because the club are too big to become the modern day version of Liverpool however I think whenever LVG goes not a lot of people will miss him.


6.) 11 Aug 2015 21:06:19
Well put red man. And I do tend to agree. I'm usually one for judging in hindsight given the results and the methods, and I do believe he will do well, at the moment.

What I wrote in the original post is not the entirety of my opinion on lvg, it was just to give this thread a particular flavour.

I'm still interested to see what the pessimists expect to be the leftovers from his reign. Any more for any more?


7.) 11 Aug 2015 22:16:22
Red Man, I'd agree in general. SAF was abrasive when needed with the players.

However, it was usually behind closed doors. LVG seems to go out of his way to slag players off, especially in public. That's fine, but you need a filter. You need to be able to put an arm round them as well.

From what I've seen of him over the years, LVG doesn't have that filter, whereas, along with Cloughie, SAF was probably the best man manager of them all.


8.) 11 Aug 2015 22:27:42
Don't always agree with you Red Man but you are bang on with that reply.


9.) 11 Aug 2015 23:05:38
Think about the players he's got rid of Cleverley, Welbeck, Nani RvP likely Evans and Chicharito. Then there's all the players that have come in since too, not to say that he orchestrated every signing but the quality of the squad has been dramatically improved if he can't managed to get them to play well together someone else will.

He's giving youth a real chance in Blackett, McNair, pereira, Wilson and lingard. We're struggling to create at the moment that's all and it's down to a combination of having Rooney up front and mata and Young on the wings. Play Depay on the left and Pedro (if signed) on the right and that'll change. Midfield has been sorted. Defence will likely be sorted, Rojo replacing Blind when fit will help.


10.) 11 Aug 2015 23:21:00
Red man,

Absolutely spot on, one of the best posts on here for ages in my opinion.


 

 

10 Aug 2013 22:55:45
So as to not appear to be directing this at any individuals in particular, I've waited for a moment when its not been mentioned much.

I take great dissatisfaction in reading people, and fans of Manchester United, calling Tom Cleverly 'the brand'.
This is in no uncertain terms berating a person for being ambitious. Take aside football and fandom, this is just a guy trying to maximize his potential commercially. It also shows the level of ability and influence he is aiming to reach within his profession. Admirable qualities. Yet some find this suitable criteria to bully and name call.
This remains true regardless of your opinion on his current (and/or potential) ability. That's a different discussion. But we're talking about a man who has given his all whenever he has worn the famous shirt. And even when wearing the shirts of other clubs in his striving efforts to play for our club. Yet some of you want to knock the lad. If you don't think he's good enough for our first team that's fine, but its not a personal problem you have (that would be the processes leading to his selection), so don't try to undermine him on a personal level.
You'll be relieved to hear this is a character flaw that I find forgivable. After all, getting swept up by Kloots structured and reasoned arguments is only natural.

Nizza

1.) Nizza,

I take your point and I haven't called him that. However, i'd does niggle me that he is marketing himself when he has achieved bugger all. A perfect case of putting the cart before the horse


 

 

23 Jun 2013 16:12:22
Moon, what an outrageous assertion to make:

'Completely agree, what I tend to find is that clubs like Arsenal, Chelsea and Liverpool are very good at finding youngsters for cheaper prices in the English leagues. '

Can you help me to name 1 player for any of the above named first teams that was a cheap buy from a Football League club?

I'll help you out by ruling a few out -
Walcott - £9-12mil
Oxlade Chamberlain - £12-15mil
Shelvey - £3-5mil
Carroll - £35mil
Henderson - £18-20mil
Downing - £18-20mil
Shevchenko - £30

Not cheap, not cheap, not very good, not cheap, not cheap, not cheap, not cheap or wait a minute. how long since Chelsea actually bought young English talent?

The general consensus, I would speculate, would be that only Oxlade Chamberlain would be good enough for Manchester United from that list. But he wasn't cheap.

Feel free to give me examples that support your point. However I think you'll find that most would not be acceptable transfers for most fans of Manchester United. And more importantly, please feel free to offer up any gems I may have missed, because I'm always greatly amused by Liverpool's transfer policy.

Nizza

1.) Couldn't agree more. Liverpool's transfer windows have been comedy gold for me.

