Manchester United Banter Archive June 29 2018

29 Jun 2018 22:05:33
Hows she cutting lads and ladies. Haven't posted in a long time but keep well abreast of the site. Great site, keep up the great work posting, making up for lazy bastards of me.

I read a lot of the posts on fellaini below and I have to say I'm fairly shocked that our own fans have such bile and hatred towards one of their own.
Henning berg, ronny johnsen, nicky butt, Phil neville, John o shea, mikael silvestre, wes brown, Alan Smith, I can go on and on.

All players that would not be classed as top players I think its fair to say.

All players bought by the greatest manager the world has ever seen.

All players given plenty of game time under the greatest manager the world has ever seen.

All players, I think its fair to say our fans were not totally convinced on/ wanted them out of the club and 'better' players signed.

Very simple equation folks:
60 games / 11 players = not possible.

All of the above players and many more have been squad players at our club.
It is impossible to compete on every level without having a strong and united squad.
I don't love fellaini, I don't hate fellaini. I didn't particularly want us to sign him as I didn't know where he will fit, I kinda still don't. When he was at Everton he played in almost a 10 role, with Moyes taking advantage of his height and power and he scored a lot of goals.
United are obviously not Everton, (Fergie please explain what you were thinking when you picked the chosen one! ) Fellaini could never be used in the same manner. I seem to remember he came injured (wrist problem) and to be honest he was terrible, but so were we and I definitely remember saying to myself during couple of matches early on that he looked like he was holding himself back cause on injury.
However since van gaal and Jose have come in, and I will contest this with anyone, Fellaini has been one of our better players, no not the best, relax, just a player who I think has played well in a lot of games, scored some very important goals, been a model pro (as he has always widely been reputed to be), not caused any disharmony in the squad, played with passion and looked like he wanted to play for united.
Don't get me wrong, fellaini would not be on my top 11 players in the world, nowhere near but he is a good player, a good pro. He doesn't suit our system, pogba doesn't suit our system either, sanchez doesn't seem to suit our system.
Fellaini provides options, he can play anywhere in midfield, he can be brought on as a 10 to lump balls up to when needed. He's dominant aerilally in both boxes.
There are teams we will play against both in England and on the continent that may not just allow us to have 60% possession and play beautiful football, sometimes we will need Fellaini's exact attributes in order to turn 1 point into 3, or 0 into 1. I've seen him do exactly that in numerous games over the last 3 years.

I can't believe how much people hate fellaini and in my opinion underate him. He is a good solid squad option, I think he's a unique option off the bench, that can change a game, how can people not see the worth in even that.
We've also managed to keep a player that is still easily worth 20m rather than letting him go for free. So we've managed to keep a very good unique squad option for the price of his wages, Hopefully now even less, fellaini is nowhere near our top earners in any case, I don't get what's so terrible about that.
I don't think we're going to base our system around him or I don't think he's going to start all 38 pl games but, I seem to be in the minority here, I certain see the value in him.

Oh and he made horse manure out of the English midfield the other night didn't he.

29 Jun 2018 22:30:59
I disagree completely with you. The players you listed were either home grown or added real value. Nicky Butt, Phil Neville? You’re not serious surely? John O’Shea and Wes Brown were brilliant for us. Johnson won the Champions League, Alan Smith was patchy but watch the Roma game and tell me when Fellaini has ever had that impact. You may like him but tryng to justify that the way you have is laughable (no offence mate) .

He is everything that is wrong with our club right now, if you are supportive then we have different ideals.

29 Jun 2018 23:10:27
You’re judging Smith’s entire contribution to Utd on the one Roma game? Please. He was as bang average but he tried every game, like Fellaini.

Fellaini is a great squad option, is effective off the bench, gives his all and the squad love him so he brings harmony. Why would we not give him a new deal.

Anyway, what does Jose know who lives and breathes this squad all day every day. a manager who’s not proven at he highest level. Oh wait.