Sydney!


2.) I agree with Nizza here. United have bought the best of the English lot by far. They may not have exactly come in cheap, but when you look at what other English clubs have got we are far better off.

And Liverpool's transfers during Dalglish, Hodgson and the last year of Rafa were good entertainment.

REDFAITH


3.) In fact we should have paid more when Bale was moving. What a mistake that was!


4.) Carroll, Henderson and Downing weren't playing for football league clubs when they were bought.

I have no idea why you mentioned Shevchenko.

Shelvey is actually a decent prospect.

now, let me justify my claim; Bertrand came from Gillingham, Carl Jenkinson, etc.

there are also a LOT of youth players signed from football league clubs by Chelsea, Arsenal and especially Liverpool.

My point wasn't that there are loads of "Manchester United quality" players (that term p1sses me off so much) sitting in the lower leagues, it was that we get charged HUGE prices compared with other 'big' EPL clubs.

I mean I would take a 16YR Walcott over Zaha. I would also take an 18YR Ox over Zaha.

Not that Zaha is a bad player, but the fee we got charged was crazy.

In fact another MAJOR point I was trying to get at is that we have pretty non-existent relationships with Football League clubs.

Now, Being Spanish I couldn't care less but its something United need to address. the reason the La Liga clubs do so well at producing young spanish players is because they have great relationships with the teams below them.

Its quite simple for me, English football is Arrogant. It's over-rated and the mindset of always buying abroad IS going to destroy the national team completely.

For example, I've seen tons of suggestions on here and in the media about young players like Kovacic, Dzagoev, Goretzka, etc.

when there are players just as good in England such as Max Clayton, Will Hughes, Mason Bennett.

All will cost the same prices give or take £1M-£2M.

Maybe my claim was a little out there but at the end of the day my point is that United don't have the British affiliations that maybe they should especially when you look at the relationships between top clubs in other countries with the smaller clubs in those countries.


5.) Didnt he say cheap players from the leagues below which only 3 on your lish comes into it


6.) The reason we get charged so much is because we buy the best of the lot from the lower leagues. The best costs a premium. I don't exactly agree with the Zaha fee, but when we complain about not paying over the odds to get some foreign player then we shouldn't complain about paying a premium for the English players who once signed are likely to remain at the club for their entire careers.

REDFAITH


7.) Is £10.3m for Zaha that high? He's English and still 20. He is on seriously low wages and the £10.3m fee will be paid over the length of his contract which suited both MU and Palace.

When you consider Liverpool have spent £7m on some Spanish lad who nobody has heard of before now, I think it's not a bad deal. Also, did you say Shelvey is a decent prospect?

Sydney!


8.) JonJonJo Shelvey is a decent prospect? This must be up there with "Liverpool will finish 4th prediction". And then you keep harping about that you are Spanish. Paying 11 m (approx) for the best English player in the Championship is not paying through the nose. Yes may be a little over priced, but who cares? Neither of us are paying it. Funny that you mention Liverpool who paid 35 million for the Geordie donkey. With statements like these, you definitely lose any credibility. And you talk about the English media over hyping players, well every decent football fan would judge for themselves, rather than falling for a rousing eulogy by a tabloid. Spain as a footballing nation is head and shoulders above others but your league is devoid of any competition. Doesent make for interesting viewing.

Deeps.


9.) Granted, my list comprised of some players above the Football League. That was just to show you that other teams hugely overpay for young English talent. And in the same breath, you never mentioned the Football League in your claim, that was something I dropped in.

I will also grant you the notion that Spanish teams have better relationships with smaller clubs, especially B-Teams. Its something that is looked into by some managers in this country (Wasn't Moyes one of them?) However, it wasn't part of the claim I was disputing and is of little interest to me as a discussion point.

Ultimately you justify your wild claim with the use of Carl Jenkinson and Ryan Bertrand. And add etc as if there are more. I don't think either are particularly good buys. You could say 'you get what you pay for'. We buy better, we pay more.

I, like you, dislike the phrase 'Manchester United quality'. I find it fairly meaningless and lacking in any insight. You'll notice I didn't use that or a similar phrase.