29 Jun 2018 23:41:18
5 matches into the new season and we need to protect a lead and mourinho brings in fellaini. We all moan like hell because he can't pass can't hold the ball and can't tackle. Result is a stupid penalty being given and we draw the game.
I just don't see what he has to offer. And he held the club to ransom over his contract. I would've told him to F off a long time ago.

29 Jun 2018 23:47:04
Ross. Agree with every single word. Great post.

30 Jun 2018 00:38:08
Ajj sorry man but if you completely disagree with me then surely you are wrong, I mean you disagree with every word I have said?
You seem to have mistaken me, I see the value in the players I have listed, squad players who played an important part whilst they were here.
Fans are unfortunately fickle and tend to rewrite history, Johnsen, blomqvist, porborsky, berg etc were never seen as players deemed good enough for united by a lot of fans.
The same can be said for neville and butt, Phil neville gave away a famous penalty too no?
Even Michael Carrick was only truly appreciated towards the latter part of his career at United, regularly being said that he wasn't fit to lace Keanes boots nevermind wear his shirt.
Also as I said in my post I done love or hate fellaini but I see the benefit in keeping him as a squad player rather than letting go on a free transfer.
My ideals are to see us back where we belong whilst supporting all of our players whilst they are at the club. If yours are different than mine than I'd rather have mine.
Do I think united will win the league and challenge in Europe with Fellaini as our star midfielder that our game is build around no, do I see fellaini in a squad that wins the league and challenges in our, I say why not.

30 Jun 2018 05:01:54
AJH is one of those who go on and on and on about the "United Way" and the "philosophy" and in the same sentence spreads hate/ dislike for a Manchester United way. I am so confused. is that the philosophy we keep talking about? If yes, then let's just burn them all in hate and that will win us the leagues, "the United Way".

Horse rubbish all this is.

Go on Marrouane, you have my backing as long as you represent United on the ground.

30 Jun 2018 06:08:40
Good post RossPique, some of us still appreciate what Fellaini does bring to the team. Great squad player IMO and pleased he's staying.

30 Jun 2018 07:04:35
Ok, completely disagree might be harsh. However Butt and Neville were not under appreciated, Johnson was never deemed not good enough, and Carrick might have only got deserved recognitions n later on but I don’t ever remember the not fit to. lace Keane’s boots comparison.

Of course there have been players who were not good enough, or didn’t settle, or proved to be flops, it some of the ones you have listed don’t fit that category. John O’Shea seems to have become a bit of a joke figure but he was great for us.

UnitedAddict, not sure where I am spreading hate mate. Yes I go on about the United way and if you think that’s wrong then I guess you are a lot younger than me. Read my post again, there was no hate, I said he seems to be a really nice guy, I just think when we bought him it summed up that we had lowered our sights.

30 Jun 2018 07:36:26
Yes i am a lot younger bud but i do remember that SAF wanted Fellaini but couldn't get him from Everton then. So may ne SAF didn't really go the United Way? How is it lowering of sights? Just because you don't like the player doesn't make him poor. There are others who deserve to go out before Fellaini does. Shaw, Darmian, Martial, Smalling, Jones and the most over rated of em all Rashford.

30 Jun 2018 08:29:07
We're losing the plot here. Ross asked if it was such a bad thing giving Fellaini a two year deal? Just because we've had flops at United, it doesn't mean its ok to keep another flop. And that's what fellaini has been.
My argument is that he was mouthing off about United not giving him a deal and how he is in a strong position, then he touted himself about, and predictably no one wanted him. He then comes back and we give him a 2 year contract. It smacks of desperation. United are bigger than players and certainly bigger than Fellaini.
The other point is that he's a midfielder who can't pass, can't tackle fairly, can't run fast enough, can't dribble, and can't manoeuvre and turn quickly. So what is the point of having him? Just so that we can throw him up front when plan A hasn't worked? Its so pathetic and uttetly predictable. United should be aiming higher than that.
We'll see what happens but I'll be back here 10 games into the season to guage his performances and your views.
Lastly, he seems to be injured 80% of the time, which is a blessing i suppose.

30 Jun 2018 09:09:53
I think the issue here as AAA says is that it seems fellaini disrespected the club. I’m not a fan of his and didn’t want to see him re sign. However, when he does play he does give his all.

Ross you mention players such as Neville, brown, berg? O’shea and smith etc and how they were not world class. But at the time we had those players, we were a team winning the top honours and had the greatest manager of all time. We had the likes of Scholes, Giggs, Ronaldo, Rio, Keane to compliment those squad players. We could afford to have those who were less talented because we had that sprinkle of gold dust in those other players. We don’t have that now. So we cannot be relying on the likes of fellaini if we want to get back to the top. Don’t dislike fellaini as a person, but I do as a footballer. As Tony says, he is not in keeping with the United way, and he should never have been signed.

30 Jun 2018 09:36:57
The problem with the current squad is that there are too many who fall into the category of being underachievers, mentally weak or fragile or just not good enough. How many of the current squad would get into the squads of '94, '99 or '08? Jose has had 2 years with them now and knows who isn't up to the task. This summer should've saw the start of the final clear out. And Fellaini should've been the start. I don't care if he's a nice guy since when has that been a prerequisite of a title winning team. Keeping him on the off chance he can snatch a late goal is enough justification. And this farce is on Jose.

30 Jun 2018 09:40:19
Yeah, because no Utd players, some now thought rightly so as legends, ever disrespected the club by trying to get a better deal. Oh wait.

30 Jun 2018 09:59:45
If you are referring to Rooney nou then yes fair point. But Rooney had more ability in one of his toes than fellaini does in his whole body. He is a club legend and our highest ever scorer. Yet we have pandered to an average footballer. Says it all really.

30 Jun 2018 10:04:40
Ive no issue with fellaini getting the best deal for himself many have done that before him it what he should be doing for himself and his family.
I don't hate the guy personally either. That's just hyberbole. I think most recognise that he appears to be a decent sort of chap
I don't like him playing for the team because i don't like his style or what we revert to when he plays i don't think over 5 years he has done enough to warrant a new contract.
But jose has chosen him so its over and done with and let's hope we get rid of some of the other under achievers from this squad instead and use that money to improve the overall squad quality.
I still think we will see 3 more players signed and 3 or 4 more leave before the window shuts from blind mata martial darmian jones smalling rojo shaw pogba herrera.
Time will tell but i'm pretty relaxed about it.
Our squad as it stands has no chance in putting a title bid together imo we are still alarmingly short in some areas as the last 5 years tells you but i expect that with 3 more players in we can put in a real challenge.

30 Jun 2018 11:23:52
Not just Wayne over the years, Park. I could understand the dislike for him, if he was trying to steal a living, not putting in the effort or something like that. But in his case, the complete opposite is true. If people don't rate him, that's fair enough, but some of the comments about someone who's only crime was to be signed by the club and wear the red shirt, leave a lot to be desired.

30 Jun 2018 13:06:23
Sorry but if anyone think we should be chasing Fellaini to a new £100k pw contract I think you’ve lowered your standards and accepted mediocrity. He is a terrible footballer. Because he’s tall and can bring the ball down on his chest he’s worth a squad place and £100k a week? He’s got no quality on the ball and often gives away stupid free kicks around the box.

It just shows me where we are as a club to be honest. Did anyone see the likes of city, Chelsea, Bayern, PSG, Barca, Madrid sniffing round with his contract down? Of course not. I’m not even sure he’s top half of the PL level tbh. We’ll never get to the top of European football again while we have players like him, Smalling, blind, Shaw, young, Rashford etc in the side.

{Ed0333's Note - After tax it’s not £100k a week does that make you feel a little better mate?

30 Jun 2018 13:30:42
10k a year would be too much.

{Ed0333's Note - I think elbows is worth 10k a year for sure.

30 Jun 2018 12:18:43
The lack of support from our supporters is a joke .
The lad plays for a very good Belgium and United team for a reason .
Football snobbery at its best.