In order to change the direction of the discussion, or to wrap it up, can we agree that the premium for English players is induced by the quota system and a lack of up and coming players due to regulations on training time?


10.) And look at zaha who as been outstanding for under 21's


 

 

16 May 2013 11:57:11
You're all getting my two cents now.

An ambitious man wants a change in his career. That's fine.

He decided he wanted that change two years ago, but was persuaded that the time wasn't right for him or the club. That's also fine.

In this case, he may be persuaded to stay again because the club and the manager believe him to be essential to the on field success. Or they might let him go because he is replaceable. From my point of view, not an easy decision for the club, and not an easy player to put a value on right now.

If he goes, I'll thank him for his years of exceptional service and wish him well in his next endeavors.
If he stays he has my full support and believe he will continue to show he is a top drawer footballer.

Nizza

1.) If he wants out let him go should have let him go the first time instead of bowing 2 his demands and paying him a fortune he ungrateful just because he got took off a few games he throwing the toys out of the pram with the transfer fees and wages we should get players that want 2 play for man utd


2.) Nizza

Good post. that's all I have been saying all this time, if its time to part ways, let's do it with a bit of respect and appreciation for 9 good years. But what we see here is bitter teenage girl bitchiness.

Deeps.


3.) 16 May 2013 12:27:29
Personally I can't wait to see him in his new Chelsea kit with Mourinho's loving arm around his shoulder.

Imagine him at Old Trafford playing up front off Falcao. Mata, Hazard and Oscar feeding the pair of them. Jeez.


4.) Or imagine Falcao. Mata, Hazard and Oscar playing at OT and Rooney sitting on the Chelsea bench because he is unfit and can't get a place in the starting 11


5.) 16 May 2013 13:32:41
Its obviously time to part ways. He's asked to go twice. Are we going to have this every two years until he retires? Whatever the reasons behind his requests its clear he's lost the motivation to stay here. His fitness issues are a symptom of the problem. All of this, being dropped and subbed comes from his lack of fitness. This is Rooney's fault no one else. So why can't he do the minimum of a professional and keep fit? There was no need for a transfer request. He should have just knuckled down and got on with it and got into shape. By all means moan to the boss but no need to ask for a transfer. I would have backed him but for him asking to leave. Now I think he has to go. Thanks for the service but its better if we part ways. Not being bitter just the way it is. I think Rooney leaving will help the team. So purely from football reasons its better if he goes.


6.) 16 May 2013 14:51:42
Those four at Old Trafford, that is some freaking imagination, probably aided by some special mushrooms. Jeez


7.) Jeez, I think noname meant the four of them playing for Chelsea. Unfortunately.


 

 

 

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12 Dec 2020 13:29:41
Fair play! Good effort!

Nizza

 

 

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19 Feb 2020 23:53:21
Shappy, you're not wrong in most of what you say there. However I took issue with the claim that with more off the ball work rate he would be 'one of the best strikers in the world'.
You go on to compare two of his other attributes unfavourably. Not even the best finisher at the 7th best club in England. And better hold up play than Lukaku of all people. Not exactly the benchmark of hold up play.
We have a tendancy to overrate a lot of individuals at United because we remember the hype of the signing, the highlights, the glimpses of potential. But many of us acknowledge our squad is poor, demonstrated by our league position.
LAS point,

Nizza

 

 

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19 Feb 2020 13:51:57
Shappy, You can't just add an attribute to a player and say they'd be brilliant. Plus, I disagree on Martial even with added effort. His finishing just isn't good enough to call him anywhere near top class (think the chance against Liverpool). The man needs a magic boost to composure, finishing, decision making, movement, hold up play, strength - then we can were looking at one of the world's best strikers.

Nizza

 

 

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19 Feb 2020 13:49:09
Agree with Shaps DLIB and redarmy. Atletico play anti-football, but by far the best anti-football on the planet. And that term is a description of the style, not a criticism.
He's got about 12 0-0's or 1-1s this season.
Just because they ground out a good result against Liverpool doesn't mean you'd accept that football 50 games in a season!

Nizza

 

 

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16 Sep 2017 12:40:26
It's been a strange one with Wayne Rooney for a few years now. I'm inclined to agree with your sentiments above, however I hope he is remembered more fondly by history.

Nizza