{Ed001's Note - because Martinez is a gimp and Belgium lack strength in depth? And because Jose likes his thugs to kick lumps out of the opposition when things are going against his team? There you go there is a reason for you. Football snobbery my arse, the guy is crap and on obscene amounts of money, and people defend it just because they think it makes them a better fan.}

30 Jun 2018 12:20:38
If the likes of butt oshea brown Smith etc played in this current team the same people would be having a hissy fit .
Not fancy enough names.

30 Jun 2018 17:12:52
I think the result on Tuesday, showed Belgium's strength in depth isn't too bad.

{Ed001's Note - or does it show how abysmal England's is? Belgium's midfielder is dross. Witsel is awful but he is first choice. They are not a good side and all this fantasy crap about England being great will be dispelled the moment they face a decent side with a back 3 consisting of 3 defenders who are utterly hopeless at defending.}

30 Jun 2018 21:04:15
Ed001, I'm an Ulsterman. You'll not get any argument from me about the merits of England's football team :)

{Ed001's Note - it is not just England to be fair, the whole tournament lacks quality, which makes you wonder how bad a country has to be to have failed to qualify.....}

01 Jul 2018 09:47:17
Ouch 😁.

{Ed001's Note - what??? ;-)

29 Jun 2018 15:04:04
Hi Guys

So we've got Fellaini for another 2 years with an option of a third. Personally I'm not a fan of his and in my opinion he is very one dimensional. My only hope is that we sell him and get a transfer fee for him but I think I'm clutching at straws.

29 Jun 2018 15:39:50
Strange decision for me, but not surprising given everything I would do the club seem to do the opposite. He has contributed at times, but this is not the message the club should be sending.

I understand why some people see the positives as the 'X factor' he can bring in certain situations, but i'd prefer alternative routes and too much is made of that X factor! We all know that when he plays he brings very little to the table unless we play direct. Yes he is committed, but so what, 99% of players for Utd would be committed if they believed they were punching above their weight being at a club like ours.

He actually doesn't win a lot in the air as CB's are similar size or have a better leap, not much actually comes from his aerial threat for us. He is a liability giving away possession, he slows the game down when in midfield, playing the obvious pass and often failing with that. he is very slow and often resorts to hacking down an opponent when they get the better of him, which is too often - he needs a smaller pitch to be effective. Then aerially it's a toss of a coin whether they opposition pick up a freekick or not.

I don't dislike Fellaini, but he is not good enough to be in a Man Utd squad there are literally a hundred midfielders I'd rather have taking up a position in the team. He may nick a goal now and again, but at what overall cost?

29 Jun 2018 15:54:59
There’s always the risk of a massive asteroid might hit the earth, and if lands in Manchester we’ll be glad that Fellaini is here to chest it down safely.

29 Jun 2018 19:41:59
I have nothing against Fellaini, he seems a nice bloke and apparently he is a popular character in the dressing room, but when we bought him my mind went back in time to when Liverpool signed David Speedie. I’m not comparing the 2 players, just the message it sent out. Fellaini is not, and never will be a United player, he was a last minute desperation signing. For me it’s a bit like the Arnautovic rumours: if true then we continue to fall.

Having said that he keeps getting picked. Moyes signed him, LVG played him, and Jose wants to keep him, so hey what do I know? Even if I know nothing, I know he is not a United player.

29 Jun 2018 20:30:12
Moyes signed him, got sacked. LvG played him got sacked.

29 Jun 2018 21:34:46
Jesus wept, reading this baloney. one player who is actually quite good!

Squad player who will play his share but mainly be a plan b.

29 Jun 2018 21:40:48
Good posts ajh and beast.
Agree with all of that ajh. The manager his his reasons i just don't agree with them.

29 Jun 2018 23:15:06
Moyes, LVG and Jose all play him. Martinez plays him for Belgium. but what do they know.

29 Jun 2018 23:46:40
Agreed Beast and Tony. I have never liked him or his way of playing.

30 Jun 2018 10:08:35
Eric - I know they know how to take a quality squad and make it look bang average.

29 Jun 2018 12:03:05
{Ed's Note - Ed001 has posted a new player profile about, Gary Cahill

29 Jun 2018 12:56:45
He's two hot and cold for me. Some days he's unplayable and others he looks woefully out of his depth. Always depends who he's playing beside, I think he's better when he's playing next to an accomplished centre back. When he's the main man I think he can be got at fairly easily. Haven't said that, that's some trophy haul he's got over the last 7 years!

29 Jun 2018 07:57:39
Considering we were linked with Eric Dier for £50m and he came up against a much better fellaini yesterday, I know what I'd rather do. Sign wig on a new deal, or blow £50m plus fees and wages on the most static player I have seen in an England shirt in a while. it's almost like Jose knows what he's doing.

29 Jun 2018 08:32:12
Dier is so average. He is an inbetween player. Not technically good enough for midfield and not positionally aware enough for cb. I’m glad we didn’t sign him because matic is a better player. I would also take fellaini over him.

29 Jun 2018 11:29:31
I agree Dier is not good enough, never rated him. Another swerve I'm pleased we made is on Carvalho, looks like a lumbering mistake waiting to happen every time I watch him play.

29 Jun 2018 11:52:51
There has been paper talk of interest in Tanguy Ndembele of Lyon. think he would be a great addition alongside Fred.

29 Jun 2018 20:53:29
I like what I have seen of Ndembele from Lyon. Dier, agree with all of you, no thanks.

29 Jun 2018 01:17:03
How great is it to see Lukaku leading the team talks. He has matured a lot this season and is growing as a leader for both club and country. He has become my favourite player and I would be gutted if we were to lose him. Give him the captain’s armband next season because he leads by example and has the passion and desire to play for united.

29 Jun 2018 02:16:29
I prefer the armband going to a center back or center mid, I'm old school like that, but I do like Lukaku's attitude. He has a good year for us, a big club, and this has allowed him to express himself as we have seen. He has a hunger to win.

29 Jun 2018 08:27:30
I tend to agree zidaniel I also like my cbs to be captain. But looking at the squad there are very few leaders and so De Gea and Rom would be my choices.

29 Jun 2018 10:07:22
I don't buy into the position of a player being important for them to be a good leader.

If you can bring the lads together and inspire great performances out of the players then it doesn't really matter where you play.

I think the position thing comes from this idea that a captain should be like an army general and he should be commanding his troops where to go and when. This might be the case if your playing with amateurs, but these are professional footballers. Will a CB really know more about the job a CM or FW should be doing. Could they really accurately communicate that information over 50-60 yards in a full stadium to someone who's first language is different to theirs?

Professional players spend all week training and preparing for a match, they work on their weaknesses, they work on improving all aspects of their game, they work on the tactics for the game and their role in those tactics.

If at the end of all that they need someone who plays a completely different role to them shouting in their ear about what they have to do and when then they are a very poor professional.

All players should be communicating and working together during a match.

So I don't see the need to have a captain who plays a certain position l, it should be about whether they have the right personality to lead and inspire.

29 Jun 2018 11:35:37
I think it matters where they play in an ideal world. The margins are so small though it isn't a big issue. Ultimately when you have captains like Valencia that can't speak much English and seem to play in silent mode it kind of defeats the purpose for me. The you have some players like Rooney get distracted by the 'responsibilities' of captaincy in my opinion. A striker needs to be alert, almost stealth like, making them captain and doing what a captain should do (although most don't) means the opposite, that say 1% of selfish focus they lose by being made captain can be costly in a game of fine margins.

Strikers should focus on finding space, exploiting lapses - not guiding others through a game. That is for a CB or a defensive CM in my opinion. But then the captains role in most cases is just an honory thing now, it can be a slight advantage though if you have a real leader at the hub of everything, lack of leaders nowadays though.